Need Advice from Gen X with Kids. Should I interfere or let sleeping kids lie?
Posted by The_Outsider27@reddit | GenX | View on Reddit | 263 comments
This is a delicate issue. I have a friend who a 66 year old boomer.
She has a son who is 31, lives at home with her. He is a college dropout. Clinical depression keeps him in and out of jobs. He will get a job at Taco Cabana and get fired two weeks later. He doesn't have friends or dates. His world is his mom. When I do things with my friend her son will text to say come home and make dinner.
I'm childless and told I will never understand what it's like to be a mom.
My friend recently told she needs a hip replacement. She wants to retire but needs to support the 31 year old son. She looks exhausted. The son's dad sends little money to support him. The son will not get on disability or public assistance.
We went to a movie this weekend. She left her purse. I paid for tickets for both. Then he wanted snacks.
Lots of snacks. On the way home in the Uber he began criticizing my friend for not making more money and bad career choices. She is a lawyer like me.
After he went to bed, she told me she's worried about dying and no one to take care of him.
She is leaving him her retirement because she's given up all hope of this kid holding a job.
She asked if I would look after him if she dies suddenly.
I'm only 11 years younger than her.
How do I have the conversation with her that this 31 year old kid needs to find their own way?
I've watched him. This is not a man who is autistic or special needs. He is verbally abusive to my friend and I don't buy the depression excuse. He does no chores. It kills me to see my friend like this. She's lost several boyfriends because the 31 year old chases them away. Why can't he get on disability?
I don't want to be responsible for him. Do I try to have an intervention? Do I not understand because I'm not a mom? I don't know how to help her.
Jealous_Speaker1183@reddit
My aunt and cousin have this relationship. Depression runs in our family and the depression can create a whole different set of issues for familial relationships.
The best thing my aunt ever did for herself was move into a 55+ retirement community. At first it was a clean break from her son. She gave him money for rent with a roommate. 55+ communities are very active and she found her “tribe”. She was doing tons of activities and made lots of new friends.
Of course about 5 years later things fell apart and her son ended moving in with her. (Not sure how that worked - it being 55+). When he moved back in, the dynamic had changed. She was an “active adult”. And he had become was not be so dependent. They were roommates. Now she’s 84 and having him around can be helpful.
My aunt moved when my cousin was in a “good place”. He had a solid job and a relationship. This “kid” doesn’t sound like he’s gonna get to that point, but maybe you can explore what she would wish for him, before she dies and help him get there, rather than taking over for her after she dies.
Chai-Tea-Rex-2525@reddit
You don’t have to be a parent to care about children. They have a co-dependent relationship. The only advice I would give you is to suggest your friend get therapy, if for no other reason than to figure out what she wants to do for her son as she ages.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
She has a psychiatrist. From what is shared with me the son is not what comes up in therapy.
bored-panda55@reddit
She needs to speak to her psychiatrist about this. Seriously. She needs to tools and if her kid is so depressed he can’t hold down a job at Taco Cabano for 2 weeks he needs 1. Medication 2. Therapy and 3. Coping skills.
His lack of self awareness and living off his parents probably doesn’t help any.
I mean, my kid is 13 and is more self reliant then her 31yr old.
LowkeyPony@reddit
Can nearly guarantee that her 31 year old son isn’t “depressed” at all. And is probably not at all on any spectrum for any type of disability. She’s just enabling him to be a leach.
And she’s got some balls asking OP if she’d look after him should she die.
OP. You remember when “Tough Love” became a thing? That is what you need to do with your friend. And what she needs to do with her lazy ass son.
And don’t let either of them use you anymore!
If she’s an attorney she can pay for her own self
newnewnew_account@reddit
Psychiatrist prescribes meds. She needs a psychologist/therapist to talk to
Freyja2179@reddit
Some psychiatrists only prescribe meds others do therapy in addition.
DivineCaudalie@reddit
This, this, this. Psychiatrists get almost no training in actual therapy, interpersonal behavior, communication, and teaching the tools of introspection and self-discovery. They’re almost universally not good at therapy. And honest ones will say that.
SunShineShady@reddit
She needs to get real with the son, she’s an enabler and he’s never going to change unless she toughens up and stops supporting him.
If he needs daily outpatient therapy to help him do that, hopefully she has the insurance to send him. If he’s an addict, send him to in patient rehab.
She should have done this years ago. It’s neglectful parenting to coddle your adult kid so much that they are unprepared for real life. Don’t have kids if you’re not willing to be a parent.
I saw this within my own family and the spoiled, indulged adult who never received the psychological care he needed is an absolute disaster in his 40’s, unable to live on his own.
DoktorNietzsche@reddit
A psychiatrist is not a therapist -- they are generally two different things. Psychiatrists are medical doctors who can prescribe meds.
Also, "what comes up in therapy" is really under the control of the patient. If it's not coming up, it's because she's not bringing it up.
gringo-go-loco@reddit
They can be both. My psychiatrist was my therapist
DangerKitty555@reddit
Psychologists are the MDs of therapy…
gringo-go-loco@reddit
Yeah that’s what I thought. They can do both if they want to. I always thought it was weird to have a person giving you meds who wasn’t also helping you work through the problems…
qning@reddit
I have a reaction that I don’t want to blast into the universe. So I’ll just suggest that the things doctors prescribe medications for aren’t always the things that came be “worked through.”
I have a nurse practitioner who prescribes my psych meds. I’ve seen her for 15 years. My previous psychiatrist was also with me for ten years. I see my current provider every three to sex months. Sometimes nine months. I’m sure I’ve gone a year. I’m lucky that my conditions are very stable.
I’ve had different therapists during that time. Sometimes none. Sometimes couples stuff. Sometimes just me. Sometimes I went to support groups. Recovery meetings. Couples recovery meetings. So some different stuff. Those are the places that I work through the things that can be worked through.
gringo-go-loco@reddit
Everyone’s experience is different. I personally didn’t find much value in meds and find the science behind them to be rather lacking, especially given recent research that was published.
I was in therapy and on 4 different meds for over 15 years. The meds actually made things worse giving my side effects without really reducing my symptoms. Therapy was helpful in helping me cope and giving me a private person to talk to but none of the modern medicinal practices were life changing. The meds kept me numb and the therapy prevented me from over sharing with people who would not have my best interests in mind while listening.
The only thing that helped me through my issues was strangely enough magic mushrooms. After I started microdosing my mood improved significantly. After I tripped 2-3 times I was able to quit taking meds altogether for stress, depression, and anxiety. I found peace and happiness. I was able to break down the walls that held me back for most of my adult life. I healed from my trauma. I was just sort of fixed.
zoeyversustheraccoon@reddit
Not sure where you're getting "generally" because in my experience that was very clearly not the case.
DoktorNietzsche@reddit
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UmsswRdNHOo
zoeyversustheraccoon@reddit
She's not saying psychiatrists generally don't do therapy as well though. Yes, it's true that if you want medication for mental health you have to go to a psychiatrist, but that doesn't mean they are limited to that kind of service.
I mean, I don't really want to admit this but I saw psychiatrists for 15 years. Highly qualified people with degrees from Yale and Stanford. Half the time I wasn't taking medication either.
qning@reddit
You don’t want to admit that? I’ve seen a psychiatrist for 25 years. I should have started seeing one when I was about 12, but I waited until I was 25.
Changed my life in so many profound ways.
I have no idea where my doctors went to school. And I’m kinda wondering why you mention it.
Between not wanting to admit you saw a psychiatrist, and the compulsion to share where they went to school, I don’t know, you might want to talk to someone about that. KIDDING!
DoktorNietzsche@reddit
The majority of people who get therapy go to a therapist. There are simply many more of them around. The practice I go to has one psychiatrist on staff and over a dozen therapists. This has been my experience at other practices as well.
Freyja2179@reddit
My therapist at my college health center was a psychiatrist.
DoktorNietzsche@reddit
Excellent
portuguesepotatoes@reddit
This!
Zoinks222@reddit
I don’t doubt that. There’s probably deep-seated issues.
JustABizzle@reddit
Definitely. I remember watching some talk show, years back, (maybe Oprah?) and the subject was codependency. They said people can go through some trauma, and get “stuck there.” They replay the trauma over and over in subtle ways, but the feelings are the same, and it begins to define them.
I suddenly realized what was going on with my mother and my brother. He had a hard time in school, but it was always the teachers fault. My mom would show up and defend him. He was not a good team player and had a hard time with sports. The coaches fault. He went to lots of different colleges, but never earned a degree. He kept having “bad roommates,” “bad landlords,” “bad police interactions.”
Always someone else’s fault.
And my mom kept saving him. She’d set him up in a new place, in a new town, at a new school. Over and over again. It drove my dad nuts, and it put pressure on their marriage. He’d tell her to stop, so she would do it in secret.
Well, when he was a baby, back in 1967, he crawled into my grandparent’s pool. She was all dressed up, and leaving for a party, and she heard one grandparent say , “Where’s the baby?” And she screamed, “Stop the car!” She jumped out, ran to the pool, and dove in, dress, panty hose, high heels, updo and all. Everyone thought she’d lost her mind.
Until she came up out of the water, holding her baby. He was blue. Not breathing. My uncle had just returned from Vietnam, and he was telling her how to give him CPR. She saved him.
She told that story a lot.
And I think they were stuck there in that traumatic moment. He was forever the victim, and it was nobody’s fault. She was forever the savior and would never let her son suffer again.
Maybe this woman and her son are “caught” in a moment and can’t get out? They’ve been in this place for so long, it feels normal to them. It’s heartbreaking. They need therapy.
As for my mom and my brother? They both died within a year of each other. Unrelated medical problems, her of organ failure and he of colon cancer. But I was not surprised that they kind of died “together.”
WonderfulTraffic9502@reddit
Very similar situation in my family. Mother is a revolving door of martyrdom to atone for the sin of not realizing my brother had epilepsy until he had a grand mal seizure and nearly drowned in a pool. None of us realized it until that day. Now, it is 35 years later and she is still martyring herself. My whole family is torn apart because she doggedly refuses to see the codependency. I have given up at this point. I have to just accept it for my own sanity. Sadly, I will get no time for any relationship because my parents are approaching 80.
