Guidance on salaries in the Netherlands compared to US
Posted by saidwyn@reddit | expats | View on Reddit | 38 comments
I'm am in the process of being interviewed for a leadership team position at a small manufacturing site outside of Rotterdam, and am looking for salary/benefits package advice. I am currently making mid-six figures at a petrochemical manufacturing plant in North Central US where I am mid-level management. What is a reasonable salary, and what are benefits package considerations in the Netherlands?
My reasons for moving are quality of life (public transit/pace) as well as getting closer to family I have living in the Nordics, but I don't want to maintain a comfortable life and the ability to easily pay for a couple vacations per year (including visiting the US). Ideally also move out to a small house in the country, which may lead to needing a car.
Dablicku@reddit
I would say: Don't
As you're a foreigner you'll be entitled to the 30% ruling so your take home is a lot higher, but without it the tax are crazy high.
Cost of living is expensive (main reason I moved abroad) and trying to buy a house is only possible with a lot of cash.
Netherlands is a whole different country, just think about it if its going to be so much better for your future.
KetaCowboy@reddit
How many years of experience? You have to imagine "six figure jobs" are not as common in NL as in the US. Our salaries are alot more leveled.
saidwyn@reddit (OP)
12 years
Both-Basis-3723@reddit
Look into the 30% ruling as that needs to be sorted out in the right order. Also, pre tax and after tax will probably shock you here. Total lifestyle costs can be comparable with much better healthcare value and outcomes.
KetaCowboy@reddit
I would say then closer to 90k to 100k EUR. Please remind that dutch people never talk about yearly salary but monthly, and your company will probably offer you a monthly salary (times 13 to calculate yearly)
atimidtempest@reddit
Why 13 or 14?
KetaCowboy@reddit
13 is standard as we get the holiday allowance in May. This is basically an extra monthly salary. And some companies give something thats called the "thirteenth month". This is also another monthly salary, mostly given around the end of the year.
NoidZ@reddit
That's the problem, it's not an extra monthly salary it's just withheld from your yearly salary. There's nothing extra about it. You act if it's like free money, which it definitely isn't. This is why you should calculate per year and not per month.
KetaCowboy@reddit
Im not saying its free money, im just explaining how our system normally works. And again i have only seen monthly salaries discussed ever, but might d3pend on sector and experience level.
NoidZ@reddit
The system is designed per month so it feels you get paid more. I would strongly advise to always think in years because of this. It shouldn't even be discussed. With a lot of stuff I think the Americans have batshit crazy rules, but this is one of the few good ones hahaha
NoidZ@reddit
What? I never asked for a salary per month. I always thought that something usually only very young people do. I"ve always asked per year. It's just easier to calculate with.
saidwyn@reddit (OP)
Gotcha, thanks!
exclaim_bot@reddit
You're welcome!
PanickyFool@reddit
For after tax equivalency divide by 3.
ComprehensiveWar120@reddit
They’re taxed at 66% in NL ?
PanickyFool@reddit
Taxes are pretty damn high, and if you include the VAT you may be close to 66%. But just combine the lower incomes and higher incomes taxes, take home is about 1/3.
Stuffthatpig@reddit
I disagree on the 66% aspect. Other than tech and clothing, I find food to be cheaper here. Cars are more expensive but you generally have smaller cars that aren't that spendy.
Taxes are high but OP will almost certainly have the 30% ruling. With the 30% ruling, your income rate is more or less capped at 35%.
Accprova@reddit
I'll never understand people who say "mid-X figures". Just say how much you make, we're not the IRS. Anyway, if I were in your position, I wouldn't move for less than €150k.
saidwyn@reddit (OP)
Yes, that was more vague than I meant. I meant around 150,000 (mid-100s), it depends on bonus payout.
dallyan@reddit
I would edit your post. Mid-six figures sounds like 500,000.
Stuffthatpig@reddit
No, it doesn't. Most people mean ~150 with mid six. Accurate? No but it is reality. It's a throwback to when 100k was making it
Accprova@reddit
Allright, then it's quite a different story. Still, I assume that with your profile you'd get an offer around the €100k mark, which is a nice comfy salary with the 30% ruling. I would aim for that.
Simco_@reddit
The posts here where people can't get their answers because they're too scared to say what continent they're in are worse.
lamppb13@reddit
For real. Why are people so scared to share where they are? Especially if it could be relevant.
Creative-Road-5293@reddit
They're called Europoors for a reason. Your salary is going to take a huge hit.
theGIRTHQUAKE@reddit
Hi OP, I was in your situation in 2023, moved to NL at start of 2024. Prior to moving here I was making $200k base in the US in engineering middle management in the nuclear industry, living in a medium/high COL city. My reasons for moving were also similar.
I received a job offer for a similar or slightly higher-level position in NL for €8.300/month + 8% holiday pay, so approximately €107.500 annually. Of course, there was some sticker shock there by pure numbers, especially when considering the 49.5% marginal tax bracket in NL compared to my 24% in the US when married filing jointly, but I did the same research you’re doing now including a reddit post. I was effectively clowned because few locals took it seriously that in the Netherlands I was really asking if €100k+ a year was a good salary for experienced management. In short, yes, this is more than enough to live comfortably and not think much about money even as the sole income for a family of four (two kids).
