TheaterFire

Catastrophic flooding across parts of New England

Posted by GoodDayMate_@reddit | collapse | View on Reddit | 135 comments

Rescue teams from Massachusetts and other states rushed into Vermont on Monday after heavy rain drenched parts of Northeast, washing out roads, forcing evacuations.

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135 Comments

GoodDayMate_@reddit (OP)

This is related to collapse as we are seeing multiple states undergoing "once in a 1000 year flooding." We will see events like this across the world way more frequently as the jet stream slows and El Nino starts gaining strength. Get ready folks this is tame compared to what we will be seeing in 10 years.
View on Reddit #5170106

Fezdani@reddit

What do you expect we'll be seeing in 10 years?
View on Reddit #5211329

finishedarticle@reddit

2033.
View on Reddit #5246755

Fezdani@reddit

We'll look back fondly on the good ol days
View on Reddit #5285361

ItilityMSP@reddit

Sure is a lot 1000 year events happening....hmm maybe we need to adapt our calculations for the future not the past.
View on Reddit #5170998

GoodDayMate_@reddit (OP)

We can't even do that, the climate is so out of wack and everything is happening faster than expected to the point where future calculations would still be wrong
View on Reddit #5171177

PervyNonsense@reddit

Exponential, so more floods, sooner, at 10,000 year levels. When was the last flood in Vermont? Or serious weather event involving rain? If it was a decade ago, it will happen again inside a year... could be a month away, too. Continuously blown away people aren't reacting. None of the rest is a surprise... but the complete disinterest is creepy af. It really is like watching someone burn their own house down and you ask them what they're doing, and their response is something like " housekeeping. Gotta keep the place clean. Going to hand it down to my kids so they can raise their family here"..."and... uh... where are your kids?"... "inside. Theyre studying. My daughter's getting married next week. She's expecting"... "help! Neighbors! There's kids in this house that's on fire!"... *Neighbors show up with jerry cans* "hey Don, did we hear you needed a hand?"... "nah, that was this jackass. He's clearly mentally ill"... *Neighbors douse the house in gas, the fire spreads* "isn't Hailey getting married soon?"... *flames climb the walls*..."next week! You didn't get your invitation? Well, you're all invited! We're having it at the house" And how are we not looking at this and making the connection that this isn't corporations dumping stuff in the air, it just us, living. We're responsible for all of this and we made it by following the rules.... which means the rules are wrong. All of it is wrong. But there's no one to warn because they're too busy... throwing gas on the fire.
View on Reddit #5180822

CodaMo@reddit

Last event was Irene in 2011, and these flooding levels even surpassed that tropical storm. I will say, Vermonters do acknowledge the causes more than other regions. Our state has historically pushed big corporations out and actively seeks to keep them out. You can find everything you need local and family owned. Even utilities. But, you’re right, it’s all just us living and it all still contributes. Like every brook feeding the river. For now, our capitol sits underwater, my main highway to access the city is completely gone, but suns out today. I’m thankful. Our state is still largely undeveloped forest. I can’t imagine how different this might have been if the dense sponge of forest floor had been replaced with concrete. Or if we hadn’t made headway with programs to dismantle the dams along every nook of rivers. Or if every bit of river access had been built up as expensive bowling alleys of waterfront property.
View on Reddit #5187283

RandyCheeseburgers01@reddit

>Our state is still largely undeveloped forest. As pretty as the forests are in Vermont, I was surprised to learn that almost none of it is old growth; most of the land had been cleared for agriculture when it was settled. Most of what is there now is second or third growth.
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islet_deficiency@reddit

> Our state is still largely undeveloped forest. I can’t imagine how different this might have been if the dense sponge of forest floor had been replaced with concrete. That's why most experts don't think that the 1927 floods will ever be surpassed. At that time, >80% of the land was deforested for sheep and cattle grazing. The open ground allowed significantly more runoff than is possible today. The 1927 floods were absolutely insane. Right now the Winooski river in essex junction is at 20.1 ft with flood stage beginning at 12ft. In 1927, the river was measured at 51ft (!!!!). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9k80YezvWI
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jenredditor@reddit

