Applying for a Certificat de nationalité française (CNF)

Posted by glassheadedwallaby@reddit | expats | View on Reddit | 17 comments

Hi, all - I'm a U.S. Citizen born in the United States to an American mother and French (born in Tunisia, French citizenship) father. I've been wanting to apply for my CNF for a long time now, but have a few questions while I'm putting this dossier together to make sure I'm not wasting my time. Would love if anyone knows the answers to any of the following questions:

* Will I run into issues if I don't have a marriage certificate between my mother and father? They were never married...so there's not much I can do about that. My dad is listed on my birth certificate and I have a copy of my Livret de Famille which clearly shows my dad's name, so I am hoping that is evidence enough.

* My dad said he never "registered" my birth with the consulate. Is there a way to double check that?

* I'm mainly going to all of this trouble because I'd like to be able to travel easily to and within France/the EU, and I'd like for those benefits to go to my children as well. But is a CNF enough? Will they get any benefit to this if I'm given my CNF, or no? (they are both minors)

* Anything I'm failing to consider?

Thank you!

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NoFascistAgreements@reddit

I just happened upon this post. I'm mostly through the process of compiling all the documents for my situation (born in USA to USA mother, USA/French father (who was born in the US to a french mother and whose last interaction with the french state was a 1985-issued passport). I'm worried they'll just deny based on my father not interacting enough with the french state.

Also, when you had the CNF in hand and you went about transcribing your birth cert, did you send in the original CNF, some kind of certified copy, or just a photocopy? It's not clear to me from the consulate's application forms.

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marccerisier@reddit

There is absolutely a timeframe for how long it’s been since you interacted with the government, but you’d need to check to see what it is. My dad said it’s 50 years, but he’s not a lawyer and regulations do change from time to time.

Once you have the CNF, oddly, you just use a basic photocopy. They can’t be reissued without going through the whole process again, so you keep it safe.

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NoFascistAgreements@reddit

Thanks that makes sense.

One other question, I have a 3 year old. Is it strictly necessary for them to have a CNF to get them a French passport or is it sufficient to get their birth certificate transcribed and then submit my own CNF as evidence of their French nationality on their first passport request.

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marccerisier@reddit

The lawyer I worked with suggested requesting one for my daughter at the same time as me just as a “if you’re already doing it…” sort of thing, but my understanding of the policy currently followed by the consulates is that it is only required if the birth is not registered by majority (18). I’m not a lawyer, though, so your mileage may vary.

NickinSac@reddit

Hi there, going through a similar process. If your french parent does not have a CNF (but has a passport and is registered with fee ch abroad), how do you prove that they were a citizen at your birth? What's perplexing is I have a passport and my parent too, but that doesn't seem to be enough to get me a CNF?

I've done this exact process (American mother, French Father, birth not registered, nor their marriage registered on his French birth certificate—just in America). I'll be honest, it wasn't the easiest process, and required boatloads of paperwork—all apostilled and translated, of course. Knowing the scale of the task, I did hire a lawyer in Paris that was very familiar with the process, and while slow, was successful.

- If you father has a Livret de Famille, my first presumption would be that the French admin knows about the relationship. I would be curious what details are registered in his livret.

- You can check that you were registered or not, firstly by seeing if you're in the livret. Secondly, if they're in a good mood and you ask nicely, the consulate is able to check the register of foreign births to see if you're there. Thirdly, you could just request a copy of your French birth certificate from the registry in Nantes—if it's found, there's not necessarily a reason for you to request a CNF. If it's not found, your birth was indeed not registered.

- When I requested my CNF, I requested one for my daughter at the same time—which just required that I send the paperwork necessary to justify her birth, and my marriage.

When you get your CNF, you'll have a list of tasks to complete (assuming your birth is not registered):

1) Register your birth with the consulate responsible for the state of your birth (either LA or DC)

2) Register your marriage and request your Livret de Famille.

3) Register your children's births and request that they be added to your Livret de Famille. (Depending on where all of this happened, you might be able to combine some or all of 1–3—in my case, my birth had to go to LA, and my marriage and daughters birth went to DC)

4) Then with the births registered and French birth certificates issued, you can schedule appointments to request your French passports from the consulate that services your area. Note—you need to have a French ID already to be able to request a child's passport, so you'll have to go through that process first for yourself, and then with it in hand then repeat the process for your children.

5) Then get yourself registered on the consulate's registry, and participate as much as possible as a French citizen. If your citizenship is ever questioned in the future, it will be useful to show printed proof that you were registered and participated in elections on a regular basis. My father thankfully knew this as his citizenship was questioned in the process of the issuance of my CNF, and he was able to show his military records, consulate registration, voting receipts, old passports, etc... They take this very seriously, especially when the citizen in question doesn't live in France for the majority of their lives.

If you have a French birth certificate already, you wouldn't necessarily need the CNF and would skip to step 2 above. I think the only difference it makes if you have a CNF before you register yours or your childrens births (if you also request a CNF for them) is that they will notate the existence of the CNF on the birth certificate, which makes for a much stronger claim of citizenship.

It's not a fun process, and I was very happy to have a lawyer who knew the system inside and out preparing and managing my request for me. Took about 2 years start to finish for me, with the warning to expect up to 3 years. In reality, I know when they actually took mine out of the pile to look at it because they questioned my father's citizenship. When the additional supporting documentation was submitted, the final documents were quickly issued. I don't think the actual process is that hard for them to manage, they just get an insane volume of requests every year, and all of the requests are handled by one office.

Bonne chance

tinoturner6969@reddit

Are you saying that if your birth outside France was registered in Nantes, you can bypass the CNF process? I’m getting a lot of “maybes”

Yes, at the time I got my passport, and registered my daughters birth, that would be correct. Policies change all the time, so you’d have to check with your local consulate. Theoretically, you’d just need to show up to your passport with a current copy of your French birth certificate and a photo and you’d be good to go. As my birth wasn’t registered, I first needed to submit my CNF (and a thousand other things) to register my birth. Then I just needed my birth certificate to get my passport.

Good lord, my fingers are crossed. I’m waiting to hear back from the DC consulate for confirmation.

happytuesday7@reddit

This is a lovely explanation! I am starting this process and am looking for a lawyer to help me. Would you please be able to share the details of the lawyer you worked with?

https://www.avocatsmodena.fr/

Remember it’s August, so they’re likely on vacation this month.

Thank you very much!

Forsaken_Milk4922@reddit

How did you prove that your father was french at the time of your birth ?

By basically supplying enough info that he too could have gotten a CNF if he needed one. That’s part of the whole process.

In my case my father got his cnf after my birth but his birth was registered and he had carte d’immatriculation consulaire and and a passport which he got before my birth is that enough proof I’m 18 by the way

Could be. The rules to change over time. You’d want to submit a copy of his CNF with your application. The rules changed during my 2 year wait in such a way that my father had to submit additional information for consideration that wasn’t required at submission.

glassheadedwallaby@reddit (OP)

Thank you so much for this explanation - so helpful. I was going to do the work myself, but wondering if you'd mind sharing the lawyer's information you worked with? Maybe I will outsource it instead...