Have faster DDR5 speeds ever become more stable on AM5 platforms

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-UserRemoved-@reddit

You have massive L3 cache, there isn't much reason to go higher anyways, assuming your workload is gaming.

Do you have a specific workload where faster memory makes a noticeable difference?

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VaeVictius@reddit

Is it true that 6000MTS matters very little at 1440p with a 7800X3D? I have huge boot up times when I enable Expo 6000MT/s. But when I disable expo and ram runs at 4800MT/S, it boots up fast

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PiotrekDG@reddit

Well, test it and share the results with us.

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-UserRemoved-@reddit

Is it true that 6000MTS matters very little at 1440p with a 7800X3D?

For gaming, yes.

I have huge boot up times when I enable Expo 6000MT/s.

Sounds like memory retraining is causing longer boot times

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/11m10fz/turning_on_memory_context_in_bios_fixes_long/

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Bluedot55@reddit

You should try messing with the fast boot settings instead. That may help

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CaptainAmerica679@reddit (OP)

i use lightroom and will probably get a little more into photoshop soon. not sure if it would noticeably benefit either of those applications?

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If you haven't already bought the 7800x3D, you should consider spending the bit extra to get the 9800x3D instead, it's quite a bit faster in PS, and while I haven't seen any LR benchmarks, I'd imagine you'd get some performance increase there too due to the higher frequency.

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CaptainAmerica679@reddit (OP)

i still may, but already you can find 7800x3d back closer to $350. Central computers had it on sale for $349 last week

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ime1em@reddit

read this https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/impact-of-ddr5-speed-on-content-creation-performance-2023-update/#How_Does_DDR5_Memory_Speed_Affect_Content_Creation_Performance

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Moscato359@reddit

The L3 cache certainly does help photoshop, as the 9800x3d is the fastest benching photoshop processor out there, even including the 9950x

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pc-master-builder@reddit

No, it has not changed, the limitation is the IO Die, and the silicon lottery, and there is less than 2-3% advantage with ddr5 overclocking. There is substantial increase if you tune your sub timings on am5. Don't waste your time with ram speed overclocking, spend your time working on your subtimings.

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Moscato359@reddit

You can use ddr5 8000 on am5 on x870(e) motherboards, and you might get a sub 2% performance increase.

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Braidster@reddit

With the newest agesa I've noticed ddr5-8000 listed on more x670e memory compatibility lists.

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Plenty-Industries@reddit

Yeah that doesnt matter much. QVL's are just a list of what the manufacturer has personally validated to work.

In terms of performance, whether gaming or productivity, the difference between 6000 vs 8000 is not enough to justify the price increase you're paying for the additional speed.

It doesnt benefit Ryzen 7000/9000 series CPU's because the Memory Controller beyond 6400MT/s is running at a lower overall speed and known to introduce a latency penalty which negates any potential performance increase, as compared to say an Intel CPU running the same 8000MT/s which doesnt have that issue.

In gaming specifically, which is what I use my rig for, you're looking at low single-digit performance gains on average FPS and the lows.

If find it difficult to justify paying $50+ more for higher speed RAM just to gain less than 10fps compared to paying $80-100 for 6000CL30 32GB kit.

For productivity applications, you want stability and capacity over speed.

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Braidster@reddit

Neither does the essay you wrote because I never said anything about performance comparisons, or which was better. All I said there is x670e boards that are now updated to handle that speed.

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RunalldayHI@reddit

That's not how it works, 8000mhz on 2dpc x670's are limited by the mobo topology, not the agesa version.

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double0nothing@reddit

The issue is the memory controller, which resides on the CPU, not the motherboard.

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Braidster@reddit

I know that.....You do know this started with this dude saying x870's run ddr8000, and all I said was that some x670e's are as well. That's it, and this dude just kept arguing with me lol. I'm only humoring him because I'm being paid, and I'm bored.

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Plenty-Industries@reddit

Im simply adding to it.

Rather waste of money to spend $150+ for a kit of ram just because its "faster" on paper when the reality is that its not beneficial

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RunalldayHI@reddit

The issue is most 2dpc x670's aren't going to run 8000mhz and they certainly aren't going to do it without custom voltages/timings.

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Moscato359@reddit

That is more of an on a per motherboard basis, than tied to a chipset, but all the new chipsets generally support higher than the older chipsets did at launch

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Braidster@reddit

Yes and I said it is now appearing on more, not all 670's now. You do know x670 and x870 use EXACTLY the same memory controller right?

