Anon on game engines | TheaterFire

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Upper_Current@reddit

Anon would have been the type to insist that videogames continue using cartridges instead of jumping to cds

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joe1up@reddit

Solid state storage has never been cheaper. Unironically 100+ GB sd card based cartridges would be better than discs for larger games.

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https://hiepsibaotap.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/img_1673.jpg

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=nes&iax=images&ia=images&iai=https%3A%2F%2Fi2.wp.com%2Fwww.retrobitgame.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2019%2F06%2FNES-FINAL2.png%3Ffit%3D1080%2C1080%26ssl%3D1

We had both here.

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Londtex@reddit

Intriguing that europe got both of them. After the day though they are the same system. The cartridges are compatible with each other with an adapter. The NES side loader is a iconic design and a good looking system imo, but the reliability of the connection is terrible.

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Michigan_Jones@reddit

Never knew about the cartridge adapter. But in my case, they werecway cheaper (and available) than the NES ones.

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Unreal is not just about cutting costs. It's about hiring and time to get up to speed. Teaching people to use your own proprietary engine is infinitely more difficult than hiring someone with unreal experience now working in unreal on your project.

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Milos-H@reddit

That’s what I meant with “cutting costs”, overall it will be cheaper to make a game with Unreal, even more if we take into account the amount of outsourcing that takes place in the industry nowadays.

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grizzlor_@reddit

making an in house engine makes a game stand out more by giving it the feel and look that the developers want for their game, not to mention they could be able to do things that aren’t possible with any other engine

I don't think you realize what an undertaking it is to make a performant game engine in this day and age.

You can get a huge difference in look & feel out of the Unreal Engine. If you just want to develop a game (and deliver a reliable product on time), developing your own engine these days is crazy.

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_Khaos_@reddit

Except jumping from something like the fox engine to ue5 is like abandoning cd's for cartridges

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The_Krambambulist@reddit

I don't get why. Using a more broadly used solution instead of creating and/or maintaining your own engine is not the same as using outdated technology. The in-house engine might even be a better fit to your own games and the superior technology. However, it comes at a cost and is less broadly available knowledge.

And the amount of parties invested into a properly working engine and more broadly available knowledge might of course mean that Unreal can get a lot better than whatever these parties do seperately.

I wouldn't say it is a cartridge vs cd situation though.

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jshaultt@reddit

Unironically he is right about the FOX ENGINE. It's one of the best engines out there with a fuck ton of potential. MGSV looked amazing while being able to run on a shitbox at 60. To top it off it has great character and car physics it feels incredibly smooth and satisfying to play.

It was only used for that game and the....erm Metal gear survive...Great job konami!

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EntrepreneurMinimum6@reddit

They tried to use it in a football game and probably ruined the franchise

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Technical-Revenue-48@reddit

What game?

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EntrepreneurMinimum6@reddit

PES 2014. They tried to implement the Fox Engine because of the new gen consoles and they failed miserably and pretty much ruined most of the goodwill the fanbase had in the game... It took like 3 or 4 years to get a solid game with that engine.

Only thing I knew about PES 2014 was that it was the last game to be made for the ps2

WTF there was a PS2 game released in 2014?? The PS4 came out in 2013 right?

This is like an NES game being released after the N64 launch

^(actually fewer years between NES->N64 than PS2->PS4)

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EntrepreneurMinimum6@reddit

Yeah man it was disastrous.

One thing that always keeps me awake at night is the thought of PES 2014 with the PES 2013 engine, that might've probably been the best football game of all time

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edoCgiB@reddit

In-house engines will always be tailored to the games they were developed for.

Just because you have a good experience as a player, does not mean the engine is good if it takes hundred/thousands of hours to iron out bugs. Development time is both limited and expensive.

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Hawt_Dawg_II@reddit

The fox engine really wasn't that special. The driving in MGSV was notoriously weird. I think the most remarkable thing in that engine was the magazine physics.

Realistically, performance will eventually get better once unreal becomes a standard because of how common it'll be, meaning it'll develop faster and consoles and PCs may even start being made to natively work better with it.

Standardising things has historically been pretty beneficial, if sometimes a little boring.

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Soft_Cable_39@reddit

I think studios might start making modified versions of base unreal engine. But engine development is a major part of studios so the employees specialised in that will be affected a bit

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Nexii801@reddit

Shitbox being?

