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Nethlem@reddit

It's weird how casually we accept it when protests are banned in "liberal democracies" even tho that's a pretty blatant violation of the UDHR;

Article 20

Everyone has the right to freedom of peaceful assembly and association.

Yet so normal and mundane, except it happens in a country we don't like, then we suddenly remember all that human rights stuff again.

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Best_Change4155@reddit

Time, place, and manner exceptions exist in every liberal country.

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Nethlem@reddit

Like "Free Speech Zones" in the US? Like banning protests as violent before they even happened?

As an older person I can't help but notice that most of these exceptions were only established rather recently.

It also begs the question: If we are allowed to have such exceptions, why ain't other countries? Why don't we recognize their exceptions, which usually are pretty much the same as ours?

Case in point: Plenty of European countries have banned wearing masks while protesting already in the early 2000s.

Yet when the Hong Kong government banned masks, as part of violently escalating protests during the 2010s, Western media declared that move "authoritarian" and as evidence for how totalitarian the HK government allegedly is.

So it seems more like one more of the usual unspoken double standards we love to preach at others, while practicing nothing of it ourselves.

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What are they protesting about?

Are they unhappy that the government should shouldn’t have done something?

Are they unhappy that the locals seemed to have formed mobs to deal with mobs formed of visiting fans? It’s clear this is not anti-semitism, from the reports of what the visiting fans did.

What exactly do the protestors want?

If the protestors don’t want anything, but instead just want to cause disruption, then sorry, there is a reason to stop them.

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

I say that attacking people chanting "death to arabs" is justified.

These zionist freaks feel so confident about being racist in Israel that they feel free to do it abroad. Well, FAFO.

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Syrairc@reddit

I say that attacking people chanting "death to arabs" is justified.

Violence in response to words - regardless of how horrible what they're saying is - is never justified. By that logic, Israel is justified in what they do - there's certainly a lot of 'death to israel' in the middle east. It's not justified when they do it, it's not justified when its done to them. No double standards.

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Zellgun@reddit

double standards exists. it's why we're here talking about antisemitism and not a single mention of islamophobia or arabophobia.

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DDAY007@reddit

Because you hide behind those 'phobias' because you dont want to talk about real sisutations and real history. For every single historical case of islamaphobia or arabophobia i can raise you 100 cases of anti semitism.

Just admit you have a problem with jews are too intellectually cowardly to critic the middle east.

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Zellgun@reddit

Look how’s turning this into a competition of suffering. That’s typical.

I never once claimed that islamophobia should be considered more than antisemitism, nor did i even deny that there was antisemitism. Show me where I claimed such things.

Instead you immediately jumped to attempting to dilute one sides suffering with another’s side. I don’t believe any major religion values such a disgusting mindset.

and then resorting to just immediately accusing me of hating Jews with no rhyme or reason. What an embarrassment lmao

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DDAY007@reddit

I love how you listen a mordern day pogrom against jews an as islamophobia. Truely the arabs somehow are still the victims while being the perps; when they arent crying when they lost yet another way with Israel they are crying when they try to hunt jews in a city known for being a slaughterground of jews.

Also because most anti-zionist pro palestinians hide behind islamophobia and other similar useless terms to avoid taking responsiblility for their rhetoric. The real double standards here is that there is a societal hatred of jews in arab/muslim culture that stems back thousands of years that none of you want to talk about. Also as a malaysian you should know about anti-semetism as its been an active government policy since the 1970's like banning schindlers list because it could make the jews look like victims. You know the movie about the holocaust ... yeh....not a good look that or government officials outright saying "jews control the world".

Just for reference:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Antisemitic_attacks_and_incidents

And thats just the events important enough to be recorded. Happy reading!

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Zellgun@reddit

a city known for being a slaughterground of jews.

Who slaughtered Jews in that city, remind me again. Was it Arabs? Anyways, my apologies for generalizing the entire Amsterdam incident, there definitely was cases of antisemitism and islamophobia. I did not mean to claim the entire incident for one side. Unlike you.

Also because most anti-zionist pro palestinians hide behind islamophobia and other similar useless terms to avoid taking responsiblility for their rhetoric.

This is actually hilarious especially since the weaponization of antisemitism has a literal Wikipedia page around it. Not sure why anti-Zionists and pro-Palestinians would hide behind Islamophobia when they're not a Muslim or Islamic group but a diverse range of people of various ethnicities, sexualities, religions and nationalities. Including many Jews in JVP, IfNotNow, Rabbis for Human Rights, Achvat Amim, Standing Together, Peace Now, Na'amod. All FANTASTIC primarily Jewish organizations, some I've had the lovely pleasure of working with. (Anyone interested, please reach out to them, they're amazing people doing actual work for the future of the region while people like the guy I'm replying to simply attack others online).

The real double standards here is that there is a societal hatred of jews in arab/muslim culture that stems back thousands of years that none of you want to talk about.

Sure, buddy. Like I said, I never denied antisemitism exists, not sure why you're trying so hard to prove it. Anyways, for anyone who isn't as hateful as this guy, do check out the Jewish organizations I listed above. As Muslim, I truly admire the efforts made by those Jewish groups and call on all Muslims and non-Muslims to support them.

Also as a malaysian you should know about anti-semetism as its been an active government policy since the 1970's like banning schindlers list because it could make the jews look like victims.

Malaysia has a lot of issues, I never claimed we're perfect. I'm well aware of antisemitism we have here and I've never denied it. Not sure what that has to do with the topic at hand.

My guy, my comment was about the double standard of antisemitism vs islamophonia in the media, and you went down a whole diatribe about pogroms, crying Arabs, historical hatred, and Malaysia? It's almost as if you're just looking for things to attack me with. What do you have against me? I didn't call for violence or denounce Jews or anything.

Oh we're sharing wikipedia articles? I thought you said you can share me 100 individual antisemitic incidents for every 1 Islamophobic incident. Some fighter of antisemitism you are, you could be standing by your statement and instead you're sending Wikipedia links like a 8th grade teacher lmao.

Anyways, tell me more about how much you hate Arabs, I'll be over here hanging out with some of my Jewish friends that work in the organizations I mentioned above.

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DDAY007@reddit

Keep in mind 3/4ths of all Dutxh Jews were killed, the majority of them coming from Amsterdam makes it just as bloody as warsaw.

You are right it was nazis who slaughtered the jews and in the modern day pogrom it was also nazis who comitted these acts. Or do you think you have to be German or Italian to be a nazi; or is it because you would rather ignore people like Amin al-Husseini who wasnt just a nazi but also is recorded to have discussed the final solution with the German nazis. Truely the least Anti-semetic pro palestinian /s.

Notice how that page you linked is based on work done by post holocaust writers (post 45). The history of anti-semitism dates back to antiquity and yet the 'weaponization of antisemitism' only dates back to after the holocaust.

If you had any honest bone in your body you would find it a tad odd that most of the work on this was done in the post 45 period and not in any of the thousands of years of antisemetism. Its truely a bit strange that the holocaust happens and people go, "hmmm them jews are a bit too uppity about an event that decimated their population".

A brief reading through some of the various authors works reveals a consistant anti-israel thread. Not to mention veiled references to the nazi talking point of, "go back to europe". This is why authors, pro palestinians and redditors love to missrepresent Israeli history. If you don't look at israel with both the context of;

The holocaust.
The original zionist thesis.
Thousands of years of history.

You will never be able to understand why Israel exists. A lack of underatanding of these three points leads people to essentially 'cope' and look at other methods of explanation. Hence your post 45 wikipedia page or the claims of hasbara that you see from the less intelligent pro palestinian commentators.

I grew up interacting with Jews and holocaust survivors. The majority of the Jewish world absolutely supports the existance of the Israeli state. Fringe movments within the Jewish peoples will always exist, even to the delusional levels of people like Max Naumann.

Its also very telling that instead of adressing my point directly regarding; " a societal hatred of jews in arab/muslim culture that stems back thousands of years". You did exactly what i claimed afterwards; "none of you want to talk about", this refers back to my earlier 1-3 points that people need to know about when talking about israel; an ignorance of history that is ever present.

Furthermore it's why Muslims/arabs are silent when the following question is asked, "where did your jews go?".

There is an absolute double standard in society and media; a double standard of the Islamic world to their own issues.

Assad killed 200k of his own civilians the muslims world was silent, china is ethnically cleansing the Uyghurs the muslim world is silent, when there is an actual famine in yemen the muslim world is silent. In the modern world muslims care more about hating jews than helping their own people. These issues are all larger than just Israel byitself.

You hide behind islamaphobia because you don't wish to face the reality of the current circumstances. You are deathly afraid of critizing anything to do with arabs or muslims because you have engulfed yourself in echochambers where you are either 100% supportive or 100% against; thats called a cult btw.

Also I love the selective biases over Wikipedia. Its hilarious how much that triggers simpletons. I know reading about Jewish suffering is hard for a nazi aligned individual but I believe in you! Lmfao.

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Zellgun@reddit

I love it when people bring up Amin al-Husseini, since he was given his power and authority not by Palestinians but by the British High Commissioner. Does that mean Britain supports Nazis?

Also you're right, you don't need to be German or Italian to support Nazis, you could even be Jewish like the terrorist group Lehi.

"Above all, in the summer of 1943 Lehi had still not broken free from the doctrine of persecutor and enemy'. Even after the extent of the Holocaust was revealed, Lehi refused to depict Hitler rather than England as the main foe." - From Joseph Heller's book

What happened to these group of Nazi collaborators? Oh right, Israel absolved them and even gave them medals! Why is Israel rewarding Nazi sympathizers? Heck, even their leader was elected Prime Minister of Israel! Can you imagine a country of Jews electing a former Nazi sympathizer into head of office?

But anyways this is besides the point. My original article was about the double standards of the media in reporting antisemitism in comparison with Islamophobia. PLEASE READ THE TOPIC SENTENCE AT HAND.

Your whole middle comment talks about the existence of Israel in the context of the Holocaust and historical antisemitism, which is not the topic and nothing I ever refuted nor do I require. It's just a waste of time. Especially when youre breakdown is so heavily biased since they're basically your interpretation of the subject. It's hard to consider you credible when you call people "delusional" "less intelligent" and lack of any of your own sources. Besides, the weaponization of antisemitism discussion only takes place after the Holocaust because that's when it became prevalent enough to have a discussion on it.

Furthermore it's why Muslims/arabs are silent when the following question is asked, "where did your jews go?".

Not sure what this has to do with anything? We all know where they went. What happened after 1948 is not a secret and neither is it a requirement for us to talk about that in this context or in the context of Israel's genocidal actions, except to explain how it was the Mizrahi who helped the far right cement their power in Israel.

These issues are all larger than just Israel byitself.

Literally every human rights organization that is calling Israel genocidal has also reported on everything you listed. The Syrian civil war is being fought by muslims on all sides. China is ethnically cleansing the Uyghurs and it should be stopped, and Israel has stolen and ethnically cleansed historical Palestine and murder thousands of innocent women and children. All those can be true at the same time. Besides, if all the Muslims in the world spoke up about all these atrocities at the level you are happy with, would that somehow make criticism of Israel legitimate? No, you would still shit on all of us anyways. So please leave you childish whataboutism to the children's playground since adults realize how stupid that strategy is. As someone who has engaged with hasbara for years, you are going down the usual talking points which is obvious since many of it has nothing to do with the original topic.

You are deathly afraid of critizing anything to do with arabs or muslims

This right here says enough. If you actually knew me and gone through my post history, you would know that I have no issues with this. In fact, it's something I get in trouble with occasionally in my own local community, you know, the one you claimed is antisemitic.

I suggest maybe trying to think for yourself because just regurgitating hasbara propaganda requires you to assume that everyone you talk to thinks, acts or believes in the same thing. Obviously this is not the case.

I also love how you shifted away from claiming I hate Jews since I shared my involvement with Jewish groups. Instead now you're focusing on how i distribute my criticism of the world's atrocities and how it's unfair against Israel (not Jews, cause you know I don't have issues with Jews). Remember everyone, this all started from the topic of antisemitism in the media, in the context of the Amsterdam incident. What a ride eh?

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DDAY007@reddit

So your first statement is exactly why Pro jewish voices have to research every little morsal spat out by pro palestinians because they almost always prove to be innaccurate.

Amin al-Husseini was elected to his position in 1921, but in 1928 he was effectively exiled after his role in the anti jewish/anti british riots. By the time he met with the nazis his 'connections' to the british has long been effectively politically destroyed.

I dont know if you get your information from content creators or groyper accounts on twitter but you are wild to assume Amin al-Husseini had good connections to the british at the time of his talks with the nazis and the Final solution; that is wild retelling of history.

You are correct the Lehi was a terrorist group; a small one at that operating primarily against the british. What people like you, who blindly follow propaganda fail to mention is that the extent of the Lehi's "dealings" with nazi Germany were to transfer Jews over from europe to help them in their fight. There are literal documentary interviews done with surviving lehi members where they outright point out that their only dealings were to secure jewish passage to help their cause. An out of context quote from someones analysis proves nothing but that persons 'opinion', quotes without context are useless by themselves; Keep in mind also that during this time the true knowledge of the holocaust was not yet known to all with lehi members admitting they would not have tried to make dealings if they knew what was truely happening.

Like your false statements regarding Amin al-Husseini, you fail to mention that the lehi were awarded medals because of their assitance during the 1948 war. What a crass way to misspresent the situation. Its like saying Wernher von Braun was heralded by the americans as a hero because he used jewish slave labour during ww2 and not because he was the father of american spacetravel. Your entire point is presented from the side of not understanding any aspect of ww2 history.

Just to be clear my presentation of the facts only appears biased in the sense that I and not a historian who is writing the words but rather a person regurgitating facts that people really don't like to address. Anyone who doesnt understand the need for a Jewish state is either outright ignorant or historically illiterate.

Btw, thanks for proving to me why no-one talks about the mass ethnic cleansing of Jews from the middle east. Because even you clearly recognise it was pruely provoked by generational hatred of Jews.

These same organisations have had a history missrepresenting the facts on the ground to Suit an anti-Israel narrative; in case you don't know one of the reasons that Jews especially dont take a lot of value in these organisations is once again due to history. Specifically the absolute failure of the league of nations and that the Red-Cross lied about the state of concentration camps in europe. Why would anyone trust organisations who consistantly focus on Israel but dont have any of the same energy for other regional conflicts.

