Ukraine's US Missile Attack is Western 'Escalation' Says Russia
Posted by IntnsRed@reddit | EndlessWar | View on Reddit | 32 comments
Posted by IntnsRed@reddit | EndlessWar | View on Reddit | 32 comments
SendStoreJader@reddit
It’s not an escalation because Russia have done it since the first day of the war.
Now Ukraine can strike back in Kursk.
Russia was stupid to think they could attack Ukraine without being hit inside Russia.
Russia can stop the war by going home.
Critical-Quality3314@reddit
They've been striking Russia with long-range drones for a while. Now Ukraine can order US strikes on Kursk.
Zelensky can stop the war by running out of Ukrainians.
SendStoreJader@reddit
It’s not US strikes lol.
Critical-Quality3314@reddit
Well you can't attribute a single long-range strike to Russia, it could have hired a Ukrainian to hit the launch button. That damn Ukrainian could even strike Biden's house from the territory of Ukraine.
SendStoreJader@reddit
What are you on about?
Dismal_You_5359@reddit
I don’t see you posting the atrocities Russia and Iran commit, including in the Middle East and Africa. It’s Reddit moderators vs the world’s intelligence agencies. This sub has no idea what it’s talking about. Kremlin cronies.
IntnsRed@reddit (OP)
What atrocities are those? And how do they compare to atrocities committed by Israel?
Dismal_You_5359@reddit
Israel? Oh is this what this is about? your hatred for the US shows when your spewing Kremlin propaganda on here. How bout Vietcong in Vietnam, the North Korean War, Afghanistan, Syria, RSF in Africa? That’s the atrocities they are currently operating. What you’re mad about is religion, that’s what’s happening with Israel and Palestine. It’s Judaism vs Islam, both horrible for the human race. You’re only spreading misinformation that’s going against what 70 international intelligence agencies around the world say about Russia bc you’re dedicated to one of these religions. Shows you’re weak minded and have no idea what you’re talking about. There’s no progress in radical religions.
fritterstorm@reddit
You mean Zionism? Where Jewish ethnonationalists believe that land is theirs because their skygod gave it to them 5000 years ago? So much so that they're willing to genocide the current population, just like they genocide the Canaanites to begin with. The Palestinians are fighting for their lives, their freedom. Palestinians of all faiths, and no faith, are participating.
Dismal_You_5359@reddit
Yeah I mean Zionism and Islam. Of course the Palestinian are fighting for their lives. Weak minded Zionist are killing in the name of their God bc weak minded Muslims killed and raped Israeli people in the name of their fairy tale god. Meanwhile the innocent people on both sides that are not religious are stuck in the middle suffering. It’s all religions influencing wars one way or another. Weak minded people that only read one book their whole life’s and then pick up a weapon bc their man made God told them too.
Nethlem@reddit
You mean the US starting a proxy war, killing millions of people, while trying to "contain" China?
You mean the US splitting Korea in half, with Nazi-like violence, to ensure having a beachhead in SEA against China?
Do you mean the US funding and training what would later become the Taliban and AQ?
Where militias armed by the Pentagon fight those armed by the CIA, basically the US deepstate proxy-warring itself, on the other side of the planet, using Syrian people.
France in Africa? US-trained soldiers in Africa?
They are currently operating the Vietnam and Korea wars? What..?
Because with the Cold War being over the last thing we need is running out of groups of people we can declare our enemies based on arbitrary differences.
Tho, interesting spin trying to make Zionist settler-colonialism out as an religios issue and not the far-right ethnonationalism it actually is.
Nethlem@reddit
But you do remember the MENA region is mostly in the state it's in, with millions of dead people and dozens of millions made refugees, the largest international displacement of people since WWII, thanks to ~20 years of US-led "Crusade on terror"?
It's not "the world's intelligence agencies", it's a handful of Western intelligence agencies, the same ones that have been caught lying plenty of times and whose stated mission it to agitate against whoever is deemed the "Hitler of the month".
You are projecting harder than a cinema.
