Russia says that Ukraine used US made missiles to attack it, says they are ready to follow up with a nuclear response per CNBC
Posted by Protect_your_2a@reddit | preppers | View on Reddit | 1117 comments
https://www.cnbc.com/2024/11/19/russia-says-ukraine-attacked-it-using-us-made-missiles.html
Is the US ready for a nuclear conflict? What would the fallout be? Where would be safe places in the US to evac to if any?
AirEither@reddit
lol anyone believe Russia will end their own world bc of missiles hitting them in Kursk is dumb… also IT OBVIOUSLY LEVELED A HIGH LEVEL command center and Russia is really bent over loosing some “special orcs” lol.
Honestly Putin will be killed by his own if he tried allow a nuclear strike because their citizens their government knows they’ll be gone. Putin looks weak to his people and he knows he’s done for.
illkeepthatinmind@reddit
It would be colossally stupid for Russia to escalate now when a new US government is taking office in 2 months. That's probably why Biden approved it.
Magnison@reddit
I see Trump coming to office and to "save us from nuclear war" cuts all aid to Ukraine and forces them to sign a peace treaty on Russia's terms.
equinox_magick@reddit
That’s exactly what will happen
kilofeet@reddit
That was going to happen anyway though, at least this gives them a fighting chance to take out the Kerch bridge and maybe hold onto a little more of their own turf
WeepingAndGnashing@reddit
At the cost of getting nuked? Come on.
Clever_Commentary@reddit
They don't think putin will use tactical nukes. I don't either.
Even if the use of low-yield nukes doesn't result in a strategic nuclear response by the US, it places us directly into WWIII. Russia does not have the resources to go to war with NATO. (China can, but doesn't want to. )
Meerkat-Chungus@reddit
Russia might bank on nukes ending the war like they did in WWII. They know that the rest of the world does not want to enter a nuclear conflict. They could drop nukes, under the pretence of them being attacked first, and then present negotiations as a way to avoid nuclear war.
Warrior_Runding@reddit
Ukraine can supposedly field atomics within 90-180 days of deciding to construct them, according to a leaked report. The idea is to take spent fuel rods and then process them to pull the Plutonium-239 which can be used to make crude atomics. They won't be Tsar Bomba but enough to be used tactically.
Meerkat-Chungus@reddit
That won’t matter much if Russia takes out Ukrainian leadership or destroys their supplies before they can build them.
Warrior_Runding@reddit
I mean, they still have access to 3 of their 4 nuke plants. A smart Ukraine would have already started the work soon after the invasion.
Meerkat-Chungus@reddit
It’s not really the production of nukes that will hold Ukraine back, but their ability to respond to a Russian attack. If Russia decided to use nukes, they would almost certainly perform offensive strikes in areas that would protect them from Ukraine nuclear retaliation
Maximum_Mastodon_686@reddit
No one is getting nuked. 1 nuke means we are all nuked. It's all or nothing.
Nuciferous1@reddit
So why the slow steady escalation? Why didn’t we just give Ukraine long range missiles on day one and tell them to fire them wherever they want?
Maximum_Mastodon_686@reddit
We didn't understand the connection between the war and donald trump until more recently.
Nuciferous1@reddit
Biden wouldn’t let them escalate faster because we didn’t understand the connection between Putin’s invasion of Ukraine and the former president? I can’t fathom where you’re going with that but I’m all ears.
Maximum_Mastodon_686@reddit
Do you think russia's war in ukraine coinciding with bidens presidency is entirely coincidental?
Nuciferous1@reddit
No
Maximum_Mastodon_686@reddit
Then what do you think the connection between them is?
Nuciferous1@reddit
I think Putin found Biden to be weak and it felt like a good opportunity for him to strike.
But it doesn’t feel like we’re getting any closer to my original question.
Maximum_Mastodon_686@reddit
That's where we disagree. I believe putins war in ukraine is only for the benefit of trump. Without putins inside orange man, the war wouldn't have happened what so ever.
Nuciferous1@reddit
You must realize that on its face, it makes no sense to say that Trump is a Russian asset and so Putin waiting until Trump was out of power to start a war and that war was only started to help out, not the ruler but the asset. Are you going to connect those dots for me?
And you’re still not explaining why Biden wouldn’t just tell Ukraine to escalate as much and as fast as they want.
Easy_Insurance_8738@reddit
The plan was Trump was to win then the war….. he lost and still had to hold on till trumps rein again which its playing out in real time now
Nuciferous1@reddit
Source?
Maximum_Mastodon_686@reddit
The connection between trump and putin is clear. If you think it doesn't exist, then I can't help you.
Biden didn't know the entire war was staged for trumps benefit at the beginning of the war, meaning he thought a nuclear war was an actually possible. Now he knows better.
Hitit2hard@reddit
You're right, you can't help us but I think there may be some therapy that may help you.
Maximum_Mastodon_686@reddit
Sure thing nazi sympathizer, sure thing.
Nuciferous1@reddit
You’re not even getting the narrative right as far as I can tell. The line is that Trump is a Putin asset. You’re the only one suggesting that Putin is a Trump asset.
But all of this is neither here nor there. You started off indicating that nuclear war would never happen because it means everyone gets nuked so escalation doesn’t matter. Now you’re saying escalation doesn’t matter only because Putin decided to start this war purely to make Trump look good. It’s incoherent.
Maximum_Mastodon_686@reddit
Both things are true. Mutually assured destruction is a big hurdle to get over. And because it's all a show designed to get trump elected, putin won't end the world over it.
PracticeY@reddit
They aren’t going to nuke. The only chance is if we go into actual Russia. US troops could even be used to take back much of the Ukrainian land are would probably be safe unless we attack into Russia. Russia has a shot of hanging on to Crimea and maybe some of the Donbas while getting back the Kursk region currently occupied by Ukraine. Neither side will be completely satisfied but we may be able to end it for now.
Holiday_Albatross441@reddit
Ukraine has been firing ATACMs and Storm Shadows at the Kerch Bridge for a year or more. This makes zero difference.
And it would be an otherwise pointless PR exercise in any case. Military supplies generally don't go over the bridge and the damage would be fixed in a few weeks.
Nibb31@reddit
The Kerch bridge was always considered fair game as it was built on Ukrainian sovereign territory.
Spartikis@reddit
Well we have limited options. The war is a meat grinder and Ukraine doesn’t have the population to keep up with the slaughter. At some point they will have to surrender. That or the US and NATO Allies step in and push Russia out of Ukraine. I think the easier option is to give up some low value territory so Putin can mark it down as a win. Create a DMZ, no fly zone, and accept Ukraine into NATO, so in the end Ukraine is trading some land in exchange to mutual protection from other European nations. They will likely get continued US and foreign aide and new western trade partners. Russia will gain some farm covered with mines.
Head_Vermicelli7137@reddit
He’s not going to save us Russia owns him and has since the late 80s
soonPE@reddit
And thats a good thing
Why should my taxes support Ukraine, Israel or any other country?
screenmonkey@reddit
You probably have 1776 somewhere in your vehicle, and 3% as well. Why should France's taxes help the colonial rebellion against England?
FaceDeer@reddit
Because it is often in your country's interests. Have you not heard of things called "alliances" or "international trade"? There are tit-for-tat interactions between nations just like there are between individuals.
The value of specific cases of international aid can be be questioned, of course, it's not always a good thing. But the general case is pretty straightforward. Unless you want your country to be a hermit state you need to be able to engage with outside nations.
soonPE@reddit
in the country's interest or the war mongrels lobbyist elite from Washington DC?
I want the country to engage in free markets and business.
Did i say both, Ukraine and Israel? Don wanna somebody later on playing gymnastics and putting words where they dont belong.
FaceDeer@reddit
You said "Why should my taxes support Ukraine, Israel or any other country?" Making your question very generic and broad. So my answer was very generic and broad.
I also said that specific cases can be questioned. But as a general rule, my answer fits. The reason countries spend money supporting other countries is because they derive some benefit from that. In the case of Ukraine the benefit is that Russia's aggression is deterred and contained so that you don't end up having to fight them in the Baltics instead, and so that other countries don't get the idea that conquering neighboring countries is a good idea that'll work out well for them. That's a solid benefit.
soonPE@reddit
in the case of Ukraine, the benefits go to Zelenski personal accounts, and most of Washington politicians
in the case of Israel, the same, just remove Zelenski and place with somebody else
susanrez@reddit
If US cuts all aid, Poland and probably Finland jumps in to defend Ukraine because they know they’re next on Putin’s list. Then WW3 is off to the races. And yes DonOld is too stupid to see it coming.
susanrez@reddit
If US cuts all aid, Poland and probably Finland jumps in to defend Ukraine because they know they’re next on Putin’s list. Then WW3 is off to the races. And yes DonOld is too stupid to see it coming.
Flux_State@reddit
He's terrified of Putin.
StupendousMalice@reddit
Which is why Ukraine will be fielding their own nuclear weapons within the next two months. They have everything they need to do so and they have announced as much already.
OilInteresting2524@reddit
Yeah..... the EU isn't down for that. And while trump can inflict russian pain on Ukraine, the EU will step up and protect their own.
EntireAd8549@reddit
I don't think so. EU is not NATO, and Ukraine is not part of EU.
belleweather@reddit
They absolutely will. Because if it wasn't Ukraine being invaded -- and if they don't stop Russia at the borders of Ukraine -- it's going to be the Baltics and Finland next. And then Poland. Europe is very, very clear about that, take a look at their statements some time.
Tytoalba2@reddit
Unlike Ukraine, that would trigger art5
FaceDeer@reddit
So don't you think it'd be a good idea to stop Russia before it comes to that?
Tytoalba2@reddit
Yes I do actually
Embarrassed-Aspect-9@reddit
Yes it would but the US would be extremely likely not to honor the obligations if it does go nuclear.
HiltoRagni@reddit
Many in Europe don't trust the US to honor article 5 any more. We see you as unreliable allies only out for your own interests.
EntireAd8549@reddit
Poland and Finland are in NATO. I am not sure where the hysteria about invading Poland comes from. I don't know about Finland, but Poland has a very strong military. So far Russia is unable to control Ukraine, how are anyone expects they will be able to reach NATO countries and believe they would be sucessful? In order to go after Poland (and NATOP forces, even without US), they would have to stop what they are doing in Ukraine.
Guglielmowhisper@reddit
Is this some Eastern European trauma based hysteria the rest of the world doesn't quite get?
Artistic-Blueberry12@reddit
Ukraine is already a candidate nation with many European leaders asking for the application to be accelerated. They are hoping for Ukraine to join in 2030.
Try doing some research.
FrostingFun2041@reddit
When Trump gets in the deal, it will end up being Russian stops attacking and retreating 10 miles from current held positions and that Russia agrees not to advance again in exchange for not allowing Ukraine into Nato for next 20 years. Russia has always asserted it wouldn't allow Nato to touch its borders and consider it against its national security. It would be the equivalent of Mexico joining an alliance with Russia and allowing Russian troops and missiles on the US Mexico border.
EntireAd8549@reddit
Thanks, I don't need doing more research on the country that is my neighbor :) Yeah, I know they applied and have hopes, but applying does not equal being accepted. And there is a long way to 2030. Not sure if you noticed, but EU was as interested in Ukraine and its affairs for the last few decades. I don't agree with those politics, but that's what it is. And this is why I honestly don't think Europe will drop everything and go 100% helping Ukraine (just like they didn't even blink in 2014).
pushpullem@reddit
The EU has no balls and has been hiding behind the US's skirt for decades.
They aren't even contributing as much as the US financially and you think they are gonna put boots on the ground. Lol.
RoughRomanMeme@reddit
Lmao a crock of shit for nutrition. That’s a hilarious analogy
HiltoRagni@reddit
That's simply not true, while the US is the largest single contributor the EU (EU institutions + member states) has contributed about 30% more in total.
Also false. You can find many videos of Leopard tanks and Marder IFVs involved in the Kursk offensive for example.
pushpullem@reddit
So both the things I said are true and you are just straight up wrong about what I said about Germany.
They literally reiterated [yesterday]](https://www.dw.com/en/ukraine-updates-germany-still-a-no-on-long-range-missiles/live-70806745) that Ukraine can't use their weapons in Russia.
synapticfantastic@reddit
Ummm... How are you so uninformed?
Sleddoggamer@reddit
The time to completely dictate the terms Russia could demand to end the war was probably before the U.S. election. I don't think Russia will care if European influence is extended if Russia knows it can get away with drafting troops from other nations without the European army reaching US numbers and inserting it's own troops before they can try dig in again, assuming there confidant half the funds for the war effort are removed and there isn't a way for Ukraine to aquire armenent that doesn't have a equal
Sleddoggamer@reddit
The EU is genuinely going to be Ukraines' last real hope, and I don't think it'll step down when Ukraine is the barrier between Russia and Europe, but I think it's too late in the game to expect Europe to be able to dictate the terms Ukraine can end the war on
There's still too many leftists who sneer at the idea of putting 100k formal troops together for the eastern borders, and the Russian sympathizing communist party will probably get a second wind before Europe can parallel American stockpiles in a way that can completely seal the borders
Division2226@reddit
They should have stood up to protect their own a long time ago.
Artistic-Blueberry12@reddit
The EU has been making massive contributions to Ukraine since the invasion, considering they have smaller economies compared to the US they're almost giving more proportionally.
slap-a-taptap@reddit
>almost giving more
So they're giving less?
HiltoRagni@reddit
Nah, proportionally they are giving way more, the US isn't even in the top 15. Source.
ocean_yodeller@reddit
Nope. See history for evidence of European attempts to appease dictators
oppressed_white_guy@reddit
Really hoping you're right
Tiny_Independent2552@reddit
But then Putin will go after Poland. He’s already made his intentions clear. They can stop the war in Ukraine, and give Russia what they want, but it will not stop the ruthless dictator from finding his next victim.
None of this will end well. Taking prepping to the next level now.
Bigironstonks@reddit
Good. Ukraine shouldn’t be a concern of the United States. We have a plethora of our own problems to deal with. This war is only happening because we need to fuel the military industrial complex. Rather interesting that as soon as we left Afghanistan we found a new place to spend money on for the military.
ExistentialDreadnot@reddit
>This war is only happening because we need to fuel the military industrial complex.
Man, I didn't realize the U.S. military industrial complex ordered the Russian military to invade Ukraine.
Got any other brilliance to share with us?
Bigironstonks@reddit
lol ok. Go check all the manipulation and propaganda the US has done in Ukraine prior to 2014. You idiots seem to not understand that without an enemy, the military spending is pointless, and when you can’t spend money on the military then you can’t make money in politics 👍
ExistentialDreadnot@reddit
What part of this edgy enlightened centrist Chomsky-esque bullshit has to do with Russia being an imperialist nation engaged in a deliberate war of aggression of its own choosing?
Also, prior to 2014, Ukraine was ran by a literal Russian puppet.
Effective_Raise_889@reddit
How is that bad? Im not pro-Russia, but all the US is doing is fighting to the last Ukrainian.
OldWarrior@reddit
Finding a way to de-escalate this situation and push for peace is best for all except perhaps Zelensky.
marvinrabbit@reddit
The promise of "Peace for our time."
averagemaleuser86@reddit
That's exactly what's going to happen. Trump is in cahoots with Putin, we all know that. That's exactly why Biden went ahead and lifted the ban now on these munitions.
nightshadet_t@reddit
That was always going to happen unless a foreign government actually put boots on the ground instead of just funding the war
RIPMHVG@reddit
That's going to happen anyway, might as well save some lives.
Boredandhanging@reddit
That’s 100% what he’s going to do
Onlyroad4adrifter@reddit
He would allow Russia to attack the US again. This time with nuclear weapons.
BallsOutKrunked@reddit
one of macnamara's lessons in Fog of War was "rationality will not save us"
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
Neither will being afraid of other world leaders and de-escalating/negotiating with ruthless dictators which has failed countless times.
All this time, Obama, Biden de-escalated with Putin, and what has it yielded? More compliance by Putin/Russia/China? No the opposite: they've been escalating.
Do not de-escalate with dictators. They only understand strength.
nunyabizz62@reddit
The planet you live on, the weather nice there?
The US has done nothing but escalate over and over, the US started it with a coup replacing the elected leader with a russia hating nazi, ginned up and armed those nazis and gave Russia no other choice. Russia tried for 8 years and tried every possible diplomatic solution. The US again and again lied and escalated at every opertunity. This is 100% the fault of the US.
LilTardy69@reddit
Not sure why you’re being downvoted. We are all programmed to think we’re the goodbye but we have escalated every step of the way. Including bailing on missile treaties, Color revolutions, tanking peace talks. Putin isn’t a good guy, but neither are we.
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
Hold up everyone lil Tardy has chimed in.
We have escalated by witnessing Russia invade their neighbor and Putin writing a whole 10 page article on the internet explaining how Russian Empire's borders from 1765 are appropriate.
LilTardy69@reddit
Nothing about the steps that lead to the invasion huh? Interesting. You seem to know your stuff. And just a lil tardy.
nunyabizz62@reddit
Because most in this country are utterly clueless to what's actually happening.
They swallow the corporate media propaganda hook line and sinker
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
No you're just both wrong.
OkWelcome6293@reddit
You’d have to be an idiot to want to be associated with Russia rather than the EU.
nunyabizz62@reddit
Well the vast majority of the planet is behind Russia because they aren't fooled by the propaganda of the US.
This is 100% the fault of the US and everybody knows it. Germany has completely destroyed itself following the US off a cliff.
The majority of the businesses in Germany have closed. Its stark raving insane what the US and NATO countries are trying to pull, and for what?
US oil companies?
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
Your submission has been removed for breaking our rules on civility, trolling, or otherwise excessively hostile.
Name calling and inflammatory posts or comments with the intent of provoking users into fights will not be tolerated.
Comments that discourage others from prepping, demean them, or otherwise harm genuine discussions are not permitted and will be removed. A common example of this is discussions involving "nuclear war". If your "prep" involves suicide or inaction, keep your fatalistic commentary to yourself.
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honorable__bigpony@reddit
Russia is not a global power. It is a nuclear armed petrostate.
I agree, the US has issues. Specifically, our own oligarchs have been given the keys to plunder our economy at the expense of the middle class.
But that has nothing to do with Russia.
Also, the EU is providing far more support to Ukraine than the US.
Just out of curiosity, where do you get your dose of media propaganda?
Objective-Tea5324@reddit
RT and FB no doubt.
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
Hmm a really long paragraph where everything up is down. US and EU and the western world are all wrong and attempting to make oil profits--but Russia the gas-station mafia state that runs propaganda media outlets around the world because they cannot win a conventional war--are the good guys?
Up is down. Down is up.
Good is bad but bad is good?
OkWelcome6293@reddit
Press X to doubt.
Press X to doubt.
Germany “destroyed” itself cozying up to Russia with gas deals and shuttering their own nuclear power, going 100% on hydrogen power when it wasn’t ready, and failing to make commitments to growth.
Also, 1% GDP growth is a strange definition of “destroyed”.
Press X to doubt.
Maidan happened because Ukraine wanted to join the EU, not the US or NATO.
Sampsky90@reddit
Yes, the weather here on Earth is pretty nice. Not sure what planet you're on, though, if you legitimately think the US started this conflict. Why not talk to Putin about his attempt to keep Russian puppet Viktor Yanukovych installed as president of Ukraine in 2014? You know, the guy that the Ukrainian people overwhelmingly wanted removed from power during the Euromaidan protests. The same one who fled to Russia when his game was up. The Ukrainians have a right to self-determination. It's what they chose and what they earned. Lootin' Putin is the one who has been escalating this whole thing from the start all because he couldn't get his way.
nunyabizz62@reddit
I know for an absolute fact the US started it. You're clueless
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
Your submission has been removed for breaking our rules on civility, trolling, or otherwise excessively hostile.
Name calling and inflammatory posts or comments with the intent of provoking users into fights will not be tolerated.
Comments that discourage others from prepping, demean them, or otherwise harm genuine discussions are not permitted and will be removed. A common example of this is discussions involving "nuclear war". If your "prep" involves suicide or inaction, keep your fatalistic commentary to yourself.
If the mod team feels that you are frequently unhelpful or cause unnecessary confrontation, you may be banned. If you feel you are being trolled or harassed, report the comment and do not respond or you may be sanctioned as well. The report function is NOT meant for you to fall back on if you start losing an argument. Similarly, if you are rude and hostile, then report someone for being the same, you may face the same punshment as them, if any.
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Throwaway118585@reddit
“Absolute fact” - what you’ve been told by people manipulated by foreign powers
Adorable_Ad_9381@reddit
This! And Putin started this years earlier by stealing Crimea. Why nobody did anything then will be a major question in history books of the future.
idfuckingkbro69@reddit
Were you dropped on your head as a child? How does anyone become this profoundly retarded?
nunyabizz62@reddit
Buh bye
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ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
Do you really believe Zelenskyy is some Nazi who led a career of comedy etc.?
I mean when you say these things, do you believe people reading it are that stupid?
Clever_Commentary@reddit
And with Groysman, also Jewish. (Ukraine is the only county besides Israel to have both a Jewiah head of state and of government.
Now, being Jewish doesn't mean you cannot be a Nazi-- the original Nazis apparently retained several Jewush generals--but it makes it much harder.
FindingMindless8552@reddit
If Russia had plans of setting up bases near the Mexican border , what would we do?
Astrosurfing414@reddit
The issue here is, Mexico wouldnt allow that as a sovereign country. Former Bloc nations flocked to NATO for obvious reasons; protection from Russia.
Ref; See Finland joining NATO.
FindingMindless8552@reddit
My point was Ukraine expressing interest in NATO, which would lead to the US setting up bases right on Russia’s doorstep.
Astrosurfing414@reddit
Yea, and your point absolutely sucks!
FindingMindless8552@reddit
Keep swallowing the propaganda from the military industrial complex and billionaires that you hate. Fucking moron.
Astrosurfing414@reddit
Get off the Kremlimonade.
FindingMindless8552@reddit
I don’t give a shit about Russia, but let’s not pretend this war started because Russia wants to take over Europe or whatever you psychopaths are believing.
https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/feb/28/nato-expansion-war-russia-ukraine
Here’s a link in case you’re still not understanding or just stupid.
Astrosurfing414@reddit
Do you have any idea who Ted Galen Carpenter is?
He’s a pro-Russian Libertarian quack that got fired by his own think-tank of 37 years for making outrageous, grossly incorrect statements around Ukraine.
FindingMindless8552@reddit
Does that make anything he said unequivocally false then? Oh wait, you never read it. You just saw the author and stopped there because you’re a fucking moron
Astrosurfing414@reddit
Yes it does.
NATO is a defensive alliance.
That alone ends any argument of “aggression”. The reality is Russia wanted its own sphere of influence where they could meddle, invade and control - depriving any satellite state of a due democratic process.
How about you discuss Russia’s complete ban on Ukrainian imports prior to Euromaidan, which lead to strong arming the Ukrainian government into abandoning its EU agreement?
Viktor was elected as the most corrupt democratic leader in the world per Transparency International and still understood democracy and EU ascension was the better path for Ukraine.
Until the Russians decided it wasn’t.
FindingMindless8552@reddit
Right, so you agree it would be fine then if Russia started setting up defensive alliances around the United States ? As long as it’s a “defensive alliance”
Astrosurfing414@reddit
They can try, and they have - who wants in? Cuba?
You live in fantasy world.
KoozDoingBetter@reddit
Ukraines constitution didn't allow it to join NATO until it was amended after Russia invaded. If you can't get basic facts right, your opinion isn't worth considering.
BookMonkeyDude@reddit
Honestly? Likely not much. You don't scare us... we outclass Russia in every single way and a few hundred conscripts parked near our border is likely far less of a security threat to us than the actual cartels operating there now.
See, I think this is what really bothers Russia... they keep this paranoid delusion that this is all just maneuvering to somehow subjugate them. The truth is, nobody wants them... they'll never be worth the effort to invade, hell they're barely worth the pain in the ass it is to trade with them. Fuck.
FindingMindless8552@reddit
You’re a fucking joke 😂 I’m an American, and there is no world where the United States would allow for that. Russia has been invaded multiple times throughout history through Ukraine. Ukraine expressed interest in NATO which violated previous agreements between the US and Russia. WE have been provoking Russia because the military industrial complex would love that.
BookMonkeyDude@reddit
Roll over and show your belly... good dog.