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Moscato359@reddit

Different boards have difficult qualities of traces, different number of layers, and different micro optimizations at the physical layer.

There is a reason two different boards with the same chipset can have different potential maximum clock speeds for ram.

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Braidster@reddit

Same could be said about your claim that "870e" mobos do ddr5-8000 because they all can't, but keep doubling down and downvoting me it's hilarious.

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Moscato359@reddit

I haven't downvoted anyone here. If you were downvoted, it wasn't me.

I was talking about trends. Exceptions exist.

For example vrm quality: Asus prime b650 boards are 50~ ish amp, and has 6 layer PCB. Asus prime x670 boards are 60 amp, and has a 6 layer PCB. Asus prime x870 boards are 80 amp, and has an 8 layer PCB.

Asrock pg lightning b650 is 50 amp, and has a 6 layer pcb. Asrock pg lightning x670 is 70 amp, and has an 8 layer pcb. Asrock pg lightning x870 doesn't exist, but the lowest vrm size board is asrock board is 80 amp, and 8 layer.

I don't claim all x870e boards can do 8000, but more of them can do 8000 than b650, or x670.

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Braidster@reddit

Don't pretend I ever said a thing about performance, price, gains, losses, buy this, buy that, anything.

You - "You can use ddr5 8000 on am5 on x870(e) motherboards, and you might get a sub 2% performance increase."

Me - "With the newest agesa I've noticed ddr5-8000 listed on more x670e memory compatibility lists."

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that maybe you mistook the "more" in my sentence as me claiming that it was more common on 670. When I meant more 670 boards were were becoming able to reach those levels.

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Bagman220@reddit

I’m running a 7950x3d at 6400 with CL 32 corsair vengeance ram 2x32GB. Took a bios update and some manual tweaks on my x670 msi tomahawk, but it does work. People say 6000 cl 30 is the sweet spot, but this ram was a few bucks cheaper and essentially the same thing as far as I know?

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geniuslogitech@reddit

I've seen one reviewer doing 6800 in 1:1 on 9800x3d, 7800x3d usually maxes out at 6400 1:1 but people usually recommend 6000 MT/s tCAS 30 because that will work better out of the box, just load profile, if you want to manually set profiles if your CPU can do 6400 you should get either a 6800 MT/s kit(that's where you only get good chips, below is lottery wwhat you get inside) and manually tighten it or get 8000/8200 chips and de-sync the IF, 7800 de-sync matches or slightly outperforms 6400 tuned, that's the breaking point if you are willing to spend money and want to tinker with stuff, otherwise 6000 MT/s tCAS 30 and call it a day

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pepsi_dealer_420@reddit

The memory controller gets iffy past 3000 Mhz which means for most people DDR-6000 is the sweet spot.

You can run faster memory but you gotta half the memory controller speed, so to run the memory controller at 2000 Mhz for DDR-8000. With a significantly slower controller and significantly faster RAM performance may or may not be better, depends on the workload. This is definitely a more advanced configuration/tuning topic for many.

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lolmagic1@reddit

I think you can overclock the controller but not very far I heard some people can do 1 to 1 at 6400

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pepsi_dealer_420@reddit

DDR5-5600 is the maximum spec for Ryzen 7/9 so technically anything above that is an overclock. DDR-6000 tends to be "set it and forget" for most chips. Anything above is less guaranteed based on silicon quality, and takes more fiddling to ensure stability.

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atatassault47@reddit

AMD really needs to update its IO chiplet

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SoupIsNotAMeal@reddit

Great article about all that here: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/ddr5-memory-performance-scaling-with-amd-zen-5/

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NoAirBanding@reddit

If I reading the chart right, in theory, 12000 might be the next 'sweet spot'?

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Amazingawesomator@reddit

hhmm, this makes me want to create a proportional spreadsheet for fclk and memory speeds.......

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digitalfrost@reddit

Buildzoid already did in this this video

https://youtu.be/Xcn_nvWGj7U?si=Q54Ae7GPk26DjA7P&t=1614

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gronz5@reddit

I believe he's talking about the MCLK. Spreadsheet of all three pls

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ptok_@reddit

Faster memories do work with AM5. You can go 7200MT/s 2:1 with probably any CPU. But there is no reason for this, as this config is slower then 6000MT/s 1:1. Why buy more expensive modules?
So if you have 6000MT/s CL30 you can try just overclock it to 7600-7800MT/s and check if it works. Hynix A-die is very flexible.