JustABizzle@reddit
I’m sorry 😞
AvailableAd6071@reddit
Wow. This is a perfect example of codependency.
PeyroniesCat@reddit
Very astute observation. I agree with you.
katzeye007@reddit
You said she was a lawyer. Which is it?
istara@reddit
Sadly she’s made the bed she’s now lying on.
There’s nothing you can do except stay alert for elder abuse as she gets older and less independent.
RNH213PDX@reddit
In all honesty, unless your friend has some mental challenges herself, its almost like she is getting off on being a martyr here. She intellectually knows this is ridiculous, but being The Mother and this pathetic self-sacrifice is its own disorder. Obviously don't agree to raise this ManBaby, but also, why are you going on mother-son dates with them? Don't enable this sadness.
DysthymiaSurvivor@reddit
I am the father of two boys. The eldest (20) lives with me and is an electrician apprentice and I have said he can stay rent free until he becomes a journeyman. After that it will be pay rent or get out. No way would I allow either to sponge off me at age 31. This is beyond sickening. I feel sorry for your friend but she has her own issues to even allow this abuse to continue. You should not have paid for his ticket or snacks, nor should you have anything to do with him after she passes. I would have no problem giving her my opinion and setting that boundary.
Fake_Eleanor@reddit
All you need to do is say no. Say it clearly and unambiguously: "No, I am not going to look after your son after you die." Say that every time it comes up, as necessary.
You don't need to have an intervention, or to tell her how to manage her kid, in order to justify saying no. In fact, it's probably better to separate those. Make sure she understands your "no" is serious before you start digging in to trying to fix her life for her, if that's something you actually want to do.
You're friends. You can have a respectful conversation with her about the situation, particularly if you start by asking "do you mind if I give you some advice about your son?" But this isn't a situation you can fix, and it's probably not a situation you can convince her to fix. It's a pattern that's been going on basically his whole life.
What you can definitely do is set your own boundaries and be clear about them.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
The last time I started with that, I got the you're not a mom and therefore have no idea what it means to love a child lecture.
I will set the boundary of no I won't do it. I'm chicken and feel I need an excuse. I'm relocating soon and can use that as an out.
JenniferJuniper6@reddit
Don’t give a reason. She’ll just keep asking.
CurrentResident23@reddit
Pretty wild to me that she doesn't want to hear your opinion about her son, but has asked if you'll take care if him when she's gone. She knows this is not a healthy relationship, but can't break out. Sadly, this is not a problem you can fix for her. I would not participate in any activity including the son, but that's just me.
RaspberryMobile2554@reddit
I wish I had a dollar for every time a parent told me I wouldn’t understand because I’m not a mom. This is where you use this to your advantage. How could you take care of her man child, I mean, son if you’re not “equipped” to handle a parental role. They both seem rather codependent and your attempt at advice obviously strikes a nerve. Bow out and if that affects your friendship that is her problem to deal with. That was an audacious ask.
Daghain@reddit
I'm not a pilot, but if I see a helicopter in a tree I know someone done fucked up.
Catladylove99@reddit
Loving a child means doing what’s best for them, not using them to meet your dysfunctional need to be necessary to someone, or letting your misplaced guilt or fear of confrontation get in the way of what’s best for them. Loving a child means nurturing their growth and independence. Even if it’s hard. Especially if it’s hard.
Signed, a mom
auntieup@reddit
I’m sorry you’re going through this with her. It’s familiar to me.
My husband and I have an acquaintance who is in the same spot with her adult child (they’ll be 33 next month). What we finally realized is that both mother and adult child have the relationship with the other that they need and want. You should realize this too.
Our acquaintance has heard from everyone - friends, family, neighbors, coworkers, law enforcement, court officers, even her own younger child - that her adult child is abusing her, and escalating the abuse. She is more than aware. She’s smart, financially well off, and still socially connected to some people who could help her. But she won’t seek help. She doesn’t want it. What she wants is what she has: that rotten adult she raised.
I would advise you to distance yourself from her. If she won’t change, and I don’t think she will, everything that will happen from now on will break your heart.
It’s so hard. Best of luck to you.
ChubbyChoomChoom@reddit
Well, if you ever want to torch the friendship after she gives you the “you’re not a mom” line, here’s some food for thought from comedian Steve Hofstetter:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekoDt_uxb_E
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
This was awesome!
winklesnad31@reddit
That is gold. Thanks for sharing.
alinroc@reddit
If she won't have that conversation with you, then she shouldn't be asking you to take on the burden of caring for her adult son.
Mean_Fae@reddit
I'm a mom. I have a son and i see this situation the same way you do. Anybody with eyes, nonetheless a caring friend can see what's going on here. You don't need an excuse...that dude sucks and no one wants to be around him. I wish she didn't have to lose friends and significant others to see how bad its gotten.
bored-panda55@reddit
You aren’t a parent but you were a child at some point.
eightezzz@reddit
Well sounds like you need to just let her do what she wants to do. Tell her you won't be looking after her parasite, i mean, Son, when she's gone. He can look after himself with her money, burn through it and see what real life is like when he has nothing left.
Fake_Eleanor@reddit
Then that's your answer. She doesn't want to have that conversation with you. That's her decision to make.
You can either enforce your boundary, maintain a relationship, and not talk about her son, or you can decide that you can't keep quiet and should probably withdraw from the friendship.
I know it can be hard, and if you need to come up with an excuse to draw the line, you should. But "No, that's not going to work for me" is all the reason you actually need, so it would be OK if that's what you said.
sabereater@reddit
Tell her no and tell her to go to an elder law attorney to do some estate planning. I guarantee that elder law attorney will tell her to cut the umbilical cord and what will happen if she doesn’t and later becomes incapacitated or dies. Source: I’m an elder law attorney. Your friend’s situation is all too common, unfortunately.
The_Dixco_Bunny@reddit
I would tell her absolutely not and why. I understand that she’s your friend but she dragged you into this by asking you to look after him - you don’t owe her anything but the truth.
Easier said than done, I know. Hugs to you. ☺️
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
Thanks. I've watched this train wreck for over 7 yrs. Thing is, he is a very smart guy and can be independent if she'd just kick him out and let him fend for himself. Harsh but how else will he learn? I care about him too. He needs a productive life in nine years he'll be 40.
No_League3501@reddit
You are a loving, caring person and I applaud you for that. I agree that it doesn’t take being a mom to see that your friend’s situation is messed up. If you were telling her what she wanted to hear, I have no doubt that your friend wouldn’t bring up that you’re not a bio mom. Saying clearly and unambiguously “NO” to your friend’s request is actually the one and only thing you CAN do to help her in this situation. NO is a complete answer. Without a “safety net” giving her an excuse to let the situation continue, your friend is more likely to finally take actions she should’ve long ago.
EaterOfFood@reddit
Sometimes the school of hard knocks is the best education.
Exciting-Half3577@reddit
Gen Xer here so here's a GenX answer. Fuck that dude.
Otherwise_Gear_5136@reddit
He IS very smart... and manipulative. He has learned that he has to do NOTHING and gets whatever he wants. The ONLY option here is to cut him off. But she will never do that.
SilverStory6503@reddit
I was married to a lazy man. One day he just decided to stop working. I put up with it for about a year and then divorced him. It was the best thing for both of us. I didn't have to carry his dead weight, and he embarked on a new career and ended up making some really good money. More that I was making. We actually remained friends until his death at 54.
The_Dixco_Bunny@reddit
Maybe you telling her no will be the kick in the ass she needs to get him independent. Probably not but one can hope.
tjdux@reddit
She already lost multiple boyfriends over this. What's one friendship too?
arianrhodd@reddit
He doesn't have to be productive, because she takes care of him. And he never will be as long as she does. She will work herself into an early grave while he watches and doesn't care.
I think you need to consider lowering contact with her to protect yourself and your peace. (No, you won't "look after him," he's 31 not 11!) You can't save someone who doesn't want to save themselves.
SunshineAlways@reddit
I don’t think she will be able to hear the truth about her son (possibly with therapy). I think you’d be better off reaffirming your feelings of friendship and concern for her, with a simple “No, that’s just not something I’m comfortable taking on” and change the subject. Perhaps suggest discussing the concerns she has for her son with her therapist.
If you try to make her see reality by saying anything negative about her son, she’s likely to end your friendship.
ClickAndClackTheTap@reddit
My sister and I have had to (between us) put three kids out- needed to kick him out of the nest, seriously- we were definitely there for emergencies assistance as needed, but it wasn’t easy to do and it took a lot of planning and support. Like I needed my own therapy and so did she to get our kids to move on. It wasn’t easy for them, but a few years down the road and one is really thriving, 2 are better off mentally than when they were at home.
My big concern for this guy is something like happened to my neighbor where they never never handled it and when mom passed away, the son got the house, but couldn’t maintain. It couldn’t take care of it. Lost everything it is now homeless
JustABizzle@reddit
Oof. That story hurts my heart.
ClickAndClackTheTap@reddit
It’s a pretty brutal story and super sad. It’s really tough to come back from homelessness.
liquidpele@reddit
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_helplessness
JustABizzle@reddit
Great link, thanks!
SnatchAddict@reddit
You permit what you allow. Unfortunately she has created this situation. It sounds like she is incapable of creating boundaries so there is no upside here.
Have you tried shaming him since you spend time around him? Not overtly but like how's the job search? Your mom wants to retire, she can't because she has to support you. What are your plans if she unexpectedly dies? Etc
I'm not rude by any means but I can be direct.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
Not shaming per se. I've taken him to work with me to see if he could help in the mail or filing rooms. He said he had a migraine. I've paid him to do odd jobs so he could have some money. He was supposed to paint my guest room. I bought the paint, rollers, everything. Came home from business trip, the walls were still the same. He said the fumes gave him a migraine when he opened the can. I've tried to find his passion which seems to be gardening. Asked friend with landscaping business if the 31 year old could help. He quit after a few weeks.
darkest_irish_lass@reddit
Maybe this will be the wakeup call she needs. You can say it with gentleness - "I love you very much, but no. Your son is smart and capable. He chooses to stay with you as a son instead of growing up, but I think he can be more."