Throwaway118585@reddit
Ah yes…the Jewish nazi ….hahaha that’s the fucking hilarious part…they actually run with this line
nunyabizz62@reddit
Zelensky wasn't elected in 2014. The nazis fully took over in 2014 after the US led coup that ousted Yanukovych. Just like they own Zelensky, he is a patsy a rube and if he doesn't do exactly as he is told he's dead. So he takes the millions, he does exactly what the nazis and the US tell him to do.
Those are simply the historical facts, well documented and irrefutable.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
Your post has been removed for being "Not focused on prepping/Off-Topic - Political." Try to keep posts and comments on the topic of prepping and not on politics. You may reference political events in your posts and comments as a way to lead into a discussion of prepping, but the main point of your post or comment should not be about politics.
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Throwaway118585@reddit
Bahaha oh man…you really didn’t look into this at all did you. All I’ll say is look up where Yabukovych lives now. Then tell me how many ex Ukrainian presidents live in the USA… it’s ok..I’ll wait.
Comfortable_Try8407@reddit
Your take doesn’t take into consideration the will of Ukrainians, only super powers. Ukraine obviously cares about sovereignty or they wouldn’t be fighting still. That government has the support it needs from the people.
And all your BS about interference! Russia, China, and a host of other nations peddle propaganda on social media in the USA just as much as any U.S. entity does overseas. People like you only want to call out the USA for it but not any other country. Giving power to the people of Ukraine was the right thing.
The only escalation that matters is Russia invaded a sovereign nation and they are paying a high price.
nunyabizz62@reddit
63% of Ukrainians want peace talks.
And the only reason its that low is because the percentage of full blown nazis in Ukraine is at least on par with 1930s Germany.
Maybe you should step away from watching corporate media propaganda for awhile.
Watch something educational like the two documentaries done many years ago explaining all this in great detail.
Ukraine on Fire
https://youtu.be/IwZApPCFXIc?si=d3IakAbCxBQ8Y1So
Revealing Ukraine
https://youtu.be/jhu3lfgHhCI?si=0CN5_XDtjbaQCFSs
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
Your post has been removed for being "Not focused on prepping/Off-Topic - Political." Try to keep posts and comments on the topic of prepping and not on politics. You may reference political events in your posts and comments as a way to lead into a discussion of prepping, but the main point of your post or comment should not be about politics.
You are welcome to reformat your comment to fit into the sub rules and resubmit.
Feel free to contact the moderators if you would like clarification on the removal reason.
numaxmc@reddit
Godamn your comment history is like a comedy thread. Tell your last two brain cells I said hi.
nunyabizz62@reddit
And buh bye
/blocked
Puzzleheaded-Age249@reddit
Lol, Zelensky the Jewish nazi, go back to fucking your whore mother in Moscow you trifling little bitch.
nunyabizz62@reddit
And buh bye, /blocked No time for the too far gone. Time for your 15th booster
Danteruss@reddit
What having an intravenous line of RT news straight into you does to a mf
BackgroundActuary687@reddit
You call poking Russia with getting Ukraine to join NATO de-esculation? Thats exactly how this started.
America: hey, come join NATO Ukraine: okay! Russia: that’s a national security risk. America: to bad
Now replace America with china, Ukraine with Mexico and Russia with an America and let me know how that turns out.
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
Biden tried to tell Putin that Ukraine won't be joining NATO... Yet they still invaded. So don't lie.
GigsandShittles@reddit
Obama and Biden deescalated this whole time? Wow man what world have you been living in? $120,000,000,000 in 2023 alone. We've had open talks about Ukraine joining NATO. Every time Putin sets a red line, we soar past through it... you're delusional.
Now here come the downvotes for speaking rationally.....
Opposite-Program8490@reddit
When those weapons were earmarked as defensive use only? Yes, that is backing an ally without escalating.
The country that invaded is responsible for this war. If they can shoot missiles across the border, they basically gave Ukraine a blank check to do the same.
Why the Russian apologism?
GigsandShittles@reddit
It's not Russian apologism. It's taking a realistic view of the situation. You're not taking into account what led up to the invasion. Our involvement in trying to bring NATO to our enemy's border, and then act shocked when fucking Russia of all countries decide to invade? The West definitely had a large part in the whole story.
Ukraine has every right to defend itself, but I don't think we should be funding it. While I do agree that the aid is technically defensive, this wouldn't have happened in the first place if we hadn't very obviously tried to bring NATO to Russias border. Even just now we've approved long range missiles into Russia.... Moscow has been attacked by bomb drones as well. Ukraine is currently invading parts of Russia as well.
We should've been trying to lead peace talks early in the conflict, but the US and Britain squashed that when both Zelensky and Putin were willing to talk. Remember, at that point, our own leaders were saying how great of a position we're in to wear down our adversary without giving up American lives. I've been saying from the beginning that this could easily be a catalyst to WW3.
Objectively speaking, Ukraine wasn't strategically important to us in the first place. It wasn't worth the risk for us to have gotten so friendly with them from the beginning. Now, at this point, our position globally may be riding on Ukrainian victory. We should've never gotten ourselves in this position in the first place.
proweather13@reddit
How can NATO threaten Russia because Ukraine is in it?
Opposite-Program8490@reddit
Neville Chamberlain would be proud.
donkula232323@reddit
Russia has broken every peace deal it has made. But the next one will definitely work!
ride_electric_bike@reddit
I can't see how anyone thinks what's been going on the last three years could be considered descalation
Capable_Extension246@reddit
Just make sure you’re one of the first to enlist in the infantry since you’re so brave.
Sydneysweenysboobs@reddit
So are you volunteering to go to the front lines?
bvogel7475@reddit
There won't be a front line if Nukes are used. The best thing is to keep providing weapons to Ukraine. Let's give the F-35's and hundreds of Apache helicopters to rain down destruction on the Russian invaders. Any peace treaty just gives Putin time to beef up his arsenal.
randomaccount6777@reddit
This is the best take, some people forget Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons post soviet collapse (~1994?) to gain support from the US and Russia and what has it yielded Ukraine in terms of relations with Russia now? Any peace treaty is just another ceasefire before somewhere else gets taken (Ex: Appeasement policy pre ww2). Giving weapons doesn't cost us anything other than our already existing military spending and doesn't cost more people other than the ones already affected.
ImpressiveFishing405@reddit
And we get to field test weapons in real battlefield conditions against a near peer adversary, while simultaneously degrading their capacity for further actions at a significant discount of cost, clearing our back inventory of older systems, and without deploying American soldiers to the ground. Like there is no reason not to support Ukraine tactically or strategically.
conbobafetti@reddit
I think a lot of people don't know this.
CarmenCage@reddit
Dude I am, but since I have either adhd or bipolar disorder, either way no one wants me. I am 100% ready to take ‘salt pills’ and be up for days. In fact you could say I’ve been training for it my entire life.
xUncleOwenx@reddit
You're insane to gamble billions of lives
Paul-Smecker@reddit
You’re both gambling with the same amount of lives….
xUncleOwenx@reddit
How
Paul-Smecker@reddit
Neither of you really know if appeasement or direct confrontation will lead to one outcome over the others. Since the amount of human lives on earth are constant in both scenarios, you are both gambling the same amount of lives.
xUncleOwenx@reddit
I see. You must have a Ph.D. in probability for such an insightful analysis.
Zealousideal_Tree_14@reddit
I think your point still stands. The choice itself is the gamble, regardless of which way you bet. Reasonable people might disagree as to the odds of the bet, but you're gambling nevertheless.
Additionally the world is a crazy place, and there is no such thing as a sure thing, so everything is a bit of a gamble. I think you've got a fair perspective.
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
Of course we know. A dictator is an animal. They do not play friendly with other nations. They have no interest in listening to the US and making deals with the US. They are animals with basic brain material. Otherwise if they were geniuses or smart, they would have been easily able to make friends with Western nations that follows the rule of Mutual Benefit in nature. Animals that work together tend to have Mutual Benefit.
But a dictator is worse than a mutually-benefitting animal. A dictator IS A PARASITE. A parasite that feeds off the funds of his own people's tax money for glory (emotional gain) by showing the world how scary he is and how powerful he is. He cares about how his power looks--not whether his power benefits his people or not.
Therefore, appeasement can never work on a parasite. A parasite does not ADHERE to mutual-benefit it adheres to exploiting others, aiming primarily for its own glory/emotions/wellbeing. A parasite hates it when others also benefit from the share of the pie.
Direct confrontation is something a parasite understands. Because it is a dangerous organism that requires emotions and glory. It cannot withstand being embarrassed or confronted. Because in reality, their need for glory, emotions, power, control, is a creation of their fear. Their fear of losing control. Their fear of being brought down from power. Their fear of losing glory and emotional satisfaction. The parasite has FEAR.
In contrast, the Western nations are after logical reasoning for mutual-benefit. This rule forces Western nations to wonder if there was a misunderstanding in the logical reasoning that caused Russia or China or dictatorships to suddenly become hostile despite the great benefits they were afforded by trading with the US and EU. But the reasoning for the hostility by China and Russia is NOTTTT logical reasoning... It is parasitic. It is emotional. Therefore, confrontation is required, not appeasement, because it is ultimately their fear that drives them to evil, hatred, hostilities with the West. They're afraid. So strike them even further with fear, not with being nice--because they are an animal, a parasite, that only understands pain, not gestures or gifts or deals or words.
If I was wrong -- if I was wrong, then they would have been best friends with Bush or Obama or Biden or Trump or others who appeased them. They would have seen it as a great sign of friendship and mutual benefit. Instead of drifting further and then lying about the reasoning by claiming "NATO expansion" etc.
That is basically proof of why "appeasement" will NOT work.
dwilliams202261@reddit
Take the L, ur on the wrong side dude.
xUncleOwenx@reddit
No I'm not
Old_Baldi_Locks@reddit
Zero dictators in history were stopped by appeasement.
NotAMeatPopsicle@reddit
Repeating failed policies is truly insane.
Explaining2Do@reddit
But the US LOVES dictators, they support them all over the world.
SiouxStreet_Bets@reddit
Obama and Biden de-escalated when? They have only escalated the conflict with Russia. Putin said 9 months ago that the war would be over within a week US aid to Ukraine stopped.
HiltoRagni@reddit
Putin also said in early February 2022 that he's obviously not going to invade Ukraine, what makes you believe the "within a week" statement is any more truthful than that?
SiouxStreet_Bets@reddit
He said that he wouldn’t invade Ukraine if they didn’t join NATO. What happened in September 2022?
jus13@reddit
?
Russia invaded in Feb 2022, Ukraine didn't join NATO, still isn't in NATO, and had no roadmap before the invasion to join NATO. Western countries wouldn't have allowed it before either due to your same escalation fears that they've now abandoned after seeing that it hasn't worked since 2014, and that it has only made things worse.
Contrary to that, Russia's invasion caused both Finland (which shares a border with Russia) and Sweden to join NATO, adding two strong military forces to NATO.
You are just eating up Russia's lies, it was never about NATO.
SiouxStreet_Bets@reddit
Russia did not invade in February. They started massing at the border in preparation of Ukraine joining NATO. In September 2022 they officially started the process. It has always been about NATO
jus13@reddit
This is just a straight-up lie that makes zero sense at all, anyone can easily fact-check this. I have no idea why you would even lie about this.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#cite_note-FOOTNOTERamani202374-20
SiouxStreet_Bets@reddit
Okay I’ve been corrected. I’m not lying on purpose. I just had my facts wrong.
jus13@reddit
I dont see why anyone should listen to you on this when you have extremely basic facts wrong.
That throws off your timeline, and again, Ukraine was not in any roadmap to join NATO prior to Russia's full-scale invasion.
Russia first invaded Crimea and the Donbas in 2014, and Ukraine in 2022 was still no closer to joining NATO than they were at that time.
If it was about NATO then Russia has already lost, Finland and Sweden already joined NATO specifically due to Russia's invasion.
SiouxStreet_Bets@reddit
You are correct. I only know basic facts. If it’s not about NATO then is it about Neo-Nazi ideology in Ukraine?
HiltoRagni@reddit
Have you considered that it may have started because of imperial ambitions in Russia?
SiouxStreet_Bets@reddit
If this is the case why is Ukraine the only target? Why have they not tried to invade anywhere else?
HiltoRagni@reddit
They did invade Georgia in 2008. Finland has been preparing for another Russian invasion ever since 1939, and even though they were not in NATO they were in the EU and had very close relations with the other Scandinavian countries and the West in general so they were guaranteed to receive lots of support if they were invaded. The Baltic states managed to join NATO in time so they were protected by article 5. Belarus is already a Russian vassal state, so no point invading. If we skip Ukraine the next neighbor to the south beyond the Black Sea is Georgia, which as I mentioned Russia invaded in 2008. Then they have a very short border with Azerbaijan, then beyond the Kaspian Sea there's Kazachstan, Mongolia. China would throw a fit if Russia invaded either of those. Then there's China which they don't invade for obvious reasons and about 20 miles with North Korea. Ukraine was the low hanging fruit, one of the easiest targets they could have gone for, the one country with no clear allies and a major Russian military port already on its territory.
FloatingGardens@reddit
Because Russia intends on attempting to take back its former ussr territory, a sort of former glory they want back - a glory they never had, mind you. I know that's not the whole of it, but it is a large part. I, too, need to do more reading up. It's hard to keep up with everything happening in the world around us, but not impossible.
Canwesurf@reddit
This is categorically false. The invasion part of the war started in February, and it is extremely well documented. Putin even had soldiers in Ukraine as far back as 10 years ago even. Wtf are you on/getting your information?
PairOk7158@reddit
He invaded Ukraine in 2014.
Lord_Larper@reddit
The guy who typed this will not enlist btw
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
Do you believe in a draft? You WANT dictators controlling the world and destroying their neighbors?
Lord_Larper@reddit
Why don’t you apply that strength and force to stop the dictator? Or is that someone else’s job?
Medium_Surprise_814@reddit
I hope Trump escalates. At this point, humans don't deserve to continue.
IronDBZ@reddit
People like you want us all dead. Jesus
Old_Ad7839@reddit
Didn’t McNamara lose?
Lazy_Bread_9213@reddit
HEY, MACARENA!
arealFiasco@reddit
Or scarily enough..the complete opposite. I'll launch nukes only worry about Biden for 1 month and then negotiate with antiwar Trump who most likely will descalate...?
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
Once the nuclear seal is broken, there’s no going back. Even Trump’s hand’s would almost certainly be tied.
Reinvestor-sac@reddit
Hence why trump literally has been saying nuclear war and “nuclear warming” is quite literally the only existential threat for the us and the world. Not global warming, inflation etc.
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
What ties trump's hands? We have no defense treaty with Ukraine. He could absolutely let it happen and shrug.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
It doesn’t matter. The use of a nuke anywhere would destabilize the entire planet, which is why diplomats worked so hard in the 20th Century to prevent proliferation. Let’s say North Korea actually was actually able to aim all along. Ukraine is by default an ally/proxy of the US now. Japan is an economic colony, as is South Korea. Without retaliation, both of those nations are now targets, as North Korea may see it as a signal that the US is not willing to protect its allies and proxies from nuclear strikes.
On top of that, Ukraine probably wouldn’t be the target. The effectiveness of tactical (battlefield) nukes is debatable. The first target would likely be the UK or Poland. Maybe Germany.
flanneur@reddit
I can imagine Putin striking Kiev or some other large Ukrainian city and daring the West to respond, if he's desperate enough. A massive conventional response might suffice to discourage further nuclear conflict worldwide, but I'm not hopeful.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
A massive conventional response would result in Russia pressing the red button. You can’t win against 32 countries. Since the war has become a war of attrition a la WWI, it’s now a matter of who breaks first:
Ukrainian line collapses—>NATO intervention—>nukes fly
Russian line collapses—>nukes fly
The Russians, especially the state apparatus, view this war as existential, meaning they will not stop. A conventional NATO response would trigger a nuclear war, meaning the best we can hope for is a peace treaty before shit escalates
Better_Objective_286@reddit
And then in a few years it will start all over again. "because russia has nukes" narrative. And russia will get more just because "russia has nukes". And so on. Wasn't Crimea supposed to be a silent "peace treaty"? They saw that it worked and they went ahead for more. Russia can't be trusted anymore. They broke all signed agreements so far.
Mediocre-Magazine-30@reddit
I don't want to lose the world and my kids futures over Ukraine so I think Putin actually has a lot of leverage
Nibb31@reddit
Putin views the war as existential, but it really isn't. If Russia withdraws all its troops from Ukraine, it continues to exist and is back to business as usual.
Nibb31@reddit
You don't use nukes on cities. That would be a waste of military power. Cities are not military targets.
Tactical nukes are for tactical purposes: to stop an invasion, to break through defenses, or to destroy a naval or air base.
flanneur@reddit
Where do you think soldiers come from? Where do their leaders live? What are they motivated to protect? What are factories close to? By your logic, the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki was a ''''waste of military power''''.
Nibb31@reddit
The WW2 mass bombings of German and Japanese cities would be considered war crimes since the Geneva Conventions of 1949, and there is much controversy about the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Their psychological effect is what caused Japan to capitulate, not their military effect. Japan was militarily defeated well before August 6th 1945.
Today, terror attacks on civilian populations are not part of the military doctrine of any Western country. The primary target for a strategic nuclear exchange is to reduce the enemy's capability to retaliate: command and control centers, early warning radars, launch sites, airfields, naval bases, and carrier groups. Hitting cities would be low on the list of priorities.
Could Putin commit another blatant war crime by nuking a city? Sure, but he would instantly open himself up for retaliation, lose support from China or Iran, and there would be no pretense of a justification and no plausible denial, even for his own people.
If there is a nuclear exchange, it will be on a tactical level: to break through defenses or to repell an offensive. It will probably even be preceded by a warning shot, like a nuclear test in Siberia, just to prove and remind that they have the capability.
Knogood@reddit
In the meantime, we're gonna send em more munitions...
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
You used a whole lot of normal rationale in that reply which under normal circumstances would be absolutely true. My point is, we're dealing with trump and he both doesn't follow normal rationale and also makes incredibly poor choices.
fruderduck@reddit
That’s the only saving grace of having Trump in office. He’s so damn crazy, they really don’t know what he’ll do. It’s FAFO.
Sweaty-Feedback-1482@reddit
You’re forgetting that Trump is completely beholden to Putin. Name a single time Trump has criticized Putin… legitimately criticized him… I’ll wait
mowog-guy@reddit
get out of your bubble and stop reading pure propaganda sites for once in your life
Sweaty-Feedback-1482@reddit
So I take it you can name a single instance where Trump actually had the balls to criticize Putin… my guess is that you can’t. Seems kinda suspicious when he’s plenty willing to talk shit about everybody and anybody else.
But I’m sure it’s only a coincidence that numerous Trump associates have been indicted for various illegal interactions with Russian nationals.
The coolest thing about being a Trump supporter is that it allows you to live in a fantastical world where facts don’t matter and reality is purely subjective. “Ugh that guy online said Trump is Putin’s fuck boy… I don’t like that so instead of examining the facts I shout ‘FAKE NEWS’ even louder” you say while breathing through your mouth.
fruderduck@reddit
Oh, I entirely realize Trump, Putin, Kim and Musk are virtually bedfellows. Doesn’t make any of them any less insane or volatile.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
Braindead take. If Trump didn’t understand what was going on, he wouldn’t have been able to get the Abraham Accords signed.
Bluddy-9@reddit
Every knows Trump doesn’t want nuclear war. If Putin uses nukes it will be against Ukraine. Trump doesn’t stand on pretense. He will not retaliate on behalf of Ukraine if nukes are deployed prior to him taking office. Russia won’t use nukes after Trump takes office.
The question is what will Biden’s response be if Russia uses nukes on Ukraine prior to Trump taking office.
itsgreybush@reddit
If russia throws a nuke at any NATO country it's game on
Eeekpenguin@reddit
Game on? You will be incinerated in a full nuclear exchange and that would be the preferable outcome. Unless you rather die a slow death to radiation poisoning or starvation once our biosphere is wrecked. The stupidity of war hawks baffles the mind...
Mediocre-Magazine-30@reddit
Exactly. "Game on " are you kidding me
sparkle-possum@reddit
I mean we wouldn't have to worry about the possible outcomes of a Trump presidency then.
I was hoping more for giant meteor, but fuck it, Global Thermonuclear War 2025
/S, kind of mostly
hartguitars@reddit
I voted for giant meteor
noFOXgivenFURreal@reddit
Bring on the mothership!
WeepingAndGnashing@reddit
These were the guys protesting the Iraq war 20 years ago. Complete NPCs.
itsgreybush@reddit
Im Dessert Shield/Desert Storm Vet.
itsgreybush@reddit
The level of your stupidity baffles my mind. Do you think I'm the guy that actually decides who pushes the button? Fucking idiot. I'm stating that if russia lobs a nuke at any NATO country then it's what? Say it with me....Game on because they have to respond in kind.
You should educate yourself on NATO doctrine before you open your little mouth or better yet just continue to use your mouth to breathe through. Fucking window licker.
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
Ukraine isn't a NATO country.
itsgreybush@reddit
You're right, it's not but Poland, Germany and the UK are. London is most likely 1st target of russia.
Lost_inthot@reddit
Why London?
itsgreybush@reddit
Because Putin
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
Why wouldn't he just nuke Ukraine and not pull NATO in? The US under Biden said we wouldn't respond with nukes already.
enstillhet@reddit
Right but they were responding to a comment mentioning the UK, Poland, and Germany.
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
Nope, that was an edit he made that happened after the fact.
ctr72ms@reddit
In this case it'd be congress. We have gotten too used to presidents exceeding their power and drone striking whatever they want with no recourse. Congress votes to declare war and if Russia uses a nuke it will most likely happen. If they nuke a NATO country article 5 goes into effect.
fruderduck@reddit
Congress is going to do pretty much whatever Trump wants. The republicans own the show.
conbobafetti@reddit
They can all run to the Greenbriar, anyway. Although their families can't.
cyanescens_burn@reddit
There is some split between the new school maga repubs and the og republicans. I could see some infighting, especially with something as serious as a potential MAD situation developing.
It’s a rare case where the Congress folks (that are mostly, normally well insulated from the lives and daily concerns of the hoi polloi) will have their asses in the line too if it gets way out of hand (I’m sure they don’t want to live in their bunkers). And they are almost all ancient, and likely recall the hysteria around nukes from the Cold War; many likely remember doing drills in grade school and hiding under desks.
In that Netflix doc about the bomb they point out how that was often traumatic on some level to the kids, so that experience will likely color their perspective on the situation (anyone reading and interested should check out that series by the way).
But maybe I’m just being overly optimistic about checks and balances of our system still having some relevance.
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
You think republican controlled congress will go against trump? Nah
ctr72ms@reddit
Do I think the congress that is funded by the MIC and has given them billions for decades will vote to give them more when they know he can't be reelected and can't override them? Yes I think that vote is a sure thing. Yes alot support him but there are still tons of Liz Cheney types in office.
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
He controls whether they get reelected. He's already demonstrated the ability to get them primaried and that is why they all kiss the ring despite hating him behind closed doors. If anyone thinks he's going to disappear after this term, they are not paying attention. He will milk this cash cow until the day he dies.
stinky-weaselteats@reddit
We’re part of NATO
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
Ukraine isn't a part of NATO.
stinky-weaselteats@reddit
America is though & NATO will defend Ukraine.
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
Russia isn't going to nuke the US.
tristanbrotherton@reddit
We did sign one, it’s just not been honoured https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
We did not sign a defense treaty. That memorandum is a nonbinding, no legal consequence, pinky promise that Russia won't attack the Ukraine and provides for potential UN assistance if attacked. Clearly Russia hasn't held up it's side of the pinky promise.
maturecheddar@reddit
Because the USA would no longer have a nuclear deterrent because it has shown it will not use what had been the deterrent.
flanneur@reddit
Because it's in the US's best interest to not let every country they support without a treaty (e.g. India) get nuked without consequence?
Infinite-Bullfrog545@reddit
flanneur@reddit
My bad, I got that wrong. It'll likely happen in future unless a peace treaty forbids it.
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
My point is it's trump we're dealing with. Norms go out the window.
