What's the easiest EU country for residency as a retiree?

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ExpatProf-France21@reddit

American living in France since 2021. Bought my house site unseen while I was living and working in the UAE. I have also spent time in all of the cities on your short list oddly enough. France is definitely an option, particularly if you're only thinking of a couple of years. Moving over would be fairly painless given your savings and no desire to work. You'd only really need to think about your driver's license and opening a local bank account - tasks that can be challenging, but solvable. Paperwork is definitely a thing here, but as I have written before- commensurate with moving your whole life to a new country. (Why people would expect such a huge life event to be easy is beyond me.) I live in the countryside around 30 minutes from a city of 25k and find it works well. We pay taxes here and are covered by all of the social systems. My children now speak French fluently and life is pretty much like it has been everywhere else we have lived - meaning we are assimilating and beyond the honeymoon stage of, 'omg, I live in France!' Life isn't perfect here, but it isn't anywhere. There are good days and bad days and we face them just like our neighbors do, with only our passports being different. (For now)

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Previous_Repair8754@reddit

Portugal D7 for sure.

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

Thanks, that sounds easy. But I want to be more centrally located in Europe, so not Portugal, Bulgaria or Malta. I get claustrophobic on islands after a couple weeks. I want to hop on a train or drive a few hours.

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ginogekko@reddit

You don’t get to be picky

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

Yes, I do, indeed. I want to live where I'll be happy.

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_Jope_@reddit

You haven't consider that flying low cost can be extremely cheap. The more central countries have more qualified immigrants coming in, thus your visa processing could take forever (as in, up to a year in Germany for example)

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

I do know about flights, but since I have two dogs I'd have to drive. Or take them on a train. One is tall, too tall for the kennels on the Queen Mary II.

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trashnici2@reddit

Germany does not offer any kind of pension visa, additionally if you never paid into public health insurance until the age of 55 you are not eligible for public healthcare.

There are countries where OP has the possibility to reside, still most European countries aim for qualified immigrants and won’t allow people that might become a burden for their social system in the future without ever having contributed.

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Baejax_the_Great@reddit

You've done apparently zero research on this yourself and are going to be picky about the good advice others are giving you? Lol please stay in the states

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

You "think" I haven't done research. This is also part of my research. I know I can become a resident of Italy, and I feel at home with the culture, language, and people. Also in Argentina, Thailand, Ecuador, Indonesia, Panama, Mexico, France. There are many other countries I could reside, but these I know I'd feel comfortable in for 2-4 yrs.

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PrettyinPerpignan@reddit

You can pick just about any EU country for a visitor Visa. You should really think about where you want to go and live and narrow down your choices. For France long stay visa it’s simple if you have income/retirement or savings. I got an appointment 2 weeks after my app and my Visa was ready 2 days later. But France isn’t for everyone. Learning the language is essential and picking the right city is also important.

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

What do you consider in picking a city?

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PrettyinPerpignan@reddit

Culture? Quality of life access to healthcare. Weather. What do you like

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

A small city, convenient to a larger city, picturesque with culture and history. Places I'd be happy to live: Bassano del Grappa, Sapa, Mendoza, Rome, Lucca.

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PrettyinPerpignan@reddit

Ah so you have a short list. I’d visit those places first. Can you take two weeks off and hop around to each of these cities and see which one you like best

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

I've been to all of them. Sapa is one of the most beautiful places I've ever been- mountains, lake with koi, rice paddies.

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DBWVLF@reddit

Hi - may I ask what US city your appointment was in and how long ago this was?

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PrettyinPerpignan@reddit

DC in early September

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Wanderluster65@reddit

Turkey

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velikisir@reddit

I am assuming you are a non-EU citizen.

If real estate isn’t your focus, skip Greece.

Have you looked at Cyprus? Very generous immigration policies. You can qualify for their retirement visa on just $10k+ in annual income.

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

I'm an American. I don't want to invest $300K in a home. Italy gives an option of buying or leasing.

