Lexus Kills Off The RC And RC F Coupes After 11 Years | Carscoops
Posted by KpopMarxist@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 400 comments
Posted by KpopMarxist@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 400 comments
Juicyjackson@reddit
I think the RC looks awesome, I just always felt it was way too expensive for what you get below the RCF level.
$1800 more over the RC350 gets you an M240i...
And I feel like for $70k for the RCF is just too much for what you get. I think it would be hard to chose over a Dark Horse or M2.
aceofspadez138@reddit
I also feel like the RC got left behind in terms of design overhaul during the last major refresh. I’m obviously biased, but I feel like the IS surpassed it in terms of looks.
mr_duong567@reddit
The latest IS is gorgeous regardless of the trim. I wasn’t a fan of the 3GIS’s headlights and felt the whole body proportions were weird (rear looked narrow, grill gave it a wide front look), but the 4GIS fixed a lot of it.
F1_Geek@reddit
It's the 3.75 gen IS (A.K.A. the second refresh of the 3rd generation IS). It is not the 4th generation.
mr_duong567@reddit
Thank you good sir!
F1_Geek@reddit
No problem. <3
cubs223425@reddit
I don't mind the looks myself. I think it's fine. However, like the IS 500, it's come down to a question of how you justify price increases that are paced with competing platforms that get whole new generations.
DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit
While the updated 2021+ IS received a fantastic refresh, Lexus screwed up the center stack design by using glossy piano black plastic, instead of sticking with the matte finished center stack that the RC still has. And this is coming from someone who really likes both cars.
Internal_Set1283@reddit
After having mine for almost 4 years now, I only have like 1 small scratch on that section that’s only noticeable when I dust my car. It’s just climate control buttons and volume knobs, not like you’re often dragging things or bumping into it with water bottles.
Now the area with window switches being piano black is much more of an issue… ugh
Gorgenapper@reddit
I'm also super biased, the IS has the elements of a coupe-sedan going on in the rear, but without sacrificing the rear doors and their practicality, plus that light bar across the rear is so sexy. The IS350 F-Sport is also cheaper than the RC by $9k CAD, a not insignificant amount.
InvasionOfScipio@reddit
Putting Dark Horse in the $70k category makes me want to throw up. What a rip off.
Juicyjackson@reddit
There is no competition, it sucks, but it's your only option for a V8 Manual <$100k.
Cpt_Kneegrow@reddit
Isn’t the GT350 a NA VA manual?
Juicyjackson@reddit
Not in production right now.
X-02@reddit
CT5-V Blackwing fits the bill, but only if you have zero options on it
Juicyjackson@reddit
$99,090 starting price before any fees/taxes.
After fees and taxes you will be paying well into the $100k range.
Larcya@reddit
Which is why people will get the mustang over it. $100,000 is nearing 911 territory. And yes I know it's a Super charged V8 but still the cost is really hard to justify when you look at what else you can get for around $100,000.
terroristteddy@reddit
But the whole appeal is that it's a manual sedan. So the real competition is other sports sedans, and it undercuts all of the M's and AMG's at least.
DaggumTarHeels@reddit
911's start at $120K now and are absolutely atrocious in terms of interior/features unless you add another $25K in options.
WhetBred14@reddit
Probably can’t handle the truth. Was building a base 911 the other day and once I was done with what I found necessary I was at a price where I thought I might as well get a GTS
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Stripper 911 is best 911
narwhal_breeder@reddit
Unfortunately you have to pay more for a stripper 911, a-la 911T
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Too true.
Larcya@reddit
The Blackwing is also going to cost closer to $120K after all the taxes and Fees. That's assuming you don't option it out.
A base 911 Interior is serviceable and owning a 911 makes up for it.
DaggumTarHeels@reddit
I strongly disagree here. The base interior feels like a GTI. And that comes with manually adjustable seats, hard plastics, no heated/vented seats, base headlights, no adaptive cruise, etc.
They're fun cars, but we're at the point where hype has overtaken the actual product.
cannedrex2406@reddit
I dunno, when it comes to a Base PDK 911 or a Manual Supercharged V8 Sedan, I genuinely think it's weird to pick the 911. It's such a bland car in comparison. Sure it won't handle as good as a 911, but it'll be slower and less interesting.
But what do I know about Fun, I drive a Volvo
desirox@reddit
Are those selling for sticker?
narwhal_breeder@reddit
Yes. Chevrolet is making enough of them.
Slideways@reddit
Chevrolet is making zero of them.
narwhal_breeder@reddit
Doh. GM.
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
Camaro was a great model, but lack practical capability killed it.
Angels-Fall-First@reddit
I've seen manual Mustang GTs brand new marked down to 40k at local dealerships. I get that it doesn't have magnaride or anything but if all you care about is a V8 and a six speed then that is an option for almost half the price.
gropingpriest@reddit
can you not get the base GT or any of the cheaper trim GT Mustangs with a manual anymore?
ScipioAfricanvs@reddit
Of course you can, the Dark Horse is not the only option lol.
$48,850 for a stripper GT Fastback with manual.
Mug_Lyfe@reddit
Jesus 50k for no frills GT?
Intel_Oil@reddit
Starting at 68k in europe :)
sohcgt96@reddit
Well I mean, you can just get a GT and not a Dark Horse. But JFC I just priced out a 6 speed GT, performance pack, then the option deal with heated seats because I do really like those, nothing really else for options and it was still $57,000. Fuckin' A man. Then they wonder why younger people aren't into cars anymore.
Unlucky_Situation@reddit
Base GT s650 comes in manual.
You're not limited to the Dark Horse.
Leo_York@reddit
The only other new option under that price that exists is the CT5-Blackwing and I just looked up the prices, it's nominally under $100k, but you're not out the door for under 100.
I'm not counting the obvious regular GT Mustang. And if you're willing to go over, I guess there's always the Koenigsegg CC850 lol.
FWD_to_twin_turbo@reddit
I get it tho, i was cross shopping a manual coupe the other day and i'm having a hard time choosing between a clapped New Edge Cobra from Craigslist and a Pagani Utopia.
Suck_My_Thick@reddit
You would have to be a hardcore Mustang fan to get that over a C8 Stingray.
uberdosage@reddit
Well the dark horse starts at 60k not 70k, thats a pretty big difference
AncefAbuser@reddit
I'd rather light 70k on fire than get a Dark Horse. What a rip off.
M2 is the only sane option at that price point for a 2 door RWD sports coupe.
Juicyjackson@reddit
What's wrong with the Dark Horse?
Tremec 6 speed manual.
500 horsepower V8.
Magneride suspension.
Seems pretty cool?
AncefAbuser@reddit
If it was 60k, sure. Not 70k.
That is honest to goodness Corvette money and at a level that comes with a Corvette that isn't bare bones and is far more performant.
I'm old enough to remember when a V8 Mustang actually started below 40k too, not 46k.
The prices on the S550.2 are insane.
strongmanass@reddit
Then you're also old enough to remember when pay was much less. I'm sure you wouldn't want to go back to whatever wages you earned when the Mustang was $40K.
Porshuh@reddit
The average US income in 2000 was $57.5k. In 2022 it was $77.6k. A 35% increase.
https://www.statista.com/topics/789/wages-and-salary/
Groceries cost 94.25% more since 2000.
https://www.officialdata.org/Food-and-beverages/price-inflation/2000-to-2024?amount=100
The median home value in 2000 was $119.6k (Inflation adj. $219.2k). The actual median home value in 2025 is $440k, an almost 370% increase.
https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2003/dec/c2kbr-20.html https://www.usinflationcalculator.com https://www.usatoday.com/money/homefront/moving/median-home-price-by-state/
strongmanass@reddit
From that food link:
Inflation over the same period was 2.43% per year. In other words, food has gotten only marginally more expensive. Here's a graph which makes it easier to compare goods categories.
As for wages, the median wage has increased slightly when accounting for inflation.
I'm not saying things are fine and dandy for consumers - that's not the case at all. But "25 cents for a gallon of milk back in my day" type comments always ignore that wages were a lot lower then too. And the big picture is always more nuances when you take a big picture view of things.
Mug_Lyfe@reddit
Why not find stats about cars instead of food, though? Or better still, inflation salary vs cost of living over the same time frame.
strongmanass@reddit
The comment is deleted now, but the person I replied to used food as one of their inflation metrics. The link to the graph in my previous comment has different categories you can select for. New cars is one of them.
Inflation-adjusted salary is a measure of the cost of living over time.
Mug_Lyfe@reddit
This can't be 1:1. There's no way.
strongmanass@reddit
Idk how it's calculated and I imagine being as accurate as possible is the subject of a lot of debate and some complex differential equations. For example, housing costs outpace inflation, but housing costs are part of inflation, so the overall inflation rate depends partially on the change in housing costs. But housing prices are market-driven - i.e. they directly depend on what housing buyers can pay. So housing prices depend on pay. Except that's not a linear relationship because home ownership rates skew toward the wealthy and there's a separate investment property and short-term rental market.
I think basic inflation calculators you see at BLS and other webites are fairly rudimentary in terms of methodology, but to properly capture it would require much more complicated equations and variable relationships.
TL;DR: you're probably right, but I'm not sure in what way. Only economists can really know how to calculate inflation. For casual conversations like this, basic calculators are enough IMO.
Mug_Lyfe@reddit
My man 🤝
probsdriving@reddit
Whatever the source is for your 2000 income, it’s way off. Median income was $42k according to the US Census.
Nearly $60k in 2000 just seems way, way off and I had to double check that. Looking at Census data, the average income didn’t eclipse $60k till 2017 (!!!)
Drzhivago138@reddit
Median and mean are different things.
probsdriving@reddit
Mean is a worthless measure to draw conclusions from.
AncefAbuser@reddit
I made more when the Mustang was 40k.
Inflation + declining Medicare reimbursement and private reimbursements to physicians haven't been so kind.
But your average administrator absolutely made more in the same time period.
strongmanass@reddit
I've been hearing more about physician salaries and they definitely seem lower across the board in real terms than a few years ago, and certainly when I was in school and it was the field to get accepted into. The academic hazing, stress, weight of consequences, hours - to say nothing of difficult patients and administrative tedium - that you all deal with seem increasingly less worth it. But I'm sure it's a labor of love. I never had the calling so from the outside I only see the negatives, but I'm sure there's a lot of good as well.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Average pay for a UK NIH doctor is £40k.
Cry me a river.
strongmanass@reddit
Ok you're underpaid too. By a lot. You being severely underpaid doesn't mean someone in the same field as you elsewhere in the world isn't also underpaid.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
I am not a doctor employed by UK NIH.