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honorio2099@reddit

it was used on the P.T Silent Hill's demo of Kojima aswell, the graphical level of that shit when it came out was amazing

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TerryFalcone@reddit

I do agree that it made MGSV look amazing, but unfortunately, it couldn’t handle more than 12 enemies on-screen at once. I once tried putting more than 12 unconscious ZRS soldiers in a room and their bodies kept disappearing in smoke when I walked away a small distance.

It also doesn’t seem to support AI soldiers fighting. I saw a post a while ago where someone made a Soviet soldier NPC technically friendly, but upon getting an alert status, he still fired at Snake. There was no chance of getting a big battle between a squad of DDs and Soviets, which was extremely unfortunate

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demfridge@reddit

right, i forgot about that but at this point i assume that it is because of how heavily modified it is

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DickHydra@reddit (OP)

Exactly, especially in the case of Microsoft and their reliance on contractors. Also takes work load off of the studio.

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muklan@reddit

You can outsource the job, but you can't outsource the responsibility. Look at what went down with Too Human.

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Studios aren't meant to be run by c suite execs who don't know what an engine is or why is necessary. To them, they hear how fucking expensive it sounds and demand someone further down the pole cut costs and you end up with franken engine 3 years later. Once again, mid level management doesn't get held accountable. I say fuck em all, get paid and do nothing. I wasn't gonna buy the next Microsoft owned game anyway. Good luck Bethesda, id, etc. You're all dead to me.

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ArceusTheLegendary50@reddit

Studios aren't meant to be run by c suite execs who don't know what an engine is or why is necessary.

I am a software engineer, and this is basically the story of my life so far. Boss is a scientist who repeatedly tells us he doesn't understand programming, and yet the entire software team is accountable to him. You'd be surprised how underrated soft skills are in this profession. You really can't grow if you don't learn to water everything down for anyone who doesn't code.

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BobertRosserton@reddit

Working for a manager who doesn’t understand the field he’s managing is like working for a child who needs you to explain how the world around them works.

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ArceusTheLegendary50@reddit

That's basically everyone with an MBA tbh

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AlternativeEmphasis@reddit

Speaking from someone who got into the profession since COVID some companies are frothing over soft skills because they realise they have an entire generation of management and employees who can't communicate effectively with each other.

I've for sure noticed it. It does shock me sometimes talking to some older devs and the way they struggle to talk. For the record not everyone is like that for sure. And yeah dumbing it down for someone is a herculean task for them.

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PiscesSoedroen@reddit

And that 6 month period is just so the company doesn't have to pay out more than just the base wage

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Pepperonidogfart@reddit

Tencent is the owner of Unreal. They probably have some incentive structure for executives that switch. The Chinese government wants a back door into your programs and this is how they will do it.

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Wintergreen61@reddit

40% owner, not that I trust Tim Sweeney either.

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Watapacha@reddit

i mean, there are plenty of modders bethesda could hire... to make em tiddys big

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FeeblyBee@reddit

bethesda could hire

Why? Then they would have to pay them. It's better to release an unfinished product, and modders will complete it for them for free

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BringBackSoule@reddit

it's the year 2028. Every game is made in Unreal engine 5. TAA is the only antialiasing method left, because all the other effects like lighting/shadows/ambient occlusion/denoising depend on it. All games look like vaseline has been smeared on your monitor and you will like it.

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Muscle_Bitch@reddit

Rockstar will keep doing their thing. Setting the bar at a level that the rest of the industry takes a generation or more to meet.

It's been 5 years since red dead 2 and the only game out there that holds a candle to it in terms of visual fidelity, attention to detail and gameplay is Last of Us 2

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krixxxtian@reddit

Red Dead 2 looks good but it's not the best looking game of all time lol. Not even on ps4.

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BringBackSoule@reddit

womp womp

Red dead 2 uses TAA aswell.

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That, and most inhouse engines are a clusterfuck of old code no one really understands because the people who wrote it are long gone and they didn't annotate anything, so the little change breaks it.

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yeezusKeroro@reddit

Senior staff are leaving in droves. They're asking guys who are starting families and starting to age for 60-100 hours of their time per week to make a game that some corporate exec or money-grubbing shareholder sucked all the soul and passion out of in favor of trying to make the most broadly appealing, risk-averse, profit-generating game possible. The remaining senior developers' loyalty is rewarded with layoffs because the business guys see them as a big annual paycheck rather than someone with irreplaceable expertise.