IntnsRed@reddit (OP)
What atrocities are those?
collymolotov@reddit
The rhetoric I see across this site is infuriating. So many absolute fools are saying that the Russians won’t do anything because they’re running out of soldiers/losing the war (which couldn’t be further from the truth) and that MAD will protect us all from this turning into a nuclear war and doesn’t everyone remember the lessons of Munich in 1938? We have to stop Hitler now, even if it means gambling with all our lives and our entire civilization. These people are absolutely insane. The propaganda, ignorance and lack of critical thought run so deep.
I don’t know who I hate more, the world leaders who gamble with our lives and don’t care if they get us all killed or with the moral grandstanding fools who rationalize it all online and who smear anyone who offers a challenging factual argument to their propaganda narrative a Russian stooge.
aglobalvillageidiot@reddit
If you don't support war you are ~~a commie~~ ~~a hippie~~ ~~a terrorist~~ an anti-Semite~~ ~~Chinese shill~~ Russian stooge.
The only moral choice is war and the only moral war is the one that expands American interests.
IntnsRed@reddit (OP)
MAD is no more! We can "thank" the torturing war criminal president George W. Bush for that. He broke and unilaterally withdrew the US from the Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Ballistic_Missile_Treaty#Unilateral_United_States_withdrawal) which was the core backbone of MAD. As the CIA-edited Wikipedia states:
And we all know why the US broke the treaty. Reagan started the erosion of the treaty by spending hundreds of billions to develop our "Star Wars" anti-ballistic missile systems and technology. When that was operational Bush withdrew from the ABM treaty.
The Russians responded by developing new ICBMs that can evade our Star Wars systems -- and Russia developed hypersonic missiles (now combat proven in Ukraine) that cannot be shot down.
So, far from us having MAD, the torturing war criminal president George W. Bush actually created an incentive for Russia to do a nuclear "first strike!"
fritterstorm@reddit
Warhawk Redditors believe we can shoot down hypersonic weapons easily.
mikemaca@reddit
USA does not currently have this capability.
fritterstorm@reddit
They don't, they are working on it, but yes, they don't. I don't know how these ideas take hold.
Nethlem@reddit
The same Bush also pushed for the militarization of space, the creation of the American "Space Force" actually goes back to his administration, just like Chinese efforts in space as a response to that American move.
Hypersonic missiles most dangerous capability is to destroy aircraft carriers, by punching through even the most dense AD networks, not as nuclear delivery vehicle.
Quite the opposite; For the past 20 years the US has done everything to make a first-strike scenario for itself winnable, NATO East expansion remains a fundamental part of that strategy.
What tearing up the ABM treaty did was allow the US to station interception capabilities way closer to Russia, giving them improved chances to intercept Russian strategic strikes, first and retaliatory.
At the same time, the US keeps heavily investing in its own strategic arsenal to give it bunker-busting abilities, that weren't possible during the Cold War. As in: US strategic missiles have become accurate enough to target and destroy even heavily reinforced Russian strategic missile silos.
While on a tactical level the US also tore apart the INF treaty, which banned stationing intermediate and medium-range missiles, due to their extremely destabilizing nature as ideal first strike weapons.
This includes advanced versions of cruise missiles, like Tomahawks, that can carry nuclear payloads and deliver them with very low chance of even being spotted due to their ability to stick close to the ground.
The ABM and INF treaties existing was in big parts the result of the by now widely forgotten Euromissile Crisis, the so-called "NATO Double-Track Decision" as if NATO did some good thing there.
A crisis very similar to that over Cuba, but with the "liberal democratic" twist that West Germans absolutely did not want to host such American missiles, with massive counter-protests.
Sadly modern day Germans lack this geopolitical awareness, ABM and INF treaties are gone, the US has stationed new nuclear missiles in Germany, with barely anybody taking notice, or Germans at large even being asked about it.
ttystikk@reddit
Who's the "Hitler" here? Putin? I don't think so. The West, currently the United States, has been trying to start this war for decades, and they even said why; to weaken Russia so that Western interests can break up the country and strip it of resources. Again.
collymolotov@reddit
I agree with you, but that’s how normies frame him whenever this argument comes up and with their rhetoric for justifying foreign involvement.
ttystikk@reddit
They aren't "Normies," they're propagandized citizens, victims of a billion dollar machine designed to manufacture consent for Armageddon.
