What you talking about, I’m still 21 and drive a ford fiesta on sick allows bruv

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Pukit@reddit

They use to be 99p when I worked there as a student, 2005ish. A normal hamburger was 69p, cheeseburger was 79p, a happy meal £1.99, a medium extra value meal was £3.49.

At the time Wetherspoons advertised its burger and beer as the “Sorry Ronnie Burger” at £3.29 as it was cheaper than Macs and had a beer with it.

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throwmostlyaway@reddit

Yup, £3.19 when I worked there in 2004 for a medium extra value meal.

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gagagagaNope@reddit

To be fair, 69p in 2005 is £1.20 now with inflation - so it's bang on the same price in real terms.

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Zavodskoy@reddit

I used to walk to mcdonalds and get two double cheeserburgers for £1.98 on my lunch break at college in like 2010 / 2011

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mab1984@reddit

Used to be 99p for double cheeseburger when they were new roughly 2002, in 2000 49p hamburger 59p cheeseburger. A medium meal was £2.99 I started August 2000 and left February 2004.

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This is a problem. In my mind, a "value meal" is still £3.29. I associate McDonald's with being cheap and nasty. Now it's just nasty. always surprises me when it's over £7. I assume they're not called value meals anymore

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FingerBangMyAsshole@reddit

Only time I eat there is when I can expense it back to my employer.

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lankyno8@reddit

£7 is roughly the same ratio to minimum wage as 3.30 was in 2005

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ElonMaersk@reddit

The value of the pound has almost halved since 2005; £1 then is £1.73 now, so £1.99 is only 15% higher while energy costs, minimum wages, are up.

No he's not, although his timeline might be a little off.

It was £1.19 before the prices went up in 2022 (the article shows a single cheeseburger going from 99p to £1.19).

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/jul/27/mcdonalds-uk-raises-price-of-cheeseburger-for-first-time-in-14-years

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Alarmed-Cheetah-1221@reddit

That's a cheeseburger.

They're talking about a double cheeseburger...

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dmmeyourfloof@reddit

When they upped the price of the cheeseburger to £1.19, they also adjusted upwards the price of a double from £1.19 to £1.39 at the time.

I implied this in my comment.

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Alarmed-Cheetah-1221@reddit

https://www.standard.co.uk/business/why-have-pret-prices-rises-so-fast-mcdonalds-prices-subway-prices-leon-b1106825.html

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13687401/Price-McDonalds-Big-Mac-soared-Covid-Happy-Meals-jump-60p-double-cheeseburgers-cost.html

Double cheeseburgers were £1.49 five years ago.

You're wrong regardless of what you attempted to imply.

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dmmeyourfloof@reddit

I couldn't find exact figures but by that, it's still a huge price rise from £1.49 to £2.29.

Yes so for 20 years they were ripping you off less and less each year until it was finally, literally, not profitable for them to charge you 99p anymore.

Double cheeseburgers were £1.49 on 2020.

Please don't just make things up to serve your narrative.

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bubbles_blower_@reddit

All you have to do is Google, and you will see they ain't lying. You are

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Oh god your right 🙈🤣 my apologises dude ! Reddit is my escape from stressful life , I fucked up there sorry 🫠😂!

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MotoMkali@reddit

Maybe at your local store. But the one where I worked double cheeseburgers were 1.59 all through covid.

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anomalous_cowherd@reddit

Fast, Cheap, Good. You can't have all three, but you don't necessarily get two or even one either.

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Financial_Way1925@reddit

All three is entirely possible, especially when it comes to food.

Tbh, most of the time, if someone can do quality work, they'll do it quicker than a guy doing bad quality work, and it'll likely end up cheaper to finish a project.

Bellshill saying that makes no sense.

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anomalous_cowherd@reddit

I tend to agree, getting the right person to do the job is often going to end up with all three.

Price comparison of the same combi meal in every country. US are 11th at $11, UK is 27th at $9.69.

There’s even people that have done comparisons of the same items.

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TatyGGTV@reddit

US food prices are way higher than the UK, even accounting for their higher incomes.

An apple can cost $4 there. they're 20p here.

UK has the cheapest food in the world relative to average incomes.

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PlayerHeadcase@reddit

I have absolutely no idea where you are getting this data. Cheapest food in the world relative to income??

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throwaway388138@reddit

and removed the cheap and quick part

It's hardly expensive, as an example I can get double the amount of nuggets from mcdonalds than all 3 of my local takeaways for £3 less. They're selling 10 for nearly 9 quid and I can get a box of 20 for 6 50 or whatever it is.

Sure I only live in a small town with very limited options but I can go to mcdonalds and spend half what I would on burger/chips type food from my locals yet come away with much more food.

Mcdonalds is still cheap as a takeaway/Fast food type of meal and honestly it tastes so much better, although again I'm aware I only have a very small selection of takeaways within 5 miles to chose from and compare.

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Disgruntled__Goat@reddit

If all you want is some nuggets, surely it’s cheaper AND quicker to just get frozen ones from the supermarket and bung them in the oven.

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throwaway388138@reddit

I don't disagree, it was just purely an example of how mcdonalds isn't that expensive when compared to other forms of takeaway. As I said, I'm aware its only a small sample size.

At the end of the day, if someone can't justify spending £15 on a mcdonalds, they shouldn't eat takeaway and stick to what they can afford.

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throwaway388138@reddit

and removed the cheap and quick part

It's hardly expensive, as an example I can get double the amount of nuggets from mcdonalds than all 3 of my local takeaways for £3 less. They're selling 10 for nearly 9 quid and I can get a box of 20 for 6 50 or whatever it is.

Sure I only live in a small town with very limited options but I can go to mcdonalds and spend half what I would on burger/chips type food from my locals yet come away with much more food.

Mcdonalds is still cheap as a takeaway/Fast food type of meal and honestly it tastes so much better, although again I'm aware I only have a very small selection of takeaways within 5 miles to chose from and compare.

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The fact that sirloin isn't shit? I.e. not full of preservatives or who knows what else. So cheaper AND better quality. Do I need to draw you a diagram?