When you add the fact that more than half of your staff are contractors that get replaced every 6 months to 2 years, the transfer of knowledge is severely hindered.

EA, Activision, Blizzard, and Ubisoft all started as small, passionate teams until they started making that Madden, Call of Duty, World of Warcraft, Assassin's Creed money and they ballooned from development studios into massive corporations. And if there's one thing you can't corporatize, it's art.

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WhoTheHeckKnowsWhy@reddit

Easier to hire people who already have experience with UE than teach them how to use an in house engine

this, and Epic being such a giga monopoly in the game engine space probably means their licencing rates are very favourable... Even to AAA beancounters.

Either way CDPR perfectly outline that while the RED engine is impressive, the cost and loss of training people to work with it in a high turnover industry was becoming onerous. Sure they could be doing things better, but that's their logic and it makes sense.

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A_Blue_Potion@reddit

That's why I just stick to homebrew these days. I just can't bring myself to develop on newer systems. It all feels too easy or cheap.

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SaulGoodmanAAL@reddit

True developers use TempleOS

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Bolts0806@reddit

the unreal engine is not only more powerful than the engines listed, but also more versatile and easier to program in. they’re switching because it can make their products easier to work with

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In this case, it's a fundamental limitation of how the engine is designed to handle coordinates.

In the CE, there's always a fixed zero point to which everything refers. That's why they can do persistent world objects. But it also limits the size of the map because of float precision. Basically the old Minecraft Far Lands issue, but much much closer to home. That's why Starfield maps were comparatively small.

So it doesn't matter how much procgen they throw at it, they're limited in size.

There's also an issue I understand less that has to do with all "instances" of the world being on technically the same grid. So changing something in one after (like building in the vault 88 FO4) affected the outside world, "removing" certain parts of the map from NPC pathing. Only scaled up by the difference in map size.

There's apparently more issues with CE, but there's videos on that. Because of how fundamental on the design level they are, resolving them would be as much work as just writing a new, different engine from scratch.

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sartres_@reddit

The float-limited map size is a fixable problem. Star Citizen (lol) has done it, without changing engines.

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dirschau@reddit

I mean, a lot of games don't have that problem.

But Bethesda allegedly spent 8 years on Starfield and didn't fix it, despite it being a core limitation to the core concept of the game. Instead, they worked around it, kneecapping the exploration aspect.

In other words, I wouldn't hold my breath for them fixing the engine.

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wahchewie@reddit

What do you get from saying that ? Do they pay you?

As someone who has actually worked with various game engines, unreal is not this utopian dream people think it is. Godot and unity currently have a greater usage in the industry and there are many reasons for that

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RoshHoul@reddit

What? Come on now, lol

Name 3 big games made with Godot. Name one AAA studios developing on Godot. I love the engine, it's fun and functional and I use it for my own current project, but greater usage in the industry than Unreal? You are talking out of your ass

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wahchewie@reddit

Meh, big games is subjective, but fair to say the big guys like ubisoft and ea are not using godot,

It depends on how you apply the metric, but here's a source that shows godot has overtaken unreal this year. That's what I'm referring to.

https://gamefromscratch.com/game-engine-popularity-in-2024/

Also when talking about big releases, at least recent ones.. hopefully not the direction we continue going in. Games made for shareholders, with all of the passion removed.

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PorblemOccifer@reddit

Measuring game engine popularity by their usage in game jams when discussing game engine use in industry is intellectually dishonest. In game jams the games don't have to be maintained or be supported in the long term. They don't have to be hired for beyond the 1-5 enthusiasts who make the game once and forget about it.

In industry you have the complete opposite problem. Industry will happily take entrenched jank over new jank just because of developer availability, vendor support, and global knowledge base.

It's the same in web dev with React vs Vue/Svelte and programming with C++ vs. Rust. You have the actual industry standard vs what hobbyists love and _want_ to become the industry standard.

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wahchewie@reddit

Not deliberately trying to be dishonest. Fair points.

I may be biased because I was personally very frustrated with the unreal engine 4 hell we seemed to go through last year with small teams. Terminator resistance being on UE4 broke me man. Just hoping for less of that.

