737 crosswind take off during Storm Darragh at NCL
Posted by Blythyvxr@reddit | aviation | View on Reddit | 119 comments
Posted by Blythyvxr@reddit | aviation | View on Reddit | 119 comments
Blythyvxr@reddit (OP)
If anyone’s interested, there’s a 777 with one hell of a decrab from the same day as well: https://youtu.be/WiPl0S7xcbE
septer012@reddit
Must feel like twisting for the passengers at the end
unclepetey69@reddit
That’s a landing in full crab not decrab in the flare.
Toronto-Will@reddit
I was going to ask — just as someone who recreationally flight sims, but has been dealing with severe crosswinds in MSFS 2024, and trying to learn how to do it right - that seemed late.
aceyt12@reddit
Boeing recommends landing with crab in strong crosswinds due the excessive low wing required to keep the aircraft flying straight. Decrabbing after touchdown is preferred
Final_Winter7524@reddit
Requires a hell of a lot of confidence in the strength of the landing gear.
VexingRaven@reddit
The 777 has steerable body gear, does it not? I know normally they turn opposite to help ground handling, can they turn into the crab to aid in a landing like this?
Canadian47@reddit
Opposite end of the size spectrum but my buddy flies an Ercoupe without rudder pedals. In a cross wind he doesn't have a choice and has to land with a crab.
MikeandMelly@reddit
This reminds me of when I flew into London with my family in high school. I was in a window seat and when we were coming into land, the plane was swinging like a pendulum in a manner where one moment I'd be looking at the ground and then the plane would swing and I'd slowly reorientate until I was looking at the sky and vice versa. Not a single damn clue how that pilot made that landing.
VerStannen@reddit
Oh the same guy. Love his “flipping heck!” lol.
Pretty impressive to say the least.
Belzebutt@reddit
Flippin' heck guy!
Thats_my_cornbread@reddit
There was no decrab. Homeboy just let it ride till he was on the ground then decided to unfuck it.
Good_Air_7192@reddit
Passengers must have got a good view of the landing
oojiflip@reddit
Hits a bird just before landing too lol
littlelowcougar@reddit
Damn that was slick as fuck. Didn’t seem to be gusting as much. But still insane, that was like a 30 degree crab!
rtuck06@reddit
I'm going to catch downvotes for this but this has to be straddling the safety line, no?
ch4m3le0n@reddit
I would say exceeding it. Max crosswind is 33 kts, and according to other commenters, this was probably over 40.
Mental.
Temporary-Prior7451@reddit
Max crosswind is 25kts for a wet rwy, still metar winds don’t matter, the wind the tower gives them with the take off clearance is what counts.
ch4m3le0n@reddit
"It's close to 50 kts but I saw it as low as 25 at one point. You'll be fine."
xxJohnxx@reddit
That is common. Often you have to shoot your shot when conditions allow it.
Many places would have to shut down regularly if that weren‘t the case.
gonzaloetjo@reddit
nice thing to read from the perspective of a pleb :V
nuggolips@reddit
Continental 1404 was a 737 crash under crosswind conditions that were probably less severe than this.
RadosAvocados@reddit
Just looked it up. CO1404 had crosswinds between 40-45 kts.
The metar at 4 minutes prior to takeoff for this flight was 37 gusting to 58. Wild.
ffffh@reddit
~a dry runway, a Boeing 737-800 has a maximum allowable crosswind component of approximately 33kts. For taking off on a wet runway it's about 27kts.~
comptiger5000@reddit
Is that considered a limitation, or is it just listed as max demonstrated? If it's max demonstrated and not stated as a limitation, then it's not limiting unless an airline chooses to consider it limiting in their manuals. However, if you're exceeding max demonstrated crosswind and something goes wrong it likely won't be looked at too kindly.
DudeManJones5@reddit
Was that total wind speed or crosswind component?
RadosAvocados@reddit
Total
Funkytadualexhaust@reddit
Hold on to your butts!