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Alarmed-Cheetah-1221@reddit

So then you're saying that McDonald's used to be equivalent quality to a sirloin steak?

I'm just following your logic before you get any more butthurt.

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PickingEnthusiast@reddit

They completely remodelled my local maccas so you don't have to look at the driver's any more and whilst the endless punter/rider beefs were annoying, it gives the place a real dystopian vibe

My social credit is high enough that I don't have to look at drivers while I wait for my order to come out the food hole!

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mattjimf@reddit

There are a few places here in Newcastle and surrounding area where they have a separate entrance and waiting area for delivery drivers.

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clayalien@reddit

It's still the same kitchen though, which seems to be the bottleneck point.

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mattjimf@reddit

But you don't have to put up with the arsehole drivers pushing past you to get the three deliveries they need.

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_whopper_@reddit

They’ve also been opening delivery-only locations to make the normal places a bit nicer.

I don't know how they can afford it.

I've seen the gradual takeover of these services, still have no idea how it makes sense.

The cost and the absolute mediocrity put me off. In person or not at all.

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I read once that supermarkets have an ‘acceptable level of dissatisfaction’ where they know people will be annoyed at the level of service, but they won’t leave or go and shop elsewhere in future, as it’s tolerable. So same thing happening here.

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anonyx@reddit

If you look at their offers in the app they are all for delivery. McDonald’s have clearly decided the customer of the future is one that has their items delivered and not one that comes into store. I have no idea why, but it’s the absolute worst.

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SuperSpidey374@reddit

Yep. I remember as a kid you would get it almost instantly.

A few months back I was on a trip somewhere out of my usual way and got a meal from a KFC. Ordered at the counter, went to stand to one side to wait and they asked me where I was going while handing my food. Felt like I'd been transported back to the early 00s.

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FR1984007@reddit

our local one is a waste of time now your waiting at least 10 -15 mins for your food

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wrighty2009@reddit

Yep, when I worked there, drive thru was always the priority, as the cars were timed from ordering to leaving the drive thru.

WanderWomble@reddit

That's a different system to home delivery though.

No one wants to park cars - because to be totally honest it's a massive pain in the arse. The kitchen can only produce so much food in one go and if what you've ordered isn't ready then yes, you'll be asked to park up.

But again, I only worked for them for ten years so what do I know?

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CorporateWageSlave20@reddit

If they're struggling then the store needs to stop accepting delivery orders and deal with the customers coming to visit them.

I was there 8 years and have a pretty good idea how it operates too.

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ClassicPart@reddit

Very wrong. In-person and Just Eat orders appear differently on the order board. I've been there and placed an order, had my number appear on the board, and have been made to wait whilst countless other remote orders have been placed and collected.

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WanderWomble@reddit

I mean I only worked for McDonald's for ten years but please do keep correcting me.

I ordered one hamburger once to avoid the park up and was still told to park up

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joehonestjoe@reddit

I have no experience of working there but I get the impression pre making things at McDonalds went the way of the dodo years ago. It feels like they only make exactly what is required, as it comes in. Why a forgotten item takes ages, because it wasn't forgotten to be bagged, it was forgotten to be made.

choodudetoo@reddit

At least that means that your meat didn't get to ~~rot~~ sit in the steam drawer for ages before your order was fulfilled.

Sigh -- evidence of the enshitification:

Every parking spot at my local McDonalds is always taken up by delivery drivers, luckily I’m on a motorbike so I park on the path behind the drive through screens well out of the way of pedestrians whilst I pop in and out

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Bob_Aggz@reddit

So you're pissed at the time it takes to get the fuckin poison to your slobbering mouth? Not the fact that it's slobbering poison?

Tastes good though, eh?

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Inside-Shallot-4798@reddit

I’m more pissed that the get all butthurt if you ask for a refill in a redesign they specifically made to get rid of the fine in customer 🙄

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clayalien@reddit

Had to take the kid to a medical appointment. Bit of a drive to a specialised unit, so asked the teacher if I could pick her up a bit early to allow for traffic, but that was in the middle of her lunch time. So I picked her up before lunch, we drove there super early and I figured 'haven't been to McDonald's in years, let's have a treat for ~~her~~ me' and we went for lunch.

Ended up paying at a machine which was fine, gave us a ticket number, but failed to print it, waited 20 mins with an increasingly frustrated child just anxiously waiting wondering what would happen if I missed it, how long it would be, if the lack of ticket number would be a problem...

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Because until a number of years ago the food used to be made prior to your visit and stored in the heated bin. A batch of 9 cheeseburgers could be made 20 mins before your visit. When you order the crewmember would pick up said burger and hand it over to you.

Now everything is made to scatch(burger is still precooked).

I'd say it's better now as previous. I can confirm burgers were kept for over an hour back in the metal number flag days(which was used in conjunction to the clocks customers and employees would see at the tills(red and black numbers would be next to the clock numbers).

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iAmBalfrog@reddit

"Hey can you park up while we bring over your standard order 20 minutes later"

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Chewingupsidedown@reddit

I don't... disagree but, McDonalds has never referred to itself as "fast food" and fast food as a moniker has never really meant food that is cooked quickly.

thinvanilla@reddit

Yep, this is definitely one of the main reasons they changed it to those ordering screens, because now they can have far more orders queued at once despite the kitchen not being able to handle that many orders. They've essentially moved the queue from before you pay to after you pay.

A physical line serves as a signifier of the capacity of the kitchen and if there's a long line then you know it's going to take a long time, so people tend to change their mind and leave. Now that people have already paid, they can't just give up a leave without forfeiting their food (Maybe that's why so many numbers get called out but not picked up).

With those screens you can normally order immediately, and because there are far more screens than there would be people taking orders (Without any change in kitchen size/capacity), the kitchen becomes over capacity far quicker and lags more than it used to.

Best way to get around this is to check how busy the pickup location is before you order. I've walked out after realising it's going to take an age to get my order from looking at the pickup section.

