Record numbers of wealthy Americans are making plans to leave the U.S.

Direct taxation on wealth is unconstitutional in the US, so any Wealth taxes would have to appropriated amount the states according to the population (equal tax amount per resident of each state).

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Chrono_Pregenesis@reddit

Or we make a wealth tax constitutional

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DataGOGO@reddit

That is not only a terrible idea (limiting the direct taxation powers of the federal government is very important), but entirely unrealistic.

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mmmmpb@reddit

We’re talking semantics here. My apologies for not knowing the proper terminology, but we’re talking about the same thing. You’re really angry, though. We can have a conversation without you being so emotional. We don’t know each other. We’re having healthy debate. We say we want to live in a free country, but as soon as you have to educate someone, you put them down to instill inferiority. It’s unnecessary. Be the change we need in this world.

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mmmmpb@reddit

Go read.

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series_hybrid@reddit

Yes, but the IRS doesn't tax wealth, it taxes income.

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TriggerTough@reddit

Jersey and Cayman comes to mind.

If they're used to excellent infrastructure from expensive places here in the US , They're going to be in for a surprise. Also most wealthy people really value their health and health care. Big US cities have cutting edge medical care and excellent emergency response times.

Try surviving a heart attack or stroke without prompt care!

BYE!

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Wise-Lawfulness2969@reddit

Yep. My wife is from Brazil. We thought about moving there, but the healthcare system is horrible.

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nicolas_06@reddit

Ýes and to be fair, the grass isn't so bad in the USA.

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D-Truth-Wins@reddit

Until it's covered in the blood of anyone that doesn't fit the new Hitler's ideal type of people...

CastleBravo88@reddit

L.ao, please tell me the definition of inflation. Just want to hear that.

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Sanchezsam2@reddit

And what does inflation. Have to do with the fact revenue collected numbers completely destroy your point about tax cuts increasing revenue? If anything if these numbers were adjusted for inflation it would show the loss of revenue substantially greater….

The GDP shrunk for multiple years in a row? Nah you just hate the current administration, just like 2015 to 2016 we went from the worst economy to the best over night for way too many morons. In reality the only time we had shrinking GDP in the last 10 years was in 2020.

https://www.macrotrends.net/global-metrics/countries/USA/united-states/gdp-gross-domestic-product

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CastleBravo88@reddit

Wtf are you talking about? Are you having an argument in your own head?

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poiup1@reddit

The GDP, the economy. Or did you have a different metric to measure how good it's doing? Unless maybe you're one of those my feelings mater more than any fact.

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Big_Knobber@reddit

Did you know that we are at record low tax rates?

Agreed but also make it progressive.

50% exit tax on anything over 50 million 25% exit tax on anything over 5 million 5% exit tax on anything over 1 million

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Vobat@reddit

Great way to stop skilled migrants coming to US.

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Vobat@reddit

Ex Patriot Act was introduced in 2012 and added as amendment to Immigration Bill in 2013. It did not pass.

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ben_zachary@reddit

Ahh funny because I just heard about it couple of weeks ago and figured it was in place

Under Sec. 877A, a U.S. exit tax may apply to individuals who relinquish their U.S. citizenship or are long-term residents who cease to be a U.S. permanent resident. The tax is designed to make sure that all unpaid taxes are settled before a U.S. citizen or resident withdraws from the U.S. tax system. Individuals subject to the exit tax generally are assessed tax as if they had sold all of their assets the day before they left the country, also known as a “deemed distribution

Yeah I see so it's just unpaid taxes on all your assets. But if I'm reading that let's say I have 10 million in assets it's like I sold all my assets and have to pay tax on 10 mil no?

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Ok-Sympathy9768@reddit

That is an excellent question 🤔.. it would not surprise me if it ends up being similar to 1930s Germany when the Nazis took over and the Jewish people who saw the writing on the wall and fled the country and Europe in general before the shit hit the fan… in the beginning a lot were able to get out, later on others trying to flee- not sure but were they not basically taxed to the point where they left with the clothes on their backs? And maybe that’s why so many stayed because they were not willing to give up everything they worked for..had they known how bad it would it would get,hindsight being 20/20, they would gotten out sooner and took their wealth with them..

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Stripe_Show69@reddit

Well you don’t have to pay you just won’t be able to come back with paying the bill. If you plan ti stay for the rest of your life, that is.

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Akira282@reddit

Unless you're a billionaire..then you pay almost no taxes

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Since you are too lazy to read the article - it would do this to the economy: 'The number of undocumented immigrants in the US workforce, according to the Pew Research Center. That’s 5% of the workforce. And the share of undocumented workers is particularly high in certain industries, including construction, agriculture and service.

Economists have been warning that any major deportation effort would have a significant impact far beyond any one particular workplace.