Of course this significantly depends on your COL and lifestyle in the US, and what you expect to maintain and can tolerate giving up, but in the ballpark I would say any offer in the €80k+ range for middle management is fair for NL and would give you a comparable standard of living, though depending on the responsibilities of the role and industry benchmark you may want to demand higher. Keep in mind that you’ll most likely migrate on an HSM visa and benefit from the 30% ruling, but if you plan to stay in NL indefinitely don’t let them lowball you on the base salary just because you’re getting a temporary tax break. Eventually it will end, and you don’t want to be stuck with a low base compared to your peers. And no matter how much your employer covers of the move, unless you only own a suitcase worth of stuff you personally will spend a lot of money in the move that you wouldn’t have had to spend otherwise and this tax break helps recover that loss.
Its a complex comparison, and again also largely depends on your COL in the US and your family situation, but very generally: after all taxes and normal bills, I had a little more disposable income in the US—but not a lot more. This was also because I put a fair amount into savings/investments to pay for kids’ college and retirement supplementation, two things that aren’t things you have to plan so heavily for here.
And our quality of life is the same or better, all things considered. (cont'd...)
theGIRTHQUAKE@reddit
(...cont'd) On the surface, the US looks better—more money and opportunity for growing wealth and investment, private health insurance meaning top specialists are only a phone call away, much larger houses and land, cheaper nicer cars and car ownership, generally cheaper consumer goods, and better variety of food and entertainment.
But the lifestyle here is more relaxed, simpler (if you allow it to be), far, far more human working culture, healthier, food is pretty boring but there is lots to love and you can still get creative, transport and infrastructure is stellar, houses—though small—are better quality and more modern from a materials and energy management standpoint unless you’re getting an old place that hasn’t been renovated in decades. Kids’ healthcare is free until 18, childcare is cheaper, you can choose what school they go to and most will be walkable/bikeable when they’re old enough (like 7-9 depending), and university tuition and costs is a couple grand a year rather than requiring a lifetime of debt. And while I’m sometimes frustrated by the Dutch approach to healthcare administration, it is high quality first-world healthcare that does not change because you’re a millionaire or because you lost your job or because you’re retired and geriatric. It’s the same for everyone, and it’s guaranteed by law, and growing old here doesn’t terrify me like it does in the US after watching what my parents went through. You do still have to pay health insurance premiums, but it's in the ballpark of €200/month per adult with annual out of pocket max of €300 instead of $1400/month for a family plan with $15k out of pocket annually.
Look, it’s a beautiful, charming, boring, rainy, relaxed, friendly, cold, healthy, temperate, little home of a place, and most people speak OK-to-excellent English which helps you stumble through your early years. It’s not perfect. Some things you will love, some things you will miss about the US. Even being quite familiar with NL for a decade before moving here (wife is Dutch), in retrospect I still had rose-tinted glasses on when we made the decision. But even now after settling down and living with the reality of things, I still prefer it to the US without hesitation. Of course, this is extremely subjective, and YMMV. Do note that the various NL subreddits and expat/immigrant posts are ridiculously negative for whatever reason--my experience is vastly different IRL. It's a great place, and it's a great jumping-off point for travel.
The one thing I would caution you on is don’t take the housing crisis lightly—it’s very real here, far worse than anywhere in the US. Look around on Funda.nl to get an idea of the kind of house you can afford in the area(s) you're considering, and then consider that (especially in the larger towns and cities) you will probably lose your first few house bids to people putting in ridiculous emotional €20-100k bids over market value, or cash offers.
I'm writing a book, DM me if you have any questions. Cheers
EnoughNumbersAlready@reddit
Hey OP! I came from a similar background in the NE US and my former US salary was $172k per year in NYC. I left the US for love, quality of life, and access to good and reliable healthcare. My salary at my new job in NL went from €82k to 95k to now €103k in the last 3 years. You need to manage your expectations because you won’t be getting the same salary as the US but you will be getting a lot more in social safety nets and quality of life.
I was quite sour about the drop in my income initially but I adjusted and still much prefer my life in NL than in the US. Groceries are not insanely priced. Public transportation is good and reliable for the most part. Even moving to the countryside isn’t a huge issue because this country is literally so small that you can drive 15 minutes and be in a new village.
blooparagraphs@reddit
you can just research general salary trends online, but it's not uncommon for a given role (in general) to pay half as much or even less in NL -- compared to the US. So if salary is quite important for you, NL cannot compete with the US.
dallyan@reddit
Why are these types of white collar jobs so highly paid in the US yet service sector work or other blue collar jobs so poorly paid (relatively)?
hmm138@reddit
The US has almost no worker protections. Very weak labor laws. So highly trained professionals can demand more but more ‘replaceable’ workers have almost no rights and no ability to negotiate a living wage. The federal minimum wage is still only about $7.50 per hour, although many states have increased that.
dwylth@reddit
Racism
samelaaaa@reddit
For one data point, I make around $500k in the US, and was offered a transfer to the same job in the Netherlands (machine learning engineering) for around €280k.
Outrageous-Garlic-27@reddit
Did you accept?
samelaaaa@reddit
Yes, and then at the very last minute decided to come back to the US due mostly to schooling issues for our kid who has some special needs, and we didn't think dropping him into a new environment and new language was the best idea at the time. It still feels bittersweet as we absolutely loved the Netherlands, in particular Utrecht where we were going to be living. Maybe one day, there are many seasons of life!
mayfeelthis@reddit
Payscale and Glassdoor are good websites to look this up, and also google if your sector has a collective labour agreement (CAO is the abbreviation in Dutch)…always good to know your field.
ComprehensiveWar120@reddit
They’re taxed at 66% in NL ?
Chary_314@reddit
Please check the rent prices in the Netherlands, they are crazy now. Much easier to get mortgage.