Mediocre-Magazine-30@reddit
What do you do then if a strategic nuke is used? Go ahead and end the world? It's tough to see a good answer. Catch 22
Nibb31@reddit
NATO could retaliate and destroy every single Russian soldier on Ukrainian soil in a couple of weeks without firing a single nuke.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
Abe Russia’s response to large scale NATO intervention would likely be a full scale launch of nukes. So we’re right back to the problem
Nibb31@reddit
Not if the NATO intervention limits itself to liberating Ukraine and makes it clear that it will not attack Russian territory.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
It would still likely result in nuclear exchange. Russia views this war as existential, regardless of what we view it as. On top of that, if the war is lost, Putin personally loses everything. You willing to roll the dice that your city won’t get fried?
Open-Attention-8286@reddit
For most politicians, I would agree. But Trump, for all his faults, literally wrote the book on brokering deals. His chances of stopping a nuclear war might not be great, but I don't think his hands would be tied.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
That’s a solid point. He was able to broker the Abraham Accords, which held until Mossad let that Hamas attack happen
haterake@reddit
Mossad let it happen? Any reliable source on that?
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
The wall was monitored 24/7 from every angle and Hamas’s communications were largely tapped. I find it incredibly difficult to believe they weren’t aware.
accushot865@reddit
The “Art of the Deal” book wasn’t written by Trump. The guy who actually wrote it has said it was written about an idealized Trump, not the actual person.
IcarusFlyingWings@reddit
Is this a joke? He literally did not write that book… it what’s ghost written by Tony Schwartz.
PurpleBee7240@reddit
I’ve struggled my entire life, and vehemently dislike what humanity has become.
nuclear winter is fine by me.
technicolortiddies@reddit
You mean UK would hit Russia & US to prevent more attacks?
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
Basically, London or a UK base would probably be Russia’s first target if they launched. The instant a nuke is launched everyone on Earth would know. If the US decided not to do anything, the UK has its own nukes. It could launch one at Russia back before London got vaporized, without the permission of any other NATO member state.
technicolortiddies@reddit
Ah I thought you were saying London would send one to each of us for even partaking in the exchange. Now I get it! Thanks.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
No, the only nation that has a policy like that is Israel. They have what’s known as the Samson Option as their nuclear policy, named for the Old Testament story of Samson in the Book of Judges, where he pulls down the temple where he’s chained in order to take out the Philistines as well as himself.
Basically, the Samson Option states that in the event that the continued existence of Israel is in question, they will launch nukes at pretty much everyone. It isn’t clear who “everyone” is, but I’d rather not see what happens if Mecca and Tehran get deleted from the map.
vamatt@reddit
Everyone would be everyone that is physically attacking in the moment.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
Maybe. We don’t know. The official doctrine is classified and kept tightly by Israeli MOD & Mossad. We genuinely won’t know until the day it’s put into action, if that day ever comes (God forbid)
technicolortiddies@reddit
You know this is terrifying and impressive at the same time. Probably be the wrong way to handle it but damned if I don’t respect them for it. That’s a shiny steel spine.
vamatt@reddit
London doesn’t even need to exist for the UK to retaliate with nukes. In addition, if Russia launches a nuke at London, than the UK will likely launch every nuke it had at Russia
grassisgreener42@reddit
Deescalate? Is that what you call it when the Fuhrer gives Putin a handjob while sucking on his balls?
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
Your comment has been removed for being "Not focused on prepping/Off-Topic - Political" as well as lack of civility. Try to keep posts and comments on the topic of prepping and not on politics or crude sexual insults.
arealFiasco@reddit
😰😳 my worry.
betterthanguybelow@reddit
Trump isn’t anti-war. He’s pro-Putin.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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es_cl@reddit
He’s pro-dictatorship and authoritarianism.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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robotmonkey2099@reddit
lol “anti-war” Trump. He’s only anti-war against Putin because they are buddies. He’s full on “wipe Palestine” out Trump in the other war.
arealFiasco@reddit
Probably right
leadretention@reddit
This.
Head_Vermicelli7137@reddit
NK sent troops and Russia just bombed more hospitals is why President Biden ok it
lord_pizzabird@reddit
Word is that Trump is not turning out to be as Pro-Russia as Putin had planned, which is why he's suddenly spiraling.
We're not sure exactly what happened, but we know that Trump called Zelensky first and then Putin. The call went so poorly for Putin that the Russian government is denying it ever happened, while the US press is insisting that it did.
One theory I've seen is that Putin had just endorsed Kamala for president recently. This may have ticked off Trump. Meanwhile Trump and Zelensky seem to get along well. It's been reported for a while that Trump like's Zelensky, basically thinks he's a "cool guy".
It's crazy to think about, that an entire countries sovereignty and future is hinging on whichever leader complimented Trump more.
Negative-Departure-1@reddit
Watch Russia use nukes and the rest of the world do nothing but “condemn” their actions. I recon the most they will do is move to shoot down missiles over Ukraine.
rstevenb61@reddit
Small nuclear weapons will be delivered with artillery, with little to no warning.
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
Doesn't matter, it will show the world the evil of dictators. Let them go for it. Let Russia show the world their evil warmongering and cruelty.
Their complete lack of ability to just admit defeat and pull back their army back to Russian territory.
bellj1210@reddit
i wish i still had this level of optimism about the world.
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
The arc of the universe bends towards justice, but tons of terrible things can happen in between.
If I was wrong, we wouldn't be living in a free world today, thousands of years after hundreds of empires. It's because even when the whole world is just captured by tyrants -- they almost always lose control eventually.
As much as they always think of themselves as geniuses who can control millions or billions of people, there's always some unexpected people that come along and crash their dreams.
IllogicalPhysics2662@reddit
There is no arc
Mediocre-Magazine-30@reddit
It's not a movie. Jesus isn't coming. It's human nature to see it that way though. Like "things HAVE to get better " or "karma"
Mediocre-Magazine-30@reddit
Yeah I'm completely dissolutioned. The media brainwashing and control is so complete (social media #1 here) that I'm fairly sure anything can be programmed now
Aortotomy@reddit
You would have thought that attempting a coup to overthrow a legitimately elected government, being convicted of multiple felonies and openly admitting to sexual assault would have sealed the deal that someone was fundamentally unfit to hold political office yet here we stupidly are.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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KnightandBishopExch@reddit
Not that I disagree with you, just want to interject for a question-
Could any country or people currently supporting Russia be swayed against them by their use of nuclear weapons? Their media is state run so their own citizens won’t know the truth, and the same for their external allies. Facts will get spun, subverted, misconstrued, or ignored.
public pressure or opinion are useless.
Guglielmowhisper@reddit
What about against Ukrainian troops inside Russia already
NoteMaleficent5294@reddit
Why would they pull back when they have conquered territory? Ukraine was always going to lose territory. Its a war of attrition at this point, Russia is in a much better spot for it and save for third party boots on the ground, they will at the minimum continue to make small advances like they have been
Barbarian_818@reddit
AFAIK, the Russians never had artillery sized or "suitcase" nukes like the Americans did. They've always favored MIRV warheads in ballistic missiles.
For individual. tactical level nuclear strikes, they'd likely use something like one of the Kalibr cruise missiles. Most of those are purely sub-sonic, so interception is possible. But some have a second propulsion stage that is super sonic, making interception much more difficult.
therealhairykrishna@reddit
They had essentially every type of nuclear weapon type the US had. That included everything down to 1kT 152mm shells. Binned the vast majority at the end of the cold war but almost certainly have a few in storage.
uncwil@reddit
They had artillery delivered nukes until 2000. They started phasing them out in 93 and had destroyed them all by 2000. Similar to the US.
Nibb31@reddit
Russia doesn't have artillery nukes. They use Kalibr IRBMs and air launch for their tactical nukes.
tianavitoli@reddit
probably zalenskys house
Negative-Departure-1@reddit
Yeah, I’m not talking about shooting down nukes. I’m saying other nations will do very little other than maybe start shooting down missiles over Ukraine or creating a no fly zone. There will be no overwhelming response from anyone
SquirellyMofo@reddit
I’m sure Trump will write a sternly worded letter to his best bud Putin.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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ExistentialFread@reddit
Not to mention their army has been exposed for what it is
MileHighOllie@reddit
This was just the start of Ukraine sending long-range missles. You can guarantee that many more are on the way, and Russia won't sit back without responding for a couple of months.
They have been actively building and deploying nuclear shelters all over the country. Units hold 52, I believe. They are in full swing, cold war preparedness, and it can't be all for nothing.
Slivovic@reddit
A shelter will do nothing for you in a cold winter. You just die in it.
MileHighOllie@reddit
They're climate controlled
Slivovic@reddit
I meant Nuclear winter. Essentially winter for years in complete darkness and all food crop dies. They may end up eating each other at some point. If there was a nuclear war, I just hope I don’t survive the blasts, as the aftermath would be horrible.
MileHighOllie@reddit
Yeah, nobody wins here. Humans have an incredible willpower to live but at the same time have an incredible level of stupidity. It's like a fatal flaw deep inside us.
Chicago1871@reddit
I live 5 miles from downtown Chicago. Im dead on a first strike and im ok with it.
I dont wanna live some bleak nuclear winter starvation existence. Ill be one of the lucky ones.
kratz9@reddit
Nuclear winter is a myth. The only event in history that did such a thing was the Chicxulub impact that killed the dinosaurs. The impact of which was estimated at 72,000,000 MT TNT, which is 1,000,000x larger that the biggest nukes ever created*. With 25 trillion tons of material ejected from the impact and 75%of the world's forests catching fire, they estimate that the darkness only lasted 10 years or so.
Yeah nukes are scary, but they don't come remotely close to that.
*As a side note, most of the huge nukes like th 50 MT Tsar Bomba were mostly research related or just showing off. For example a Minuteman III missile contains 3 W62 warheads, which are only 170 kt. Because that's plenty to take out a city/base/etc.
conbobafetti@reddit
So we will all be eating our dogs and cats, after all. I have informed my little fat furry one snoozing beside me that he will be first, but he seems unfazed.
Embarrassed-Aspect-9@reddit
We are in the beginning if an ice age climate process, a nuclear war would only speed it up a bit, and guarantee our extinction.
conbobafetti@reddit
So we will all be eating our dogs and cats, after all.
U-47@reddit
Because the filmed a few containers with boxes on the outside doesn't mean they have any shelters in place beyond those that have been rotting away since the 80-90's.
They can't even equip their forces in Ukraine and are importing 70's era 170mm naval artillery from north korea. Those containers are at best deathtraps and at worst just containers with some paint.
AdamDet86@reddit
Maybe they used some lead paint too for added shielding from radiation?? I mean makes sense to me.
GhostofAyabe@reddit
Can't believe people are falling for this based on a random photo posted on a propaganda news site.
MileHighOllie@reddit
CNBC, Reuters, New York Post, Greek Times, Daily Mail, Yahoo, The Economic Times, London Evening Standard, US News and World Report, The Globe and Mail, Politico.....I could keep going but are all these credible western media sites just pushing Russian propaganda or is there possibly some truth?
U-47@reddit
Its propaganda that gives lots of clicks. Reuters, politico, etc. Have not seen these containers just the foto and the propaganda.
Dont call the daily mail and Yahoo news.
MileHighOllie@reddit
You should let them all know it's propaganda and your sources are credible and better than all of thiers. Maybe this is your career calling.
U-47@reddit
They know, I am allready glad I informed you :).
MileHighOllie@reddit
Good thing you're here to set the world news straight. Appreciate your service!
U-47@reddit
That's the job. But really Russian media all are propganda now. There is no independant press in Russia anymore, no independant courts or politicians. People, young and old are being jailed fot kids drawings and sayingvthey want peace. Ndws channels talk about nato mercenaries and attacking german airbases. Whst part of that propganda should you take on face value?
MileHighOllie@reddit
I'm aware of that, just confused why so many Western media sources are running with it. I find that odd and counterproductive to inform people correctly.
If everyone's wrong, then who's right?
U-47@reddit
Research and context. Critical thinking and sceptiscm. Get sources ypu trust, verify and chrck wiyh non tabloid, professional journalsm and if you can own sources near the ground. And always remember, if Russia says something its probably a lie.
MileHighOllie@reddit
Correct but when multiple highly trusted media organizations run a story that Russia is mass producing nuclear shelters it's hard to not find some truth in it cause the other possibility is our most trusted sources have turned into Russian propaganda outlets which is even more concerning.
I dont find it completely unlikely to build these cheap storage units because I believe Russia is doing so as a scare tactic and fir show. These units are the propaganda, so it's plausible they are being built to send a message instead of practical use.
U-47@reddit
But they aren't.
grapher1080@reddit
the translation is "20 people joint coffin"
Femveratu@reddit
Reminds me of the nuke sub that failed and the “anti-radiation” suits were just cheap cloth …
Mysterious_Ad7461@reddit
If Russia had anything to respond with I assume they’d have used it before instead of letting a bunch of leftover NATO stuff wipe the floor with them.
stagarmssucks@reddit
If it's the same quality as their body armor they build it's not really a shelter.
SquirellyMofo@reddit
And we just elected a clown. Yay
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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HawkGuy507@reddit
No. We elected a man who has promised peace, and can deliver, look at what he accomplished in the middle east his first term. It is no coincidence Russia is emboldened when a Democrat is in the oval office.
Clever_Commentary@reddit
Ah yes, the Middle East is in great shape. /s
I have no doubt he can deliver "peace," just as Chamberlin would have...
HawkGuy507@reddit
The middle east was in pretty good shape when he left office the first time. Obama, I mean Biden, released Iran's money and look what happened. Say what you want and down vote me into oblivion, but the truth of the matter is the world was much calmer when Trump was President. The tds many have is sad. Fuck your feelings and look at the facts.
Clever_Commentary@reddit
I definitely concur with your last two sentences.
Faqyoutoo@reddit
No, that was 4 years ago !
randynumbergenerator@reddit
This is the second time someone has referenced this, and based on the story I read it was a tour of some demonstration units with zero evidence they've been shipping shelters much less deploying them en masse.
MileHighOllie@reddit
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/russia-begins-mass-production-radiation-resistant-mobile-bomb-shelters-2024-11-19/
randynumbergenerator@reddit
So no evidence they're actually producing anything, just claims from Moscow.
MileHighOllie@reddit
I dont know if there's evidence, but a lot of Western sources seem to be running with it. I'm sure if they're being mass-produced, satellites have picked up the activity.
Two possibilities here: Western media is amplifying Russian propaganda, or it has some truth. It's up to each individual to figure that out.
Holiday_Albatross441@reddit
Ukraine has very few long-range missiles left. France reportedly just said it's going to send more of their Storm Shadow variant.
A whole forty of them.
That's about as many missiles as Russia fired in an hour the other night.
ATACMs and Storm Shadows are already below 10% effectiveness against Russian air defences, which is why they've mostly been fired at civilian targets with limited air defence in the last few months. They're basically a solved problem for the Russian military, so this whole thing is just another tedious PR exercise that will only make Russians less likely to care about what happens to Ukraine.
GhostofAyabe@reddit
Bullshit they have, stop reading stuff from News24International.com or bot generated BS.
MileHighOllie@reddit
This is from CNBC, Reuters, New York Post, US news and world report.
Otiskuhn11@reddit
“won’t sit back without responding for a couple of months”…….care to unravel that for us?
Avg_DadBod69@reddit
Russia won’t. They are spineless cowards. They know they’ll be the world pariah and that’ll be the end of Pooptin’s “glorious ruZZia”.
raMnEmetnemlEl@reddit
Those shelters are useless. Giving 48 hours of protection indicates (to me) that they are prepping for tiny tactical nukes.
bvogel7475@reddit
Nobody will want ti survive a nuclear war once they see all of their cities, food and medical care destroyed.
visceralfeels@reddit
You can thank Biden then
rycklikesburritos@reddit
It's actually probably the best time for them to use a nuke if they want to. Obviously I hope they don't, but it wouldn't give the outgoing administration enough time to do any consequential response. And the incoming administration has been bragging about how it will use diplomacy to end the war. The timing would actually allow Russia to send a message that they are willing to escalate, and then stop with one based on "negotiations" with the new administration. It would give the new administration an excuse not to further escalate by blaming it on the outgoing administration.
Littlevilli589@reddit
I’m no expert but I’m pretty sure Biden could respond within a couple hours unless Putin times a nuclear detonation to coincide with Trump’s inauguration.
rycklikesburritos@reddit
Nah, way too much red tape. If Putin nuked the US that would be true, but if he uses a nuke in Ukraine like he's threatening, that would take time to develop and get a response approved. Perhaps not months, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it within a few weeks in advance of inauguration day.
Littlevilli589@reddit
I think the severity of a nuclear strike anywhere in the world would warrant immediate action. It’s been 80 years since we dropped the nukes on Japan and those are the only two nuclear bombs used in combat in history. The president is commander in chief and needs no approval to use our own nukes if he so wished. He’s not going to wait for congress to gather and debate to impose more sanctions or declare war. He’s going to have his cabinet and top generals in a meeting within the hour to make a decision as quick as possible. There’s no tape in a scenario like that.
rycklikesburritos@reddit
There is a 0% chance that the US is using nukes based on a nuclear strike in a non-nato country. They'll try anything and everything else to react, but they're not nuking unless they have to, which they wouldn't have to. If Putin uses a nuke, there is a 99.9% chance it will be a tactical nuclear weapon in Ukraine that is only determined to be nuclear days after it's been used. He's not jumping straight to strategic nuclear weapons.
I get that a lot of people are hypothesizing this as a worse case scenario, a strategic nuclear attack on NATO, but that's not what's going to happen in the next step. That's about 10 steps of escalation down the line.
Littlevilli589@reddit
I think the severity of a nuclear strike anywhere in the world would warrant immediate action. It’s been 80 years since we dropped the nukes on Japan and those are the only two nuclear bombs used in combat in history. The president is commander in chief and needs no approval to use our own nukes if he so wished. He’s not going to wait for congress to gather and debate to impose more sanctions or declare war. He’s going to have his cabinet and top generals in a meeting within the hour to make a decision as quick as possible. There’s no tape in a scenario like that.
TXSyd@reddit
They’ll wait till January 19th so there will be no time for Biden to launch a response before Trump comes in and hand waives Russia’s actions
the_real_dairy_queen@reddit
I feel like Trump would be pissed if they actually nuked us. Even if he and Putin are buddies, you still get upset if your buddy nukes the country you wee elected President of. He’d have to respond with a show of force, ya know, to show the world what a man he is.
omahaomw@reddit
Drump wouldn't care tho if the nuke hit a blue US city - Unless someone he trusts tells him to care.
rycklikesburritos@reddit
Well yeah, if they nuked the US, but they're talking about nuking Ukraine. Likely with tactical nukes.
1wrx2subarus@reddit
Perhaps, it’s time to substitute “Putin” for “Russia”.
Also, it’d be nice if industrialized powers in Europe could use their special forces equivalent to go get “Putin” and let him be tried at The Hague, International Court for War Crimes.
He belongs in Milošević‘s old prison cell. Make it so.
LeadOnion@reddit
One might also say that it was colossally stupid to invade Ukraine in the first place.
47952@reddit
A new administration that owes Putin (as has been stated).
New_pollution1086@reddit
Trying to give Ukraine a chance before Putins lil buddy takes seat in the oval.
underratedride@reddit
Still trying to push that misinformation?
RevoltingBlobb@reddit
Unless you have your head in the sand, I don't think you truly believe that's misinformation.
Trump in office said he believes Russia over western intelligence for god's sake. He tried to blackmail Zelensky and was impeached for it. He sent his buddy Vladimir covid resources before Americans had access. And more recently Vance said he would negotiate a ceasefire under Putin's terms.
Ukraine's sovereignty and security are fucked come January.
underratedride@reddit
The same intelligence folks that told us the hunter Biden laptop was fake?
The same intelligence folks that tried to say trump was a Russian asset?
Ukraine was known as the most corrupt nation on the planet until Russia invaded. Now they’ve become this hopeless bastion of freedom and western ideal? Give me a break.
RevoltingBlobb@reddit
You think Ukraine was the most corrupt nation on the planet? One nation is bombing military targets to defend itself while the invader is bombing apartments, schools and children's hospitals. I don't know if you're Russian or not, but I'll let you do your best to figure out which side history will look kindly on.
Also, I've never heard of any intelligence agencies call Trump a Russian asset. But there is certainly a difference between being an active asset as opposed to more passively being coerced, blackmailed or manipulated. I don't think Trump is on Putin's payroll, but for whatever reason, he continually advocates for Russian goals and talking points.
Simplenipplefun@reddit
(Eye roll)
Faxmesome_halibut@reddit
They can’t help being indoctrinated clowns…actually believe what they hear Jen Psaki/Rachel Maddow say.
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
Half the GOP has ties to Russia. You're either purposely ignorant of the facts, or you're a liar.
Faxmesome_halibut@reddit
Ok, crazy person.
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
Simple fact. You could do a little digging into a few dozen of the people around Trump, & right wing media, & find out, or you can just ignore our decent into fascism...
Faxmesome_halibut@reddit
You people are so unhinged and you just can’t even have a moment of introspection and see how crazy you are 😆…the country has digested and shat out the propaganda, but you’ve apparently still got a mouthful to chew on.
MayorWestt@reddit
Guess what Paul manafort was doing before he was trumps campaign manager. He was working in ukraine to get a Russian stooge elected.
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
JFC you're blind. 🙄
Deep_Stratosphere@reddit
You’re actually believing that Putler would be willing to commit suicide over Ukraine?
melodicmelody3647@reddit
But the new administration is quite friendly to Russia
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
Your comment has been removed for being "Not focused on prepping/Off-Topic - Political." Try to keep posts and comments on the topic of prepping and not on politics.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
How does that help us now?
melodicmelody3647@reddit
Was anyone asking about how to help us now? Seems irrelevant to the OP
I’m saying this is a great time to escalate things because the new administration is going to cut off the money supply to Ukraine which is perfect for Russia.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
But will Putin be sane enough to wait for the new administration to come to power? I'm betting that's a no.
melodicmelody3647@reddit
Idk you seem like you’re looking for an argument
ResidentInner8293@reddit
No, just stating the obvious which needs to be said more. People are really underestimating Putin.
melodicmelody3647@reddit
He still feels embarrassed about the fall of the Soviet Union and wants revenge and to build it back. I get it.
He’s a psychopath and doesn’t have any accountability which makes him dangerous but he’s not stupid. Hell wait till January to do anything seriously stupid
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Thats imo wishful thinking but to each their own.
pwn_plays_games@reddit
It would be colossally stupid to approve it.
JonCocktoasten1@reddit
Should Biden be in control of that kinda control though??
scoop_booty@reddit
Historically, the transition of IS presidents had marked escalation for Russian attacks as the outgoing president doesn't want to deal with the aftermath, they'd rather just punt the Putin problem to the incumbent president. Turn about is fair play. I believe Biden decided this was a hail Mary for Ukraine, as Trump will be sympathetic to Putin, seeing as how Putin has bent over a barrel. Dang, that's an awful word picture...yuk.
Tight-Reward816@reddit
Can't put the genie back in the bottle till you make 3 wishes.
Oh, btw. Russia can't launch their nuclear powered missile carrier (ship) bc there is no fuel. 🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣🦅
jareddeity@reddit
It would be colossally stupid to invade Ukraine.
za72@reddit
If they think Russia is a global pariah now wait till they launch a nuke cause their corner borscht got hit by a missile...
66hans66@reddit
Or Biden really decided to poison the well.
WeepingAndGnashing@reddit
It is colossally stupid for the Biden admin to approve the use of these missiles two months before a new government takes office, especially when they knew the incoming administration would never have approved their use.
It’s like they’re trying to start WWIII.
OutlawCaliber@reddit
Seems to me the perfect time to do it.
OwlRevolutionary1776@reddit
It was also just as easy for him to do nothing. Dumb decision once again by this administration.
AlfredTheSoup@reddit
I agree and idk why youre being downvoted. It's not our conflict, and biden doing this just put ALL of us citizens at risk of nuclear firey death. I really do not want to go out like that and I fucking HATE biden for doing that. Like he deserves some kind of death penalty or something for that action. Why the FUCK would he do that, other than to make shit difficult for trump???
thefedfox64@reddit
Once again, why would Russia invade a sovereign country. Why would Putin do that, he is putting the entire world at risk. He deserves some kind of d***h penalty.