LowOilPressure@reddit
"Watch this" - The Captain
blueb0g@reddit
Nah it's fine
betelgeuse63110@reddit
Guessing this exceeded the Maximum Demonstrated Crosswind Component. Get-there-itis at its finest.
argote@reddit
Hard to think what could justify going ahead with that takeoff over waiting for conditions to improve.
PrettyGazelle@reddit
They were in Newcastle. They didn't want to be in Newcastle. QED.
elmwoodblues@reddit
English women and English food account for the great number of English sailors
hybridvoices@reddit
Couldn’t take another minute of the shite Newcastle weather.
KC5SDY@reddit
Agreed. I don't know that I would have gone through with that myself.
RogerRabbit1234@reddit
I’m here to hopefully hear from a 737 Pilot what the crosswinds limits are and what on earth is going on here. That was pretty intense.
byerss@reddit
I’m no pilot but that has to be beyond limits, right?
It’s getting pushed sideways and tipped over. Left gear may not even be contacting ground before takeoff.
Funkytadualexhaust@reddit
Agree, I don't like this.
Agreeable-Spot-7376@reddit
The stewardess would be bringing be new pants.
OutrageousSun7308@reddit
Crosswind “limitations” are max demonstrated by test pilots that are normally well above the average pilot. This is above those and if you watch the centerline control on the full video and the veer off of centerline after rotation it isn’t great. They almost have engine contact early in the takeoff roll. Every takeoff is a what if? If you lose the upwind engine in this takeoff (the most critical in checkride parlance) your chances of putting in the correct inputs in a perfect proportion to the loss of thrust and drag are exponentially increased to the point where there is minuscule room for error if any. I am a pilot with thousands of hours in this type and this is a crazy video to see.
M2DaXz@reddit
What i guess is that the tower gave them a wind just before departure that was within the limits. Then they started the roll and the plane remained on the centerline pretty much without needing max rudder input, and to counteract the crosswind they kept the aileron (with the yoke) into the wind. Not too far though cause i can not see any roll spoiler deployed, so once a gust kicked in you could see the plane almost lifting one wing but it didnt ultimately. After liftoff the instruction must have been to remain on runway heading since they didnt apply any bank. To me, as a professional, it does not look that crazy but you can argue that since right before the departure there were high gusts reported it would be smart to delay the departure. This all is ofcourse seen as an 'outsider' without all the official parameters etc, i am sure if they have busted any limitations the company will follow up on it in order to learn from it.
The end result does look awesome though
Imlooloo@reddit
Incredible luck/skill/wind/danger/why would you even attempt this?
LaoBa@reddit
All part of the job at KLM
IAmAUsernameAMA@reddit
Can someone answer why I feel like I only see these extreme crosswind videos from airports in the UK?
icejerk1@reddit
there are quite a few in keflavik iceland but not a lot of spotters frequent to record
elchet@reddit
You get a lot from some folks at Düsseldorf too. Bilbao is also good for crosswinds.
anteup@reddit
also, lots of single runway airports.
Blythyvxr@reddit (OP)
Lots of people with cameras, lots of winter storms
HumpyPocock@reddit
Kind of wonder how affected it’d be due to something like liguistic sampling bias. Yes, the planespotter’s mother tongue is more or less irrelevant, spoken word ain’t the focus after all, nonetheless wouldn’t surprise me if it scrambled the statistics a little.
53bvo@reddit
Lots of wind in an area with a high population density and many (smaller) airports. Amsterdam for example also gets a lot of wind but has 5 runway so bigger chance of one having less crosswinds.
Rincewindcl@reddit
The plane spotter gene runs strong here in the UK, hence the decent (and frequent) footage!
bergler82@reddit
that was a prime example of really really bad TEM. The fact that he had the spoilers sticking out makes it so much worse, ALL the calculations for ASD are out the window. And jeebus, if the left engine fails that thing will turn into the wind faster than a politician.
xxJohnxx@reddit
We do ailerons into the wind on the A220 as well. The effect of rollspoilers deploying due to that has been factored in the take-off calculations.
bhaug4@reddit
This should have been a ground stop. Crazy. The pilots did excellent though.
xxJohnxx@reddit
Why a ground stop? There are plenty of aircraft that have crosswind limits of 40knots or more while many have lowers. Can‘t bring operations to a halt just because of some unfortunate wind.
aigoopy@reddit
This is acceptable only if Langoliers are eating the runway.