Just making the point that by global standards, American doctors are obscenely overpaid. Just one facet of the broken US healthcare system.
strongmanass@reddit
UK physicians also receive a lower - and much less expensive - level of standard training (MBBS vs MD).
If you read my whole exchange with the other commenter, you'll see that US healthcare costs are not due to physician compensation. You're entitled to your opinion on MD salaries, but part of the reason I didn't go to medical school is I don't think doctors are paid enough to deal with all the crap they go through. To phrase it differently, I'd have to get paid a lot more than physicians currently are to put up with the crap they have to.
AncefAbuser@reddit
The people who generally use physician salaries as the scape goat to US healthcare dysfunction are the very same people who benefit from the system as it is.
Its always like clockwork with these types.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Orthopedics, huh? Show me your OpenPayments data and we’ll let the voters here decide whether your are underpaid, little bro.
Always the guys driving the Vantage and taking huge kickbacks from Medtronic and the rest crying poverty.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
The US healthcare system can be trash (it is), US doctors can be wildly overcompensated by global standards (they are), AND their salaries can be a facet of (though by no means the primary reason for) the unbelievable cost, yet mediocre outcomes, of the US medical system.
The fact that you and the other commenter have latched onto a point I never actually said or implied:
shows me neither of you actually care to debate the issue honestly.
Cheers!
YaB0ring@reddit
Can you please point out to me where I stated that? Because it seems to me that you and the other commenter have gone on and on about a point you have made up.
AncefAbuser@reddit
I take the good with the bad. I'm private practice ortho, so on many levels I blunt a lot of that BS but its very hard to ignore in my practice.
It is still a stable career. The public just hates us on average, except when they still need us. Its gotten worse over the last 5-6 years for sure.
Its tough having the same conversation with patients that the middle managers and morons are what drives the bloat, upwards of 85-90% of the costs have nothing to do with the clinicians. I'd love to tell them I get maybe 1400 for their total knee, the other several zeros on their bill I have no clue what are for or where they go.
strongmanass@reddit
Part of the unfortunate backlash against intellectualism. They hate scientists and scholars too. But we don't have to deal with them directly and put emotions aside to provide their bodies better care than they want to learn about or believe in.
I'd argue that for the amount of schooling, the specificity of expertise, the hours worked, the competence necessary for the job, and the importance, you all are underpaid.
I remember spending two hours going line by line through my mother's surgery bill a few years ago because it was way more than the estimate. They double charged her for a couple of different parts of the procedure, but the duplicate charges were dufferent by a few dollars and under different obscure terms, so it took some digging to figure it out. When we called the hospital to dispute they just removed the charges with no pushback. Stories like this always sound like r/thathappened urban legend, but it indeed happened. Maybe it was clerical error, but it was an expensive error.
AncefAbuser@reddit
Nope, it 100% is done by design by administrators, MBAs, PBMs and the rest of the bloated apparatus. They know enough people will never challenge it and they rely on you not contesting the errors.
Way too many peer to peers end with me winning simply because I called and took a confrontational stance. Its purely an exercise in wasting time and delaying care because that is all they care about - the quarter to quarter gains.
I feel like I get paid a very comfortable amount for what I do and what I've built in my practice and building. I think that my colleagues are genuinely underpaid in the primary care side of things and their burdens increase on a regular basis beyond mine. Or EMS who is critically essential but is paid like dogshit and many areas of the country face significant shortages as more and more EMS consolidation happens.
Is there enough to raise our income to levels that matches what the general public almost always thinks it is? Sure. Fire 90% of the administrators and you'll recover hundreds of billions of dollars to then spread around to where it needs to go.
American healthcare is intentionally bloated. No reason we can't have systems that mimic the public/private apparatus of say, Germany. I'd still make income like a dog and do well. People would not be going bankrupt over their healthcare. Americans pay in taxes, then they pay monthly premiums, then they paid to meet out of pocket maxs - but somehow everyone in authority is convinced that single payer is satanic.
DM-Me-Your_Titties@reddit
Our system isnt perfect in Australia (in my state, nsw, public sector healthcare is severely underpaid at all levels) but i can honestly say I've never needed to worry about if my patient will be able to pay for the lifesaving care that they need. I can't believe it's even a consideration in other places.
If you need it, you will get dialysis, intubated, ECMO, etc. It doesn't matter if you are broke. Your taxes and someone else's taxes already paid for it.
strongmanass@reddit
Deliberately overbilling is fraud; there's no way to sugar coat it.
I'm glad you feel well-compensated. That goes a long way toward job satisfaction and one would assume patient outcomes are tied to physician job satisfaction on a large scale.
Medical reform in this country is a regulatory and political nightmare. We consistently have worse patient-related metrics despite high medical care costs and some of the best hospitals in the world, but people somehow don't think the system needs radical change.
AncefAbuser@reddit
The overbilling always kills me. There truly are few things that have teeth with Medicare, and billing fraud is 110% of the time caught and convicted on.
It also tells you all you need to know. Medicare comes down harder on the individual doc who ducked up than they do the conglomerates and health insurances and PBMs.
StandupJetskier@reddit
Private health insurance is a parasite that feeds both on patients and providers-the only known parasite for two hosts at once.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Average pay for a UK NIH doctor is £40k.
Cry me a river.
AncefAbuser@reddit
That is the UK. Their education is not predatory. They have no insurance bloat. Context matters.
I don't have a problem taking a pay cut.
You're not doing too poorly yourself little bro. Do you really need a baby Porsche and fancy Crown?
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
I am not a doctor; I am in a different highly overpaid profession in the US.
Just making the point that US doctors are obscenely overpaid, by global standards, “little bro.”
AncefAbuser@reddit
We're underpaid, little bro.
Congrats on buying the rhetoric that doctors are why healthcare is bloated in America.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
I don’t buy the rhetoric. The fact that doctors are paid with they are is just a symptom of the entirely broken healthcare system. The AMA sees to that with its quotas.
AncefAbuser@reddit
Lmao it isn't rhetoric. Medicare literally announces cuts to reimbursement on a yearly basis. This year is what, 3-4% or something. Private insurers follow along and decrease their reimbursements accordingly.
You strike me as a MBA/JD type who has zero idea or worse, actually believes the business led rhetoric.
AMA doesn't do quotas. You must be thinking ACGME, who oversees residency seats, who approves increases and new programs every single year. Or you're thinking CMS, which used to be the sole funding source for residency training but lately programs self fund or use HHS/HRSA because residents are cheap, profitable labor for hospital systems.
You don't even know what you're talking about yet are so arrogantly confident about it.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Whether Medicare should be paying $80k per year for a single Humira prescription, or 3% less, is not the flex you think it is.
And you admit, there are quotas in place? Weird how that might cause the cost of physician labor to be artificially inflated, little bro.
AncefAbuser@reddit
Yup. You have no clue what you are talking about. Typical.
bullyXLdisrespector@reddit
Unlike many car forums, in this sub a greater percentage of the active users tend to actually own interesting cars, which I appreciate.
However, the result of that is they tend to be employed in extractive industries such as finance, management, and administration, which don't contribute in aggregate to the health of an economy, as those are the positions that have been most rewarded in the last decades.
GimmeChickenBlasters@reddit
2 years ago? You sure have strong opinions on a subject you clearly know little about.
Word_Underscore@reddit
My 2012 GT 6MT manual premium package (leather, shaker, spoiler etc) STICKERED at like 33-34.
MentalMiilk@reddit
Youre just gonna leave out that 34k in 2012 money is 47k in 2024 money huh
LordofSpheres@reddit
And in that time the mustang got IRS and 70 more horsepower, to name only the most obvious improvements.
probsdriving@reddit
They are $60k though.
They’re selling for $6k-$8k under MSRP and like $15k under MSRP for demo units with <1k miles on them.
I swear everyone on this sub inflates the cost of cars by $10-20k to suit a narrative that hasn’t been true since 2022.
AwesomeBantha@reddit
I’m pretty sure S650s are selling with massive incentives because everyone has realized that it’s overpriced
And I’m not saying the Dark Horse is a great deal or anything, but it comes with a stick, and I bet it’ll be more desirable than a base C8 in the future
MentalMiilk@reddit
Imo its more desirable than a base C8 now.
Juicyjackson@reddit
Can't get a manual Corvette.
AncefAbuser@reddit
A manual doesn't belong in a car that claims its about track performance.
Not a good argument.
MentalMiilk@reddit
A car that is focused on track performance doesn't belong on the street.
Juicyjackson@reddit
Tell that to the ZL1 1LE or the Viper ACR.
FWD_to_twin_turbo@reddit
That other dude just casually forgot that the same manual Viper ACR was in shootouts with Europe's finest on track for a good minute, and it wasn't exactly losing.
Nowadays, no one wants to even go near them in a straight line unless your horsepower numbers look similar to a suburban street address.
cubs223425@reddit
I've personally never taken the "We're unique, so we're going to rail you on the price" to be something that makes me want a product more. It's one of my greatest frustrations with the current market of performance cars. Car makers have tried to each off a niche and punish the buyer for wanting it. All of the niches (Lexus NA V8, Cadillac-V manuals, etc.) have received unreasonably markups I don't care to accept.
DanielG165@reddit
You sure can, the C7 still exists, and you can get a nicely specced C7 Z06 for around $80-$90k these days.
Juicyjackson@reddit
Of course if you go used you can. But then why not talk about other used cars...
You can't compare a last gen used corvette to a brand new dark horse, that's just dumb.
DanielG165@reddit
Shrugs. Fair enough!
uberdosage@reddit
I mean... it is 60k though. As long as you don't get the handling pack, which is honestly a better move if you aren't tracking it.
macgirthy@reddit
Yup, the auto DH weighs 4000lbs too. Like how did ford manage to add that much weight when an auto S550 mustang GT was around 3800lbs? The S650 and S550 externally are the same dimensions. They added 200lbs somehow while the size remained the same.
If there is an S650 GT500 I wouldn't be surprised if its near hellcat weight, while still being a smaller vehicle.
Krankjanker@reddit
If your that "old", then certainly you are aware of the massive inflation rise between now and when the V8 started under $40k?
WrongdoerSoggy4422@reddit
Agreed. $70k gets you a corvette now with discounts, the dark horse is not irrelevant at anything more than the high 50s
AncefAbuser@reddit
The Corvette will always, barring neurological trauma from GM, be the performance bargain at basically all pricepoints. They've upped the quality without dragging the price too far upmarket too. It is commendable and should be lauded.
They easily could've said "suck our ass" and priced the thing at 80k and gotten away with it too, they didn't.
Hell, a 3LT Z51 for 90k is punching at double to triple its MSRP. God bless them.