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ethlass@reddit

If you aren't investing in the country you are going to why would they want you there? You are retired, most likely means older. Older people are a strain on society (not in a bad way but it is what it is). Strain on society means you are going to cost more to society than give back to it. A society will not accept you unless you are going to provide back to it. Usually you do so by paying taxes all your life so your medical expenses (which will be higher by a lot compare to a 20 year old) can be paid for.

So, if you aren't going to invest a lot of money in the country they won't get taxes from you, those taxes needed to keep you healthy. No sane person in any society will be ok with someone rich arriving in their country to just guzzle up the resources and thus immigration policies usually require work/investment/business to open.

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

I have a good retirement and can meet the income requirements anywhere. And I'll also have my own health insurance. I wish to avoid the next four years of Trumpism.

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ethlass@reddit

You should have a good chance. Just was trying to explain why it is so hard when you are not a citizen to move to a country. I am lucky to have these citizenships and can move easily, I know however not everyone has that privilege. In an ideal world the entire planet will be just one country and we all get along :).

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PrettyinPerpignan@reddit

I’m confused why would anyone need to invest that much money in order to immigrate? That’s not a requirement for most visitor Visas

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ethlass@reddit

I thought I explained. Each person is a burden to society. Kids and elderly are drain of resources. Healthcare costs for elderly are astronomical (that is why we have things like insurance/collective ways to ease that burden), kids need education.

Countries want people to come and live there only if they will be a net positive (pay more in taxes than they will consume) to ensure their kids and elders can have these resources. That is why illegal immigration is really not something people want, these people arrive and usually do not pay taxes but still get to use utilities (even driving on the road for example).

Tourism is a net positive, you arrive at the country and just spend money there. You might use some of the utilities (roads, transportation) but you spend more than you receive. And that spending causes others to pay more taxes (as a lot of countries will let you not pay sale tax for example if you are a tourist). You also pay a lot more than normal for a place to stay (hotel) which has its own tax system usually. Pay for traveling (taxes on flights for airport usage).

As a society, you want to take care of yourselves collectively. And if an elderly person arrives at a country and just uses the health system and all other benefits without paying for it that is a burden. Kids are investment in the future in society as they will pay into it more than they receive. Elderly people already paid into it. A new elderly that never paid for it is in no nicer terms leaching on the younger generation. They did not pay for the healthcare of that country for 40 years. They didn't pay for any other utilities for 40 years.

The same reasons above are why countries usually allow high earners to more easily migrate and even give incentives. Because they in the grand scheme of things will pay more taxes than they will put in that society and probably won't stay until they actually need to get the benefits.

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PrettyinPerpignan@reddit

I really don’t understand why you wrote this long book report for me if the person qualifies for a visa and satisfies all the requirements and gets their own healthcare as required by the visa I don’t understand what your problem is

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GZHotwater@reddit

As they haven’t mentioned their nationality it’s (almost) safe to assume they’re American.

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RexManning1@reddit

😂😂😂😂

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GZHotwater@reddit

From a later post…

I'm an American. I don't want to invest $300K in a home. Italy gives an option of buying or leasing.

😂😂😂😂

On this and other international subs the majority of you’re countrymen (& women) have a habit of not announcing their nationalities…whereas most other posters do!

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RexManning1@reddit

I’m a multi-national. That part is one I often try and disclaim.

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Telecom_VoIP_Fan@reddit

Many people from the UK choose Spain or Portugal. Obviously, the weather is a key factor but it also seems to work from a residency viewpoint.

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reddit33764@reddit

Spain. Google NLV visa

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a_library_socialist@reddit

Just a note, that will require 2400 EUR in provable income a year, with 600 more per depedent.

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smirklurker@reddit

Can use savings instead if you have enough

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a_library_socialist@reddit

Believe that's a different visa, the Residence By Investment.

That requires you to move the money to Spain, anywhere from 250K to 2 million, depending on how you're holding it.

Note though that Spain has a wealth tax, which makes this path not as popular - since if you qualify for the RBI, you likely also qualify for the wealth tax.

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smirklurker@reddit

Nope it's the non lucrative visa. Source: me, I'm on it with no passive income. Just showed savings.

