Today, we are now one short year away from Windows 10 EOL.
Posted by Jimbuscus@reddit | linux | View on Reddit | 209 comments
[removed]
Posted by Jimbuscus@reddit | linux | View on Reddit | 209 comments
[removed]
imsoindustrial@reddit
Win10 will be the last for me.
It’s just not worth it anymore with all the silly things they are doing and trying to sell as “features”.
It’s dystopian futurism and the performance requirements are the computing onus transfer.
Get fucked Microsoft.
qQ0_@reddit
Based, I switched full time a year ago and never looked back
jkl1100@reddit
you people seem like you cant never stop looking back, complaining every day about microsoft when the other companies like apple and google collect even more data
MegaGandhi@reddit
Just finished migrating my main PC to endeavouros last weekend after toying with a bunch of different distros on my laptop and educating myself for a few months. Not the most trivial thing in the world, and smug gatekeepers didn't make it any easier, but being on the other side feels pretty damn good.
Been using windows since 98, copilot was the final straw for me personally.
Get Fucked Microsoft.
Rubisrik@reddit
This exact situation was happening every 5 years in the past exemption made for the Windows 8 screwup period. This has not made Linux’s market share skyrocketed. Why? Fragmentation of the offer.
Rubisrik@reddit
Not everyone is curious or a gamer. Asking an average user to install Linux is like asking to replace your TV’s OS. It would be a very very difficult task; ain’t a PC just a simple appliance they say.
Constant-Might521@reddit
Sad part is that that problem was essentially solved with Ubuntu's Wubi (and previously UMSDOS), which allowed installing Linux onto a Windows file system just like a Windows app, without any repartitioning or other weirdness. Sadly it got abandoned a decade ago.
dare2bdifferent67@reddit
Q4OS still offers a Windows installer, so that might be an option for people who want to hang on to Windows, but try out a Linux distribution in an easy way.
kaxae@reddit
My bet is that a) Microsoft is going to extend the support for 1 year b) they are going let install Windows 11 (or some kind new version of 11) to everybody
20230630@reddit
The TPM thing isn't some secret conspiracy, it is used for better security. For bitlocker encryption for example. Microsoft wants to do that because other platforms (mac, iOS, Android, etc.) are all encrypted by default nowadays, so windows lags behind in that regard. I don't see them dropping that requirement, not officially in any case.
burner-miner@reddit
Isn't bitlocker only enabled by default on non-home editions of Windows? In any case, a security conscious person like a persecuted journalist in Iran will still achieve better security than Joe from Wisconsin, even without TPM 2.0
20230630@reddit
On new OEM installed Windows 11 it enables it for the C: drive, if it meets some requirements. ( more information ) So if you buy a new laptop and use the stock OS install, provided you login with a Microsoft account. (which is required anyway unless you bypass that)
Though it seems they are going to enable it for "DIY" installs too from version 24H2: https://www.theverge.com/2024/8/14/24220138/microsoft-bitlocker-device-encryption-windows-11-default
Alverso_Balsalm@reddit
Neither of those options. What is going to happen is some dude or group or dudes are going to find how to bypass tpm check, which actually I think is already happened. People will only switch when they software or games are explicitly required to use windows 11 otherwise they will stay in windows 10 (their best bet is LTSC IoT). People are so conformist even with Microsoft pushing that recall thing slowly as they did with copilot, ads and every bullshit that Microsoft pushes. I don't expect an enormous numbers of people switching to Linux because it's never going to happen even if Microsoft fuck up things again and again. I don't care preaching about Linux advantages over Win11 to those people because they don't care and they only want a a tool to play their games or do whatever they need. Of course Windows is a tool to get shit done . A tool which sometimes destroys itself with an update, a tool that spies on you when it shouldn't, a tool used to show you ads and install shit after an update even if you uninstalled it before, a tool that shoves unneeded stuff into your throat, etc. I only care to help to those people who already sat down and started to analyze what they want of an OS and saw how much Microsoft values them as an user. People who are genuinely interested in learning how to use Linux.
rantingathome@reddit
This is my feeling.
A ton of machines that are for all intents and purposes quite capable daily drivers will be made obsolete by this cut-off. We've known this is coming for awhile, but like most crises, nobody will get really concerned until the deadline is looming less than 6 months out. They're gonna get a ton of government pressure in those last six months to drop the requirements for Windows 11 a couple of CPU generations, or to keep security updates on Windows 10 for a couple more years. For the average non-gamer, a 10 year old machine is still a quite capable machine.
