AVEF MEA question

Posted by andybader@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 5 comments

This may be a dumb one. Let’s say my clearance altitude is 2000 feet, expect 5000 after 10 minutes. I lose my radio immediately after takeoff. Do I fly at 2000 for 10 minutes and then climb to 5000, or do I climb directly to 5000? The former is the option that makes the most sense. After all, what’s the point of the “expect” if not? However, the exact text of 91.185 states: “(2) Altitude. At the highest of the following altitudes or flight levels for the route segment being flown: (i) The altitude or flight level assigned in the last ATC clearance received; (ii) The minimum altitude (converted, if appropriate, to minimum flight level as prescribed in § 91.121(c)) for IFR operations; or (iii) The altitude or flight level ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance.” It doesn’t say to fly it when expected, it just says fly the highest of these three altitudes. Is my reading off this way off? Am I just overthinking this while I wait for my delayed checkride?

5 Comments

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grumpycfi@reddit

I used to think you should/would fly the expected altitude at the time you're told to expect it, but per the written reg I don't think that's true. I believe you would climb immediately to the highest of the applicable altitudes. Usually it'll be pretty academic because the odds you have a radio failure immediately on take-off, in IMC, before the "expected" time elapses anyway, is pretty minimal. But if you do I'd just climb up to my highest altitude because honestly that will get me out of the clouds (maybe), out of the way of others (maybe), and away from terrain (definitely).

TheFlyingCrooner@reddit

ATC is “reserving” the airspace at 5000 for you. In the clearance they inform you of your “expect” altitude so you know exactly what to do, and they know exactly what YOU will do 10 minutes into departure during a lost com scenario. In practice, it goes like this… So, you depart, starting your clock at wheels up. You climb to 2000. Oh shit! Your radio isn’t working. Troubleshoot, squawk, transmit in the blind, and you remember M.E.A.. Continue flying your ASSIGNED 2000 feet. Check the low chart. Are any of the MINIMUM altitudes higher than 2000? Fly that when you get there. 10 minutes in, do what ATC EXPECTS you to do and climb to 5000. They’ll be clearing the path for you. This is all of course assuming that you can’t just exit and avoid IFR conditions, squawk, turn around and go home. If in IMC, you and ATC need to be on the same page so they can clear the way for you.

randombrain@reddit

From an ATC perspective, we would plan on you maintaining 2000 until ten minutes has elapsed and *then* climbing to 5000. In mountainous areas where you want to climb sooner, we issue shorter "expect... in" times. Five minutes or even two minutes I think I've seen.

FlowerGeneral2576@reddit

Squawk 7600 and immediately to 5000 (or higher if subpart ii applies and there a higher published altitude to go to)

rFlyingTower@reddit

This is a copy of the original post body for posterity: --- This may be a dumb one. Let’s say my clearance altitude is 2000 feet, expect 5000 after 10 minutes. I lose my radio immediately after takeoff. Do I fly at 2000 for 10 minutes and then climb to 5000, or do I climb directly to 5000? The former is the option that makes the most sense. After all, what’s the point of the “expect” if not? However, the exact text of 91.185 states: “(2) Altitude. At the highest of the following altitudes or flight levels for the route segment being flown: (i) The altitude or flight level assigned in the last ATC clearance received; (ii) The minimum altitude (converted, if appropriate, to minimum flight level as prescribed in § 91.121(c)) for IFR operations; or (iii) The altitude or flight level ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance.” It doesn’t say to fly it when expected, it just says fly the highest of these three altitudes. Is my reading off this way off? Am I just overthinking this while I wait for my delayed checkride? --- Please downvote this comment until it collapses. --- I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. If you have any questions, please [contact the mods of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/flying).

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