RTX 5070 vs RTX 4070 Super
Posted by Mandleaf@reddit | buildapc | View on Reddit | 54 comments
I got my new PC, a 1k build without a GPU, and about 600£ reserved for that purpose. I know I want to go for an Nvidia, but I am currently utilising my old GPU, a 1660 Super OC from Gigabyte (triple fan)—if that matters.
Honestly, it is a good card, and I don't need an update that badly; I still think that 1660 was one of the best Nvidia products for the price back then. But it is what it is; I am not here to discuss whether Nvidia is good or bad.
I bought a new PC without a card because of the upcoming 50xx series. I would appreciate your help or advice on whether 5070 (I know it is not out yet) is worth buying over 4070 Super. Please keep this in mind:
I do not care about 'fake' AI frames, DLSS, etc. I only care that games be playable on a 4k monitor (I know the xx70 series isn't the best, but I am out of my budget for xx80). I don't mind fake frames; for me, the end customer, all that matters is the experience, not some principle. If it looks good, I am fine. And also I don't want old cards, I will not buy 30xx or 20xx series, this build is intended for the next 7 years, so 40xx is the min I can go for.
Ideally, the new pricing for 5070 is perfect for me. 550£ sounds excellent, but as I said, I have a 600£ budget, so I will not exceed it. And I will probably go for an FE edition; if not, some white shroud. As I have white build.
Some additional things:
- - My PSU is 1200W ATX 3.1
- - My MOBO can support up to Pci-e 4.0 gen cards (yeah, I know I messed up with this one ;<)
- - CPU is AMD's 5' 9th gen series
Oh, I am not sure if I mentioned this, but I will not buy used cards, only new ones. And if you're reading this after the 50xx cards are out, please give me your opinion; it may not be too late, you can help others.
swezubben@reddit
People are talking shit about 12gb on 4k. That is not a problem, i have been playing games in 4k with my 2080super (8gb) for years and was still doing it 1 week ago when it finally gave up on me.
Mydomainuserone@reddit
4070 super is in stock now for msrp. good luck finding a 5070 on release for less than 800
lane5555@reddit
I have a 4070 super. I mainly run it at 2560 x 1080 (21:9 ultrawide at 100hz).
It is, of course, more than powerful enough for that monitor. I also have it hooked up to my TV most of the time, 3840 x 2160 (16:9 55" at 60hz native and 120hz with frame generation), which is mostly used for media content at 60hz, but I've used it to test the 4K ability of the 4070 Super at 60hz and 120hz.
It was honestly impressive. Without any of the dlss and all that, you'll never see consistent 120hz while playing games, but with everything turned on, it's definitely close (1% lows maybe reaching 90-100hz in the worst cases on some pretty demanding games).
Without any dlss, I could still get over 60hz at 4K on my TV with the TV's frame generation, probably around 70-80hz, but 1% lows closer to 40hz.
I would absolutely recommend the 4070 Super. If you can muster up the extra cost, a 4070 Super Ti would help a lot more for 4K gaming, especially if you want more consistent frames at or around 120hz, if not higher.
ItzFyliop@reddit
Bro just wants to know which one would be the better option and y'all are arguing about his claim on fake frames. When he clearly just meant that he doesn't want ppl to talk about the fake frames and just wants an answer🤦🏽♂️
MaldadUchiha7@reddit
In December, I built a PC with an RTX 4070 Super, combined it with a Ryzen 5 7600X, and 32gb of DDR5 6000Mhz 30CL ram. I use it with my 43" 60Hz Samsung 4K smart TV, and let me tell you, it's brutal.
Games:
Shadow of the tomb raider: 4k, max settings, DLSS Quality, 60fps
Horizon Zero Dawn Remastered: 4k, max settings, DLAA, 60fps
Indiana Jones(I got it for free with the purchase of the gpu): 4k high settings, 1440p max settings, DLAA, 60fps
Cyberpunk 2077: 1440p, max settings (no RT), DLSS Quality, 60fps
Baldurs Gate 3: 4k, max settings, DLSS Quality, 60fps
Diablo 4: 4k, max settings, DLSS Quality, 60fps
Other games, 4k, max, 60fps: Battlefield 1, Spider Man Remastered, Assassins Creed Origins-Odyssey, GTA5, Jurassic World Evolution 1-2, Resident Evil remake 2-3.
In some games the difference in resolution is sometimes not so noticeable, for example in Diablo 4, between 1080p and 4k the difference is not so big. In Shadow of the Tomb Raider, 4K is very preferable. At the moment I am very satisfied with the gpu, I love it.