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CryptographerNo450@reddit

I have the same setup. There really isn't much reason to go higher than 6000 CL30 unless you do a lot of productivity related activities (if that were the case, I would go with a more balanced CPU vs. the 7800X3D which is primarily a gaming CPU)

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lichtspieler@reddit

6000MT/s dual ranked DDR5 murders the 8000MT/s single ranked kits in performance anyways.

And for later you need to use BCLK overclock, that was never safe to use for a daily system.

As for productivity, the 9800x3D did for sure change the sweetspot choice for the typical "productivity" in real-world desktop use-cases:

IS IT PHOTOSHOP?
The 9800x3D murders even the 9950x https://i.imgur.com/Wyh2rr7.png
IS IT HANDBRAKE ENCODING/TRANSCODING?
The 9800x3D is pretty close to the 9950x https://i.imgur.com/ajPMU0A.png

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Kofmo@reddit

You can still only use 2sticks if you want the full speed of the ram right?

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Im12AndWatIsThis@reddit

Depends on the motherboard, RAM, and luck, but as someone who recently ran into this problem trying to use 4: mostly yes

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bong-water@reddit

2 sticks is recommended

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Kofmo@reddit

You can still only use 2sticks if you want the full speed of the ram right?

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EirHc@reddit

Memory Controller is on the CPU. What it is is what it is. Maybe the 9xxx line is slightly better? I couldn't tell you.

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Slyons89@reddit

6400 CL30 if you are lucky with a strong memory controller and are willing to juice the SOC voltage a little.

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Melodic_Alps435@reddit

it is more faster.

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lollipop_anus@reddit

You can roll the dice on silicon lottery if faster than 6000 will work for you, but even if it does the difference in performance is in margin of error vs 6000 speed ram. There is no point to spending extra money on faster ram that may or may not work and also provide no noticeable improvement to your performance.

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voltagenic@reddit

I took a chance and bought a 8000mhz kit for my 7950x and it's been stable the entire time.

Literally worked right out of the box and didn't have to tinker with any settings or voltages.

I use an Asus x670e-proWiFi board. What is also interesting about this upgrade, is that the sticks weren't listed on the QVL page for my motherboard.

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m4tic@reddit

If you didn't change any settings, it's running at base 5200 speeds

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voltagenic@reddit

I enabled XMP, so it's running at its rated speed. Infinity fabric is running at 2000mhz as well.

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m4tic@reddit

Very nice. it's like people leaving their new display at 60hz. Enoy!

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majoroutage@reddit

Might want to double check what your underlying clock speeds for the IF and memory controller actually are.

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voltagenic@reddit

Theyve been working at their rated speeds since they were put in and XMP enabled. Haven't had a single issue.

IF is at 2000mhz as well.

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GeraltForOverwatch@reddit

That is incredible. What kits are they exactly?

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voltagenic@reddit

G.skill Trident Z5 RGB series, 48gb (24x2) CL40-48-48 128 kit.

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pepsi_dealer_420@reddit

Did you enable EXPO? Because if you're didn't your running that memory at default board settings which are much slower.

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voltagenic@reddit

Of course I did.

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NFLCart@reddit

QVL rarely has even half the supported RAM in my experience.

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voltagenic@reddit

In my case, I don't believe that 8000mhz sticks existed at the time the motherboard was manufactured, so that may be why they were "missing".

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leops1984@reddit

You can go watch the hour-long Buildzoid video on this, but nothing has really changed. 6000 CL30 is still the sweet spot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xcn_nvWGj7U

His advice on what DDR5 to buy has also held up well. You want to find the cheapest RAM you can find that uses Hynix A-die, which is identifiable by the combination of speed and timings.

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Local_Community_7510@reddit

x870 might be good that can support up to 8000+ MHz (or MT/s), but i didn't know how much performance gain compared to the price (if you do concern about the budget)

but the thing is, will the processor be able to "keep up"? even the newest 9800X3D still support 5600 MT/s for dual-channel, and 3600 for quad channel which kinda fully wasted potential, and made me rethink that i would stay on AM4 for like 2-3 more years until it can't keep up with my needs

if you're into gaming, then it's generally fine, but if you also had other thing than gaming, especially working with specific workloads, i think you should conern the CAS Latency too.

but on overall, don't worrying too much on speed, but rather worry about stability

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