Or we're finally looking at 2026 as the year that Linux on the desktop gets a lot more attention.
Retard7483@reddit
I don’t think so, I feel like one of the main reasons for the Windows 11 requirements was to increase sales of new PCs
aitorbk@reddit
More sales and more spyware.
Retard7483@reddit
On a semi related note, group policy my beloved♥️
Jimbuscus@reddit (OP)
It can work both ways, they will have gotten an increase in sales in the leadup to Oct 2025, then last minute extended support will just be for the stragglers.
Sharpman85@reddit
Tried switching to the newest fedora 40, immediately had issues with Intel 7260 wifi connectivity. It was definitely the drivers but from what I’ve found they are imbedded in the kernel (4.1/4.2+ in my case) which was up to date. Could not find any solution and did not want to lose more time so I switched back to Windows 10. I understand that it’s an old wifi card but such devices are prime candidates for switching to Linux. Unless there is a comprehensive guide or one distro I fail to see the adoption to progress in a meaningful way. Before anyone suggests I already tried mint, ubuntu and suse tumbleweed. All had some sore of issues, mint the least but recurring update problems don’t give much confidence.
Don’t get me wrong, it would be good to have an alternative for old hardware but Linux desktop is more of an enthusiast project, contrary to server versions.
Dqdragon@reddit
What issues did you encounter? The issue I've been experiencing with the Intel 7260 is that I'll be connected to wifi and it will drop the Internet connection for a while.
Sharpman85@reddit
It did not connect at all, keeps retrying and errors out
_HT03@reddit
Linux Mint is the solution
sophimoo@reddit
i think a nauseating amount of people will pay
BobEdMac@reddit
Every branch can only bend so far until it breaks. Windows 11 finally broke my branch and I'm exclusively using Linux Mint now on my PC. I'm definitely a minority but every movement starts with a minority. No amazing changes or changing of the guard, of alas any great undertaking in the for the good of mankind started with a bunch of unimaginative people saying "Oh... That will just never happen"
The Linux community will likely be the downfall of Linux ever gaining if anything and I'd venture a guess that many Linux power users are fine with the status quo. There will likely be more like me though as time marches on and I hope eventually we'll be large enough to outnumber the naysayers.
I just look at how far desktop Linux has progressed in just the last ten years and it gives me hope. As per usual, Reddit is a poor representation of what's actually happening in the wider world.
But I'm also a dreamer so... 😬
andymaclean19@reddit
Surely Microsoft won't actually abandon all of those PCs? The vast majority of consumers are not going to throw away a working computer just to get Windows 11 and they also aren't going to subscribe to get security updates. They will just carry on without security patches.
One Zero day which hacks millions of Windows 10 PCs which are no longer getting security updates and their name is mud. Consumers won't understand why, they will just know 'Lots of Windows users got hacked because of a bug in Windows'.
I'm fairly sure they will keep distributing critical security updates for free for as long as there is a significant user base on Windows 10.
MouseJiggler@reddit
I love this. This is so zoomer-brained:
The two worst forms of demi-documentation to exist, if you ignore the existence of Discord.
Please don't do this to people. Documentation that isn't organised and that you can't reference is worthless.
ConfidentDragon@reddit
I have read "boomer-brained" and for a moment I thought your complaint will be about people not willing to watch a video or ask too much on Reddit to troubleshoot problems. That's quite realistic scenario.
Expecting people to read man-pages or Arch-wiki style documentation is completely out of touch with reality.
Grouchy_Might_7985@reddit
if expecting that is considered out of touch with reality maybe the reality of human stupidity is out of touch with having a functional society and successful species
BroccoliMobile8072@reddit
Says a lot about society when basic reading comprehension is too much to ask, tbh. It's like text isn't good enough anymore? Sure YT is great and very helpful but ffs we are talking about Linux, most everything "complicated" is going to be CLI text based anyway..
ReleaseTThePanic@reddit
I know a person that uses YouTube like a search engine.
Some people can't seem to handle not being directly told what to do either by a response under a Reddit post or a face in a YouTube tutorial.
chemape876@reddit
Arch problem? Arch wiki.
Nix problem? Everything other than the nix wiki.