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RoshHoul@reddit

UE5 made a huge jump from 4 in pretty much every aspect. Performance, out of the box tools, UX, documentation, etc. I'd strongly suggest giving it another go.

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RoshHoul@reddit

big games is subjective

In the industry, big games mean budget and that is a pretty objective measurement.

Godot is great for game jams, great for small scope projects, but it stills lacks in a lot of places when you are looking for scalability and maintenance. The landscape is full of one off indies and game jams and your link accounts for those. Such metrics are honestly not relevant for serious game development (and by serious, I mean you plan to make games as your full time job)

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wahchewie@reddit

Fair point. I take it on board.

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source 2:

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wappledilly@reddit

id Tech.

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Icy_Magician_9372@reddit

Now they can do mass layoffs and mass hires with only a fraction of the penalty! :)

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I_miss_berserk@reddit

look at that the real reason why.

Now when they fire 80% of their workforce after the game is made they don't have to worry about the new wage slaves they ~~abuse~~ hire not knowing how to use their engine. Industry standards are there not for the consumer or the worker, but for the conglomerate.

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gruez@reddit

You can make an equally plausible argument about how in-house engines are a conspiracy to drive down wages/negotiating power by making your employee's skills non-transferable to potential competitors. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

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grizzlor_@reddit

Industry standards are there not for the consumer or the worker, but for the conglomerate.

While I agree with you 100% about the shitty conditions that game programmers often face in the industry, I will completely disagree about your take on industry standards.

What are you exactly wanting out of newer graphics?

Graphics wise I was absolutely happy since 2016. Games like Battlefield 1, SWBF2 or Control look absolutely amazing while also running smooth.

im a huge fan of arkane studios and their games (glances nervously at redfall) and feel like they are great in the art direction regard. I mean they certainly have an aesthetic they are know for (giant hands) but the art direction really is good. Like deathloop and especially dishonored look amazing imo. and while both games have similarly modeled people, they both look completely different. one has a neon 60s inspired look with a touch of futurism. the other is a steampunk late 1800s aesthetic based on london and the Mediterranean (for both 1 and 2 respectively). Prey is slightly more realistic but still heavily styled.

The game weird west is another great example. made by wolf eye studios, a company made by someone who helped make dishonored. and that studios newest game has a style kind of similar to dishonored but with a retro futurism vibe instead.

Drunk_Krampus@reddit

Starfield is currently Nr.15 on Nexus of the most modded games of all time despite being only a year old.

Man, its a single player RPG that is still in the top 150\~ ish games on steam after more than a year. It's /fine/

It's obviously not bethesda's best game, but it's still one of the better RPG experiences out there compared to the general chaff, there's only a half dozen studios that can put out a more compelling RPG than starfield.

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RangerF18@reddit

Bad replayability, bad scores, bad game.

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IKetoth@reddit

"stop having fun damn it"

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Randolph__@reddit

Despite what a lot of people say, Starfield is decent. Dated and flawed, sure, but it's fun. It's not everything I wanted, but it met what I wanted from it.

There are some unique parts of the game that I really love. Zero g combat for one.

The only other game that does zero g FPS combat in the same way (better) is Star Citizen, and that game is over a decade in development and will probably fail.

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EtheusProm@reddit

"Anyone can be a winner if you set the bar low enough."(c)

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anthonycarbine@reddit

15th is dogshit for a Bethesda game on Nexus considering all others are the top 10 and it can't even beat Morrowind which is a game almost no one plays

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kuenjato@reddit

Compared to Skyrim it was a massive flop. Bethesda will never match what they had in 2011 on any case, there games are 15 yrs behind in design and they run on gamer nostalgia fumes more than anything else.

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Realitype@reddit

Compared to Skyrim it was a massive flop.

Skyrim is literally in top the 10 best selling games of all time. By that metric almost every game is a flop.

But if you actually look at things realistically, Starfield was financially successful for Bethesda.

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mymemesnow@reddit

I have very high hopes for ES6, they know what people think and they know what made Skyrim so amazing. They could make something great.

However if ES6 isn’t better than mediocre I’ll lose all hope and love I have for Bethesda.

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DickHydra@reddit (OP)

Unless they completely change the formula with ES6, I can't see how they'd mess this up. It's a different game than Starfield, meaning you can't make the mistake of having 1000 planets or whatever.

But yeah, the writing is a whole nother thing.