“The economy as a whole downsizes to the detriment of everyone,” says Michael Ettlinger, a senior fellow at the Carsey School of Public Policy at the University of New Hampshire.

“Removing people that we know are here and working would be shooting ourselves in the foot economically,” Collins says, noting that the impact of immigrant workers also includes what they spend, not just what they earn.

“Anyone who is here and working is also getting haircuts and eating at restaurants and buying groceries and doing lots of things that grow the economy more,” she says.

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Big_Illustrator6506@reddit

Hey as they should be deported.

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squirreltard@reddit

And that will result is mass violence and deaths. And yes, American concentration camps. Again.

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Samthestupidcat@reddit

Not at all. The US has tax treaties with many countries, the essence of which is that income that you are taxed on in another country is not taxed by the US. You can’t avoid paying taxes, but you can avoid being double taxed, and you can avoid paying taxes to the US if you live the majority of your time in another country (that has a tax treaty).

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A tax on unrealized capital gains would collapse the economy. Everyone would be affected, not just 100 million+ people.

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nicolas_06@reddit

Honestly if had 10-50 millions I would feel concerned for that tax. Income tax was for the rich only at the time and now about half of the people pay it.

That’s if you live long enough to get diagnosed, see a specialist, and start treatment…

Here’s Nate’s latest numbers, his real numbers. https://x.com/gagladla/status/1853312547962626247?s=61&t=HE_GdCHfHWfXMH01NOiNHg

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HybridVigor@reddit

Thanks. I didn't want to visit Musk's X, so went directly to Nate's actual web page.

These numbers show Harris with a popular vote lead (though not in Iowa), but I'd like to see an electoral college prediction. Looks like it may be behind a paywall? He does have all the swing state numbers there so I guess I could do the math myself.

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squirreltard@reddit

My mom didn’t know either but not sure she believes me. She’s progressive and a former politician but a bit brainwashed too and lives in fear because she watches news all day designed to do just that.

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Loeden@reddit

I think that's what the people who are just going for visas (like St. Lucia, etc) are looking at-- Just having an alternate country on the visa if everything goes haywire.

People may be afraid for various reasons but there are a lot of people who are afraid in general right now. Anecdotal, to be fair, but that's what I'm hearing and I hang out with a few different age groups and social strata and it's been on an increase in all of them. (My circle doesn't include super wealthy people, to be fair!)

Trump might not get elected. He is also old and will have limited power anyway. House and Senate + SCOTUS as well as military or Police are not interested in having a Trump dictatorship regime, even people from his party and he will have no legal claim to stay more than 4 year if he isn't dead by then.

He will not have the majority he need to pass too drastic stuff and he know it well.

The worst case scenario wont happen.

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Walk_The_Stars@reddit

This is a good point. I hope to have an acceptable ‘immediate gtfo’ country, from which I can apply for visas in more desirable countries.

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Elegant_Tale_3929@reddit

People were already looking at other options years ago because of Healthcare.

Then RvW got overturned (Reddit Expat boards exploded with people looking for options) and more people started looking because who wants to chance dying trying to have kids because of stupid laws by politicians who wouldn't abide by these laws themselves?

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/us-citizens-and-resident-aliens-abroad

ShoulderIllustrious@reddit

A good book to read is, "Why nations fail". It posits that stability in governing institutions drive stability in the market place leading to overall wealth. Stability is a broad word, but it goes beyond just money. The institutions must be fair.

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Good! Hasta la vista baby!

Born_Obligation_1595@reddit

To flee if the democrats steal the election again

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GranpaCarl@reddit

Ah yes. The big lie repeat it often enough and the morons will start to believe it. Fact of the matter is when trump had his shot to prove fraud in court he said the exact opposite. The only election theft attempted was on January 6th. By Donald Trump and his proud boy traitors.

look up the word Lügenpresse.

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Born_Obligation_1595@reddit

Haha good ol liberal sheep good boy believe everything the media tells you. Lma

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GranpaCarl@reddit

No don't wanna answer that one? You've been throwing a bitch fit allover reddit for hours but when it comes time to answer what Donald Trump said on the record you shut your cocksucker. I wonder why that is. Hmm. It's a mystery.

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Born_Obligation_1595@reddit

No im not gone quiet i got busy and didn’t get a chance to reply back. Lmao cocksucker that’s a liberal ideology. No kyatery. It has been proven in several place of election fraud but you are to brainwashed to believe the facts.

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GranpaCarl@reddit

Ah the good ol nazi play book.

"Accuse the opponent of that which you are guilty" "Lie big and repeat it often" "Lugenpresse" "Brownshirts aka constitutional Sherrifs"

Did Donald Trump have anything to say about fraud in court or was it just Twitter?