It's not all black and white.
cekoya@reddit
It’s sad how true this is.
jarvislain@reddit
Don't be too sad. When I have an issue on Windows, the last place to look for an answer is anything related to official microsoft support. As a result, I always end up in a forum or whatever, most of the time, finding out by myself anayway. Even going about documentation, any documentation, Linux might beat Windows. By the way, I'm a Windows user on my home computer and I still wonder what I'll do next year. The BattlEye thing kinda made me rethink a bit about it again.
7573657231@reddit
sfc /scannow will totally fix your issue this time! I promise!
De_Clan_C@reddit
To be fair though, the arch wiki helps for general Linux configuration as well. I've used it a lot just to learn about different systems on the OS. Even as a Fedora user.
irasponsibly@reddit
Yeah, the Fedora wiki is... pretty bad. The instructions for how to install multimedia codecs are a straight up lie.
Jimbuscus@reddit (OP)
Earlier on with very little context to go by, videos tend to do a better job, with written information becoming more useful as you advance.
maigpy@reddit
what kind of whacky theory is this
Jimbuscus@reddit (OP)
Showing as opposed to telling.
maigpy@reddit
videos are for kids
screwdriverfan@reddit
Yeah, there's shades of grey between them. 50, to be precise 😉
Arkhenstone@reddit
I saw an it guy asking chatgpt to add the -v to a command they already had. Yes chatgpt just added -v in the command and the guy said "it's that. !!" I repeat this guy, develop,, and is doing IT.
EternalFlame117343@reddit
Yes, it's called having different types of learning
BroccoliMobile8072@reddit
Knew I'd find a fellow fedora user talking some sense here. Some of us are old crotchety millennials who don't want to watch a YT video about CLI. Gimme them docs baby
Illustrious-Tip-5459@reddit
Also that you don't control. Discord/YouTube/Reddit could close down your community for whatever reason and then where are all your support docs? Just completely gone?
Spin up a forum (some great FLOSS options out there) and be in the driver's seat.
chemape876@reddit
I think you are massively overestimating the security consciousness of the regular PC user. I would be extremely surprised if even 10% were aware of the implications of not receiving updates.
DonaldLucas@reddit
My main gaming PC has windows 10. I'm not going to install 11 or Linux on it, lol. And I'm among the people that know that I shouldn't do this, but I'm going to do it anyway. Now imagine all the people out there that don't know much better. They will stay on windows 10, with the same logic from the people that stayed in windows 7.
Endemoniada@reddit
Why wouldn’t you just upgrade to 11?
Apart from the task bar and the right click menu, at least the latter of which is a 2 second google away from restoring to the Windows 10 version, there’s basically zero difference for the average end user, especially as strictly a gaming PC. I did the same upgrade myself on my gaming rig, zero issues, zero regret.
Yes, there’s matters of principle around ads or telemetry, but anyone who pretends those things aren’t issues on Windows 10 as well is only fooling themselves.
Swizzel-Stixx@reddit
Ads, telemetry sure, but the TPM 2.0 chip requirement makes loads of relatively new pcs obsolete
fivre@reddit
TPM 2.0 requirement is possible to bypass with a registry edit, isn't it? im kinda surprised MS hasn't finally relented and just removed it.
being unable to use a start bar on the side of widescreen monitors is more of an annoyance for me
Swizzel-Stixx@reddit
Microsoft patched that iirc
Endemoniada@reddit
Yes, but the person I responded to didn’t mention that and seemingly didn’t point to any particular obstacle to upgrading whatsoever. Further, he admitted in his response it was just laziness.
Swizzel-Stixx@reddit
Fair enough
580083351@reddit
Older hardware isn't going to get updates to video drivers and they did make changes to the video infrastructure in 11. It's not "just" 10 with a new skin.
eriomys@reddit
Microsoft blocked older Hardware from upgrading. Eg I have a i7 4790k + 1080gtx + 18 GB DDR3 ram which still rocks on ssd and 3440x1440 games, yet is not eligible for upgrade.
Endemoniada@reddit
Yeah, but respectfully, I wasn’t responding to you, but rather another person who didn’t blame old hardware and even admitted he was just being lazy. I’m well aware of the hardware requirements.
eriomys@reddit
In this case you have to blame Microsoft, not old hardware
DonaldLucas@reddit
Lazyness.
green_boi@reddit
If you're aware of the problem then why not fix it? I don't understand.