>Which dams were dismantled? I remember that Marshfield almost lost their dam during Irene.
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CodaMo@reddit

I don't see any plans for the Marshfield Reservoir, though VNRC has a lot more in the pipeline with state funding: [https://freevermontrivers.org/projects/](https://freevermontrivers.org/projects/) [https://vnrc.org/clean-water/dam-removal/](https://vnrc.org/clean-water/dam-removal/)
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GreenPL8@reddit

I'm worried Vermont is going to burn one day. There is a LOT of forest at risk of drought and fire.
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bookpants@reddit

That is such a good metaphor for how dire this is, my God.
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danj503@reddit

Hailey finally settled down eh? Boy we had some wild times back in college. Ah the one that got away…
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thinkingahead@reddit

Ugh, poignant
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estebar01@reddit

This analogy is going to stick with me. Well said and also horrifying.
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ProfessorStrawbs@reddit

I can never unread that and you’re totally accurate.
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ItilityMSP@reddit

Well basing it on the past won’t help... We can expect to see this every year somewhere and some times you will be in the news too.
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Hugin___Munin@reddit

Here in Australia we have had major multiple flooding events on the east coast . Many areas are no longer offered insurance or it's just expensive. What's interesting is people act like insurance is a right , that an insurance company should offer reasonably price policies regardless of risk . It just shows the lack of understanding about how insurance works .
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greatunknownpub@reddit

> It just shows the lack of understanding about how insurance works . Right. If people would just realize already that insurance only exists to take as much of their money as possible, and then to find loopholes to not pay out when they have a claim then insurance companies would have much higher profit margins.
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Hugin___Munin@reddit

Yeah it's a bet , the insurance companies bet your house won't burn or flood and you're betting it will . And if it does there are a multitude of exclusion clauses for them not to pay.
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EpicEmmett@reddit

The problem is that in the US, while insurance isn't mandated by law, home insurance is typically required by the lender if you're taking out a mortgage for a home. Not many of us can just pay for a house 100% down. So when a home becoming uninsurable, that effectively takes the house off the market for the majority of people. Not only does it make that house hard to buy, but if the current residents want to move, they're looking at taking a huge financial lose because the house they're leaving is so hard to sell. I think a lot of Americans wouldn't give two hoots about whether or not their home is insured, but it's not really our choice, it's the mortgage companies.
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fuckityfuckfuckf_ck@reddit

I am deeply interested to see what the housing market does as less and less homes become insured. Worst fear is that wealthy foreign investors buy up all uninsured housing in cash and rent to everyone and home ownership completely dies.
View on Reddit #5191498

theCaitiff@reddit

That's what is already happening. They're the only ones able to "take the financial risk" of having homes burn/flood/hurricane. And by take the financial risk, I should be clear that I mean raise everyone else's rent to pay for it.
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Thissmalltownismine@reddit

LOOK MA WE'RE FAMOUS!
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rp_whybother@reddit

Floods in India, China, Russia, NY, and many other places at the moment.
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danknerd@reddit

What they really should say, which I heard a need station say recently, is not really 1 time in 1000 years but should be seen as a 0.1% chance of happening.
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bernmont2016@reddit

That nuance doesn't really matter when those odds were calculated based on decades-old data that has become completely outdated in today's ever-worsening climate.
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danknerd@reddit

Oh I agree with you completely. However, when speaking to viewers, readers, etc. having a baseline reference is helpful for communication. Now granted, I would prefer it is just stated more matter of fact... "Look people, we fucked up the planet and these things are going to happen every year in every location. No one is safe, you will get no peace! But hey, for a brief moment in time shareholders profits were amazing!"
View on Reddit #5195747

EpicPlays718@reddit

I'm so so annoyed hearing phrases like this still. They have to act like the paradigm hasn't shifted at all costs to protect the status quo.
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Prestigious_Bobcat29@reddit

Can’t wait to go into work tomorrow (regional planning) and get told to keep it down when I say we need to throw out the flood plain maps. And I’m in New England!
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Water_Wonk@reddit