Let us frame our thinking to hold the correct people responsible.
IntnsRed@reddit (OP)
It's amazing, isn't it?! We Americans live in a "propaganda bubble" believing BS and lies.
Russia isn't even using draftees to fight this war. The war is so popular in Russia that they do nothing but recruit volunteers -- the same way the US does military recruiting.
Russia is suffering KIA and casualties, sure, but nothing like Ukraine is suffering! The Russian offensive is so slow because the Russian army is fighting a war of attrition -- they don't advance unless everything is "right" so they suffer few casualties. But our propaganda is that Russia uses "meat grinder" tactics and huge numbers of Russians are dying.
The danger of living in a propaganda bubble is outlined by one of the experts at war propaganda:
That idea that "the state" must us all of its powers to repress dissent we can see in the US and colleges and police crushing anti-Israeli protests on college campuses.
dersteppenwolf5@reddit
The moral grandstanding fools are just regurgitating propaganda, which is everywhere in the mainstream media. Billions of dollars are spent to manipulate these dimwits, they don't really stand a chance. I despise the leaders more, but what's scary/depressing is that it's really such a giant system with enormous momentum. Anybody who speaks out against the system gets immediately labeled as kooky or a traitor or all of a sudden allegations of sexual misconduct against them arise. The war machine is a freight train that crushes anyone that gets in its way, I don't know that anyone can stop it, even the leaders (who, to be fair, mostly don't even try).
mikemaca@reddit
Enjoy your nuclear strikes guys I guess. Nothing I can do to stop this. Don't even know who is an AI bot.
TheAxeOfSimplicity@reddit
What makes me mad about the supporters of M.A.D. is they are clearly mad.
1) M.A.D. is so unthinkable that no one will risk it....
2) ...and that it's only a deterrence if it's a credible threat...
3) we can nibble the other side to death by a thousand small cuts but they will never go nuclear because that would be mad.
4) we can make the cuts ever deeper and larger and the other side won't go nuclear because that would be mad.
5) We can use conventional bombs that are bigger than small nukes and the other won't respond because that would be mad.
That's where we are up to now. Seriously, we're at this point already.
Coming up shortly.....
6) We can use small nukes, because the other side has used larger conventional bombs, and the other side won't go nuclear because that would be mad.
7) We can use larger nukes because the other side is using nukes, they won't go full nuclear because that would be mad.
8) The other side is destroying our nuclear capability, we must do a full retaliation now before we lose credible deterrence, and that would be mad.
Before we get there I need a world government to step in and take all the toys away from these idiots.
I seriously dislike Biden AND Putin. They are both making the future worse.
ttystikk@reddit
I was with you right up until the last sentence. Putin is THE adult in the room right now. If he was as bad as you say, WWIII would have already happened.
America is the global provocateur.
Critical-Quality3314@reddit
Putin's proxy didn't kill beachgoers in Delaware with a cluster bomb. He hasn't retaliated to any of Biden's reckless attacks and Biden is continuing to escalate further.
aglobalvillageidiot@reddit
People in the west don't understand that from where Russia is sitting this is there Cuban Missile Crisis.
And just like Soviets didn't think Kruschev should back down because of the relentless propaganda machine, the west thinks we shouldn't back down because of the relentless American propaganda machine. But we need to.
IntnsRed@reddit (OP)
The historical reality is that the USSR did not back down in the Cuban missile crisis. It was an equivalent agreement! The USSR withdrew its missiles from Cuba and the US withdrew its missiles from Turkey (right next to the USSR). Only the US sought a provision to keep oun withdrawal secret and the Russians stupidly agreed to it. Thus, we in the west were propagandized by our own "democratic" gov'ts!
aglobalvillageidiot@reddit
Huh. TIL. Cheers comrade.