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SomeMoronOnReddit@reddit

Sadly that still doesn't account for app users waiting at tables or in their cars; or even deliveries in the ones with a separate area for the drivers.

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TentativeGosling@reddit

Whilst that is true (at least drive-thru, apps are just in the same queue as you, it's just that they aren't physically there waiting in front of you from point of ordering), another big change came when they moved from a production bin holding hot food to what they called BOP. Basically, every then became "assembled" to order rather than batch made. Theoretically, this should mean food was fresher when bought, as even if the burger or chicken had been cooked for a short while, it wasn't sitting in a bun with lettuce, sauce etc.

However, as the buns are "freshly toasted", and then assembled, this adds additional time from ordering. And rather than being handed to you straight away, it sits in a colder area than previously, waiting for the worker to get to your order.

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It’s because they have 200 Deliveroo orders to get out the door and don’t give a stuff about the guy waiting at the counter for his burger.

In fact, at the nearest McDonald’s to me, the counter is more or less gone.

The amount of times I've tried to buy a couple of bog standard happy meals via drive through from my local one and heard "Park up over there, we'll bring it out". Go in to check where the food has got to 20 mins later to find they've forgotten / cancelled it.

I've given up on the place.

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UnNormie@reddit

The honest reason why it's been such a change is all the UK stores have stopped making burgers in advance for ones that are common, but making them all per order. It used to be X big macs made and held for Y amount of time till someone purchases, meaning you'd get it near instant unless you requested something different taken out, which used to be far less common before kiosks took off. Now everything is made to order.

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Charlieuk@reddit

All the stores in my area prioritise the drive through and Uber etc so if you actually go inside for food, even just a cheeseburger, expect to wait at least 20 mins.

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SprintsAC@reddit

I asked them to make a veggie burger in 2016 & the waiting time was ridiculous. I'm guessing it wasn't common people ordered them there.

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cactusplants@reddit

During the laxing of lockdown, well a few months after we got mostly back to normal I was waiting for 45 mins for a cheeseburger.

Nope. McDonald's UK have considered themselves a family restaurant since at least 2012. The biggest competitor is Greggs.

These same people that put zero effort in will then cry and whinge like a baby when they're passed up on manager positions or other promotions.

thenewblueroan2@reddit

Every burger I've had in recent memories looks like it's been through a hard game of heads and volleys in the back before getting it.

exactly. got to wonder why so many people are so eager to consume that over-processed crap. it’s not like we’re ignorant of how unhealthy it is

… once in a while, i can understand, but even once a week is too much

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gary_mcpirate@reddit

They have been losing a lot of money recently. This being one of the stated reasons

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ClericalRogue@reddit

Correct answer. And lets face it, why do we pay £8 for a meal there when we know we're gonna be hungry again in an hour? Its the least satiating fast food for its calories i can think of...

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theivoryserf@reddit

You get a dopamine hit for ten minutes from the salt and sugar as you eat it, then you feel like shit the rest of the day. Really not worth it

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BreakfastLopsided906@reddit

I liked this.

Beartato4772@reddit

Yeah, so long as it was at some point cooked properly, there's nothing illegal about serving food that's then got cold, otherwise supermarket chicken sandwiches would be illegal.

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richardhod@reddit

The Tories underfunded and ruined the health and safety executive because they don't care about you, they want their mates to make more profits instead. So whoever's left doing any little bit of enforcement doesn't have time for this stuff

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SnooKiwis5591@reddit

this is your fault, dont remember ? women sue them because was to hot !

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Boldboy72@reddit

ok... I thought I was the only one who noticed the their food is almost always cold these days. I thought that if I asked for a burger with something removed, I'd get a fresh burger but they just take one from the rack and remove that item.

I ordered breakfast from a cafe that is 4 miles away from me on Just Eat, the food arrived piping hot. Tried the same with McDonald's which is half a mile away. arrived colder than my fridge.

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Bob_Aggz@reddit

Scottish food standards are the highest in Britain but the "fast food" corporations get away with it by being based elsewhere.

Don't eat McD's, trust me...also:

KFC BK GDK TACO BELL WENDYS ANY OTHER CHAIN OF TOTAL POISON FOR PROFIT.

SOURCE? I fuckin read the information, you can too.

THEY ACTUALLY PRINT HOW IT'LL FUCKIN KILL YOU ON THE GREASE SHEET!!!

2 TIMES THE FAT, SALT AND SUGAR YOU NEED IN A NORMAL MEAL DEAL.

Not my decision, you eat shit, eventually you die.

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scienceisrealtho@reddit

I'm not in UK. I'm American (please don't hold that against me, although I would understand if you did) and was a professional chef for 20 years.

If they're serving food outside of the hot hold window that's definitely not a good practice, but from a food safety standpoint t it's probably not much of a deal. Foods can be in the danger zone for a certain amount of time before it becomes unsafe to eat.

“Hot food when held must be kept at 63°C or above. You can keep it below 63°C for up to two hours.”

RevolutionaryHat4311@reddit

We sit at the window and check EVERYTHING before driving off and have done for a couple years now, sick to death or missing things and cold stuff, I’m not queueing again or walking into the shop to get it fixed it should have been right the first time. Too many missing bits and cold stuff miles down the road to be bothered about holding up the lines anymore

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RipCurl69Reddit@reddit

This is me with KFC. Half of the time my chicken ends up being wildly overcooked or not cooked at all; genuinely akin to a slop covered piece of chicken more than fried.

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Tumeni1959@reddit

"9 times out of 10"

Stop giving these jokers your money.

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Dnny10bns@reddit

I can relate. I used to like their breakfasts but they come out like they've been thrown together now. Hot, but literally thrown together, then tossed about in a brown bag for good measure. My favourite recently was a big mac where everything was on the bottom bun. Realising what they've done they decided to stick the remaining bun on top of the middle, also dry. Was pretty funny to be fair. The reason I wasn't too bothered was the meal was cold anyway and I got a brand new hot one, including decent amount of fries. Their coffee also comes out luke warm now too. Unsure if that's policy now, it's crap either way.