Himoy@reddit
I don't work in aviation but looking at this makes me wonder if the decision to clear for take-off was appropriate in this case. Perhaps somebody with knowledge can share some insight?
FarButterscotch4280@reddit
Poor decision making from the pilot. If the chief pilot of that airline sees that video the pilot will be in trouble. Im sure the passengers will have some verbal output too.
Newspapers will say the pilot was a hero....
Temporary-Prior7451@reddit
Do you know all circumstances regarding this take off? Do you know the tower wind given with the take off clearance? Who says it was poor decision making, before knowing all the facts…
FarButterscotch4280@reddit
I'm sorta a results oriented person, but... I say it was a poor decision given the potential danger that guy was putting the passengers into. If he makes a mistake and balls the airplane up off the runway, I suppose he could tell the survivors -- "Well it looked good when I started, but then I needed to make the next stop on time, hell, I meant well".
Probably a lot of of the pilots that have unstabilized approaches, and then have the airplanes go sailing off into a ditch think the same thing. * I can handle it *
I will take another trip to SE Asia in a week. and the only danger related thing I think about when I get on the airplane is--I hope the pilot isn't an effing idiot.
Temporary-Prior7451@reddit
Well the result was: they got airborne and didn’t crash.
If you wonder about the guys up front being effing idiots and care to educate yourself a bit; take a look in this sub about how to become an airline pilot.
That comment say’s more about you, than it does about the possible effing idiots in the flightdeck.
send_lasagna@reddit
Is the 737 limit 25 kt on contaminated runways?
butthole_lipliner@reddit
Incredibly poor airmanship. Sorry not sorry. If that was my bird it would’ve stayed chocked with some well compensated pax for their troubles.
AliceInPlunderland@reddit
Anyone know the published conditions at NCL that day?
RadosAvocados@reddit
They departed from runway 07 with the winds coming straight from the north at 37 kts, gusting to 58.
AliceInPlunderland@reddit
Thank you!
Blythyvxr@reddit (OP)
I work out that as a crosswind component of 33.8 kts, gusting to 53 kts
Affectionate-Move229@reddit
Correct, probably the limit is with the gust excluded.
BroadTea8292@reddit
There is no way that departure was within limits on a wet runway. The gusts are usually included which would make it 52kt crosswind. If you lost an engine just before rotation speed it’d be extremely difficult to control the aircraft.
Apprehensive_Cost937@reddit
Most airlines nowadays include gust within the limit for safety reasons.
Apprehensive_Cost937@reddit
33 kts with the winglets.
Temporary-Prior7451@reddit
I wonder what the windreading was that the tower gave them as that is the only thing that matters.
BroadTea8292@reddit
Yeah fair point, however watching the video with left main gear lifting it’s likely it was outside limits. There was an error somewhere regarding the wind reading. It’s a pity you can’t access Newcastle ATC archives.
anomalkingdom@reddit
I think it just said "closed"
DadCelo@reddit
Must have been a fun ride onboard
ArrivesLate@reddit
I love seeing the centerline on takeoff!
shikki93@reddit
That pilot should never fly again. How the fuck was this allowed to happen. If I was on that plane I’d be furious
368995@reddit
If I was on this flight I honestly would just prefer to have a cancelled/delayed flight until the weather cleara
BrtFrkwr@reddit
Landed in a 40 kt crosswind on Benbecula. If felt a lot like that.
kaiserbun@reddit
Back in the late 90's it was was kicking 40kts coming into LGA from MEM, there was a huge ice storm that ripped through the Mid South followed by a Polar Snap. It wasn't a descent so much as a controlled fall. People were weeping, pissing, crossing themselves, praying, saying the Shahada. We set down on the tarmac nice and smooth but we were slipping left to right so bad I was like Oh Christ here we go. The guy next to me says, "Flushing Bay's gotta be 25 degrees!" I said, "Man, Please!". They closed the airport right after we got in. I remember everyone shook the flight crew's hands.