AlfredTheSoup@reddit
Yes I agree. This is fallen upon both biden and putins and zelensky's shoulders and the rest of us innocent people should not have to suffer the consequences of old fucking idiots playinf war games with one another.
thefedfox64@reddit
I think we know who is to blame. Enough of this blame US for reacting. Blame the Russian people for electing a guy like Putin. His rhetoric, his strong arm war mongering BS. His "we are tough" mentality that caters to a lot of people. The blame is solely on Russian citizens, and we should squarely accept it.Love how Ukrainian citizens are ok to bear it, but heaven forbid any other country.
Tome_Bombadil@reddit
How dare Zelensky fight for his nation's survival.
...
Only one of those 3 started a war.
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ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
Stop believing Russian propaganda. Putin ain't gonna do shit, he's already having to use NK troops & weapons, & Iranian weapons. Using a nuke would be the end of Russia, he's not that stupid.
AlfredTheSoup@reddit
Maybe he is though! Remember, news sources reported in the past that covid fears and isolation have changed Putin, quite a bit. It was only after the pandemic that je sought to terrorize Ukranie for territory. Almost as if he felt he had somethinf to prove. I understand all the jistory behind the land and territorial claim crap, but him threatening nuclear action is scary. The dude is unhinged, and it would appear that he choses to surround himself with people that echo his opinions, similar to the proported trump project 2025. If this is the case, his advisors and subjects will only support his cause and I personally am terrified by the idea that he is actually considering nuclear war over this childish and pointless conflict. Again idk why I'm being downvoted. I'm only expressing my fear and anxiety about the whole situation. Idk why in his mind he would EVER feel that nuclear war is an "appropriate" response. I think Putin deep down knows what he is doing is wrong. I just hope his aides and advisors communicate that to him somehow. That mutually assured destruction is an immature and gravely irresponsible way to go about all of this.
All I'm saying is, I don't wanna die because of a fucking dementia ridden r-tard who made this decision for all of us without gauging how "The People" felt about all of this. If we are to be a true democracy, citizens should be able to have some sort of channel to the white house to directly express our disapproval to the president.
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
Dude, the people of Ukraine deserve the ability to defend themselves from an invading dictator. If the human race has decided to just roll over to dictators out of fear then we might as well all be dead, because we're gonna be enslaved otherwise. Grow a spine.
AlfredTheSoup@reddit
I do have a spine! I feel for Ukraine you goddamned fucking ass of a person! Are you so ignorant though to seriously give up your own life all because you feel "bad" for a nation you knw jack fucking shit about!?!? I'm not!
Whenever nuclear ANYTHING gets dropped in a diplomatic session, that is the time for regular folks to be scared and getting ready ro prepare.
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
You're scared over nothing, so where is that spine? Putin been saying this shit for years. In two months his puppet will be in the White House, he has no reason to do anything crazy now.
AlfredTheSoup@reddit
Idk I'm guessing the headlines I'm seeing on youtube and cable TV have me pretty freaked out. Leave it to the media to put the fear of God into people everywhere.
I'm glad you have thought on the matter a bit more than I have. It helps often, to have an outdide perspective on things. Thank you. :)
ad-bot-679@reddit
I don’t know. Not a military strategist but wouldn’t Biden escalating be something Trump could negotiate down to end the war? Russia you stop the invasion and we’ll stop authorizing deep strike?
Siglet84@reddit
Russia has the land it wants. If they said a ceasefire today, Russia would be happy. Russias primary goal is to keep the eastern part of Ukraine where the oil travels through so they can keep that revenue.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
Also to secure a year-round warm water port. The smart thing the Kremlin did was never concretely define victory conditions, meaning the leaders probably won’t have to deal with getting Romanov’d when they don’t take over Ukraine entirely.
The war has gone pretty badly for Russia, and with 500,000+ casualties, 2,000,000+ fleeing, and terminal demographic collapse, if Russia walks away from this and her people feel like the war was a failure, the Kremlin’s leadership is probably fucked.
Siglet84@reddit
I believe they have that with Sevastopol.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
They have it de facto, but not de jure. For it to be secure Ukraine would need to recognize it as Russian territory.
Siglet84@reddit
Thing is, it’s almost impossible to invade crimea as the land between it and Ukraine is mainly swamp. There is narrow tracts of land that are used to access it that would be one hell of a choke point. Crimea wasn’t technically part of Ukraine in the first place, it was its own sovereign country.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
That is factually incorrect. After the Soviet Union’s collapse in 1991 and the creation of the modern Ukrainian state, Crimea was recognized as sovereign Ukrainian territory. A deal was made that leased the Port of Sevastopol to Russia, which was not renewed after Euromaidan, which triggered the annexation.
Siglet84@reddit
It was known as the autonomous republic of crimea, it had its own government and its own constitution.
myhouseisunderarock@reddit
“The Autonomous Republic of Crimea is an autonomous parliamentary republic within Ukraine[4] and was governed by the Constitution of Crimea in accordance with the laws of Ukraine.”
Literally from the Wikipedia page. It was granted greater autonomy, just like Iraqi Kurdistan is granted greater autonomy but is still part of Iraq (source: I’ve been there). It did not have the full rights of a nation-state.
jtshinn@reddit
Russia, and specifically Putin, will not be happy with eastern Ukraine. He set out to take the country and stopping halfway there would be viewed as a loss to his oligarchs and opponents at least if possibly not to the Russian people.
zethren117@reddit
Putin has stated that he thinks Ukraine isn’t even a legitimate country, I doubt this ends before he takes all of it. Either that or he retreats, but I’m not sure that’s as likely as the former especially with Trump coming into office soon and likely rolling over to Putin’s wishes.
Siglet84@reddit
He will take a ceasefire to gain some land, build up forces and try again, well someone else will probably be the one to try again as I doubt he has another 10 years in him.
Joe_Exotics_Jacket@reddit
According to ISW, Putin is still pursuing maxmalist objectives. He wants more than 20% of the edges, he wants to neutralize the whole of Ukraine.
kvolz84@reddit
Im not sure about that. Turkey proposed a cease fire a few days ago. The conflict would be frozen on the front lines now, ukraine can't join Nato for at least 10 years (basically while putin will remain alive), and international troops monitor the ceasefire zone. Russia said they will not agree to freezing the front lines as is
xopher_425@reddit
It was Trump's idea. It was a 20-year freeze on Ukraine’s NATO bid, and among other things letting Russia keep the land they've stolen so far and a not patrolled by US or UN forces.
Siglet84@reddit
Turkey doesn’t really have any power to do that. It’s going to take a lot more of nato to orchestrate it. Turkey also isn’t a very respected country within nato.
jtshinn@reddit
He probably won’t either way. Ukraine is a pretty gigantic neon sign to china that the us isnt going to roll over to countries that it’s protecting. Makes the calculation on Taiwan much more expensive.
EmergencyAnimator326@reddit
Nah He should have given permission when they First send them and He shouldnt have anounce IT.
Fantastic-Series9339@reddit
I think it was a great decision. Ukraine shouldn't be forced to fight with their hands tied.
Bubskiewubskie@reddit
Russia is full of pusssy boyyyyyysssssss……pusssssy boyyyyys!!!!
fantamaso@reddit
A dick move. It’s like the corpses can’t leave the office without further driving the situation into shits.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
U think Biden approved it? That's cute
glasshalfbeer@reddit
He literally did. The current administration sent offensive weapons for the express purpose of
ResidentInner8293@reddit
It's likely not him since he's supposedly not fit to run against Trump. Maybe its Kamala? She is next in command after all when the president isn't capable.
TyrionsGoblet@reddit
I think its adorable that you believe any of these Muppets make the calls.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
I'm right then, it wasn't Biden
TyrionsGoblet@reddit
100% right. But it wasn't the laughing woman who couldn't pick an accent and stick to it.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Perhaps you are right. Either way if this goes south we are going to suffer the consequences.
TyrionsGoblet@reddit
Feel it in my bones, storms brewing, thought it for a while. The last few weeks now topped with this. I feel like we are watching a plot of a bad KDrama unfold.
intothewoods76@reddit
Biden possibly approved it because if nuclear war pops off he can invoke martial law and stop Trump from becoming the next president.
zethren117@reddit
If nuclear war begins then it really doesn’t matter who is president for all that much longer.
kvolz84@reddit
If nuclear war pops off, not sure anyone who survives gonna be worried about Presidents anymore. The world would be a waste zone. And Biden could have found plenty of reasons to stop trump but has already agreed to a peaceful transfer of power because he respects this is how the people voted.
Inevitable_Shift1365@reddit
Yep
jmi60@reddit
Russia is like a child throwing stones from his parent's porch.
Representative-Cost6@reddit
Serious question time. Why hasn't someone just taken Putin out? We have 24/7 satellites over Russia. I would be willing to bet one of our 3 letter agency's know his location most of the time.
Censoredplebian@reddit
Here we go…
catullus-sixteen@reddit
Cool. Let’s cut to the chase. Sooner I hear that Putin fell out a window the better.
Original-Turnover-92@reddit
Do it! Let Biden declare a national emergency so we can postpone the Trump admin for 4 more years just like how Trump postponed the Jan 6th sentencings.
Reduntu@reddit
They also threated to follow up with nukes if
We helped Ukraine at the start of the war
If we gave tanks to ukraine
If we gave F16's to ukraine
Now if we let them use ATACMS
LetsGetNuclear@reddit
With the tables turning towards Russia's favour, it is not in their benefit to escalate and strike at NATO members.
The real nuclear risk is from a collapsing Russia. No matter the outcome of the war, Russia is going to face something between a depression and full on collapse.
Ghost10165@reddit
Yeah the only way I think they'd actually go nuclear is if their government collapsed and Putin or someone else just goes "fuck it." They're not going to do it when they can back out or otherwise scale things back.
bellj1210@reddit
Putin is 72- strange things start to happen after 70 that you can be 100% healthy today and dead in 6 months. Not a threat just saying that he is nearing his life expectancy. As hyper rich it is likely much higher than general russian life expectancy, but that still only puts him with another 5 years or so
Kooky-Commission-783@reddit
I work with seniors. This is the thing NO one seems to think about. Say Putin even has mild dementia. This can bring about emotional changes, irritability, conflict seeking etc. we are going to learn real quick this century why our leaders should not be seniors.
Friendly_Fail_1419@reddit
My grandfather was a nice man most of the time I knew him. But when he turned 70 he suddenly started falling down conspiracy theory rabbit holes and being openly aggressive to people.
Like a light switch from rational fixer of all things to tax protestor who became obsessed with buying illegal firearms (our state had just imposed an assault rifle ban and he would modify guns just to make them illegal or seek out private purchases of illegal weapons for no reason other than belligerence).
Ok_Employment_6179@reddit
Sorry for the dumb question, but are things turning in russias favour?
LetsGetNuclear@reddit
I'm not here (on this subreddit at least) to speculate the outcome of the war or how it ends. All outcomes lead to a severe economic and demographic crisis in a country with the largest nuclear arsenal and a declining grip on power.
Street_Moose1412@reddit
Russia had a demographic crisis before the invasion. It's gotten much worse since then. Now their 2060 population could be half of what it is today.
bellj1210@reddit
and i am sure a war that sent a large portion of their youth to the front lines has only made it worse.
Ukraine has ports and wheat- the 2 things russia really needs.
ForgottenRuins@reddit
Russia is one of the top wheat producers. They produce more wheat than Ukraine. They don’t need any of what Ukraine has. Anything would be a bonus, and help corner a resource indispensable to nations around the world. Ukraine has fewer ports than Russia. All of the ports Ukraine has face the same Black Sea challenges faced by Russia for centuries: the Bosporus and ottoman/turk control.
GreatGrumpyGorilla@reddit
Can Russia controlling UKR wheat provide them with leverage over third countries?
ForgottenRuins@reddit
Why wouldn’t it? Russia already has that leverage since they export grains.
conbobafetti@reddit
Don't forget Georgia. The country, not the US state.
NickU252@reddit
Do their weapons actually work? Their troops don't, and they don't care about anything. Their threat of WW3 is a joke.
I_Smell_A_Rat666@reddit
Probably not.
Tweedledownt@reddit
I think he's talking about what happened in the election, not the reality on the ground per-say.
ModerateTrumpSupport@reddit
The ground is turning into Russia's favor slowly. Unfortuantely they're wearing down Ukraine bit by bit and without heavier weapons or a more effective Ukrainian counteroffensive, Russia is slowly taking territory back in Kursk as well as pushing in Donetsk and Luhansk
Tweedledownt@reddit
They've been saying that every day for the past 2+ years of the 3 day special operation.
Joeman64p@reddit
The war is not turning in Russias favor.. it hasn’t gone anywhere for them in quite awhile.. now with Ukraine having authorized access to the ATACMS.. the Crimea bridge is coming down and with it, Russia’s ability to reinforce the western front - several other key targets will be taken out and the war will truly be pushed into Russias territory. Russia lacks qualified leadership within its ground forces.. nearly all of its ground forces are untrained, uncoordinated conscripts and or forced meat soldiers. This is a war of attrition at this point, Russia has the bodies to throw at the meat grinder but Ukraine has the rest of the world suppling it with ammunition and firepower to kill Russians soldiers faster than they can replenish the front lines
LetsGetNuclear@reddit
After I posted that, Zelensky has come out ans said that he'll lose the war if US aid is cut. Much hinged on the US election and aid cuts seem all but certain. Had the election gone the other way, it would have been beneficial to Ukraine.
This isn't a prediction about how the war will end, just what it looks like right now.
Joeman64p@reddit
The US aid may tamper down but that just means the other NATO countries will have to step up and send our weapons to them, since we provide the infrastructure and communications for them - we’d send the most but theirs several other countries providing arms manufactured by us to them as we speak. But the reality is the proxy war with Russia is good for the economy and Trump isn’t going to sending aid completely.. doesn’t matter what he says, it’s not fully in his control to do so
ForgottenRuins@reddit
They have been gaining ground everywhere slowly for months. Russia is probably going to get the better deal once negotiations start.
Hinterwaeldler-83@reddit
How much ground? Slowly is an understatement. Russian army is advancing at a pace of 0,003 miles per hour - a snail is 10 times faster. Russian bots want to make you believe they are making collosal advances while sacrificing thousands of their soldiers for a couple of yards. In the meantime they have lost parts of Russia to Ukraine and have not been able to retake it even with North Korean help.
ForgottenRuins@reddit
It’s not bots I’m hearing it from. It’s slow for sure but they have regained territory in Kursk salient since the surprise incursion and it doesn’t look like it will stop not with all the troops Korean and other that have been moved into the sector. Russians have advanced in many other sectors as well. Costly but they can afford it much more than Ukraine can.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn0dpdx420lo.amp
Hinterwaeldler-83@reddit
As I said, a snail is 10 times faster. We will see how much they can afford it.
ForgottenRuins@reddit
You say a snails pace. I have no idea if that’s true but I know ground is changing hands and it’s usually Russians gaining it.
Hinterwaeldler-83@reddit
You divide ground gained by the Russians with the days they needed for it. That gives you the speed. It you compare that to the speed of a snail, a snail is 10 times faster. You can do the math yourself, you have the maps. Ground is changing hands, but not even at snails pace.
Sky_Prio_r@reddit
"North Korean help" is a crazy way to say selling back the weapons that russia sold to them during the cold war at a major up sell
Hinterwaeldler-83@reddit
Well, they didn‘t sell them 10.000 North Korean babies they now want back as meat for the grinder, didn’t they?
Sky_Prio_r@reddit
You ain't wrong, but if we can measure to the thousands, I want a decent 10.056 north Korean babies for my burger night thursday.
randynumbergenerator@reddit
Finally someone with an understanding of incentives.
bellj1210@reddit
i agree- this has been a military failure for russia- the almost need a total victory for this to be worth it- and who knows if that is even possible.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
You assume Putin is sane and reasonable.
Most_Purchase_5240@reddit
He is. He is very sane. He wants to live in his multiple places and mistresses, feeling like a mafia boss everyone is afraid of. He has no other beliefs. He has no other aims. There is no ideology behind it. Which is why he will not start the apocalypse. Hard to live in a place when you reach reached the temperature of the sun or having to live in a bunker on an irradiated planet.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
You are way too optimistic 🤣 Good luck with that 😂
Shiny_Collector@reddit
User name checks out 👍🏻
No_Character_5315@reddit
Problem is one of these times it won't just be a threat.
mortalitylost@reddit
Problem is more that it is becoming more and more evident that the world will accept nuke usage in war and MAD isn't correct.
Watch what happens if it goes down. No one wants total annihilation. No one wants that shit. So, Russia picks a small tactical target after saying "we told you so" and they do an incredible amount of tactical damage which is also fear causing devastation to Ukraine, who isn't losing as easily as they thought.
All these NATO countries and more will condemn the hell out of the nuke. They'll say this, do economic thing here and there, but they won't nuke back. They'll say "if you do this again!!!" And wag their fingers collectively, but they'll never get to the point where they nuke back. It's like a bully shooting a kid in the foot with a gun. No one is fucking with the bully anymore, but no one is shooting him either. It's not a gun fight like everyone acted like it'd be.
So it gets normalized, Russia weathers out more economic sanctions, Ukraine surrenders, and it's over and people forget about it, mostly. And it's back to making money and oil shit and whoever works with Russia still will.
And if something else goes down, Russia can be like "the West is making me antsy and I might push the red button", and people will get all frantic and Russia will actually be able to rattle that saber and it means something. But it could just be a tiny tactical nuke that scares their enemy, yet doesn't cause a nuclear retaliation.
The West has become one big wet pussy and Russia knows it. It's like we collectively.decided to only fight proxy wars, got really good at it, and Russia said "fuck it" and decided that proxy wars were enough aggression to warrant escalation to nukes. They stopped playing that game and the rules are changing, and Russia is playing chicken with us. But it's a game no one ever wins, but when you're already fighting and losing... You're playing a game you're not going to win anyway, might as well make the others lose too. Especially if you're an aging dictator.
Shits ugly and it's been ugly for literally 100 years. This has just been one big unending war and it will stay this way for another 100 if we survive that long.
LengthinessWarm987@reddit
Did we even get good at the proxy wars?
erobb221comeinmybusy@reddit
a whole essay of nonsense
Ok-District5240@reddit
Okay... But if Russia nukes Ukraine, do you think Germany will stop buying Russian oil?
m15wallis@reddit
The only issue with this statement that "the west will wag their finger" is that the US has explicitly stated that any nuclear usage in Ukraine will immediately result in a conventional (but not nuclear) invasion by the US and allies., including destroying any and all naval forces in the Black Sea. Unless Russia decides to preemptively nuke everyone, they still overall lose out using a nuke and will absolutely demolish any and all credibility they have on the global stage even with their allies.
Meekois@reddit
Ehh, I disagree with this analysis. This is still the same game of brinksmanship and proxy wars, and it feels like it was written by an American.
The only way I see Europe doing nothing is when/if Trump assumes office. Because Trump is a Putin ally, if Ukraine falls, the EU will back up knowing they don't really have the military force to handle a nuclear aggressive Russia. Now knowing the US security assurances are meaningless, Germany/France will begin a massive ramp up of their MIC.
TN_UK@reddit
You said and made very and every good point. Your whole post was excellently thought out and written
NickU252@reddit
No it isn't. If Russia sends a nuke into a NATO country, the Kremlin will no longer exist.
Nibb31@reddit
Why would Russia do that ?
We are talking about Russia using a tactical nuke on Ukrainian soil.
charbo187@reddit
I just disagree. one nuke gets used and the seal is broken. use of a nuke requires a nuclear response full stop. this is doctrine.
I_Actually_Do_Know@reddit
I'm amazed how rational and objective some of the comments here are about the whole global situation. Usually this sub leans towards delusions.
Even in other subs the geopolitical claims happen to be very off the mark mostly.
KreeH@reddit
Yes, folks saying he is just bluffing could of said the same thing when he was threatening to invade the Ukraine.
Working_Staff2491@reddit
I remember that many people believed that Russia was not going to invade Ukraine and that it was a joke. The day will come when the nuclear threat is not a joke and these memes of Putin and the nuclear threat will age very badly
KreeH@reddit
No kidding!! I hope that day doesn't every come, but I feel strange that we even need to consider this as a possibility.
Mediocre-Magazine-30@reddit
Eventually a nuke will be used again imho. It's almost impossible for it not as time passes. Small chance each day but they accumulate
Master_Shibes@reddit
Well hey, at least we’ll look all strong and tough on foreign policy to whatever life forms evolve to replace us over the next few hundred thousand years.
EmergencyAnimator326@reddit
OK so how does it go when He uses the nukes? The world Just watches? This IS never gonna Happen. Realisticaly i See the probability of nukeuse in Ukraine at aboit 1%
Working_Staff2491@reddit
I believe that as a society we do not want to face the possibility of a limited nuclear attack by Russia in Ukraine and instead we have chosen to laugh at Putin and his threats as a defence mechanism in the face of the horror that gives us to think about the use of nuclear weapons, no matter how limited it is.
But the day when the threats cease to be and Russia move on to an action can come and we must be mentally prepared at least for that moment.
I don’t think there will be a massive nuclear attack, I hope never. But I do believe that Putin can launch a limited nuclear attack in Ukraine at any moment to prove to what extent we would respond both in Europe and in the United States.
Insanelycalm@reddit
IF Putin pushes that button the response from the west would likely be devastating and they’d be strategically bombed to push them back well within their borders almost instantly, if it didn’t decapitate them from the top down.
SwordfishFrosty2057@reddit
Well the countries East of Ukraine that eat the nuclear fallout will shut it down or simply attack Russia to disable their nuclear capabilities.
You can't sit idly by while nuclear fallout wakes over your citizens and lands.
big_nasty_the2nd@reddit
Uhhh the world either tries to intervene and everyone gets nuked, or everyone is too afraid to get nuked so they don’t intervene.
Either direction is really bad. But we keep fucking around and someone’s gonna find out.
No_Character_5315@reddit
I'm not even sure by the article it Russia is just threatening Ukraine with nuclear counterstrike or nato or even the mainland usa ???
LiminalWanderings@reddit
The phrasing suggests tactical short range nukes against Ukraine. ..."since Ukraine is supported by a nuclear state, it's ok to strike them back with nukes" seems to be the change.
No_Character_5315@reddit
Regardless it's a dangerous game why Biden would allow this knowing full well Trump has a shot at peace talks is just dumb. I could see it if Trumps would have the same hardline view as the Biden administration why escalate it further.
1rubyglass@reddit
They can't allow Trump to get into office and get credit for ending the war.
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
You mean forcing a Democracy to surrender to a dictator? That peace plan? GFY
1rubyglass@reddit
Right, because that's real. Also, it's not a democracy.
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
JFC I hate how confidently you people say stupid shit. 🙄
1rubyglass@reddit
JFC I hate how people that know nothing of Ukraine are suddenly experts as soon as this war starts
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
Don't have to be an expert to understand what a democracy is.
1rubyglass@reddit
Case and point 🤣
jtshinn@reddit
Trumps peace talks are probably nothing of substance. Putin is committed to taking over Ukraine not just a negotiated deal with parts of Donetsk and Luhansk. He set out for the whole thing and settling is a loss and his power evaporates.
vamatt@reddit
Any sort of peace under the type of terms that Trump has talked about would be a grave mistake. It’s simply a play at appeasement.
The only long term path for peace involves Putin swinging like Mussolini
jtshinn@reddit
Absolutely, I think that taking a negotiated deal would lead to him swinging too though, and I think for that reason he’d string trump along but never actually take one.
vamatt@reddit
Most likely. Putin likes to play games like that.
Traditional-Leader54@reddit
Maybe you answered your own question and Biden doesn’t want to Trump to obtain peace. Just thinking out loud.
kvolz84@reddit
Because trumps peace talks will most likely favor Russia. Biden couldn't approve these strikes pre-election because it would have hurt kamala, but I think the decision was made when North korea send troops to fight. Besides, Biden just announced it first but some EU countries are also allowing it with Scalp and Storm Shadow missles. If Ukraine is going to be forced by trump to negotiate, at least they can do it from a better position of power to try to convince russia to actually want to negotiate. This is why Russia has been pushing so hard these last few weeks. Russia claims they will negotiate but then say it's only if all their terms are met. On the flip side, if Russia feels they are winning anyway... why would they negotiate?
LiminalWanderings@reddit
Because Putin is not and has not and will not be genuinely interested in peace talks unless they end up in a degraded NATO/US strategic position. All of this has been punished and written about by Russia as part of its strategic doctrine for years. Anyone who has been paying attention outside of the US politics bubbles understands this. I certainly got a taste for it when I was in Poland and a former Baltic state talking to some of the people adjacent to the situation a few years ago.