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EtheusProm@reddit

Don't underestimate Tood, he'll make TES6 into Battlespire 2 and have a 1000 shitty generated worlds with one village of 4 houses each, all accessible through your massive time- and resources-sink home.

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Weeb_twat@reddit

Unreal is somewhat easy to use to create mods of existing games. From the top of my head I can think of Squad, plenty of mods that add new guns, models, and even the full conversion Star Wars mod that looks like what Battlefront 2 could've been.

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mymemesnow@reddit

It won’t, Bethesda is most likely use Creation engine 2, I find nothing to suggest otherwise.

Anon is spreading misinformation.

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Dry-Committee-4343@reddit

Modding was so prevalent in earlier Bethesda games because the creation engine had tools to mod the game, unreal engine will not have those tools unless Bethesda decides to make custom modding tools for their game. UE games are not known for their modding capabilities.

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sippyfrog@reddit

From my personal experience, not good. Most of the unreal engine games I have played have been severely under-modded due to the technical difficulties of doing so.

Basically the easier it is to do the more you'll see, and less when it's harder.

Some of it's on game devs too. Some devs release amazing modding tools and extremely well documented APIs for modding and some actively try to make it hard to mod their games, or half-bake a tool once they learn players are modding that unintentionally makes it harder.

Factorio is the gold standard for moddabiliy IMO, it's on a custom engine build just for the game, and has its own bespoke mod manager and well documented modding API. I'm an absolutely trash programmer and even a hobbyist schmuck like me can make quite game changing mods in it.

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MetaCommando@reddit

Hell Blade and Sorcery hired some modders

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nuuudy@reddit

How will this effect the es6 moding scene?

When it comes out in 2050? Idk, by then we may have some help with brain chips or something

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MiruCle8@reddit

Why make a proprietary game engine if you can hire people who are good with an engine that already exists?

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xjrsc@reddit

because your proprietary engine is likely better suited for the game you're trying to make. What other reason did you develop it for?

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truedeathpacito@reddit

Yea but then you have to have teams to further develop and maintain the engine and teach everyone about your engine, with how inflated game budgets and development times have already gotten is it worth it?

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xjrsc@reddit

Yes, it is worth it because it will lead to a better product.

The thing is unreal5 has a ton of canned assets and is reportedly easy to work with.

I think modding disappearing is about as likely as pirating going away.

When did skyrim come out again?

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InternationalFrend@reddit

All mods I mentioned were out in 2015

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Omegawop@reddit

Uh huh. Okay.

Well let me just put it this way. If modding "disappears" with the release of the next Elder Scrolls, you are right. If there are still fucktons of mods, like there are for a host of games, not just Skyrim, than I am correct.

Let's just wait and see.

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VicariousPanda@reddit

No one is saying it is going to disappear, big dawg. We are saying that the creation engine was a huge part of why the modding scene was so accessible, and why there were so many more mods as opposed to other games. As someone who made a couple mods, I can assure you.. it was the creation engine.

Your argument about the amount of time cyber punk has been out is terrible. The modding scene isn't even close to being where Skyrim was within the same period of time. You will not ever see the same size or depth of mods in cyberpunk as Skyrim just due to the accessibility.

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InternationalFrend@reddit

Why are you so stubborn, of course there would be a fuckton of mods but the majority would be small fixes and little additional content like with most Unreal games. But the quality and scope of these Mods would be extremely lower than what we were used from creation engine.

Just tell me one(1) Unity game mod which is somewhat comparable in scope to something like Vigilant for Skyrim.

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Omegawop@reddit

Neverwinter nights. Older engines have more mods because the game has been out longer and the scope is very broad.

Again, I'm responding to the guy who days modding "dissapears" with the creation engine.

I doubt that highly as the next generation of modders will be learning on new tools in new games.

In 15 years you'll probably have plenty of extensive unreal engine mods for any game that people want to mod.

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InternationalFrend@reddit

Ok let’s hope that. I still find it unlikely, because of the Engine being as unwieldy as it is for modders.

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intoxicatedpancakes@reddit

Modders are always gonna find ways to mod games, but not only is creation engine super easy to work with, Bethesda also supports modding with an in game mod manager. Granted, you need to get MO2/Vortex and a script extender for more complex mods, CE is just super easy to work with.

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EtheusProm@reddit

The guys behind Nehrim and Enderal moved on to UE for their next project.