When it mattered. What were his fraud claims. Don't bitch out and "oh hes a democrat (I'm not you are just in a cult)"

Nothing that I've seen has anything to do with having had kids disqualifying you (although while you might qualify for citizenship, they might not because it's to far in the line of descent), but there might have been a recent amendment to that.

https://www.ireland.ie/en/dfa/citizenship/

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they want a progressive country without the right wing culture war but don't want to pay for it.

like Harris's tax ideas aren't even radical except maybe the unrealized capital gains tax but thats not even figured out much less getting through congress.

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No one is leaving America out of concern of Islamophobia.

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cnation01@reddit

Same in 2016 when the rich folk in Hollywood decided to flee after Trump got elected.

No one left lmao.

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Weak_Credit_3607@reddit

Regardless of how the election turns out, I will never leave. I will stand my ground and keep moving forward with voting the way I feel is best for the entire country

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Awedidthathurt@reddit

Didn't Republicans say this with the Biden win? Didn't Democrats say this when Trump won, Didn't Republicans say this when Obama won?

OR

is this another click bate for simpletons.

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Isaigach29@reddit

Good leave!!!!

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QueenieAndRover@reddit

“Record numbers”

MrGruntsworthy@reddit

Making preps in case there's another 4 years of blue in office.

Imagine San Francisco, except country-wide.

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The_Original_Miser@reddit

How about these rich bastards put said money toward reducing said instability?

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redditmodsarefuckers@reddit

Heaven forbid they put in the effort to be liked by any of their coworkers or those they consider their underlings or minions.

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nicolas_06@reddit

I don't think people agree to the reason of instability or the solutions really. Actually any policy change in one direction will make a part of the population upset.

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LudovicoSpecs@reddit

What makes you think they don't?

Who do you think is donating to all the candidates fighting against the crazies? Who do you think funds the ACLU and SPLC?

Wait, so their choice of countries are some of the ones most pummeled by climate change driven disasters in the last few years? Floods, fires, droughts, etc? And economic instability in a few cases?

Um if US goes total fascist so will the rest of the world. Bannon, Putin, Musk et all have goons everywhere.

My wife and I are not wealthy at all, but if trump wins we are honestly thinking about leaving.

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Sock_Eating_Golden@reddit

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OverlyExpressiveLime@reddit

It sucks to be left behind, but I’ll still be glad those Americans are safe. I and my husband will likely be stuck here if Trump wins barring a Hail Mary company transfer to Canada. If Trump wins, we plan on moving to one of the cheaper areas of Washington state (We can’t afford CA or OR). I figure the West Coast will be the most resilient to whatever Trump & the Heritage Foundation do.

I spent weeks researching. There are countries that will allow people “long residencies” without paying a zillion dollars. One has to prove just cause, but that won’t be hard to do for many if Trump is elected.

It’s definitely not a golden passport. You’re right that the golden pasports basically require someone be rich.

The long residency programs for refugees though aren’t based on money. They also don’t guarantee a safe place in a year as the country can change its mind and say “GET OUT”. It’s not a golden passport, but it’s better than nothing.

If you look at Nazi Germany. Nobody was angry at the people who got out. We all have different internal alarm systems and different fight or flight impulses. Plus, some people can’t flee because of family, health, financial reasons, or etc.

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LowChain2633@reddit

A lot of people who tried to get out of nazi Germany were turned away and sent back. Nobody wanted Jewish refugees. It will be the same for Americans. No one wants us. The only Americans getting out will be the very rich and well connected ones (just like the jews who managed to leave Germany), or in today's environment those with elite tech skills, and I really mean elite like top 0.1% in their field, similar to H1Bs in the US. So many people so delusional thinking that they cna get it when they don't know any language but English and don't have skills that set them apart.

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softsnowfall@reddit

Idk how much is delusion… I think it’s hope… When people are scared, they need hope. They need to believe there’s a possibility of something better even if it’s a possibility with an incredibly slim chance at succeeding.

Countries will often have language training etc for refugees… So much depends on the country…

LudovicoSpecs@reddit

Did you read the article?

A bunch of them are considering leaving because Trump might get elected and fascism will grow even more.

These rich people are the ones who can afford to donate to candidates on the left to try to get America out of this mess.

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warboy@reddit

"on the left"

Brother, you think rich people are going to donate to politicians that will run on working class (not middle class) rhetoric and legitimate wealth redistribution? That's the actual left and rich people are never going to just give up their privilege.

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HybridVigor@reddit

As much as I hate it, neoliberals are considered the "left" here. There are pretty much no classical leftists with any political power remaining.

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warboy@reddit

Yeah because rich people aren't going to fund their downfall

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GunGoblin@reddit

You cannot comprehend how stupid I think your statement is overall…

There is no party that blames the ultra wealthy more than the left/liberal/democratic/whatever party. But now all of a sudden they are the only ones that can save us?

How about people vote for common sense and intelligent plans. That is what would help us the most. The millionaires and billionaires are not our guardian angels.