I am a planner too and I feel the same way, although I am in the Southwest and have the opposite problem. Hang in there!
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PandaBoyWonder@reddit

LOL!!! "Stop talking about this stuff, you are making the investors nervous!"
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GreenPL8@reddit

What's funny is I moved to VT from TX to escape bullshit like Hurricane Harvey, Tax Day Flood, Memorial Day Flooding, etc. 3 years in a row of 1000-yr events. Now I live on a hill, so my house is fine. But we have to realize that there will be no 'normal' weather for the rest of our lives, and expect and plan for events like this.
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massiveboner911@reddit

China is having severe flooding again as well.
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imminentjogger5@reddit

Fukuoka Japan is also experiencing catastrophic flooding from rain currently
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Suckamanhwewhuuut@reddit

Give it 3 years
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IntrigueDossier@reddit

RemindMe! 3 years “how’s the Niño working out?”
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View on Reddit #5180420

Plane-Valuable6117@reddit

#ITS JUST GOD. DONT WORRY. UNLE**SS** YOU THINK YOURE A GOD 🤣
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nommabelle@reddit

Hmm, time to cross of NE USA as safe haven for climate change. Is nowhere safe?
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Arte1008@reddit

San Francisco. It’s 65 degrees all summer.
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are-e-el@reddit

Damn it, we were targeting New England to escape the Midwest red states. First we had to cross the PNW off the list, and now NE. I don’t think there’ll be any true safe havens anymore
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baconraygun@reddit

Dang, maybe we should try Alaska? But I know they had intense flooding this last year as well.
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nommabelle@reddit

You guys decide, just tell me where I'm moving! But really, I think that's one of the few good options left still within USA (for Americans not wanting/able to get visas elsewhere) I wouldn't mind living in town with a lot of collapseniks. I think, especially the active community, is reasonable and proactive towards our future (well, current, lol) issues
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Surfing_magic_carpet@reddit

Maybe the solution is to no longer try to be safe and just accept that it's only a matter of time for all of us.
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nommabelle@reddit

Same. I'm also from Midwest, and wanted to move to the same spots for largely for political and cultural reasons so I can fit in better, but also a bit for climate change. Fortunately I have Scotland as an option, which I consider stronger every day it seems now
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bernmont2016@reddit

Pretty much. Canada was another top pick until recently too.
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Hour-Stable2050@reddit

Yep. Especially avoid the coasts of Canada or areas close to the Boreal forest. The Great Lakes region has been getting lucky lately. Toronto hasn’t had major flooding in 10 years but I expect our winning streak to end soon. And we now have wildfire smoke every summer, although that’s more of an inconvenience.
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WhoopieGoldmember@reddit

Oh look another "once in a 1000 year event."
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Displaced2017@reddit

It IS a 1000 year event. In base 500.
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n0ahbody@reddit

Quite a few of those this year
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WhoopieGoldmember@reddit

Yeah the year 1023 must have been absolutely wild.
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roblewk@reddit

I was painting my bathroom today and thinking “the world is coming to an end, and I’m painting my bathroom.”
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Surfing_magic_carpet@reddit

At least I'm sure it'll look nice for the end of the world (:
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Hour-Stable2050@reddit

Interesting that many people have been moving to Vermount because it has been listed as the best state for avoiding climate change issues. Now the entire state is flooding.
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Amp__Electric@reddit

Personally know a few Californians who moved to VT last year to avoid the wildfires. Can't help but laff at the hubris of it all.
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PowerfulContext1325@reddit

Here in Boston, it's been raining so much and so often that the sewerage system spilled into Massachusetts Bay, making swimming at area beaches hazardous to health. I'd drive down to Cape Cod for a swim, but the Cape in summer is a vacation spot for Great White sharks everywhere.
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Ford-daily710@reddit

inner bay no sharks
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Striper_Cape@reddit

For extra fun, remember that the Northeast is supposed to get off "light" on the medium term effects of global heating. This is considered light. Sick
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Darkwing___Duck@reddit

People say it's no worse than Irene. That's fairly light on the scale of possibilities.
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crazylamb452@reddit

