How does a Trident Submarine know if a nuclear attack has started on the UK?

[-]

snakeoildriller@reddit

You might enjoy [Le Chant du Loup](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7458762/?ref_=ext_shr_lnk) set aboard a French submarine.

Reply

[-]

''Quick enough to send a timely retaliation strike'' What needs to be quick about it? Nuclear-powered subs have been able to stay at sea for enormous periods of time, and can spend a large chunk of that submerged. They could be out there waiting LONG after nuclear annihilation has happened to most of us. They would have plenty of time to determine what has gone on and to decide the best course of action. HOW do they do that? The rest of the comments have already explained that. You seem to be quite dismissive for somebody who asked the question because they didn't know the answer though. What kind of answer did you think you'd get?

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

You need to retaliate in a timely fashion or it’s not a retaliation any more

Reply

[-]

TheWorldOuterHeaven@reddit

I disagree on both points, so you tell me; 1 - What is a timely response for nuclear annihilation, and why? 2 - What's the cut-off for retaliation, and why?

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

Like that we can not say But if the school yard bully punches you and you don’t punch him back till next week, it’s no longer a retaliation

Reply

[-]

FrankSarcasm@reddit

Personally if I was a submarine commander and everyone else shot their bolt , you would be best served by being the remaining nuclear force. So I wouldn't set my missiles off , I'd go and hide and wait to become the dominant super power .

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

You’d have to follow the LOLR son

Reply

[-]

FrankSarcasm@reddit

Presumably, if everyone has shot their bolt , and I'm left , that's us winning , so we can go rock up to a continent that's not been obliterated and reinstate the British Empire in say Peru.

Reply

[-]

MushyBeans@reddit

If you Google 'HMS vanguard cut out diagram', you will be able to spot the number of masts and periscopes that can stick out the water while at periscope depth.

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

Those will be detectable

Reply

[-]

MushyBeans@reddit

Yes, they are. But why do you think they spent millions developing and installing them onto the bombers? Source: I'm an ex- Royal Navy submariner

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

How is life on the submarine ? Looks way more cramped than a surface ship

Reply

[-]

FrankSarcasm@reddit

Gives you a bit of a sinking feeling I think.

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

I’m just imagining if someone farts the smell never leaves the boat

Reply

[-]

Thandoscovia@reddit

If BBC Radio 4 goes offline, then it’s goodbye for me and you

Reply

[-]

IsWasMaybeAMefi@reddit

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letters_of_last_resort

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

Little know fact- Liza Trust wasn’t in office long enough to write a LOLR

Reply

[-]

Puborectaliss@reddit

She’d probs ask to nuke the woke nonsense

Reply

[-]

Dr-Maturin@reddit

She was outlasted by the lettuce of last resort

Reply

[-]

GlutBelly@reddit

Thank fuck

Reply

[-]

Equivalent_Parking_8@reddit

That's a really interesting wiki. Thanks

Reply

[-]

HeWhoHasABeard@reddit

We all know those letters just say Nuke the French. Regardless of what’s going on we have the stay true to our British values

Reply

[-]

chef_26@reddit

Before they set sail they are each given a letter of last resort. This details and checks they must perform before enacting the letter above the standard checks. Radio for Admiralty, Radio for any known overseas base (Cyprus as example) and presence of BBC World Service from London. If all checks fail, the letter is opened which might have additional instruction to check. The letter can then detail what should be done, typically this would be empty every nuke you have on these targets then flee to a friendly nation and support as best you can. Modern times it’ll be something like; bomb fuck out of Moscow and flee to Australia.

Reply

[-]

Independent_Elk_7936@reddit

Matt Berry will inform them.

Reply

[-]

DanTheLegoMan@reddit

😂😂😂 Release the nuclear weaponssss!!!

Reply

[-]

Only-Support-3760@reddit

By carrier carp

Reply

[-]

ARobertNotABob@reddit

ELF https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communication_with_submarines

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

Thanks! Seems they must have a way to send the order then from the mainland, no need for the “wait till radio 4 stops” nonsense

Reply

[-]

ChefPaula81@reddit

Yes but if we’ve been nuked, there won’t be anyone left in Britain to send that order, hence, they’ll still have to check if the radio4 has stopped broadcasting, just to confirm that London is gone

Reply

[-]

TypicalPen798@reddit

The radio 4 thing is not nonsense, it’s just not the first thing that happens. If there is a nuclear attack and UK is wiped out, and no orders have been given. The commander won’t know what has happened and can’t get in touch with anyone. This maybe a communication error or the people on the other side might be busy (could be killed for example but not nuclear related), it’s unlikely but still possible. If all these attempts fail and then they go back to old school technology that checks BBC signal and then commander will then make a decision if to fire or not. It’s a fail safe protocol. Remember submarines have fully autonomy and can fire nukes without authorisation under certain conditions.

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

Sounds like horse shit. But if it’s on Wikipedia it must be true !!

Reply

[-]

AdmRL_@reddit

If you need more proof: [Radio silence puts subs on nuclear alert - Manchester Evening News](https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/radio-silence-puts-subs-on-nuclear-1157478)

Reply

[-]

TypicalPen798@reddit

The radio 4 thing is not nonsense, it’s just not the first thing that happens. If there is a nuclear attack and UK is wiped out, and no orders have been given. The commander won’t know what has happened and can’t get in touch with anyone. This maybe a communication error or the people on the other side might be busy (could be killed for example but not nuclear related), it’s unlikely but still possible. If all these attempts fail and then they go back to old school technology that checks BBC signal and then commander will then make a decision if to fire or not. It’s a fail safe protocol.

Reply

[-]

Iamamancalledrobert@reddit

This is maybe me being dense, but— if they’re not detected, it doesn’t need to be timely. It only needs to be quick if you have first strike capability: you need to fire all your nukes from your silos before the silos themselves are nuked. But, well, it’s obvious where silos are; they cannot move. A sub can fire for as long as it evades being spotted

Reply

[-]

P2P-BSH@reddit

They check if Radio 4 is still on the air. If it isn't they will open the letter of last resort that's written by the PM which insists them of their next moves. No one knows what the letter says.

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

How will they know to surface, to check that radio 4 is still on air?

Reply

[-]

ChampionshipComplex@reddit

They dont need to surface - there is a device which can be detached from the submerged sub which floats to the surface on a cable and can be used to communicate before being retracted.

Reply

[-]

Automatic-Expert-231@reddit (OP)

That device will be detectable

Reply

[-]

ChampionshipComplex@reddit

A buoyant cable antenna can be trailed at shallow depth and doesn't even need to break the surface. They will regularly need to check their position - and cant rely on dead reckoning for too long.

Reply

[-]

shitthrower@reddit

The subs could be literally anywhere in the world though, so it’d be like finding a needle in a haystack

Reply

[-]

cougieuk@reddit

They won't want to miss the Archers every night.

Reply

[-]

DaiYawn@reddit

'use Slough as a zeroing test site, no one will know' ~BoJo the clown being banterous

Reply

[-]

Cuntmaster_flex@reddit

Nice try Russia.

Reply

[-]

Personal_Director441@reddit

Loose women will go off the air, dead giveaway that.

Reply

[-]

AutoModerator@reddit

**Please help keep AskUK welcoming!** - When repling to submission/post please **make genuine efforts to answer the question given**. Please no jokes, judgements, etc. - **Don't be a dick** to each other. If getting heated, just block and move on. - This is a strictly **no-politics** subreddit! Please help us by reporting comments that break these rules. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*

Reply

Reply to Post

45 Comments