Whats up with these S&W and why is it so cheap? Only $295 brand new.

[-]

MehenstainMeh@reddit

they work, but they are gritty and built to a price point. I would take them over a high point though.

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1000_fists_a_smashin@reddit

Hi point makes the greatest firearms in the history of firearms and history

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I went shooting with a guy once and and he had a high point. We gave him some shit and and he challenged us. He unloaded it, as us to verify condition then tosses it the air 3-4 times and let it land in desert dirt, then skipped though the same desert dirt, sand several times. reloaded and emptied a full mag no issues. None of us took his challenge be cause f that. So I guess the high point won over Sigs, Glocks, Colts and a Staccato. Ugly, heavy POS but it worked. :)

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sla342@reddit

You and I had different encounters. A friend of mine bought one as his first gun about 10-12 years ago. We went to the range and it had a failure every 2-3 rounds. We couldn’t get it to cycle a full mag. Failure to eject. Failure to feed.. just everything fucking sucker about it.

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Playful-Researcher46@reddit

I bought a hi point when I was 21 and it did exactly this. It was a magazine issue. I changed the springs in the magazine with glock springs and never had another jam with it.

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DismalPassenger4069@reddit

It is all luck of the draw in my opinion. I have shot with guys and their Kimber customs and other fancy stuff and they couldn't get though a mag with out a failure. My Keltec's always run. Kind 'a like cars, I drive an old GL450 with a OTA tune . A total money pit, POS by all reviews. I regularly hammer on it. But the god damn thing never breaks, same with my old ML. It is just a lottery, depends on how hung over the guy was on the day of the assembly I guess. :)

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Paladin_3@reddit

Did he clean and lube the gun well before he took it out for the first time? I've seen similar complaints from folks who just opened the box, rammed in a mag full of ammunition, and went out shooting without making sure the gun was properly lubed beforehand.

I've never shot a high point, but I've heard this complaint from all kinds of pistols when they aren't kept well lubed.

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tcarlson65@reddit

At the price he paid he can afford to do that.

I am sure I could do the same with some of my firearms but why do that? You can abuse your gear or you can take good care of it.

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BeenisHat@reddit

Should you ever need to go use it for real and go out and drop your gun in the mud, it's nice to know it will still work.

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AvrgSam@reddit

Hence guntubers and torture tests haha

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DynaBro8089@reddit

After seeing so many YouTube videos of those high points I had to agree. You can beat the living shit out of them and it works still and he’ll even after days of abuse if it doesn’t they are so cheap you can just buy another one. Still haven’t bought one though 😂

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Wandering_Weapon@reddit

They're guns with a dead simple blowback system. It's extremely difficult to get them to jam because of this.

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AboutSweetSue@reddit

That Hi-Point destruction video was impressive.

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1000_fists_a_smashin@reddit

The torture test videos? lol We love to trash talk hi point but they put it through hell and it still worked

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weeniehead7@reddit

They are great but look sooooo bad

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mgmorden@reddit

Yeah with Hi Points price and reliability are very good, and at that price point nothing else typically was reliable (eg Jennings and Bryco and other such junk guns). Aside from being cheap and working though, all the OTHER stuff about them is bad.

They're ugly. The ergos don't feel good. They have a bad trigger. They're heavy. They have a small single stack magazine. You can't find many holsters for them. The sights are tiny.

For a purely utilitarian tool for people on a budget they're a good option, but they're nothing I actually want in my personal collection.

I did have one (a C9) for a while that I got in trade. Shot it a couple times then ended up selling it off.

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Lick_My_BigButt_1980@reddit

But heavy is good for recoil.

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mgmorden@reddit

Heavy is good, but blowback action is not. Any help they'd get from the weight is largely negated by the fact that the breech isn't locked.

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snuffy_bodacious@reddit

NGL: I can't bring myself to buy one just for the aesthetics.

Call me shallow. I just... can't.

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weeniehead7@reddit

Lol yeah I was given a few as a gag gift and my buddy is now a felon and gave me all his guns so I got some cool stuff

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snuffy_bodacious@reddit

Man... now I want one of my buddies to commit a felony.

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weeniehead7@reddit

Lmao

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1000_fists_a_smashin@reddit

So bad…. I’ve been on the fence wanting to try they’re 10mm but it really is hideous

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weeniehead7@reddit

I have one and it's decent but I'd rather shoot my other 10mms

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1000_fists_a_smashin@reddit

Tell me about the others!!! lol I just have a 20.5 and it’s been great, no issues at all

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soiledmeNickers@reddit

I have their 10mm carbine in a high tower armory bullpup conversion. It’s fun as hell. I’ve taken deer with it.