Our discussion is purely focused upon this thread. I neither have the time nor the 'want' to look through hundreds or thousands of your comments to divulge your specific issues on point X, Y or Z. Pro palestinians on mass will misscatagorize and attack Israel and levy accusations against them while remaining comparatively silent on other issues. Without fact or reason they will blame Israel for yemen, Israel for Sudan, Israel for Syria and so on. They are moslty western liberals who reside within echo chambers wherein they have to be 100% in assent or they are 100% in dissent. They label islamaphobia as a "get out of jail free card when they dont want to address any issue specifically.

The famous line has finally appeared, "Hasbara propaganda". I should apologise that i didnt know I was dealing with a complete and utter buffoon who believes in the conspiracy theory of a propaganda cabal run by jews.

This line is always used by pro palestinians as a last ditch 'hail mary' when they have no actually factual arguement and are grasping at straws.

It is no different than talking about the "deep state" or the nazi talking point of "jews control the world". Its always laughable that it comes to this; LMFAO.

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giboauja@reddit

Well, we're talking about antisemitism, because the topic is about a bunch of Israelis got hunted down and beaten, because presumbly some of them chanted awful sht at a soccer game.

Not a bunch of muslims being hunted down a beaten. Being in a major city, i've seen plenty of protests that have wild chants that call for death or other bs. The proper response isn't to hunt people down looking at passports and beating them half to death.

I got friends from Russia who consumes all there propaganda, the whole Ukraine, nazi etc etc. I don't punch her in the face. I understand she's deeply entrenched in propaganda and sometimes try to even reach out delectectly.

My point is none of this helps Gaza. If anything it plays to Israel's own narrative that the world wants to destroy them just because their jewish and not that they're committing a kind of violence that gets people around the world shocked and appalled.

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

The thing is, when people say "Death to Israel" means death to colonization and the apartheid (unless you believe that western bullshit that all Arabs are terrorists that hate jews)

When Israelis say "death to arabs" well... they are in the middle of conducting a genocide so what do you think they mean?

What do you think they mean when they sing "there are no longer schools in Gaza because there are no children anymore"?

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Poolturtle5772@reddit

Wait so a group that has previously had and arguably still has a stated goal of jihad says “death to Israel” and it isn’t supposed to be taken literally, but the reverse must be?

giboauja@reddit

? did not read what i said. Jesus why do i even both....

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soyyoo@reddit

Answer the question, how would you react if r/israelcrimes murdered your family and stole your land for 70+ years?

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giboauja@reddit

How would you react if the CCP kidnapped then let your family die?

Answer that?

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soyyoo@reddit

I believe you have to answer my question first, no?

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giboauja@reddit

I was making a point that your question is a non sequitur and unrelated to anything. Even if its topic was adjacent. It proves nothing and doesn't elucidate on any points mentioned in my post.

But regardless, I'm a pacifist. I know that continued violence and vengeance just continues more violence and vengeance. I would be a strong advocate for peace and leverage forgiveness as a tool to create it. So that a new life could be built, not just for myself, but for all those after me.

No you dont. You are lying.

Your knowledge of rhe middle east and this conflict comes from people who also have zero idea about the region. You are literally calling for the death of jews dont try and sugar coat it.

The Jewish state/zionism exists because they are the most opressed group of people in history. Its so funny watching people like you justify FAFO when Jews have the most justification of self defence and of being radicalised in history.

But I can tell fron your comments your extent of knowledge is the standard issue of rewriting history when it comes to the middle east/arabs because you need any justification to hate jews. Unless you are outright admitting you are ignorant/uneducated you are ignoring that anti-jewish hate in the middle east is centuries old.

There are dozens of arabic slurs for jews btw (youll ignore this)

Where did all the jews go that lived in middle eastern countries? They were ethnically cleansed, but you will ignore that as well.

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berbal2@reddit

You sure can justify a lot if you claim you’re fighting a genocide…..

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

No, that would be "death to jews". You see, most people can understand that the apartheid fascist regime of Israel does not represent Jewish people.

Now, why are zionists not chanting "death to hamas" and instead say "death to arabs"?

It's taking some of you are painfully long time to understand that zionists are akin to the nazis, and that when they scream that they want to kill every arab while they are slaughtering palestinoans we should believe them.

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thecrispynaan@reddit

More cope and ego defense while ignoring all the other ethnicities that live in Israel.

“Death” has a meaning. Displaying your mental gymnastics on the subject just shows how far you’ll go to excuse violence if it doesn’t conform to your narrative

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loggy_sci@reddit

Or they mean death to Israel.

Also people keep forgetting that these were Maccabi ultras chanting this and not all Israelis. Some Mexican soccer fans throw batteries and cups of piss at Americans during U.S.-Mexico games but not all Mexico fans are like that, and certainly not the vast majority of Mexicans. Don’t use the bad behavior of fans to generalize about an entire nationality.

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But what’s r/israelcrimes doing on 🇵🇸 land?

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Fuzzy_Yogurt_Bucket@reddit

Does the Mexican government command and statement in full support of their actions?

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giboauja@reddit

Hear me out I wrote this in good faith...

Why kind of propaganda is that. I dont have much of a stake in an Israel or a Palestine. But both are places where people live. Whole cities are built there. People have been born and died.

Jewish Palestinians were a 20 percent minority, using outside funding and influence, to justify the existence of their own state. I know the whole colonizer thing is popular to lob at them these days, but they don't fit that definition very well. Israel is a weird country that surged its population with war refugees. While using global influence to get it to exist on paper before it could make any borders.

None the less, look at the original border for Israel and Palestine, it was along tribal settlement lines, with Israel getting the big desert because they were assumed to be taking in hundreds of thousands of refugees. Very quickly outnumbering the Palestinians. Now there's a valid reason to support Israel here. Even from a perspective of protecting Palestinians. Clearly they wanted territory and had the money and arms to fight for it. Creating a division based on population lines is a way to stop a brewing war before it began.

I don't think at the time I would of personally supported an Israel in that area though, because the jewish people were the slave caste of the muslim empire and a lot of that sentiment still held strong. Especially considering most of the new countries being formed (from whole cloth like Israel) were more conservative than the Ottoman Empire and far less secular.

Israel is an awful country, that has done awful things (much like all their neighbors tbh). Still a path to peace needs to be found that doesn't involve the "death of (country here)". Because that's just genocide. If what your saying is true, that you feel that death to Israel is valid and they should be (presumably) completely removed from the region, your advocating genocide whether you realize it or not. Tens of, if not, hundreds of thousands would die. An entire culture erased.

Thats happening in Gaza right now and propaganda is making you amenable to the idea that it should happen to Israel instead. Yet this mentality is exactly why 50 thousand (god i hope it's just that) palestinians are dead. Dont fall for the bull sht propaganda. Peace is the only option. And getting a radical country like Israel to accept and foster that peace is hard enough without people rationalizing genocide against them.

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Longjumping-Jello459@reddit

Then say death to colonization and apartheid make it crystal clear.

Maximum_Rat@reddit

I read some news article but can’t find it now. But either way, they attacked random people who weren’t even at the game. And here’s the link to that https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ckgv4mdr9y8o.amp

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

I read some news article but can’t find it now

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Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit

I've wasted time with disingenuous people like you, if you actually cared about your opinion you'd have educated yourself, it's ok we all see you don't actually believe in anything, you're just trying to convince yourself that you do.

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FantasticMacaron9341@reddit

So I am understanding that its not the same people, and this is your way to dodge giving the videos.

If you actually had an argument you wouldn't mind giving your source.

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FantasticMacaron9341@reddit

They didn't chant "death to arabs"

And if some fans beat up a taxi driver then beat them, thats not a justification to beat up any fan or any Israeli, you are a psychopath

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thats also not what they said, you keep inventing things to justify your support of violence.

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Leather-Ad-7799@reddit

Wait collective punishment is bad now all of a sudden? Interesting take coming from someone defending starving 2 million people and killing 45,000+ confirmed in a year. Very interesting take.

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Leather-Ad-7799@reddit

We have the video, I have friends who speak Hebrew, that is exactly what was said and you can’t even condemn your fans chanting genocida l chants like the absolute Morons they are. Keep your genocide low key and back in Israel, you don’t want even more people to know that your ethnostate are disgusting fascists people might get the wrong idea!

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Leather-Ad-7799@reddit

Flexing genocide like an absolute 🐀

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Those children can be dangerous when they swarm you in large numbers. I wouldn’t tangle with them without a heavy machine gun and air support.

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WeirderOnline@reddit

Someone was saying "fuck the Jews" during the Holocaust they're basically saying "kill the Jews" and to pretend they're not is literally Holocaust denial.

The same goes for literally any other genocide out there. If a group of people are being slaughtered with the goal of genocide, anyone saying "fuck em" is basically saying "kill em all"

Remember that language is cultural and contextual. Bart Simpson was never instructing anyone to ingest his clothing.

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gdch93@reddit

Like Arabs hadn't been doing the same thing during the last year.

Really, they are in no position to give lessons.

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soyyoo@reddit

How would you react if r/israelcrimes murdered your family and stole your land for 70+ years?

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gdch93@reddit

Well that is what Jews went through by almost all countries including Arabs.

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Yeah that is a fallacy. The use of Palestine as a denonym to specifically speak about Arabs is the area is fairly recent, yeah... 1700s is extremely recent compared to the Kingdoms of Judaea and Israel or the Tetrarchy of Herod which was Jewish.

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soyyoo@reddit

🇮🇱 was made up in 1948, so maybe you’re referring to the Jews?

What do you mean with "arabs"? Are all arabs a monolith? That's extremely racist.

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Hmm... All the history of the Islamisation and Arabisation of the Middle East implies a genocide of all of the indigenous peoples there. Read about the Siege of the Banu Qurayza (Jews in Arabia).

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DaniZackBlack@reddit

Oh so you're saying that those Israeli fans were genociding?

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DaniZackBlack@reddit

By Arabs they mean the Arabs that do it, not every single Arab

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

Do you not realize that you speak like a nazi?

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DaniZackBlack@reddit

Oh? My bad I guess I'll pretend like those protests don't exist. Yes my good sir I have erred and all the Arab nations are a peaceful people who have done no wrong.

You're speaking like an ignorant dick who is exaggerating what people are saying to fit your narrative. No I am not saying that all Arabs are bad, not even most, but you can't see that can you?

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AnUninformedLLama@reddit

Neither are the Zionist thugs

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NonsensicalSweater@reddit

So from now on when pro Palestinain protestors chant death to Jews or gas the Jews people are allowed to beat them unconscious?

Next time there's a convoy that goes through London saying murder Jews and rape their daughters people are allowed to just beat the shit out of them right?

https://apnews.com/article/middle-east-europe-lifestyle-race-and-ethnicity-religion-b2f53585ed1a3eec4d7ba0d0cfc0fc47

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

Any type of antisemitism is wrong and it's good that nazis that try to infiltrate propalestinoan protests are being arrested as that article says.

Next time there's a convoy that goes through London saying murder Jews and rape their daughters people are allowed to just beat the shit out of them right?

If that was happening during the holocaust, and the people chantting it were nazis I'd say you'd be justified in beating the shit out of those nazis, I would actually commend it.

See the difference? Just change holocaust with Gaza, and nazis for zionists.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

This is one of the most unhinged comments I've seen. Are all Jews worldwide responsible for Israel's actions? Is every Israeli, even those that never voted for their government, responsible for the what's happening in Gaza? You're generalizing an entire population with blanket statements, labeling them as Nazis even though you're using the same rhetoric as the Nazis did.

Your justification of collective punishment against Jews is most abhorrent, yet it's obvious you blame Israel for its "collective punishment" of the Palestinian population in response to Hamas' attack, don't you?

Double standards and dehumanization are the bread and butter of antisemitis and I'm not surprised you're using that rhetoric tool to the extreme.

Amsterdam rioters 'planned Jew hunt on Telegram' before they attacked Israeli football fans

'They shouted Jewish, IDF': Israeli football fans describe attack in Amsterdam

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Oppopity@reddit

I like how he clearly stated that punching a nazi shouting "death to the Jews" while the holocaust was ongoing would be justified and you immediately had to jump in with the "wow so it's okay to beat up all Jews"

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Leather-Ad-7799@reddit

He’s a grifter. Almost all outraged Zionists are.

“Death to Arabs” is fine, but don’t you think for a second about saying anything otherwise, that would be AnTiSeMeTiC! You can’t criticize Israel don’t you know they suffered the holocaust! They’re victims! /s

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The Palestinian population has continued to grow so it simply cannot be a genocide.

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Yeahhh_Nahhhhh@reddit

What do you the policies to indigenous people in Australia, Canada, US etc or the numerous anti-Semitic policies Jewish people in Europe over time? Do you think just because people continue to survive there wasn’t an attempt?

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

Because Israel has been ethnically cleansing palestinians from their territories for decades and forcing them into refugee camps in Gaza.

I mean no, that's why they were prosecuted for hate speech for doing that. The Israeli football fans seem to be getting away with their hate speech though

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HummusSwipper@reddit

The Israeli football fans seem to be getting away with their hate speech though

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Cubusphere@reddit

Why do you doubt we don't care about your example of whataboutism? Is your projection sarcastic or are you oblivious to it?

Wishing dead to civilians sucks, no matter the nationality or ethnicity of the perpetrator and victim. Don't you agree?

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HummusSwipper@reddit

I dare you to find a video of the alleged "Death to Arabs" chant. You're spreading dehumanizing propaganda that has NO source, are you aware of that?

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Cubusphere@reddit

How about "there are no schools in Gaza, because there are no children left"? How am I dehumanizing people? Violent Israeli hooligans looked for someone to fight and they found violent pro-Palestinians. But somehow, one side is only the victim and the other only the perpetrator. That's delusional. People can be both.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Wishing dead to civilians sucks, no matter the nationality or ethnicity of the perpetrator and victim. Don't you agree?

This was you and here you are deflecting. We both know no one chanted about wishing for death, and you've fallen for dehumanizing propaganda by claiming otherwise.

How about "there are no schools in Gaza, because there are no children left"?

How about it what? This isn't wishing for death and I'm sorry you're not sympathizing with the chant, neither am I.

Violent Israeli hooligans looked for someone to fight and they found violent pro-Palestinians. But somehow, one side is only the victim and the other only the perpetrator. That's delusional. People can be both.

That’s where you're mistaken. First, those attacked weren’t violent hooligans; unless you believe all football fans fit that stereotype. Second, groups of Arabs targeting and attacking random Jews on the street—who did nothing to provoke them—clearly paints Jews as the victims and the attackers as perpetrators. It’s really not that complicated. What’s truly delusional is refusing to recognize that, in some cases, there is no way to blame Jews for being assaulted.