Adventurous-Egg-8818@reddit
He's a manipulative bum!
Kwyjibo68@reddit
First, you don’t know that he’s not autistic or somehow disabled. He sounds exactly like many autistic people I know. Especially when they don’t have support. I’m sure his mother is doing the very best she can, but he likely needs outside help. There are no easy answers - parents of disabled children struggle with this every day. Most at best have a child who can work PT (with support and accommodations), and can take care of themselves physically, but they frequently have no friend network due to lagging social skills. What happens to those people when their parents die is what keeps us up at night.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
Diagnosis for autism came back negative. She's been trying to get every doc to come up with something. They suggested ketamine.
Kwyjibo68@reddit
That doesn't matter, autistic people are misdiagnosed all the time. The point is, this guy clearly has issues, maybe ADHD, maybe something else. The reality may be that he cannot hold a FT job. Certainly not without some sort of supports or accommodations.
WeekendJen@reddit
The dx for her son's problems is in her mirror.
BurnerLibrary@reddit
You understand it very clearly. Tell your friend that you love her, but are not going to take responsibility for her adult son who refuses to get help for himself, much less a job.
RustyRapeAxeWife@reddit
You are not responsible for her bad parenting choices. I understand mental illness. I’ve had severe depression and anxiety but had to still work to pay bills as my parents do not financially support me (I’m 55). I have a 22 yr old daughter who also has been in therapy and on meds for many years and she manages to do online college and work part time. Your friend is enabling her son to be a deadbeat.
DragonMagnet67@reddit
Eh, this is not about you not understanding bc you’re not a mom. You just know a loafer and a mooch when you see one. Bc that is what her son is being, and it’s her fault for allowing it. He needs to grow up and contribute more to his mom’s household.
I happen to have a 26 year old child living with me and her dad, still. I should mention here she has struggled since high school with clinical anxiety. I mean, in high school, it was bad. She slacked off in school and almost quit school bc of it. But we got her help, she did the work, we did our own work, and she gets through it easier now as a young adult. But she still is prone to anxiety. But she doesn’t use it as an excuse or crutch anymore, she addresses and uses her tools - and her prescribed meds - to deal with it, so that she can function as the young adult she is.
She works full time, and has since graduating college. She can’t afford rent on her own, even for the smallest apartment around here. So we are happy to help her out. But - she helps us, too. In addition to paying us room and board every month (I only ask her to pay her share of the groceries and utilities) she buys us all dinner a couple times a month, as a thank you to me for cooking for her regularly. She often goes and gets herself a Starbucks coffee and she always brings me one, too, or one of their chocolate croissants, bc she knows I love those. She does her own laundry, pays her own car expenses, and lets us use her streaming apps 😁. We let her use ours, too, and like I said, I cook most nights for her and her dad.
In short, she is an adult member of the family now, and she acts like it. And honestly, one reason she acts like it is bc her dad and I expect her to. We treat her like the young adult she is. And we all three treat each other with respect. Yes, she is still our child, and yes, I want to help make some things easier for her, like not charging her much for rent or not making her cook all her own meals… But we also have made it clear she is responsible for her own expenses and things, and she’s expected to save some money to move out when she can. She just got a promotion and nice raise at her work, so that’s looking like it may be soon. And she was anxious as hell about applying for that promotion, but she made herself go for it bc she knew it was what she both wanted and needed to do for herself.
I know, as a parent, it can be easy to slip back into seeing your adult kids as still helpless and needing you, and your instinct is to protect them from the harsh world. But imo, it’s a parent’s primary job to resist that feeling and let your adult children grow up. That means, allowing them to make tough decisions for themselves, setting clear expectations and boundaries for them if they are still living in your house.
Expectation number 1 should be, if they are out of school and over 18, then they find employment so they can pay their own bills at the very least. A 31 year old living at home with no job and his mother cannot retire bc she feels she needs to support him? And he is physically and mentally able? No wonder he is emotionally immature and still feels dependent on her. Until she sets clear expectations and rules for him to live at her house, I doubt he will change.
Finally, you are in now way responsible for her adult son. Do not agree to be, and she is crazy for even asking you. He is not your responsibility. In fact, he doesn’t even need to be hers! He is a grown adult and needs to start acting like one. And your friend needs to, at the very least, insist he get a job so maybe she can retire at some point.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
I would give anything if my friend's son was as half capable as your daughter. I want to be clear that my issue is not him living with her. I envy people who have family living at home. The more hands the better. I do everything by myself which is hard esp. as I get older. My issue with him is that he contributes ZERO to the rent, food etc. He may as well be bedridden I know people with down syndrome who contribute more to family expenses than my friends son. I'm working up the courage to have the talk this weekend at brunch.
DragonMagnet67@reddit
Best of luck to you in talking with her, and I hope she listens to you. For her own sake, at least, but for her son’s, as well.
Atlmama@reddit
DragonMagnet, it sounds like you both have been supportive and loving parents, and your daughter is thriving! Congratulations! Our little ones all have their own paths, and you’ve helped her along her path to success.
DragonMagnet67@reddit
Thank you! She’s a good kid, we are proud of her.
DelilahBT@reddit
First, why did he go to the movie with you and four friend?!
This is deep, dark codependency and your boundaries need to be sharp when dealing with this friend of yours. You absolutely will not take care of this deadweight, nor will he join you on nights out. Lord.
I’m GenX with kids and my kids are the same age as this deadbeat. Except they have jobs, apartments and support themselves. We love each other but no one is supported by me, as it should be.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
She likes him to get out of the house. When I proposed brunch and a movie, my idea was just us girls. That morning she asked if he could come. I wanted to say no but caved because she had me on speaker phone. I did put down my foot over what movie we would see.
DelilahBT@reddit
Boundaries, boundaries, boundaries….
Top-Philosophy-5791@reddit
Ideas: learned helplessness, emotional incest, Anti social personality disorder(/manipulation/parasitism) Dysfunctional personal boundaries. Th
Sinsyne125@reddit
I'm speaking frankly, and I hope it doesn't come off as disrespectful, but...
You are 54 years old, and for whatever reason, you don't have children, but you have your own life. You have a right to your own happiness.
Do you really want to take on this BS in your life? This isn't "looking after" or even "checking in" on someone's old-ass son if something happened to your friend -- this is just taking on a full load of your friend's problem that, by the sound of it, has compromised and prevented your friend from finding happiness of her own. Do you want to fall into that role?
Her son surely doesn't sound like he has a debilitating disease or some such -- it sounds like there is just as much selfishness involved more than anything else.
You mentioned that you are a lawyer, so you're obviously intelligent and worked hard -- In this case, I think you should put your well-being first.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
Thanks . It will take courage because she is not going to put him out. My strategy is to work with her to figure out a plan to get him on the road to adulthood by age 35. He can't waste away like this. He will not be a lawyer like his mom or I but maybe working retail. Maybe learning a trade. If disability is the plan ok. But he has to apply for it.
Interactiveleaf@reddit
Something that you have not figured out yet is that neither your friend nor her son want your help.
I'm sure she says that she doesn't like the situation, but she is going out of her way to maintain it. Your story about the Bahamas is really the only thing anyone needs to hear to know that.
And he doesn't even say that he wants anything to change. Not with words, not with actions.
If she wants this to change, she'll come up with a strategy on her own and stick to it. If she ever does that, great! Give her all the support you can.
But don't try and impose a solution on something that isn't your problem.
You keep talking about this as if he's the one that needs to change, and of course, he would be happier in the long run if he did. But he's not the only one who has created this situation. If she weren't getting something out of this, she never would have allowed it to go on this long.
In fact, that's the advice: stop trying to change him and start asking her why she puts up with this. "That sounds miserable! What do you plan to do about it?" "OMG why do you put up with that behavior?" "Yes, that's awful. What's your plan to fix it?"
She's an intelligent adult who is quite capable of fixing this without your help. Stop trying to save her from the consequences of her own lousy choices, stop infantalizing her, and stop setting yourself on fire to keep other people warm.
Sparkyboo99@reddit
What is his disability?
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
Manic Depression
Neurodivergent
Chrone's Disease
Chronic Fatigue Syndrome with migraines
It's a laundry list.
General Anxiety Disorder
None of this stops him from playing video games.
Sparkyboo99@reddit
Ok I was a little confused because you said he’s not autistic or special needs. All of these sound like special needs to me 🤷🏻♀️
BumblingBeeeee@reddit
Ok, but he is 31 years old. It’s a sad fact that your friend will not live forever to ensure that he never has a single moment of discontent. So the goal can only be for him to be self sufficient, right?
awakearcher@reddit
He’s a loser
wizardyourlifeforce@reddit
Laziness and lack of empathy
WeekendJen@reddit
He absolutely can waste away like that because thats the choice he made and his mother enables it. No plan is going to change things. It's going to turn in to a sink or swim situation for him when she dies and he'll just have to figure it out himself or not like billions of other people do in their late teens / early 20s.
Leave your friend's project alone unless you want a bunch of stress from talking to a brick wall.
BumblingBeeeee@reddit
Omg how is this a four year plan?!? This should be a 90 day plan at the most. He is an adult who has attended college, even if he didn’t bother to graduate. He has had way more than enough time to become self-sufficient.
wizardyourlifeforce@reddit
I mean does he have a college degree? Law school is the last refuge of the skill-less.
z44212@reddit
Your friend must want the help first. Didn't sound like we're there, yet.
thaway071743@reddit
She knows. My brother was like this. He’s probably neurodivergent in some way but it’s not my business. She made sure to take care of him financially when she died (as best she could) because she didn’t want to put that burden on his siblings.
When you have a family member like that, whether it’s a parent or a child, it’s really easy to know what to do. And very hard to actually do it.
SciFiChickie@reddit
You should just state you don’t believe you can commit to what she is requesting, and not try to make her see the light. I say this as someone that knows that the parents that coddle their offspring this way will never listen to anything that indicates they should make their offspring stand on their own two feet.
If not for a few differences, I would’ve thought you were talking about my mom and younger brother before my mom died rather unexpectedly last year. The doctors told her she had 6 months (cancer) and she died 8 days later.