DonaldLucas@reddit
Laziness.
sohot2000@reddit
i am running both window 7 pro 64 and fedora 40on separate drives. never updated windows 7 and never had a problem as it wasn't business critical, that said i have great anti virus and my router has great firewall and malware protection. and believe it i still get Windows Malicious Software Removal updated.i believe it to be safer than windows 11 the Microsoft virus spying on you every 3 minutes taking snapshots. But remember that i am not a gamer so some just may have to make the move or pay for extended support
bje332013@reddit
I would be doing the same as you, except the only reason why I keep Windows is to play games. Since it is no longer possible to download and use new versions of Steam on Windows 7, I'm SOL as far as Steam gaming on Windows 7 is concerned.
That is literally the only reason why I'm dual booting with Windows 11 and Linux rather than Windows 7 and Linux, or why I'm not running Linux exclusively. My laptop's GPU was designed by nVidia, so the Linux drivers suck and I thus wind up with poor performance on some games - e.g. Killing Floor 2.
Ezmiller_2@reddit
What about GOG?
bje332013@reddit
GOG is great because it isn't abandoning it's customers who resist "upgrading" to newer versions of Windows. That is because GOG gives it's customers the option to download offline installers of the games they bought, and GOG doesn't force users to be logged into GOG client software just to install games from those offline installers.
The games I bought from GOG will continue to work on whatever platform I had been using when I originally bought them, such as Windows XP and Windows 7. Unfortunately, there are titles like Killing Floor 1 and 2 that were never published on Steam.
580083351@reddit
Launchers like heroic let you run installers for stuff that didn't come from an online store.
sohot2000@reddit
Yes understand . I do mild gaming , but the kid game on TV consoles instead so i do not have the hardware problems .
bje332013@reddit
I stayed on Windows 7 past the cut off date, because I didn't want to "upgrade" to bloated spyware and adware (Windows 10 and beyond). Eventually I had to get rid of Windows 7 because $#@ Steam's integrated browser is Chrome, and once Chromevceased supporting Windows 7, it was literally impossible for me to continue playing my Steam games on Windows 7.
The same BS will happen to gamers who just carry on using Windows 10.
fakemanhk@reddit
Newer Nvidia cards seem to get better open source support, so later you might found them doing a lot better with Linux.
bje332013@reddit
My current machine is a Lenovo T480 laptop, which was designed several years ago. The GPU chipset is the MX150. I doubt Nvidia is going to go to the trouble of developing new, experimental Linux drivers for a GPU chipset like this.
My advice to to either boycott nVidia if you want to game on Linux or get an Nvidia GPU and use Windows for gaming - either by booting exclusively into Windows or by dual-booting between Linux and Windows depending on how you intend to use your computer at any given time. From what I've read, right now AMD can already give you a quality experience regardless of whether you want to do something in Linux or Windows.
FollowingStriking473@reddit
Microsoft already said they would sell extended support for Windows 10, you don't actually have to stop receiving security patches next year, my understanding is that the pricing hasn't been said yet for home users but it is really cheap for educational users at least. As I understand it there will be 3 additional years of extended support so that will bring you 2028 by which time Microsoft will probably have new versions of Direct X that don't support Windows 10 and you won't be able to use it as a proper gaming OS anyway.
Also some of those people on Windows 7 are paying for extended support too, Microsoft ended extended support in 2023 but, private companies like 0patch also sell security patches to old versions of Windows. So while many people running Windows 7 are fully unprotected, many people are also doing things to keep some level of security going.
irasponsibly@reddit
The average person does not want updates, because updates change stuff when they didn't ask
chemape876@reddit
Their loss when they become the victim of a zero-click attack
irasponsibly@reddit
Yep, but tech companies share some of the blame. By linking "making sure you don't get hacked" to "us fucking with all your settings, turning on stuff you don't want, and moving things around," they've primed an audience to ignore updates.
580083351@reddit
It's more than that.. when they frequently break working features in the culture paradigm of move fast with automated outsourced output, this can be very problematic for people using a feature, such as printing.
chemape876@reddit
Totally agree. Security updates should be separate from anything GUI related.