Here, taken straight from the BBC article I linked:

Shortly after, a group asked the men if they were Jewish, and Aaron said that they were British.

“But they said ‘you helped the Jew’, and he punched me in my face and broke my glasses," Aaron said.

and

"We faced around 20 people who ran towards us. They asked me where I was from, and I said I was from Greece. They said they didn’t believe me and they asked to see my passport.

When he told them he didn't have it, the men beat him, pushed him to the ground and kicked his face, Mr Tshuva said.

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Cubusphere@reddit

Yup, innocents got targeted. Again and again, I condemn violence on both sides, and both sides keep only hearing that I condemn them. I'm so sick of it, sometimes I wonder if they deserve each other.

If you don't understand that the chant means they are happy with the IDF killing children, I cannot help you. If you deny there was a violent mob of Maccabi fans, you're lying to yourself.

Hate begets hate, and you are part of that, doing what you accuse me of. Have a nice day.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

No one asked you to condemn anything, you're more than encouraged to stay away from this topic if it exhausts you.

If you don't understand that the chant means they are happy with the IDF killing children, I cannot help you.

You're just trying to get me to agree with you on something that is completely irrelevant to the discussion. I do not condone their chanting, I just mentioned how it's irrelevant to the fact Jews were attacked.

Hate begets hate, and you are part of that, doing what you accuse me of. Have a nice day.

no u

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Cubusphere@reddit

It doesn't justify it, but it's absolutely relevant, because the inacceptable behavior of a significant group of fans is the immediate cause of the conflict in Amsterdam. Just like the October Hamas attacks were the immediate cause for the war in Gaza.

True antisemetism is on the rise, and that's horrible. Some Israelis excusing their bad behavior by simply blaming everything on antisemetism is "helping" tremendously.

I have ancestors who died in the Holocaust and it does hurt to be called antisemitic and islamophobe for opposing the suffering of innocents. But it's not about me, I'm safe for now.

I'm sorry for that last comment, I'm truly not your enemy if you're also not ok with innocents suffering on any side.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

While it’s true that both situations show a cause-and-effect relationship, the parallels end there. Football hooligans shouting inflammatory slogans does not justify or lead to violent 'hunts' targeting random people based on ethnicity—it's an entirely different scale and context from a state responding to an organized, large-scale terrorist attack. Drawing an equivalence between street violence and a nation defending itself against armed forces is, in my view, an oversimplification that obscures the very different moral and practical realities in each scenario.

I appreciate the overall sentiment, let us both hope 2025 will be the start of a quieter and more peaceful era for everyone.

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throwawayflapper1929@reddit

What else do you expect from the Irish

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Thormeaxozarliplon@reddit

I'm curious. Do you even know what the Israelis were chanting? Do you have video and an accurate translation? Are you just believing garbage you read online?

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DrFolAmour007@reddit

I've been to many pro-palestinian protests and I've never heard a single person chant anything antisemitic, there's jewish antizionist organisations participating to those protests...

But, of course, if, as those pro-genocide people, you consider that saying "free Palestine" is equivalent to saying "death to jews", then basically for you any criticism of Israel is antisemitic.

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NonsensicalSweater@reddit

"anti semitism from the leftists and muslims: support of Palestine independence has turned into hatred of lsrael (and the Jews by association) for many. There's areas, with muslim majority and arabic population, where Jews will be immediately beaten up (or worse) if they're are recognized as jews" u/DrFolAmour007 4 years ago

https://www.reddit.com/r/TooAfraidToAsk/s/vSkcRLJpSE

The article I linked literally had people on loudspeaker saying murder Jews and rape their daughters, this is from 2021 but there have been plenty of antisemetic placards and chants that have been photographed at many protests across the world. Free Palestine is not, but from the river to the sea is, as the original version is from water to water Palestine will be Arab, they would chant this at rallies where speakers would talk about throwing the Jews into the Mediterranean to drown them, much like Jews were thrown into the canals in Amsterdam. You have multiple comments where you try and downplay antisemitism, kindly fuck off

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mr_mr_ben@reddit

So from now on when pro Palestinain protestors chant death to Jews or gas the Jews people are allowed to beat them unconscious?

The weird thing is that here in Canada that did happen. A Jewish protestor in Ottawa ripped off the veil of a Muslim woman and then charged. But the charges were dropped in part because the Muslim women had said the river to the sea chant.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/hijab-assault-charge-withdrawn-ottawa-1.7369868

Thus it does appear that chants legitimize violence now, at least if you have a good lawyer and are in Canada.

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SmellenDegenerates@reddit

I don't think it's okay, but I also expect it to happen. Don't be hateful, it has a way of coming back at you

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-Dec--@reddit

If Palestinians were genociding Jews then yes it would be justified to beat them up. We would all agree.

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bassman81@reddit

the cops were protecting the zionist hooligans in Amsterdam, in London the police did something against the hate speech

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loggy_sci@reddit

I say that attacking people chanting “death to arabs” is justified.

Says someone from probably USA where consist of more than 50% retarded voters who voted for racists.

Says the guy from the country that created the Stolen Generations, is responsible for one of the most destructive right wing forces in the world, is home to the Christchurch shooting and a number of neo nazi groups and has had a recent resugrance in popularity of your most far right electoral party.

my city just arrested and charged someone who did a Nazi salute

Interesting because your country recently had students target and shout anti-semitic slurs at a professor for being Jewish and has had a notable rise in antisemitism, so much it's made headlines across the board:

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2024/oct/07/australian-jews-deeply-worried-by-sense-of-a-schism-and-the-rise-in-antisemitism-a-year-on-from-7-october-ntwnfb

Australian Jews grappling with dissolving unity and the rise in antisemitism a year on from 7 October

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/community/articles/antisemitism-rise-australia

Since Oct. 7, however, Aussie Jews have been shocked by an explosion of antisemitism, including doxing, boycotts of Jewish businesses, and violent attacks. One of the most troubling incidents occurred when a WhatsApp group dedicated to combating antisemitism in the arts had its information leaked and compiled into a “Jew List.” This spreadsheet was created with the intention of boycotting and harassing Jewish artists.

Although isolated antisemitic incidents are not new here, when Melbourne’s Mount Scopus Memorial College, one of Australia’s largest Jewish day schools, had the graffiti “Jew Die” scrawled on its fence in late May, the incident was so shocking that Prime Minister Anthony Albanese weighed in with a statement on X, noting: “No place for this in Australia or anywhere else.”

https://humanrights.gov.au/about/news/opinions/silence-anti-semitism-and-racism-flourishes-0

What we have seen occurring in recent months in Australia is something that I never thought I would see in the country that I am so proud to call home. The Executive Council of Australian Jewry has reported an overwhelming increase in the number of reported anti-Semitic incidents since the brutal Hamas attack on October 7. What is even more horrifying is that those numbers alone don’t reveal the full story. Those statistics aren’t just abstract numbers, but represent real individuals and families who are feeling afraid, threatened, intimidated and unsafe.

Literally the opposite of what I said but go off.

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Which is why I hate israel too

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Nice__Spice@reddit

The bigger issue that we all are getting at is that Israel is being provided with a lot of levee. Extra slack that just benefits them when they cry victim.

Seeing the death toll in Gaza and atleast 70% of it being non-Hamas, it seems the Israeli government would say yes, it's a valid excuse.

Also, if you purposefully agitate someone into violence towards the group you are a part of, you are partiallly to blame for all that violence, even if it affects others within said group who did nothing.

You can't just go around inciting violence and then cry when that violence exceeds your expectations. Those that vandalised property, shouted hate speech and otherwise attempted to instigate trouble should be held fully liable for their actions. The fact that a consequence of their action is more violence should not be a factor in the case, and certainly not a mitigating one.

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Inferno_Sparky@reddit

That has nothing to do with what I said. I don't care what violence the israeli criminals suffer.

The israelis comitting hate crimes in the netherlands can suffer torture and I wouldn't care, but some of the sports game israeli tourists didn't commit crimes yet suffered violence. Even if they condemned the israelis who are committing crimes, it wouldn't have stopped most/all of them from being assaulted after leaving the sports game.

My point is that violence on innocents is not justified just because some of them were in the same place as other violent criminals.

Granted, Israel shouldn't be allowed internationally im sports games in the first place, but assaulting and hospitalizing civilians because they support the same sports team as violent criminals isn't justified.

I don't even think that all of the rage at this event (from the israeli and jewish sides), or even calling this "pogrom" ever made sense, I'm not defending anyone in this event; the opposite, I just think that violence is stupid and not a better answer than excessive protests

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hempires@reddit

My point is that violence on innocents is not justified just because some of them were in the same place as other violent criminals.

please, tell that to your representatives, cause evidently they don't think the same.

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-Dec--@reddit

Yeah in an idealistic world where everybody is expected to not get emotional and follow every single little law 100% of the time yes. In the reality where Israel is committing a genocide, it's different.

In Europe we have a saying which is to punch a nazi when you see one, that's what happened. And it will happen again. We're not normalising Israel anymore.

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SaneForCocoaPuffs@reddit

So just to be clear, we should hold every Israeli citizen directly responsible for the behavior of the government right?

So just to be clear, we should hold every Israeli citizen directly responsible for the behavior of the government right?

No.

Only the government supporters and people working for that government.

Which unfortunately is a big chunk of Israel percentage wise, seeing that this is an elected government and Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East, right?

It cuts both ways.

Out of curiosity, would you apply this same standard to Palestinians?

No, because Gaza/Palestine is not a democracy, or do you really consider it one? Last elections in Gaza were held almost 20 years ago, and the median age of the current population is ~18. This means more than half the people were not even alive when the last election was held, and another quarter was too young to vote. From the 25% that actually voted, about half voted for Hamas.

Regardless though, Israel is absolutely collectively punishing Palestinians.

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-Dec--@reddit

I hold every single German who lived in Germany and knew what was happening responsible for the Holocaust.

If Israel is engaged in a genocide and its fans are singing about that genocide then I can only assume they are complicit and tbh they got off easily.

As soon as these 'traumatised' fans arrived back home to Ben Gurion airport they started singing their little chant again which tells me they have no remorse and they have no accountability. The lyrics of the chant are on the Maccabis website and we all know what it says.

I am very very glad that the world is waking up to Israeli impunity and that people are growing tired of it.

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SaneForCocoaPuffs@reddit

If Israel is engaged in a genocide and its fans are singing about that genocide then I can only assume they are complicit and tbh they got off easily.

Would it bother you to know you sound exactly like Israeli media sources when they used that exact logic to justify the Gaza genocide?

https://www.memri.org/tv/palestinians-gaza-west-bank-celebrate-october-seven-massacre-hand-out-sweets-fire-guns

https://www.timesofisrael.com/watchdog-schools-run-by-pa-celebrated-oct-7-hamas-massacres

Israel’s entire population is currently running off the exact same reasoning you use, just with the sides switched. Funny how these arguments work huh?

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

Yes, it's funny because one side is committing the genocide, enough with these mental gymnastics and trying to hold the moral high ground

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SaneForCocoaPuffs@reddit

If you ask an Israeli, they'll say the exact same thing. Talking with you guys is exactly like going to r/Israel . Crazy how that works.

You guys are literally repeating the exact same Israeli talking points with sides switched. And people wonder why this conflict never goes away.

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

I get you're trying to view this from an objective perspective, but the sides are not equal when it comes to incentive.

There's a difference between attacking a group of people shouting hate against you and bombing innocents that have nothing to do with what's going on.

These are not things that can be compared.

You want them to talk?? Stop the killing before we can talk

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SaneForCocoaPuffs@reddit

The sides are not equal. But using Israel's arguments in this way only strengthens their position.

After October 7, Israel made the same arguments you are using. They said Palestinians support Hamas, they said every single Palestinian is responsible for the actions of Hamas, and every single Palestinian should be treated like Hamas. They used October 7 as proof that Palestinians were human animals and deserved to be starved and massacred.

Now, after years of calling out Israel for collective punishment and apartheid, suddenly those things are fantastic as long as they are used against Israel. We should collectively punish all Israelis, and some of the more radical elements say "all Jews". We should treat them like lesser humans in society.

Oh and by the way, Israel loves it when you do this. They love it when nations expel Jews and bully them and kill them. It makes their arguments to their citizens look more true and it drives boatloads of angry Jews to immigrate to Israel, fill up their illegal settlements, and join their army.

That's why I pursue an objective perspective. Because everything else only helps Israel more. You think that becoming an international pariah is not in Netanyahu's calculations? You think Netanyahu is blind to how destroying the UNRWA will impact Israel's reputation? Israel intentionally maintains a state of barely plausible victimhood while intentionally keeping the region violent and unstable because that's what keeps the right wing in power.

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

Except I'm not justifying violence against jews, the jewish population is not guilty by association, replace the jewish crowd with any other group of people and i'd have the same opinion, this whole situation is getting this much attention because it involves arabs and jews.

Naturally, some groups will take advantage of any commotion to spew their hateful rhetoric, but to think this is the norm is insane, i promise you if anti semitism was as prevalent as ppl make it out to be the world will look a whole lot different.

I agree with the broader perspective you're talking about, and how these situation benefits the israeli right wing, but we can't expect people to follow the law up to a T, humans are emotional creatures especially in times of great unstability.

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-Dec--@reddit

Israel is a rich nation that has billions of dollars worth of funding, and military support from the US, Germany, UK. It has complete military reign over the region with the ability to genuinely engage in genocide.

It's killed 40,000+ civilians in the past year alone.

Hamas is a ragtag insurgency, that has killed a couple of hundred.

Incomparable with even the most creative thinking.

There is a reason why Israel is turning into a pariah that is internationally condemned and it's not because Israel is the good guy.

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SaneForCocoaPuffs@reddit

Oh okay, so we can use collective punishment and blame civilians for the actions of their government only if the nation is rich. But if they are poor, collective punishment is wrong and we can't hold civilians responsible for their government.

It's crazy how we come up with all of these rules about blame and punishment and then suddenly these incredibly convenient loopholes appear that allow us to throw them all out the window.

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-Dec--@reddit

the victim mentality is insane, and I think I can guess why you're not flaired up

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zizop@reddit

The ones who spout genocidal rhetoric are definitely responsible, which seems to have been the case here.

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pr0metheusssss@reddit

There’s no “limited” evidence of the Maccabi hooligans committing arrestable crimes, and that’s from evidence available to the public alone (ie, not including cctv security cameras, undercover police eyewitnesses, etc.).

