Libertarians in Florida went 1 for 3 here
Posted by kolorbear1@reddit | Libertarian | View on Reddit | 47 comments
Posted by kolorbear1@reddit | Libertarian | View on Reddit | 47 comments
soonPE@reddit
Libertarians And right for abortion in a single sentence
Forget the NAP.
A complete joke
MrDex124@reddit
Jurisdiction decides what is defined as aggression and what can be a subject in legal relationships.
Leave your religious worldview out of libertarianism.
soonPE@reddit
No Not religious worldview but a moral one
If you wanna play edgy and libertarian first you need a strong moral background
Jurisdiction matters shit most of the time
You can no just shoot a couple kids that accidentally got into your property to get their ball.
You can not throw into the ocean people who suddenly you don’t want in your boat anymore, even though they might have gotten into your boat without your knowledge or permission.
Morality has nothing to do with religion, and besides, think it was indeed a religious thing, as a libertarian I have all the rights to express it.
MrDex124@reddit
Moral prevents you from acting towards others in a way you dont want to be acted to. Libertarianism is about voluntarism and freedom of association. These things are orthogonal.
There are no absolute morals. Everything is subjective, and you associate with others based on these subjective morals. So there is nothing edgy in my statement as long as its normal in some hypothetival society.
soonPE@reddit
Slavery was pretty normal in a society too….
MrDex124@reddit
But it was economically inferior to capitalism, so the south has lost.
soonPE@reddit
Now you’re changing subjects
MrDex124@reddit
You are trying to make a moral argument about slavery, i counter with pragmatism. Slavery can be, was, and is moral in certain societies, and it doesn't counteradict the freedom of association.
soonPE@reddit
There are absolute morals. Thats what you get wrong. U saying everything is subjective contradicts libertarianism to such a huge extent is impossible to grasp.
misspelledusernaym@reddit
No that isnt how libertarianism works. If you harm some one it is wrong no matter where you are. By your logic slavery is not aggression because the jusrisdictions that had it allowed it. With libertarianism you have the right to what what you wish without harming another person. Nonagression is something that isnt allowed anywhere, killing innocent people is pretty agressive.
MrDex124@reddit
Slavery is not an aggression if your jurisdiction dont consider enslaved ones to be an agent. No one can force you to be legally bound with anybody agains your will. That bullshit about universal NAP and pacifism has to end. Nap is only working inside your jurisdiction. You can be at war with some other jurisdiction, but still be libertarian inside.
Libertarianism is just freedom of association and everything that derives from this.
soonPE@reddit
No Libertarianism is the “Unrestricted respect for others’ life projects, even when they don’t align with your ideals, and even when those projects are in their most basic form. It’s about not initiating hostility without reason.”
Abortion effectively kills something, to kill something it needs first to be alive, that something is human, because it had human parents and human DNA.
Gosh, I wish Trump really got rid of the Department of Education because in American it aint working.
Viva la libertad carajo!!!!
MrDex124@reddit
This is classic oldschool libertarian maxima, bit its inherently flawed, because it was born during good times of modern, where people believed that there is universal truth and there is a possibily for paradise. No world is still cruel and is there to get you, so we need to adapt by discarding reliance on good will of others.
soonPE@reddit
Regardless of how old or how new. Ideas are just good or bad.
Abortion is killing a living human organism and violates the NAP.
Adapting is why libertarians get less votes by the day, because adapting in modern society is conceding.
Miley, flawed as it can be, didn’t win Argentina by adapting and conceding on moral issues.
Thats why we got an Oliver Chase….
MrDex124@reddit
Miley exactly adapted, he wriggled like a snake while keeping loud populistic rhetoric.
Libertarians get less votes by the day because they are too stubborn and idealistic to do any real politics, they are just like that insane old man in the neighborhood
soonPE@reddit
Miley is governing with what he has in hand, corrupt politicians and corrupt institutions, other than that I don’t see him conceding, ahh ok guys, my Hayek position was a bit to extreme lets do some Keynes….
Killerwalski@reddit
Yeah, you tell that crazy religious kook what's up. He thinks he gets his morals from God, but doesn't realize it's actually the state that will tell us whether snuffing out the life of an unborn baby is an act of aggression or not.
s0p3rn1nja@reddit
Floridian here, these were some of the most important parts of my ballot voting and I’m honestly just mad waking up to it this morning.
Who the hell is voting against recreational MJ these days. I’m not even a smoker, never have been but god dammit if people shouldn’t have the right to do it anyways.
TopKekBoi69@reddit
Prohibition makes absolutely no sense and is a baseless argument. Definitely a loss for liberty in Florida
s0p3rn1nja@reddit
Had a conversation with a Boomer in my family about it, he is a regular weed smoker and was voting no on 3. I tried to understand his reasoning but all he kept saying was that people are doing it anyways.
So in his eyes, people have access via medical cards and street pharmacists so why bother making it recreational.
The rationale just flabbergasted me.