Haunting-Creme-1157@reddit
If you don't have anything personal, financial, or critical on the computer, there is little need to worry about malware. Worst case is that ransomware gets deposited and you have to do a total reload from scratch --- nothing lost.
chemape876@reddit
I dont think i know a single person this applies to.
jefwillems@reddit
My stepdad is still on XP
HurricaneFloyd@reddit
He cant be doing much on an XP machine. Modern websites barely function with XP era browsers.
Jimbuscus@reddit (OP)
Microsoft pushes notifications that take up most of the screen with information like this, I wouldn't be surprised if it happened on every boot from EOL onwards.
Kelzenburger@reddit
Microsoft have spend last 30 years to teach their user base to click next next next with out reading any of those notifications.
lazyboy76@reddit
MS can extend support for windows 10, and force people to upgrade to windows 11 in the time being.
SirArthurPT@reddit
Which are little to none in about 90% of the situations, and other 5% will make it worse or introduce new bugs or attack vectors and just 5% actually solves any issue. Valid for Windows as well as Linux.
And on the Windows particular case being most of their last updates privacy invasive, including Windows 11 as whole, they're better at 10.
war-armadillo@reddit
Receiving security is definitely not useless in 90% of situations. The difference between new vulnerabilities and old ones is that old vulnerabilities have been studied and can be used to great effect by malicious entities. Using a system with known vulnerabilities that won't be patched makes you so much more vulnerable, and a way bigger target since there will be malicious entities on the lookout for such users.
I'd completely reverse that figure : security updates are worth it 9 times out of 10 (if not more)
SirArthurPT@reddit
That's the myth you were being told and just believe without thinking.
You are not "receiving security", there's no such thing and updates aren't all about security.
To do a proper security update you need to check the change log, which CVE, if any, it refers to, if that issue is an issue for you or not (eg CVE-xxxx user A can override permissions to access user's B files, a very important update if you're in a multiuser environment, a pretty much useless update for a single user desktop). Isn't just apt update && apt upgrade -y
Also along with updates you may break dependencies, libA programmer out of boredom decided to wipe functionA from his lib, now all other programs that uses his lib will break.
Unreconstructed88@reddit
No more Windows 10? Then I guess I'll have two Toughbooks on Linux.
LonelyMachines@reddit
Funny that they once claimed Windows 10 would be the last Windows and they'd just keep updating it with rolling releases.
Inaeipathy@reddit
Seems like copium to me. 6% maybe, but probably not. Well, one can always hope.
The issue is that many people using their computer literally don't understand that windows isn't their computer. So many people that I have talked to don't know that operating systems are not the same as their hardware, or that apps are not always part of the operating system. There is no way these people end up switching to linux.
If linux was what came on computers by default when people were learning to use them then we would never have this issue, it would in fact make it impossible for these people to switch to windows because it would require learning a bunch of windows specific nonsense.
Mast3r_waf1z@reddit
I disagree, i had a heated discussion with another guy from uni a few weeks ago on the same topic, of why I use Linux, and why I don't think "the year of the Linux desktop" will ever happen
People don't care about security enough to educate themselves of the dangers of corporatization of software, people are eagerly, carelessly binding themselves to software without concerning themselves of whether that software is trustworthy
If Linux will ever have a chance to be bigger than windows, it will be a question of educating people on security rather than waiting for the inevitable drop in security from the standard OS.
TONKAHANAH@reddit
I see a lot of people saying they're waiting for SteamOS to become available for desktops. While I don't think there will ultimately be any real significant difference between SteamOS and other distros pre-packaged with KDE, I get that the branding brings them some lvl of comfort knowing they can trust valve (even though we all know their track record for providing a usable os isn't great compared to what we're all used to)
If valve can get SteamOS out with built in or easy to install Nvidia drivers, that 15% might be feasible.
I think if valve can do these 3 things, it stands a chance
1) update proton to support Microsoft office & Adobe suit
2) convince Nvidia to provide stable drivers that don't make users want to pull their hair out over dumb issues like dual monitors not working or high refresh rate not working with two different displays.
3) actually release the OS before win 10 EOL
580083351@reddit
Crazy that people want "SteamOS". I have an actual Steam Deck, and updates for it only come out once a year or two. 3.4 which I am still on, the kernel is 5.13, 3.5 is 6.1 and 3.6 which isn't released yet the kernel is 6.5.