Things that the Maccabi hooligans got caught handed doing, recorded on video, include vandalism on on houses including breaking and entering (two houses with Palestinian flags confirmed), vandalism on taxes (2 cases confirmed, one on Centraal that is caught on video hit with sticks, another one that the police chief stayed was vandalised with chains), stealing metal sticks and planks from construction sites and brandishing them as weapons.

As for violent crime, the confirmed cases include a taxi driver that was beaten, a Dutch man with his son that was chased down, pushed to the ground and attacked, as well as a Maccabi teenager attacking a plainclothes police officer with a wooden plank and temporarily apprehended (but let go without an arrest).

I’m repeating, this only includes things we have videos of or official police statements, and does not include eyewitness accounts or footage from security cameras.

And to answer your question, no arrests were made, nothing that lasted more than a couple hours at best, and all Maccabi hooligans are safely back in Israel.

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regeust@reddit

Was it "mass racial violence"? Were they targeting Maccabi hooligans or jewish people broadly?

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binneysaurass@reddit

Destroying other people's property is not speech.

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umbertea@reddit

Even if you believe Maccabi fans are all responsible for the Gaza situation and should be collectively punished for it.

The point is that they are responsible for the situation in Amsterdam. They must have thought that they were in Ramallah because they promptly attacked the locals. Turns out that was a learning opportunity for them. A very useful and timely lesson, because their next match abroad is in Istanbul — where things could end very differently for these dumbasses. Good thing they got a swimming lesson because they might have to swim home from Turkie. :D

SimilarSituation5298@reddit

Keep in mind these people believe in collective punishment as long as jews are being punished

Not jews, zionists. Just like denazification campaigns in Germany after ww2, after we stop this genocide zionists will have to be reeducated.

Why didnt jews strike back against the germans post ww2 in revenge or backlash for the holocaust?

What, like the Warsaw uprising? Are you saying that jews escaping their concentration camp and killing Germans were terrorists? Because that's basically what happened on October 7th.

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FantasticMacaron9341@reddit

So you feel the same about palestinians? Since most support hamas and support october 7th, with vast support for things like this or this or this or this or tens of thousands of other instances throughout the years.

or collective punishment should be reserved for jews?

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OkTransportation473@reddit

Both Israel and Palestine should be occupied by the USA and forced into compliance. Yes.

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throwawayflapper1929@reddit

lol you live in an alternate universe or Iran, not sure which

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DDAY007@reddit

90% of the worlds jews identify as zionist. You have to be either ignorant or an outright a nazi to not understand why zionism exists.

Btw you are actively calling for jws to be put in camps. Tou understand that right? Nazis always love outing themselves.

Unless you suffer from severe head trauma you would remember the warsaw uprising happened during world war 2. An uprising which the soviets watched and refused to stop btw. People like you deny the holocaust because you argue "all jews werent killed tho".

So you agree and think that Israel is perfectly jusitifed in its war in gaza because its blowback for the attacks on ictober 7th. Because gaza isnt a concentration camp no matter how many times you lie. But its good to know that you support Israels right to resist against terror.

Thanks habibi Am Yisrael Chai!!

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

90% of the worlds jews identify as zionist.

So what? If most Germans identified as nazis it still wouldn't mean that all Germans are to blame for the nazis.

There's a LOT of jews, including ex IDF jews, that are outspoken about the war crimes of Israel.

So no, zionism does not equal zionism and implying so is extremely antisemitic.

Btw you are actively calling for jws to be put in camps. Tou understand that right? Nazis always love outing themselves

Not jews. Zionists.

warsaw uprising happened during world war 2

Ok? And October 7th happened during the 70+ year illegal occupation of Palestine.

o you agree and think that Israel is perfectly jusitifed in its war in gaza because its blowback for the attacks on ictober 7th. Because gaza isnt a concentration camp no matter how many times you lie. But its good to know that you support Israels right to resist against terror.

Nope, blowback can't happen to the oppressed, only the oppressors. October 7th happened because Israel is an apartheid regime maintaining an open air prison. And now Israel is indiscriminately bombing that open air prison.

Palestine will be free, regardless of zionist progenocide antisemitic freaks like you.

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-Dec--@reddit

90% of the worlds jews identify as zionist.

receipt?

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Zipz@reddit

Are we really ignoring the people who were attacked ?

https://www.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/s/V1yjzf4R8X

Shouting something is very different than attacking people

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

Is Mexico conducting a genocide?

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huysocialzone@reddit

Well Israel also doesn't.

And if we are talking about accusation then Mexico has also been accused of genocide during its history.

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We also know this attack was preplanned and had nothing to do with what the soccer players were chanting.

This is pathetic. Yeah sure it had nothing to do with a bunch of racist zionists chanting "death to arabs" nah I'm sure people just wanted to hunt jews in AMSTERDAM.

"Some bad things" i wonder if you said the same thing when nazis were chanting "jews will not replace us" in Charlottesville in 2020.

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azure_beauty@reddit

i wonder if you said the same thing when nazis were chanting "jews will not replace us" in Charlottesville in 2020.

Look, if in response to those marches people started running over and beating up everyone from Virginia, I would also decry that as idiotic, violent, and immoral.

By your logic certain Arabs chanting hateful slogans against the Jews means I can beat up my Arab neighbor.

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

By your logic certain Arabs chanting hateful slogans against the Jews means I can beat up my Arab neighbor.

Nah, you're missing the point, but let's use your example.

If your neighbor was a nazi during ww2 and started chanting "death to jews" WHILE the Holocaust was happening, I'd say you'd be completely justified on beating him up.

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Inquisitor671@reddit

Which is why we are currently fighting the palestinians. Do recall that their leader allied with the nazis and helped them recruit bosniak Muslims and others.

And they still hate us just like amin al husseini did. The constantly chant "itbach al yahud".

Sit just sot in your wretched cartel state and keep your mouth shut about subjects you gave no understanding about.

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azure_beauty@reddit

I mean by that dudes logic when my neighbors were chanting "yitbach ah yahud" on 8/10 I should have gone and beat them up?

Something tells me that if I did, the people here would be deeply unhappy with my actions.

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azure_beauty@reddit

Firstly, my neighbors did quite literally chant "kill the Jews" in Arabic while 7/10 was happening. I did not beat them up.

Secondly, in the example, I would not be beating up my neighbor, but a random third person who shares his ethnicity.

Anyway, if you want me to go beat up my neighbor just tell me, because their actions definitely fit what you claim to be justification for violence!

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big_cock_lach@reddit

We also know this attack was preplanned

Do we? Can you show proof of that that doesn’t come from an Israeli source?

what the soccer players were chanting

It wasn’t the players, it was the fans. Also, no they weren’t unrelated fans. They were the fans that were making these comments.

Also, you’re significantly undermining what happened, although that’s to be expected from Hasbara isn’t it? I’m assuming that because in many places, assault charges are typically wavered or reduced if they’re in response to a large group chanting hate speech, albeit a mob doing so isn’t. Regardless, at no point did I say the attack was justified. I’m saying that a) the Israeli’s weren’t innocent either and both groups should be charged for their respective crimes and b) you can’t be surprised you get attacked after chanting hate speech in a large group. Especially if you’re foreigners chanting things the local population strongly disagrees with.

People here focus on why the Israeli’s are bad, because so many people are trying to spread misinformation and claim they aren’t. No one here needs to condemn a mob committing assault or a terrorist group because everyone knows that what they did was wrong and no one is trying to justify it. If Israel wasn’t trying to wrongly claim the moral high ground, people wouldn’t care. Ironically, all this talk defending Israel just makes more people aware of their actual crimes.

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azure_beauty@reddit

Can you show proof of that that doesn’t come from an Israeli source

A source being Israeli does not make it any less relevant.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/dutch-government-probing-how-israel-warnings-were-missed-ahead-of-amsterdam-pogrom/

We know the Mossad passed a warning to Dutch authorities prior to the event having taken place. That means it was premeditated.

Also, no they weren’t unrelated fans

A British Jew (not Israeli in any way) got beat up and had to get stitches.

I have seen claims that a random Cypriot couple got attacked because they looked Jewish.

The attackers cheered for attacking Jews and Israelis, not the specific Maccabee fan which said bad things.

Even if Maccabee fans did chant bad things, that does not mean you can assault them. Even if you believe those actions are deserving of assault, not all the fans acted like that. This attack is objectively irrational and immoral.

the Israeli’s weren’t innocent either

I refuse to believe that a random British Jew who got beat up was deserving of it because certain fans of an Israeli football team chanted hateful slogans.

chanting things the local population strongly disagrees with.

The local population is perfectly peaceful. You know full well who the people attacking Jews were.

No one here needs to condemn a mob committing assault or a terrorist group because everyone knows that what they did was wrong and no one is trying to justify it.

This is insane degrees of historical revisionism. The literal founders of both Zionism as a movement, and Israel as a state, have mountains of quotes referring to the project they're undertaking as colonialism, and acknowledging that it requires displacement, and acknowledging that they're doing or have done displacement.

Now, a little while down the very short timeline of modern Israel's existence, you are somehow denying the foundation of it, while claiming to teach me about its history. Just insane.

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SG508@reddit

You do realise that Jews started coming to he land much befor ethe foundong of Israel, right? The old Yishuv was there from the 18th century. What I assume you are referring to when you say displacement is the Nakba, which when used, as far as I understand mostly refers to the first part of Israel's war of independance, which resulted in the fleeing of around 750,000 Arabs from what became then Israel's land. This was not initiated by Israel, but by acts of aggression from the Arabs there. The displacement of said people could be fairly traced back to three things - the attacks of Jews on hostile villages as part of the war, the massacres (which were few, and I absolutely comndemn them), and the panic created by the Arab leadership on hopes to move more Arabs to fight. They were not a part of the Jewish plan, and could have been avoided, at least mostly, if not for said violent repsonse. Do you really think the Jews would habe risked their best chance to get a state for a land grab?

As for the quotes you mentioned, I can only vaguely address those, as you weren't too specific yourself, so I'll just say that I could probably pretty easly bring you extreme quotes from the leaders of the Lehi, but it's clear that it wouldn't reflect Zionism today or then. Even if we'll talk about Herzl, who is considered the father of Zionism, he wanted Israel to be in Uganda, which is very far from what can be considered a representation of the Zionist movement.

Also, I just now realised that your original claim was that colonialism is very close to Nazism. While they are both bad ideologies rooted in racism, this is still a pretty weird and far-fetched claim

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GuentherKleiner@reddit

I mean the houthis execute non-believers and gays, the taliban want to stop women from talking to each other, ISIS supporters still fight for a jihadi state where anybody else buy Muslim men are fair game for any type of abuse, Arabs in sudan are happy killing and raping black people as they please.

GuentherKleiner@reddit

I'm interested, tell me how the definitional criteria after international law are met.

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

I don't think that's genocide.

Oh. Ok then.

Maybe read up on your countries genocidal history and you'll find out how genocide is defined.

LMAO please, educate me.

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TheStoicNihilist@reddit

Join the IDF: At least we’re not ISIS!

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jamesandflint@reddit

They just split meaningless rhetoric with their head buried so far into the sand that they ignore atrocities spanning the rest of the globe. Their a primary focus on a country the size of wales that is doing a damn awful job of committing genocide since the Palestinian population continues to increase…

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SimilarSituation5298@reddit

That increase of population is because Israel has been ethnically cleansing the palestinians from their homes and pushing them into the concentration camp that is Gaza.

Oh, and "there's a lot of wrong in the world just let us do this one genocide" is a horrible argument.

That country the size of Wales is responsible for more children killed than any country in any modern conflict.

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throwawayflapper1929@reddit

The only Nazi here is you dude

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Congrats on justifying people hunting down and attacking Jews on the street because some Israelis burned a flag or said "F*ck the Arabs". Is it justified for Americans to attack Hispanics on the streets because they're all immigrants?

It's shocking how many people here are openly justifying violent attacks on Jews, citing incidents like Israeli football fans chanting "F*ck the Arabs." This is a blatant red herring—these attacks weren’t spontaneous reactions but organized in advance. Trying to reduce them to mere responses to chanting or flag-burning is appalling.

Amsterdam rioters 'planned Jew hunt on Telegram' before they attacked Israeli football fans

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wasdlmb@reddit

What the hell is going on in this thread? Why are people now super down with collective punishment if it targets Jews? Imagine getting your ass beat randomly and people say it's OK because some folks of the same religion were acting like hooligans.

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Rubysz@reddit

Their telegram group was titled “Jew Hunt” and they assaulted random people who they thought were jewish, including ukrainians, british, and other ransoms thought to be jewish or helping jews. Take your head out of the sand.

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soyyoo@reddit

I wish r/israelcrimes felt like this towards 🇵🇸

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BorodinoWin@reddit

But no one is allowed to touch the Arabs in Canada and America changing death to America and death to Canada.

ShootmansNC@reddit

You're just fantasizing about what you want to do.

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BDB-ISR-@reddit

That's not the correct analogy. The correct analogy would be attacking any Arab-looking and/or Muslim person. The attackers didn't care what their opinions were.

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Keesual@reddit

Hot take: Both sides aren’t blameless. The maccabi fans shouldnt have destroyed those flags and provoked. But there has also been people just vocally targeting jews and intimidating/assaulting people to show their passport on the street. People getting knocked on the street for looking jewish. There has been many videos floating of that night on the internet.

The police WERE called, did nothing. People have a right to protect themselves AND their towns from hooligans and we all have a right to beat down a racist or two.

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Best_Change4155@reddit

The police WERE called, did nothing.

Source?

we all have a right to beat down a racist or two.

1) If someone is a racist and only a racist (e.g. he only says racist shit, but is non-violent) you do not have a right to beat him down, you fucking barbarian.

2) They were randomly checking people's passports. They were not checking if they were racist

Why are you defending Islamophobia?

I am defending the right of people to say incredibly rude and offensive things. Because the Netherlands is ostensibly a civilized society and not a society of knuckle-dragging sectarian fighters.

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One must wonder why violence is wrong. To me, it's wrong because it causes harm onto people. And words justifying a literal genocide cause more harm (to actual innocent people, in this case mostly children) than punching a bunch of genocide apologists.

It's shocking how many people here are openly justifying violent attacks on Jews, citing incidents like Israeli football fans chanting "F*ck the Arabs." This is a blatant red herring—these attacks weren’t spontaneous reactions but organized in advance. Trying to reduce them to mere responses to chanting or flag-burning is appalling.