Coley-OleY@reddit
It wasn’t a good amendment, it really only allowed a few companies like trulieve to sell recreationally in Florida. There was no home grow and you could be penalized for owning weed not from trulieve or whatever other big weed companies sponsored it. TBH, I still voted yes on it but it’s not shocking that it didn’t pass. It wasn’t a good bill
TopKekBoi69@reddit
Thanks for context!
psilocydonia@reddit
I would have voted for it, and I was an enthusiastic supporter when CO first made moves to legalize recreational MJ 10 years ago. That said, since moving here (CO) a couple years ago, it isn’t quite as idyllic as I’d imagined. Most days just stepping outside my house to take out garbage/recyclables, I’m hit with the stench. People who use it in crowded public areas with no regard to others does get old after a while. I do not smoke, and I do not care if others do, but I do wish they made some small effort not to bother others with the stank. I could see how others might vote this way just to keep their quaint downtown areas free from the constant smell.
Stockholmedstatist@reddit
I don't think people should be locked up for it. But living in a state with it legal and decriminalized for decades it's the homeless incense, and I don't blame people for hating it.
No-Wonder7913@reddit
Tbh I think they aren’t really but it was blowback from the strength of their opposition to anything resembling blue. Baby out with the bath water kinda deal. If it came up again during a midterm it might pass.
isthatsuperman@reddit
You live in boomer land, what do you expect?
s1105615@reddit
I want legalization of marijuana. I don’t want it controlled by one corporation within the state while also not allowing any personal cultivation. 3 was too flawed to support.
Issue 4 does not and will not have monolithic support among Libertarians for reasons that have been rehashed on this sub and elsewhere in Libertarian circles ad nauseum. 4 is also a badly written item that was designed to be a wedge issue for Ds to drive their base to the polls. I am shocked it went over 50% but glad that simple common sense restrictions like parental consent for minors aren’t being removed.
lakesuperiorduster@reddit
I was in Hollywood Florida and maybe saw 10000 adds of Trump defending this bill and asking voters to vote yes…. Wins the state handily - loses this prop… only in Florida
Trumbulhockeyguy@reddit
This amendment was put forward by big business and only gave legalization to two huge weed corporations. It wasn’t true legalization
AlphaMuggle@reddit
Even Trump said he would vote yes to amendment 3
kolorbear1@reddit (OP)
Which at least gives me hope moving forward about him being libertarian-ish
kolorbear1@reddit (OP)
Same here! I can't even use it because of work, but there is ZERO justification for it to be illegal. Alcohol is worse for the body and mind.
TexasBrett@reddit
Probably won’t get a lot of support here, but I wish the legalize marijuana movement a little more nuanced. Like I’ll support legalization if it applies to private homes or establishments. Don’t want folks just walking around downtown USA smoking it, because I don’t want to smell it. Feel the same about cigarettes.
kolorbear1@reddit (OP)
So here's the thing. I agree entirely that people shouldn't smoke in public, but I also don't think it's the government's authority to dictate that.
TexasBrett@reddit
So here’s the thing. While, in principle, libertarianism sounds great, this is exactly why they will never win a major election.
Killerwalski@reddit
You don't have the right to "clean air".
If you shit your pants on your own property, and I can smell it from my property, are you violating my rights?
TexasBrett@reddit
Ok, so I’ll just keep voting against it then.
Killerwalski@reddit
You sure showed me, a non FL resident, lmao.
BraveDawgs1993@reddit
How isn't it? Other people have to deal with the smell. It's not life threatening, but many people will consider it a nuisance. There's a real argument that outlawing public use of marijuana falls firmly into what the government should be authorized to do. We're libertarians not anarchists, there is a difference.
ETvibrations@reddit
I have issues with smoke and air contaminants. I go into coughing first from small amounts at times. The smell isn't always an issue, thankfully, but people need to be more cognizant of other people.
My grandma has 20% lung capacity and most recently ended up with an infection from a strong skunk smell according to her doctor. Sounds like pseudoscience to me, but the fact she could get sick from it according to her doctor is concerning.
Siglet84@reddit
I feel the same way. I’m not a user but fully support people being able to do as they please but the smell is so offensive. No different than cigarette smoke.
bodhiseppuku@reddit
So does that mean you can legally fish in Florida without a license?
kolorbear1@reddit (OP)
I think so, but I don't think it comes into effect immediately.
bodhiseppuku@reddit
As a Michigan hunter, fisherman, and outdoor enthusiast, I know the fees collected for licenses are used to support the DNR and other nature resources. I hope Florida has good enough fiscal planning to make up for this revenue loss without losing important services.
ETvibrations@reddit
This is the major thing for me. I hunt and fish and understand fully that we need to regulate takings and charge fees for doing so. We can't decimate the populations by removing all restrictions. Wildlife needs protected from us. I love the WMA and other public areas in Oklahoma that are maintained by the wildlife department, and they need that money.
misspelledusernaym@reddit
2 for 3. N.A.P.
divinecomedian3@reddit
Looks more like 3 for 4, the only miss was not legalizing weed