SoccerGuyo11@reddit
brutally good?
Connect_Tie9855@reddit
What PSU you have?
GonstroCZ@reddit
> I do not care about 'fake' AI frames, DLSS, etc. I only care that games be playable on a 4k monitor
this doesnt make sense, if you play games that support DLLS, especially at 4k these "fake" frames will give you so much better experience. You said it yourself that neither of these cards are best for 4k gaming.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjnEiP9a9kQ&ab_channel=NVIDIAGeForce
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
What I meant to say is that I understand people are getting upset about NVIDIA's aggressive push in the AI fake frames, and some are labelling these cards as "fake performance cards." That's why I mentioned, "I don't care about fake AI frames." I don't mind whether the frames are real or not, as long as the technology works effectively. I apologise for any confusion.
I have a 4K monitor because I am using my TV; I simply don't have the budget to buy a dedicated machine for that purpose. So, I need my card to at least launch games at 4K.
Random-Posterer@reddit
Then you better care about “fake” frames and dlss
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
I do, but I also do not; I don't mind or hate them as people are used to. I simply play a game and don't look at game settings if that makes sense. And as long as I get what I expect, I am happy.
Random-Posterer@reddit
No, it doesn’t make sense. Why are you asking your question but refuse to understand the difference to know what you want?
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Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
I am looking for a fair discussion about whether the 5070 is worth buying instead of the 4070s. I want to consider all aspects of the comparison without debating the merits of Nvidia's frame generation; I view it as part of the card's performance. In my previous post, I mentioned that I’m not concerned with DLSS or similar technologies, as I know people have strong opinions about them that could skew their opinions. I simply want to engage in an unbiased discussion.
Random-Posterer@reddit
Okay in that case skip the 50 series, go for a cheaper 40 series. Simple. Raw performance the 50 series has a small uplift.
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
Thank you
GonstroCZ@reddit
I know what you mean but why to play game at low settings when you can turn on DLLS and set settings to high/ultra + maybe even get more FPS?
IMO both DLLS and FSR output a really good frame rate when used in "quality mode" and I dont notice and tearing, high latency etc... but we will see how the DLLS4 will turn out, but so far I heard mostly positive reviews.
depaay@reddit
I think you should get the 5070. Performance between them without frame generation will be close, but with the 5070 you will have the option of using multiframe generation which the 4070 super doesn’t have. I don’t know whether MFG will be good or worth it over normal FG, but in a scenario where we assume MFG works well the 5070 will output a lot more frames than the 4070 super. Obviously wait for reviews to be sure.
B4N_C1@reddit
But what if he has a 60hz Monitor? Is Framegen gonna work well in that case? I have a 4070S with a 4k 60hz monitor and I always turn Framegen off because it makes the game feel/look worse
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
Yeah, mine one is 120hz, but thanks for your feedback
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
I appreciate your opinion
and I think it is the best solution. Thank I may actually wait for 5070.
o0ade0o@reddit
But the chances are he’ll get a reduction in response rate and image quality, in my eyes that’s a worse experience.
Juusto3_3@reddit
He clearly ment it as not minding "fake frames"...
GonstroCZ@reddit
and before that he says "I do not care about 'fake' AI frames, DLSS, etc.", which sounds like he cares about raw performance of the card
Juusto3_3@reddit
Yes but if you read the entire post it is quite clear what he meant.
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
Yes, you're correct. I don't mind them; I do not hate them, nor do I like them. It is just a feature to me.
imarcelofabian@reddit
probably a 5070, but it's more reasonable if you wait for tests, I think depending on your components you may have a problem with input delay.
BaronOfTheVoid@reddit
The 5070 has almost the same specs as the 4070 Super.
The 5070 Ti has somewhat better specs than the 4070 Ti Super, but not much.
The 5090 has much better specs than the 4090.
All in all it depends on the prices but the 5070 seems like the worst deal of the bunch.
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
Could you elaborate on your reasoning? I checked the stats, and while the 5070 has worse specifications compared to the 4070s, it offers better ray tracing (RT) and AI performance. This improvement might help balance things out. Additionally, the 5070 is about 20% more performant than the 4070, which could balance it out. If both models ultimately provide similar performance, wouldn’t it make more sense to choose the newer model? Feel free to discuss.
danielnicee@reddit
It wouldn't make sense to buy, no. It'd make more sense to buy whichever is cheaper, and you're assuming scalping won't happen and increase prices.