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hybridtheory1331@reddit

That's because it's literally milled out of a 3 inch thick steel block. Lol. The walls on hi point slides are almost as thick as the entire slide on some guns.

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HzrKMtz@reddit

Milled? Those suckers have minimal machine work, they use a cast Zamack alloy slide. They could probably make them smaller with cast steel but would increase their cost.

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Material_Victory_661@reddit

Actually, it is an alloy called ZAMACK that the frame and slide are made with. That is why they are so thick. Steel is the barrel material.

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Stevarooni@reddit

Yep! It's awkward, ugly, and overbuilt...and works.

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Killerjebi@reddit

It’s just the AK of the pistol world

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Big_Z_Diddy@reddit

They absolutely have the best customer service and warranty on the market too.

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Middle-Chipmunk-3001@reddit

Yeet Canon

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DumbNTough@reddit

Petition to make the Hi-Point C9 the new base currency unit of the United States. 9x19 FMJ can replace cent pieces.

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1000_fists_a_smashin@reddit

Lol

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Jaruut@reddit

Back when Hi-Points were actually $100, they were used for currency conversion on gundeals. "Hey check it out, Bob's Basement is clearing out RMRs for 3 Hi-Points!"

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2_black_cats@reddit

Dollar for dollar, agreed.

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AnnArchist@reddit

They are remarkably reliable when held properly.

They are remarkably reliable when ran over with a truck too

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CockpitEnthusiast@reddit

The pinnacle of firearms engineering

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MysticalWeasel@reddit

If they had either their own double stack mags or just redesigned them to take Glock mags, I would buy one immediately; and one of the new short carbines they had at Shot Show.

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JoeHardway@reddit

They're def 1'a the guns ever made! 🤣

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1000_fists_a_smashin@reddit

lol

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Mistawondabread@reddit

I've shot a couple thousand rounds through my sd9 and it's still kicking. It's basically a truck gun now, but for the price they are hard to beat

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Lick_My_BigButt_1980@reddit

Truck gun?

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Mistawondabread@reddit

Yeah, like a gun I keep in my truck when I'm out hunting/fishing/whatever.

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gunsandsilver@reddit

Pot metal quality, with surprisingly good reliability. I bought one to see for myself, never had a problem with it. Ugly though.

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MehenstainMeh@reddit

The glock lawsuit still makes me chuckle. So much of a copy they had to pay royalties. But yeah they do work.

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BoxerRadio9@reddit

High points are hated on way too much.

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Lick_My_BigButt_1980@reddit

Most of them just want to let out some badmouthing on something. I’m one of those people. We’re immature, because we want to have a certain kind of fun, to which no substitute exists.

Then, there is the Creedmoore! People get triggered sooo easily, you just mention it a little around your average good ol’ redneck boys, and then it’s all about the anticipation of what he thinks you meant, playing a little game of finding the narratives!

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SovereignDevelopment@reddit

The SD9 is a better shooting experience, but I would trust the High Point to be more reliable.

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mgmorden@reddit

I'll agree. I haven't shot the 9mm versions, but I've got an SD40 and a Sigma SW357. I've also owned a Hi Point C9. The C9 never jammed. Both the SD40 and the Sigma SW357 have the occasional jam.

That said though, there are a ton of police trade-in M&P's on the market right now and while my Sigma-based guns have jams, my M&P has always ran like a sewing machine. Plenty of trade in Glocks too which will run great.

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SovereignDevelopment@reddit

The M&P is definitely a better choice as is the Glock. But if you're truly dirt poor and need a reliable handgun, it's hard to deny the HiPoint is the most reliable at it's price point.

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MyLlamaNeedsAHat@reddit

I’ve fired the new sd9 2.0 it’s not gritty. Trigger is much nicer than the original but still heavy. Like 6.5-7 lbs or so.

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vamosACojer@reddit

Awesome pistol shot over 1k rounds not one hiccup

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Rip1072@reddit

SD9 (VE) 2.0, entry level glock clone from S&W. I have a SD40, bought it years ago for $175.00. Still in my carry rotation.

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Helassaid@reddit

Same. I have an all black SD9 that was my first pistol. It shoots decent enough even with the “worst trigger in the history of guns” according to some people in this thread. I think the ergonomics are better than my Glock 19.