No worse than Irene, but keep in mind this was just a “regular” storm. What happens when the next Irene/tropical storm/hurricane hits the northeast?
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MuelDaddyLongLegs@reddit

My thoughts as well….haven’t seen one spin up and into the northeast yet and this year and that Atlantic is MAGMA hot, there’s a trail of bath water temps clear from Florida to New York and fuuuck that shit is gonna hit hard once it does
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Striper_Cape@reddit

If a flash flood destroys your home and all of your possessions, you can die just from the loss of shelter within a day or so. Now pretend that FEMA/Military isn't coming to help because they are already stretched thin due to "regular storms" flooding or knocking down other people's homes. "Light" still sucks ass. More than that unlucky woman would have died if emergency services were unable to assist.
View on Reddit #5207686

Darkwing___Duck@reddit

It's a personal tragedy and catastrophe, for sure. I'm just a bit zoomed out here.
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MBA922@reddit

It's a big deal that an "ordinary summer storm" would be hurricane Irene. The tropical storm flooding will happen more often up there too.
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Dark-Delegate@reddit

Thanks, Biden!
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Dark-Delegate@reddit

Forgot the /s tag oops
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ArtSchnurple@reddit

I hate that thing but this is one case where it would have actually come in handy. A lot of people these days would say that with zero irony.
View on Reddit #5215432

NarcolepticTreesnake@reddit

It really is the correct sentiment. Rinse and repeat for whomever the neoliberal economic uniparty puts up next time too.
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MartoufCarter@reddit

LOL.
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NarcolepticTreesnake@reddit

People do be getting kind of defensive about their turd sandwich with sprinkles on top instead of a turd sandwich with mustard. Y'all still out here eating turds.
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Bellybutton_fluffjar@reddit

Thanks all leaders of all governments in every western country over the last 70 years!
View on Reddit #5187083

Lorkaj-Dar@reddit

Thanks, Obama!
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Aswanghuhu@reddit

Thanks, Edward! (my neighbor)
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plopseven@reddit

So what happens when homes can no longer be insured? Is that what finally pops the housing bubble? Hard to justify paying $1.5M for an uninsurable house that was $700K three years ago.
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GreenPL8@reddit

People are moving to Texas and Florida. They're not going to care until it's too late.
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plopseven@reddit

I don’t really feel bad for anyone moving to either of those states in this political (and environmental) climate. I feel a little bad for people who already live there, I guess. Except my out-of-state landlord.
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Hour-Stable2050@reddit

I feel bad for people who have moved away from bad areas to Vermount thinking it would be better.
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bernmont2016@reddit

No insurance means no mortgage means prices have to drop drastically.
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plopseven@reddit

Yes, in theory, but supply and demand means people still need housing whether it’s insured or not. You know, sort of how nobody has proper healthcare coverage but we all still just sort of…exist…sort of.
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bernmont2016@reddit

Of course "people still need housing", but if they can't get a mortgage to buy it, very few people have hundreds of thousands of dollars sitting in a bank account to spend up-front out-of-pocket. So the price of a house has to drop to what the potential buyers do have sitting around, which is usually a *lot* less.
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FantasticOutside7@reddit

No insurance means no insurance requirement for mortgages. Remember no insurance.
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plopseven@reddit

This feels like the Getty quote: *”If you owe the bank $100 that's your problem. If you owe the bank $100 million, that's the bank's problem.”* Are un-insurable homes going to be a problem for lenders or borrowers first? It all feels like a giant game of chicken, except one side constantly gets bailed out and the other is told to “make it work.”
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OhNoMgn@reddit

I’m in VT and things have been going downhill fast all day. Expecting to wake up to worse news, as the rivers are expected to crest well over flood levels overnight. This is basically unheard of for this area and I fear it is just the beginning as I look towards the next 5-10+ years. Vermont is a special place, especially to those of us who call it home, and swaths of it are being washed away before our eyes. I grew up here, love it here with all my heart, always thought I’d be safer here when the chickens came home to roost. I’m angry and sad today.
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PolyDipsoManiac@reddit