WrongdoerSoggy4422@reddit
Yeah i agree with all of that too. Im just saying its hard to tolerate a non special mustang like the darkhorse for the same price as a base corvette. The corvette gets you exotic looks, mid engine, aluminum chassis, better transmission, etc. Darkhorse you can row your own gears so i can see some buyers for that but otherwise at $70k, the mustang just is not competitive.
DanielG165@reddit
Too expensive for what is essentially a beefier Mach 1. You could either get a nicely-specced C8 Stingray Z51 with the same power, Magride, a mid engine set up, and a host of tech and amenities for the same price, if not a little cheaper.
Or, you could snag a newer 2SS Camaro SS 1LE that also offers Magride as standard, sits on a superior chassis, comes with a 6-speed manual, and a bunch of hardware that makes it track ready day 1. Hell, you might even be able to find a taken care of ZL1 for $80k these days, and have a supercharged sports car with a manual trans for the price of a Dark Horse.
ClassicRealistic4423@reddit
It is extremely hard to find 1LEs in my area right now. It's effectively a discontinued car now
LordofSpheres@reddit
Oh man, I have bad news for you about the Camaro...
ClassicRealistic4423@reddit
Yeah I'm quite aware from searching for one. Not sure why I said effectively and not literally 😅
stakoverflo@reddit
For me, at the end of the day, it's still just another Mustang. Barely looks different than the EcoBoost that costs half the price. Everyone and their mom has a Mustang.
randeus@reddit
The DH looks quite different from a base ecoboost lol
nondescriptzombie@reddit
$125k top tier trim package what?
What moron would buy a Dark Horse over a Vette with that kind of clink?
Juicyjackson@reddit
We just making up numbers?
The Dark Horse Premium with every single option including the accessories is $99k...
nondescriptzombie@reddit
Oh, I went off of the blurb that popped up when I googled 2025 Dark Horse MSRP which said $75-125k
ClassicRealistic4423@reddit
I'm purely a bmw m guy but the dark horse is still an excellent car even compared to the m2 assuming you're looking for something track worthy.
kamil234@reddit
Yeah true, I been cross shopping the f type, rcf and m2. M2 checks the most boxes for me, but it is SO ugly (in my personal opinion)
ScipioAfricanvs@reddit
Same. In a vacuum I'd be an M2 buyer. But I can't past the styling.
biguk997@reddit
Just get an f87! Thats what I did.
ScipioAfricanvs@reddit
Thought about it but for a daily I had concerns about suspension stiffness. A test drive doesn’t really say enough to tell you whether it would annoy you over time. What do you think?
For what it’s worth I used to daily a 997.2 without PASM and tolerated it but would ideally like something more plus, and especially adaptive would be nice.
biguk997@reddit
Yeah thats 100% fair. Mine is on coilovers which are supposed to be softer than stock and it still is an atrocious ride. I dont think I could daily it.
Suck_My_Thick@reddit
C8 Stingray starts at $68K
ricochet48@reddit
This. I'm in the market for a AWD coupe with a somewhat usable backseat and there's 3 available
I was hoping Lexus would somehow make a modern coupe to follow these up and compete with BMW as the more reliable, cheaper option, but alas that does not seem to be happening unfortunately.
StrangeMedium3300@reddit
i felt it was overpriced 8 years ago when i had my rc350 f-sport, and i got mine for over 25% off sticker.
HankSteakfist@reddit
Yeah, an NA V6 or a 4cyl Turbo just wasn't eventful enough for an 1800kg grand tourer.
The V8 should've been the standard powerplant with the RCF getting a tuned or turbocharged version.
eyi526@reddit
People are willing to pay the "reliability" tax.
Just played around on the Lexus and BMW configurators. An RC F built to my perference is about $80k. A BMW M340i xDrive built to my preference is about $70k. The M240i xDrive would be about $60k.
With my last few visits to Lexus dealers, the first thing a sales associate does is pull out the Consumer Reports car reliability chart (same ones that get posted on reddit), and talk about how trash German cars are and how I'd be stranded on the highway eventually due to a breakdown. Not necessarily disagreeing, but not a fan of this tactic either lol.
mrob2@reddit
Genuinely, what other selling point do they have over BMW? BMWs are faster, more efficient, and more modern. And barely less reliable even at this point with Bx8 motors
CrimsonFlam3s@reddit
V8 and the exhaust note I would say are big selling points for some if you look at the RC F's main competition but Lexus could have definitely lowered the price to make it more competitive.
mrob2@reddit
I obv agree with you, but I don’t think most people do lol based on sales numbers between is500s and m340is
CrimsonFlam3s@reddit
I agree but such is life, there is always gonna be those who prefer raw performance for the price.
I drove a 2020 M2 competition and although I liked the styling/power/transmission, it didn't feel any faster than the RC F to give up the v8/exhaust note, without mentioning that they were even on the 0-60 and on the rolling start or 5-60(which is is the metric I care the most about) and the RC F has it beat.
Most turbo cars are hard to judge by paper specs alone, gotta drive it to tell for sure.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Lol if you think the cost of maintaining the engine itself makes those cars “barely less reliable” than a Lexus, well then you are in for a rude awakening.
mrob2@reddit
Cost has nothing to do with reliability. If my oil change is twice as expensive on a BMW as it is on a Lexus (which it isn’t but I’m making a point) it doesn’t mean the BMW is half as reliable.
We’re a long way from the rod bearing failures, sub frame issues, fuel injector issues etc of BMWs past. The biggest issues for most BMWs (bar the E46 sub frame problems I think) were all engine related so I highlighted engine reliability specifically.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
I think you’ve just proven my point. My RC has had zero none-routine maintenece in the last decade. I’ve spent maybe $3k total (including tires and fluids) on maintaining the car over the last ten years. Most guys with M cars are falling over themselvesthe part ways with the car as soon as the warranty is up.
We are not the same.
mrob2@reddit
Dude I own an IS500 lmfao I get where you’re coming from. But I think it’s disingenuous to say BMWs (especially new ones) are unreliable because they are expensive. They are expensive to maintain but if nothing breaks on one I don’t think you can say they’re unreliable. Nothing broke on my M6 I just didn’t want to pay for my upcoming brake job and injector/coil pack refresh. I wouldn’t say the car is unreliable for that because it’s known consumables.
You’re conflating cost of ownership and reliability.
Also, how tf have you only spent $3k on tires over 10 years? A set of high performance Conti’s are $1k and I’m torching through them at a rate of new rears every 10-15k miles lol
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
On the tires, I bought the car with only 9k miles in 2020 and they were the original OEM Bridgestones. I replaced them due to age, but a replacement set was only like $1400 installed or so. I only put about 5-7k on the car annually, and the rest of the $3k is just anyal fluids & checkups.
mrob2@reddit
Gotcha. I’d think there’s a lot of overlap between having a cayman and RC 350 (two door coupes). If you aren’t driving the RC much why keep it around and not just have the cayman?
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Cayman is a decent daily for a true sports car, but not ideal as a daily more broadly. I did daily it for several years and it just felt like a waste to rack up the miles on my mundane commute, so I opted for something a little quieter / more comfortable and the Cayman comes out on weekends.
eyi526@reddit
IMO, outside of "reliability" and "ownership costs" (obviously model dependant), that's all I could think of.
Those key terms are most mentioned in other subs like r/whatcarshouldibuy r/askcarguys and even car brand subs r/lexus r/bmw r/audi etc etc.
Then there's always the discussion of "If I had $100k+ to spend on a car, I could care less about reliability/cost of ownership".
mrob2@reddit
Yeah there’s really not much lol. There’s a reason BMW is selling so well despite a lot of their cars looking questionable to many people.
I guarantee people would still care about resale too though lol.
I got the IS because I think it looks better than a 340i or M3 inside and out, the V8 is unique, and I know it will last well over 100k miles, and it will theoretically depreciate less than the BMW due to rarity compared to those other two cars.
eyi526@reddit
Oh yea. Forgot about depreciation/resale. I usually don't care about that because I tend to keep my cars for as long as possible - this generally has me favoring the Japanese brands. I don't have the luxury to switch cars at my leisure lol.
The IS isn't a bad platform, though it's definitely a bit "long in the tooth" or whatever the saying is. I have a love/hate with the IS as it "looked" sporty to me, but didn't really feel like it when I used to own one. I hope the Toyota/Lexus can figure out things for the next generation. Fanboys turn a blind eye to the brand's latest shortcomings and always downvote me whenever I mention them lol.
mrob2@reddit
Even if you don’t swap cars often it’s still important to consider imo. It’s nice knowing that ISFs are still selling for over 20k, usually well over that when they’re 18-13 years old
eyi526@reddit
Yea for sure. I think it also helps that buyers are willing to get older cars than deal with Toyota’s new problems/(seemingly) drop in quality.
Example: I was considering a GX 550, but now the plastic on the outside is melting under direct sunlight (amongst other problems found by owners)?? Doesn’t look like Toyota is willing to admit fault yet, either. Might have to consider the GX 460 for now, or another brand entirely.
Thomas_633_Mk2@reddit
To get it in yellow you need to pay 87k, it seems. Because the carbon fibre package is a requirement for yellow paint????
eyi526@reddit
Looks like it. Pretty common with Lexus in terms of options and packages.
FOr context: I'm not a brand hater as I actually own a Lexus (along with my current Civic), but I'm not a fan of how we cannot choose our own options.
Thomas_633_Mk2@reddit
You can probably tell my opinion on locking yellow behind options packages costing more than a Kia Picanto by my flair
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Is it a “tax” though? It seems to me paying more for better fit, finish, NVH, et cetera is a non-controversial decision. When you add it the massive maintenance costs and depreciation on many of its direct competitors, it seems to me whatever “tax” you pay upfront is more than repaid many times over the life of the vehicle. Which is why RC owners (myself included) dont see it that way at all.
Its a moot point I guess if you are leasing and just have to have all the latest bells and whistles (some of which, like modern BMW’s LED disco atmosphere in the cabin, or all-touchscreen-everything may turn off buyers rather than them seeing it as some sort of plus).
eyi526@reddit
You're not wrong. Not trying to argue nor debate, especially with someone who's been commenting on this post for the past 2 hours lol.
Just curious: if you had to choose between your Cayman S or RC 350 as your only car, which would you choose and why?
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Lol true I’ve been home sick today and am bored, hence my full-throated defense of the RC over the last few hours.
I think that if I had to choose between one or the other, I’d go with the RC. I’ve daily’d a Cayman for a few years, and while that is very doable (Costco runs in the Cayman were routine), I am no longer in my 20’s / 30’s when the tradeoffs in comfort, reliability, and NVH of the Cayman (which is a blast to drive) outweigh its downsides in each of those areas.