Make no mistake: the goal is to realign the world to a Russia/China axis.
Otherwise_Ad1797@reddit
Except he said he wasn’t going to invade Ukraine then did. Not the same thing as a bluff.
big_nasty_the2nd@reddit
They did actually, can’t even begin to remember how many people said it wasn’t going to happen as we were getting satellite photos of armor amassing at the border
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
Our intelligence agencies were spot on, & I believed them. 😉
lineman4910@reddit
Well Biden told him a "minor incursion" was ok. We literally gave him permission.
LordMongrove@reddit
Putin will accidentally fall from a window if there is a chance of it becoming more than a threat. He is running very short on political capital already.
Rizz_Crackers@reddit
That’s my biggest fear. Putin backed in a corner with nothing to lose.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Exactly. If he's desperate enough there's no telling what he'll do. This is normal for anyone If backed into a corner they can act put. Biden should have never made that decision.
LordMongrove@reddit
So just let Putin take all of Europe then because he threatens nukes whenever he feels like it? That is what will happen unless red lines actually mean something.
You know Russia has NK troops fighting for them now?
The only way to fight bullies is to hit back. His own side will take him out soon enough.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
No, what you are suggesting is a recipe for WW3. Do you have any kids? Nephews? Are you draft age? The draft was legalized for both men and women recently in the USA.
Are you ready to go fight against Russia or send your loved ones or friends and family's children to fight this war?
Peace talks and de-escalation is the solution, not fighting.
SnooBananas216@reddit
NO. The draft was NOT legalized for women.
You call it "de-escalation," but at this point it would just be appeasement.
If you're so confident Russian appeasement will save us from WWIII, I'd asking you to research how appeasement worked out with the world & Germany in the 30s, and the lead up to WWII.
See Arthur Chamberlain...
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Did some research and you are correct, women don't have to register for the draft. However according to Google this can change in the near future:
"Currently, women are not required to register for the draft in the United States, as the law specifies only men must register. However, there are ongoing discussions in Congress about potentially changing this to include women in the future."
As for ww2 and Germany, those aren't interchangeable with the current conflict. Presently the issue is a lot more complex.
I think deescalation could buy us some time at minimum.
LordMongrove@reddit
Hard disagree. Thats what Putin wants and that’s what Trump wants. You are following their playbook.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Wtf are to talking about? Everyone wants peace. You are loony my friend. What ever garbage they are feeding you is going to ur head.
Every country that's at war wants peace. This isn't a partisan thing and there isn't a "playbook". Peace is universal. You must have some sort of mental illness or are just incredibly dense. I feel sorry for you.
NNegidius@reddit
If Russia wants peace, they can simply withdraw from Ukraine. It’s that simple. They were at peace before they chose to invade, and they’ll be at peace again when they finally go home.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Yes I agree. However there need to be agreements and parameters on this for each conflict/war to government both sides peace of mind. Again, you are oversimplying a complex situation. A lot is at stake here and neither side can just withdraw and assume things will go back to normal. You don't know anything about strategy and it shows.
LordMongrove@reddit
Russia invaded and is occupying a sovereign nation. That doesn’t square with “wanting peace”. You are deluded or a Russian mouthpiece.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Putin attacked Ukraine because we promised to not put nukes in Ukraine and promised to not pressure Ukraine to join NATO. We then proceeded to try to put nukes in Ukraine and then Ukraine asked to join NATO.
Putin did not attack Ukraine unprovoked. Have u been living under a rock? How is this news to you? Or are you pretending you didn't know this to justify your stance?
LordMongrove@reddit
There are no nukes in Ukraine. They gave them up at the end of the Cold War in exchange for Russian protection. What a joke.
You are spread pure Kremlin misinformation and nobody buys it. Either you are a Russian, a bot, or woeful ignorant.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
We TRIED to put nukes in Ukraine.
Either way, this action is what provoked Putin to attack Ukraine. Also, seeing Biden's weak leadership didn't help.
LordMongrove@reddit
You need to back that up. When did the US try to put nukes into Ukraine.
And when did the US pressure Ukraine to join NATO? It didn’t happen. Ukraine wants to join NATO because of Russian aggression. Did NATO pressure Finland and Sweden to join NATO also.
I don’t know where you are getting your information from dude, but it’s not hard to see when it originated.
YeaTired@reddit
I do not think the United States ever tried to place nuclear weapons in Ukraine
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Question, If you were the President of the USA and China was attempting to put nuclear warheads in Mexico, next to the border would you allow it and put your entire country at risk in doing so?
Or would you start a war in Mexico to get China to back off?
You already tried talking to Mexico and China, and they both agreed not to put nukes in Mexico but then they did it anyway, which means talking IA now off the table.
Any country would do the same if they have the ability to effectively defend themselves. Russia is a nuclear superpower. We have always towed the line with them and it has been working well so far.
Whatever bs msnbc fed you about Putin being no match for 'Merica is false.
Russia is very capable of going to ear with us and winning. They have nukes and so do we. However, at this moment our military recruiting numbers are down and our weapons arent able to fully compete with Russian weaponry in the anti nuke department (our iron dome of sorts isn't up to snuff) or what some would call anti nuke systems.
I can't tell you how many people spew this horse maneuver everytime going to war with Russia or Ukraine is brought up.
No we can't win a war against Russia rn. Yes, Russia will use nuclear power of they get desperate. No, Putin didn't attack Ukraine unprovoked. NO, He wasn't going to take over all Europe. He knew NATO WOULDNT ALLOW IT And won't allow it. So your bs theory that if we don't intervine he will just take over all Europe is 100% impossible and false. He and China can't take on all the NATO countries. If they could this country would have ceases to exist decades ago.
LordMongrove@reddit
So much Russian misinformation on here these days. Not biting.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Hate it or love it that is the fact of what happened, amigo.
It's not "misinformation" it's fact. Or do you really think Russia was just itching to start a war with us? They knew ahead of time how we felt about them going into ukraine and they still did it.
LordMongrove@reddit
Putin wants Ukraine, which is a sovereign nation. If he gets that, he’ll move on to his next target.
He won’t nuke shit because then he loses all his leverage. Even Trump won’t support him then.
I’m not arguing with you any more. You are just spouting Russian propaganda and it’s pure garbage. Either you are ignorant or deliberately misleading people.
VRTester_THX1138@reddit
People forget that the leaders themselves don't actually press the button.
Holiday_Albatross441@reddit
If Putin is forced out of power, it will be by someone who DOES want to nuke the West. He's a moderate by Russian standards, which is fortunate because I'd rather not get nuked over this.
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
Also he knows that history will remember that he nuked the very victims he's invading because he's a sore loser who couldn't conquer a smaller country with conventional weaponry.
History will remember any dishonorable sore losers in a very bad light.
ShimazuMitsunaga@reddit
If nobody is left alive to record history, is there really a winner or loser?
ThunderboltSorcerer@reddit
There will always be one guy in a cave recording history in stone tablets, not to worry. It's a long tradition. Even when tyrants are successful they destroy the world and yet the history of that gets recorded.
Examples of that include Nebuchadnezzar, which everyone remembers. Nero, Caligula.. King George III.. King Leopold II... Stalin... Mao... Pol Pot.. Hitler.. They're recorded in the Hall of Infamy of tyrants.
GhostofAyabe@reddit
He'll catch a bullet if he even tried to give that order; not every Russian is an insane lunatic who wants to destroy the world to protect the ego of one man.
itsgrandmaybe@reddit
Russian roulette is fun 5/6's of the time. That remaining 1/6's of the time is catastrophic, and up until that point the player feels invincible. And funny enough, when it goes wrong, the player doesn't even get to know he lost.
The hubris of humankind has no bounds.
DotRepresentative110@reddit
Fun fact: Russian Nagant revolvers hold 7 rounds.
jtshinn@reddit
Horse shit. If he wanted to he would have. They didn’t even have the ability to overrun a neighboring country in the past three years.
YardChair456@reddit
The difference is that when they can overcome the new weapon, when it gets to be a losing situation for russia, I fear they would take whatever steps to not lose.
jtshinn@reddit
They lost on about the third week though. Once they couldn’t over take Kiev it was a losing effort. Once nato expanded on their border it was an outright disaster, all their objectives were missed.
YardChair456@reddit
The objective was that Ukraine not join NATO, so its not an ideal situation but its not lost. Ukraine is the one that is going to inevitably lose, its a cant lose war for russia.
jtshinn@reddit
If that’s the claimed objective it’s a deflection. NATO expanded on another front by much more than ukraine and by two countries that were hesitant to join. Russia pushed Sweden and Finland to finally make a call that’s been 60 years in limbo. It’s wild gymnastics to say ‘yea we’re fine with Finland joining nato, we just didn’t want Ukraine to.’ And it’s not at all clear that Ukraine still won’t find its way into nato. They have simply looked at the two options they lie between and chose Europe with all its issues over the rotting corpse of the Russian bear to the east.
YardChair456@reddit
I dont understand the history over there, but I know for a fact that Georgia and Ukraine are different for them, and this can be seen by their direct actions taken in those two countries to keep out western influence and control. The real question here is why would NATO/US mess around with those two countries when they knew it would cause a direct conflict?
jtshinn@reddit
Ukraine threw off its Russian government in 2014 and said they as a people want to align with the free countries in the west. That’s why. That spot in Europe has been a conflict many times through history. Russia wants it because it’s got warm water ports that they lack everywhere else, lots of gas, minerals and farmland. And there’s a nationalist sentiment in Russia that tries to make the claim that it is Russia even if that’s not the case any more. Can’t collapse as a nation and expect to keep all your outlying territory. Especially not those that directly connect to the eu.
Ordinary144@reddit
How do so many people not understand escalation of force? Was he expected to nuke Washington DC after we gave Ukraine some artillery? No, but if American servicemen launch ATACMS into 50,000 troops inside Kursk, Russia, you can bet your Yankee doodle feathered hat that it will be hard for him to show his face at the Kremlin or another BRICS meeting unless he does something big. And probably nuclear.
jtshinn@reddit
How are the American servicemen getting involved?
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Because only Americans can or know how to operate those weapons. So if American soldiers are firing the weapons for Ukraine and at RRussian soldiers that's America getting directly involved and means America is in the war.
SwordfishFrosty2057@reddit
HiMARs are exported. Your stated fact is easily disproven. Taiwan getting some as well write this.
jtshinn@reddit
Only Americans can operate them? What? It’s a missile system, I bet the Ukrainian military took to the training very well and they have had them for some time now.
Ordinary144@reddit
Really, like do you even understand the Russians' main stated objection to being hit with ATACMS? It's literally the main point of why it's being heralded as ww3.
jtshinn@reddit
Generally you can avoid being hit by not hitting first. But you didn’t answer the question, how are the American soldiers getting involved?
Ordinary144@reddit
First, they load the bloody thing and send it to Ukraine...I'm not doing the rest for you. Read an article on it, keywords "encryption and navigation."
jtshinn@reddit
You are barely making sentences. The us isn’t operating these things in Ukraine. They just train trainers and send the hardware.
Ordinary144@reddit
Nope. The long range missiles require sensitive data that NATO has to program in to work properly. That is why Putin is so pissed off. US hasn't even denied this, why are you playing dumb,?
jtshinn@reddit
Ukraine has had the system and used for over a year now. If he wanted to get bent about it he would have. They even consider eastern Ukraine and crimea part of Russia now so you can’t even claim that landing the missiles inside the proper borders of the country is any kind of escalation. Fact is, if you can’t take a punch don’t take the first swing. And calling in North Korean support negates any standing to complain about outside support on the side of Ukraine.
Ordinary144@reddit
Not the Long range ATACMS. The older, shorter range stuff was used and didn't require our help. You clearly have not been following along nor have you demonstrated a basic understanding of what has changed in the war since Sunday.
ReturnOfJohnBrown@reddit
He's just repeating Republican/Russian talking points, they don't have to make sense or be true.
TN_UK@reddit
I'm just guessing, I've never been in the military and I know nothing about it and I'm not being facetious. I'm just guessing
But I think maybe the service men and women pack and then deliver and then set up and possibly train the Ukrainians.
Please forgive my fucked up imagination, but I just imagined some Ukrainian soldiers opening up a box like a Christmas present and going, Wow! Missiles! Who's this from and Is there an instruction booklet?
jtshinn@reddit
The Ukrainians have had atacms for a year plus now. They are trained by the us and other western armies outside of Ukraine and then return to use and share that training. It’s not a secret how non combat military support works.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Why are u getting down voted? These are logical facts. So people here not like facts
FaceDeer@reddit
So I guess we have to just let Russia do whatever it wants, then.
eagles2011ct@reddit
Giving them equipment is one thing- we didn’t give them atacams- they wouldn’t be able to operate Them- we launched on their behalf, big difference
sanitation123@reddit
Huh?
fattest-fatwa@reddit
There is a popular Russian talking point going around that American servicemen are the ones actually launching the ATACMs (Ukrainians can’t be trusted with the lockout codes or the satellites or something) and not Ukrainians. Ergo this is an attack by NATO, justifying Russia retaliating basically however it wants. It’s nonsense. If it mattered, it would have mattered when they were launching ATACMs not deep into Russia for the last several months.
1rubyglass@reddit
I wouldn't at all be surprised If there are American paramilitary intimately involved
fattest-fatwa@reddit
Yeah but nobody cares.
1rubyglass@reddit
Right
sanitation123@reddit
Okay, then.
LisleSwanson@reddit
Do you actually believe this or are you just regurgitating RT?
eagles2011ct@reddit
If it’s the block 1a- how do you think the satellite targeting system works?
LisleSwanson@reddit
I use US satellites daily to run simple errands.
I can give you the GPS coordinates of any Russian military installation in just a few minutes. I'm sure Ukraine is also capable of the same.
eagles2011ct@reddit
I understand your point. Not to get too far into how they work but the technology requires active updates while in flight via US (military) satellites among other things.
I’m Not making the case we shouldn’t be providing them, but I am saying this is a different animal than providing arms, munitions, tanks etc, and will be viewed as such by Russia.
vamatt@reddit
Shoot you can even view most Russian military installations with google earth view
EmergencyAnimator326@reddit
Every Word you Just wrote IS wrong my man.
SwordfishFrosty2057@reddit
That's a chance we have to take.
Living in a world where we all are held hostage by nuclear arms at all times not only empowers those who use terrorism as a tool but demands all countries and or regimes to desire and need nuclear arms.
Russia has been given enough leeway for owning nukes. Any further is flirting with nuclear blackmail being the de facto option for all.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
This
itsdietz@reddit
It will most likely always be just a threat. Like their paper army
EmergencyAnimator326@reddit
Nah they are Not stupid they know that If they use nukes the Globes will come of.
waveball03@reddit
No, it won’t.
ChromaticRelapse@reddit
Totally off topic, but it would bring me so much joy to hear that the military calls those missiles "attack 'ems"
Please let it be true.
GFSoylentgreen@reddit
And, if McDonald’s and Bay Watch reruns got pulled.
Zromaus@reddit
And for some reason we just keep pushing them instead of staying in our lane.
Reduntu@reddit
"Staying in our lane" means giving Ukraine to Putin, and likely bringing war to the Baltics after. We learned from "staying in our lane" in the build up to WWII.
Zromaus@reddit
If we weren't the world police in our heads none of this would be a concern.
Reduntu@reddit
I'm sure that was the justification for letting Hitler take over Europe.
Zromaus@reddit
And a reasonable one at that, my tax dollars should be spent on local defense frankly.
Reduntu@reddit
It's extraordinarily naive to think letting an imperialist dictator take over Europe won't affect you eventually.
lilith_-_-@reddit
We didn’t let them use them, USA soldiers and satellites helped to aim the missiles and played a direct roll in attacking Russia. It’s not that simple. We physically caused an attack on Russia, all Ukraine did was fire them. It is an escalation that involves direct USA and Russian combat. Please don’t downvote me for saying this. But it is the truth and it’s why Russia is going to escalate further
Reduntu@reddit
Hasn't Ukraine been using U.S. GPS to fire HIMARS into Russia based on U.S. intel for a while now?
lilith_-_-@reddit
GPS is not the same as involving direct soldiers to fire this missile. It’s not a passive system. It actively requires people to do things.
Economy-Ad4934@reddit
sabre rattling intensifies 😂
tempest1523@reddit
The argument, well we already crossed 4 red lines therefore there is no red line is a dangerous one to make.
No_Space_for_life@reddit
True, but all of those things were used in Ukraine. Today the ATACMS were used against Moscow.
sanitation123@reddit
US supplied weapons and munition have been used for a long time already in Russia.
No_Space_for_life@reddit
You're right. And yet none of those compare to what currently caught the green light.
sanitation123@reddit
Why? Why is this some sort of new red line? How does Putin have any credibility?
No_Space_for_life@reddit
Is nuclear Armageddon really worth, mayyyybe this time.nukes won't come in play because fuck it?
No one's saying roll over here, but walking down th3 exact road that leads to a minimum a nuclear holocaust seems the least productive method.
This really isn't anything but a brazen attempt at the left to escalate the situation due to their recent loss politically.
sanitation123@reddit
K 👍
No_Space_for_life@reddit
If you can't have a rational discussion, then perhaps this isn't the subreddit for you.
Don't ask questions if you don't want serious answers to those questions, and you're going to act like a child. Grow up.
sanitation123@reddit
Sounds good 😊
Fantastic-Series9339@reddit
ATACMS do not have the range required to reach Moscow lol.
No_Space_for_life@reddit
You're right that's why I said against Moscow, not into Moscow.
As stated elsewhere i should have been more careful in my wording as it was easy to misconstrue my point.
Reduntu@reddit
I don't believe ATACMS were used against Moscow. Russia has been being attacked inside their borders for many months from a variety of weaponry including HIMARS. Ukraine even took some Russian territory this past year. The only new thing is slightly increased range.
No_Space_for_life@reddit
Read below, against Moscow, not fired into Moscow.
I probably should have been more specific, but it was a coffee break so I just dropped a comment and continued on.
Ordinary144@reddit
They meant Moscow as in Russia proper. Like how Washington can mean USA. Launch an ATACMS into Moscow, and I bet the lovely people of Washington DC will be learning how to take x-rays of themselves against concrete walls.
No_Space_for_life@reddit
This is it. Sorry, I suppose I could have worded it better.
Yes Moscow as in Russia, not Moscow as in the city. I suppose specifically are more warranted.
Terrorcuda17@reddit
I remember an analyst somewhere saying that something like 37 of Russia's red lines have been crossed.
ResidentInner8293@reddit
Sounds like we are pushing our luck
TheFuckboiChronicles@reddit
Since the development of nuclear weapons its always only been a matter of time. Hopefully I’ll be dead when the time comes.
Fur-Frisbee@reddit
It a question of when.
If Biden was too mentally deficient to run for reelection, should he have a say in decisions like this that threaten everyone?
PetraphobicDruid@reddit
no one is every ready for a nuclear conflict. The fallout would be a lot of gamma and other radiation, There are plans on the FEMA and other websites based on the last mapping of targets from the USSR and Russia, There would be safe spots but it is all relative if you get somewhere not to irradiated - do you have the materials and ability to survive.
DariusEranSought@reddit
Dur
Scormey@reddit
OH, NO! The country that invaded another country got struck back upon by the country they invaded, and now the aggressor nation is upset?
Eff em.
nunyabizz62@reddit
Wow, the misinformation on this thread is frightening.
Weird-Conflict-3066@reddit
Saber rattling by Putin basically telling us to knock it off.
Provoking long range misses to Ukraine and allowing then to use weapons we gave them is a bad idea and very easily could escalate WW3
proweather13@reddit
Eh. Putin wants you to think that.
Gustomaximus@reddit
Putin wont launch nukes.
Best case 'launch' is a small tactical nuke into Ukraine, then we watch the world turn on him + arm themself to the teeth with nukes. He says he was worried about weapons being stationed in Ukraine, the cause of this entire war. He knows if he sends even the smallest nuke into Ukraine a bunch of countries around him like Sweden/Finland/Poland/Ukraine/Japan will be looking down the path of hosting and/or owning their own nukes. And a bunch more countries further away will be adding or ramping up, so this is no good for long term strategy.
If he launched something serious at a NATO country, then we have war + a heap more countries nuclear arming themself fast. And he is struggling to beat Ukraine...he knows NATO can bend them over if the will is there.
Worst case he goes all out in nuclear attack and launches hundreds or thousands (if they even can...) then his country is gone. And for all his faults he loves his country and wouldn't want that.
The only time I see him launching a nuke is if there was a real and significant invasion of Russia. No-one wants that, so wont happen.
Im not an expert but logically nukes dont play out here IMO.
proweather13@reddit
Correct!
nunyabizz62@reddit
The Russians have conventional bombs with the blast radius of the bomb that hit Hiroshima. They don't need nukes to take out Ukraine. They have been extremely restrained and have tried to keep civilian casualties to a minimum. If not they would simply take the power out right before winter and the whole country in the cold and dark.
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ButtWhiffer@reddit
Who ever is running this administration is a complete fucking idiot. Why would anyone in their right mind allow Ukraine to use US weapons to strike deep into Russia. We know it’s not Joe as he’s prob still lost in the jungle.
ButtWhiffer@reddit
All of you down voting why don’t you get off your lazy asses and go fight for Ukraine. You won’t cause you don’t have the balls to fight for Ukraine. You want someone else to do it for you while you run your sucks on Reddit.
The_Besticles@reddit
He is safer than every American here on the mainland in that god damned jungle and he probably has no idea. “Number one, can we go back right now for Ice Cream? Number Two, ah— too late, hey cmon man give me a wardrobe change I feel like Jane Jackson if she sat in hot Rocky Road (Big smile). Number three, can we go back right now for ice cream? What a bout Putin? Shhh it’s not easy bein an old guy like me, someday you’ll be wearing my pants and then you’re gonna uh, ass cream ice scream we all want some damn ice cream galdarnit!”
Sporesword@reddit
Pretty sure Ukraine has access to fissile material and can turn those into missiles that will force Moscow to evacuate permanently.
throwaway281409@reddit
Putin will use a small yield tactical nuke on Kyiv. I’m sure the US is expecting that since we shut down the Embassy this week. He will do it to see how NATO will respond. Most of their ballistic missiles may not leave their silos. Those require a lot of ongoing maintenance that Russia doesn’t do.
RodLeFrench@reddit
Putin is not stupid. He knows that NATO will spank his ass so hard and hand it back to him on a silver platter.
The USA and by extension its NATO allies are the only military in the world with the experience and (actual) capability to deploy strategic nuclear forces. Russia has fake hypersonic rockets, a completely ineffectual command structure, and limited assets in place to effectively pose a threat to anyone capable of nuclear retaliation.
It’s all posturing to help Trump look better when he takes office and “brokers” a peace deal to “save” the world from nuclear war.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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Made_In_Vagina@reddit
I still don't understand why any of this is our (US) problem.
Why are we "giving permission" to use these weapons? And why would Russia attack us over Ukraine using them?
skexr@reddit
Because we provided security promises to Ukraine in order to convince them to give up their nuclear weapons after the Soviet Union collapsed. This of course was before Shrub broke the post WW2 order by invading Iraq over bogus WMD claims right after backing out of the North Korean nuclear deal that the Clinton administration had hammered out.
Sending the obvious message to anyone who might find themselves in the crosshairs of one of the nuclear powers. Putin followed suit by taking Crimea in 2014 then China went back on their assurances to respect the autonomy of Hong Kong.
In just my lifetime I've watched the Republican party and it's backers continuously undermine the peace and security of the United States of America and the world.
And here we go again.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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vinonoir@reddit
Because Russia states/believes (whether true or not) that the missile systems used by Ukraine (that were given by the US etc) would still need the U.S to provide the intelligence (satilite imagery etc) to assist with targeting specific sites within Russia.
skexr@reddit
Good fuck Putin. We got nukes too and ours definitely work.
vinonoir@reddit
This in turn equates to the U. S being directly involved, as our intelligence is necessary for these missiles to be most effective. Putin doesn't seem to use the same logic with regards to their own involvement of North Korean troops to fight in Ukraine.
Either way, we as civilians will never know the truth. We only know what we are told by our government and media. And those two entities only release the info that the gov wants us to know.