And also, I get you're deadset on going Nvidia, which is fine, but if AMD offers more for less, then it makes even less sense to buy the 5070. If leaks are to be believed, the RX 9070 XT would seemingly cost similar to a 5070, but perform better in raster and similar in RT. It would make 0 sense to buy the 5070 over that, then. You're free to buy whatever, of course, but you invited discussion.
Nathan_hale53@reddit
I'm waiting for them both to release and I'll probably go for whichever is definitively better. Recently got a 4060 but I want a little bit more. If the 9070xt is priced 450 I'll take it either way with the rumors on its improvements being pretty good rn. If it's a 4070ti super but AMD it's a wrap.
danielnicee@reddit
I am waiting for the same, whichever is better and cheaper between RTX 5070 and RX 9070 XT.
Some leaks dropped yesterday saying that the 9070 XT performs like the 4080/super and better than 7900 XT in raster, and completely destroys the 7900 XTX in RT. That's without the new FSR4. If it's true, that means it's much better than the RTX 5070. If it's priced anywhere near the 5070, hopefully below it, it's an instant buy.
BaronOfTheVoid@reddit
RT and AI features are indeed nice - if you use them.
The AI features make an impact for upscaling and frame generation. Usually you would only enable this on a 4070 Super or 5070 if:
RT only really looks better in some games. For many there is no real improvement in image quality and in some cases it looks even worse. I'd say the best positive example would be Cyberpunk 2077 with full path tracing.
If that is how you intend to use the GPU/computer then the improved RT and AI features will come in handy.
But other than that the good old rasterization performance (and by extension, VRAM and Cuda cores) are more important.
Personally I would recommend to wait for actual real world benchmarks and would favor either the 5070 Ti (which, as said, does have somewhat better specs) and also the upcoming 9070 XT.
Nathan_hale53@reddit
Dlss is a miracle in some games. My 4060 punches above it's weight thanks too it. 5070 is gonna have the next version and it'll last a bit longer go for the 5070.
PreviousAssistant367@reddit
The 5070 will cost a lot more than that when it comes out. Mark my words.
Murky-Rush2988@reddit
Yep, your only chance at getting one at retail is brick and mortar. Online will be all scalpers. I’ve always thought about buying a handful of them, if I can get them at retail and put them up for sale around Christmas, they’re always sold out come mid December!
o0ade0o@reddit
If you don’t care about fake frames / MFG (which I don’t either due to the inevitable increase in response rate, latency and drop in quality), then go for the 4070 super. Based on released benchmarks of 4070 via 5070, it’s predicted the 4070 super will be on par.
Sasha_Viderzei@reddit
From what I understand, you can pull the trigger now and game with your 4070 Super, or wait for february for the release of the 5070. As you said you're in no rush, so I'd advise to wait until you can make the educated choice (reviewers that aren't NVidia will have posted their testing videos) if the 5070 is worth it
However, be mindful that there are risks the cards won't be obtainable at their 550£ MSRP, especially the FE from what I understand. There's not so many sold by Nvidia, and they'll be selling like hot cakes since it's the lowest price option. So the day they come out, be ready with your credit card in front of you and cross your fingers
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
Yeah, I was thinking about it, too. That's why I am kind of desperate to be decided by February. As I know, scalpers and crypto people will buy the whole stock in minutes.
Scrotum_Monster13@reddit
Hey Mandleaf, Consider this, as well:
The 4070 Super has similar GPU frequency speeds to the 5070, however, the 5070 has a 2,209 MHz speed for the GDDR7 memory. The 4070 Super only has a 1,313 MHz speed for its GDDR6x speed. Plus, the 5070 has a 672 GB/s bandwidth for data transfer on card. The 4070 Super only has the ability to transfer 504 GB/s on card.
These are factors that make a DEVISTATING impact on gaming performance. Although the theoretical performance numbers are slightly better for the 4070 Super, we have seen HUNDREDS of times in the past, that these paper figures pretty much don't have an effect when it comes to last gen tech and new gen tech. New gen tech always trumps last gen when it is slightly behind in theoretical performance figures.
But, we will only know for sure, when the card releases. And the decision is ultimately, yours.
Good luck with your new GPU, friend ;-)
PossesedZombie@reddit
”Fake AI Frames”. I understand your point and what you mean, although the right word is Frame Generation/Frame Blending. It’s used to generate extra frames similar to the frames that would be in between your actual frames, it has been available for years in programs such as Adobe AE etc. DLSS is an upscaling method which I think is actually worse. Claiming a GPU is powerful, “Ohh with DLSS you can’.” Nawh miss me with that shit, an expensive card being flexed based on software/game settings and unrelated optimizations. Brag the power without the software contribution involved.