Amsterdam rioters 'planned Jew hunt on Telegram' before they attacked Israeli football fans

People were hunted down in the streets, asked if they were Jewish, and then viciously beaten—even if they said they weren’t Jewish. Any one of the people in this community could have been brutally attacked by these violent criminals. Yet, because Jews were the primary targets, many here seem willing to excuse it. This community is disturbingly saturated with antisemitic enablers, and it's disgraceful.

Lmao, sweeping accusations that all Palestinians are terrorists since kindergarten and want the murder of every Jew, and in the same breath, castigating someone else for lumping all Israelis together. You're too much man

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HummusSwipper@reddit

sweeping accusations that all Palestinians are terrorists since kindergarten and want the murder of every Jew

You're showing your own stupidity by making these logical leaps. How did you reach that conclusion is truly beyond me my guy, maybe you think they're all terrorists but want someone else to say it? Sorry but I don't think all Palestinians are terrorists.

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shieeet@reddit

How did you reach that conclusion is truly beyond me [...] please try to point out the part in which I said or hinted that all Palestinian are terrorists.

Hahah, you really are something special, man. Lets see;

I'll address your concern but first let me further cement my point about the Palestinian mindset and why your understanding of Israel's society is wrong.

The majority of Palestinians in Judea & Samaria and in Gaza overwhelmingly support Hamas. Hamas' charter calls for the annihilation of Israel and the murder of every Jew in it. They fund and organize summer terror camps, the maps taught in Palestinian kindergartens portray the entire land as 'Palestine', children watch TV shows with protagonists that blame their problems solely on Jews and promote Jihad.

Gee, gosh! What here could possibly hint or suggest that all Palestinians under occupation support terrorists? Is it 'the Palestinian mindset,' where they overwhelmingly support Hamas? Or is it the repeated allusions that they all want to murder every Jew since kindergarten? How could aaaaanyone read the paragraphs above and possibly think you are making sweeping generalizations and implying an overwhelming majority supports terrorism 🤷‍♂️?

Anyway, let’s go back to how ackshually, in contrast, Israeli public opinion and voting is, like, really diverse and complicated or maybe get lost in the weeds about some other minutia.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

This is you:

Lmao, sweeping accusations that all Palestinians are terrorists

This is also you:

all Palestinians under occupation support terrorists

Are you back-paddling from your initial accusation or are you just demented and forgot what you said in the first place? Maybe you need me to explain the difference between being actual terrorists and supporting terrorism?

Imagine writing that entire rant whining about the wrong thing, truly impressive.

Anyway, let’s go back to how ackshually, in contrast, Israeli public opinion and voting is, like, really diverse and complicated or maybe get lost in the weeds about some other minutia.

The effort you put into mocking could be better used to improve your reading comprehension.

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shieeet@reddit

Lmao, and here comes the minutiae into the weeds, as always.

I was mocking the farcical way you make sweeping generalizations of Palestinians and then act all disconcerted when someone else lumps Israeli political opinions together. As a response, not only do you use the word 'back-paddling' (lol) as a weird, nonsensical gotcha, you also do the whole dork-ass charade of UHM, SIR, YOU MISCONSTRUE THE PHRASING 'ALL PALESTINIANS ARE TERRORISTS' WITH 'ALL PALESTINIANS SUPPORT TERRORISTS ☝️🤓

Either the most dishonest or the most self-deluded person in this sub, bar none, but always cringe regardless.

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I’ll remember this when the next pro-Palestine march happens in my city. Every time there are people shouting antisemitism, so I guess i should attack all the protesters with a bat.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Putting words in my mouth i see, another classic tactic.

What words would those be?

Actions have consequences, who would've thought, weren't you guys saying the same to justify the genocide on gaza??

Oh another generalization of an entire population. Even though there are hundreds of thousands of Israelis protesting the government here you are telling me everyone is justifying the war. You're truly ignorant of reality.

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

Last time i checked israelis were protesting the discharge of galant, the guy who wanted to escalate the war in Lebanon and involve syria.

Unless I'm missing something I'd be happy to see more than few hundreds of people protesting netanyahu actions in gaza

Listen im not justifying random attacks against jews the same way i wouldn't want it to happen to any other group, but in this particular situation there was a reason, and the telegram evidence aren't substantial so far, unless an actual cyber investigation proved or denied it, it is still up for debate.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

1.Check again then.

2.There are more a few hundreds.

So you are justifying it.

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

Then please, inform me with what my news source are not showing me regarding the internal situation in israel.

Also, recognising the reason behind it is not the same as justifying it.

Would you justify it if the roles were reversed?

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Why do I have to spoon feed you?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/sep/01/protests-israel-strike-eruption-outrage-gaza-war

Giant anti-government protest rally grips Tel Aviv

I googled "israel anti war protest" and got this, couldn't you do the same?

You are justifying it by doubting the evidence and demanding irrelevant conditions such as a "cyber investigation" as if this was a group of hackers breaking into a bank.
No I wouldn't, but you clearly are.

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

Doubting anything is a great way to try and get an objective view, if the attack was premeditated regardless of the football fans actions then that's horrible, but until we can confirm it, it's still up for debate. That's all I'm saying.

Also, thanks for you sources, I'll be happy to be more informed of the situation

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throwawayflapper1929@reddit

Awww just like Hezbollah sending hundreds of rockets to northern Israel and then crying about being the victim, right?

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dbgtboi@reddit

People were hunted down in the streets, asked if they were Jewish, and then viciously beaten—even if they said they weren’t Jewish. Any one of the people in this community could have been brutally attacked by these violent criminals.

I agree, if anyone in this community was in Amsterdam that day, spouting hate speech, and being a violent piece of shit, they absolutely could have been attacked.

Yet, because Jews were the primary targets, many here seem willing to excuse it.

It's not our fault that the Israelis football hooligans were being violent racist shitheads.

Are you implying that being a racist violent shithead is the same as being a Jew? That is actually pretty anti-semitic if you associate all Jews with that.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

I agree, if anyone in this community was in Amsterdam that day, spouting hate speech, and being a violent piece of shit, they absolutely could have been attacked.

You misunderstand. The people attacked were casually walking home, they weren't part of the hooligans.

Are you implying that being a racist violent shithead is the same as being a Jew? That is actually pretty anti-semitic if you associate all Jews with that.

Wow, what a take. You totally missed the point of my comment just to come up with this painfully unfunny response. The ironic part is you're actually painting Jews as 'racist violent shitheads' yourself by misunderstanding my comment. Peak projection really.

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dbgtboi@reddit

HummusSwipper used Reality Bend

It not very effective...

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randompersononearth9@reddit

They were football hooligans who made it political by ripping private owned flags and chanting slurs all over the city. Attacking taxi drivers who were arabs and taunting a certain population knowing they would react. Even celebrating the death of children.

Who said that the hooligans did not organise this in order to provoke a reaction before they even came to amsterdam.

If an arab club went to antwerpen for a football match and the supporters went to jewish neighborhoods shouting death to the jews they would be labelled as terrorists, hamas and would get locked up. Everyone would blame that country for being extremists. But you expect us to now say the hooligans were the victims?

Maybe start with not killing children for over a year before you are looking at others. The people getting thrown into canals or beaten up provoked and found out that they cannot just do whatever they want. Maybe the politicians and media are spineless but the people are not silent about this and they showed it. Are you really suprised that a growing part of the world is getting anti zionist/ israel when you see what your government and people are doing?

Anyone who is celebrating the death of children can get fucked and that is what happened. They should be ashamed of themselves but that means that you need a moral conscience first.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

An entire wall of text that does nothing to engage with what I've said, just pure whataboutism and condoning violence. You're not here to discuss in good faith, you're just using the opportunity to inject the discussion with your vile ill-informed opinions.

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randompersononearth9@reddit

As if you are here in good faith. If you do not condemn the people celebrating children dying and chanting there are no schools in gaza because we killed the children then you are morally corrupt. Is that not a bigger issue? Because now you are also ignoring that and saying what about this or that.

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hamgrey@reddit

To HummusSwipper there's no bigger issue in the world than conspiracy against Jews, and every single aspect of this entire conflict obviously boils down to that. It's useless trying to discuss or debate with them when the merest glimmer of antisemitism is treated as more heinous than the murder of children :/

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knockoffgerardway@reddit

spent some time going through your previous comments and i gotta say, i don’t like hyperbole? but you have to be one of the most disingenuous people i’ve ever come across on this platform.

you cherry pick, purposefully misrepresent facts given to you, and straight up ignore any contextual information presented to you if it delegitimizes your arguments.

you’d a zealot, a purposeful liar, and genocide denier. you should be ashamed of yourself dude.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

I'm honestly surprised you resorted to personal attacks even before engaging in discussion, usually your type goes the other way around.

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That's not what I'm asking. If you defend aggressive people, be consistent. Don't change opinions when the situation is similar but the parties involved are reversed. Attacking one side regardless of actions in any situation is just hypocrisy.

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Yeahhh_Nahhhhh@reddit

I think it’s cause this has happened outside of the protest/political movements makes it different. It’s also highly influenced by how violent football fans can be in general.

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Mastermind1776@reddit

It’s definitely a hot take, but it feels like a weird argument that something that may be “instigated” at an event had premeditation of the attacking group that carried out the attacks after the event.

“I hate this guy and brought a knife to the party, but he bad mouthed mother so I stabbed him when no one was looking as he left the house. So it’s his fault for starting it.”

Are there videos or other links showing the chants and other items? Haven’t seen it to date but always looking for different evidence and perspectives.

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Quiet-Hawk-2862@reddit

What about those random Cypriots who got beaten up for looking Jewish, were they belligerent instigators too?

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sieurblabla@reddit

If the situation were reversed, they would have been referred to as unfortunate collateral damage.

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NoHetro@reddit

If the situation were reversed

They arranged to beat them up prior to any video coming out.

These are just generational nazis who are culturally taught to hate jews.

Its why 95% of the jew haters who pop up in this sub can just blatantly lie because they dont live in a world of facts.

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kraaqer@reddit

You saw the news before you saw the videos of them saying death to Palestine and burning Palestinian flags, stealing others property.... They were there,are you crazy??

They were literally in the football match.... You are not healthy

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DDAY007@reddit

So you beleive in collective punishment then?

So when a jewish school in canada was shot up (TWICE) should jews have just gone on a rampage.

When a jew was shot in NY should all jews have started burning down anti jewish establisments?

When a muslim man in germany went around stabbing people should germans have burnt down every arab establisment?

Weird how this only happens when jews are invovled.

Keep in mind none of the nazi attackers were football fans. The amsterdam club is literally a pro zionist club, these were outside aggitators who pre arranged this. You are actively supporting a pogrom btw a few days before Kristallnacht's anniversary.

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kraaqer@reddit

My guy, where does the idea of collective punishment come?

There are videos out there hooligans fightings protestors where the hooligans take up wood planks...

Idk what you are on about with your examples...

Weird how this only happens when jews are invovled.

Maybe don't shout anti Arab slurs and wish for a genocide on the Palestinians?

"A separate video geolocated by NBC News showed Israeli fans taunting pro-Palestinian protesters either before or after Thursday's match by singing “Death to the Arabs” and “Let the IDF win. We will f*** the Arabs,” as well as tearing down a Palestinian flag."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israeli-soccer-fans-attacked-amsterdam-maccabi-tel-aviv-ajax-rcna179262

You are crazy to compare this to Kristallnacht, there are Jews living in Amsterdam there are doing just fine and is most likely part of the anti genocide protest.

Then you have these fascists hooligans chanting this shit and expect to do whatever they want, like burning Palestinian flags...

Imagine if it was Palestinians going to some pro Israeli country and taking down Israeli flags burning it, and chanting the same but with Jews... Then it would sound more like Kristallnacht... Stop with your crocodile tears

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Hey thanks for protecting racist and violent people even when they're aimlessly targeting Jews! Imagine thinking it's a given to chase people, ask them if they're Jewish and then beat the shit out of them.

Your morality is rotten to the core and your justification of these attacks is disgusting. I can't believe you're actually from Denmark with this bottom of the barrel level of thinking.

Amsterdam rioters 'planned Jew hunt on Telegram' before they attacked Israeli football fans

'They shouted Jewish, IDF': Israeli football fans describe attack in Amsterdam

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kraaqer@reddit

I took some time and looked into israeli zionist football culture, and some of the clubs are known for being VERY racist.

https://www.jewishchronicle.org/2008/03/31/israeli-soccer-exposes-racism/
>> "I suppose Maccabi Tel Aviv soccer fans should be congratulated for restraint. They didn’t start making monkey sounds — chanting “hoo-hoo-hoo” as loud as they could — at black players on the opposing team until one of them scored a goal.
>> It’s quite a sensation to hear “hoo-hoo-hoo” every time a black player touches the ball when you’re watching a soccer game in a big stadium in Tel Aviv. That was the scene at Bloomfield Stadium in a Saturday game recently between Maccabi Tel Aviv and Hapoel Kfar Saba."

https://www.972mag.com/israels-most-racist-soccer-club-isnt-shouting-death-to-arabs/
>> "Maccabi Tel Aviv, however, takes care to smuggle in the Palestinian players who are prepared to play for them. Maccabi fans have consistently cursed at Arab players on their team, from star acquisitions to graduates of the club’s youth academy. They apply pressure on the club’s management, who for their part are quick to relieve themselves of the unnecessary “burden” by trading the players in question. Since the club was taken over in 2009 by Mitch Goldhar, a rich Canadian Zionist, the number of Arab players has steadily dwindled.
>>
>> The racism at the club is further enabled by the fact that Maccabi flies under the Israeli media’s radar, which instead prefers to focus on the antics of Beitar Jerusalem fans, particularly “La Familia,” and the complete absence of Arab players in the club’s entire history. But the decision of Maccabi Tel Aviv players to wrap themselves in the Israeli flag following Tuesday’s match shouts out the subtext that Arabs have no place here. In other words, those Maccabi players are no less racist than members of “La Familia.”"

https://www.jta.org/2004/01/20/lifestyle/racism-in-israeli-soccer
>> Chanting “Death to the Arabs,” hundreds of young Jewish soccer fans race up a dusty side street to catch a bus carrying fans of the Arab team that had just beat theirs in a tense game. The supporters jeer even after the bus pulls away.
>> Racism in Israeli soccer stems mostly from Jewish fans who feel they can shout slogans such as “Death to the Arabs” and “Go to Palestine” without fear of repercussion, experts say. The same cannot be said for their Arab counterparts. Jews playing on Arab teams say they feel at home on their teams. The Arab fans “give us lots of respect; there is no racism. They treat us well and we enjoy every minute,” Asulin said, smiling as he was slapped on the back after the game by a steady stream of fans.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Congratulations on both ignoring my comment completely and going on a random rant about football hooligans no one cares about.