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No-Zombie1004@reddit

Trigger can be easily modified (remove one spring). The sw40ve has the worst accuracy of any handgun I've ever fired with and without trigger modification. Never bothered to try the 9mm variant but I'd guess it's not quite as huge a spread.

(I had five others at the range try it on different days and a cheap rock island 45 with cracks in it was a gold medal gun in comparison.)

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Rip1072@reddit

I did the spring kit a few years ago, made a world of difference in weight, feel, staging and reset. Best $15.00 i ever spent. Also changed to Novak style rear sight and added Tritium insert to front. I tore it down completely and did a deep clean while installing the new stuff, reassembled with CFP and it is very nice.

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Rip1072@reddit

I agree, underrated in my opinion.

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Phoenix_Live_@reddit

The 2.0 is definitely better than the first gen. Smooth trigger, frame feels kinda cheap but for 300$ it’s definitely better than a Taurus. Get it.

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Somedudeness@reddit

My buddy has one. They don't make the parts for them anymore because of a lawsuit with Glock, they feel like ass to shoot, and they also feel super cheap, but his hasn't broken or jammed yet.

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jimtheedcguy@reddit

I tried the “improved” trigger out of curiosity, and it’s still crap. Like slightly less crap than the previous model, but still, spend your ~$300 on a CZ or a PD trade Glock/M&P. That’s not to say these are bad guns by any means, they’re perfectly serviceable, I’m just saying, better things can be had for the same price range.

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Former-Bill-4887@reddit

I owned one - sold it 6 months later. Not my favorite 9mm I've ever shot.

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tramadoc@reddit

Started out in life as the S&W Sigma Series. They got sued by Glock over the design and lost. The made some changes and it became what is known as the bottom feeders of S&W’s. The SD9VE and SD40VE.

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Sad_Veterinarian9393@reddit

It a smith and Wesson not a high point ? Why is every comment about high points ?

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FadedIntegra@reddit

Buddy of mine has the 40 and it's a pile of shit. Looks cool tho.

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Steveesq@reddit

They were s&ws shitty copy of a glock.... a poorly executed, shitty copy. Great reliability, reasonably accurate, HORRIFIC triggers.

Essentially when Glock was handing Smith & Wesson their ass in sales, Smith borrowed a Glock, made a gun that looks exactly like it internally but was cosmetically different on the outside and figured nobody will notice

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Germanelo@reddit

You get what you pay for.

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honeybutthole733@reddit

It's cheap bc they're junk.

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mzrdisi@reddit

Please do yourself a favor and save for the M&P, this thing is dogshit.

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retardsmart@reddit

M&P is just shorthand for lowest bidder. That's what the Military and Police line is. Could have gone with PP for Price Point.

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mgmorden@reddit

The M&P is an excellent gun. The one I have is one of the original M&P 9L's with the 5" barrel. I've put over 15k rounds through that gun and its ran great. From my understanding the 2.0's are supposed to be even better, though I have only shot the originals personally.

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retardsmart@reddit

The entire line is aimed at duty use. Small departments are not going to issue the latest and greatest, they issue adequate and affordable.

It's not shitty it's just not as finely finished as the guns aimed at the consumer civilian market.

Look at the difference between the model 28 and the model 27.

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TheBrownSlaya@reddit

What is a good alternative besides Glock, would you recommend HK or Walther?

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retardsmart@reddit

HK, because you suck and we hate you.* Walther will make you hate yourself when trying to put one back together.

Any of the military adopted pistols will work, they have to meet certain standards so you probably won't get a dud.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDH25dFEzzM

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anothercarguy@reddit

shorthanded for lowest bidder

Military adopted pistols

You clearly have no idea how military bids work

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2MGR@reddit

I would trust a FN 509T or a Beretta M9A4 before an M17. Military adoption is just a financial game.

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TheBrownSlaya@reddit

Understandable

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retardsmart@reddit

I should mention that I have a lot of 1911s and P226s.

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Jack3489@reddit

Produced to sell to consumers that would otherwise buy Hi-Point or Taurus at the same price point.

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Crackercroaker55@reddit

I don’t know why Smith and Wesson still makes this. I think this was the gun that caused Glock to sue them over seven patent violations and won. You could actually change barrels with this and a Glock.

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MikeyG916@reddit

Hood rats.

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Wolfwood428@reddit

The SD series is the budget line of handguns.

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Nata-Again@reddit

I was gonna buy one of the SD9 but idk something told me to get the Shield instead of the SD9 also I fell in love with the S&W Shield just cause I saw every single review of it being just one of the most reliable micro 9’s and barely jams up. I have the 1.0 and the Shield Plus. Love em both to death. Call me a S&W fan boy lol.