She took care of everything for him to the point that he is completely fracked now that she’s dead. He would always treat her so badly yelling and throwing things to get his way. Then once his kids were born he would use access to them as blackmail for her to do what he wanted. My mom retired with a robust retirement from both her national guard retirement and her civil service retirement. She owned her house free and clear and two years after she retired her account was empty and she had sold her house to pay for my brother and his kids “necessities.” Then had to take a customer service job and do Uber eats to make enough just to keep a roof and put food on the table. She died with less than $500 in her account and a month behind on her rent.
Now my brother keeps trying to get me and our other family members to fund his job free life. It’s to the point that I refuse to even read his texts or answer when he calls.
pm1022@reddit
NTA and I feel so bad for your friend. Such a sad story! Her son is a piece of shit & she's enabling him to stay the way he is. Depression my ass! She's his free ride and sees no reason to be a responsible adult. Also, if he's verbally abusive to her in front of you I can only imagine how he treats her behind closed doors. This poor woman needs help but not with taking care of him. She needs help taking care of herself. Does she have family that can intervene? Anyone who can talk her into kicking him out? Please give her the biggest hug next time you see her.
ParadiddlediddleSaaS@reddit
Mom, meatloaf!
SassyStealthSpook@reddit
You tell her no. If she wants to know why, be honest with her.
redtesta@reddit
He needs a kick in the butt. Lazy and full if opinions. Needs to know how lucky he is and how he is destroying his mom. Kid is 31. He needs to have fear of loss to wake up instead of pulling the depression card. Then taking Adderall . Bet he is gaming most the day. I feel andcworry for mom. She needs to be more strict and not enable him. Imagine if we did this at 31 being gen x. Oh, that's right it didn't happen. Lazy generation of kids now.
Pearlline@reddit
Do not allow yourself to be dragged into this mess. She’s an enabler and he’s an opportunist. If he knows there’s no safety net, he’s presumably smart enough to know the consequences. It not your problem nor is it your responsibility. Your friend, the lawyer, should be able to set up a trust for the deadbeat son. If there’s not enough there to support him in the life he’s clearly become accustomed to, then so be it.
ItsPumpkinSpiceTime@reddit
Disability isn't for people with depression. I can't get my son on it and he has five qualifying conditions, they say they're just not 'severe enough" to stop him from working.
He is taking advantage of her because he is getting away with it. He's not motivated to do better. She probably already knows all this. I doubt any intervention would help unless she's willing to do the work involved, which will mean upsetting him. She is likely getting something from this too, unfortunately. That's how it is with codependency. What she would have to do is set a timeline for him to get a job and then immediately set a timeline for him to move out on his own. IT will not be easy for him and he'll likely lash out, cry abuse, or just cut her out of his life completely.
LeftwingSH@reddit
You know the answer. You can't fix it. You are getting something out of this drama as well, so you continue to look for ways to solve the problem. You can't, your friend is an adult who has created a codependent relationship with her son and now with you - let me say this again - YOU ARE BEING CODEPENDENT HERE. Drop the rope. I know that's not what you want to hear, it's what you need to do.
You can't fix other people, I know... I'm a reformed fixer myself. Now I firmly mind my own business.
Daghain@reddit
This. OP, your energy might be better spend trying to figure out why you want to make this your problem.
FaceMaulingChimp@reddit
No matter what lead up to this, she and he need to prepare . Tell her you will take her on a week vacation so the son gets used to being alone so he’s not homeless when she dies .
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
For her 60th birthday we planned destination b-day trip to Bahamas. Six days away. She set up everything for him. Loaded the fridge, labeled meals. Gave him a DoorDash gift card. Got a cat sitter and dog walker.
Two days in he had panic attack and threatened to check himself in a psyche ward if something was not done. My friend sends him ticket to Bahamas. I can't get her from him. Maybe for a weekend.
Daghain@reddit
She should have called his bluff. If he'd actually gone through with it he might have gotten some help. But, he knew darn well she'd cave, which is why he pulled that crap.
I'd just not involve myself in any of this. No one in this scenario is going to change and you're just causing yourself unnecessary stress. Not your circus, not your monkeys.
Catladylove99@reddit
Well, this is how you know it’s not really about taking care of him or doing what’s best for him, because if he’s that ill, a psych ward is a good, safe place for him where he could get the help he needs. Your friend is meeting her own dysfunctional emotional needs through this codependent relationship. There is a reason she can’t or won’t say no to him, and until she wants to get help for this problem and chooses to seek it out for herself, nothing will change. Best you can do now is draw your own boundaries on what you’re willing to put up with. For example: maybe you won’t plan trips with her anymore since she can’t be trusted to follow through on the plans you make without letting her son come and ruin everything.
Nicodemus888@reddit
Oh wow this is really unhealthy levels of toxic learned helplessness.
He did that on purpose because he saw the slightest inkling of her maybe getting some freedom and him having to fend for himself. And that is what terrifies him the most. And he was NOT having it.
She doesn’t seem to be in complete denial, but she hasn’t found the fortitude to stand up to it.
It’s just like a child, when they want something they scream and tantrum. And if the parent gives in, that sends a message to the child: “if I push hard enough they’ll give in and I get what I want”. And then it becomes even more difficult and the parent feels powerless.
The only way to get past that barrier is to absolutely NOT give in. She needs to take control.
I hope she finds a way
steffi309@reddit
My mother was friends with a guy like this. His mother had cut him off. My mother started helping him out and she probably gave him $5000 or more over the time she helped him. Anyone who complained at her about helping him got cussed out, myself included. He treated my mother the same way your friend's son treats her.
You probably can't stop her from putting up with him but I definitely wouldn't agree to help take care of him. There may also be a drug or alcohol issue involved. That's what my mom's friend's problem was. He owed everyone because he used all the money for drugs.
Rude_Masterpiece_239@reddit
They need therapy. She’s enabling this behavior. Hes 31, not too late to get his life on track.
Scared_Wall_504@reddit
Let her go so she can find someone who understands that it takes a village to raise a child.
Sparkyboo99@reddit
Absolutely you should tell her you cannot be responsible for him when she is gone. As her friend you can check in with her on this periodically but I don’t see this as your problem to solve. They have a dysfunctional relationship that has nothing to do with you. It might mean your friendship is affected, but reading your other comments it doesn’t sound like she wants a change and continues to enable his bad behavior. Ugh it’s really a terrible dynamic that sounds like a total mess.
Nadie_AZ@reddit
Ok I've gone back and forth on answering this. A lot of type type type delete delete delete.
My mom has never been much of a worker, a house cleaner, a care giver. I watched her slowly give up and become dependent on others. She still managed to have 6 children and sort of raise them until, I guess, 10 or so. Later on, after she divorced my father, she would live with my grandfather and leach off of him until he moved into a retirement community that had an age minimum higher than her age. Brilliant move that forced her to leach off of her children.
Anyways. You get the idea of who she is. I was the oldest and lived with other families and saw how they raised their kids, treated each other, kept their homes, etc. That was a true education for me.
My youngest sibling was 6 years old and out riding her bike one day. She was hit by a car. Horrible. She was thrown to the ground and went into a coma. Thankfully the car was going about 25 mph. It could have been worse. She was in a coma for a few weeks. My mom became a hawk over her. When she was released from the hospital, the doctors did their exams, xrays, CT scans and had her go to PT. Every doctor said mentally she was undamaged. Every doctor said she would make a full physical recovery. Great news! Except my mom never listened. She treated my sister as if she was beyond repair and let her basically do whatever she wanted and would protect her.
My sister became the kind of person you describe. Needy. Mean. Unable to hold a job. Spoiled. Verbally abusive. I remember one conversation where she told me she hated her minimum wage job because no one was treating her with respect. I told her that is not uncommon and either time on the job or moving on to something like, say, college, would give her the opportunity to gain knowledge and experience to give her that respect. She thought that was stupid. My sister had a payout at 21 from her accident and once that came, my mom leached off of her for a bit. Once it ran out, she kicked her daughter out. That's when she went to her father. My sister, embittered, fled to another state and somehow has done for herself without any disability (she can't quality because there is nothing wrong with her, according to doctors).
My advice? Don't do it. If you lose your friend, I am truly sorry. The amount of emotional turmoil you will have will age you more quickly, cost you more money than you can make or save and leave you alone. I have struggled with all of this but have found my mental health is worth the boundaries I set for myself.
bzngabazooka@reddit
You and your friend are babying him waaaaay too much. I can tell by what you said and the wording(calling him a kid. He’s a man).
You have to be upfront and truthful and a bit blunt to your friend. What she is asking is a selfish request and you need to make it very clear that it’s not going to happen. Rip off the bandaid. There had to be kindness but sternness as well, if not she won’t truly get the reality of the situation. That her son is screwed when she is gone(however she wants to go, by working to help her son or by retirement).
Sometimes in life, a true friend gives another friend a kick in the ass, even if they don’t want to hear it. Tell her they need family therapy to begin with.
Lastly, I don’t know if the relationship calls for it, or if it’s breaking boundaries…so this is a maybe situation. Warn the son, and I mean scare the shit out of him on the reality that he’s going to face if he doesn’t get his act together, because time stops for no one and the world will not give a shit if he makes whatever excuse he has in his arsenal.
And if all of that fails, you did your best. Stay friends if you can, but make sure when you see them both drown on their eventual struggles to NOT jump in that metaphorical lake and save them because they WILL drown you if you’re not careful.
Senjii2021@reddit
She needs to kick that big dumb birdie out of the nest.
QueenScorp@reddit
My mom supported my sister (and her husband) her entire adult life, until my mom died. Both of them had physical and mental health issues, and both went through a bout of drug and legal issues. Mom paid for the lawyers and the medical and their utilities. And moved them into a house she owned. My other sister and I had told her repeatedly to let our sister deal with her own shit and hit rock bottom but she just couldn't. My sister needed her. Even on her deathbed, she was worried about how my 45 year old sister would survive without her. Textbook codependence.