Fortunately I am lucky enough to be in a position not have to choose.
WitBeer@reddit
Bmw reliability vs lexus reliability. It all depends on if you want to keep it after the warranty expires.
Juicyjackson@reddit
I would happily keep a M240i after the warranty expires... uses the same exact engine that is in the Supra.
WitBeer@reddit
The supra has the bmw motor, and that doesn't mean either has toyota/lexus reliability. I spent so much more money on my bmw than I did on 3 toyotas combined.
mrob2@reddit
Which bmw? Which motor?
WitBeer@reddit
E46, S54. The motor wasn't the problem, it was everything electronic.
mrob2@reddit
Yeah E46 is the one I can think of where it was everything around the motor. S65, N63, N54, early S63 definitely were the ones where the motor was the main problem I think.
TheAnon13@reddit
What about the rest of the car and all its complicated parts. Sure the engine is the big one, but I don’t get why people assume the engine is the only thing that can go wrong in a car.
Signed, someone who’s seen countless HUD issues and other electrical components fail
wip30ut@reddit
keep in mind that the ppl who're choosing any kind lexus coupe over a BMW are doing so strictly from a reliability & cost of maintenance stand-point. Something like 75%+ of BMW's are leased so their buyers don't really care about long-term reliability & out-of-warranty costs, but Lexus owners are keenly aware of the hit to their wallets.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Bingo.
bikedork5000@reddit
Plus they have just let the things become stale. Never did meaningful updates to it. I'm the first guy in line to gripe about infotainment jumping the shark recently, but a 2023 Lexus looks like it's from 2011 on the inside. I mean what year did they FINALLY ditch the stupid analog clock in the dash?
DM-Me-Your_Titties@reddit
You have to pay porsche extra for one. "sports chrono"
04limited@reddit
The RC powertrain options were severely outdated compared to the competition. Reliable but outdated.
That old 2.5 V6 they had in the IS was like 220horse and the upgraded 350 3.5 V6 was 300. Those are E46 era numbers. When the RC came out 2015 I believe the base engine was a 240hp 2.0 turbo and the 300hp 3.5 V6. Wasn’t until recently where the RC300 came with 280hp V6 standard, which closed the gap for the RC350.
narwhal_breeder@reddit
Not to mention the RC-F was heavier than an IS500, for some reason.
animealt46@reddit
The reason is that the RC had no real reason to exist so it got the parts bin special using a cursed mixed platform welded together from 3 different Lexus models (IIRC). For what was seen as a barely viable product it had a good life.
MonkeysRidingPandas@reddit
And it wasn't even for the RC to begin with - it was for the IS Convertible. They just beefed up that Franken-platform a little bit and made the RC.
jca_ftw@reddit
Dammit I got an RC-F after hearing all these idiot YT "car journalists" say it's a modern classic, the V8 is the best they ever heard, it's an investment car, all that garbage. Damn things just depreciate along a normal Toyota curve (maybe slightly better). Roughly 40% after 5 years. The sad fact is nobody wants them because they aren't a manual, they are not that fast, and they don't look exotic.
animealt46@reddit
Which car journalists???? The RC-F is still a great car, but IIRC it did not at all get that level of praise among prestigious journos. The Lexus being called the modern classic is the LC 500 and the inevitable LC-F that actually wasn't inevitable so it doesn't exist.
mr_duong567@reddit
It’s such a same Lexus really shot itself in the foot with the RC, as like you said, it’s an awesome looking car with amazing road presence (especially the facelift), plus Lexus reliability.
I just personally wouldn’t get it new over the many other awesome vehicles in the segment or price, and the used values are way too overpriced, like 45k for a 2015 and no CarPlay ability.
mustangfan12@reddit
I feel like the biggest problem with Lexus's sports coupes is they're underpowered, and reliability alone isn't good enough to sell them. And they also cost too much for what you're getting
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Underpowered compared to what? 300 HP is more than adequate for a daily. Not everyone is trying to live out their Fast & Furious fantasies on public roads.
eZreazy@reddit
Compared to everything else. I agree 300 HP is more than enough but what exactly are you paying for when a camry has just as much power, and a nicer interior? The car also doesn’t handle much better either despite looking sporty.
I also don’t think you need to be driving crazy illegal speeds to enjoy cars either more performance. I had a stinger with more than enough power, but even just a slight upgrade to the m240i is noticeable because of the b58’s characteristics and the transmission being a lot more fun.
The RC350 had it’s place 10 years ago when it was competitive as the nice cruiser but at some point when you sell the same thing for 10 years, either make it cheaper or improve it.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Camry? Really?
Tell me you have never driven a higher end Lexus without telling me you have never done so.
eZreazy@reddit
I’m mainly talking about power and acceleration, it’s an exaggeration but my point is that its wildly overpriced for what you get for the price brand new even when comparing tk other toyota products.
Even within Lexus products it makes no sense at this point. Just an extra 10000 CAD and you get an IS500 which is a lot more exciting. The RC was just really left to rot similar to a nissan z. Even looking at the used market you can see the car is pretty undesirable and isn’t holding its value at all like other Lexus cars. When you compare it to competitors in the used market like the m240i in pretty much all years since the model came out, it’s selling for lower than the m240i according to kbb which is pretty insane considering Lexus is the king of holding its value with its other cars.
I think the car is fine and it looks good, and it’s reliable as hell considering there’s nothing new in the car, I just think it’s been grossly overpriced brand new for the last 5 or so years as I think it doesn’t do anything close to their competitors. Segment wise this compares to the 4 series, A5, or C class coupe and all or those do the GT job better than the current RC at this point yet the price of the cars are way too close.
For what it’s worth I was shopping a 2015 RC 350 back in 2018 but ended up going with an E350 instead and I did drive a newer 2022 RX for about 4 months a couple years ago. I’ve had my experience with Lexus and I think it’s the perfect brand when you just want a daily, my problem is with the RC since I think it doesn’t really make much sense for it’s segment.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Uhh wat? Maybe up in Canada that might be true (they were never ideal for the Canadian climate anyway), but my RC is worth approximately the same in the resale market today as when I purchased it about 5 years ago, even with the addition of 20k more miles. Granted, I purchased it used and your points about the value when new are valid.
eZreazy@reddit
Man I don't know what to tell you, I'm just going by KBB values it might be different in your local market but by KBB they have it that a 2018 RC has depreciated more than a 2018 m240i. I went with 2018 since it's the first model year with the b58.
https://www.kbb.com/bmw/2-series/2018/m240i-coupe-2d/ A 2018 BMW 2 Series M240i Coupe 2D has depreciated $9,782 or 29% in the last 3 years and has a current resale value of $23,810 and trade-in value of $23,172.
https://www.kbb.com/lexus/rc/2018/rc-350-coupe-2d/ A 2018 Lexus RC RC 350 Coupe 2D has depreciated $11,692 or 32% in the last 3 years and has a current resale value of $23,995 and trade-in value of $21,515.
And yes I have been talking about new values this whole time, in the used market if reliability is your thing then yeah the RC makes sense but it just doesn't compete in the segment when reliability is basically the only thing it has going for it.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Well the data spraks for itself; I guess my bias is showing.
Regardless, I maintain that if purchasing a used one with the intent of keeping it long term, and if going with with eyes wide open that it isn’t a sports car or even a performance leader in its class, it is a fantastic value and probably will be a low-key future classic (along the lines of an SC300 / Soarer).
mustangfan12@reddit
You have to step up to the RC 350 to get 311 HP, and it gets very expensive at that point. The BMW M240i offers way more bang for your buck at that point. And the RC 300 is pretty expensive for what you're getting in terms of HP. Even the base Audi A5 coupe offers more HP than the RC 300
squidwardsdicksucker@reddit
That’s a shame, very pretty cars, but they were pretty outdated and overpriced no?
Juicyjackson@reddit
Yep, at every price point you can pretty much get a BMW or something that blows it away.
The M240i destroys the RC350.
The Dark Horse Destroys the RCF, etc.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
As an RC owner, I wanted a reliable, good looking GT luxury car. Mine is now 10 years old and I have had literally zero issues with it. None; just routine tires and fluids. Let’s hear the chorus if M240i and Darkhorse owners say the same thing (with reciepts) after 10 years.
I would never consider unreliable plastic junk like the BMW or Cadillac, regardless of whether they have better hypothetical performance — that is 95% wasted in everyday street driving anyway. (My Cayman is more exciting and better in every way than those cars anyways…)
Choosing a car is about more than just lining up performance numbers.
movingtobay2019@reddit
I would. There are literally thousands of M240i on the road. Yes, I think Lexus has greater reliability if you look at it in aggregate. But if you are an owner, you don't really care about how reliable a car brand is. You care about how reliable YOUR car is.
TurboSalsa@reddit
But isn’t also about more than just lining up predicted reliability numbers?
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Sure is. If that was my priority, I’d buy a Prius.
Penguinwalker@reddit
BMW is arguably as reliable as Toyota/Lexus. Reality is the RC is no longer competitive. Maybe ten years ago when you bought it, but today it’s relic that has been surpassed by better performing cars (with similar reliability).
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
I mean Lexus 100% agrees with you.
Penguinwalker@reddit
It's a beautiful car. It's a tough sell though. People buy enthusiast cars because of numbers (performance). I have to admit, I like cars like this. Well the interior. It's got buttons and analog gauges. Yeah it looks a bit dated but who cares? It's going to hold up well and its intuitive to use. Oh well. Sucks to lose an enthusiast car. Feel like it's a dying breed of cars.
wip30ut@reddit
+1... dad's buddy is now retired & isn't leasing a Porsche or BMW any longer because he puts on 5k miles a year at most. He's got an RC that's 7 yrs old & isn't costing him thousands in repair & maintenance. These specialty German techs absolutely rape your wallet because they think you can afford it.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
As a Cayman owner, I can attest that the Porsche tax is absolutely real. Meanwhile, $113 or whatever once per year at my local independent shop is all I’ve needed foe my RC over the last decade. And not a squeek or rattle to me heard from the cabin.
squidwardsdicksucker@reddit
Seems to be a recurring theme with a lot of Japanese premium performance products.
Either overpriced for what you get or more affordable but also half baked in comparison to German/American offerings.
schultzM@reddit
That and the Japanese struggle to make worthwhile upgrades
squidwardsdicksucker@reddit
Acura and Lexus are definitely a lot more conservative for sure. Their pedestrian counterparts seem to put more of an effort into their performance products.