The guy behind Forgotten City moved his mod to Unreal Engine already and successfully released on PC and consoles.

Damn I didn't even think about that. I'm so familiar with the physics engine from Skyrim, FO3, and NV. It will be a hole to play without being able to screw around with commands.

It's easier to hire people with experience with a widely used engine. It's better to gain experience with a developer-agnostic system. It's easier to seek information from a wider network of people if you run into a problem.

yawn18@reddit

It's easier to hire experienced people who work in one game engine, than to have your own special engine that every single new person has to learn from the ground up.

Also this means they no longer have to spend money maintaining their own engine and finding ways to improve it to match the new standards of gaming as the generations increase.

ToAbideIsDude@reddit

In Bethesdas case it’s because the creation engine is a Frankensteined engine still in life support from the days of Morrowind and is convoluted and limited in function.

Unreal will fix a lot of their issues.

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LordVaderVader@reddit

Didn't Unreal Enginge create nanite technology which can create graphics with 33 million of polygons or smth like that?

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uaxpasha@reddit

Great but don’t we have great graphics from like 2015 (Arkham Knight) or 2018 RDR2?

NuclearLlama72@reddit

Why make your own engine when UE5 is going to be better than anything you yourself could produce?

Making your own game engine is incredibly difficult. You need to have an extremely good understanding of advanced calculus, physics and linear algebra.

If you're smart enough to make your own then go for it, but if you aren't then just use the superior product.

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Anen-o-me@reddit

When you build an engine and a game, that's twice as many things that can go wrong.

And it's not necessary anymore. Modern game systems have much more leeway than in the past, and UE is extremely good, better than anything you could build in a few years.

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durashka228@reddit

i just hope next fallout will finally work on something what allows vehicles

There’s only 2 reasons to make your own game engine. 1. It’s impossible to do what you want to do within the limitations of every existing engine, and 2. You want to challenge yourself for fun.

That’s it.

yamfun@reddit

What's next, should game dev invent their programming language too?

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eXclurel@reddit

Think of it like this:

is it too costly for studios to maintain their own engines

Unreal is known by many more developers. Easier to get them onboarded.

MCButterFuck@reddit

100% for more contract work

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The_Syndic@reddit

I hope Elder Scrolls does switch. Their engine is the worst part about the games, feels really dated now.

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cool_epic_bruh_gamer@reddit

when it comes to halo, correct me if i’m wrong but wasn’t the slipsace engine primarily based off the previous engine BLAM? that was used for all the games before infinite? i’d imagine it might be time for a full change due to it being outdated??? i’m really not sure how this stuff works though

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Pathogen188@reddit

Yeah the Slipspace engine was a modified version of the original Blam engine. From my understanding, between the MS hiring freeze + contractor policy, a lot of the struggles with Infinite came from simultaneously trying to develop the Slipspace engine as they were developing Infinite while also having to teach said engine to new contractors who wouldn't understand the engine until the end of their contract, where they would be replaced by someone new who didn't know how the engine works.

Part of it definitely just comes down to the Slipspace engine being old and inefficient but part of it also stemmed from how broader policies affected how 343 was able to manage staff. At a certain point, they had a very old engine that was actively being overhauled by a rotating cast of devs.

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Schowzy@reddit

Is Source 2 available for devs that aren't valve? I have no idea how good or easy to work with it is, but if it's available in surprised no one has used it besides Valve. CS:2 and Half Life Alyx look incredible.

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Substantial-Cat2896@reddit

Unreal engine has yet to prove itself if it can do a big open world like cyberpunk or fallout. The unreal test i see has not been in the main world due to fps issues

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DrScience-PhD@reddit

TES6 on unreal is the best gaming news I've heard in 10 years. put that gamebryo bullshit out to pasture.

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Kelimnac@reddit

I’m particularly upset about Delta because of how neat the FOX Engine was, it felt perfectly logical for Metal Gear to have its own engine

But Kojima is gone so anything Konami does with the license now won’t have his spark, so I’m not surprised to see them switch

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runswithclippers@reddit

I think the better question is what does the FOX engine NEED to do that makes it necessary to do in-house over UE. My guess is not much. Maintaining an engine takes time and money away from developing games ultimately, and if you can outsource that labor per se, you can crank games out faster.