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Red-Dwarf69@reddit

Don’t listen to people talking down on these guns. They’re snobs. These guns are awesome if you’re looking for something reliable, functional, simple, and affordable. People complain about the trigger, but unless you’re a toddler or a competition shooter, the trigger is fine.

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Lick_My_BigButt_1980@reddit

It’s cold outside, there’s no kind of atmosphere!

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Lick_My_BigButt_1980@reddit

Trig’s a bit Glocky, though. 😏

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noljw@reddit

It's intended to be a budget pistol. It won't shoot nearly as well as their M&P series though. Imo if you want budget then look at CZ P10 or PSA dagger

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bcmGlk@reddit

My first gun was the SD40VE around 10 years ago. Trigger is long, heavy and mushy. However the thing is VERY reliable. It literally ate all ammo without fail. I put an Apex trigger shoe and a metal guide rod. I’m glad I started out with that gun, The heavy trigger taught me a lot about trigger control. It makes a glock trigger feel amazing in comparison. The 2.0 should be even better than the one I bought

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bassexpander@reddit

That has a different trigger than the original. S&W were sued by Glock for that gun. I think somebody added an aftermarket trigger system to that, or Smith & Wesson changed it and I didn't know. The original trigger system they had for that gun was ridiculously heavy at something like 12 lb. I didn't like the way it fit in my hand and hurt the web between my thumb and pointer finger.

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ExplanationMaster634@reddit

That’s actually 15 bucks cheaper than wholesale I don’t know how much freight is or how much a transfer will cost but that’s a good deal

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ExplanationMaster634@reddit

I have owned all the generations and all the colors For the price you have a hard time finding something to compare it with because they are actually decent pistols

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Medical-Fly-3493@reddit

I bought the original sd9ve back in 2020. Absolute ass gun lol. I mean it went bang every single time. So that’s a plus. But feels like a 10 pound trigger, super sludgy. A lot of recoil for no reason being it’s a 9.

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THiRD_i_NINE11@reddit

The 2.0 trigger is much better. Gun still feels basic, cookie cutter minimalist design but it's a huge improvement to the sd9

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mgmorden@reddit

You can get an Apex spring kit for them for about $25 that will help a LOT with the trigger. It still won't be a target gun but it'll put it about in the same ballpark as a factory Glock trigger.

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90bronco@reddit

The triggers are terrible, but apex makes a trigger for them that helps a lot.

It was my carry gun even after I bought nicer guns because I didn't mind it taking the wear and tear and possibly being seized in a worst case scenario.

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Hovie1@reddit

The take up on that trigger is a out 4 inches long.

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barto5@reddit

Sig P250 has entered the chat.

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PrometheusSmith@reddit

Well that is a double action, hammer fired gun.

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barto5@reddit

It’s still a Terrible trigger.

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Intelligent_Ease4115@reddit

I too bought my OG SD9 back then too. Trigger pull is horrendous. However I can shoot 2-3 inch groupings at 12-15 yards with it.

I bought a SIG M18 after firing the M17. Same size groupings at 15 yards but damn it’s ALOT faster and smoother.

The SD9 is now retired to my home defense gun.

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adk09@reddit

A Sigma was my first handgun in like 2010. That was back when Glock sued for patent infringement and they had to modify it to the SD series.

It functioned, but lawd the trigger was 12+ pounds and tough.

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rvlvrlvr@reddit

Had one of those - the SW9VE, purchased in '07 or so. Supposedly slightly redesigned from the original Sigmas, but the trigger was really bad - gritty, long, too much overtravel (the weight of it didn't bother me, though, as I was already pretty used to longer, heavier revolver triggers). I guess the SD9 is the modern day equivalent.

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yankeedoughboy@reddit

Yeah my old man got one, not the worst gun imo but I totally get what you mean about high recoil for a 9mm. I haven’t put the time in with it to get better, but I have never shot well with that pistol for that reason.

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MoloneLaVeigh@reddit

I learned to shoot on the S&W Sigma. Worst trigger I’ve ever come across but it really made me slow down and be deliberate with each pull. I trained the flinch out at step 1 instead of further down the line.

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DieselTech00@reddit

I agree. Absolutely hated mine

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ChancellorOfDoom@reddit

I have to disagree except for the trigger. Mine is a nail driver and shoots like many other mid frame 9’s. An apex trigger and spring kit handles that issue, which I agree was awful.