WATTHEBALL@reddit
There's no reason for Acura to exist imo. They haven't found themselves since 2007. Even the new NSX was a snoozefest. Now they had the perfect opportunity with the Prelude coming back to reskin that into the RSX but they chose to make it into a derivative CUV...why?
ducky21@reddit
Because nobody is going to buy the Prelude, and even fewer people were going to buy a lux version of the Prelude.
The closest you were going to get to "what you want" is if the Integra based crossover was called the RSX instead of "ADX"
WATTHEBALL@reddit
I'm going to say the Prelude becomes a success. It's the most interesting car in the Honda lineup.
Cuv-ing all the things is absolutely not the answer. Acura already has too many that aren't that competitive to begin with.
007meow@reddit
Acura tried bringing back the Integra.
It wasn’t exactly a flaming hot success.
tylerderped@reddit
They put a damn CVT in it. They didn't try. Nobody wants a CVT in a performance car. They should've given it a dual-clutch.
God damn it looks good tho.
ScipioAfricanvs@reddit
An Integra is a performance car?
tylerderped@reddit
It's the Civic Si not a performance car? It ain't your average Civic...
I don't want a manual transmission in a daily driver.
ScipioAfricanvs@reddit
No, I don’t think it is. The Type R and Type S are performance cars that have much more different than a base manual Civic compared to the Si and obviously are actual track cars. Same way I don’t consider an S5, M340i, etc. to be performance cars but an RS5, M3, etc. are.
ducky21@reddit
The Si/Integra are functionally identical to base Civics. The only difference is fuel mapping, the LSD, and cosmetics.
ducky21@reddit
This would have cost more money because Honda doesn't have a DCT that fits the L series.
Would you have paid $38k for a base Integra with that bespoke DCT? When the perfectly adequate CVT is right there and paid for with Civic, Accord, CR-V, and Fit sales?
ducky21@reddit
While I would like that to be true, Honda's interesting cars like the Clarity, Civic coupe, CR-Z, the old Prelude, the old Integra, the Accord coupe, the S2000, all these cool, interesting cars died for a reason:
Nobody gives a shit. The mass market wants CUVs.
hi_im_bored13@reddit
Nit, the S2000 was a sales success, they sold 113k globally, it died due to the stock market crash alongside pretty much every reasonably priced fun coupe/roadster from every manufacturer japanese-or not.
ducky21@reddit
There are lots of contemporary stories of S2000s (especially as we got into AP2v2s) rotting on dealer lots, much like the Z is today. The S2000 was always excellent for what it was, but a lot of people had trouble spending Boxster/Z4 money on a Honda.
hi_im_bored13@reddit
Definitely, but that was really towards the end of the run once it was getting stale and market, and much like the NSX profitability didn't matter quite as much as it was a passion project.
I don't think it's in quite the same category as the CR-Z, Clarity, Accord/Civic coupe etc. where there was just barely any market demand on a mainstream, mass-market car.
(but the integra didn't die - it was just called the RSX here with the 4th gen, then a little gap til the ilx, then back to the integra)
WATTHEBALL@reddit
The older Prelude died because of the strong Yen not because there wasn't interest. It was very expensive comparatively for the time.
Most of those fun sports cars died because of the economic climate of the time not because of waning interest.
ducky21@reddit
The Prelude died because Honda's market research showed the Prelude's biggest competitor was the Integra. Honda wasn't competing with the Celica or the 200SX or any of the other manufacturer's spocos, they were competing with themselves.
As you said, you can get away with this with the bubble economy of Japan in the 90's, but even if there hadn't been the hard crash the Prelude would not have continued on.
WeedFiend365@reddit
You don’t understand. If Acura just got rid of all their SUVs and came out with a RWD coupe with no features a nice interior and manual transmission it would sell like hotcakes
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
There is also no reason for Infiniti to exist neither. However, we really don’t see how Honda and Nissan able to stay luxury segment if they really merger.
WATTHEBALL@reddit
Nissan having Infiniti is way better than having Acura.
Rework the Infiniti brand and drop Acura imo
MadUohh@reddit
Please elaborate. Because Acura sells way more than infinity and is probably a bigger household name than Infinity. Since 2020 Acura has been selling double the numbers compared to Infinity. To me that seems moronic to drop Acura for Infinity.
WATTHEBALL@reddit
Acura exists as a "technology" option to Honda. At least that was the case years ago. Lately, Honda's have been getting very premium and there's barely any differentiation between the two anymore.
Either they completely revamp Acura and potentially inject some excitement via Infiniti models or just axe Acura and Infiniti completely as they really serve no purpose anymore.
Acura used to be about having premium technology over Honda but now that isn't happening anymore, Acura only serves as an CUV brand for Honda. It doesn't need to exist, why not just port over the r/M/Z DX to Honda and call it a day?
The new NSX is a snoozefest, barely anyone talks about it, and the ITR only has the nameplate going for it, otherwise it's a carbon copy of the CTR.
Acura has no identity and hasn't had one since I'd argue 2007/8.
Infiniti's failures are much the same as Nissans - pure neglect and sticking to pricing that would make sense if Infiniti had desirable models. I'd argue that Infiniti has way more of identity than Acura has ever had in the last 20 years. They just neglected the brands and products.
After the merger, they should really decide which premium/luxury brand to keep and overhaul it. They both suck as stand alone brands at this time.
squidwardsdicksucker@reddit
Yeah I could see Acura going the way of Infiniti if they aren’t careful, but the MDX is a pretty good product and one of the only bang for your buck products in an otherwise pricey category and the Integra Type S is a unique enthusiast product.
007meow@reddit
For the same reason the Mach-E is a CUV. CUVs sell, and the branding helps boost awareness and recognition.
WATTHEBALL@reddit
They have the RDX and ZDX...what makes them think another derivative cuv will help?
007meow@reddit
Look at the RDX and MDX sales figures compared to their sedans.
That's why.
But beyond that, it's a homegrown EV - something they don't have in their lineup yet.
WATTHEBALL@reddit
Acura has only 1 sedan which most people by the Honda version of anyway. It's why excitement needs to be injected in the form of something "affordable". The Prelude would've been the perfect answer.
Instead - they fumbled their way into another crossover which is literally a cookie-cutter CUV when they already have several in their lineup.
The ZDX is around - they don't need a homegrown EV-CUV.
007meow@reddit
It's smaller than the ZDX. It's in a different size class.
That's like saying Lexus doesn't need the NX because they have the RX.
BMW has the X1, X2, X3, X4, X5, X6, X7, iX, and XM.
Acura has 3. Now 4, with the RSX.
Companies have tons of different sizes of CUVs because they sell. That's what people are buying.
Acura is a CUV brand. They try with their sedans, but that's not what people are buying.
Are you upset that they made another CUV, or that they called it an RSX?
WATTHEBALL@reddit
I'm not upset. It's definitely more of an "eyeroll" feeling. CUV-ing all the things isn't the answer anymore than Sedan-ing all the things. A healthy mix of different types of cars is what an automaker should offer.
The nameswapping is pretty annoying because why not just call it something else? I think the whole Mustang EV approach is very tacky and in bad taste.
Acura has been lost as a brand since 2007. They simply cannot identify who they are and what they want to be. They keep flip flopping and it's just hurting their image...or what's left of it.
xkmackx@reddit
Worthwhile upgrades? Lol
This sub is so detached from reality. Lexus just broke sales records. They're clearly doing something right.
https://lexusenthusiast.com/2025/01/03/lexus-reports-best-ever-sales-in-35-year-history/
Lancer876@reddit
Ok that is using really broad strokes, not to mention the RCs are more gt cars than performance machines.
Civic type r, supra, and the GT-R all offer great performance.
superchibisan2@reddit
Buy way more reliability
squidwardsdicksucker@reddit
Not so sure that’s even that true nowadays, BMW and Audi have 90% of the same reliability for a more modern and dynamically better product most of the time, and given that most people lease premium cars, the reliability doesn’t matter so much.
I see very little reason for getting the Lexus or Acura from an objective point of view over the German product unless you’re going the used route or keep your cars for more than 160k km and don’t do your own maintenance.
tylerderped@reddit
mAh JaPaNeSe ReLiAbIlItY
LoOk HoW lItTlE iT dEpReCiAtEs
It'S sO cHeAp To MaInTaIn!
sohcgt96@reddit
The irony being, they've also got pretty good resale value, so even trying to buy a used one is expensive.
GrynaiTaip@reddit
Are you taking it to the track? Is your goal to win against other stock mass-produced cars?
I think that choosing one car over the other because it has three more horses or accelerates a tenth of a second faster is a bit silly.
F1_Geek@reddit
The RC F was on par with the S550 so I don't think the S650 will fare THAT much better.
R_V_Z@reddit
I don't get the "outdated" complaints on cars. Everybody is always complaining about the new design trends on vehicles so you'd think they'd be fine with a car that hasn't updated to adopt those features.
hutacars@reddit
They want a price to match, and the RC doesn’t offer that.
NCSUGrad2012@reddit
My friends got a 2014 IS when it first came out. This car has basically the same interior in 2025. Lexus really didn't ever update it.
squidwardsdicksucker@reddit
For the people who do like Lexus products that is usually one of their selling points from what I see on their forums.
bikedork5000@reddit
Liking stability and elegance in design is one thing. But NOBODY likes an infotainment unit that feels like a standalone Garmin GPS from 2008.
aprtur@reddit
The current car has Android Auto and CarPlay, so aside from the fact that it has a redundant touchpad in addition to the touch screen, I can't see anything that would set it terribly apart from other ones on the market currently. If anything, in my opinion, the extra controls that give you a choice are a plus...but that's just me.
mrob2@reddit
I don’t think it feels that way at all. I think it’s a lot more elegant than iDrive 8 onwards
NCSUGrad2012@reddit
I think that's the reflective of people online but not the majority of the car buying market.
xkmackx@reddit
They didn't break sales records by just selling to redditors.
https://lexusenthusiast.com/2025/01/03/lexus-reports-best-ever-sales-in-35-year-history/
NCSUGrad2012@reddit
Did you read the link you posted about which models are the best selling ones? It has nothing to do with the RC or IS with the outdated interiors, in fact that link backs up what I said, most people want something with a more modern looking interior
dookie__cookie@reddit
The average car on the road today was made in 2013. More people are driving older interiors.
uberdosage@reddit
I still like the IS interior.... it has aged well compared to other cars from that era.