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kraaqer@reddit

i replied to you on the other comment tf... this was jsut a followup....

> The people attacked on the street were asked if they're Jewish, not if they're "israeli zionist football fans", but I'm not surprised you're conflating the two.

Do you really think that is how it works?
"hey are you jewish"
"yes"
*beat up*

I sincerely hope that you one day find yourself in the real world.

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zlex@reddit

Do you really think that is how it works? "hey are you jewish" "yes" beat up

I mean that is exactly what was happening...

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Do you really think that is how it works?
"hey are you jewish"
"yes"
*beat up*

I sincerely hope that you one day find yourself in the real world.

Are you actually attempting to gaslight me on Reddit? The only one who's clearly never stepped outside their comfort zone is you my guy.

Here, taken straight from the BBC article I linked:

Shortly after, a group asked the men if they were Jewish, and Aaron said that they were British.

“But they said ‘you helped the Jew’, and he punched me in my face and broke my glasses," Aaron said.

and

"We faced around 20 people who ran towards us. They asked me where I was from, and I said I was from Greece. They said they didn’t believe me and they asked to see my passport.

When he told them he didn't have it, the men beat him, pushed him to the ground and kicked his face, Mr Tshuva said.

I have no interest in the rest of your accusations as they are irrelevant. The ones referred as animals were Hamas, the chanting about school was not in Amsterdam. You're just derailing the conversation or resorting to gaslighting because you have nothing better to say.

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kraaqer@reddit

In the daily mail article they say this:

"Amsterdam police said on social media yesterday that tensions before the match had been high and they were being particularly vigilant in the wake of several incidents, including the tearing down of a Palestinian flag from a building by Maccabi fans.

Footage also emerged of provocative chants including, 'Let the IDF win, we will f--- the Arabs,' and, 'F--- you, Palestine.'"

And on the BBC article: "Some Maccabi Tel Aviv fans have previously been involved in racist incidents in Israel, including cursing at the team’s Palestinian and Arab players and reportedly applying pressure on the team to oust them."

In the dailymail they compare it to the pogroms in the russian empire... Which is what you would expect from Dailymail lol

Your morality is rotten to the core and your justification of these attacks is disgusting. I can't believe you're actually from Denmark with this bottom of the barrel level of thinking.

Imagine being a Zionist and talking about morality... Talk about morality when Palestine is free.

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theRemRemBooBear@reddit

Didn’t the “protestors” beat Cyprus nationals? Why did they get beat up?

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kraaqer@reddit

Because they believe that Cyprus is part of the ottoman empire ofc...

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Quiet-Hawk-2862@reddit

Pro-Palestine protesters:

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.9zFHxGWMvhT-7WY5WzA5wgHaE8%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=be44721bad338604cc91754ddc05c782f3243c679fd31aa78805382d325bebb2&ipo=images

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse2.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.e8lrJFF87kD-pOO25mKtwwAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=1012a1fb7fa38bbda19cb922074c79ff104b6a8d2ebceffc4435477a2e2a6c66&ipo=images

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse2.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.U10VA_Fib2mRqRdwmKJqSgHaEl%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=82822b62a088306edf353d0c1d65346172b11a05f5b3d1cacad4989fa754786a&ipo=images

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.4evha9p6TpB6fjJin8oL9gHaFL%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=e5a33ab943bf4fcfc995c92cc849358b681fd88c08e61985e29352c7a1e5b79f&ipo=images

Yeah, I bet Jews can't wait to get in there and join the fun!

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kraaqer@reddit

Saying pro palestinian protestors are antisemetic is just hilarious in november 2024, get out of here lmfao...

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Quiet-Hawk-2862@reddit

I suppose you think those photos were faked..... by TEH J00000000z

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kraaqer@reddit

You are living in an alternative universe. imagine that you think that jewish people are linked to iseael by some higher thing that they are not in control of.

I have written before that jews and israel have as much in common as muslims and saudi arabia, or christians and the pope.

If muslims wanted to learn antisemetism they would ask the likes of UK and europe... europeans did do the pogroms and genocide against jews that we are referencing to in this thread.

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Quiet-Hawk-2862@reddit

I never said Jewish people were or were not linked to Israel, I'm sure they have no connection just as I'm sure that you have no connection to Denmark, just because you're, you know, Danish doesn't mean that you have any connection to Denmark at all lols

All I said was I doubt they want to spend a lot of time in the company of people who like swastikas for some strange reason. You know, like in the pics.

Btw if you don't like Gaza, you should see what's been happening in Ukraine while you were being distracted by Uncle Vladis little buddies and their tantrums.

One million dead so far. But they don't matter because they're not fighting your little race war for you, are they?

Oh well, Trump is President now, in no small part thanks to your lot encouraging leftwing Americans to abstain - so I guess you'll be hearing a lot more from Uncle Vladis fun loving crew of ACTUAL genocidal mutants in the near future, unless Denmark's got a bunch of nukes in it's back pocket lols

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kraaqer@reddit

> I never said Jewish people were or were not linked to Israel, I'm sure they have no connection just as I'm sure that you have no connection to Denmark, just because you're, you know, Danish doesn't mean that you have any connection to Denmark at all lols

A danish person have connection to denmark. Denmark is a nation-state. When you are danish your nationality is danish, meaning you could have some cultural, language, historical values. A state in the other hand is a political entity, with boarders on a map and centerally organized governmnet.
Judaism, a religion, have 0, nothing, nada relation with the STATE of israel.

And you dont need to hallucinate my connection to denmark, i am danish.

"I suppose you think those photos were faked..... by TEH J00000000z"
Explain what you mean by this, i did not bring jewish people in the conversation when i talked about Israelis, it was you. So why did you feel the need to involve jewish people?

> All I said was I doubt they want to spend a lot of time in the company of people who like swastikas for some strange reason. You know, like in the pics.

I am in the protests here in denmark, i do see "jews against genocide" in the pro palestinian protests, are you gonna call them kapos?

> Btw if you don't like Gaza, you should see what's been happening in Ukraine while you were being distracted by Uncle Vladis little buddies and their tantrums.

Stop deflecting, we are not talking about russias invasion of ukrain right now,

> Oh well, Trump is President now, in no small part thanks to your lot encouraging leftwing Americans to abstain

Politics is not a team sport, the politicans have to deserve your vote by their politics.

Quiet-Hawk-2862@reddit

Why do you think that might be then?

Clue: they showed us what happens when they are allowed in one day in October...

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kraaqer@reddit

I think we should stop this discussion here. You are not alright.

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Quiet-Hawk-2862@reddit

K thnks baaiii

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DDAY007@reddit

Weird how your entire comment is just definitionally collective punishment. Keep in mind that Pro palestinians have consistently called for the genocide of Jews in Israel; unless you of course believe the neo nazi talking point that calling for an intifada is not genocide (you would be factually wrong).

None of the attacks were football fans vs football fans. Both clubs have a long standing history with Ajax literally being a zionist supporting club.

By using your logic the entire football system needs to be dismantled because if we collectivise the system unless once again you believe that British, Spanish, Eastern European sports dont have an issue with racism.

Weird how there was no word from you as Jewish insitutions worldwide were being attacked. No word from you as dozens of countries have massive increases in hate crimes against jews. Btw when I say 'weird' i mean to say 'nazi alligned individuals'.

Over 90% of the worlds jews are zionists. You either have to ignorant or historically illiterate to not understand why a jewish state exists or why some Jews are radicalised.

Please readup on international law and the UN conventions while I have you here. Youll realise that definitionally there is no genocide. You are only reitierating nazi talking points because you are afraid of being kicked out of your online echochamber communities where if you dont support something 100% you are against it 100%.

The only one here historically doing crocidile tears are the palestinians btw. They numerous times rejected UN and unilateral plans for a peacefull resolution. They start wars they cant win and hide behind their middle eastern neighbours all of which (with the exception of the rogue shia states) hate them btw.

Keep in mind all of these nazis who attacked jews, pre arranged this ahead of time. All you are doing is giving them justification; you know who else did that btw? The nazis when jews defended themselves in kristallnacht.

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frizzykid@reddit

I mean you guys make excuses up to bomb and kill thousands of innocent Palestinians and Lebanese people a week.

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Specific_Occasion_36@reddit

And think some street brawling evens things out. Or college protesters getting in a shoving match.

The Murica’ mindset emerging in other countries now is kinda amazing.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

It's shocking how many people here are openly justifying violent attacks on Jews, citing incidents like Israeli football fans chanting "F*ck the Arabs." This is a blatant red herring—these attacks weren’t spontaneous reactions but organized in advance. Trying to reduce them to mere responses to chanting or flag-burning is appalling.

Amsterdam rioters 'planned Jew hunt on Telegram' before they attacked Israeli football fans

People were hunted on the streets, asked if they were Jewish or not, and then beaten the sh*t out of them even if they responded that they weren't Jewish.

It's literally not contradictory, two events can happen simultaneously. These are two different acts of violence.

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Best_Change4155@reddit

The idea that this was a “pogrom” is insulting to the memory of Jews who actually died or were displaced by such events. The Maccabi fans were the belligerent instigators here; make no mistake.

Except the people you are defending are still checking foreigners' passports even after the Maccabia fans left. They very clearly didn't get the memo that what they were doing was a "reaction" rather than "an organized effort."

https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/301550981/demonstraties-in-amsterdam-ook-door-rechter-verboden-pro-palestijnse-protest-mag-niet-doorgaan-op-de-dam

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No, they went home after this all happened.

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Best_Change4155@reddit

They went home, and then the pro-Palestine folks were still passport checking people.

I already cited a source:

https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/301550981/demonstraties-in-amsterdam-ook-door-rechter-verboden-pro-palestijnse-protest-mag-niet-doorgaan-op-de-dam

Why isn’t that a possibility?

This is like suggesting it's possible the pager attack on Hezbollah wasn't Israel. (well they just admitted it was them, but still).

Do you have any evidence that it might be one very organised group?

It isn't an organized group as in "Al Qaeda" - it is an organized group as in those flash mobs of thieves that shoplift. There have already been WhatsApp messages released. These were people coordinating with each other.

Honestly, it probably was mixture because you have the normal football hooliganism plus the current political climate. Israelis shouting hate speech etc could attract a lot of hate from many different groups and individuals.

When faced with evidence, it's very important to never ever back down. Also, the punishment for hate speech is not vigilante violence.

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Yeahhh_Nahhhhh@reddit

No it’s nothing like that. Like at all. Again any proof that EVERYONE involved was in that WhatsApp group?

Maybe wait for the police to finish their investigation? Also, not I don’t give a shit when a racist gets beaten up. At all. Doesn’t mean I think it should be the response.

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Best_Change4155@reddit

Also, not I don’t give a shit when a racist gets beaten up. At all.

And you don't see how that conflicts with this:

I care if people not involved were hurt. That’s all.

When the people determining the "racism" are the guys doing passport-checks and assaulting random people based on their ethnicity?

I also don't care if racists get beat up, as long as the sole arbiter that determines "what is racism" is me.

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Yeahhh_Nahhhhh@reddit

The state often fucks up when it comes to punishing crimes so it’s the same issue you are calling out. I just said I don’t care if a racist gets beaten up and I don’t know anyone who would. I didn’t say that people should go around doing that, but sometimes violence speech has consequences and makes people act like dickheads back.

Do you have any response to anything else I wrote? All I’m calling for at the moment is a more level headed wait and see approach instead of acting like this has been fully investigated.

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Best_Change4155@reddit

You are right, the state often fucks up, better having roving gangs determine who is racist and issue a beating.

I don’t care if a racist gets beaten up and I don’t know anyone who would.

So who gets to beat up the racists that checked people's passports asking if they are Jewish? It sounds like you are OK with some measure of inaccuracy, so we might as well call upon the Dutch people to ravage Arab neighborhoods.

violence speech

lmao, I am good. Love talking to people with no concept of civilized society.

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Yeahhh_Nahhhhh@reddit

When did I ever say I supported roaming gangs? Are you OK? I said I didn’t care about the racist football fans getting beaten up, but I didn’t agree with the violence happening. I was talking about how actions have consequences I wasn’t saying I agreed with those consequences only that I don’t care about any of the Maccabi fans who are pieces of shit. Is that clear?

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black_flame1700@reddit

I second this, fuck around and find out.

If your going to chant death to arabs in front of arabs don’t cry when they retaliate.

Reportedly the israeli fans were going around looking for fights so…

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LifesPinata@reddit

Well, they're used to killing unarmed kids. When unarmed themselves and up against people that can throw hands, they quickly turn around and start crying foul

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hazza-sj@reddit

I knew people like this in school, they were my least favourite kind

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real_human_20@reddit

I think they’re called bullies

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The_Bear_Jew@reddit

I second this, fuck around and find out.

Oh dear god no! anything but that, I beg of you... I have a family, man!

Come now... Do you actually think I care or...?

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black_flame1700@reddit

well well well

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Except there was reports and intelligence showing that his pogram was planned in advance and carried out against all Jews, regardless of whether or not they acted horribly during the games. You’re absolutely ridiculous and grossly antisemitic if you’re trying this hard to justify this. 🤮

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bandaidsplus@reddit

Imagine dispatching airlifts to Western Europe everytime some ultras got their asses beat. The RAF would be making more sorties to Italy, Greece and Germany combined these days then during all of WW2.

You'd think football hooligans control more political power in the Netherlands then the actual state the way this is being discussed in the media. 💀

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pr0metheusssss@reddit

And this actually highlights a very valid point.

I live in Amsterdam. All things considered, this was a very minor hooligan clash, by the city’s (and Ajax’s) standards. Much worse happen almost every time Ajax (Amsterdam) plays Feyenoord (Rotterdam) for instance. And I’m not talking about slogans, but objective metrics like number of people involved, level of injuries, number of injured or dead, number of arrests, extent of vandalism.

Yet, for this specific clash, you have it placed on the international spotlight, you have heads of states making statements, you have Dutch officials rushing to apologise and altering their official schedules and diplomatic visits to cater to this event, and so on.

Seems completely out of proportion, to a ridiculous extent. Really feels as if there’s a special, protected class of hooligans that would warranty all that. “God’s chosen hooligans”, if you will.

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the_recovery1@reddit

not just the Dutch. Trudeu is giving statements officially. Trudue from Canada. Penny wong from Australia. Lol. Lmao even.