Mom died nearly a year ago. Since then, I have had to literally tell this grown ass adult how to file paperwork, get insurance, cancel services, etc. She has been horribly stunted and held back because my mom couldn't let go. However, she and her husband have stepped up and taken on their responsibilities. If she asks me how to do something I send her in the right direction but will not do it for her or hold her hand. It turns out the issue wasn't my sister and her husband, it was my mom's overbearing need to control them. TBF, they could have refused her help, but they were not in a financial position to refuse her financial help and the rest of it came with that.
As for your friend, its very likely she may not even listen to you. She is convinced her son "needs" her and its unlikely she is going to give that up. You can try to broach the subject by telling you that you are concerned about her being taken advantage of and abused, but be prepared for her to deny it or excuse it. Depending on where you live and how toxic the situation is, you can also call an elder abuse line and let social services investigate. I'll be honest, reading what you wrote again, I'd probably go that route.
You can refuse to be part of it. Tell her you cannot commit to supporting her son when she dies. Suggest if she wants him taken care of that she set up a trust and an annuity rather than leaving him a lump sum, but do not agree to be sucked into this toxic dynamic. And why can't the father step up if the son truly needs help?
Also, disability is exceedingly hard to get on. My sister is physically disabled - you can see it when you are with her, its not fake nor deniable - and yet she has been denied disability more than once. Mental health is even harder to "prove" is a disability since a lot of metal health issues do not preclude being able to work. Not to say he couldn't get on it with really good documentation from medical professionals, and proof he has tried things like meds and therapy to help with the depression, but its not as easy as people want to believe.
akajondoe@reddit
Why would her son qualify for any kind of disability. I hope just being a lazy ass with free room and board does not qualify for disability.
insomniacandsun@reddit
I know that it’s tempting to try and intervene, but don’t.
black_flag_4ever@reddit
As someone that had to move out at 18, I have zero sympathy for this guy. None.
auntieup@reddit
Happy cake day, and I’m sorry. The opposite of this situation (parents who kick their kids out when they’re still teenagers) also sucks.
black_flag_4ever@reddit
Thanks.
DeleteMetaInf@reddit
Happy cake day.
black_flag_4ever@reddit
Thanks!
Carrots-1975@reddit
This is classic depression- he needs to be in therapy. My son is like this and it wasn’t until we got a late ADHD/Autism diagnosis and meds that he’s started to pull out of his hole. He’s 23 and still living with me, but he’s been gainfully employed for 6 months now and has started making plans to go to school ands for his future. I firmly believe there’s no such thing as “lazy people”. It’s almost always a mental health issue.
muphasta@reddit
He isn't your drama. Politely decline to take care of him. If he is this verbally abusive to his own mother, imagine what he'll be like with you.
oneupme@reddit
If the friend is a good friend, you owe it to your friend to be truthful with her.
*DO NOT LET PEOPLE YOU DON'T LIKE BECOME A PART OF YOUR LIFE*
Just tell her, no you are not going to take care of the son. Whereas her patience and love may be endless towards this man-child, your limits have been long exceeded. If she is worried about him surviving her, she needs to do the things that would encourage him to be independent.
Don't intervene, but just tell your friend what your attitude on this is. Point out all of the sacrifices that she has made, which has only made matters worse. Tell her that she is blinded by her own love for him, love which he takes for granted.
If it was me, I'd just kick the kid out of the house. I have zero patience for adult-aged people who refuse to grow up and be responsible for themselves.
GenericRedditor1937@reddit
I would only focus on the stuff that affects you. So, no more treating her son to movies and allowing him to be the third wheel during your hangouts unless you invite him. And definitely don't agree to take care of him once she's gone.
BoogerWipe@reddit
Her situation is the result of decades of her own decisions. She gets to lay in that bed now.
wizardyourlifeforce@reddit
He can’t get on disability because he’s not disabled
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
Isn't depression one of the qualifying illnesses?
Catladylove99@reddit
If it were, then around 1/10 American adults would be receiving disability for it. That’s not how it works. I have worked with adults with debilitating issues like schizophrenia who were homeless because of it and still were being rejected for disability, after years of trying. This “kid” is not going to get disability for his depression.
moonbeam127@reddit
No! I’m a therapist. The disability process is very long and involved. You need years of mental health records, years of supporting documentation, years of trying treatments. They don’t just hand out disability. Disability for any mental health issues is almost impossible to get.
This man needs a a JOB. This man is lazy
stormstormsmilez@reddit
Ok, I can relate to your friend in a sense. I have a 20year old developmentally delayed son. I'm also dieing, If this is not something you wish to do then tell your friend you cannot take on that responsibility.
Maybe suggest she seek information on getting him into a group home or something so that his daily needs are no longer hers to carry. He should be able to live independently from her somehow and I think she can request assistance from the state on his behalf of he is unwilling to do so for himself.
I got lucky with my son, in the fact that my step-daughter has agreed to managing his finances for him if I pass away suddenly. And is also willing to help him live independently someday if I haven't gotten him to that point before I die. I'm very lucky that the kids are close like they are, he helps her with babysitting her daughter while she works, and she'll help manage his finances and pays him for babysitting.
I'm in the process of getting into a place of my own and finally getting the chance to help from a distance soon. I hope your friend will be able to help her son get to a point where he can be independent... She might want to consider getting therapy for herself and focus on setting firm boundaries and consequences for the son as well... She deserves a break
EastHuckleberry5191@reddit
You can’t fix this. This is her problem. She raised him to be this way. This started a long time ago. I’m assuming your friend has self esteem issues and keeping her son dependent on her makes her feel like she’s worthwhile.
lostmindz@reddit
He can't "get on disability" because being a lazy leech is not covered.
That said, I doubt there's much of anything you can do other than what you have been, though I'd certainly squash any attempts committing me to any future responsibility whaysoever.
SpaceAdventures3D@reddit
If you think there is verbal and psychological abuse involved, you can report it. Time for your county to step in. Report it as elder abuse.
This might be a bigger problem that you can handle. If he is demanding that her mom stop her social life to cook him dinner, how is that any different than an abusive husband doing the same thing? If she can't date, that is controlling behavior. This is abuse.
He might have some sort of disability. But ti doesn't matter at this point. What matters is this is an abusive situation, and it needs to be reported. Then a properly trained person can step in and sort out his diagnosis, and where he needs to be. For both their sake, and yours, don't take this on by yourself. You need to report the situation, and advocate for someone to step in.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
But what if it gets my friend in trouble? It's a great idea . You can't lose custody of an adult. My fear is that he would end up with some guardian ad litem that would cost my friend lots of money.
NewLife_21@reddit
He doesn't get a gal. He isn't a child nor is he so disabled that he is unable to speak on his own behalf.
He can hire a lawyer of his own if he wants one.
The only issue with calling Adult Services is that if your friend has capacity the worker cannot force her to do anything. She is over 65 which is the age AS are allowed to intervene for someone who has capacity. But having capacity means being able to make your own decisions. Unless your friend is willing to listen to what the worker says regarding elder abuse, there isn't much the worker can do.
If nothing else, maybe a visit would start tearing the wool from her eyes.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
I worry about the GAL because there are crooked lawyers out there who abuse the system and declare fit people unfit. You did give me the idea to find a social worker.
NewLife_21@reddit
Again, no one in this situation is going to get a GAL. Those are for people either too young or too incapacitated to understand what is going on.
Both of the adults in this situation have capacity, which means they have to hire regular lawyers for themselves.
I'm glad you're at least looking into a worker. They can help many ways.
Lopsided_Panic_1148@reddit
She is 66 years old, and what he does may very well qualify as elder abuse. I would definitely report it. He is taking advantage of her, verbally abusing her, and I wouldn't be surprised if he hits her.
SpaceAdventures3D@reddit
I was going off your statement that you though the son wasn't really disabled. If he is not disabled, then this is abusive and weird. If he is disabled, he needs a social worker.
At the very ;least this is a situation where a social worker of some sort needs to get involved. He's not going to go to jail. You need to somehow get a social worker involved in all this.
auntieup@reddit
A guardian ad litem is only required for people who can’t care for themselves. Your friend’s son can care for himself, he just won’t.
All the actions your friend needs to take are actions that only she can initiate. The state can’t force her to throw her son out unless there’s proof of abuse, and she would still have to pursue that avenue herself. She could prevail on her son’s dad to step up, but he doesn’t have to do that either. This is a man in his 30s, not a child. He’s nobody’s responsibility but his own.
It’s a mess, but remember: it is not your mess.
Exploding_Gerbil@reddit
THIS
3010664@reddit
Chances are very good that when she dies, he will miraculously figure out how to take care of himself. This relationship is not just him taking advantage of her, she gets something from keeping him dependent as well. Perhaps she doesn’t want to be alone, or enjoys the sympathy from being a martyr, etc. People like this often have convinced themselves that they are wonderful, caring parents and don’t see how they’ve damaged their child by keeping them dependent.
Either way, you can just say “no, I’m not comfortable with that” when she asks if you will care for him after she dies.
M_Solent@reddit
Gen X’er here. When I was in my late 20’s I attempted to change careers and crashed and burned. Compounding that, in that same period, I had cancer, and (in this era before Obamacare), I spent every penny I had (and then some) on medical care.
At 30, I was mentally depleted. I was dealing with some simultaneous crises: I didn’t have a good job, I didn’t know what I was going to do in the future, my mind was reeling from what cancer did to my body, and I was 100% broke.
I moved in with one of my parents in an attempt to take a break from life and pull myself back together. For many reasons I won’t enumerate, it was the most unpleasant time of my life. Being home made every single fucking thing I was dealing with, much worse.
After a couple months I got a job out of state and bolted. Additionally, I was still dealing with some follow-up procedures due to the cancer. I got fired, and moved back with my parent. At that point I took a shitty menial job to get out of the house, and made the best decision I could at the time that would get me the fuck out of there.
Those are my credentials to what I’m about to say next: It’s ok for you to just tell her no. Also, the fact that she would even ask you to take care of her 31 year old adult son, speaks volumes about his current status.
TL/DR: Say no and tell her you think it’s ridiculous and why if she presses you on it.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
What was your motivation and support strategy?