KimJendeukie@reddit
There's really nothing wrong with the interior minus the stupid track pad
The LFA cluster should be used on every F car, it's that good
yellowcroc14@reddit
Beautiful car, great daily, but hardly a sports car contrary to a lot of peoples belief
yeahnahyeahnahyeahye@reddit
Yeah, the ISF is a better sports car in every way than the RCF and the ISF is barely a sports car, closer to a muscle sedan.
squidwardsdicksucker@reddit
Are the transmissions lackluster and/or they too heavy, or is it a suspension tuning thing? Ik that Lexus tends to be a couple years behind Euro brands in terms of tech but it’s interesting that a RWD coupe w a nat aspirated V6/V8 would be a snoozer to drive.
D00dyHead@reddit
It's got a couple of things against it really. The transmission is far from aggressive or quick to be sporty and it way too heavy. I do still love driving it. Still has enough power to have fun with but anyone who would say it's similar to a 4 series or something would be lying to themselves.
squidwardsdicksucker@reddit
Sounds like it serves more as a nice commuter vehicle that looks more aggressive and sporting than it actually is.
D00dyHead@reddit
Yeah it definitely fits the bill as a touring car. I could spend all day driving in it and be comfortable.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Fellow ‘15 RC owner here. The thing is built like a tank, and yes there is a performance penalty for that. Even 10 years in, not a single squeek, rattle, or any other noise inside the cabin.
I understand why people in this sub are flogging, it though. It has far less to do with the car in and of itself; rather, it has to do with their expectations: they think it is a sports car. It is not, and that’s on the Lexus marketing department. My Cayman is a sports car, and I went in very clear eyed that the RC was not — and cannot be happier with the decision.
eyi526@reddit
The chassis isn't the most agile (basically a frankenstein chassis based off various Lexus models), transmission is OK but not much competition to a ZF8, and yea it's heavy - especially compared to the competition. You can definitely do some reckless driving, but you'd have to really wring out that engine to do so. I view it as a GT car that can be a bit manic/feral at times.
yellowcroc14@reddit
My buddy’s got an rcf, and an old coworker had an rc 350. The rcf’s motor and transmission is pretty great imo, but the 350 only gets a v6, both cars are very heavy and the suspension is lacking.
Great GT car though, for mpg reasons I’d daily one if my commute to work was 30 minutes each way max
squidwardsdicksucker@reddit
Yeah that’s what I figured if it’s not a super sporty car despite its specs. Lexus seems to be the brand if you want a comfortable commuter vehicle.
mystic_skittles@reddit
The transmission is outdated, looong delay on the paddle shifters etc.
Gorgenapper@reddit
The manual paddle shifts on the RC (and on my IS) are slow while driving at normal street speeds. However, they speed up dramatically when you're flooring the gas pedal and going for it and shift anywhere above 5k rpm.
If I'm flooring the gas and shift around 5.5k ~ 6.8k redline, the shift speeds are near instant 1 - 2, and under half a second for 2 - 3 and 3 - 4. But when I come back down to normal speeds, then the paddles are mostly useless and I switch back to D auto mode.
Ghost1k25@reddit
It’s outdated, but there is very little delay in manual mode. In sport plus it locks the torque converter. My wife has a PDK Macan S and although it’s better at downshifting, it doesn’t feel like a big difference. Without paddles and especially in normal mode it’s very lazy.
DH64@reddit
Nobody gonna mention the username?
F1_Geek@reddit
I remember when many years ago people would call the RC an ugly car. How the times have changed.
SireEvalish@reddit
Underperforming, overpriced, and boring to drive. Anyone who bought one new got scammed.
LegendLexus@reddit
Phenomenal car. Buth the V6 and V8 iterations are fun to drive. I wish I could get one of these before going extinct.
spas2k@reddit
Looks good. Drives Poorly.
V8 was cool. V6 was antiquated and underpowered. Chassis decent. Suspension Ok.
Transmission - Terrible and the true downfall of this car.
Tech is what you expect a 11 year old car to be.
SirLoremIpsum@reddit
It is just utterly hilarious to hear people say that about the V6.
All the "I hate new things" Tacoma/J250/4Runner subs are "bring back the V6" on the new models
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Everyone the big man until their V-8 biturbo platic trash grenades itself. NA V6 will take you to the moon and back, and just be getting broken in.
SirLoremIpsum@reddit
I am sure I can find plenty of examples of unreliable naturally aspirated engines and plenty of examples of reliable turbo motors.
Let's grab a 1VD-FTV, TWIN turbos and SUPER reliable. 3VZ - not the most unreliable motor in the world, but it's certainly got it's share of issues and one of Toyota's worst.
1HD-FTE will take you to the moon and back, tolerate twice the boost. Yay turbo motors! Turbo motors for all!
maximums_aurelius "i'd rather a 2JZ-GE on my Toyota Supra. The turbo makes me feel queasy when I go too fast"
Let's get a 5.4L Ford 3 valve Triton engine eh... it's naturally aspirated and V8 so it must be reliable yeah?
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
I’m not talking about any NA V6, though. I am talking about the 2GR-FSE in the Lexus RC (mine, more specifically). You know, the engine (one of them) that is in the car that is the topic of discussion of this thread.
You can pull irrelevant examples out of your ass all day, but tey to stay on topic.
See now you are just being a prick. Bye!
Posraman@reddit
I have an IS 500 and although the transmission is slow to shift, it's still a great daily and GT car
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
I disagree on all counts. I’ve probably spent less on maintenance (non beyond routine) in the last 10 years than you’ll spend on your BMW the first year it comes out of warranty (many just sell at that point to get ahead of the looking bills.)
The NA V6 is obviously not as exciting as some biturbo whatever, but again, let’s trade notes on maintence after 10 years. The engine is bulletproof.
The transmission is more than adequate. Sure it isnt a PDK or DSG or whatever, but again, this is a luxury GT car, not a sports car. And I also have a Cayman in the garage so I know very well what sharp handling and performance looks like. The RC is great in traffic and normal driving, and can pull like a mule overtaking on the freeway (again, as a good GT car should).
The tech is fine — I control everything with physical Buttons and knobs (a setup most people are clamoring for these daya) and am not looking for the inside of my car to be a multicolored LED disco like my friends’ BMWs look like.
In short, it is a reliable, well made and bulletproof GT car that will be going strong long after your M3 hits the buy-now-pay-now lot.
spas2k@reddit
You are more than free to disagree, after all these are just opinions but personally I owned an Is350 and I couldn't wait to get rid of it. It was fine for commuting but a horrible "sports sedan". Very boring and completely uninspiring to drive. I hated the tall gearing and it's lethargic acceleration off the line. It was obviously tuned for reliability but that isn't a priority for me. The cars I replaced it with, an Audi S3 and S5 were night and day better in every aspect. Both were tuned and were never in the shop. Both handled better. Both were a LOT faster. Both felt way more premium. I'm not even going to compare it to the M3.
In short, life is too short to drive boring AF cars like the IS/RC 350. YMMV
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
If I wanted an exhilarating sports car, the RC ain't it. I’ll concede that (and that is what the Cayman is for). But that is not the same as saying the RC is boring (it isnt). I’ve not driven an IS, but the IS is not a GT car (as the RC is) but instead a compact executive sedan, so I am not sure that your feelings towards it really have any relevance to the RC driving experience.
If you get an RC (or IS) thinking it is a sports car, you are going to have a bad time. If you trash the RC because it isnt an M3 (or S3 or S5) disappointment due to faulty expectations.
And as you say, these are all simply opinions based on our own expectations. Different people value different things, and in my particular case I wanted a reliable car that was good at doing GT car things, nit sports car things, and I am quite happy with my decision. But it irks me when people want to compare apples and oranges (particularly those who have never driven one or mistakenly think it is supposed to be a sports car).
We can agree to disagree. Cheers!
F1_Geek@reddit
Transmission is perfectly fine when the car is pushed at full-bore. The terrible transmission comments is getting exhausting. It's no dual-clutch but it was fine as an automatic.
spas2k@reddit
No it isn't. I owned a 350. It was the #1 reason I got rid of it.
Gearing way too tall. Accelerated off the line like oatmeal. Think prius levels of acceleration. Downshifts lurched. This is fine for a 1990 camry, but any "performance" car absolutely cannot have a transmission that doesn't want to downshift. Downshift 2 gears? lol
Go drive anything with a ZF 8 speed and compare. There is no comparison.
F1_Geek@reddit
I was talking about the F, not the 350. This article is about the F.
First, the 350's transmission wasn't ideal because the 350 is considerably more gutless than the F. The F's transmission is fine as it has way more power and torque filled between the gears. Also, the transmissions are different between the 350 and the F.
Second, I thought you were talking about shift times, not the gear ratios. The shift times are fine, but the gear ratios aren't ideal, even on the F (but it is an order of magnitude better than the 350).
clownpirate@reddit
When the RC (specifically the F?) was announced, Akio Toyoda was quoted as saying it was specifically designed for driving enthusiasts and that we were in for a treat.
But then the next gen M3/4 and C63 quickly followed and basically relegated the RC-F to second fiddle.
mr_duong567@reddit
The RC-F was already playing second fiddle to the F82 M4 when they both released in 2015.
clownpirate@reddit
Wasn’t the M4 released after the RC-f?
mr_duong567@reddit
Both the RC F and F8X M3/M4 were released in late 2014 for the 2015MY.
They ultimately had the same development cycle but the RC-F still debuted as a much worse performing product. Even the IS-F after all the revisions were finally competitive with the outgoing E9x M3 so it made no sense as to why Lexus dropped the ball so hard.
Even crazier, the entire industry had known rumors BMW was ditching the V8 (see Cadillac ATS-V’s development) and Toyota’s leadership pre-Akio still doubled down on the RC-F’s shortcomings in development, as performance wasn’t their priority.
Fortenio@reddit
Not sure if I have even seen one in person. TBH I'm surprised to find they were still manufactured. Beautiful car. Not as good of a sports car as ///M alternative but a good daily driver for those who want decent performance and style.
JediKnightaa@reddit
Not surprising. We're literally getting a new Lexus model just around the corner
Kentx51@reddit
11 years already wtf
InternationalPut4093@reddit
Still rocking the CD player... that's how old it is.
xkmackx@reddit
Japanese people still love CDs.
https://www.trap.la/blog/trapxla2022-japans-love-for-cds-still-strong-after-40-years
It's painful having to explain to people that Lexus is a Japanese company lol
aprtur@reddit
Had an incredible time visiting multiple Tower Records locations around Tokyo in November - complete with listening stations, it felt so great to browse music like that again.