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THiRD_i_NINE11@reddit

I love mine. I brought it in 40 s&w just because I have 2 m&p 9mms so I wanted something different. I shot a sd 9 gen 1 and the trigger was ass. Long reset. But the 2.0, great upgrade to the trigger. Might be there best 300 dollar handgun on the market right now.

It's lightweight, the trigger is quick and fairly smooth and quick reset. People complain about the texture one the grip. I personally like it. It does only come with one mag which sucks. But I'd get another in 9mm if it had a safety like the m&ps. Either way for 300 bucks, you can't beat it.

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DamnRightDamien@reddit

Just as reliable as a Glock since it's literally a Glock clone (lawsuits happened).

The trigger is ass and they did a poor job marketing it.

Honestly it's an incredible value for a firearm, which is why they're like top tier among gang bangers.

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mgmorden@reddit

Just as reliable as a Glock since it's literally a Glock clone (lawsuits happened).

No, not at all. Just because one company copies another design doesn't mean they build it as good.

I've owned 2 Sigma based guns (an original Sigma and an SD series). Both had jams out of the box. I've owned 3 different Glocks. The Glocks have been perfect.

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DamnRightDamien@reddit

I make up stories too sometimes

Good one

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mgmorden@reddit

I can't show the Gen 2 G17 since I've sold it, but I still have 4 of the guns. I'm not lying:

https://i.ibb.co/jvMkbsk4/20250202-225358-1.jpg

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backslash-plague@reddit

Just as reliable as a Glock since it's literally a Glock clone (lawsuits happened).

Strictly speaking, that was the gen 1 SW or "Sigma" series.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smith_%26_Wesson_SW#Patent_issue

I'm sure the new guns are similar, but they have been through several generations since the lawsuit in 1997. The latest generation, SD 2.0, came out in 2023. There probably isn't any parts compatibility between the old and new guns.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smith_%26_Wesson_SD_VE#History

https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/sw-sd9-2-2-tone-16rd

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Solidknowledge@reddit

Just as reliable as a Glock since it's literally a Glock clone (lawsuits happened).

uhhh...no where near as reliable. Taurus always did and still currently does have quality control issues.

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Chasing_Perfect_EDC@reddit

This is a Smith and Wesson

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Solidknowledge@reddit

my apologies!

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22lrMarksmen@reddit

Not even close to worth it.

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AngriestManinWestTX@reddit

Because the SD9 isn't popular.

The SD9 honestly has a lot going for it. They're generally well built from what I've seen , they're reliable, and they've got decent features (at <$300) but the trigger is god awful. We're talking \~12ish pounds, long, and gritty, even the trigger having been redesigned within the past few years. If the trigger wasn't so damn bad, I think the SD9 would be looked upon favorably.

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Threather19@reddit

This is the SD9 2.0 so it’s a lot better but for $50 more the RXM exists

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mgmorden@reddit

Or for the same price the PSA Dagger exists. I've not shot an RXM but I have enough other Ruger handguns to know they're good. Still, I have both a Dagger and and SD and I'd take the Dagger every time.

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backatit1mo@reddit

Is the trigger really 12 pounds? There’s no way lol I’ve shot a 10 pound trigger and that felt like the gun was actually on safe. I had to keep checking to make sure the safety was off lol

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yourboibigsmoi808@reddit

The SIGMA is the og glock clone and they’ve been here forever

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GuitarEvening8674@reddit

The new Springfield XD model 3 is $299, I'd buy one of those instead

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The_hammer_69420@reddit

It’s the best cheapest gun possible. It’s not “good” but it does work.

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TheBaptist24@reddit

Hipoint would like a word.

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LunchboxKovacs@reddit

Decent beginner pistol. Horrible trigger.

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MEMExplorer@reddit

I’d spend a bit more for the Beretta APX or CZ P10

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RB5009UGSin@reddit

Solid advice. I recommended the Ruger Sec 9 but a P10 is the even better buy.

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MEMExplorer@reddit

I’ve got my eye on that new Ruger RXM

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RB5009UGSin@reddit

Shit like this has me questioning the RXM…

https://www.reddit.com/r/ruger/s/4vxqHpRBxL

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gotthesauce22@reddit

It doesn’t reflect well on their QC but I’ve seen the same thing on gen 5 glocks as well so it’s not just a Ruger problem. That being said, everyone who has that defect says it has no impact on performance

My RXM doesn’t have the barrel gouges, but I did receive a slide with no roll marks 😅

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RB5009UGSin@reddit

Yeah I’ve considered it but I’d like to see what people say after a year or so. Let’s see some 1,000 round reviews.