sharkbait1999@reddit
I just replayed this in my minds eye and had a good chuckle at the flushing bay line
oojiflip@reddit
There were some absolutely wild ones yesterday lol, I remember seeing a Lognanair getting absolutely chucked across the runway as it was taking off, was the first 07 departure if anyone wants to look for it in the stream
PrettyGazelle@reddit
Maybe this one
https://youtu.be/bIz9v-lvRis?si=RbTp7w60_nPVuvQv&t=480
GaryTheFiend@reddit
In the next postcode immediately after takeoff lol.
oojiflip@reddit
That's the one!
PrettyGazelle@reddit
From Manchester, the Ryanair at 4:00 and the easyJet at 5:18 are wild.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRTIpgMmV_U
Blythyvxr@reddit (OP)
nothing loganair flies has enough power to resist even a headwind...
anomalkingdom@reddit
- Vee 1!
- I haven't throttled up yet!
thats_not_the_quote@reddit
ground-speed: 0
vertical speed: 1000
MacGibber@reddit
I think that qualifies as a STO
anomalkingdom@reddit
Ha ha yes.
istealpixels@reddit
wonder if you know How they live in Tokyo (はい) If you seen it, then you mean it Then you know you have to go Fast and Furious! (キタ) (drift, drift, drift) Fast and Furious! (キタ) (drift, drift, drift) I wonder if you know How they live in Tokyo (はい) If you seen it, then you mean it Then you know you have to go Fast and Furious! (キタ) (drift, drift, drift) Fast and Furious! (キタ) (drift, drift, drift)
PussyDeconstructor@reddit
this flight should have never been executed
RobertWilliamBarker@reddit
Shit pilot. I've done 55 knots and it looked nothing like that.
Excession-OCP@reddit
Dreams don’t count mate.
PDXGuy33333@reddit
Jesus. Were there any survivors?
Accidentallygolden@reddit
And that's s the reason they don't do parallel take off...
JimSyd71@reddit
One of those times pilot thought fuck it were safer in the air than on the ground lets gooooo!
45_ways_to_win@reddit
How could the developers of this airport not see this as a problem lmaoooo
Blythyvxr@reddit (OP)
https://wind.willyweather.co.uk/ne/tyne-and-wear/newcastle-airport.html
https://windy.app/forecast2/spot/5450487/Newcastle+International+Airport+NCL/statistics
The runway is pretty well aligned according to the wind rose.
TheInterneAteMyBalls@reddit
I took off from there yesterday, too!
E170pilot@reddit
Can’t tell for sure but looked like very little aileron into the wind to correct for crosswind.
Blythyvxr@reddit (OP)
there's a small amount being used, but you can already see the port spoilers starting to lift. No one wants much spoiler deployment.
CGPsaint@reddit
Hope some of those passengers were wearing their brown pants.
Original-Debt-9962@reddit
Pilots wife: if you can’t make it tonight don’t bother coming back.
Sr-Schmitz@reddit
Balls of the pilot bigger than his wings, looks like someone has to pay some bills, does they get paid during flight time isn’t?
Ok_Needleworker2438@reddit
Had to be a stall warning there.
interstellar-dust@reddit
737 STO model.
im_in_the_safe@reddit
I’ll take the delay thank you though.
MacGibber@reddit
Looks like a wild ride
RomeoInBlackJeans1@reddit
Watch the language, pal.
philzar@reddit
...fly runway heading...if able...
Sheesh!
Actually though, it did look like they were departing on runway heading, just with "a bit" of offset.
woodworkingguy1@reddit
This may fall into the old vs bold pilot examples.
Whipitreelgud@reddit
The cameraman said it best: flippin’ heck!
4Sammich@reddit
Side loading the mains from a gust and cant maintain centerline. Thats just a bad choice.
Hugh-Mungus-Richard@reddit
Not everyone can drift the 737, but that guy can.
botany_bae@reddit
https://imgur.com/HVpC8pK
botany_bae@reddit
https://images.app.goo.gl/a9j7fmJZfVYszKpr6