M_Solent@reddit
My motivation was to get out of my parent’s house and get back into a long-term career - but mostly the former. My support strategy was going back to grad school and taking loans so I could rent an apartment. So the motivation was basically intrinsic. My parent’s home was extremely toxic, and I had to get out of there. But, in retrospect, I just seem to have had more grit than that 31 year old. I became willing to do work that I didn’t want to do to get out. He doesn’t seem to have the internal will to do that.
justmypointofviewtoo@reddit
I don’t think her relationship with her son is any of your business. Nothing you say to her will help this situation. I think unless you’re okay with potentially damaging this friendship permanently, you should keep quiet. What’s going on between her and her son is years in the making, needs a lot of untangling, and probably has no real solution as her son appears to be suffering with a personality disorder like BPD or NPD for which there are no real cures.
Vivian326619@reddit
Ok wow. So I am an older Gen X born 1966 also with a 31 year old son. My son is married with 2 kids. owns his own home and is completely independent. He's been pretty independent since he started college at 17. I guess I did something right. My son and I are close, he only lives 30 minutes away.
I'm not sure I'd interfere but there must be a reason this kid can't go on his own, maybe he has something wrong with him. Mental illness or something.
sanityjanity@reddit
Tell her "no", and encourage her to set up a trust for him, unless she wants him to blow the entire inheritance in a few months.
FindingLovesRetreat@reddit
OP, DO NOT TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THIS MAN-CHILD!
He is a mooch and she an enabler - She had made this rod for her own back. They are figuratively still attached via the umbilical cord.
Sometimes you have to be tough and speak the truth.
This boy needs a lesson in life!
Bright_Pomelo_8561@reddit
I’m not an expert on what you can get for disability, but I don’t know that depression falls under that category. Maybe he needs to look into getting some kind of technical skill or something to plan for when she does leave this earth. Because the reality is, we never know when that’s going to happen. And the money we leave behind runs out much sooner than we think it will. In the early 90s, my parents died and I became the guardian of my brother. The money that they left behind did not last nearly as long as I think they thought it would have and that was OK. My first husband died when my kids were in first grade and kindergarten and he had planned quite well obviously didn’t plan to die that young but that money didn’t last. I’m sure like he thought it would even though I invested it very well. The recession hurt the investments very badly. Maybe these are some things you could gently point out to your friend from a perspective of somebody that’s gone through it in a different way.
Boogra555@reddit
Here's another post about a kid with a neurological disorder. What in the world is going on?
elammcknight@reddit
No. Not your responsibility. He needs to start the process to get on disability
Own_Bluejay_7144@reddit
Here is what to do: https://whatiscodependency.com/detaching-detach-let-go-with-love/
My brother is like this with my mother. I tried to help her for 20 years. It came to a head when I learned my mother's plan was to take out an insurance policy on herself, work 20 hours a day until she died, and give him her house and money. She is in her 70s. My brother disowned me when I confronted him with the plan.
I learned that as part of her co-dependency, she got off by complaining about him and getting a reaction from me, like your friend is doing to you.
Now, every time she tries to bring him up, I say, "I love you, Mom, but this is no longer my business. If you bring him up, I am ending our conversation." She tries various ways to sneak him into a conversation, but it has finally dawned on her that I am serious.
You can tell your friend that you love her, but you no longer want to hear about her relationship with her son. Nothing you do or say will change it.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
Anyone who is friends with her gets the son as a package deal. When she brings him up I always say "hey how is that disability claim going?"
Own_Bluejay_7144@reddit
You are giving her a reaction. That is what she wants.
My therapist used a vending machine analogy about it. Your friend's coins are conversations about her son. Your reaction is her bottle of Coke coming out of the machine. By cutting off the conversation, she is putting coins in without anything coming out. Eventually, she will figure out it's useless to try.
You are part of their co-dependent relationship by giving advice, comforting her, or even shaming her. She needs to realize on her own that she needs intense therapy.
Nicodemus888@reddit
This isn’t the same as codependent toxicity, but I do see kind of a similarity with my sister’s obsessive anti-vax nonsense. She knows very clearly that I simply WILL NOT engage. It doesn’t stop her going off sometimes or trying, but I shut it down by never ever responding to it.
happycj@reddit
Well, he won't live long after she's gone. I've known three people like this, and when they got the insurance money after their parent passed, they went wild with drugs and were dead within 5 years. Two of them within 3 years. Only one lasted to 5. And there was no previous history with drugs.
But the kid has never existed in the real world and has kept his mother in poverty so they have never had enough money to do anything stupid with it. So his first time with a pile of Mad Money will be his last time.
Sever those ties. Move on. You don't need that in your life.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
What happened to the one who did not do drugs? How did they pass away?
happycj@reddit
They all died from drugs. Just some faster than others. Sorry I was unclear in my wording…
Lopsided_Panic_1148@reddit
I think they mean that there was no history with drugs prior to the mother dying. Suddenly, these adults have a bunch of money and so they go hog wild, and that includes drugs.
meli_padme@reddit
I had to re-re-read the part where you went to the movies and paid for them? Your friend took her adult son with her to the movies and you had to pay for everyone and everything, including all his snacks? Yeah, she and he need help. You don't need to be a parent to know when you're being taken advantage of.
You should gently tell her no. She's enabled him to be "depressed" and a failure. If the dad is still sending money to support that "child" he's also part of the problem. Let him take on that responsibility. Not your place and why should you take on the responsibility of "adopting" an adult? As a parent she should make plans for him after she's gone... I'm sure that's what parents of truly disabled children do.
earthgarden@reddit
If this is really your homegirl then you need to be blunt. At the very least tell her that you will not take care of her son. NO. Make and set that clear boundary with her at least.
Other than that, if you cannot bring yourself to speak plainly to your friend, then refuse to discuss the son.
CommonWursts@reddit
I’m sorry that you’re going through this and especially sorry for the situation your friend and her son have created for themselves. Please consider that a friend who asks you to look after their capable adult child but uses the “you don’t have kids so you don’t know” line is one that doesn’t value your friendship in the way you might hope. They may not be able to recognize that or they’re in denial.
RabunWaterfall@reddit
He likely won’t get disability until he’s 50+, and even then he’ll need a formal diagnosis and treatment documentation. They don’t just hand out disability to people because they’re jerks.
I would decline to take care of him. Maybe lead him through the processes of funeral and stick around as legal counsel, but otherwise he’d be on his own.
I don’t have any advice on how to convey this to your friend. Hopefully another commenter will. Sending good vibes to you! Wish you the best! 🧡🌻
cholerasustex@reddit
How about approaching your friend with your observation and worries?
Come from a place of care and concern.
Maybe there is underlying trauma (son or friend) that you may be not aware of.
Maybe separate the two issues of how she is being treated, and her sons Independence?
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
She validates my observations and worries. She says "I know, I know, this is a bad situation."
I want to have a convo that goes beyond the excuses and has an action plan.
auntieup@reddit
I hope you know you’re a really good friend ❤️
eightezzz@reddit
What she needs to do is kick him out and enjoy the money she makes from her own hard work on herself.
She needs to use tough love on this parasite, or she'll continue living a miserable life, and he will go nowhere after she is gone.
auntieup@reddit
I hate to say it, but if she does manage to make him leave, she’ll either financially support his life outside of her home or leave everything to him when she dies. And he absolutely knows this is what she’ll do.
She will almost certainly die before he does. He can’t really lose.
Usalien1@reddit
So much this. I wish I could upvote it 300x.
z44212@reddit
She likely feels responsibility for how her son turned out. Layers and layers of guilt. She's not going to kick him out. Her first reaction will be to hold on tighter.
You're right. She will continue to be unhappy and he will amount to nothing.
Roundtable5@reddit
She’s an enabler.
Ok-Abbreviations9212@reddit
You can't help her. It's sad, but true. She knows her son is a jerk, but at 31.... how will he ever change?
The 31 year old likely is depressed. Who wouldn't be at 31 with no friends, no job, lives with his aging mother, and has no life outside of her. That likely explains the insults to his mother as well. Plenty of people with depression are sort of miserable people.
Depression is treatable. The only way you might help your friend is convince the mother the 31 year old needs to be on drugs, or some other form of treatment. Generally that's anti-depressants. If one doesn't work, try another. If they all don't work, try TMS.
PappyBlueRibs@reddit
Side comment - this reminds me of the book "A Confederacy of Dunces", about a 30 yo unemployed delusional slob who lives with his mother and complains all the time.
It's an extremely funny book! Read it to see the funny side of this situation.
Jobu-X@reddit
I came to say the exact same thing. This guy is a real-life Ignatius J. Reilly, from the inability to hold a job to the excuses as to why to the yelling at his mom.
Naive-Beekeeper67@reddit
Your friend is going down a rot hole totally of her own making.
She needs a psychologist, not a psychiatrist.
Just tell her firmly "No. I will not be looking after your son. He is 31 yrs of age now! He needs to look after himself. He is well into adulthood"
And i would not be having him come on outings with you both. Stuff that.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
Is there much of a difference besides one can prescribe drugs?
Tonya_Stark@reddit
I want to clarify something that people keep commenting on that is 100% false. Psychiatrists absolutely can do talk therapy. It is true that they are more difficult to find than those that work with psychologists and other therapists to manage medicine.
While a LMFT for example could be perfect for some, a psychologist for others, psychiatrists who do talk therapy can be a substantial benefit for the right patient. It just depends on the needs of the person.
UrchinVT@reddit
A psychologist will do therapy which is what she needs. (In the US) psychiatrists just diagnose and manage medication.
I’m so sorry. She is being manipulated and needs to face it and develop coping skills.
z44212@reddit
You bring up a good point.
OP - make other friends.
This friend may very well choose her dysfunctional existence over your friendship. Find other people you enjoy being around.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
I do have other friends. Her son has caused me to spend less time with her over the last several years. At times I go months without contact. This is a cop out I know but when she is constantly texting him "going to be late, sorry, take the roast out of the crock pot."
It makes me sad and angry. In your 60's you shouldn't have to deal with stuff like this.
They are like sanford and son, except at least LeMont worked and took care of Fred.
z44212@reddit
Good.
Lots of good advice here. I hope some of it helps you.