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Postaltariat@reddit

Outsourcing has been a disaster, causing nothing but failures and problems for the industry. There is a big difference between works that rely on outsourcing vs long-term in-house devs

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runswithclippers@reddit

Outsourcing causes a problem when it’s only done for monetary reasons. If theres a technical reason for it, you’re going to get better results. Again, my argument was about whether you need to develop your own engine. Because MG doesn’t do anything groundbreaking that UE can’t handle in terms of physics or rendering , it’s just more overhead for Konami.

Take the game Noita, that game needs a custom engine because it RELIES on the particle system for the whole game to function. They knew they could optimize and do it better than UE or other engines, so they made their own.

Unreal is insanely customisable and powerful, and having it standardised across studios will be beneficial.

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Street-Goal6856@reddit

Unreal is dope. That's just my guess though. As long as they don't panderstone the game it'll come out fine.

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ConscientiousPath@reddit

The main problem with this is that UE is owned by Epic instead of bring free or owned by a nonprofit foundation. That means that if too many studios drop their engines and fire their engine engineers, then 10 years from now they're going to start pulling the same kind of shit on developers that Unity did because they'll have an abusable monopoly.

I really wish all the big players were circling the wagons around something like GODOT instead. I get why they're not--UE has way more purchasable support right now--but this is going to come back to bite all these publishers in the future.

Yet another indirect casualty of the short term thinking a lot of big CEOs are incentivized into by the bonus-based pay structures that they feel they have to use as a work around against the current tax regime.

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miko3456789@reddit

Halo studios put it very well in their recent video, saying that they don't have to be both a game studio as well as a tech company. That's the issue full stop I feel

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Cyonx818@reddit

I actually have a good bit of experience in this area, having worked in the industry for one of the companies mentioned.

The reason why so many devs are heading to UE is the tooling, the polish, and, quite frankly, it being someone else’s job to create, maintain, and optimize the engine.

UE is incredibly powerful, incredibly versatile, and incredibly performant if you know what you’re doing… because it’s also incredibly complex.

Epic spends a lot of time polishing up those tools and the interface because that’s their job. If you’re a dev house, even a huge one, you have to make the calculations on whether it’s worth it to you to give up 5% of your games profit in order to not have to reinvent the wheel… especially when that wheel is probably as good or better than what you can make in house. Epic hires the best engine devs in the world.

A lot of dev houses do the math on that and determine it’s worth their while to outsource the technical part and focus on the game.

You better believe that Epic devotes internal resources to making sure those big dev house customers have the support they need to pull off their vision too.

Dr_Valen@reddit

Wonder how they plan to make mods work with unreal. Creation at least was established and easy to mod. Modders are the only thing that save Bethesda games. Can't rely on them to patch stuff and keep the game interesting just look at fallout 76. If they kill the mod scene then their games are gonna suffer.

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Dontbeme9820@reddit

A company whose main thing is making a game engine would almost always produce a better game engine than something built in house except for edge case games with unique mechanics like Noita.

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FVCEGANG@reddit

Its because unreal engine is better than 90% of in house engines tbh

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PhantomCruze@reddit

Many of those in house engines are old and can't handle the upgrades and expectations of next gen gaming

That, and unreal made a deal with the Clintons on Epsteins island so everyone has to go to it so they can claim their immortality

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NixR1007@reddit

Both

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Gonedric@reddit

UE is the reason r/fucktaa exists

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k3yserZ@reddit

Oh, so THAT'S why all these 'over the shoulder' 3rd person games are starting to look the same.

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Unreal does fine. Better to standardize like this and let those designers not have to figure out the string and tape mess of in house engines.

It also means third party modders get an era of commonality again, which is super good for communities and all sorts of good stuff.

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MissDeadite@reddit

Bethesda won't do it because Unreal doesn't support modding all that well, which hurts creation club, which hurts their bottom line.

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HorusSilky@reddit

Very highly doubt that Bethesda would dump their creation engine. I have heard that Helldivers might be switching to unreal next year though..

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redditisbadmkay9@reddit

Late-stage capitalism: Microsoft, Sony, etc. continue making cost cutting measures by streamlining production and agreeing to play nice so as to maximize profits. Gaming industry has already been going the way of movies taking few risks on new IP, reducing competition by focusing on fewer products and higher budgets, collective price setting, etc.

Only thing stopping the complete enshitification is indie game production.

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