NCSUGrad2012@reddit
Lexus was the last automaker with a tape player so it makes sense they're doing the same with a CD player, lol
w0nderbrad@reddit
Damn let me see if I still have my FM modulator to play my songs at the worst quality possible while random radio broadcast cuts in every now and then… fucking early 2000s problems
Thomas_633_Mk2@reddit
They still exist, just in Bluetooth form. Considering the quality of Spotify and car speakers and the relative lack of insulation in a 20 year old car, they're honestly fine. Not a modern car play system or anything, but a cradle + Bluetooth transmitter is about $15 AUD and does the job like 60% as well as a new head unit that costs over 500.
NCSUGrad2012@reddit
My boyfriend still has one for his 2009 Corolla, lol
w0nderbrad@reddit
lol does he run it off an old school iPod or what?
NCSUGrad2012@reddit
No, it has Bluetooth to connect to his phone and plugs into the cigarette outlet.
BasslineFreshDetail@reddit
And I love them for that!
I need good quality sound, that doesn't rely on BT or Data
InternationalPut4093@reddit
Digital has been the better quality for decades.
narwhal_breeder@reddit
Im surprised it lasted as long as it did. IMO it was dead on arrival.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
It will still walk your 86 without missing a beat.
narwhal_breeder@reddit
Oh no doubt. I didn't buy this car to go fast. I would have kept my S550 GT, or my 4C, or my Z06 if it was important to me.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
How was the 4C? A guy in my town has one and I literally look down into his cabin, even from the low seating position of the Cayman. Its incredibly small, only other thing i have seen comparable IRL is a Lotus Elan or whatever they are calling it now.
narwhal_breeder@reddit
I mean, they are pretty much bang on in power to weight and the quarter:
RC350 F Sport RWD: 14.2 s @ 101 mph
GR86: 14.0 s @ 101 mph
RC350 F Sport RWD: 3,891 lbs / 311hp = \~12.5lbs/hp
GR86: 2,868 lbs / 228hp = \~12.5lbs/hp
So pretty much identical in oomph.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Yep I saw that the original 86 was about 1/2 sec slower than the RC 350 in 0-60 times (mid 5s for RC, low 6s for the 86) but the 86 has cut that time to about even in the later models (while of course the RC’s hasn’t really changed at all).
narwhal_breeder@reddit
Did a full writeup on the 4C here: https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/y1ojf2/one_year_with_the_terrible_and_wonderful_alfa/
Why I sold it: It doesnt matter how good in the canyons a car is if you dislocate your spine every time you hit an expansion joint.
Compared to a Cayman they are incredibly loud, harsh riding, and unrefined. Still pretty fucking fun though.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
nice writeup, quite funny.
LOL, I guess you shouldn't have gone with the straight pipes and track suspension if that is what you were after. (I am sure it was not and if you are going to get a 4C, you may as well go all out, which you did.)
This is kind of how I feel about how folks are disparaging the RC in this thread. It is not a sports car. Period. If you want a sports car, get one, but don’t be disappointed when your Macan (or RC) ain’t it.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Thanks, I’ll have a look.
Thomas_633_Mk2@reddit
Mfw the car with a V6, more power and costing twice as much is faster
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Yet it is DOA? 11 year run, DOA. lol
narwhal_breeder@reddit
Yeah the auto really helps it from a dig, but they are about neck in neck in the quarter, less than a tenth of a pound per hp off in power/weight ratio as well.
dopil919@reddit
They look great on the outside. But the interior is such a buzzkill. Super outdated interior
dontbeslo@reddit
They were outdated, overpriced, and overweight at release. The only redeeming quality was the V8!available in the RCF but it wasn’t enough to overcome the Frankenstein platform.
macgirthy@reddit
My brother has an RCF, I really do not understand the hype and why they havent dropped in price. There are so many better options with better performance. We raced from a dig with him getting the jump and im slowly walking by 110mph, I'm in a stock m2 comp.
For the price of an RCF I'd rather have a GT350 or ZL1 or M3 or M4 or c7 z06. So many better options. The lexus only has better reliability but even that can be questionable if you are tracking the car. Which of all the vehicles mentioned will be the worse performing, lugging around 3900lbs, not including driver.
Zarrex@reddit
It's a shame because the I think the Lexus cars are so cool, as someone who loves the more uncommon stuff. There's lots of better options, and because of that you see them everywhere. Seeing an F car always makes me happy and excited because they're just so rare, which is part of the appeal of the ISF to me, I almost never see another
macgirthy@reddit
Its insane to me how the ISF is quicker on the track than an RCF is. You hear excuses that the RCF is a GT car. Well an older sedan with less power is able to run quicker lap times. I wonder if the IS500 on equal tires can lap quicker than an RCF Track edition, if so that would be embarrassing.
Zarrex@reddit
As much as I love Lexus, the RCF track edition is such a miss lol. Insanely expensive for basically nothing maginal over a regular RCF except an exhaust, different wheels, and ugly wing and a couple hp
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
None of the other options you named are GT cars. Apples and oranges.
Life_Menu_4094@reddit
I think they'd have done better to go after the A4 Cab / Saab 900 demographic, which currently is served by the Buick Cascada and nothing else. They were going to be low volume cars in any case.
aguacatesucks@reddit
Ugly car. Looks like an Accord coupe with Botox gone wrong.
CrimsonFlam3s@reddit
Probably a bit biased since I own one but good car that was too overpriced and it took too long(until 2023) for Lexus to update the infotainment system to something decent/good. I would buy it again if given the choice as long as you find it for a good used price. 0.3 secs slower 0-60 than the turbo charged competition (with an equal or faster 5-60) doesn't matter as much as hearing a nice v8.
Backseats bigger than most competitors except the C63 and M2 and great sounding engine, transmission is no ZF8 but it's pretty decent in manual mode.
If Lexus had dropped the price point by $10k like the IS500 and done updates sooner, it could have done better.
Goldpanda94@reddit
I looked into an RC350 before I got my ND2 RF. The infotainment being super outdated, the weight, and it not handing as good as the Miata on curvy roads killed it for me, but it's a decent looking coupe! Wish it had gotten one more facelift like the IS
MigratingSwallow@reddit
I actually love the looks of the RCF Track but that price point of $100k + gave me such heartburn.
KpopMarxist@reddit (OP)
I'm very salty that this happened before I ever had a chance to get one. If only lexus had waited a couple more years for me to graduate college and be settled in a good paying job :(
that_bermudian@reddit
To each their own, but these cars didn’t sell well for a reason compared to the IS.
They’re absolutely gorgeous, but I had a buddy who owned one of the special editions from 2017 and his biggest complaint was that the RC couldn’t put its power to the road that effectively because of its outdated transmission.
If you’re buying for looks, comfort, reliability, and longevity, then by all means get this car as soon as possible.
If you’re also hoping for a bit of power/driving dynamics, you may be disappointed.
Benjammin172@reddit
They just drive like boats IMO. The ISF and GSF feel sharp at the front end and the RCF doesn’t. It feels significantly heavier than either of the other two despite having two fewer doors.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
You driven one?
Benjammin172@reddit
Yes. Own an ISF, and have test driven both an RCF and GSF multiple times as I look for something to potentially replace it. RCF drives like a land yacht, and the GSF drives superbly. The latter will definitely be my ISF replacement if I end up deciding that I need something a bit bigger than what I have.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
Anything beyond a test drive? Sales guy let you dump it or just putter around for 15 mins?
Benjammin172@reddit
Around an hour of seat time for each. I didn't really launch it at all the way that I might if it was my car, but yes, the sales guy encouraged pushing it a bit. In my limited experience, the GSF is sharp on the initial turn in and goes where you ask and expect it to. The RCF feels sluggish to respond and lumbers around corners. It feels like a significantly heavier car than the GSF even though it isn't.
throwawayrepost02468@reddit
It's because the RC is an amalgamation of 3 different platforms, including the midsection of the previous gen IS convertible.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
RC is not meant for burnouts. Your friend should have purchased a Camaro or Mustang. They have great transmissions for converting engine power into rubber-smelling smoke.
Internal-Comment-533@reddit
This is what killed the F series overall - the automatic sucked 10 years ago, it’s unacceptable that it’s still in their flagship models today. Even the new IS500 has a similarly shitty automatic. The only decent one from what I understand is in the LC500.
Lexus is constantly the “too little too late brand” being carried by Toyota hype. It’s sad because they could legitimately be market leaders if they actually tried.
throwawayrepost02468@reddit
Even the one in the LC is too slow for a car of that caliber IMO.
Stu__Pidasso@reddit
The RCF wasn't even breaking 1k sold per year. Of course it was going to be axed
Syko_okyS@reddit
It's amazing it took them this long, I haven't seen an RCF on the road in years, plenty of RC350s though.
TroyFerris13@reddit
Yea pretty much every comparable vehicle is better than the RCF
ob_knoxious@reddit
Good news, you can get one used and let someone else eat the depreciation.
5RiversWLO@reddit
There are only 5 on sale in the entire country (Canada) on autotrader. I noticed people are holding onto them after news about the C63 going to a i4, manufacturers removing V8s from their cars, and Lexus removing V8s from their new SUVs over the past few years.
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
As you said, there was a terrific opportunity tight before COVID to snatch up one of these amazing cars. I got my 2015 in March 2020 (you can do the COVID math on that date) for $34k out the door, with only 9k miles on the clock. Although the car is now 10 years old, I’ve yet to experience a single issue with it. Probably one of the best auto purchases I have made, and that feeling grows with each passing year.
They are built like tanks, and yes that means a hit to performance. But for everyday driving it’s a non-issue; the other contenders in its bracket all get easily walked by a Model Y or 3 Tesla. To say nothing of the superior build quality and lack of overengineered plastic crap on offer from BMW and others these days.
ob_knoxious@reddit
I don't really know the Canadian market that well. In the US they are uncommon but definitely attainable.
Lexus in general doesn't have the same depreciation as some of its competitors and people do want to hold onto these, but you can definitely find this car for under 50 stateside.
uberdosage@reddit
Yep. I was looking at RCF's. Right before Covid a 2015 RCF was 40k. Now a 2015 RCF is.... still 40k.
Professional-Form275@reddit
Speaking from experience with that beautiful Giulia I'm sure ;)
ob_knoxious@reddit
The first owner ate half the value of the car in depreciation, and I'm well on my way to eating the second half.
Funny_Frame1140@reddit
Tbf not much has been changed with it. It hasn't seen many changes throughout its life cycle so you can still get one used a be fine
withsexyresults@reddit
Don’t worry LC will still be there when you retire
tablecontrol@reddit
my biggest gripe is that Lexus really never made significant improvements to the V8 engine. it produces the same HP as nearly 10 yrs ago
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
And still as bulletproof as it was 10 years ago. The horsepower wars are not everything.
fldsmdfrv2@reddit
This car was well ahead of its time........ in weight that is. Lazy shifting trans and porky weight killed this otherwise nice touring coupe.
elardmm@reddit
That means that the gt3 race cars may disappear soon! Nooooooo.
moonRekt@reddit
Best looking car but yea if you’re looking for performance BMW wins in that value but then again the Lexus fits the bill for Toyota loyalists who are intimidated by German cars.