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tmr89@reddit

They don’t advertise their food as needing to be hot. Same as Greggs

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Opposite_Orange_7856@reddit

neither do most restaurants technically

If you're eating McDonalds, you're clearly not that fussed with what you're putting into your body.

What difference is a few degrees going to make?

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SkullKid888@reddit

It doesn’t have to be served at temperature. The meat has to be cooked to minimum temp, thats it. Doesn’t matter if it goes cold again by the time it’s served.

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I treat myself to a home made McMuffin meal on occasion. For an authentic muffin I wrap them in grease proof paper to steam the toasted bun before serving. Genuinely makes them spot on

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ImperitorEst@reddit

Where do you find cheese with a sufficient plastic content? 😂

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FEMXIII@reddit

Most of the plastic cheese slices work. Occasionally I’ll posh it up and add real cheddar but it tastes too much like food then.

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GrrrrDino@reddit

sorted in a humidifier

This is why my fucking selects are soggy?!

Every so often I'll get a crispy hot select where the breading just falls off the chicken. Most of the time I'll get soggy not-crispy selects.

Still think the amount of sauce on the beef burgers needs work though, not enough of it to lubricate the meat.

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flyingalbatross1@reddit

Exactly the issue. It used to be a burger going into a bun at 150+ and then being held. You might get unlucky but usually it would be fairly hot and fresh. The downside for them is if it's out too long, it gets wasted and binned.

Now it's 63 going onto cold cheese and lettuce.

They advertise 'fresh made to order' like it's a plus - the reality is you get colder food than we used to.

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Similar-Tap-5878@reddit

You’ve hit the nail right on the head here. If something has been changed then it’s to enrich the shareholders. Enshittification.

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solarwindspolar@reddit

Hot hold - they should keep it within the safe temperature range so yes it can go cold and be refrigerated but only reheated once. Or can’t be reheated if has already been cooked and frozen.

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GarrySpacepope@reddit

But if you cook it to temp and just leave it ambient its got 2 hours before it needs to go in the bin.

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solarwindspolar@reddit

That’s true yep - The Danger Zone is real!

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DeemonPankaik@reddit

Hot food when held must be kept at 63°C or above.

https://www.food.gov.uk/business-guidance/cooking-safely-in-your-business

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difficult_Person_666@reddit

Greggs would like a word…

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TheJoshGriffith@reddit

Greggs intentionally doesn't keep their food hot because they are classified as a bakery which provides them with tax exemptions. If they stored the food hot they would need to reclassify I believe as a restaurant. The fact that you can get hot food there is sort of coincidental.

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difficult_Person_666@reddit

Totally agree…

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WheresWalldough@reddit

No, it's hot (VAT) vs cold (no VAT) takeaway food. Not a restaurant.

Restaurants charge on everything.

So:

Pret sandwich to takeaway, clearly cold, no VAT
Pret sandwich to eat there = restaurant, VAT
Subway toasted (specifically) sandwich to takeaway - clearly hot, VAT
Greggs steak bake to takeaway that happens to have just come out of the oven - incidentally hot, no VAT
KFC or McDonalds to takeaway - hot, VAT

The point is that KFC/McDonalds/Dominos are to only be eaten hot, while Greggs has successfully argued that their hot pies can be eaten cold.

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NegKDRatio@reddit

Greggs don’t advertise it as hot food. They don’t keep it warm once it’s cooked.

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SkullKid888@reddit

Doesn’t matter what its advertised as. The law is the law. If Greggs can do it, then so can Mcdonalds.

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Warburton379@reddit

In Greggs you don't pay hot food VAT. It's not served as hot food.

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SkullKid888@reddit

A common misconception but you do actually pay VAT for a lot of their goods.

As for the hot food that has been allowed to cool before being sold as cold, thats exactly my point. Tax purposes aside, but looking at it from a food safety perspective, how is a mcdonalds burger going cold any different?

Food is allowed to cool before being sold is the point.

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Warburton379@reddit

Food is allowed to cool before being sold if the point.

I didn't disagree with that. Nor was there any misconception. Bakery's that serve food as cold don't charge hot food VAT. Obviously the hot food is charged.

Hot food must be kept at a minimum of 63c and cold food can drop to 8c.

https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/vat-food/vfood4300#:~:text=The%20Food%20Safety%20(Temperature%20Control,is%20to%20be%20sold%20cold.

McDonald's can't be stored below 63c. It's hot food. Greggs cold food can drop to 8c.

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SkullKid888@reddit

Your link is about rules predating 2012 btw.

McDonalds of course will argue that the food isn’t stored though, and instead is served immediately.

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BjornTheDwarf@reddit

It quite clearly says 'published 2016, updated 2024' at the top.

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Let's break it down for the illiterate

The Food Safety (Temperature Control) Regulations (SI 2006/14, formerly SI 2200/1995) state the maximum time a hot product can be left before it must either be kept at a minimum temperature (63°C) if it is to be sold hot, or chilled to a maximum temperature (8°C) if it is to be sold cold

Food Safety Regulations require hot food to be kept at a minimum temperature of 63c. Not old food safety regulations from pre 2012. Current, existing, food safety regulations.

Prior to the 2012 changes to the law many businesses claimed that their food was being kept hot merely in order to comply with these regulations, and not for the purpose of enabling it to be consumed at a temperature above the ambient air temperature.

The law has allowances, it depends what the food is sold as.

If you serve a cold chicken salad sandwich, the law doesn't expect that chicken to be held above 60c until served. However it's previously cooked meat.

That's why there's clear differences in how the food is held

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SkullKid888@reddit

Yes I know that. My point is it can be “advertised” as whatever they want, it doesn’t make it so, only actual process matters.

I can claim my car is a bike, doesn’t mean I’m exempt from road tax.

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SilverCharm99@reddit

But Greggs don't sell hot food (plfor the pasties, that is. I know they have a hot hold cabinet and breakfast sandwiches, which are classed as hot food). They sell freshly baked food, which may or may not still be hot due to how freshly baked it is.