ProgramKitchen1216@reddit
I sincerely hope the missiles fly, full scale exchanges , we need total coverage! It will be very fun and hilarious. Really. Fuck humans, we are shit that needs to be flushed down the fucking toilet.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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UntamedCuda@reddit
Why did the current administration wait literally right up until the point it's about to be ousted to authorize the use of force escalation? They had 4 years to greenlight these strikes and instead waited until now. I hope cooler heads prevail.
WhatWouldFutureMeDo_@reddit
I doubt our alien "zoo keepers" will let Putin actually launch a nuke.
Notvanillanymore@reddit
Ah yes the war criminal putin, interfering in elections, having his feelings hurt, Do it you fucking piece of shit cunts not like a nuclear fallout would be bad for the world, fewer humans would be better for everything. It's stupid to think this is even a threat, one nuke goes off and the rest will go flying
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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8bittrog@reddit
Trump's about to backstab Ukraine so you guys can relax.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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WarLordBob68@reddit
Yeah, Putin talks big for such a little man. He is great at bullying smaller countries but doesn’t have the cojones to directly take on the USA.
Middle_Aged_Insomnia@reddit
Thanks biden. Another war for oil and gas. Let europe deal with it. Going to have nukes flying before the new year. Smdh
kabrandon@reddit
I think the world should let Russia have as much land as it wants. Give them the whole continent if they want, who cares. Shoot, give them two continents, see if I care. /s
Emotional-Rise5322@reddit
Peskov, that you?
H-e-y-B-e-a-r@reddit
Russia can’t even win a war against Ukraine what makes ppl think they can do any harm against USA? I’m expected to get downvoted but it’s a legit question
Any_Leg_1998@reddit
Russias bluffing.
RegretfullyRI@reddit
Prep those bunkers!
Buddin3@reddit
They’ve been saying this every week for 2 years.
-GearZen-@reddit
Someone needs to kill Putin.
BigMaraJeff2@reddit
I have been saying NATO countries could offer citizenship to any person that kills putin and like 5 billion dollars. He would have been dead day 2
WeepingAndGnashing@reddit
Okay. He got assasinated. Now what, genius? The red eye over the Kremlin gets vaporized and all Russia’s soldiers melt like when Frodo tossed the ring in mount doom?
There are plenty of guys who will take Putin’s place. The war doesn’t stop because he’s out of the picture.
How do you think the US would respond if Russia offed Biden? I mean, look at how we reacted to 9/11. Seriously, don’t you think they would view that as a major escalation?
“Ah man, they killed our boy Vlad. I guess we have to go home now.”
You realize how idiotic this reasoning is?
Or worse, the place collapses into chaos after he is assasinated and there’s no one to negotiate with and no one to prevent that big red button from getting pushed.
That people can even say things like this with a straight face is mind bogglingly terrifying. I hope nobody launches nuked anywhere but if they do get launched, I hope one ends up on your front porch.
We need more adults in the room.
RidingEdge@reddit
95% of the comments on Reddit is about how Putin talks big and never would truly launch a nuke or retaliate.
They then cite the numerous times the war has escalated and gleefully declaring Ukraine + Allies can just slowly up the retaliatory attacks
Then they say Russia wouldn't even dare to retaliate against NATO and suggests Ukraine and allies to just bomb Moscow itself, or like the genius you quoted, just assassinate Putin
Imagine being so dumb and full of themselves that they think escalation is a good thing
It's like they are courting for a nuke or ICBMs to be launched...
It's also ironic that this whole "de-escalation through escalation" is the exact same policy used by the US State Department, and the amazingly liberal and progressive crowd just parrots the propaganda spewed by the politicians who engulfs the world with endless conflicts
And of all this in a prepper subreddit which by all logic shouldn't even celebrate or justify missile launches lmao
HybridAkali@reddit
I’m pretty confident at this point that 90% of people see Putin as some Bond movie villain, leader and single head of an evil organization and think if 007 takes him out it the movie ends with a beautiful girl and an Aston driving towards the sunset.
BigMaraJeff2@reddit
You say that like putin isn't head honcho in Russia and he can be questioned. Just ask all his political opponents and journalists
BigMaraJeff2@reddit
You mean like the nukes putin keeps threatening every time we cross a red line he puts down?
The entire push into ukraine was his idea. He is the one refusing withdraw. Take him out a let someone more sensible take his place. Maybe one of those political opponents he jail
sebadc@reddit
Comparing a dictatorship to a democracy is ridiculous when it comes to succession. That's why most of them only last as long as their Führer and there are very few counter-example. Especially in country as complex as Russia (because of its size, wealth, etc).
Additionally, you don't seem to realize that Russia does not have an Army but Mercenaries.
The difference is that while the US Army will defend their country, most Russian "soliders" are only there for the money. So it's business.
If the manager gets killed, nobody will keep on fighting until someone is in charge. They will try to grab whatever weapon / site they can put their hands on, align with the most likely successor to the throne, and maybe fight for them in the hope of getting paid.
Russia would desintegrate (like it should have 30 years ago) and each region will be led by the local mobster (like most ex-USSR country was lead after the implosion of the country).
locohygynx@reddit
Stay away from windows brave soul.
Oktokolo@reddit
That's propaganda. There will be no nucular war over long-range conventional missiles.
Russia will just look at the map and find some US bases or US-protected countries (like Israel) who happen to have enemies nearby.
We give missiles to Ukraine, Russia gives something equivalent to Iran. That's how cold war diplomacy works and we did it ourselves in the past.
iInvented69@reddit
You did it Joe
chouse33@reddit
Based on how well their equipment seems to be working in Ukraine, I wouldn’t be too worried about the US mainland. Europe up on the other hand…
Middle_Aged_Insomnia@reddit
Thanks biden. Another war for oil and gas. Let europe deal with it. Going to have nukes flying before the new year. Smdh
The_Besticles@reddit
I guess that’s one way to keep Trump out of the White House.
ALargeMastodon@reddit
Pussies gonna puss
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Middle_Aged_Insomnia@reddit
Yes...lets end the world to show how tough men we are. That toxic masculine ego is pathetic
ALargeMastodon@reddit
We are fighting that toxic ego by not letting a dictator take over his neighboring countries. Figured I was speaking your language, my bad.
Middle_Aged_Insomnia@reddit
Nah.. youre response shows you have that same fragile male ego. Youre willing to risk nuclear armageddon to show how strong we are. Thankfully youbarent in a position of power to push a button and end us all.
Do you really not realize how fn serious this is? We are tslking the end of the world nuclear exchange.
Davis1891@reddit
Alot of people will poke fun about how they're a paper tiger or how this is the final final final final final warning but I got a different take on it.
I can see it happening one day. I really can. The guy is off his rocker and isn't long for the world.
And then there'll be alot of shocked Pikachu faces.
No-Ideal-6662@reddit
Yeah, it will happen eventually. It’s like those crocodile trainers, you tap it on the nose enough times and eventually it’ll bite your arm.
The_Besticles@reddit
Steve Irwin was likeable and he bit it from a fucking Manta Ray. That’s like if America actually helped out 3rd world countries achieve stability and then got done in by Cuba of all places.
Beige-Lotus@reddit
Yeah a croc that knows it could end the world is a different animal. But who knows?
LiminalWanderings@reddit
The threat assessment by the US government of Putin using tactical nukes something like 2 years ago was 50/50. Of course it can happen.
bostonguy6@reddit
They’re counting on it. Martial law, no time to transition power to Trump.
itsgrandmaybe@reddit
I agree with you. We'll all be dead on the surface and some worthless dingbats, deep down in underground military bunkers in the mountain ridges, will be geeking themselves & sipping coffee and be like, "lol, omg the madman rly did it, how tf did this happen, how could we have not foreseen this!?!! Wtf do we do now??"
I think we, as humans, are doomed
Nde_japu@reddit
Agreed. We're fucked. And it only increases probability as other rogue players like Iran join the nuclear club
mike-manley@reddit
I feel the same. Normalcy bias probably explains it.
bigkoi@reddit
I'm willing to bet the USA has many more functional Nukes than Russia. Russia doesn't survive in Nuclear war.
itsgrandmaybe@reddit
Bro, they have all had space nukes since the 90's. We are all dead if it pops off.
bigkoi@reddit
Yes, we've seen how well they maintain their shit.
The_Besticles@reddit
They can miss by a continent or a whole hemisphere even. If they release, they go down, then we go down, the end.
itsgrandmaybe@reddit
What are you referencing to when you mention, "maintain their shit"?
LiminalWanderings@reddit
They're almost certainly talking about tactical nukes against Ukraine.
bigkoi@reddit
Which means NATO would get involved.
The_Besticles@reddit
And that’s…..a…. Good thing?
LiminalWanderings@reddit
Sure. But depending on which weapons and the context, NATO's response wouldn't necessarily be nuclear. It's not ...not... ridiculously serious....but it's also not immediately US and Russia trading intercontinental missiles.
The_Besticles@reddit
deliberatelyawesome@reddit
Neither does anyone else.
Well, survive maybe. Have a great life above ground though...
bigkoi@reddit
Point is. Russia is in a negative leverage position when it comes to Nuclear arms. Sure Russia could take out some cities. America could take out every Russian city multiple times over.
IronSide_420@reddit
Buddy, there is no leverage. We both have enough nukes to destroy each other completely with zero winners. What do you think Mutually Assured Destruction means? We all have loaded guns pointed at each other, and it's an equal threat to all of us. That's why deterrence has worked....so far.
saltyoursalad@reddit
Problem is, none of us do.
bigkoi@reddit
Point is. You don't bargain with terrorists. Russia isn't stupid. They know they lose way more than the USA does in that engagement.
plsdonth8meokay@reddit
I’m sincerely confused about the amount of people who think trump will “de-escalate” the war. Pulling out of NATO and basically saying good luck is not de escalation. It’s exactly what Putin wants!
Advanced-Society-948@reddit
Doubt that would happen, however if it did. I’m fairly certain Russia will back down for a while
plsdonth8meokay@reddit
Trump said he wants to leave nato… https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/07/02/nato-second-trump-term-00164517
Advanced-Society-948@reddit
He also said grab them by the P.
I don’t see him doing a lot of that either…
plsdonth8meokay@reddit
Ahh okay so you’re an idiot then. Thanks for letting me know so I don’t waste any more of my time.
Advanced-Society-948@reddit
Projection is a sign of deeper mental health issues. I hope you’re getting the help you need
plsdonth8meokay@reddit
I’m not American so I’m doing great, thanks.
The_Besticles@reddit
Well there’s no recovering from that one, game point for h8me in the red corner.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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The_Besticles@reddit
I did nazi him grabbing the bj queens punan yet either. I don’t think it’s that kind of relationship. Chicken AND blumpkings apparently too much to ask for. Eva would give up everything to ze fürher so it’s a weak look. What is up with that?
CatchMeIfYouCan09@reddit
I wouldn't be surprised if Trump communicates to Putin to let it go for 2 months and when he takes office he'll handle it.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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SailboatSteve@reddit
If nuclear WWIII is to happen, let it happen now before we get any better at killing. Our planet's only hope is that we, as a species, decide not to self-exterminate before we can actually do it. Maybe a hefty nuclear exchange, wiping out a sizeable chunk of everyone and everything will get that message across. Short of that, I'm not sure what else would. Our tech is rapidly outpacing our wisdom. One or the other needs a reset.
The_Besticles@reddit
There is a point where the odd chance that true AGI doesn’t kill us all becomes our only realistic hope to avoid global meltdown. Not there yet but the clock is ever closer to midnight.
HistorianNo3749@reddit
Why is no one questioning the Biden administration and their decision to approve these strikes into Russia?
On the way out the door no less. Democrat ideals get totally rejected in this election, and on the way out the door they gift us more of those ideals.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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Pearl-2017@reddit
Russia isn't going to nuke anybody.
In 2 mths, Trump will hand them Ukraine & the war will be over.
Y'all can remove this one too but this is a direct response to the question asked.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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ExtremeIndependent99@reddit
We would obliterate them if they ever tried that bullshit. I really believe Russia is a paper Tiger compared to the USA.
Effective_Raise_889@reddit
Not sure a lot of people understand, but the US is unable to stop or intercept any russian icbms. But Russia can intercept ours. Also, they have been able to track our stealth aircraft as well
ALargeMastodon@reddit
Bot
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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StainedDrawers@reddit
I'm sure they are ready. Unfortunately their ability to reach out and hit the United States is pretty limited compared to the ability of the United States to hit them, so lobbing a nuke towards the US would mean Russia as an entity would cease to exist.
capilot@reddit
Putin will have control over the U.S. in two more months; no need to escalate before then.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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Plentybud@reddit
Shall we play a game?
akgeena777@reddit
Thank you demonrats. You voted for war and abortion.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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The_Besticles@reddit
If we dies, we dies
akgeena777@reddit
Thank you demonrats. You voted for war and abortion.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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skexr@reddit
You voted for appeasement and surrender.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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akgeena777@reddit
I vote for peace and life.
Jwbst32@reddit
Putin traded the nukes for hookers and coke years ago
OdinsVisi0n@reddit
Awww papa pootie getting snooty!?
use_for_a_name_@reddit
Yes. Their nuclear response is to give anothother empty threat
SuperglotticMan@reddit
I live 15 minutes from DC guys what do you think my odds are? Start taking bets
gojo96@reddit
This is why I hate living near DC.
AdvancedHydralisk@reddit
Probably pretty good? The US has nuclear missile interception systems - I can guarantee the DC area has fantastic missile defense
StickyFing3rs10@reddit
I think we only have 40 total missiles across the US to intercept missiles and that is targeting rentry vehicles. Mirvs carry several warheads. So figure 2 interceptors per warhead we could shoot down 20 out of 1000.
AdvancedHydralisk@reddit
I hear nuclear annihilation isn't so bad
SHlLL@reddit
Not for terminal ICBM defense. Mid-course there are a limited number of interceptors in the Pacific that I think might have had one successful trial.
So no, no defense other than MAD.
IronSide_420@reddit
You're completely right. The other dudes think we are somehow very safe and secure from nuclear strikes, and that couldn't be farther from the truth.
SHlLL@reddit
Nuclear War by Anna Jacobsen really opened my eyes to the danger of the situation and the insanity that we live in such a world.
I'm no fan of appeasement but would prefer that my family and I not perish in a nuclear Holocaust.
IronSide_420@reddit
I've watched her appearances on Lex's and Rogan's podcasts but haven't read her books. I really enjoyed her perspective.
AdvancedHydralisk@reddit
I thought we had the patriot system all up and running?
Or is that only for conventional missiles, whereas airburst ICBMs would still demolish everything
GeforcerFX@reddit
Patriot can only intercept short range ballistic missiles or theater ballistic missiles, so the crap Iran shoots at Israel or that china threatens in the pacific. We made THAAD to intercept intermediate and medium ranged missiles in the terminal phase. Those are the mobile ground based defenses. There are two mid course interceptor sites, one in California at Vandenberg and one in Alaska. They launch what is effectively a ICBM with a exo-atmospheric kill vehicle instead of a nuclear warhead. They intercept incoming missiles in space before they split into there multiple warheads.
The navy can intercept just about anything but ICBM's are still a bit out of reliable capabilities with the current SM-3 missiles loaded onto the Arleigh Burke Class Destroyers, they can also do terminal interception with the SM-6 missiles. The same load out can be based on land this is called Aegis ashore and there are a few deployed in Europe and the Pacific.
big_nasty_the2nd@reddit
MIRV’s were intentionally created to increase hit probability with a single launch. It’s easy to hit one nuke in comparison to hitting 7 all at the same time.
SHlLL@reddit
There is a pretty good discussion here. I think that's a part of it, plus the MIRV problem. Compounded when you consider a saturation attack with decoy MIRV.
AdvancedHydralisk@reddit
Eh if I get obliterated it isn't really my problem
Telemere125@reddit
Yes, because I’m sure our military has released all its defensive capabilities for public scrutiny
BallsOutKrunked@reddit
You're not going to hide a system that capable and that large. It would require training, staffing, job categories, etc.
You can keep technology on the dl but once it's in use at scale it's a lot harder, at least that was my experience in the military.
SHlLL@reddit
I wish I had as much faith in the government as you.
Lost_inthot@reddit
You can survive the blast but the fallout and chaos is what will get people in the suburbs.
Beige-Lotus@reddit
Survive yes, If you aren't in front of a window. Only 1 psi over pressure is enough to blow all the windows out. Unless the nuke is "salted" with cobalt 60 fallout is fairly limited. Smoke from all the fires is probably more of a concern. Either way it is good to have a filter for your lungs and or house.
Lost_inthot@reddit
Oh wow. Would boarding windows help or not really. And what kind of filter?
Beige-Lotus@reddit
Plywood would help substantially. I guess that is a pretty big investment of time and money, but if you had enough forewarning it would be worth it. Thing is, without warning people instinctively go to windows when they sense a bright flash outside. You don't want to ingest activated particles. So even a k95 would help.
BuffaloKiller937@reddit
Absolutely, and frankly, I don't think most of us will want to live in a post nuke world.
I know this is a prepping sub, but some things you just can't prep for. Imagine the worst case scenario, and then times that by a thousand.
Beige-Lotus@reddit
Go on the nuke map app and check your radius for the magnitude of the pressure wave of the nuke you expect.
verychicago@reddit
What is the nuke app map?
Beige-Lotus@reddit
https://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/
Beige-Lotus@reddit
If it is Russian. Odds are 800kt warhead. I would start there
randynumbergenerator@reddit
I'll bet anyone here a thousand dollars he won't get nuked.
Then again, I'm a Bayesian.
Righteousrob1@reddit
Think you’re fine. If anywhere has protection you’re good
underratedride@reddit
In what way? There’s no shot that the US could intercept a nuke in time, and even if they could it would result in a massive EMP.
less_butter@reddit
The US has had a missile defense program in place in various forms for over 70 years. We would know instantly if one was launched and would have plenty of time to shoot it down, from ground-based stations, planes that can be scrambled immediately, and from satellites in orbit.
OurAngryBadger@reddit
Now do 3,000 of them at once
MayorWestt@reddit
Why would they shoot 3000 at once?
Righteousrob1@reddit
Think all 3000 going to dc
Dixon_Sideyu@reddit
To make sure more than a few make it through
Emperor_Dara_Shikoh@reddit
Why does he even assume Russia can even do that?
Righteousrob1@reddit
They don’t just explode as a nuke if you blow them up before they reach the destination? And pending a submarine strike, yea I think they could stop most inbound planes and missiles
KahlessAndMolor@reddit
ICBM come in at orbital velocity, they are basically impossible to hit
Economy-Ad4934@reddit
Odds are we’re not talking about ICBMs
DungeonsNDragonDldos@reddit
I mean I’d prefer they wait two months
mrlunes@reddit
The amount of air defense in that area is probably incomprehensible to the human mind. Rip Nebraska :(
Rough_Transition1424@reddit
If you see the Pentagon ordering pizzas at an alarming rate then panic
big_nasty_the2nd@reddit
You’re the first one to be hit. Being totally serious too
EmergencyAnimator326@reddit
Noone IS nuking the US or Europe Just Not going to Happen
JDyumyum@reddit
Thanks Joe!
RustyPeters67@reddit
I read about this in Big Whoop magazine.
Realistic-Lunch-2914@reddit
Because Crimea gives the Russian fleet a warm water access port, it is a major strategic asset that they will never surrender, even if it comes to using nukes. Unlike the west, Russia has a serious nuclear shelter program for it's people. That is a significant factor not generally realized. Now that Biden, England, and France have decided to provide Ukraine with long distance missiles, the calculus has changed. After the first major loss of life in Moscow from them, he may just decide to nuke Kiev and tell America, England, and France that he has three 20 megaton nukes immediately ready for launch upon their capital cities if they so much as lift a finger against Russia.
skexr@reddit
Most of Russia doesn’t even have indoor plumbing and you want us to believe that they have vaultec facilities for everyone?
Lol
relephants@reddit
Just fucking do it already.
Mysterious_Ad7461@reddit
Putin says this every single time
susanrez@reddit
Ok, go ahead. I’d love to see Moscow glassed.
Ok-Maintenance-9538@reddit
Cmon Russia shit or get off the pot. I've been waiting for nuclear Armageddon since I was a kid you fucking pussys.
cluminaty@reddit
Putin is a colossal pussy. He needs to end his u just war and crawl back into his little hole.
LiminalWanderings@reddit
It seems like a lot of people are conflating strategic intercontinental ballistic nuclear weapons with tactical battlefield nukes - the latter of which are almost certainly the ones Russia would use. It's a very serious escalation, but not the same as.immediate global thermonuclear war
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/what-are-tactical-nuclear-weapons-and-why-did-russia-announce-it-would-hold-drills
ghosttrainhobo@reddit
This is what Putin will do when he’s ready for NATO to put a NFZ over Ukraine and start lending direct military support.
Lost_inthot@reddit
Would it just be Kyiv or other cities?
LiminalWanderings@reddit
They're not really for cities...more to wipe out command posts or large, entrenched enemy positions.
Lost_inthot@reddit
That’s scary
FaceDeer@reddit
Also probably not very effective in a war like this. The front is stretched over thousands of kilometers, and Russian forces are having massive mobility and logistical problems so any hole poked in that front won't give them much advantage.
About the only strategic thing that dropping a nuke would accomplish would be to finally get China and India to completely cut Russia off, at which point they're finished.
Auios@reddit
if you're Russia, cities too why the hell not they'd say
LiminalWanderings@reddit
Size.
bellj1210@reddit
this is generally right- but what sort of fallout they have is still in question. But i agree that they are designed to maybe take out a militiary base sized thing (small town downtown area- a few blocks).
The issue is we still do not know if there is a "doomsday device" floating around there- basically something that is designed to launch all their nukes on a dead mans switch (or tied to actual warheads being used). I do not think it exsists, and if it did it would likely be tied to NK or some other lesser neuclear nation (and their possession is still an open question)
GeforcerFX@reddit
Modern tactical weapons tend to be very low on the fallout issue, usually you plan to move troops into the area you struck and would want radiation to be manageable. They aren't huge weapons usually being around or under 1-2 kilotons to contain there damage better. Modern designs are extremely efficient and have small amounts of fissile material in them, most are still detonated at a height to maximize precursor damage.
LiminalWanderings@reddit
I get the doomsday device scenario, i just don't think that's what's being signalled at the moment. Or are you implying that the use of tactical nukes would accidentally trip off a doomsday device by mistake?
Nibb31@reddit
A strike on Kyiv would not serve any military purpose. It would be a gratuitous war crime that would be condemned globally, even by China and Iran.
If there is a nuclear strike, it will be tactical. Tactical nukes are used to break through defenses or to stop an invasion or to destroy a large military asset (a fleet, and air base, or a naval base).
jareddeity@reddit
Youre not wrong but the US would immediately get involved, boots on the ground where does it stop?
YardChair456@reddit
I think the biggest concern is that it continues to be progressive steps of escalation. I personally am worried that both Russia and the US feel they need to one up each other. It seems that we keep taking steps in this war that we were not intending to take.
tr0028@reddit
Man I watch most action movies and Sean Connery never explained this!
hebdomad7@reddit
too Busy being 007, infiltrating the Soviet Navy to steal a Submarine and fighting terrorists on Alcatraz island with some guy who'd later go on to steal the Declaration of Independence...
tr0028@reddit
Should never have relied on Scotland's most handsome man to teach me science I suppose
hebdomad7@reddit
Still got that UK passport? I'll get someone from Q branch to get you up to speed.
Flux_State@reddit
I'd rather just have a Nuclear war and get it over with then get threatened endlessly by the gangsters who rule over Russia.
Grg-SK@reddit
The missiles said “STARK ENTERPRISES” on the side.
bioindicator@reddit
Unlikely, but if Putin does choose to go nuclear, I wonder if he might nuke Ukrainian troop in Kursk, Russia, which is already evacuated of civilians?
Trenbalogna_Sandwich@reddit
They say this weekly…
Remember when they were going to nuke us after we sent munitions.
Dude_I_got_a_DWAVE@reddit
using a nuclear bomb will not guarantee Russia anything beyond western retaliation that would end the Kremlins reign of power.
Russias own disclosures of defense spending prior to the war show they aren’t spending anywhere near enough to maintain their fleet of ~5600 warheads
In 2021, the US spent $50billion maintaining our nuclear fleet. In the same year, Russia spent $60 Billion
ON THEIR ENTIRE MILITARY DEFENSE SPENDING
The US spent ~$750Billion+ on defense spending that year.