TONKAHANAH@reddit
Maybe on the "stable" branch but their stable is like LTS where their beta is more like it's rolling release where it gets upsets way more often. They have a preview option as well that's more like beta. I definitely get updates more frequently than one or twice a year but obviously less often than my arch desktop
drfusterenstein@reddit
Don't threaten me with a good time.
In theory, more people will use Linux.
But in likely practice, people will continue to use windows 10 or will just install windows 11 or scrap and buy new.
Due-Vegetable-1880@reddit
I'm guessing anyone older than 30 is just going to either stay with what they have or get a new computer. I imagine a very small percentage of users will actually try Linux, and of those some will struggle and give up and some will stick with it. The only thing that will increase is noobs asking noob questions
580083351@reddit
I am staying with what I have, though I will dabble. I am 8-bit CPUs old, my daily driver is already 9 years old. I did spend the time to make a Steam Deck look nice, but when it comes right down to it, the evergreen problem of drivers and support remains an issue for many years now which is why I don't use it as my desktop (e.g., while I am not a Gnome fan, it's pretty amazing that it won't have fractional scaling until GTK 4.14, until then, misshapen letters for everyone! Like, think about that one.. Gnome has been around for 25 years already and this wasn't already addressed..)
You are right that very few will try Linux. To try requires both learning something new as well as having an understanding of what is going on. For most people it's all a black box.
HurricaneFloyd@reddit
Windows 11 23H2 EOLs 6 weeks later.
zeanox@reddit
you guys are going to be so disappointed.
Prevent_Scurvy@reddit
I don't think many people will switch to Linux because of this. As a personal anecdote however, I switched to Linux a couple of weeks ago for the very reason that windows 10 is approaching EOL. I have to use windows 11 at work and absolutely hate it.
KernelTale@reddit
I can imagine a few percentages going our way by the end 2025 but 15% is unrealistic. I think it would be like 6.8%
UnfairSpirit8053@reddit
No eol here Windows 10 IOT Enterprise LTSC I'll be using it for another 7 years
QueenOfHatred@reddit
Mhmm, I am using it for dual-boot (ah, escape from tarkov, alas), and it is about the only semi-bearable windows edition I have ever used, so I am glad it does exist.
QueenOfHatred@reddit
Honestly, for some users, IoT Enterprise LTSC is also a viable solution. Windows without... a lot of sillyness, and supported for good few years more.
Anyhow, I also do hope that Linux will continue to get more users as well >:3
pmanmunz@reddit
If history is any indication, that eol deadline is likely to be extended, at least for security updates. In fact, I have Windows 7 running in a Virtualbox VM and I'm still getting security updates from Microsoft for it.
Melnik2020@reddit
I think the majority of people will simply purchase a new computer instead of looking into options. Linux users might increase, yet not that drastic in my opinion
We have gotten so used to change to a new phone when they become “obsolete”
kuroimakina@reddit
Which is exciting for us, because it means the used market is going to be flooded with perfectly functional computers for cheap!
OkOk-Go@reddit
Looking forward to an old new Thinkpad X1 Carbon
pandamarshmallows@reddit
Do you know which gens of the Carbon have working fingerprint readers on Linux?
OkOk-Go@reddit
I know mine doesn’t (2017)
joedotphp@reddit
Yep! I'm ready to get a beefy laptop for cheap from some rich a-hole who can't be bothered to learn how to upgrade their OS.
kh0n5hu@reddit
Wiggity wooty, I'm comming for that rooty!
beardedbrawler@reddit
I'm not going to win 11. I've decided with how things have been improving on desktop Linux including gaming, I'm going to migrate.
I'm going to look on with great hope as a year of updates come for games from the likes of Valve. Then I'm done with Microsoft and hopefully will never look back.
TraditionalRemove716@reddit
I'm leaning that way but, in turns, leaning toward just keeping Win 10. MS has retired OS before but none of those events have been met with the doom this one has generated. Head scratcher.
OrphanScript@reddit
I don't think its that much of a headscratcher personally. A lot of people are just fed up with the state of technology in general. Ads, tracking, data breaches, bloat, subscriptions, intuitive cruft and blowing off your preferences left and right, obsoleting hardware too soon, costing too much, annoying you incessantly. Windows is emblematic of almost all of this and those that are looking for some kind of change may well consider a switch at this point, if only because this represents an opportunity to do so.
I don't think the boom is going to be as large as OP is suggesting, but honestly its kinda tough to say. I didn't think Steamdeck was going to do as well as it has. I didn't think we'd be seeing rumors of discontinuing the XBox this year either, but, we have.