I thought they were coming out with a 600HP 4 cylinder coupe? Is that what this is about, more the death of the V8?
Maximus_Aurelius@reddit
We aren’t intimidated by the cars, we are intimated by their massive depreciation and maintenance costs and over-enginnered (yet shoddy) craftsmanship. And their deteriorating design choices.
I own a German car that exceeds BMW in every respect, so it doesnt have to be that way.
Zarrex@reddit
Sad to see it go but makes sense, it's old and hasnt had any meaningful upgrades. Always thought it looked sick from the rear but seeing it from the front or side, it think it's too bloated. Interested to see what Lexus does next because I really love their designs, I would love to own an LC someday even if it only feels as fast as my ISF
Weak_Succotash_5470@reddit
But I was planning on buying a new one in 20 years
WrongdoerSoggy4422@reddit
The problem with the rcf is that its ancient. It was never all that amazing to begin with (i had one for three years) but it grew just so dated. The looks are dated, the interior is dated, the v8 that was once competitive over stuff like the mustang is no longer competitive, especially at its listed price. The IS500 has the same problem.
F1_Geek@reddit
The IS500 FSP is cheaper though. They should have called it the RC500 FSP after a few years.
WrongdoerSoggy4422@reddit
Thats true. And for the super sedan class, the is500 is cheap. In the sport coupe/car class the rcf was pretty uncompetitive.
F1_Geek@reddit
Yeah the RC F wasn't ideal from the jump. It will be a fun used car though.
WrongdoerSoggy4422@reddit
I had one, it honestly wasnt all that fun at all. Among my worst cars in that department. Was a decent cruiser commuter type car though.
F1_Geek@reddit
Fair enough, and to each their own, but when these things get cheap I highly expect people will do some crazy stuff with them.
F1_Geek@reddit
Here's hoping Lexus has the guts to build a second generation RC. It would be sad if they didn't.
AvroVulcanXM594@reddit
I guess they'll replace both with the LFR.
F1_Geek@reddit
The LFA/LFR is the replacement to the... LFA...
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
LFR is supposed to be more expensive than it, it isn’t its replacement.
MechECSComeback@reddit
I rarely see them in the wild.. I've seen more G8x M cars, more Ferraris, more 911 Turbos even.
burrgerwolf@reddit
Wow I didn’t even know they still were making these. Pretty sure I’ve seen more 400Zs than RC Fs.
FWD_to_twin_turbo@reddit
It's wildly the opposite in the Texas/Louisiana area. I see quite a few of the Lexus coupes (LC, RC, RCF), and i've only seen a single Z since they came out.
I'd lay an egg if i ever see a IS500 F sport though.....
I will say i find it wild that i've seen more F8s, 720s and Huracans than any of the above cars.
trivletrav@reddit
There are a few IS500s around here (DC) and I salivate every time. They are soooo nice
mrob2@reddit
It always makes me laugh when I see people say they’re super nice lol. It’s the same niceness as a normal IS. Same interior and barely any exterior difference. Ours just sounds better and scoots a little quicker lol
trivletrav@reddit
Opposite for me, never seen a new Z. Pretty sure they are a myth lol
TheProwlerMech@reddit
I heard rumors that there was one sitting at the local dealership hiding behind rows of Pathfinders and Altimas. Everyone who enters only reappears with an Altima lease deal and a 500 credit score. If you try to ask if they saw the mythical Z, they use their newly acquired powers to run red lights and weave through traffic at 20 over!... I've seen a few RC-F so I know those are real lol
uberdosage@reddit
Weird that even in the Bay Area you can get like 8k off a brand new Z for a manual Performance trim. It just seems that no one wants them. Even the Nismo models are discounted
At that price though it starts to get tempting...hmmmm
TheProwlerMech@reddit
I want one, but like you said, it only gets tempting with a markdown. I'll give it a year before I choose one of the other 20 cars I have in mind!
trivletrav@reddit
I see RCs all the time. Great car, sure it’s expensive but you get that with Lexus. The SC was expensive for what it was back in the day too. The Z however… it’s just a theory. Just a whisper of an idea. Dangerous, and if it were real, a hell of a car. It’s too bad it only exists now in legends…
bigred83@reddit
I work next to a Nissan dealer. Finally saw one a week or two ago.
yellowcroc14@reddit
Saw a boatload of them in the Bay Area when I was living there
lovsicfrs@reddit
Crazy. I’m in San Francisco and I’ve seen:
I too believe they are a myth
bozoconnors@reddit
Seriously! I think I caught the ass end of one once? They're like the sasquatch of the car world.
Turbo_911@reddit
Same, I've never seen one on the road yet, ever. The only place I've seen them is the auto compound next to my work where they sit for months... Every trim, Nismo editions et al. Now being snowed on 😅
mortalomena@reddit
I have seen more Lambos than RCs.
Fantastic_Pack_703@reddit
It has been ten years or more,there hasnt been any renovation of its interiors, however the prices are renewed.
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
Now, luxury coupe only Mercedes and BMW still playing, as we’ve already lost ATS Coupe, real Audi A5, Q60, and now RC.
Feel like CLE not continuing more years and without any replacement, and BMW may decrease their coupe model to one in future. The segment is clearly following same regular coupe fate, it’s a dying class.
testthrowawayzz@reddit
They really couldn't get TNGA-L work for smaller cars like the what they did with the old N/New N platforms, eh?
Atreyu1002@reddit
I wonder if it will age as well as the LFA.
duppymkr@reddit
Thank god, those things look crazy..
tablecontrol@reddit
9! different trim levels for 1 model.
crazy
Drzhivago138@reddit
At one time the F-150 had 10.
JarifSA@reddit
I get killing the F but the RCs as well?
animealt46@reddit
TBH F might be the only reason it was kept alive.
Stu__Pidasso@reddit
SUVs dominate the market. What's left of it, sedans are going to sell much more than coupes because most people like the convenience of 4 doors. The RC has been on a steady decline for years now, with only 1500 sold this past year
For the price of a base RC, you can get a mustang GT. Easy decision for most people.
JarifSA@reddit
Yeah I get that there's no market but that was their only coupe while their competitors still offer a couple options. BMW offers the 2, 4, and 8 series meanwhile Lexus is killing their only coupe.
Stu__Pidasso@reddit
For sales figures for Lexus, 4 of the top 5 were SUVs. The only non-SUV was the ES, which is their Camry equivalent.
Let's be honest, when you think Lexus, you're thinking of the Beige sedan/SUV that Grandma drives to church, not a "sporty" coupe
JarifSA@reddit
Yeah the RC was never a standout especially since they all look the same anyways.
nondescriptzombie@reddit
People like whatever marketing blows up their ass.
My neighbor NEEDS his quad cab Dodge RAM DIESEL CUMMINS 4x4 to commute 30 miles back and forth to work every day. He PREFERS it.
ActualCounterculture@reddit
Their new car is on the way
ShadyDrunks@reddit
I hope they go turbo or supercharged for the next fun car. Nobody wants to pay the same money as an M for something you can’t really modify to make more power out of. Plus for its HP and TQ numbers the car was slow compared to its competition
5rolled_tacos@reddit
Demand just skyrocketed 😆
DavidAg02@reddit
I test drove one in 2024 while I was new car shopping... WWWAAAAYYYYY over priced.
markyymark13@reddit
I know everyones wrapped up in performance figures compared to the German equivalents but man I want an RCF so bad. I'll take the high revving, reliable Japanese V8 wrapped up in a really cool looking coupe any day of the week. These hold their value well in the used market but I hope one day to be able to afford one and drive it into the ground.
damaged_unicycles@reddit
I owned a '13 ISF for a long while and was a huge fan, but never really liked the RC appearance. Would way rather get the IS500 over the RCF
ParappaTheWrapperr@reddit
Wait that’s like their only cars worth buying
narwhal_breeder@reddit
the IS500 is more appealing along pretty much every axis. The RC-F is heavier than the IS500.
ParappaTheWrapperr@reddit
But the is500 doesn’t look as cool though
RhymeGrime@reddit
Most people comparing BMW and Ford to Lexus never have driven a higher end Lexus. They feel much more GT than the others and have a high quality feel. BMW is obviously high quality but it doesn't feel as buttery as a Lexus, but they do feel sporty and exciting. And Ford well I don't need to say much about their quality.
HamsterCapable4118@reddit
I wouldn’t be surprised if Lexus kills off the entire RWD lineup entirely by 2027.
They’re throwing away so much brand equity, and cutting off the upgrade path for folks who want to move up from their first entry level Lexus.
Chi-Guy86@reddit
Great looking car, but a poor value if bought new and way behind the competition in both performance and tech.
NCSUGrad2012@reddit
Yeah, they never updated it in 11 years outside of small changes.
bwoah_gimmethedrink@reddit
I love the LC, but RC looks hideous. Like a very heavy bloated car, definitely not like an elegant tourer or a sports car.
jdmb0y@reddit
Bloated is a good word to describe it.
Bld556@reddit
A dated relic with minimal updates that should've been put out to pasture a long time ago.
P_K997@reddit
Sad to see but expected. My daily is an RC350. I got it used for a great price but probably wouldn't buy one new considering the other options in that price bracket.
It's absolutely gorgeous and very comfortable to drive but the handling is pretty far from sporty. I think the biggest problems are the heavy weight and the bouncy suspension. Steering is actually pretty sharp with good feedback and it makes enough power for a daily. I am hoping a set of lightweight wheels and coilovers will improve it a bit, but I'm not trying to turn it into a sports car.
Overall a good concept for a car but a bit poorly executed. Still the RC will be missed. 🫡
ZaheerAlGhul@reddit
It was up there as one of there best looking designs of all time. RIP Lexus RC
XSC@reddit
These cars are so fucking cool but driving wise they fall flat. Wish they would had let GR take them over.
Rabo_McDongleberry@reddit
I guess I'm but surprised. I've seen more McLarens on the road than RCs. But the regular IS? All day every day.
AnnoyingRingtone@reddit
Is this the one where they made the air compressing lighter air-conditioning weighter less?
DocPhilMcGraw@reddit
I am surprised this wasn’t announced last year. In 2023, Lexus actually sold more LCs than RCs (fun fact by about 10 units) which should’ve been the nail in the coffin then.
In my opinion, the RC tried to straddle this line between sports car and grand tourer while not being necessarily great at either.