The absolute state of western media and politicians

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GalacticMe99@reddit

control more political power in the Netherlands then the actual state

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Amsterdam rioters 'planned Jew hunt on Telegram' before they attacked Israeli football fans

'They shouted Jewish, IDF': Israeli football fans describe attack in Amsterdam

This is a developing story and we should appreciate news media updating their articles with the most relevant data, even if it's not the data that supports your obvious bias.

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

"Proceed to reference articles supporting his bias while discrediting the ones against it"

Is this the story you're running with now?? Similar to the burnt and beheaded babies you ran through even tho it had no proof and was debunked by your own journalist?

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HummusSwipper@reddit

So now you're going through my comment history and replying on discussions having nothing to do with you? lol.

I'm sorry the development of the story has caused your favorite narrative to be debunked.

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

Im actually going through the post comments and happen to come accross you twice, regardless, we can talk about news outlet bias especially western ones, but we all saw what the tel aviv football fans were doing and heard ehat they were shouting, cmon man are we denying what we saw and heard with our own eyes and ears? Why are we pushing the narrative away from their actions?

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Yr point was pro Palestinian demonstrations aren't jailed or stopped when they indulge in hate speech . My point was that they are stomped out regardless of whether or not they enage in hate speech while pro israeli demonstrations get to indulge in hate speech without any consequences. All the while Palestinian demonstrations get shut down for even as per the report "The police banned the final two days of the event, citing concern about the potential for hate speech." just the mere Potential for it.

Why weren't the Israeli football fans apprehended for hate speech when they chanted "death to Arabs" when all across Europe people partaking Palestinian demonstrations have been jailed for far less.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

while pro israeli demonstrations get to indulge in hate speech without any consequences.

Football hooligans are not pro Israeli demonstrators. I've yet to see anything more than actual peaceful protests from the pro Israeli crowd in Europe.

All the while Palestinian demonstrations get shut down for even as per the report "The police banned the final two days of the event, citing concern about the potential for hate speech." just the mere Potential for it.

They banned protests in Amsterdam due to Jews being attacked and them needing to get a hold of the situation. That's a perfectly reasonable approach.

Why weren't the Israeli football fans apprehended for hate speech when they chanted "death to Arabs" when all across Europe people partaking Palestinian demonstrations have been jailed for far less.

You’re repeating an untrue and harmful claim—there was no 'death to Arabs' chant, and I challenge you to find evidence to prove otherwise. Until then, please stop spreading this false rumor. Also, as you know, it’s rare for demonstrators to be jailed specifically for hate speech alone. Complaining pro Israel protestors aren't jailed for it while knowing neither are Pro Palestinian protestors is concerning.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

https://jacobin.com/2024/11/maccabi-hooligans-amsterdam-media-gaza

Banning of protests in Amsterdam was for a legitimate reason but the link to the report about demonstration in Germany from where the quote "potential to for hate speech" was taken.

The "death to Arabs" chant is not limited to Israeli football hooligans rather it's a hallmark of the flag marches in Israel https://www.cnn.com/videos/world/2021/06/15/jerusalem-far-right-jewish-march-vpx.cnn

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/05/29/israel-jerusalem-march-death-arabs-00035862

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israel-police-jerusalem-march-palestinians-rcna85018

Here are reports from three subsequent years on the Israeli flag marches.

Yr insinuation that it's not something Israeli demonstraters do is false. When the simple case is they don't receive media coverage.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

You're clearly struggling to find relevant examples so you resort to providing articles that have nothing to do with the situation.

The "death to Arabs" chant is not limited to Israeli football hooligans rather it's a hallmark of the flag marches in Israel

This is some disgustingly fallacious way of thinking. You're casually implying the Israeli football hooligans in Amsterdam chanted "Death to Arabs" although that never happened and you know it. Flag marches have nothing to do with the conversation.

In fact, your entire comment is based on flag marches in Israel while we were talking about football hooligans in Amsterdam and pro-Israel protests. Flag marches in Israel are not a pro-Israel protest and conflating them after talking about pro-Palestinian protests in Europe just goes to show how shaky and fragile your argument is.

You're inability to engage with my points and stay on topic tells me you're not here to have a good-faithed discussion but rather you're ferociously attempting to justify your biased opinion with whatever is at hand. I'm sorry but I will not be playing along, goodbye.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

Read the first link

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HummusSwipper@reddit

That link has videos and none of the videos support the claim that "Death to arabs" was chanted, essentially meaning there's no evidence to support that lie.

Articles regarding Israel are usually biased in one way or another, you should verify things yourself instead of blindly believing headlines.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

I normally don't even use arab sources when talking about Palestine cuz as u just demonstrated they get labelled biased.

However since u used dailymail of all publications as yr source I didn't think u would care about the biases of a publication.

As far as evidence here's an excerpt from NBC news report "A separate video geolocated by NBC News showed Israeli fans taunting pro-Palestinian protesters either before or after Thursday's match by singing “Death to the Arabs” and “Let the IDF win. We will f*** the Arabs,” as well as tearing down a Palestinian flag."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israeli-soccer-fans-attacked-amsterdam-maccabi-tel-aviv-ajax-rcna179262

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Sad to see NBC perpetuating this lie yet they too failed to provide evidence for the "death to arabs" chant. Somehow there are so many videos of football hooligans chanting and causing havoc but not a single video of them chanting this absurd claim many people such as yourself cling on to.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

I doubt they would go out to say "A separate video geolocated by NBC News showed Israeli fans taunting pro-Palestinian protesters either before or after Thursday's match by singing “Death to the Arabs” and “Let the IDF win. We will f*** the Arabs,” as well as tearing down a Palestinian flag."

That a video was geolocated if they couldn't back it up.

Also I haven't seen video proof of the claim that people were being asked whether they were Jews. Just witness testimonials.

If we are going by witness testimonials then there r plenty blaming the Israeli crowd for using hate speech and attacking anyone wearing even a keffiyeh.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Also I haven't seen video proof of the claim that people were being asked whether they were Jews. Just witness testimonials.

There's a video of someone being attacked, yelling in defense "I'm not Jewish" and still getting knocked out.

That a video was geolocated if they couldn't back it up.

Aw shucks. Somehow they can make a collection of videos showing everything BUT that part and you don't consider it weird.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

Would like to see it to believe it after all u r were the one to advise (rightfully so) to verify claims regarding Israel due to biases.

They didn't make a collection of videos rather have a voice over of the reporter of footage of the clashes so u couldn't really hear the audio of the videos themselves. This is hardly out of the ordinary rather pretty common practice for any news org to have a voice over of the reporter over the videos of the incident being reported.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

This conversation was and is about your insistence that "Death to Arabs" was chanted. Your perpetuation of this false rumor is polarizing and inflammatory, and it's being used by antisemitic to somehow justify attacks on Jews that didn't necessarly have much to do with the hooligans in the first place.

You've come to realize there is no factual evidence for this so I will be taking my leave, I have no interest in your derailment of the conversation. Goodbye.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

Ah yes the nbs report means nothing to u.

Not my fault that u claim any evidence provided to be false.

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My man u haven't been able to provide a video evidence of people being targeted by the rioters due to being jews despite majority of the outlets covering it from an angle without mentioning the actions of the Israeli football hooligans.

You would imagine you'd be able to find the video evidence easily. Yet you expect me to be able to find it.

Still here's a sky news vid they bleeped the chants so I would reckon it wasn't exactly "we love Arabs or Palestinians" that sky news had to bleep it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzJTw974YL4

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HummusSwipper@reddit

You got the wrong impression, I wasn't trying to find such a video because I'm not interested in your derailment tactics. You've failed to provide a video justifying your own words, that's all there is to it.

That skynews vid blips them saying 'fuck' you can find uncensored versions online.

You've circled back to your starting point, which was the skynews article, so I guess you've run out of arguments. Again, I suggest we agree to disagree.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

U r now trying to back track since u can't find the video evidence, yr claim was that there's a video of a person being attacked in the riots who tried to save himself by claiming he wasn't Jewish. Since that claim I have only asked you for evidence.

I haven't been able to locate the video myself but atleast have a non Palestinian and non Arab afflicted news source claiming that they verified it's existence. Furthermore have linked report that show instances of Israeli football crowd chanting hateful slogans setting a precedence.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

As I've said, I never attempted to find or provide any video about Jews being attacked because my argument was never about that. You're attempting to shift the focus from your crumbling arguments to an imaginary event and it's a little sad to see. This is the definition of mental gymnastics.

You can believe whatever you want, obviously it's easier to believe a hateful rumor if it serves your narrative.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

I simply asked u to verify a claim u made thats noy deflection.

Also u made the claim that the uncensored video by sky news only had the word fuck bleeped and u can provide the original video still waiting on that. As I doubt saying the word fuck would have sky news of all people label the chants hateful.

As I have not avoided trying to find direct evidence for my claim. So far I have an independent news outlet (nbs) claiming to have verified the existence of the video and another news source (sky news) claiming the existence of hateful chants.

U keep claiming that the death to Arabs chants in Israel is the far right crowd. Do you really think that the leftist Israelis r going to be tearing down Palestinian flags? (something that can be seen in the videos) Leading me to the conclusion that the crowd involved was the far right crowd who have a history of chanting hateful slogans atleast while in Israel and it's likely they would carry the behaviour outside their country.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

https://youtu.be/ucnAxPXEuQs?si=EFUgwYuN9UQ0Gqmp

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HummusSwipper@reddit

How Middle East Eye is fake-news central | Arab Central

https://honestreporting.com/tag/middle-east-eye/

Middle East Eye is funded by Qatar and I have no doubt they cherry picked the speakers and rehearsed what they are going to say.

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HyperEletricB00galoo@reddit

So cherry picking of speakers only applies to ME eye but dailymail a notorious right-wing outlet didn't cherry pick?

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It's not Israeli football crowds in plural but a single football club. Again you fallaciously generalize a population. Are you incapable of employing critical thinking?

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HummusSwipper@reddit

How Middle East Eye is fake-news central | Arab Central

Middle East Eye is funded by Qatar and I have no doubt they cherry picked the speakers and rehearsed what they are going to say.

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

And that's unfortunate that they weren't held accountable for their hate speech against jews, it's not a competition of what's worst, hate speech is hate speech

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Yes and while you clearly think it's justifiable to attack people for hate speech I doubt you'd justify it when it's directed at the side you support.

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BunnyMoonCake@reddit

Were the chants illegal? Technically yes hate speech is not free speech

Was the attack illegal? Yes

Was it understandable? Yes

Will I be saying the same things if the arabs were shouting against jews and the jewish population retaliated? Yes

Don't go around insulting ppl and expect nothing, that's a general rule i believe in.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

I appreciate you admitting that both sides deserve to be beaten up for hate speech, that's a step in the right direction.

That being said, the Jews beaten up in Amsterdam were not chanting anything, they were walking in the street and attacked after being asked if they're Jewish. It didn't even matter when they said they weren't, they were still beaten up and knocked out.

There are countless videos showing people attacked and chased, justifying it because a day earlier some identifiable football hooligans chanted "Fuck the Arabs" is abhorrent and disgusting.

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n-d-a@reddit

There are videos of Jews, chanting death to Arabs among others in the video link I originally provided. Which if you watched, you would see. Your absolute bias towards everything being antisemitism is stark.

No one here is for people being beaten for no reason. No one wants to see anyone persecuted because of what idol they believe in, the colour of their skin, nor where they were born.

That being said, if you go to a country as a hooligan, act like a hooligan, destroy property like a hooligan, chant about death to a race/religion, you don’t then get to cry racism when the local populace react. That’s called fucking around and finding out.

If other people of the same religion were caught in the crossfire & hurt, that’s terrible. But how many people have Isreal killed that were innocent in Gaza? Were you as vocal there?

What people want to see is an unbiased view of the situation.

My original comment wasn’t a bias by the way. It was a link showing how sky news edited their version to alleviate the Jewish supporters of responsibility for the actions and repercussions. You obviously didn’t watch it or read the captions but just went straight for the poor us card.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

There are videos of Jews, chanting death to Arabs among others in the video link I originally provided

False, there were no Jews chanting death to arabs there.

No one here is for people being beaten for no reason. No one wants to see anyone persecuted because of what idol they believe in, the colour of their skin, nor where they were born.

That being said...

Yeah you had us in the first half but then you revealed your true colours.

If other people of the same religion were caught in the crossfire & hurt, that’s terrible. But how many people have Isreal killed that were innocent in Gaza? Were you as vocal there?

Whataboutism and justifying violence against Jews because they're Jews, wow. I guess all Jews are responsible for Israel's actions, just like every Muslim is responsible for Hamas and Hezbollah and the Houties and Al Qaeda and ISIS, right?

What people want to see is an unbiased view of the situation.

I disagree, it's evident by your actions and much of the comment section that people choose to see only the narrative that fits them. It's called cognitive bias, look it up.

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n-d-a@reddit

At 1:20 in the video. What else do you think let the off win to fuck the Arabs mean?

The whole second half thing which you think was a gotcha moment was o key to point to your cognitive bias.

Nope not all Jews are to blame for what’s happening in Gaza. But anyone who believes they are in the right in the what’s happening over there is complicit.

It’s a sky news video. Doesn’t matter where it came from. The whole point, which you’re missing while being so busy painting a target on your own back, is that the media is whitewashing the article to provide favourable impressions of the Jewish hooligans. You missed that part.

You accuse others while suffering from a conservation bias, a blind spot bias while also stereotyping people that don’t agree with you.

I feel sorry for you. The victim mentality must really disable you on a day to day basis.

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RetardedSheep420@reddit

dutch person here. this entire situation is awful and national media are really licking israel's boot.

adult israeli men (and the fucking mossad, according to one of our papers) go to amsterdam, think they're tough shit and do normal hooligan stuff and find out that a pretty significant chunk of amsterdam doesnt like that.

then, every possible dutch politican has to practially commit seppuku for israel. everyone knows anne frank and amsterdam's jewish history. isrealis trying to paint this event as "literally 1940 all over again" and as some sort of "convoluted attack on jewish people" is absolutely insane and vile.

our national news channel (nos) stated that the israeli news channel in the netherlands reported that "they feel safer in israel than in the netherlands, its like a razzia here!" what the fuck? talk about overreacting much.

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Kate090996@reddit

our national news channel (nos) stated that the israeli news channel in the netherlands reported that "they feel safer in israel than in the netherlands, its like a razzia here!" what the fuck? talk about overreacting much.

This.

My biggest issue is that instantly everyone’s rights get curbed and the politicians instantly overreact without knowing what truly happened.

But no journalist has the balls to actually question any politician about their biasses.

All violence should be condemned but it has to be said that BOTH sides were absolutely awful.