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atman8r@reddit

I’ve got my RXM and just hit 750 rounds. 0 issues with magpul and Glock mags 15.17 and 19 rounders. Threw a Bushnell Rxs-250 on there for a cheap sight to test it, the mounting system is awesome and the irons are better than the stock irons on my 17 and 19. I really really like it, not to mention the grip angle and trigger are superior to my Glock. If it keeps having no issue it may replace my Glock 19 as my bedside table gun.

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sploader@reddit

This is the way.

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hammeresq@reddit

I bought a PS90 recently and decided to also buy the Smith and Wesson M&P 5.7 because it was heavily discounted on Gunprime. Couldn’t be more underwhelmed with the M&P, it feels gritty and cheap.

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No_Leadership_6115@reddit

Just a heads up OP, most of these comments are from people who did not spend more than half a second glancing at the picture. You posted about the SD9 2.0 which came out in Dec 2023. It features a much improved trigger and redesigned slide. The majority of comments are about the original Sigma/SD9VE which came out in 2010. I would suggest finding a few videos and getting some more info there.

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JimMarch@reddit

Yup. This. It's actually a legit gun.

Takes the same sights as the M&P series so it's easy to upgrade those. No optics cut though.

The real choice is, this or a Taurus?

Odds of getting an outright bad one that has to be shipped back is higher with Taurus. But with the newest Taurus, still not very often. The gun closest to this in the Taurus lineup is the G3. I have two of the smaller G3c (one in 9, one in 40) both recent production with Bainbridge GA import marks and they're solid as hell with better triggers than the SD9 original flavor. I don't know how they compare to the 2.0 though.

Don't put an aftermarket stainless steel guide rod in an SD9 or SD40. Puts too much stress on the frame and it can crack. They run fine with the original setup. The trigger can be fixed without changing the guide rod.

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alsoknownasvipe@reddit

I have a friend that has a Taurus G3 that wouldn't chamber a round right out of the box with any magazines. Sent it back twice, both times they didn't touch it and sent it back to him. Now it sits in its box in a drawer with less than 50 rounds through it and useless. I wouldn't ever roll the dice even if there are some working Taurus out there.

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d3rp_diggler@reddit

OG sigma, the sw9, came out in 1994. That was the lawsuit gun. The SD9 was the redesign.

I had a SW9P (ported barrel). It was a gun, a reliable one…but I have nothing more good to say about it. My Sccy is a superior firearm in every way except capacity.

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WestSide75@reddit

Holy crap, the Sigma. A real blast from the past. Also a real low point in time for S&W.

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Pist0lPetePr0fachi@reddit

Sigma40 or Sigma9V bothe were good gums. Tough triggers. Still nice enough.

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irierider@reddit

The 299 to 399 intro pistol range is actually quite competitive these days. You can definitely shop around for things with Mail and rebate or manufacture. Rebates that drop it into this price zone and will have great track records and his histories. These are fine intro firearms. I know people that have owned them and shot them fine, but there are a lot of options.

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phaselinebravo@reddit

Drop $50 more and get a police trade in glock and be done with it

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pec4pec4@reddit

There are not spare parts available

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LonesomeGodOutdoors@reddit

They are terrible. Just rebranded sigmas which was the worst gun ever made

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richsreddit@reddit

Still a better option than a Hi-Point tho.

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BarryHalls@reddit

They have very little in R&D. It's their Glock knock off with a S&W extractor and WAY TOO HEAVY and gritty double action only trigger. They are pretty solid, pretty rugged, but you'll immediately want to throw money at the trigger, but they will never be short, it's always a long double action, even if you get it lighter and smoother.

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timmah1991@reddit

PSA Dagger.

My buddy has one and while it feels quality and shoots well enough, it has the most ridiculous report and recoil of any 9mm I’ve ever fired. I cannot figure out why.

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BarryHalls@reddit

If the recoil AND report are both more, it has to be the ammo.

Regardless they take G19 RSAs so you can quickly, easily, and cheaply tune the recoil.

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timmah1991@reddit

That’s a negative. Same ammo out of several pistols side by side, one of which being a stock gen 5 g19.

There’s a reason we were perplexed by it.

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BarryHalls@reddit

Ah, well I always preferred the 4 and 5 to the 3 because I thought the dual RSA really shot a lot flatter than the single in the 3.