At least, that's what they say when questioned.

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OurSeepyD@reddit

You can keep it below 63°C for up to two hours.

You went out of your way to look it up but couldn't be bothered to read one more sentence lol

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DeemonPankaik@reddit

Ye you got me there

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preaxhpeacj@reddit

Doesn’t mean it will still be 63° when you receive it

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jelly-rod-123@reddit

You are so wrong

From the FSA

Two things

It's not displayed and there's nothing in the regulations about how hot it must be between the point the food is assembled and passed to you.

For example, a sausage and an egg might be held at 63⁰ but as soon as that is put in a muffin with a slice of "cheese" then wrapped and passed to you ( which might take several minutes) it obviously can't be kept at 63⁰.

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shrewdlogarithm@reddit

This is wrong

Hot food has a specific definition and must be SERVED at a suitable temperature

Served, for McDonald's purposes, is handed to the customer, not put into a bun or a box

If your logic applied every Sunday carvery would hand out plates of cold food - ask yourself why they goto some lengths to keep it warm....

Mcdonalds used to have visible heated racks into which prepared burgers were placed so that serving staff could build the final meal, not sure if they still do that as serving areas are being redesigned to hide the prep but I doubt they did that for no reason

I suspect reality is they don't care, the franchise system passes blame away from McDs themselves and, well, look at the ice cream.machine debacle and ask yourself whether they care if your burger is tepid

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IamConfusedBiscuit@reddit

Your logic just doesn't make any sense. The reason they aren't handing out cold plates of food is that they actually want to make some sales and turn a profit? Did you actually think when you were writing that

Clearly you haven't either.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1995/2200/regulation/9/made

(2) In any proceedings for an offence of contravening regulation 8, it shall be a defence for a person charged to prove that the food—

(a)had been kept for service or on display for sale for a period of less than two hours; and

(b)had not previously been kept for service or on display for sale by that person.

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Mixed_Fabrics@reddit

Not against a local butty shop if that’s convenient but typically McD drive through is easier to find and use, especially if you’re not familiar with the place.

And McMuffins are delicious IMO 😅 If you don’t like them fair enough, but I can understand why they’re popular.

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upvoterssapiaccount@reddit

To be fair I didn't say they weren't delicious, I just don't consider them food and as such haven't had them for years.

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TheKarmaSutre@reddit

I travel a lot for work and sometimes you just need convenience and consistency. If I’ve only got 10 mins to grab some lunch in a new city, I’ll often pick a fast food chain over a lovely looking independent because I have a reasonable idea of cost, quality and service time.

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theivoryserf@reddit

a reasonable idea of cost, quality and service time.

FridayGeneral@reddit

In London, you are never far away from a charcoal grill place that will do a banging burger and fries for less than McDonald's that is better quality plus you get called "boss"

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ref_@reddit

ou are never far away from a charcoal grill place that will do a banging burger and fries for less than McDonald's that is better quality

There's a whole spectrum of quality. Yeh, I can easily find ones cheaper than Mcdonald's, but they will be those cheap plastic burgers. There's plenty of places near me that definitely do better burgers, but you won't get a meal for <£6.

There's a reason they're still in business, despite the hate it gets on reddit.

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FridayGeneral@reddit

Yeh, I can easily find ones cheaper than Mcdonald's, but they will be those cheap plastic burgers you find in burger trucks.

My local grill makes their burgers in-house by hand with proper minced beef, which is the norm in London. But even burger truck burgers are better quality than McDonald's.

There's plenty of places near me that definitely do better burgers, but you won't get a meal for <£6.

Neither will you in McDonald's, if you want adult portions. A 1/4 pounder meal is £7 now, for example.

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EpochRaine@reddit

Really?

I have tried every takeaway in a 30 mile radius of my home. There are only 3 that are better, they only serve curries.

Almost every independent that serves chicken and burgers - including the food vans - serve the Booker/Macro shit - The nuggets are terrible and the beef patties are awful. I have tried them direct - it isn't the cooking.

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FridayGeneral@reddit

That says more about where you live, which I assume must be a very remote, rural area if it has been physically possible for you to try every takeaway in a 30 mile radius. For most Brits, that would take a lifetime.

McDonald's stopped storing their hot foods (bar chicken (exc grilled) and sausage) a good 8 years ago or so.

The rack which is used to store chicken and whatnot doesn't reach 63 degrees but that's fine because they are only stored there temporarily. The 63 degree thing is for long term storage.

The burgers you get are luke warm despite being fresh because the buns are luke warm, the condiments are cold, the cheese is cold and the patty is paper thin so it cools down real quick.

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BarbadosBob@reddit

It's McDonalds. They know you don't care about the quality of what you eat.

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Mysterious_Theory398@reddit

As someone that ate McDonalds multiple times a week for 30+ years (I know, I'm an animal)

The staff move at a snails pace, The queues in the drive through are massive and have you sitting in the car park as overflow.

And sometimes the kitchens are absolutely filthy. Standards have massively dropped and they weren't that high to start with.

And now with everything being so expensive I've had to simply had to stop eating McDonalds at all.

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PalicoHunter@reddit

Another thing with fast food places in general is how often orders are wrong. Whether it’s missing items or just an incorrect order.

This has really been exacerbated with the introduction of food delivery services like Uber Eats and Deliveroo. I understand it may be busy and mistakes happen but this happens far too often. I dread to think how much money I’ve wasted over the year across various “restaurants” and brands due to missing items or completely wrong orders.

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Obvious-Water569@reddit

McDonald's is just pure disappointment (except breakfast).

Ordering a BigMac meal is akin to buying a scratch card. Most of the time it's cold, poorly made and sad. Occasionally it'll be okay - warm, somewhat fresh and well put together. It's very very rare indeed to get a really good one; one that is the perfect temp, the bun nicely toasted and dressed, seasoned well and with fresh, salted fries.

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Jack_intheboxx@reddit

I haven't gone to McDonald's much since they Discontinued the Chicken Legend back in October 2022.