Junior_Ad_3301@reddit
Nope. Not normal. You help prepare them and then you set them free. Push them out of the nest and they will be fine. If not, then maybe regroup, but what's happening in your friend's house is unhealthy for all involved.
Blackgurlmajik@reddit
Mind your business. I get that you care about your friend, but you probably arent the first person to try to talk to her. That is her son, and she is getting something or some things out of her behavior and this seemingly unhealthy relationship with her son. I would continue to enjoy HER company and i would give her a firm no to the question of you looking after him. She's trying to delay the inevitable. He WILL have to figure things out on his own eventually.
nutmegtell@reddit
They are enmeshed and it’s very very unhealthy. I don’t know what I’d tell her except no, I can’t take care of him.
Bitchface-Deluxe@reddit
I’d be like, “Hell no, I never gave birth or agreed to adopt anyone, especially a grown-ass adult that you have enabled his entire life, doing neither of you any favors. Why the hell would I want to sign up for that?”
Various-General-8610@reddit
Yeah, it's not like this man child is a puppy, or a 8 year old boy who requires adult supervision.
This is a grown man. Mama needs to cut the apron strings, and evict the lazy ass son.
TJ_Fox@reddit
Just noting that clinically diagnosed depression is no joke, and certainly not an "excuse". People who haven't experienced depression, or haven't had to deal long-term with someone who is clinically depressed, often struggle (and fail) to imagine the condition as anything more than "feeling sad", which is rather like imagining, say, drowning as "holding your breath".
Chai-Tea-Rex-2525@reddit
You’re right that it is not a joke. And people battle it every day. But this isn’t about him. It’s about the mom and what she can do to take ownership of her life.
TJ_Fox@reddit
I was mostly responding to OP's comments that the son has clinical depression and later that "I don't buy the depression excuse".
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
I battle depression. Who doesn't ? I still function as an adult. I do think something is wrong with him but I feel it does not justify not working. I know several people with adult kids with autism. That's totally different. Matter of fact the autistic kids have jobs at ages 20-27. My friend's son is quite intelligent, can do calculus but the depression is what he says holds him back.
soundwavepb@reddit
There are levels of depression and it presents differently in different people. I'm not saying he does or does not have depression, just that it can be different.
I have, what I like to call, spicy depression. That is, treatment resistant major depression. I'm also very driven and, despite basically flunking high school (I got a bare pass) I have a degree and a career now, although a lot later than some.
All of this is to say, yes and... Sounds like it does hold him back. But at some point you have to kick the bird out the nest. Maybe come up with a plan along with your friend that can make her feel more comfortable with some tough love? Like fake cutting him off.
Kick him out, but keep in contact. Unless he's about to die, leave him to his own devices - be an invisible safety net, don't let him know that it's there. If he's going to fall, let him get a bit of wind in his hair before you catch him. I'm not sure if this makes any sense...
wizardyourlifeforce@reddit
I have suffered from extreme depression and it never made me yell at the people who were supporting me
onekinkyusername@reddit
You are a very good friend, and it sounds like your friend is in a tough spot, but her mollycoddling has created this unhealthy co-dependency. You might start by acknowledging her love for her son, but gently point out that her enabling and lack of boundaries may be hurting him long-term—it’s unusual for a grown man to still be living at home. Remind her that encouraging him to find his way, interdependently, could be the best thing for his growth. She may not want to hear it, but it’s crucial for both of their well-being. If you have a mutual friend who’s a therapist, an intervention just might be what she needs as the sound of more than one person who cares can be more persuasive.
Final-Beginning3300@reddit
You don't have that conversation. It's not your place to tell her what you think she needs to do with her son. I don't think it ever goes well when someone criticizes a woman about her parenting skills. Their relationship is what it is and unless she's specifically asking you what she should do, you're over stepping.
cmb15300@reddit
I don’t have any children but I do have a mental illness, and I collect disability for it. But here goes:
First, it should be noted that having depression doesn’t mean that he shouldn’t be expected to follow some rules and respect boundaries: this means for example that he should be expected to do some chores and undergo available treatment
As far as getting disability payments (assuming this is the US) I did get SSDI the first time I applied, but I’m aware that getting on SSDI is akin to spinning the wheel or buying a scratch-off from Kwik Trip; many people in worse shape than I am have had to undergo years of appeals. And if he hasn’t had much of a work history his only other option is SSI, which is a smaller benefit amount and has different rules
I emphasize of course that having any mental illness doesn’t give one license to treat other people badly, again your friend has every right to set reasonable boundaries
Best of luck
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
I know attorneys who specialize in SSDI. I hear no one gets approved the first time. Congratulations that you did. Her son has to try to look into it. The depression and migraines , neurodiversity could amount to maybe some money.
Lopsided_Panic_1148@reddit
If he has never worked he will not qualify for SSDI, because that is based on work history of a certain number of years. However, he could qualify for SSI, which is for disabled children and adults who have never worked. Two different programs, two different requirements.
Waverly-Jane@reddit
I think it's very unlikely there aren't psychiatric, developmental or even physical problems going on with this 31 year old. You don't have to agree to help her, but don't assume anything about how hard the path has been, or the things you don't know. You're right to suggest professional help as a friend because professional intervention is needed. She's kind of right you may not fully emphasize.
emccm@reddit
She raised this man. Read that again.
This is an incredibly dysfunctional relationship that has been 31 years in the making. Noting you say or do will change it. If there’s a victim here, it’s her failure to launch son.
BetterBeeReady@reddit
If you want talking points, or if you are close enough to just tell her what to do, try inputting her situation into Chat GPT’s free app. Tell it to talk to her like a therapist. It is incredible. And free!
Popcorn_Blitz@reddit
Nope, you don't touch this one unless you are ready to walk away. That's a long long history to undo. There's undercurrents to this you can't know.
Sometimes it doesn't matter if you're right. Most likely there's nothing you are going to say to her that she hasn't already heard. You're not going to be the ray of light that finally got through the darkness.
If you want to be supportive wait for her to bring it to you and then offer her your very gentle input. Otherwise try to make plans without the kid around.
CoatNo6454@reddit
It seems like she wants to talk about his inability to take care of himself with you, and she’s throwing out a life line by asking you to take care of her son when she passes. But she’s also defensive of their codependency. That’s a huge ask, and a definite NO. Not your circus, friend. He can collect disability when she passes.
sadtastic@reddit
This is pretty much the plot of the movie Cyrus.
TheRealJim57@reddit
She needs therapy. That is not a healthy family dynamic, and she's hurting herself. Kid needs to get the boot, ASAP.
zippyphoenix@reddit
I would genuinely start putting space between you and her. Her enabling is going to drag her down and she’s going to cling to you, which will not make her do the therapy that needs to happen before she gets that hip replacement. She needs to do that so her son will take on that responsibility, not her friends.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
I'm relocating soon. It's really what prompted me to post cause I'm worried that when I leave she will not have any friends. Her law practice has suffered. You can't meet demands of clients when you have a baby at home.
BigFitMama@reddit
Some folks never find out they are driving their mom to an early death by using them as a wheel to take care of them.
Until they just drop dead.
Or suddenly the child or family has to switch to bring their caregiver.
Because they denied themselves medical care, time off, vacations, preventative care, and retirement to support the adult child.
Even IF the child is disabled the isolation of a parent becomes much like the isolation of an abused partner.
APS - is there for reports of concern but understand your friend is a willing participant no matter how dysfunctional it is. You will not be able to wake them up. You arent a therapist. And they aren't ready for help.
Except they did ask - which opens the door to find out WHY a dear friend would ask this of you. It's an open door to ask and listen.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
APS? Adult protective services? I'm learning a lot today
CommonCut4@reddit
My friend’s brother is like this except 30 years on. The mom is pushing 90 and unwell. She has a younger husband who is still very healthy but he has no intention of supporting the guy once his wife passes. Pretty much everyone is sick of his mooching. I don’t know what he can do now that he’s close to retirement age, he might wind up homeless. The best thing your friend can do is try to get him to be self supporting asap.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
Oh God I hope it doesn't last till she's 90.
LachlanGurr@reddit
I'm sure the conversation has been had. This guy requires a mental health service, maybe start with a social worker. The hard part is convincing them to accept something like that. When they know they will get someone they want it off it they will agree. This is a pretty serious mental health situation, be careful. Get some professional advice.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
The responses from this post gave me the idea of calling a social worker. Never thought of that before.
LachlanGurr@reddit
Thanks for the reply. I have been thinking about this situation and it seems unsafe for the mother. I'm sensing an undercurrent of aggression, the right social worker would make contact safely.
coffeeandcarbs_@reddit
This is not normal behavior for a 31 year old. It reads as if you are referring to her teenage son. He needs to get on disability where he can receive services and maybe housing assistance. If he doesn’t qualify, then he needs to get a job and make a plan to be independent within a reasonable timeframe.
Hometownbug@reddit
Your friends is a capable adult and can make her own decisions - right or wrong. You are in no way responsible for her grown adult child. She has enabled him for so long - kid is in for a rude awakening when mom dies.
Nedstarkclash@reddit
What a worthless piece of crap.
microgiant@reddit
You're not a parent, that's true. You're probably not a pilot, either, but if you see a helicopter upside down in a tree, you still know there's a problem. You'd be entirely justified in telling her she needs to let him find his own way now, even if it means he suffers a bit in the short run.
The_Outsider27@reddit (OP)
great analogy. I left home at 18 because I wanted to be an adult. I can't understand kids who never leave.
CannibalCrowley@reddit
She can't be helped. She raised him to be the person he is today and the consequences of those choices are hers to bear, not yours. The fact that she continues to allow him to leech off her shows that she is unwilling to take the drastic measures necessary for both her and her son's well-being.
wanderabt@reddit
My random, off the wall guess: both didn't know how to be apart, most likely both are lonely in some form. So the current situation is addressing that. Good attempt, poor solution. So, yes, they didn't have the solution between them and need an outside perspective. Therapist would be great but if that's not possible then it might just be you.
Kalena426@reddit
She is not obligated to support a 31 year old man. 31 is not a kid.