Russia recently tried testing a Satan-2 delivery system which failed. In fact, there hasn’t been A SINGLE nuclear test in the entire time Putin has been in charge of Russia.
It’s likely their nuclear fleet has seen the same rot that the rest of their military has. Not much is serviceable, and the stuff that works is vastly inferior to western systems
Is it possible they have a few that work? Yep. But any use of nuclear force will not improve Russias situation
Lordquas187@reddit
"Pussyboy don't want war" - Keith "Chief Keef" Cozart
Cultural-Sugar-6169@reddit
Who cares? Go ahead. Tired of that russian midget and his nuclear threats. He can stick his rockets up his bum for all I care.
MonsterByDay@reddit
I believe they were talking about nuking Ukraine, not the US.
Probably neither, but I never read anything to lead me to believe that attacking the US was even on the table
Sad_Tie3706@reddit
A rump set up on response so he can act like the king he wants to be
poppinyaclam@reddit
MAD
CockamamieJesus@reddit
I think he's baiting Trump into casually threatening nuclear war, given that Trump has shown to be obsessed with Putin and being just like him. "Look how powerful I am, I can threaten nuclear catastrophe on my enemies, I am the ultimate Dictator". I mean seriously Trump would do anything for that kind of power.
AnonEdin@reddit
Clown. Biden did this. Remember that.
CockamamieJesus@reddit
Hello Russia, maybe don't be so transparent? Fucking morons.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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Shagcat@reddit
Biden did this.
ALargeMastodon@reddit
Biden helped Ukraine defend itself from an aggressive dictator. Putin is working with the cards Biden dealt him and OP’s post could be his line of thought.
CockamamieJesus@reddit
Don't bother, it's just a Russian bot. Notice these comments are almost identical? Yup, bots.
MileHighOllie@reddit
What suit is best against fallout that's reasonably priced?
SweetSultrySatan@reddit
T-45
kudatimberline@reddit
Trump will hand Ukraine over to Russia. Russia will continue to expand West. You want see all democratic nations fall, but social media is a faucet for fascism.
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
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thesaint1000@reddit
I’ve seen this same post on another sub and it’s scary how everyone takes this so lightly. Making ignorant comments about how Ukraine should nuke Russia first and how we should completely destroy Russia. It’s sad that this is what we’ve become. Not a single mention of a peace agreement.
MrHmuriy@reddit
The Russians want to kill us and to take our land. We don't want that. There's little room for negotiation or peace agreement.
thesaint1000@reddit
I wont argue you on that especially since I don’t live there. However, the US has been pushing for a conflict with Russia for years and they are using Ukraine to do it.
MrHmuriy@reddit
I don't know how America pushed Russia to attack Ukraine, seize part of its territory and declare it part of Russia
thesaint1000@reddit
I talk to my friend in Kiev almost everyday. She said they are just tired and want peace. Meanwhile the west is just keep pushing Ukraine and Russia closer to the edge.
RyAllDaddy69@reddit
Those knuckleheads are so detached from the realities of war that they don’t understand the weight of that “Slava Ukraine/Don’t give an inch” bullshit. It’s like they all forget that people are fucking dying every day, and it’s not just Russians.
KarlosMacronius@reddit
Lol "russsia says...". Yeah OK russia. 🙄
BigTitsanBigDicks@reddit
This threat is great politics for them. Trump gets to come in *deescalate* & blame Biden, Putin gets some gibbs & also blame Biden.
jmcgil4684@reddit
From Putins perspective, I just don’t understand what this is all for. He wants the old ways back? They weren’t that good bud.
randynumbergenerator@reddit
Russia has a demographic problem, coupled with the threat of economic irrelevance as the world transitions away from oil and gas. That threatens the grift that keeps the Russian oligarchy alive. Ukraine has resources in the form of agricultural land, industrial capacity, and people, not to mention more warm water shoreline on the Black Sea. Plus it keeps the people focused on an external enemy and nationalism instead of the wholesale theft by said oligarchy.
jmcgil4684@reddit
Thank you for the overview, and taking the time.
FaceDeer@reddit
They were good for the Russian elites.
Tasty_Tip_68@reddit
I doubt they will but ok.
LvBorzoi@reddit
Putin needs to take note of how we responded to 911. If he tries (maybe succeeds, maybe not) to nuke the US we would turn all of Russia into a smoking cinder.
He may be nuts but he isn't crazy, so I think it bluff and bluster to isolate Ukraine.
Shrewd-Intensions@reddit
That’s the main issue with MAD, they’re both using salami tactics.
StupendousMalice@reddit
Bring it bitch.
Jealous-Friendship34@reddit
Putin needs to either do it or STFU.
Upstairs-Parsley3151@reddit
Basing every government off Republics was a mistake since they all turn into dictatorshios with access to a well built up society full of nuclear weapons.
Zixinus@reddit
The US is ready for a nuclear conflict.
Russia is not. It has failed to do a successful nuclear-ready Sarmat-2 (Satan) ballsitic missile test since 2022. The last test resulted in the missile blowing up in the silo.
Russia threatens nuclear war every week and every time Biden finally does anything. It threatened nuclear strikes with the HIMARs. The F-16s. Anything.
The real escalation was the cutting of two undersea cables. That's all Russia actually can do.
Russia will not and cannot use nuclear weapons. India and China has made it clear that they will respond with hostility (India buying oil and China's quiet support is what is keeping Russia from collapsing) and Russia would know that that counter-strikes would be immediately launched. Russia has been told that if so much as radioactive dust comes from any of its occupied territories, that will be considered a nuclear attack. Russia keeps the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant occupied, mined and implicitly threatens to blow it up constantly (like the time they burned rubber tires in the evaporation towers).
Do not believe Russian propaganda. Russians believe US people are hopelessly naive and easily manipulated. Don't make them right.
ComprehensiveAge9950@reddit
Let's hope not
sdkfz250xl@reddit
It’s is common practice for Russians to use their maintenance money for anything other than maintenance. Maintaining ICBMs is very expensive. I kind of doubt they can get their missiles out of the silos.
4-me@reddit
How about we not find out.
ALargeMastodon@reddit
How about we not find out what happens when we let dictators invade their neighbors on a whim?
4-me@reddit
OK, I’m good with that. I’m not sure why your hostile response implies I wouldn’t be.
Middle_Aged_Insomnia@reddit
Because she is a troll. Check her post history
Wildfire9@reddit
So, are they going to nuke Ukraine? With prevailing winds pushing into Russia?
Usual-Scarcity-4910@reddit
Sure they will, suck more
Anaxamenes@reddit
I think we have a better nuclear defense than we know. It makes no sense to parade it all over the planet, it’s just better to quietly upgrade and deploy with your allies.
Own_Structure7916@reddit
I think in continental US there are some state-of-the-art missile defenses to mitigate a nuclear attack. But in Europe our governments have cut military spending so much in the last decades, we don't even have public shelters anymore, we are pretty much toast if a nuclear exchange happens.
Anaxamenes@reddit
Yes but it makes sense for the US to have missile defenses in Europe because it’s better to catch them when they are close to the ground near hostile states. I believe there is a point they are in space at the top of their arc that they aren’t as easy to target and destroy.
babiekittin@reddit
Dude. Russia threatens a nuclear response once a month.
stayonedeep@reddit
Fallout
JennieCritic@reddit
The mainstream press says it is "only saber rattling". Like rattling nuclear weapons is nothing to worrry about (but global warming might raise the oceans in 100 years is more important to prepare for).
LazyBearBull@reddit
They have been "ready" since day one. Yet, red lines slowly became brown.
rekishi321@reddit
Bring it on, not afraid. If anything we should send 10 million of our boys in to encircle Moscow.
riptripping3118@reddit
Nonsense
OnTheEdgeOfFreedom@reddit
Yawn, Is it Wednesday already? Oh look, Putin issued another threat. Is that number 369 or 370?
NATO has already stated that if Russia sets off a tactical in Ukraine, NATO's response will be conventional, not nuclear. They will simply take to the air and blow every Russian solder out of Ukraine. Honestly I wonder if that day isn't coming anyway, as NATO is entirely capable of doing it and this crap has gone on for too long. But that's the stated plan; it doesn't escalate into strikes on the US because the response would crash Russia and get Putin assassinated. And he knows it.
bill_klondike@reddit
A different option is that Putin might test a nuke within Russia before he uses one tactically. The last time they detonated one was 1990. It would send a message that 1) they don’t care about the test ban they let expire 2) demonstrate to the world their nukes work and 3) demonstrate to themselves their nukes work thereby mitigating the risk a dud winds up in US hands.
FaceDeer@reddit
Russia recently tried doing an ICBM test that didn't go very well. I wouldn't be surprised if their nukes have rotted from corruption too, and a bad test attempt would show that. Might be best for Putin to continue leaving it ambiguous.
bill_klondike@reddit
I didn’t hear about that but that’s the spirit of what I’m getting at. Besides American nukes deploying on Russian territory, the next worst outcome would be NATO getting an intact Russian delivery system. Too risky to undo 70+ years of top level secrets.
WeUsedToBeACountry@reddit
Russia has two major population centers. If they use anything more than a tactical nuke, there won't be any Russians left.
We aren't exactly dealing with the USSR here.
SMTecanina@reddit
I've said it multiple times in multiple posts already
Russia claims Crimea as a part of russia.
Ukraine has utilized western supplied long-range weapons such as ATACMS and Storm Shadow/SCALP missiles against russian assets in Crimea.
Using their own logic, this has been happening for a while now.
EmergencyAnimator326@reddit
There IS No Logic to those threats Only to pressure the Western civilians ITS fearmongering Putins useful idiots in the west. Noone IS nuking qnyone because noone wants to live in an apocaliptic wastelqnd. Dont BE stupid people they Play with your fears.
Long_Run_1039@reddit
Isn’t there a thread here we’re it talks about nuclear exchange doesn’t necessarily mean the end of the world?!?
FaceDeer@reddit
"The end of the world" is such a broad and subjective phrase that it's basically useless, IMO.
Long_Run_1039@reddit
End of the world, apocalyptic wasteland, end of days, it’s just an expression that everyone uses to say it’s all over when nukes fly. There is a thread here that challenges this notion.
FaceDeer@reddit
The problem is that different people interpret "the end of the world" very differently.
Literally crack the planet and blow it into an asteroid field? End all life? End just the human species specifically? Destroy civilization and send us back to the stone age? Destroy modern civilization and go back to the 1800s? Five billion deaths, one billion deaths, a hundred million deaths? Is "the world" that's ending really just the United States and Europe? Just their form of government, their culture, their hegemony over the rest of the world? Or maybe just the comfortable lifestyle that people have grown accustomed to?
Some of these are plausible, some of these are unlikely, some of these are wildly unrealistic. But when you say "the end of the world" there can be people who jump to any of those outcomes.
ny_icequeen@reddit
Meh. He's been threatening for years. He won't because China would step in since fallout would hit not just rest of Russia but them too. Also he's pulling equipment from WW1 & WW2. Our stuff is current. He's more likely to shoot nukes at the US & have them veer off course into Moscow itself than actually hit an intended target, and THEN the west would retaliate just for the intent.
boozefiend3000@reddit
Do people actually think this will lead to nuclear war? Seems pretty clueless to me
kingofthesofas@reddit
Why is the same damn thing being posted here 10x times a day. I swear I have had this same conversation on this sub a million times in the last few days. Mods can we just get a sticky thread about this topic and delete the rest?
njgunlord@reddit
cant wait for them to nuke the comedian. i will be eating popcorn @ the time.
ryansdayoff@reddit
Russia has an idiom that works pretty well in this instance "China's final warning" which is essentially a meaningless threat that holds no actual weight
RedSun-FanEditor@reddit
It's nothing but Russian grandstanding. Responding with nuclear weapons is:
A) complete overkill
B) will result in a nuclear response from both the U.S. and Europe.
C) if Russia nukes either a major Ukrainian city or a city in Europe or the U.S., a proportional retaliatory response to one of Russia's major cities will decimate a huge portion of their population and instigate a major nuclear war.
So in short, it's not gonna happen.
ghgfghffghh@reddit
The United States has made it clear they will not use nuclear weapons if Russia does. But they will have an extreme response.
EffinBob@reddit
Then Russia will shortly cease to exist.
Vegetaman916@reddit
Along with the rest of the world. That's how it works, y'know.
GeforcerFX@reddit
Australia and New Zealand might make it out a bit unscathed.
Vegetaman916@reddit
Depends. Because this whole thing is, imo, part of a collective effort by Russia and China together. And it won't really get going until China drops the hammer on Taiwan. At that point, AUKUS and all that, I think the problem comes closer to home down under...
FaceDeer@reddit
China has 500 nukes in total, and they don't have the naval power necessary to invade anywhere overseas. If Russia's gone and sparked off an idiotic nuclear war I think China would prefer to sit it out. They get a free Siberia in the aftermath, all they have to do is not do anything stupid to get involved in the direct fighting.
EffinBob@reddit
We'll see. Or we won't.
Vegetaman916@reddit
Quite right.
Poison-Ivy-666@reddit
Apparently this is Russia’s population density. If Pukin uses nukes his entire population can be wiped out in minutes. And he knows it.
In addition, the reason the EU hasn’t gone in guns blazing is for the same reasons the US doesn’t go in guns blazing. We don’t want another war. We’re simply doing what the US has always done in history - fund and arm in the hope of keeping bastards at bay without getting dragged into a global conflict.
FaceDeer@reddit
Yeah, people look at the world map and go "woah, Russia's huge."
Russia is Moscow and St. Petersburg.
Comfortable_Try8407@reddit
It would be a tactical nuke response if ever. A strategic level strike would be game over.
Economically a Nuke would do more harm to Russia. Who would trade with them? China would have to go all in with Russia or back out. Same with India. It would guarantee a nuclear armed Ukraine in the future and possibly other Eastern European countries.
SnooStrawberries1078@reddit
If launched, what's the % chance Russian nukes hit the intended target? Even make it out of Russia?
Alt-account9876543@reddit
Joe Biden allows Ukraine to use weapons; Russia retaliates. We get into it with Russia - Joe freezes the transition of power because of the current stalemate - stalemate lasts for 4 years, hands over reins to Kamala. Election results “expire”
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IronSide_420@reddit
What's wrong with freezing the transition of power? Trump and his team tried it from nov-jan. #StopTheSteal
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Accomplished-Wish494@reddit
Exactly how does this happen? No one can “freeze the transition of power” and then choose their successor in the US.
VengefulAncient@reddit
Russian here. Stop listening to that clown and send Ukraine more arms. Nukes are only going to fly if Putin is allowed to continue attacking the free world without consequences. That's how people (in the broadest sense of the term) like him work. They act on weakness.
thepottsy@reddit
Don't worry. Trump will give Putin a handy, and everything will be fine.
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Ancient-Being-3227@reddit
Obviously Biden approved this because dementia/dictator Donnie is taking over in a couple months. Ukraine can do a lot of damage to Russia in that period but it’s highly doubtful pansy Putin will retaliate with nukes since he knows his own operative will soon take control of the white house again. Everyone can fucking relax.
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melodicmelody3647@reddit
But Dump said the war would end as soon as he was elected…
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Tombstonesss@reddit
I don’t know if you know this or not but Biden is still president.
melodicmelody3647@reddit
No way! I had no idea.
Anyways, in October Trump said “I’m gonna try and I think I can get it ended as President elect. In other words, before I even take over the White House. “
Spaghettio_Hat@reddit
No one in this sub read The Road... That book made me terrified of nuclear fall out. 😳 I pray to whatever God is running this sh*t show that this never happens. 🙏
CarmenCage@reddit
At this point I’ll take nuclear war over a second reign of Trump. Likely I’d die because Yellowstone would erupt due to seismic activity from a nuclear bomb, but I honestly don’t care. Let’s just blow this mother up.
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Away_Somewhere_4230@reddit
Russia should taken out the dem’s areas, not civilians just Illuminaty the 200 corps soros bill gates fauci when are they going to have a great summit meeting again lol no wouldnt wish it on my worst enemy actually just suck up the fact u lost and humans can actually start to get out from the prison bars of life these people have put on us and maybe well get help with the snake and draco wars soon
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Lakiratbu@reddit
Ukraine should maximize all weapons it has while biden is still president. Once Dump assumes office, they will be at Russia's mercy
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Greenmantle22@reddit
Nuclear blackmail. It’s the only play they’ve got left.
“Let us do what we want, or we’ll launch nukes!” They’ve been saying that for 70 years.
InitiativePositive77@reddit
After being ok'd by Biden
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Abuck59@reddit
Putin won’t do shit until his buddy is sworn in. Then we all better get our popcorn ready. 🙏🏽 Those 2 mf’s have something planned, take that to the bank.🫡
Putin has been waiting for this weakness ever since he first had a really good talk with the imbecile. Both parties suck ass but only one wants to be a King.😉
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Psychological_Ad9165@reddit
Get that old criminal with dementia locked up !
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MadGriZ@reddit
Biden was asked "we want Ukraine to use long range missiles; ice cream?" Yes!
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Pearl-2017@reddit
I don't think Russia will nuke Ukraine because in 2 mths Trump will give it to Putin. Why waste a nuke?
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donefuctup@reddit
Lol Putin keeps talking. He ain't doing anything. Just waiting until his pet takes office
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Helassaid@reddit
Zero chance the Kremlin uses a nuclear device deliberately on Ukrainian positions. That would immediately escalate into the 3rd World War. Most of Eastern Europe would probably declare war out of principle. If Moscow is willing to nuke Ukraine, everyone else is in existential peril.
In this scenario, nobody wins, though. Some people will just lose less. Although my expectation is most of the old Iron Curtain is going to be uninhabitable for a few decades.
Foragologist@reddit
Biden got us out of Afghanistan, albeit painful. Now he's going to push Russia back over the line they fucking crossed.
Hate'em for what you want, but Trump was to pansy to pull the Afgan bandaid off, and now the Ruskies need to be told to STFU. Trump might lower my income tax, but he's only going to suck Putins dick and make China tariff imports pass along to consumers.
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C10H24NO3PS@reddit
Like it or not, Putin is incredibly intelligent and disciplined. He isn’t stupid enough to murder the world and commit suicide because Biden gave Zelensky a few rockets.
The update to Russian nuclear doctrine is a warning, not an indication they are going to use nukes.
We are far more likely to see retaliation in the form of cyberattacks (power grids, water treatment, big data leaks, banking systems, GPS etc.)
At most we will see a major increase in conventional strikes on Ukraine, and potentially conventional strikes on NATO supply chains entering Ukraine.
In the extremely unlikely event that Putin can’t wait 2 months for his buddy to enter the Whitehouse and end the war, and it does turn nuclear, nowhere in the US will be safe unless you have a self-sufficient underground shelter that can provide years of food, water, oxygen and waste management at a minimum. The US will be littered with thousands of nukes on every city, and the fallout and subsequent nuclear winter will cause a complete collapse of the US ecosystem - if not the whole planet.
If you truly believe nuclear war is imminent and want to survive - build a shelter or accept your fate
backcountry57@reddit
Agreed Putin is ex KGB interrogator, he has seen things, he knows how to play people. Never underestimate your enemy. Like it or not he is very good,
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ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
Nuclear winter is a myth based on a very flawed model that used the absolute worst case for every single input.
C10H24NO3PS@reddit
It’s not a myth, it’s a debated issue. I’d rather prep for it and be wrong, than think I know it’s a myth and not prep for it and be wrong…
ManyThingsLittleTime@reddit
I read up on it and it's not something I'm worried about.
chargoggagog@reddit
Not gonna happen. Russia knows the incoming president is very pro Russia. They won’t drop a nuke now knowing they only have to wait a couple months.
LordMongrove@reddit
Not sure why you are downvoted. It’s as reasonable a take as any other.
chargoggagog@reddit
My guess? Trumpies are threatened by the truth. They don’t want to believe their dear leader supports Putin.
Simplenipplefun@reddit
Im not pro Trump but we've all heard these bullshit lines so much for so long without any proof. Quite the opposite, all of this stuff turns out to be lies.
chargoggagog@reddit
His love of Putin is well documented.
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Nde_japu@reddit
Yeah it's dumb. I'm worried the opposite happens. Trump offers some peace deal, Putin rejects it, Trump gets pissed and escalates the weapons to Ukraine which then causes Russia to escalate and we spiral from there.
No_Foot@reddit
Regardless it's a huge chance for him to show that he isn't weak and scared of putin, and that he wouldn't bend to putins will to the detriment of his country. A win for putin is peace with the current territory and no defencive guarantees for Ukraine, I can't see trump being dominated into giving him everything he wants, it would be catastrophic for his 'strongman' image.
Spnszurp@reddit
he literally took putins word over US intelligence.
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Super_Bag_4863@reddit
He supports an isolationist america. You warmongering neocons aren’t going to have your forever wars anymore. The American government is scoping back in domestically, no more world police.
Old_Dragonfruit6952@reddit
Let's hope that is the case .
xlvi_et_ii@reddit
Isn't the opposite also true?
A friendly incoming administration is less likely to be concerned if Russia starts using WMD's (especially at a tactical level).
slendermanismydad@reddit
Russia's entire military was dead broke before Putin started propping it up. Their soldiers were killing themselves because they weren't getting paid but death benefits were going to their families.
Putin put Trump back in because Russia probably has another six months before this all collapses. All that money they stole went to people not the country.
If they use nukes in any fashion, prepping isn't going to do anything because everyone will be wiped out. They also won't because they need access to the Petro resources in Ukraine. It's why they invaded, to loot them too. If they set off nukes, they're not going to be able to get to it for years or they're going to have to use actual slaves that will die. In which case, the planet is also fucked.
Stop talking about Trump. He's running a circus to distract everyone. If Russia uses nukes, then everyone else with them can use them too. Forget the US, that means India and Pakistan and Israel and China. Everyone else also hates each other. They use the US as a distraction to point fingers while shoving their bullshit out of sight.
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SubstantialAside3708@reddit
Lots of discussion in this thread, but no talk about who’s most in danger. If nukes start flying at the US, what cities/areas are most in danger? Or is it just look at the map of cities/military bases/nuke silos and pray you’re not near that and not downwind of fallout?
WordWordNumber31@reddit
If there is a nuclear exchange between Russia and NATO, you will die. Looking at a map will help you predict whether you’ll die in a blast, burn to death, radiate or starve.
Jamgull@reddit
They’re probably bluffing again. At least once a week for the past two years or so, Putin has said they’re ready to use nuclear weapons. Hasn’t happened yet, though he’s had plenty of opportunity to do so.
BobbyCorwen2000@reddit
Nothing will happen.
Even if it did, Russia can't even beat a backwater small-time country like the Ukraine. This whole campaign of theirs has been a disaster and has shown the world how ineffective they are, this is just mindless dog barking by them.
Germainshalhope@reddit
Yeah it's been super embarrassing for them.
thevernabean@reddit
MSNBC should be ashamed of this article. I'm almost certain it was written by an AI.
1millerce1@reddit
There has been an immense amount of lines drawn and crossed on both sides. It's all BS until it isn't. But it's the diplomacy game that is accepted practice and makes everyone feel like there's some level of control and comfort. Classic 'how I learned to stop worrying and love the bomb'.
There will be no safety and if you do find safety, consider yourself exceedingly lucky.
tree_boom@reddit
> Their entire navy (to include submarines) and air force is not generally considered a huge problem
Apart from all the SSBNs carrying SLBMs of course.
> There has been open source speculation that their ICBMs are inert due to corruption sells of the tritium needed to keep them in service.
That speculation is unwarranted. There are non-military users of Tritium, but the global demand is miniscule and sales are extremely tightly regulated. It's not like the engineers can siphon some off and sell it to Vlad down the pub, and the legitimate users aren't going to be buying it from Vlad down the pub either...but even if you ignored those problems and asserted they filled all the world's non-military needs from clandestine sales of Tritium they'd still have plenty to maintain the weapons.
> We have several abilities to defend against attacks when they in large do not.
Russia has anti-ICBM defences just as the US does, but neither nation's systems would be sufficient to deflect a determined attack by the other.
lepardstripes@reddit
Safest place is the state of grace.
robtbo@reddit
When will the United States start building bomb shelters for its citizens?