Always hated get barely any fries, the drink I could honestly care less and felt scammed for the price.

Might've gone to grab breakfast here and there and Family would sometimes ask if I wanted anything and I would just tell them to get a wrap of the day.

They moved from grilling and serving to cooking and keeping things warm in a staging oven.

I am afraid to tell you no it does not, all meat is held in heated trays and the burger assembled using that, fully assembled burgers are not hot held in nearly every single store.

I wouldn’t care but you can tell when the food has been sitting there for too long.

It’s not ideal when you end up paying over £10 for a delivery of a chewy cold burger and chips. I suppose the delivery companies are at fault as well but I don’t exactly live miles away from the nearest McDonalds. I had this 3 times in a row and just stopped ordering from them, other places seem to be better.

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SorryIGotBadNews@reddit

Do you have a job besides being a prick to people on Reddit for seemingly no reason?

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Chaossilenced@reddit

Years back while I was a student the system where they hot hold fully assembled food was the old system.

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tracey-ann12@reddit

It's the same with the Big Mac. Before when it used to get made when you ordered, everything was warm. Now when you order, the bottom piece of bread is practically cold to the point you can't eat it..

ladyatlanta@reddit

It needs to be held at 63C until it’s sold. Then it can drop in temperature as it’s being passed on to the customer

The fries also need to be thrown out after 15 minutes, because they’ve gone stale

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sosr@reddit

No, it's a defence (in reg 9) against the requirement of reg 8 (that food must be kept at 63C) that it was kept for service for less than 2 hours.

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ladyatlanta@reddit

Yeah, but, I have worked in the food industry in the past, hot food stays on the grill/warmer until it’s sold. I mean I never worked for McDonald’s, so they may do things differently, but I honestly doubt it. When I used to work in Empire some of those hotdogs were on the grill from 9am - 12am. And the nacho cheese people would rave about was reheated as well. And the popcorn (but then all popcorn is considered stale until heated up). And the buns would only be thrown out if they were in an opened packet (two buns to a packet).

UziTheG@reddit

Very fair makes sense

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kirkum2020@reddit

VAT goes on top of the price the moment they put heat lamps in those displays.

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UziTheG@reddit

Ahh, that makes sense, cheers

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BoopingBurrito@reddit

The pasties aren’t intended to be kept and served hot.

Which is why...they offer hot pastries for sale?

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Substantial_Page_221@reddit

Don't think they do offer hot pastries. I believe hot food is taxed higher than cold food, so by design they don't want to serve it hot.

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Ill-Ad-2122@reddit

It's not that hot food is taxed bigger by default, it's that specifically heated food is. They get round this by cooking it(so it's hot food when first put out on display) this means they can't reheat it to keep the vat exemption.

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Substantial_Page_221@reddit

Thank you for the correction, I wasn't aware.

Core memory updated.

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BoopingBurrito@reddit

Don't think they do offer hot pastries.

They take special care to not serve hot food by first putting it in an oven until it's piping hot, and then storing it under hot lamps.

Perhaps on paper they say it's served cold in order to commit tax evasion, but here in the real world we all know they serve hot pastries.

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diamondthedegu1@reddit

Greggs don't have heat lamps in their counters though. That's exactly why after a certain amount of time of the pastries being in the counter, they do indeed lose most/all of their heat, which is exactly why cold pastries are a common complaint about going to Greggs.

Yeah, there was a women that sued them, because she split a hot coffee on herself, which was ordered from McDonald's.

Coffee is hot, it isn't McDonald's fault she split it down herself 🤣

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jmarkmark@reddit

There is a bit of nuance to that case, McDonald's does sell it coffee unusually hot (80-90 rather than "around 80" most places sell) which is a big deal in terms of how fast it will scald

Also the woman originally asked for much lower damages, just $20k or so to cover her hospital bills, but the company refused to pay.

The ridiculousness was largely how large the jury award was, and that the jury seemed to ignore the shared liability the plaintiff should have had for being an idiot and sticking a hot cup of coffee between her legs.

There was also a similar case where they were successfully sued after a child was burned by a nugget.

Needless to say, it's not entirely a joke, avoiding serving food too hot is indeed something they have to manage.

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Glittering-Sink9930@reddit

The ridiculousness was largely how large the jury award was

It was $2.7 million, which was two days of McDonald's coffee sales. Then the judge reduced it to $640,000. i.e. half a day of coffee sales.

and that the jury seemed to ignore the shared liability the plaintiff should have had for being an idiot and sticking a hot cup of coffee between her legs.

"Applying the principles of comparative negligence, the jury found that McDonald's was 80 percent responsible for the incident and Liebeck was 20 percent at fault."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liebeck_v._McDonald%27s_Restaurants

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jmarkmark@reddit

>t was $2.7 million, which was two days of McDonald's coffee sales.

Kinda making my point.... they based the judgement on the fact McDonald's has deep pockets, not actual damages.

> was 80 percent responsible for the incident and Liebeck was 20 percent at fault.

Exactly... that's a pretty ridiculous split, even at a regular temperature, that would have scalded her, so suggesting the fault was mostly McDonald's is silly.

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Glittering-Sink9930@reddit

If you read the article, it's all explained quite clearly.

they based the judgement on the fact McDonald's has deep pockets, not actual damages.

It was $160,000 for damages. The $2.7 million was punitive damages. The whole point of punitive damages is that it's set at a level that incentivises the company not to do it again.

even at a regular temperature, that would have scalded her, so suggesting the fault was mostly McDonald's is silly.

Just read the article.

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jmarkmark@reddit

>t was $160,000 for damages. The $2.7 million was punitive damages.

Like I said, ridiculous. Batshit Americanism. No other country has punitive damages to remotely this degree, and yet the US has absolutely not one bit of improved consumer safety.

> Read the article

Dude, I read it before you commented, why do you think I got my facts correct?

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Glittering-Sink9930@reddit

What was the end result?

Read the article.

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jmarkmark@reddit

>Read the article.