It’s good to live on a hill on a lot with drainage; even so, the rains have been getting more intense, so I helped my dad dig an extra drainage tunnel and place some pipe in it to redirect water away from the foundation.
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invisible_iconoclast@reddit

I’m from the Hudson Valley and fucking same. This summer has been heartbreaking for me.
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Hour-Stable2050@reddit

No place is completely safe. A lot of people thought Vermount was the safest state.
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memento-vivere0@reddit

I’m really sorry for what you’re going through.
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cassowary_245@reddit

Everytime these unfortunate climate disasters happen I always hear “I thought my area was safe.” There is no safe area. Mine either. It’s always a shock when one of these events happen close to home.
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OhNoMgn@reddit

Yeah, this has been a wake-up call to say the least. I’ve always ‘understood’ that nowhere is safe but it just hits different when it’s right on your own doorstep. It’s sobering. I still plan to stay here long term; I feel like this is still as good a place as any to ride out whatever is to come, and it’s my home. But as a state we are not built for this. We definitely can’t handle events like this occurring with more frequency and I’m certain that’s exactly what will happen over time. I’m not sure how that will look for us, and it’s nerve-racking to consider.
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djm123412@reddit

Didn’t the same area get hit bad with Sandy? Two of my buddies lived on the backside of Okemo and that area was devastated in 2012 with flooding and roads collapsing. Looks like the same area was hit again.
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RandyCheeseburgers01@reddit

You might be thinking of Irene in 2011 (unless Sandy also did extensive damage too)?
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islet_deficiency@reddit

Sandy didnt' really impact VT. It hit hardest further south around NYC, NJ, and CT.
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bernmont2016@reddit

No state is built for this.
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BirryMays@reddit

I’m sorry. If I were raising chickens I would replace them with ducks
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NarrMaster@reddit

Modern problems require modern solutions
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roblewk@reddit

With what is to come, Vermont is still a better place to be in the US. Just maybe uphill a bit more.
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Amp__Electric@reddit

How's it comparing to Hurricane Irene?
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OhNoMgn@reddit

In terms of damage, at least on par with Irene and worse in a lot of places. It basically feels and looks exactly the same as Irene but without the high winds. Eerie, tbh. It’s pretty wild that we could be seeing such a similar impact with this event. Irene was a tropical storm so while we were surprised by the damage, it also made sense. This flood is just… rain, but on top of already saturated ground. It’s been raining here almost every day for the last couple weeks and this is effectively the straw that has broken the camel’s back. We are expecting more rain later in the week. If previous experience with Irene is anything to go by, it will be months before roads/bridges are fully repaired, possibly a year or two in more remote or damaged locations.
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Dire88@reddit

Be grateful we didn't get the wind this go round. We received 8-9in of rain as of yesterday - and it continued to rain through the night. Somehow we still have power and internet despite my mountain being entirely flooded in. If wind starts up, especially with the ground this saturated, we're going to see people lose power for weeks or more.
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islet_deficiency@reddit

The utility companies definitely learned lessons from Irene. Thankfully, the number of people without power and/or communication is drastically lower from this event compared to Irene.
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Overthemoon64@reddit

That what I was thinking was that this is typical of remnants of a tropical storm. Except there is no tropical storm. This is just a summer rainstorm.
View on Reddit #5193733

843_beardo@reddit

NH native here but moved out of New England about 10 years ago. Sad to see this happening, hoping for the best for you all!
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No-Measurement-6713@reddit

Love Vt! Thinking of you folks over hear in NH, absolutely tragic.
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sicofonte@reddit

You can look towards this summer. Next summer will be mayhem+.
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Canyoubackupjustabit@reddit

Gonna be a crazy el nino.
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DynastyZealot@reddit

I'm terrified of what this winter will bring. It's going to be so ugly.
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thesourpop@reddit