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a_library_socialist@reddit

Are you gonna get hit by the wealth tax?

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smirklurker@reddit

You only need to show around 30k euros for Nlv for 1st year. Wealth tax is a much higher threshold as you noted.

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a_library_socialist@reddit

Hmmmm OK. I hold a NLV, but they were pretty thorough about checking where my income streams came from on that, not just that funds were there.

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smirklurker@reddit

I submitted a balance letter from my US bank and that's it

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PrettyinPerpignan@reddit

Savings can be used for the NLV

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reddit33764@reddit

Yes. That's how I moved here 8 months ago with my family. OP has a pension and rental income, so I'm pretty sure that won't be an issue.

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Affectionate_Age752@reddit

Netherlands and DAFT visa

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

I like the Netherlands, but I don't want to endure cold, damp winters. I'd like to avoid northern Europe. Plus, I have no intention of starting a business.

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ccbs32033@reddit

i just did the france long stay visa for two years. rented an apartment in paris, planning to move back to the states next year. feel free to reach out if you have any questions, happy to talk about my experience in private chat

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TJDetweiler1991@reddit

Would you mind sharing a little bit about your experience here? I'm sure people (like me) could really benefit from stumbling across your anecdotes. My wife and I have been thinking about living in France for a year (from Canada), but I see lots of mixed reviews about people's experiences.

If you're up for it, I might send you a private chat to pick your brain a bit!

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PrettyinPerpignan@reddit

It depends on what you’re looking for and what city you want to move to. Visiting isn’t the same as living there, bureaucracy can be a nightmare and the city can be hard to find housing. Just do your research and visit where you want to go or join fb groups in your target city

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projectmaximus@reddit

Portugal, Spain, France and Ireland off the top of my head will have a visa for you based on pension and/or rental income.
But need clarification... are you saying that you only want to do this for a year or two and you're not seeking to stay longer term? If so there could be more even simpler options.

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Secure-Ad9780@reddit (OP)

One to four years. I thought 1-2 yrs in one place then a couple years somewhere else.

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TipYerHat@reddit

I would be interested to hear those other options!

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projectmaximus@reddit

Likely nothing that you aren't already aware of. I was basically thinking Digital Nomad Visas. Estonia, Croatia, Hungary, Italy, Greece, Latvia, Romania in addition to the countries I already mentioned previously.

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henryorhenri@reddit

If you are a US citizen, look into France. The tax treaty between the US and France is VERY favorable and it appears to be relatively easy and straightforward to get a long stay visa, renew it and then get permanent residency after 5 years. Older people get a pass on the French requirement test but you'll want to learn as much as you can anyway...

Check out /r/expatFIRE subreddit for more info applicable to your situation.

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winkelschleifer@reddit

Except that taxes are significantly higher in France than in the US. Have a tax expert review your income, wealth, etc.

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Pajamafier@reddit

i just did the france long stay visa for two years. rented an apartment in paris, planning to move back to the states next year. feel free to reach out if you have any questions, happy to talk about my experience in private chat

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RavenRead@reddit

Albania. Zero immigration stuff for one year for Americans. Many come, leave for 90 days, come back for year, rinse, lather, repeat. You can figure out things in that year.

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wbd82@reddit

Georgia offers a similar deal

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carnivorousdrew@reddit

Italy.

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PoppinCapriSuns@reddit

As long as you are an EU citizen, basically all countries within the eurozone.

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Yourlilemogirl@reddit

They're American

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bruhbelacc@reddit

Within the EU plus a few other countries

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Kuzjymballet@reddit

If you just want to stay for a year or two, France's long stay visa (long séjour) as a visitor should fit the bill.

https://france-visas.gouv.fr/les-etapes-de-la-demande-de-visa

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PurpleNurple105@reddit

As far as I know all of the countries mentioned have some type of retirement visa available. Some have higher requirements than others. I have been thinking of Malta myself. You also need to look at how they tax your income. Many have a flat rate tax on income sourced outside of the county, i.e. pension, dividends, etc. EU Citizens also take advantage of this.

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