Take your own damned advice:

According to a 2007 report, McDonald's had not reduced the temperature of its coffee, serving it at 176–194 °F (80–90 °C), relying on more sternly worded warnings

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Glittering-Sink9930@reddit

However, in 2013, the New York Times reported that McDonald's had lowered its service temperature to 170–180 °F (77–82 °C)

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jmarkmark@reddit

20 years later in a different region, do you really think it's related to the judgement in Florida?

Seriously at this point I'm thinking you must have been one of the idiots on that jury.

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Glittering-Sink9930@reddit

I'm not evaluating the evidence, I'm telling you what happened.

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jmarkmark@reddit

> I'm not evaluating the evidence,

Clearly.

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WanderWomble@reddit

Hmm her burns were so severe they fused the skin of her genitals to her thighs, required multiple skin grafts and an eight day stay in hospital. She also only sued originally for her medical costs.

Coffee should never be served at 88c.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liebeck_v._McDonald%27s_Restaurants is a ln excellent summary.

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Replaced_by_Robots@reddit

You should read the wiki page on the coffee case.

Yes she spilled on herself, but the coffee was so hot as to permanently disfigure the lady - even after multiple rounds of skin grafts. Years later she has a live in nurse because of the injury... thats a little more than mildly hot coffee

She repeatedly tried to settle for a few thousand (just to cover medical costs) and McDonalds refused every time.

Initially Cambs Council said 'nah mate, last inspection was alright', to which I replied that if that standard is their 'alright', then maybe I have to involve press and FSA directly and maybe 'your agents' need a refresher what food hygiene and safety looks like.

Three weeks later an email saying that they sent someone and both had to be written up for future inspections.

So yea. Not just they are rubbish, but councils also. All I can recommend if you truly care is report and not stop until something is done.

Went to Portugal recently and I’m ashamed to say one of our meals was McDonalds (we’d been for a lunch but it hadn’t filled us and we needed to make a pit stop so just grabbed a burger each to tide us over till dinner) and honestly the quality of food there was so much better than in the UK! The burgers were big, like advertising poster style and they were hot too. Tasted (dare I say) fresh!

It also wasn’t overrun with chavs and children and we were sat there like “how come the McDonalds’ in the Uk suck so much?”

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My McDonald's sometimes incredibly hot or cold

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frowawayakounts@reddit

My local McDonald’s is the same, if they just hired more staff or more competent people it’s not really a problem. I think there’s a bad attitude these days in the service industry and most of that is because you’re being over worked and under paid and treated like crap by the employer so no wonder you don’t care about the job. McDonald’s deserves to go bust tbh

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MightyPotato11@reddit

McDonalds as a brand is too busy eating Israel's ass

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Midnight_Manatee@reddit

Apparently it's what people want because they keep going back and shoveling the absolute slop down their throats.

15-20 min wait for a overpriced shit burger and anemic chips is what my local maccies is like 4/5 times now, I've just stopped going.

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WanderWomble@reddit

Do you eat McCain frozen chips? That's who produces McDonald's fries.

Do you eat supermarket meat?

Because that's the same quality as the meat served at McDonald's.

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underrated_prunes@reddit

Don’t know what supermarket you go to, but my local Tesco meat is pretty good. I can’t say it is anything like meat in McDonald’s. God knows what they do to it, but it tastes different

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FridayGeneral@reddit

Do you eat supermarket meat?

Because that's the same quality as the meat served at McDonald's.

That's a huge spectrum though. "Supermarket meat" ranges from horrible mechanically-recovered slop through to the best cuts of steak.

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ribenarockstar@reddit

If you 'special order' (eg without pickle) you'll get a freshly constructed one

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ThomasEichorst@reddit

This hasn’t been the case for a while, they’re all freshly constructed now but the patties come out of a plastic tray that they’ve been living in for hours

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Airborne_Stingray@reddit

Companies can do what they want. Who you gonna complain to

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fussyfella@reddit

Their HQ, Trading Standard, Environmental Heath at the local council to name just three ways to complain.

In my experience, the chains like McDonalds and KFC take complaints quite seriously - one KFC I complained about got shut down by the head office, the franchisee fired and new one took over.

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Airborne_Stingray@reddit

You can carry a thermometer around you everywhere and snag a picture of a cold burger to send them.

Sure, you might get a voucher for a free meal. The manager will get an email.

The food will still be cold, and people will keep paying for it.

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fussyfella@reddit

Of course it was not just one complaint. Buddy.

Fuzzy-River-2900@reddit

I love your scientific explanation 😃!

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Luke_Nukem_2D@reddit

The reason behind that is so they are quicker to cook, therefore being ideal for the 'fastfood' ideology of McDonalds. It's literally by design, and being like that from the outset.

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Immediate_Fly830@reddit

When you order add or remove an item . They have to cook it from scratch either way . Been doing this since I worked there 22 years ago

Well that doesn't work anymore, because they cook and store the meat in a UHC now and they build all brugers to order. The whole burger isn't premade and kept warm like they used to

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SquiffSquiff@reddit

This explains so much. Given up on waiting for fresh made cold big macs

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SheRoseFromTheAshes@reddit

Was not aware of that .

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Immediate_Fly830@reddit

Its pretty much since they started doing that everything's gone downhill tbh

Orders are slow AF, burgers are cold, because they just toast the buns, slap on some cheese that's probably been chilled and throw it in a box. And you wait 10 minutes for it to happen.

That used to work in the old system but for a few years now they hold meat the same way they do chicken, so that wouldn’t work these days.

If you can ask for the meat without seasoning you’d be able to get something fresh, but not sure how possible this is.

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SheRoseFromTheAshes@reddit

It can even be as simple as adding extra sauce or pickle so it won’t cost anything

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firesky25@reddit

if it is hot held at a safe temp of above 63°C for however long they allow, it is going to drop fairly quickly to a “cold” temp below 63°C when served. It doesn’t stay at the danger zone temp range long enough to be unsafe, so it is still within legal laws. Now, if this is hold hold temp is raised to 75 or higher, food will stay warmer but dry out quicker, meaning they have to recook it more frequently.