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ClassroomNo4024@reddit

People buy these purely for the looks and the cheap ass price.

They don't give a tinkers nail about a trigger so don't try to explain it.

Sold guns for a long time.

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Lizzo_sized_lunch@reddit

I thought it was a budget gun that lowers the barrier to entry for new gun owners

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CommonStance@reddit

An he’s the shiny hi point

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Unable_Coach8219@reddit

In the gun world you get what you pay for!

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OODAhfa@reddit

A friend of mine was the CLEO of Texas Parks and Wildlife and they needed new duty weapons. One of the guns was a S&W 40C and the durability test was a month long almost continuously tested with a total of 40,000 rds. It was shooting 4" groups for the first 250 rds but settled at 1½" afterwards all the way to the end. The rails had no appreciable wear at the end as well. S&W was sued by Glock over the design.

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backslash-plague@reddit

The SD9 2.0 is from Smith & Wesson's "Value Enhanced" line. They are supposed to be reliable and cheap. As others have noted, they have a reputation for being "rough around the edges".

I haven't shot one, so I can't give you my impression of them.

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movebacktoyourstate@reddit

It's a gun built specifically to give people who want to buy Tauruses something way better for about the same money.

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SvardXCvard@reddit

I have a sdeve i inherited from my dad. It’s just a cheap gun. I’ve ran maybe 400 rounds through it no issues.

At its price point it’s solid.

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Bravo82bill@reddit

I also want the high point with the 100 dollar hydro dip all over it, lol

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Bravo82bill@reddit

Are you sure this buy now price and not a bidding price? I do this alot on gun broker.

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9gagsuckz@reddit

I have an sd9ve and it’s great. Trigger was a little stiff but I replaced it with a 6lb apex trigger and it’s great over 1000 rounds and no issues

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Pheren@reddit

SD9VE was my first handgun. Trigger sucked, but you can't get much better for the price. It's not nearly as awful as others will say. I think I recall there was some lawsuit where S&W were 'borrowing' ideas from another maker and that's why it's so cheap, but I don't remember. Still a damn fine piece for it's price.

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lil_johnny_cake@reddit

Get a surplus M&P or Glock. These are cheap for a reason.

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Unicorn187@reddit

Thts the SD series, the sequel to the older sigma. They used to have nice triggers... until glock sued them. Since they copied glock almost exactly. So they had to pay glock royalties for each one sold. They changed the design just enough. Then come out with these pieces things. And changed it just a little more and created the M&P. Ok, the SD isn't really a piece of shit. It's not a Taurus. It's just that the trigger isn't good at all.

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FuckkPTSD@reddit

Because it’s a SD9 and not a M&P or an equalizer

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pguy4life@reddit

Cheap? That's like 3 hi-points!

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john_sum1@reddit

I've been looking at getting one as a garage gun because of how cheap they are. Wouldn't mind having decent reliability while also not caring about it not being climate controlled.

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RB5009UGSin@reddit

lol I did this with a G2c as a bathroom gun. The barrel rusted in a couple days.

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JimmyReagan@reddit

It's a solid gun, and they make trigger kits, I replaced mine and makes it a ton better.

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RB5009UGSin@reddit

Op, I would go for this over that SD9 any day of the week. It’s far superior for the same price.

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someomega@reddit

Academy Sports has that gun with Crimson Trace light for $299.

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RB5009UGSin@reddit

For $299 they can keep the light and I’ll take a Ruger Security 9. That’s still the $300 gun to beat imo. A Dagger will out shoot this too.

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Kokabim@reddit

They're cheap because they copied Glock and got sued, and have to pay royalties to GBwH

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halfghanistan@reddit

They are trash. Buy a canik for the same price

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RB5009UGSin@reddit

I wouldn’t call them trash but yes, Canik for the same price is the move to make.

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monsieurLeMeowMeow@reddit

The sd9 2.0 pros: -cheap -reliable -newer versions has ok trigger

Cons: -some parts are held in by roll pins -slide serrations are a few big cuts instead of several little slits (I just like the cuts on a glock more) -magazines are somewhat hard to find.

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PatriotWholesaleDir@reddit

From a gun store owner it’s a reliable firearm.

However, what customers don’t like is it’s very heavy for the type of firearm. Most also don’t like the trigger as well.

S&W didn’t do much to advertise this weapon. Could be because Glock wasn’t too happy.

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AaronSlaughter@reddit

My buddy loves his and it only jams 2 or 3 times per range trip.