Literally skies ablaze from wildfires not three weeks ago, now it’s monsoon level flooding. Normal and cool
View on Reddit #5182263

mlon_eusk12@reddit

Multiple places flooded, multiple places in drought. This is 2023 and I'm in my early 20's, imagine what it's gonna be like when I turn 50. Imagine what it's gonna be like for someone born today when they turn 50. I feel so sad when I see young kids, and can't help judging their parents for bringing them into this.
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VioletRoses91@reddit

Someone born today will be lucky to see 30, let alone 50.
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Longjumping-Many6503@reddit

This is just not true.
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lightweight12@reddit

The Venus by Tuesday crowd is strong today! Watch those downvotes come!
View on Reddit #5198692

klyrish@reddit

Yeah, I wouldn't consider living 50 years past today "lucky" nor would I consider it very likely.
View on Reddit #5192626

Longjumping-Many6503@reddit

Hey man, I'm alive and loving every day. Life is what you make it.
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nightshadow995@reddit

I don’t think we will see 50 chief. I’m 28 myself. It’s not looking very bright.
View on Reddit #5181873

Beautiful_Bus_7847@reddit

Recently finished Mandatory military service in my country, (I am 24) now I can be drafted in case of war. I 100% think Im gonna die fighting a war sometime. Especially since my country is in full RED regarding water scarcity. Water wars it is then
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Tearakan@reddit

My guess is multiple breadbasket failures kill most of us due to the following massive famine and war. I highly doubt we will even have half of our population still alive in 20 years.
View on Reddit #5188109

CollapseSurvival@reddit

I get that, but keep in mind that some of us parents had no idea that collapse was coming until AFTER we had children. Imagine how sad and guilty we're feeling now.
View on Reddit #5187663

jhunt42@reddit

Don't worry the plan is to stop emitting carbon in 27 years time, we'll be fine
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BirryMays@reddit

Gonna be hard to reach net zero when all the carbon-capturing sources become carbon-emitting
View on Reddit #5187374

NolanR27@reddit

This region was supposed to be relatively stable in the face of climate change.
View on Reddit #5178628

JackOCat@reddit

No region is safer from extreme weather. They meant background climate changes.
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NarrMaster@reddit

In the future, this is what relatively stable will look like.
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Dire88@reddit

Not safe, but least impacted. Just you wait.
View on Reddit #5184543

decjr06@reddit

No region will be relatively stable. You should expect disastrous weather everywhere
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Parkimedes@reddit

Hotter air means it can hold more water before raining. So for dry parts of the country it means no rain. Just a vacuum cleaner taking all the moisture and water away in the air. But the parts that get the rain will get more. I think Vermont is down wind from the Great Lakes in a lot of weather patterns. So they’re going to be on the receiving end of a lot of rain as long as those weather patterns hold up and as long as there is water in the Great Lakes.
View on Reddit #5187036

Chaiteoir@reddit

Also Vermont is mountainous so that moist air rushing up the mountain slopes is going to drop water - the precipitable water values in the air above the Northeast Sun/Mon was around 1.9-2.0 which is above the 90th percentile. Upslope flow was a huge factor in this event.
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shotthroughtheshart@reddit

Woke up to a scene straight out of a disaster movie and the 1 road leading out of here having been washed away sometime in the night. The driveway is soup and the fruit trees are all uprooted as well. Just a god damn mess
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FaustusC@reddit

... We've also had almost a straight month of rain ffs. Like, legitimately I think it didn't rain for maybe 4-5 days in the entire month of June.
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nightshadow995@reddit

REVELATION BABY!!!
View on Reddit #5170361

IntrigueDossier@reddit

🤘😝🤘
View on Reddit #5180447

Bellybutton_fluffjar@reddit

Currently there is major flooding in India and South East Japan too. We all know why.
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StatementBot@reddit

The following submission statement was provided by /u/GoodDayMate_: --- This is related to collapse as we are seeing multiple states including Vermont, New York, and New Hampshire undergoing "once in a 1000 year flooding." We will see events like this across the world more frequently as the jet stream slows and El Nino starts gaining strength. Get ready folks this is tame compared to what we will be seeing in 10 years. --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/14wdmk7/catastrophic_flooding_across_parts_of_new_england/jrhgntp/
View on Reddit #5171190