In all honesty if I was you…
I’d stick to my 1660S, wait for the market to calm down on the RTX4080/RTX4080S and buy one of those second-hand. I kinda have a feeling the 50 Series is a bit over-hyped.
But that’s me, I play a lot of games that will require extra VRAM, RE2, RE3, Avatar, Shadow Of The Tomb Raider, Watch Dogs Legion. I’m a graphics nerd, not someone cracked at CSGO.
Scrotum_Monster13@reddit
Keep in mind that most of these people who use "fake frames" don't understand that their OLED displays use BFi to make up for the latency between frames on their LG C series TVs. This is why OLED screens are HORRIBLE for judder and stutter and are globally KNOWN for it. XD LoL!! (Which has the same gross effect as "fAkE fRaMeS", but without Ai slapping a real full image together in between).
I've been an electronics specialist (displays) for many decades. This is why I push people to stop reading the spec sheets. They don't fully understand what most of the details mean. They just love comparing numbers and arguing without the background knowledge.
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
I hadn't really considered this important aspect before, so thank you! I want to avoid finding myself in a situation where all the 4080 graphics cards are sold out or overpriced if the 50xx series could be a flop. Alternatively, if the 5070 turns out to be a great option, I don't want to miss out and see them vanish off the shelves like fresh buns.
PossesedZombie@reddit
There will always be someone selling one somewhere, it’s just a matter of price and priority.
I doubt 40 series would flop since NVIDIA will do whatever to configure their game-ready drivers towards the 50-series. If it flops hard, they will probably engage their backup plan, release a “beast” based on the 50 series. Or AMD push their prices even lower while at the same time beating NVIDIA. Then you could go for AMD!
I see RTX2070 for 250€~ in my country now when it was originally 850€ back then. I doubt a used graphics card can remain its value😅
Reggitor360@reddit
Good luck with that.
Also, 550 bucks is US MSRP. Means 650 in pounds after taxes plus the AIB tax on top.
Best you will be able to buy is a crippled 60 class.
Scrotum_Monster13@reddit
Dude! I have a 10 GB RTX 3080 and I game at 4K with zero issues. I play on ULTRA on AAA titles, with MSAA down to 2x, no RT, and reflections down to medium (because who cares about background details), and if there is tessellation, I turn it to medium as well. I don't care about foliage on the trees and bushes.
My display is locked to 75 Hz (SUPER comfortable for my eyes, no headaches).
And a 3080 is equal in power and performance to an RTX 4070.
Keep in mind, consoles use the equivalent to an RTX 2070/SUPER and they play at 4K. So, that opinion is wildly inaccurate .
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
I checked the prices, and in the UK, cards will be at the promised price £539 (at least, I hope so), as we have TAX already included. I know VRAM sucks. That's why I don't mind DLSS and dynamic scaling. I can always run games at lower res.
Alasio@reddit
Then why not consider AMD? They prioritize raw rasterization power and the 9070XT looks like it’ll be competing in the 5070-5070Ti range. Should be cheaper too.
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
I understand, and I considered it too. As I said, I have decided to go for Nvidia because of a few points:
- I need a card that can handle well local AI runs
- I actually like Nvidia's approach and integration with AI, and their apps and GeForce Experience app too.
- Better RT: I want RT to look good.
- Nvidia's connector: I know people dislike it, but I like the new GPU connector; I think that just one (I think it is a 12-pin) connector is an perfect solution for cable management.
- As long as AMD makes better CPUs, I believe Nvidia makes better GPUs
Alasio@reddit
That’s fair. Honestly without benchmarks, it’s hard to compare the 5070 but I expect the 4070 Super and 5070 to be similar. If you can find a 4070 Super at msrp then I’d get that to avoid waiting. Otherwise the 5070 would be the logical pick.
Mandleaf@reddit (OP)
Thanks for your help. I will consider it!
ArsenyPetukhov@reddit
Get the 5070. Or better yet try get some money while you wait to get 5070ti so you won’t run into issues at 4k
theboywithno@reddit
Save and get something future proof like the 1660 was you said your comfortable make sure you get something that cans push the refresh rate of your monitor without dipping on highest settings But you don’t need the best card in the same breath you will either chose a card balanced with your cpu or go for a overkill bottleneck