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DontBelieveTheirHype@reddit

There's a spring kit that fixes a few of the jamming issues and the feed ramp being polished up a bit is generally a good idea, but yeah this gun is bottom bargain bin stuff for guns (it's the second pistol I ever carried)

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Shawn_1512@reddit

Are you being sarcastic because 2-3 jams per range trip is horrible

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AaronSlaughter@reddit

Once is too much. Yes excessively sarcasming.

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SeminoleSwampman@reddit

Because it’s bad

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Fresh-Wealth-8397@reddit

Last I checked it's one of the most common weapons to be found left at gun scenes it's a modern day Jimenez Arms 22. cheap disposable murder gun

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smegma_toast@reddit

CZ P-10 can be had for not much more and is way better

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Monkeyswine@reddit

I have a couple stashed in my house and shop and have shot them a bunch. They are solid shooters. Someone (Apaex maybe) makes a spring or spring kit that makes them much easi3r to shoot accurately.

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kalashnikovkitty9420@reddit

id take a cz before this.

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blankford@reddit

Because they're irrelevant in a world where the M&P exists. Don't buy this, buy the M&P.

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ranchmallow@reddit

They are not great lol. Mine had an issue where it wouldn't lock the slide back on an empty mag so that was cool, but aside from that everything else worked fine. It's just cheap. I ended up giving mine to my buddy when he got married.

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MisanthropicNun@reddit

One of the worst triggers I’ve ever felt. Better off throwing it at them.

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ratmanmedia@reddit

The 2.0 is a substantial improvement

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USCommando@reddit

The SD series, or the "Self Defense" series, is a cheaper entry level pistol. Originally designed for states with restrictions on pistols and to meet their requirements, like loaded chamber indicator, limited mag capacity, heavier trigger (use to be a 9lb trigger but idk if it the same one now). There are after market parts to improve sights and triggers but alot of people are uncomfortable doing gunsmithing especially since this pistol is for those who are getting into firearms and are on a budget.

Normally they cost around $400 but during the 2020 riots, they jumped up to almost $500 to $600, so I believe the seller may have bought too many of them expecting people to buy them up when Trump went into office, but failed to do so now trying to load them off whole sale. Another possibility is a store is unfortunately closing its doors and the owner is trying to sell his stock. Idk for certain, I'm some stranger on the internet.

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Ferdinand_Magelatin@reddit

I got mine lightly used for $150. After replacing the trigger and recoil spring i have no complaints with it.

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Deleter182AC@reddit

There good but trigger is really crappy not snappy so needs upgrading .

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Sangyviews@reddit

I have this piece, shot it, cleaned it, and now the bullet catches each time you rack it. Haven't gotten around to a gunsmith, but they're cheap because they're cheap.

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WombatAnnihilator@reddit

Because they’re shit

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SufficientOnestar@reddit

Its the economy car of guns.

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Noland150@reddit

Sigma without the stigma.

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pj830@reddit

Throwaways

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Edrobbins155@reddit

Unpopular opinion. The new sd9’s are amazing for being $270. If that is all you can afford. Go for it.

And this is coming from someone that has beretta’s to walthers.

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roaming_art@reddit

Incredibly late to the polymer striker fired game, doesn’t do anything a Glock can’t, way less aftermarket support and parts availability, the list goes on…

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Nick_Man_1@reddit

Not really that late, I have one of these that I purchased 20 years ago. They have been making these a long time.

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roaming_art@reddit

I looked it up before I commented, these were introduced in 2010.

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Negative_Ad_2787@reddit

It was called the sigma before it was called the SD and they started producing sigma’s in 1994

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th4tguy321@reddit

Late??

They were so early they got sued by Glock and had to alter the design and pay up.

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Dependent_Ad_5546@reddit

I think the original model was so aweful that I heard they were going to be purchased on the cheap cheap by .gov to provide pistols to the ANA and ANP. I was there 2011-2012 but didn’t see and handguns on ANA or ANP I worked with.

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CreatedUsername1@reddit

It's basically hi-ppint with +7 Rd cap & looks better.

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100hphd@reddit

Bought one of the originals when they came out in like 2010. It was my first pistol, and it was an absolutely terrible first choice. I didn't have the knowledge I have today, and not much on the forums about them yet. I couldn't figure out why my accuracy was so terrible. I let other people shoot it, and same issue. Turns out, no one understood how to shoot with a double action trigger that was worse than most revolvers. Lots of training and an Apex trigger kit made it better, but still sucked.

Sold it for a $100 loss and never looked back.

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