The NOS quietly put up an actual timeline in the evening. Just after everyone joined the ragebait train at 20:45;

https://nos.nl/artikel/2543763-geschopt-geslagen-en-opgejaagd-hoe-het-misging-in-amsterdam

But now? They are talking about “was it terrorism against the jewish?”

Then they should also ask “Was the Israeli government involved in any way to enact state terrorism?”

Read this absolutely disgusting piece of “Journalism” here:

https://nos.nl/nieuwsuur/artikel/2543907-was-wat-in-amsterdam-gebeurde-terrorisme-zeker-een-optie

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Pklnt@reddit

The media treatment when an Israeli is victim of violence compared to when a Palestinian is victim of violence is disgusting.

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HumanLike@reddit

Can you give me the source citing the mossad being there? Gathering some lines for a friends in media

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The_Bear_Jew@reddit

as some sort of "convoluted attack on jewish people" is absolutely insane and vile.

Except there is evidence that it was a pre-planned attack: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/11/08/jewish-maccabi-tel-aviv-fans-attacked-in-amsterdam/

Revealed: How Pro-Palestinian mob organised via WhatsApp to ‘Hunt Jews’ across Amsterdam

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_2B-@reddit

In one video, a group was seen singing an insulting chant about Gaza and Palestinians.

What was included in one of the chants? "Death to Arabs."

It's actually wild to me that people brush this off like it's no big deal. It also reminds me of when Israeli children die, they get called Israeli children. Yet when it's a Palestinian child, they can be referred to as a young woman, in the case of a Palestinian minor. Really takes me back to when African American children were judged to be adults as minors. No big deal, move on. Yet we're going to treat these racist adults on the level of protected children, the irony.

For those who don't know, the Israeli citizens in question, are part of the Ultra football community, for which far-right politics and racism is par for the course. Far-right politics is spiking in Europe, so I understand why they're getting so much diplomatic cover in this instance. But if people want to tie Israeli's to these people, that call for the death of all Arab's and the mocking of dead children, fair.

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Sweaty_Sack_Deluxe@reddit

The chants were — supposedly — much worse. It would be nice if someone speaking Hebrew could fact-check the accuracy of these subtitles: Quick question, but do you speak Hebrew? It would be nice if someone could verify the subtitles in this video: https://www.reddit.com/r/GreenAndPleasant/s/vzbjoAlQUI

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Beautiful_Midnight88@reddit

This is the first time I've seen it translated to those particular words. It seems like the man is paraphrasing from memory or what he heard from others. The translations I've seen, in multiple places, are similar but not the same.

The first part of the song is confirmed by Reuters to be, "Ole, ole, let the IDF win, we will fuck the Arabs".

The second part is said by the New York Times to be, "“Why is there no school in Gaza? There are no children left there.”

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Private_HughMan@reddit

There are two ways I can interpret this and both are horrible. The first is the most obvious: all the children are dead. The second is that they no longer consider any of the children there to be children.

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So killing 45,000 is justifiable? Your post history seems to suggest that’s the case just need to confirm

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Sweaty_Sack_Deluxe@reddit

Where am I justifying anything? I was even saying 'supposedly', as I realized it could have been fake. I was simply asking for a confirmation. Don't put words in people's mouth.

I also know this was in Israel. Good that you mention it, because that makes it worse to me as everyone there understands what's being said. It's so bizarre to me that this is sung at a public space so shamelessly and everyday Israeli people just smile at it.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

And I asked you if you're justifying it, I did not say you are. Maybe don't instantly get defensive and accuse others bro, it's all good.

This single country is currently fighting for survival against at least 5 different Arab entities (Hamas, Hezbollah, Iraq, Iran, Houtieis) so forgive me if no one is rushing over to tell the football hooligans singing about the IDF defeating the country's attackers that they should remain politically correct after they were attacked by a cowardly Arab mob in Amsterdam.

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Sweaty_Sack_Deluxe@reddit

forgive me if no one is rushing over to tell the football hooligans singing about the IDF defeating the country’s attackers that they should remain politically correct after they were attacked by a cowardly Arab mob in Amsterdam

You're phrasing it as if the chanting was a result of the attack, but that isn't so. They were chanting the same things in Amsterdam before the attack, even during the one minute of silence for the victims of Valencia, according to reports. They have also been filmed pulling multiple Palestine flags from residencies, as well as attacking people with boards and poles after vandalizing. There had been a hostile and intimidating atmosphere from the Israeli side well before 'the attack'. I'm again not justifying anything, but let's be transparant.

singing about the IDF defeating the country’s attackers

This is also phrased extremely cherry picked. They're chanting about schools being closed in Gaza because all the kids are dead.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

You're phrasing it as if the chanting was a result of the attack

No I'm not, please re-read my comment. I specifically mentioned the attackers I was referring to as well.

This is also phrased extremely cherry picked. They're also chanting about schools being closed in Gaza because all the kids are dead. Those aren't exactly 'attackers' in my book.

I explained the motivation for the chanting, I did not say the children in Gaza are the ones attacking Israel. You're again encouraged to re-read my comment and tell me if there's anything else that I wasn't clear about.

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hamgrey@reddit

So they are saying "Death to Arabs" or was that translation incorrect? Just asking a specific question as I don't speak Hebrew

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Sweaty_Sack_Deluxe@reddit

Read this comment. This person said something else: https://www.reddit.com/r/anime_titties/s/7bGDCp1qIY

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Hi, in that video at no point did they say "Death to Arabs" and it's very concerning how the speaker accuses them of doing so yet even the captions of the chanting show otherwise.

To reiterate so there won't be misunderstandings: The English captions for the part where the football hooligans are chanting at an airport in Israel is correct and at no point did they chanters or the captions say or show "Death to Arabs".

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ramiro-cantu@reddit

They’re offensive chants not racist slurs when Israelis do it

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HummusSwipper@reddit

It's shocking how many people here are openly justifying violent attacks on Jews, citing incidents like Israeli football fans chanting "F*ck the Arabs." This is a blatant red herring—these attacks weren’t spontaneous reactions but organized in advance. Trying to reduce them to mere responses to chanting or flag-burning is appalling.

Amsterdam rioters 'planned Jew hunt on Telegram' before they attacked Israeli football fans

People were hunted down in the streets, asked if they were Jewish, and then viciously beaten—even if they said they weren’t Jewish. Any one of the people in this community could have been brutally attacked by these violent criminals. Yet, because Jews were the primary targets, many here seem willing to excuse it. This community is disturbingly saturated with antisemitic enablers, and it's disgraceful.

'They shouted Jewish, IDF': Israeli football fans describe attack in Amsterdam

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_2B-@reddit

citing incidents like Israeli football fans chanting "F*ck the Arabs." This is a blatant red herring—these attacks weren’t spontaneous reactions but organized in advance.

Sorry, I may be a gentile, but I don't allow people to get away with calling death's on an entire population and I find it appalling you're willing to do just that.

Yet, because Jews were the primary targets, you are willing to excuse it. This community is disturbingly saturated with antisemitic enablers, and it's disgraceful.

You just disregarded Israeli's saying "Fuck the Arabs." And yes, you're aware that it's a disgusting thing to say since you censored it, yet you want me to feel sorry for brutish Ultra's? Nah sorry, I won't ever feel bad for Ultra's, whether they're from my country, from Italy or Israel. Disgusting group of thugs.

Like I said, if you, HummusSwipper, are willing to allow Israeli's as a whole, to be tied with calling the deaths of _all_ Arab's, along with their children, that is on you. I personally feel it's disgusting and it would make you no different than the Ultra's themselves. Do better brother.

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CaptSpankey@reddit

As we all know liberal democracies that call themselves the "Beacons of civilization" should definitely ban protests as soon as they go against the governments interests.

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tupe12@reddit

According to the comments here, next time there’s a pro-Palestine protests and people start chanting things that are antisemitic, they’re free game. Not sure if that’s the standard I would want to set, but I’ll be make sure no one forgets if it ever does happen

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That’s a lot of words to say that you downvoted me, I didn’t know I mattered to anyone this much

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Lenins_left_nipple@reddit

Maccabi fans weren't just chanting, they had been forming violent mobs attacking random passerby and taxi drivers for being too brown. The firts instances of this were on wednesday, an entire day earlier. Nobody was arrested over this, however. There is a video of a mob running down and beating a man, with a police car just driving by doing nothing. There was news reporting of taxis being totally thrashed with chains and drivers being assaulted. The police let this happen without any response.

Is it surprising that when the state fails to protect people vigilante mobs form?

People have been calling out for death of Jews, the destruction of Israel and chanting celebratory chants in support of Oct 7 for over a year, yet nobody touched them. According to you Israeli supporters would have been perfectly in their right to beat any Arab they come across. Duly noted.

In cased you haven't noticed it, they didn't beat the people who took down the flag or chanted offensive chants. Not saying that's acceptable, and to be clear, it's not. They beat random people who looked Jewish.

Could you imagine the outcry if white Europeans beat random Arabs and Muslims after yet another terror attack? Yet when the victims are Jewish you all couldn't justify it quickly enough. And over offensive football chants no less. You're a bunch of antisemite scum, plain and simple. I just hope people'll finally see through your BS liberal facade. Unlike you, at least the neo Nazis don't hide their true beliefs.

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Yeahhh_Nahhhhh@reddit

Every protest I have seen in my country has a protest organisers not allow hate speech against Jewish and call it out when it happens. Also, have had Jewish speakers.

People have had inappropriate flags etc have also been arrested. Have the Maccabi fans been charged?

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dbgtboi@reddit

This is exactly why legacy media is dying and social media platforms are taking over for news coverage.

This blatant lying and bending of reality is incredible, especially when there is literally video all over twitter showing what actually happened here.

How the hell did a bunch of vandals and racists getting their asses kicked become an international news story?

Imagine if citizens from any other country did this? We'd be cheering that they got their asses beat.

In Western countries, you can freely be a racist piece of shit if you want, but don't expect people to cry for you if you get your ass whooped.

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zlex@reddit

I don’t understand why people are incapable of understanding this. The obvious reason is because the attack was not targeted at the agitators but instead towards all Jews.

It would be like if a mob went into an Arab neighbourhood and started beating random people because of something racist that was said by another person.

It’s unclear to me what is so confusing or why people are incapable of understanding this.

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Rouge_92@reddit

Holy shit Israelis can do literally anything without any consequences and the ripple effect to it is consequences to everyone else.

Imagine being this much of a cuck to a fake country, I would be so ashamed to be a European lmao.

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neuropantser5@reddit

waahhhh a nazi hooligan gang can't even do hate crimes without getting beat up these days.

more proof that no israeli has ever won a fight with an adult without air support in the entire history of their rancid little fascist colony.

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anime_titties-ModTeam@reddit

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DDAY007@reddit

Israel beat every country around them without direct foreign support.

Its already been shown through whatsapp messages that these people planned to hunt down jews long before the comments were made.

But hey nazis gonna hate jews for any reason.

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neuropantser5@reddit

"uuhhh they were going to beat us up anyway before we went around trying to lynch people and bragging about all the children we rape and murder" yeah idk man.

nobody believes you worship anything but raping, toturing and killing arab children, zionists have no culture or identity outside of that.

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DDAY007@reddit

Nice projection there, runs in the family it seems. Its always real telling when the rotten fruit starts trying to talk like its a functioning part of society.

Thats why you are so scared of the Jews because you and your entire genetic lineage have never achieved anything beyond mulling around on their own filth.

Jews have thousands of years of rich history; meanwhile all the nazis you align yourself with either swallowed the pill or the bullet. Lmfao.

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Longjumping-Jello459@reddit

They said without air support not an ally or allies.

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DDAY007@reddit

In the 1948 war where all neighbours attacked israel?

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Longjumping-Jello459@reddit

They could do terraform the land because they had the money to do so unlike the vast majority of Palestinians.

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DDAY007@reddit

Rather they had the knowledge to do so

Hence why the palestinians were given virtually all the arable farm land.

The original zionist ideology has large elements of marxist theory in its conception. Including working the land to create a paradise.

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LifesPinata@reddit

Lmao. Take away the US support and see how long Israel lasts. Even if they try to nuke their neighbours, they'll get nuked right back.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

I wonder if you're as equally offended by the USSR supporting and arming the Arab side against Israel? No, you obviously aren't.

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DDAY007@reddit

Most pro palestinians believe that there were american troops on the ground in 48.

Their knowledge of the region can be summed up as:

western bad, jews western. Jews bad.

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HummusSwipper@reddit

Most pro palestinians believe that there were american troops on the ground in 48.

That's hilariously pathetic and sad.

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DDAY007@reddit

None of their direct neighbours have nukes, and the countries thst do would never nuke israel, nice try but your middle school geo politics understansing may need an upgrade.

Also you have basically zero understanding of economics or military funding. Israel fought its first major war without US support; I know you people who are ignorant therefor you try to deny this.

All Israel would need to do is to divert funding to their military to offset the loss of american support. Which btw wont happen, the americans arent about to sit back and let half the worlds jews be holocausted again.

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Zaper_@reddit

waahhhh a nazi hooligan gang can't even do hate crimes without getting beat up these days.

Just dropping in to say that were you born 100 years earlier you'd be justifying kristalnacht (because the evil communist Jews killed Rohm!) :)

more proof that no israeli has ever won a fight with an adult without air support in the entire history of their rancid little fascist colony.

Sure thing bro the Arabs courageously brought knifes to a fist fight and ganged up 10 to 1 on whoever looked Jewish. Truly the lions of Allah.

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joeyjoojoo@reddit

Zionist can’t exercise their right to peaceful hate crimes and vandalism anymore, how antisemitic

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AlludedNuance@reddit

People forget that the Netherlands is fairly conservative in many cases.

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ibuprophete@reddit

Never hear of “antisemitic hit and run”.. sounds tiring. Shocking to observe how the propaganda works though, how the media tries to portray this, even the king is part of it, like he’s nothing more.

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Hi empleadoEstatalBot,

We've found 25 sources (so far) that are covering this story including:

The Algemeiner (Leans Right): "Amsterdam Bans Protests After ‘Antisemitic Squads’ Attack Israeli Soccer Fans"
WION (Center): "Amsterdam bans protests after 'antisemitic' attack on Israeli football fans"
thecradle.co (Left): "Western leaders express support for Israeli football fans who instigated violent clashes in Amsterdam"

Of all the sources reporting on this story, 58% are left-leaning, 17% are right-leaning, and 25% are in the center. Read the full coverage analysis and compare how 25+ sources from across the political spectrum are covering this story.

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