Usalien1@reddit
AYFKM? "The son's dad sends little money to support him." Yeah, because he's 31. He's not under any obligation to send him shit. Son is dead weight. The best thing she can do for him is give him a decent amount of money, if she can afford to, and kick his ass out, and tell him not to come back till he's got his own place and a job.
MyChoiceNotYours@reddit
He's definitely abusing her. I live at home I also pay rent plus an extra $300 a fortnight. I am also my mum's carer and while I'm not perfect at that job I do do my best and she does the things I truly can't do like she cooks one meal a day for us because me in a kitchen is just asking for the house to burn down. My mum is my world. He clearly doesn't do anything and doesn't even try.
FrannyFray@reddit
Nope. Not your problem. When your friend passes, he is in for a rude awakening. He probably needs it, unfortunately. Tell her the truth. You are not going to be responsible for a grown ass man.
Outrageous-Pass-8926@reddit
You reap what you sow! That man was once a boy and his mother has likely made excuses for his bad behavior for many years. He’s finally drowning her, she can’t carry him any longer. It would have been SOOO much easier when the kid was 6 and she told him “no” and stuck to it. Weak people make weak people.
lisanstan@reddit
Mind your own business. This isn't your child nor your relationship to manage.
lonerstoners@reddit
You need to tell her the truth!
DarkElla30@reddit
"I'm sorry, Helen. I've been watching you care for John as if he has cerebral palsy or severe brain problems for many years. If he had some kind of limiting disability that kept him from getting off your couch and living his life, caring for you, contributing to the household, I'd be more likely to keep a supportive and encouraging role in his life if anything ever happened to you.
Of course it wasn't ever my place to challenge you about why you test him as if he's not capable of being a grown up like every other healthy person - or why you allow him to treat you so poorly.
But, I hope it brings you a little comfort that I truly believe he's capable of working, paying rent, finding love and companionship. When there's no one to make his dinner or treat him to nights out, he'll need to find good own two feet. It will feel scary but very empowering for him to discover for the first time that he can do for himself.
Meanwhile, I wonder if your able to get a home health worker to care for you while you recover. They won't be rubbing John's back or running his bath, or pulling his crusty underwear out from under his bed to launder, but I'll feel better that you're in good hands, my dear friend."
ResoluteMuse@reddit
You say yes, give her that piece of mind, let her do whatever legal wrangling she needs to do to set her son up. When she passes. You wish her peace and you block the son.
Here_In_Yankerville@reddit
You need to give him six month notice that you're retiring and can no longer support him. Help him find another living arrangement and then cut him off.
z44212@reddit
My son has mental disabilities. Many parents like me take care of their kids until they no longer can, then all hell breaks loose. We placed ours in a group home, where he's better taken care of. Moms in the special needs community look down on that. They think parents should sacrifice their lives to their kids and don't consider what comes next.
Your friend sounds like a martyr parent.
There's a lot of guilt there to unpack. It's not your job to fix it, though. Not your circus, not your monkeys.
TheHairyHunter@reddit
That kids just a self absorbed millennial who's shitty behaviour has been enabled by allowing them to dictate their wants in a form of slavery. They need a good reality check.
FlizzyFluff@reddit
I have a similar situation with my 63 year old boomer friend. She does everything for him. Puts her health & herself dead last. I love her dearly but don’t visit much. I just can’t.
FallAlternative8615@reddit
This is sort of the plot in Stepbrothers before the Mom met the Dad at the conference. A good cautionary tale to kick kids out of the nest and teach them self sufficiency lest they be a 30 something titty baby working you into an early grave.
Even if she leaves him her retirement he will piss it away in no time after she is gone.
jeanneeebeanneee@reddit
Her asking you to take on this burden is a clear sign that she is in denial about how bad this situation is. Just the fact that she said it out loud and didn't hear how ludicrous it sounded.
An able bodied 31 year old adult, depression or not, is not entitled to a caretaker. If I were you, I would take the opportunity she's giving, and tell her bluntly that this is unacceptable. She will probably react badly, but an intervention of some sort is necessary for her to realize that change is needed. Offer to support her in taking steps to get better (therapy, drawing boundaries, whatever it may be).
GreatGreenGobbo@reddit
From my view this is her problem. You weren't here to solve everyone else's problems. Not your friend's or her kid's problems
I'm sure she knows what to do but is unwilling to do it.
Tell her once what's on your mind to get it off of your chest. Don't expect immediate results.
See if it's worth keeping the friendship.
slr0031@reddit
You obviously don’t have to take care of a 31 year old person
Happy_Saru@reddit
So likely she has some sort of trauma or guilt over something from the past and that is why she feels so beholden.
Step1. Your friend needs to get help as stated by others on her side.
Step 2. Not your responsibility but look into getting the son into some sessions as well. Is there a mirroring trauma or just plain taking advantage of a Free Lunch?
Step 3. Step back and see if you will continue to be part of their lives. There may be some fall out from your involvement in these life changes and it may not be welcome. Be prepared to not be so close to the family after this.
Fun_Flamingo_4238@reddit
If he hasn’t ever held down a job he may not have enough work Credits to get SSDI. He might qualify for SSI. but it’s not likely if she supports him.
Oceanbreeze871@reddit
You should not promise to take care of him. He’s not your responsibility. He’s a grown middle aged man.
In all honesty sounds like he has some undiagnosed stuff and needs to get it addressed. Maybe he can get on disability or meds ?
If he’s just lazy and been coasting through life..:well he needs to kind of figure that out on his own. Your friend, his mom is right to be worried, but you also can’t be taking in this adult child as a stray puppy either
Ns4200@reddit
ugh that’s a tough situation. your friend is probably undermined 24x7 and has been conditioned to have no spine.
She needs a therapist to help he learn to set boundaries and care about herself. it’s not a black and white situation, she needs to see the nuances and put them into practice.
RCA2CE@reddit
I’d mind my own business
Exploding_Gerbil@reddit
Boundaries!
Tell her No!!
Usually, I'm all for delicate, diplomatic approaches. But this situation is destroying your friend's health too, as well as rendering her fiscal, physical & MH crumbling. You would sincerely do her a favour if you made her realise, that she needs to stop treating her 30 yr old son like a 12 year old. The father won't be sending money because HE IS NOT A CHILD.
This 30 Yr old male is draining his mother mentally & financially & is ungracious, ungrateful and rude. He can claim Welfare, LIKE ANY ADULT WOULD DO. Too proud to claim, but not proud enough to leach off his mother? I'm sorry for OPs friend. But her mollycoddling has created a monster.
She clearly has enabled this behaviour but will not acknowledge or take responsibility for what she has created - a selfish, cruel, rude narc who demeans others whilst doing nothing with his life. A snob without ability or effort.
So, hard truths must be told, OP.
Maybe the friend will disconnect from you?
Good!
Harsh? Tough. But, dear OP, it'll save you money and your mental health down the road from The Leach. It's a hard No, sweetheart.
Protect yourself.
Mean_Fae@reddit
I accidentally went on a date with the version of this guy who was alone in his mother's house after she died.
It was a fucking nightmare. Not one thing had been moved or cleaned in the years since she had passed, including the bathroom. He found a way to feed himself and add to his record collection, as he did have a solid job. I just heard through the grape vine that he died before his 50th birthday because he couldn't even take care of his own health.
Maybe paint a picture for her that she's possibly created a person who will follow her to the grave in a short time. I would gently tell her that I could not care for a healthy grown adult, and one who is very unpleasant at that.
No_Zebra2692@reddit
Well, since you're not a mom, how can you possibly take care of her kid? And you of course think it would be better if his father stepped up because he, too, is a parent, unlike you.
I would just tell her that, but I've been called brusque more than once.
I think you need to be more direct with both of them because they doing their best to drag you into their drama. Like I'd have never bought him snacks at the movie theater (I don't even buy them for myself), and I would have asked him why he's criticizing him mother's career choice when he's never made any himself.
If your friend tries to make plans, ask her if they will be interrupted by her son, and if so, maybe you'll catch her another time.
Tiptoeing around the situation really isn't helping you OR the mom, she's probably thinking if you agree to take care of him, then she hasn't been in the wrong this whole time.
Fritz5678@reddit
Say no and butt out. I wouldn't get involved with that situation with a 10 foot poll.
Strangewhine88@reddit
I have three friends in almost identical situation with abusive children, ex husbands that are not helpful, etc. There’s little to be done that hasn’t been tried except deadlines to move out and allow the adult kids to flail and be homeless.
MaximumJones@reddit
A thirty one year old, lives with his mom, becomes abusive when he doesn't get his way.
This is the exact plotline of the The Joker starring Joaquin Phoenix. 😎
I definitely would not agree to look after him.
WGAS-26@reddit
My BIL is this type of a sponge. He’s 46 and expects his mother to pay for everything. It’s a codependency relationship for sure. No matter what you say, things will not change for her. Stay as far from him as possible.
Tx_Atheist@reddit
You don't understand because in whatever way you became so, you were prepared for adulthood.
You dont have the 'conversation'. But i would suggest letting it be known to her ( if / when she mentions it ) that you are not interested / available to parent her grown-ass man-child...in no uncertain terms.
tcrhs@reddit
Urge her to require her son to seek treatment for his depression or she will cut him off financially. A combination of medication and therapy will drastically increase his quality of life.
NorCalFrances@reddit
Unfortunately, I think you need to set a boundary with her and taking care of her adult son is on the other side of that boundary. Beyond that, if you cannot convince her that she's being taken advantage of there's little you can do until elderly protective services can become involved.
ParticularCurious956@reddit
I have kids and do not understand this kind of enabling parenting. Based on the people I know who have been through this, it's unlikely that either of them will change until outside forces require it. Unfortunately that's usually through disability or even death.
Prestigious_Fox213@reddit
No is a complete sentence.
As a parent, of course I want to know that my kids will be okay once I’m gone. This is why I am trying to set them up with a decent education, some life skills, and some good habits.
If your friend doesn’t feel like guiding her son towards independence, that’s her decision as a parent. But she, and her son, cannot expect anyone else to carry that burden.
You don’t owe her any explanation, but if she pushes for one, I would provide it.