There is no law requiring food be served at 63. It must be held at 63.

https://www.food.gov.uk/sites/default/files/media/document/hot-holding.pdf

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morkjt@reddit

Ha. Clearly someone who has never worked in McDonald’s on the night shifts and been told by management to change the timer on the food bin when nobody is looking so it doesn’t get thrown away. Seen nuggets 6 hours old sold many a time.

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AceNova2217@reddit

We just do it in front of everyone at my branch, customers can't see it and the managers teach us to do it.

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jmarkmark@reddit

Absolutely true: i've never seen that, despite working at McDonald's for five years.

Any franchisee doing that regularly would quickly lose their franchise. Plus no restaurant would stay open if they have such low demand they can't use up one basket of nuggets in six hours.

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DarthScabies@reddit

I always remove the gherkin from my burgers. It's fresher and hotter then.

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wjdhay@reddit

I really don’t know why you’re eating this stuff.

There's nothing to get away with. They don't have to serve it at that temperature. It just has to have been cooked to that temp at minimum.

There are other rules around hot holding, but they're less relevant in answer to your specific question.

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ElectricToast@reddit

I worked at McDonalds back in 2012/2013 when they switched from the system where burgers were batch cooked and assembled then kept in a red hot storage bin, to making everything to order.

When they batch cooked the burgers it was much better because they stayed hot and the cheese would melt, all the other toppings would get up to temperature also.

Now everything is made to order and the burger meat is kept in a UHC, meaning they'll assemble the burger when the order comes through, the problem with this is that they'll not temper the other ingredients, the burger meat may be red hot, but by the time they've put literally ICE COLD cheese and salad on them, the entire burger is cold.

Most of the time my McDonald's is piping hot to the point I have to wait for it to cool down.

I find if you order a Big Mac they are always warm not hot, but I think it's due to it having mote cold salad and sauce than the rest

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Ndorphinmachina@reddit

Hadn't really considered this. I don't eat there much anymore. But with the exception of their disgusting "apple pie" which seems to be cooked in actual hell. I don't think I've ever opened a burger and said "oh that's too hot, I'll start with the chips.

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LasagneFiend@reddit

Mcdonalds isnt a fast food business, they are in the property business. They make most of their money renting out buildings they own, to franchisees. Who in turn gets profit from the food.

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Particular_Meeting57@reddit

I prefer my McDonalds warm. I hate when i get roasting hot fresh fries, give me the warm ones that have sat. In the salt for a while.

I'd love to know how not being able to stomach ridiculously expensive food is elitist!

Seriously, have you ever tried it??

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Plenty_Ample@reddit

Your taste runs counter to the vast majority. You're the very essence of elitist -- at least that's image you're trying to project. Dudes like you claim to prefer girls with small breasts and read books at Starbucks.

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Scarred_fish@reddit

Haha well I'm obviously not good at being a stereotype. Wouldn't be seen dead in a Starbucks (only marginally better than MacDonalds etc if you're completely stuck/drunk).

I do ride a quad wearing a boilersuit most days.

And I just love tits, size doesn't matter, only who they're attached to ;)

Still find it hard to believe anyone actually enjoys stuff like MacDonalds/Burger King etc. It's so far removed from real food.

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Plenty_Ample@reddit

till find it hard to believe anyone actually enjoys stuff like MacDonalds/Burger King etc.

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the_merry_pom@reddit

It’s a grab and go set-up. I’ve caught a branch or two early doors on the way to work and the serving has been as close as you’d get it to piping hot, considerably superior to ordering later in the day, so that tells you the increased foot traffic further in to the morning and the use of the heated shelving probably contribute to items cooling down very quickly overall.

It’s basic quick bites, staffed mostly by people that don’t actually want to be there in an ideal world and a sizeable proportion of the clientele are arguably addicted to its offerings, so it’s not surprising they get away with it on balance.

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glasgowgeg@reddit

I've always wondered why McDonald's seem to get away with serving food that is under 63° Celsius.

What aspect of this do you believe is against the law?

"Hot food when held must be kept at 63°C or above. You can keep it below 63°C for up to two hours."

ZakFellows@reddit

I tend to get served pretty quickly in Maccies.

Only problem now is that apart from breakfast, the food is terrible. My taste buds have just completely been turned off by it.

That's a bit of urban legemd. Unless it's a massive high volume McDonald's no sandwich is assembled before the order. And if it is a massive McDonald's it's irrelevant because they're going through enough that nothing sits in the bin more than two minutes.

The parts (the buns/patties) etc, will be pre-cooked and sitting in a warmer for 15-20 minutes, but adding/removing pickles will have no impact on whether you get a patty from warmer or not.

raskalUbend@reddit

If you want good food you're in the wrong restaurant. People don't complain because they don't expect better

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bsnimunf@reddit

It just has to be cooked to a certain temp and held at a certain temp it doesn't have to be served at a certain temp. Obviously putting a 63 Deg c 3 mm thin patty into cold bread, lettuce and sauce isn't going to result in a 63 Deg c burger or patty.

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Key_Milk_9222@reddit

McDonalds prepare food preemptively and are supposed to throw it away after something like 5 minutes. If you're not happy with your order why not complain and ask for another one?

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Choccybizzle@reddit

Since they started cooking things to order, or whatever the new style is, I haven’t had an issue with this. I also never think that drive through or Uber eats takes priority over me, if my number in the queue is 5, it’s rare that more than the 4 in front get served before me. Maybe I’m lucky.

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House_Of_Thoth@reddit

Last time they did that they lost a lawsuit and now we have to be told coffee is hot

(Small /s)

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Spare-Tourist-6898@reddit

Because we keep going back and buying it

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Cultural_Horse_7328@reddit

I swear to Charles, if they serve me a 63 degree temperature salad, I'll "harrrumph"!

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ProminentFox@reddit (OP)

🤣🤣🤣

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Reported.

McDonalds Lincoln

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