Large_Change8279@reddit
I’m ready I’m so sick of my job.
kathmandogdu@reddit
harryhooters@reddit
What if Ukraine secretly still has nukes all along?? this won't end well....
WangusRex@reddit
Russia just installed a US president beginning his term in a few months. They’re not going to attack the country they just defeated right before the fruits of their efforts are ripe.
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Chief7064@reddit
Russia ran the Harris campaign?
WangusRex@reddit
The Harris campaign made some costly mistakes and Biden/DNC refused to acknowledge what democrats and/or 3/4 of the voting public actually wanted. Regardless Harris still got more votes that Trump. Harris didn’t lose, Trump was chosen as the winner.
It’s foolish to deny Putin’s fingerprints all over Trump’s success. He is undeniably in contact with Musk who in addition to buying votes is also influencing Trump’s chaotic cabinet picks. Musk also obviously controlled how information was presented to vulnerable minds on Twitter (X)
Conservative (and even “middle”$ media companies with questionable funding streams controlled the media narrative.
All demonstrably true facts.
GrooverMeister@reddit
Quit your bitching Trump will be here to suck your dick pretty soon
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Name calling and inflammatory posts or comments with the intent of provoking users into fights will not be tolerated.
Comments that discourage others from prepping, demean them, or otherwise harm genuine discussions are not permitted and will be removed. A common example of this is discussions involving "nuclear war". If your "prep" involves suicide or inaction, keep your fatalistic commentary to yourself.
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farmersdogdoodoo@reddit
Why would he start a nuke war now. His bitch boy trump will be in office in just a couple more weeks and putin will be allowed to steam roll any European country he wants will trump will do nothing…
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react-dnb@reddit
Doesnt everyone use US made missiles?
premar16@reddit
Some people haven't seen Red Dawn and it shows! Jk lol
Multipass-1506inf@reddit
Russian cowards won’t do shit. They didn’t do shit when they threatened nukes over the introduction of tanks, they threatened over F-16s, over MLRS, over aiming for The Kurch bridge… they are all talk. Russians are spineless morons and won’t do and dang thing.
Aromatic-Deer3886@reddit
Ruzzia isn’t going to nuke anyone or anything
carbon-based-drone@reddit
Fucking do it already. We’re tired of hearing you complain to the manager, Karen.
lanzendorfer@reddit
If there was going to be a nuclear response, it would have happened by now, and we probably wouldn't have gotten a warning about it.
At this point I'm kind of like either get it over with and end the world or STFU. Either way IDGAF.
Awesome_hospital@reddit
I mean, they pretty much threaten nukes any time anything happens so it's kinda losing it's fear factor
captaindomon@reddit
Which in some ways, makes the situation more dangerous, unfortunately.
CamedMyPants69420@reddit
That’s how I’m feeling, we call think they’re bluffing. Until we wake up one morning to realize the last threat wasn’t a bluff. Similar to how most were thinking at the beginning of this thing, “they’d never invade Ukraine that’d be so stupid” Dude is unstable and one days threat may hold more weight than the previous.
The_Nauticus@reddit
The Kremlin who cried Nuke.
WearsTheLAMsauce@reddit
They’ve literally been talking about this for 40 years, just keep living your life
Daekar3@reddit
I'm going to die laughing, maybe literally, if the entire left was pissing itself over Trump only to have Biden get everyone nuked to beaded glass on his way out the door.
I can only imagine the observing aliens doing a stand-up routine after the fact, they would get quite a chuckle.
bergler82@reddit
have at it. I can't take this posturing any more. Most of their nukes will most likey explode in their launch tubes.
AtmosphereCivil5379@reddit
I'd be upset too if the explosive items landing in my yard had "Made in the USA" on them.
.
This is how you get North Koreans.
YeaOhRetro@reddit
All posturing. Nobody is using a nuclear response. Self assured mutual destruction. There’s a reason only one bomb has been used in history. All scare tactics
waler620@reddit
It was 2, but you make a valid point.
Nursul_Mugabadaev@reddit
“Russia says” is where I stop reading
RabicanShiver@reddit
If there's a nuclear response of any kind, every store and ATM within 100 miles from your house will be empty no matter where you live.
That's best case scenario if it's a limited strike in Ukraine.
If it escalates into a nuclear exchange... Maybe we get lucky and someone throws Putin out a window after only a few cities are destroyed. If we start a real exchange, we're all doomed.
ReactionAble7945@reddit
Lol. They are not that dumb. . They know once some uses nukes, the oth we r side will also
Poison-Ivy-666@reddit
UK here. Pukin is a sneaky bastard. Before he uses nukes he’ll use destabilisation. See underwater cables in recent news. I’m expecting loss of communications, ‘accidents’ in power facilities, DDOS attacks, ‘terror’ attacks he can blame on other bad actors, gas supplies cut off, etc etc. His disinformation and conspiracy projects have worked pretty well over the last few years. He wants to bring us to our knees, not nuke us.
GhostofAyabe@reddit
No this isn't happening.
No, there is no where you would be safe.
Stop worrying about it.
EROSENTINEL@reddit
wont happen
Zorandercho@reddit
Mate, it's not like Russia hasn't made that threat 10 times a day for the past...1000 days.
MrHmuriy@reddit
The Russians have been doing this for three years of the war - as soon as they have problems, they immediately start scaring everyone with nuclear weapons. The Russians just want to be able to destroy cities, plunder captured territories, kill civilians, and get away with it, while those around them watch and do nothing. While the Russian elites send their stolen money and their children to the West - these are just words. When they start buying real estate in the DPRK - then it is worth starting to worry. Ukraine has already destroyed half of their early warning system and nothing happened. If we talk about ATACMS, then this is more of a symbol - Ukraine was given very few of these missiles, while Ukraine sends more than 80 long range drones and cruise missiles of its own production to Russia every day.
Happyman321@reddit
I think it helps to keep in mind that US nuclear doctrine, as far as we know, is completely retaliatory and as long as Russia nukes only Ukraine, this SHOULDNT escalate into some kind of thermonuclear war. US is not going to get itself involved in that over Ukraine.
buy-american-you-fuk@reddit
nobody wins a nuclear conflict, not even russia
Embarrassed-Aspect-9@reddit
It's actually ideal time to escalate, this is why... the US is very divided on who will be in charge, Ru knows that the current will try to stay in power. So long as the US isn't directly engaged the US is unlikely to issue a nuclear strike to answer a strike on Europe. Even though bound by treaty the US has a long history of not honoing treaty obligations and RU knows it. The result would be a world wide flight from the USD no matter what the US chose in response. Also the pride and desire to stay in power could cause a concurrent internal conflict to further cause chaos. All without a single nuclear strike on the US itself. I don't want any if this to happen, but strategically it is what it is. 💀💩😔
renegadeindian@reddit
Putin will rule the world with threats. He has been doing this since the Cold War. He’s old school KGB. That’s why do many sex crimes in the Ukraine area especially against guys. It’s their bag. He said may or may not but he will threaten to get more stuff. That’s his go to.
U-47@reddit
Russia has threatend with nuclear response litterly since the first hour of its offensive against Ukraine in 2022. This is nothing new.
BrandoSandoFanTho@reddit
The global conflagration is coming soon. Maintain strength, comrades.
Nibb31@reddit
Russia is not going to nuke the United States.
Repeat after me.
Russia is not going to nuke the United States.
maxxdues@reddit
I thought Trump was gonna start ww3. I feel cheated now
FangsOut23@reddit
Stop pushing the media hype of bs. Get a life
Reggio_Calabria@reddit
Russia, bothering the world for 70 years because the US wouldn’t drop 2 nuks on them in the early 50s.
Inside-Ad-4076@reddit
Because it’s not about Ukraine. putin couldn’t care less, he aims higher and if NATO won’t step in now, it will cost much more in ~ 3 years from now.
Oscarjrs5@reddit
Bring it on
Visible-Produce-6465@reddit
A nuclear attack by Russia is strategically a dumb decision. Since all of Ukrainian troops are already entrenched. A tactical nuke would do less damage than maybe 10 conventional missiles. Even a strategic nuke wont really do much a lot of spread out soldiers.already sitting in bomb shelters. It's not worth it for Russia to use a nuke
RedditModsRFucks@reddit
I honestly think before we let that happen we’d evaporate Putin with a space laser that we 100% have.
Long_Run_1039@reddit
I could see them nuking Ukraine, that will def send a message about nato expansion.
Additional_Maybe_795@reddit
The fallout varies by weapon system. The first stuff to fall out is large particles that were lifted- debris and ash that is somewhat radioactive. Its the nuclear material that is the worst fallout and can come down based on altitude of distribution and weather patterns. It really won’t take that many large scale nukes to make human life pretty unlivable. A few small tactical nukes are “just another radioactive accident.” So “normal society” goes on. You just eat slightly radioactive mcnuggets and cokes. Much more than that and you can’t really prep for more than a few years of survival to enjoy death by starvation, predation, or multiple cancers.
ballskindrapes@reddit
Y'all getting worked up over nothing.
This is a dictatorship way of counting to three for a child...and they never ever get close to three....
Unusual_Resolve2708@reddit
Once a nuclear bomb is used - there be no end until all is destroyed. Think about this.
No_Skin7645@reddit
Speak of mutually assured destruction? Nice story, tell it to Reader's Digest!
Petrivoid@reddit
Besides the obvious saber rattling they are most likely to use nuclear weapons in tactical strikes on ukrainian soil. It's really not worth worrying about them targeting the US directly at this time
kkinnison@reddit
Russia is using Iran, North Korea munitions into cities of Ukraine as well as using North Korean troops in battle
Russia has already escalated well beyond what US has allowed even before this
stop being Russian propaganda
Russia is so behind on its nuclear warhead upkeep they I bet they cannot even get them to detonate anymore.
DiarrheaPoopBalls@reddit
Slava NATO 🏳️⚧️🏳️🌈
bvogel7475@reddit
Pointless threats from a man who feels like he is losing all of his power. He knows Russia will cease to exist in its current form if he launches a nuke. Every NATO country will unleash non stop nuclear strikes if he dares to make a nuclear move.
RipArtistic8799@reddit
Russia keeps putting out these BS threats. They won't launch a nuke. Every turn of this entire conflict they keep threatening to do it. They absolutely will not. This is complete Russian BS.
RoninisFury2020@reddit
We need to just go and silently eliminate Putin
J701PR4@reddit
“We?”
Rikan_legend@reddit
This is the time when we need UFOs to show up and do something about it 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
MurkyCress521@reddit
No way Russia is launching a first strike against the US. Russia would need to launch at least 5-10 missiles to overwhelm our ballistic missile shield. Such an action would result in Putin and his shitbag cronies being introduced to the surface of sun.
Russia is not starting a nuclear war over minor improvements in the targets that Ukraine is allowed to strike in Russia if Russia was willing to start a war of minor nonsense, they would have some it already. Russia would not nuke the US even if the US gave Ukraine nuclear weapons and Ukraine destroyed Moscow, they would instead nuke Ukraine.
TooSmalley@reddit
Russia has thrown nuclear escalation at the west every time it has saber rattles for the last decade.
Russia on paper has the largest army and airforce in Europe and couldn't effectively invade Ukraine one of the poorest counties in Europe. I doubt they have the nuclear capabilities they claim.
Is Ukraine worth the annihilation of their country, I highly doubt it.
Sendit24_7@reddit
The prevailing wisdom is that he would first use battlefield nukes in Ukraine. Nobody is going to nuke the US any time soon
charbo187@reddit
is this a serious question? a nuclear exchange means the end of society. period. full stop.
the lucky ones would die instantly in the initial volley. those who survived would envy the dead. there'd be no food in about a month. famine and diseases run rampant. human population cut down from 8 billion to maybe a few 10s of millions within 36 months.
Basic-Mycologist7821@reddit
Uh huh. So… would Waffle House close or what?
Nero8762@reddit
Not a fucking chance.
Comfortable-Panic436@reddit
Puffy
humanbeing21@reddit
If the war-criminal, dictator Putin doesn't want people shooting missiles at his country, he might want to consider ending the brutal invasion of a free and proud country that happens to be our ally
Comfortable-Panic436@reddit
Puffu
OutlawCaliber@reddit
Nothing would start with nukes, and I doubt Russia would act alone. I suspect, if they decide to move, it will be Russia, China, Iran, and North Korea, and likely some others as well, that will move at the same time to create too many points for the US military to be able to respond effectively. There's been chatter about this for roughly the past year, give or take. Also, if we're going to get hit, it will start with massive end-day cyber attacks on everything in the US, allies, and bases. As for survival, don't live in a big city, and don't be near military bases, major hubs for planes and ships, etc. Stay inside for two weeks, and use potassium iodide or iodine directly on the throat over the thyroid if you get or suspect exposure. The half-life is fast, and most attacks are air bursts rather than ground bursts. My bigger concern is other people and nuclear power plants. Unlike nukes, atomic power plants have radioactive fuel that would contaminate the area around them for a long period of time. You can pull up wind maps, play with nuke map, and a couple other sources to get an idea on what things would look like in your area.
1one14@reddit
Talk about spite, LOL. Salt all the ground before DT gets in office. I expect Putin will start dropping tactical nukes on Ukraine unless DT can make some big promises. Ukraine should not have escalated at this stage in the game...
HappyAnimalCracker@reddit
I figured they were doing what they could while they still have a chance
CharmingMechanic2473@reddit
This is why we need disclosure… the good tech is about to drop.
According-Ad5312@reddit
Bring it
stoutymcstoutface@reddit
Jesus Christ - Russia threatens nuclear annihilation every Tuesday and Thursday.
Once the missiles are launched from F16s, they’ll also make nuclear threats on weekends.
BasedPontiff@reddit
This seems like Putin giving Trump another reason to stop supporting Ukraine even if he has no intention of actually using nukes. Trump can just say 'I'm not going to start a nuclear war, Ukraine will have to live with it' and Putin will have bought yet more time until he does this again with another country.
Vollen595@reddit
Sounds like the entire purpose of the United States, spreading Democratic values worldwide whether the offending Nation wants it or not.
maturecheddar@reddit
You can nuke your local neighborhood with a 1 ton bomb and get a good idea of the destruction.
https://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/
My dog walking spots are gone.
mildOrWILD65@reddit
China, Japan, Korea, the DPRK, and the EU absolutely will not allow Russia to use nuclear weapons. Even Fat Boy Kim doesn't want the risk of nuclear fallout drifting over his impoverished nation, unless he's the one inviting it.
KalleElle@reddit
Anyone that thinks a country that can barely fight a war on its own doorstep is capable of landing a nuke on the soil of the singular global military superpower is an absolute buffoon
Dry_Catch7310@reddit
Bring it Russia
petit_monstre12@reddit
Russia is not the Soviet Union or Warsaw pact anymore. They have few allies. NATO would respond to any nukes used and would cripple Russia.
Swimming_Duty_1889@reddit
Yawn
MattDapper@reddit
Read “Nuclear War: A Scenario” by Annie Jacobsen if you’re interested in what a nuclear conflict might look like. The book presents an all too possible, well researched and faceted scenario on the outcomes of nuclear war. It’s a very intense read.
EUV2023@reddit
But Russia had NO PROBLEM using Chinese and Korean weapons?
lineman4910@reddit
The ONLY reason i doubt he will use nukes is he knows Trump is about to take the reins. Putin has respect for Trump from what i have seen in the past. If he says no i think that will be the end of it. I have been wrong before but hopefully im right on this.
vamatt@reddit
It isn’t “respect” that Putin has for Trump
bishpa@reddit
Get real.
celtickerr@reddit
Friendly reminder that Putin has threatened nuclear war repeatedly and has not followed through. It's almost like it is an empty threat as actually following through serves no benefit.
https://www.newsweek.com/vladimir-putin-threatened-nuclear-war-35-times-uk-johnson-ukraine-russia-1720897
https://thebulletin.org/2024/02/putin-threatens-again-an-updated-timeline-of-commentary-on-potential-nuclear-escalation-of-the-russia-ukraine-war/
Flashy-Canary-8663@reddit
Russia is only able to stay in this fight due to economic support from China. Chinas entire economy is on a knife edge and they rely massively on the West to buy their goods. You think they’re going to let their little puppet Putin start a nuclear war because his little special military operation is going poorly, the one he visited Xi days before starting and likely promised would be quick and painless.
vamatt@reddit
Very true. If Putin used a nuke China would turn completely against Russia.
In the past few months there have also been signs that Putin has started loosing favor with Russia - many Chinese banks have stopped doing business with Russia.
WangusRex@reddit
Is it Tuesday already? Slow week for Russia.
mementosmoritn@reddit
Guess it's time to build the rad meter from the nuclear survival skills book, and start cutting trees for the shelter. I'm not financially stable enough for all this crap.
LJinBrooklyn@reddit
ATACms need to be managed and operated by the US military, so Russia will call it a direct attack by the US if they fire them into Russia.
This is serious shit and really bad.
Economy-Ad4934@reddit
Oh no more sabre rattling.
They won’t do shit because they know what happens next. Ignore it
PurpleBee7240@reddit
Russia has small-dick energy. Seriously, what a bunch of whiny bitch-ass motherfuckers.
Safe_Boy2000@reddit
GoGreenD@reddit
lol. If real nuclear war broke out, not a single thing aside from cockroaches are going to survive.
Ghost10165@reddit
They're all talk anyway.
Digital_Simian@reddit
Russia has threatened nuclear response a few times in the past couple years. At this point it seems primarily directed to use fear of nuclear war to push for a peace deal where Russia gets what it wants.
anonymouse0789@reddit
How can anyone support Biden’s “decision” for this shit?!? It’s insanity at the highest level while playing games with our lives!!
Careless_Pause2419@reddit
Russia only talk!
4BigData@reddit
predictable as f*ck
Vegetaman916@reddit
Everything you need.
However, I do not believe Putin will follow through. He knows now that victory is only a few months away. He will bide time now. The danger really only existed so long as Ukraine was able to mount a sustained push backed by unlimited US munitions. Without that... just another poor ex-soviet satalite.
HughDanforth@reddit
Did their invasion of Ukraine take three days? The Russian military is fully outfitted out? Guns all work perfectly? Surely they would not need to buy weapons from vassal nations like NK?
Fheredin@reddit
The saber rattling means this is almost certainly not a genuine threat. If Russia was actually planning a nuclear launch, they would go radio silent in hopes of blindsiding the target better.
Don't get me wrong; Russia is almost certainly up to something, but the nuclear arsenal is probably the distraction and not the threat.
-Spankypants-@reddit
Putin didn’t use nuclear weapons when he was losing, he’s not going to use them now while he’s winning. The odds have shifted heavily in Russia’s favor, with little to slow the momentum. We’re trying to any reason for the Russians to come to the bargaining table. This won’t do it.
Any_Price2924@reddit
They won’t. Pussies.
imactuallyugly@reddit
No balls
Rvplace@reddit
Democrats love war!
preppers-ModTeam@reddit
Your post has been removed for being "Not focused on prepping/Off-Topic - Political." Try to keep posts and comments on the topic of prepping and not on politics. You may reference political events in your posts and comments as a way to lead into a discussion of prepping, but the main point of your post or comment should not be about politics.
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snakes-can@reddit
If Russia gave a warning and shot a tactical (small) nuke at Ukraine, no country is lunching nukes at Russia.
USAFmuzzlephucker@reddit
Why does everyone believe Russia and start freaking out when they rattle their nuclear saber? They won't do shit. Putin isn't about to risk dying in a nuclear inferno. His generals aren't about to either.
Not only will it not happen, but his arsenal probably isn't in top shape even if he actually did want to.
0megon@reddit
Just do it already. As my grandad used to say, Shit or get off the pot.
DEATHbyBOOGABOOGA@reddit
Mine used to say shit in one hand and beg for Crimea in the other, see which one fills up first.
FahQBro@reddit
Russia will be a sea of fire and glass...
They're bluffing.
stacksmasher@reddit
This will never happen. A bomb dropped on Ukraine will only case massive fallout to blow into RU.
HobsHere@reddit
They've detonated a nuclear weapon in Ukraine before. And hundreds in Kazakhstan and Russia itself.
jamesegattis@reddit
I think Putin is afraid of a coup and this is more for people in Russia than anywhere else. In his "circle" Putin is one of the more reasonable people believe it or not, some powerful people around him want all out war. He's very dangerous but isn't stupid.
agent_flounder@reddit
I think you should be evaluating how your preps stack up to a variety of asymmetric retaliatory actions by Russia. E.g., various cyber attacks. I think those are more likely.
troublesome_imp@reddit
Yeah right. Putin is desperate as are his messages.
Thanato26@reddit
I feel that would be an exceptionally bad move for Russia.
vincedarling@reddit
Meh. I’ve lost count of the red lines that got crossed and Moscow did jack.
Different-Chest-5716@reddit
Putin has been saying this for the entire time this has been going on.
BetterGeiger@reddit
I hate that events bad for humanity are good for my business.
WTFAnimations@reddit
Russian threats about nukes are just so common at this point that they might as well just be a copypasta. They would be colossaly stupid to use even a tactical nuclear bomb.
No-Statement-978@reddit
The biggest threat to Democracy is Democracy itself. We live in a fear not felt since the Cold War. The Russians don’t want a nuclear war & neither do the NATO countries (USA). This said, it’s now a game of Chess. Who flinches? The Americans won’t, but the Russians might b/c Putin’s deliverability is questionable. He’s not sure if/when a nuclear strike is capable, but he’s gambling that it is capable. Time will tell (& I’m certain the Americans are back-channeling talks RFN).
KlounceTheKid@reddit
Okay I’m uninformed on this matter and I want to learn, what’s the deal? Were the missiles anything special? Like I guess what’s the difference between M4a and Brads ?
Blackhawk-388@reddit
I wouldn't be surprised if Russia used a few EMP devices in and around Ukraine. Non-nuclear results, but massive damage.
Sergio_AK@reddit
I think russia is playing with fire: US can strike first....
poestavern@reddit
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 Go USA. Go Ukraine!
poestavern@reddit
F ‘em.
aeric67@reddit
That rusty ole saber is going to fall apart from all the rattling.
TheySayImZack@reddit
The US has been ready for nuclear conflict since it dropped two bombs on Japan 80 years ago. Russia isn't going to do anything here.
But to answer your question: Not Montana, Nebraska, or the Dakotas. Not Chicago, or Denver, or Atlanta, or any big city. Not anywhere on either coast. If you're worried about nuclear war, you should have left any counter-force or counter-value target decades ago.
The safest place? Prob New Zealand, but who really knows.
TheGolfinDolfin@reddit
Russia couldn’t even take over the Ukraine I’m not worried they’re gunna start shit with us
hello_three23@reddit
Yikes
myheartbeats4hotdogs@reddit
Why would putin drop a nuke on the land he wants? Whats he going to do with it once it's contaminated and full of radiation??
ParallelPlayArts@reddit
If he were to launch nuclear weapons where are the likely targets?
lmsc07ct@reddit
Ukraine, kiev specifically. If it's outside of that then NATO is triggered.
jtshinn@reddit
Bet they don’t.
boobookitty2@reddit
Yes
CantEatNoBooksDog@reddit
They call this shit sabre-rattling.
Stuck-in-the-Tundra@reddit
I think them following through depends on a lot of things. If Ukraine strikes too deep into Russia or hits Moscow they will have to retaliate or the government will be seen as weak. Dropping a single Nuke as a message, even low yield in an unpopulated area of Ukraine would show the world they are serious. Their nationalists would celebrate and try to garner support for the show of restrained strength used “in self defense”.
Kradget@reddit
I'm pretty sure if an American farts too loud at this point, the Kremlin threatens to nuke the US and Europe.
Seated_Heats@reddit
My bad guys.
howdidigetheresoquik@reddit
"Ready for nuclear confrontation"
Any nuclear exchange is a MAD scenario. You don't tell someone you're about to annihilate them if you actually are
Adventurous_Bid4691@reddit
Putin knows better. He would cease to exist as a world power.
I'd be more worried about NK doing something stupid since they have nothing to lose.
Old_Dragonfruit6952@reddit
I am glad I live near a large airport , myriad oil storage tanks and an LNG terminal I stay tight here in my cushy Second Strike Zone. . It'll be a quick end.. The likelihood of a larger conflict will be in the cards if Putin uses Nuclear Weapons. Crap!.
gilbert2gilbert@reddit
Hide under your desk.
Fantastic-Series9339@reddit
They been saying this for years now.