That's fair. And unless you have a source for how many people moved or not and why I don't factor it in.

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GunGoblin@reddit

Is that a question or a statement?

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lake_gypsy@reddit

Both

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GunGoblin@reddit

Ah yes, the ole “questionable statement” maneuver, how could I have missed it!

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Useful_Hovercraft169@reddit

People might say something about losing great innovative minds, but by the time people make big bucks they are about protecting their empire and squishing competition

Did you mean to say wealth folks WANT to live in a “MAGA America”?

I’m quite certain folks are fleeing the USA because of democrats. If Trump wins, they will stay. The way you have it written suggests the opposite.

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A year ago I set my adult kids and grandkids up with a secure home, vehicle, and requisite gear, supplies, etc. in the event things go sideways.

Then I left to follow my dream and wander the world.

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Loeden@reddit

Not gonna lie, that sounds amazing. And good on you for looking out for them!

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SilverBronco68@reddit

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What do you mean

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therapistofcats@reddit

2016 https://www.theguardian.com/money/us-money-blog/2016/may/12/donald-trump-president-move-to-canada

2020 https://www.businessinsider.com/rich-people-getting-ready-to-flee-america-post-election-2020-11

Spring of 2024 https://fortune.com/2024/03/19/wealthy-americans-second-citizenship-living-abroad-fire-insurance/

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/04/10/rich-americans-get-second-passports-citing-risk-of-instability.html

Yeah, but they probably have that second passport in their back pocket now in case the fascists hit the fan.

If he starts targeting and imprisoning people, if abortion is banned nationwide, if he starts shutting down news outlets, etc. people with second passports will start to bail.

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a_duck_in_past_life@reddit

Tbf the climate is wholly different than it was in 2016. We've seen what people will do.

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hortlerslover2@reddit

True. But these same rich people will stay where the money flows to them. Im not complaining if they actually leave. Im not a eat the rich type but plenty of these people love using the system and people and will dip the second the system may not go the way they want.

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Ancient_Dinosaur@reddit

Dad retired at 50, mom was stay at home. They bought a large sailing vessel and outfitted it for if shit hits the fan and store it in another country with armed security years ago. It’s registered to the state of Delaware only for US Navy assistance when dealing with pirates.

Motivations for Leaving:

Political factors: Many wealthy individuals express a desire to avoid living in a "MAGA America."

This right here. It's not about taxes, it's about getting out ahead of the fascist takeover.

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CartridgeCrusader23@reddit

The grass always seems greener on the other side

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jackz7776666@reddit

I mean if you can get a second passport I don't see a reason not to.

My spouse and I (both no where near millionaires) are looking into the potential of a second passport for yes travel benefits but also being able to have options that say a single passport may not offer or draw unwanted attention towards.

If the opportunity presented itself I'd rather have the option of presenting one passport to one entity over another depending on where I am in the world.

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motsanciens@reddit

Is a second passport literally just another passport, such that the stamps and visas in one are not apparent when looking at the other?

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jackz7776666@reddit

My thinking was more so lets say I or my spouse are traveling and our nationality which could otherwise be ambiguous then becomes confirmed in an unfriendly space.

A great example was an associate of mine who was ablw to get out of a country experiencing a revolution, all native citizens were having their passports confiscated at the local airport, he had his native passport AND a Canadian passport; as soon as he showed the Canadian passport he was shoved on a flight out of the country, presumably because they didn't want to deal with the issues of harming a foreign national.

Been there n done that.

There’s a reason why we all come back.

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Traditional_Yam1598@reddit

It’s never a bad idea to have a backup plan. Figuring out how to get a second citizenship is one of the best things anyone could do

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Spunktank@reddit

Lol well there's a record number of wealthy individuals in the first place as the wealth gap has only grown since covid. This is hardly newsworthy by itself.

Wtf is wrong with people.....they shared an article.

Attorneys and advisors to family offices and high-net-worth families said they’re seeing record demand from clients looking for second passports or long-term residencies abroad. While talk of moving overseas after an election is common, wealth advisors said this time many of the wealthy are already taking action.

“We’ve never seen demand like we see now,” said Dominic Volek, group head of private clients at Henley & Partners, which advises the wealthy on international migration.

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geeisntthree@reddit

they were banking on trump winning, they're in trouble if Harris stays true to her word

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caveatlector73@reddit

Motivations for Leaving:

Political factors:
Concerns about violence following the election results.
Fears surrounding potential tax changes proposed by Vice President Kamala Harris, specifically regarding unrealized capital gains.
Other cited reasons include rising antisemitism, Islamophobia, mass shootings, and concerns over U.S. government debt.

Doesn't sound like you actually read the post. No offense intended, but the problem with pulling thoughts off the bottom of your shoe without reading the information through is that you miss the intel part.

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