The biggest barrier still is going to be with people (most people) who have never actually installed an operating system in the first place, who use w/e came with their computer. Those people are impossible to move unless they have some tech savvy family member with an ideological motivation to move to Linux. And that doesn't represent all that many people. But there are certainly a quantity of people outside of that category who will and are evaluating options right now, and if they are, they're hearing a lot of: Its never been easier to use Linux, its near parity with Windows for gaming, it solves all of the above listed problems, its free, etc.
themobyone@reddit
One option is if you have a spare drive or need a new one anyway.
When I switched to Linux 1.5 years ago, I bought a new m.2 ssd since they were so cheap and just installed Linux on the new drive to avoid dualboot issues. After just a few weeks I stopped booting into windows.
IfiHadaMCHammer@reddit
It’s easy enough to put Linux on a bootable USB and, after setting it up the computer, making a restorable disk image. I run Linux about 80% of the time on my computer. The other 20% of the time I’m running Windows. This really quick and easy a switch between.disk images and thus OS’s).
NicDima@reddit
I remember having a Moto G4 Play. That thing still got Custom ROMs more updated than my Moto G8 Plus I have today, but that may be something called updates and motorola... Tho I have heard about them doing it better than before
dinosaursdied@reddit
I think it will be more interesting to see how many people switch to a Chromebook. Buying a new Windows computer in this economy will be tough, but budget Chromebook have a unique space to fill.
dinosaursdied@reddit
As a person who switched to Linux because of XP EOL I am proof that some people will take a shot on Linux. I was young and simply couldn't afford new hardware. I think it's even more likely because the quad core systems of the last decade still run just fine. I struggled a bit running a single core processor on Ubuntu 13.10 but that won't be the case for most.
I think there are two important hurdles that are always tough for new users, making (and frankly understand) a live USB and hardware comparability. I really do think it's time to sell pre flashed jump drives because opening up Rufus or the like is still a huge barrier for people already feeling a panic at changing an operating system. Most have never and will never do this.
The biggest problem though is hardware compatibility. Installing Linux on an old desktop is one thing, but laptops are a much bigger issue. These rely on weirder and oftentimes proprietary drivers to make certain comfort features operate properly. In 2022 I helped a redhat developer test a headphone switching quirk for a then 7 year old netbook that was only recently implemented in the kernel. Portability isn't what it used to be.
gx1tar1er@reddit
I think the same happened to modern mobile phone (hardware: no headphone jack, no removable battery, no SD card insert) and the OS like Android is becoming more locked down, more proprietary and Google services added over the years.
Narrow_Awareness2091@reddit
The last windows.
I haven’t had a personal computer with windows since 7.
I am in a somewhat similar boat with macOS Ventura eol next year. I could oclp but I am planning Linux instead. Already Linux on 2012 MacBook Air and it does everything I need.
hazyPixels@reddit
When Windows 10 came out, I remember Microsoft touting how it would be the last version of windows and there would never be a reason to upgrade.
That didn't last long.
Jimbuscus@reddit (OP)
Why Microsoft is calling Windows 10 'the last version of Windows'
jkl1100@reddit
they never said that when windows 10 came out. it was a rumour that came out a couple of years ago.
rantingathome@reddit
Bullshit. At the time Windows 10 came out, if Microsoft didn't actually say it (I'm fairly sure they did), it was extremely highly implied.
starnamedstork@reddit
A lot of people are still running 7, or even XP. Some may move to Linux, but I don't think 10 going EOL is going to create a landslide of Windows-to-Linux conversions.
CodeCompost@reddit
Didn't read your post but I can already say whatever you think is going to happen is not going to happen.
joedotphp@reddit
Pop!_OS should have COSMIC running by then. Excellent time!
utf80@reddit
Alarming. I hope Microshit ditches her customer base by not forcing them to upgrade their system.
Linux is more likely then but MINT needs to be even more consumer friendly to compensate that.
And lol, I thought the D-Day is on 10-14-2024 😂
arglarg@reddit
I'm still hoping they are opening up the upgrade path to prevent history's largest botnet.
topsyandpip56@reddit
Due to the silly system requirements of 11, you'll see a lot of LTSB in enterprise popping up, or extended support licences like with XP. Changing to Linux for the end-user in an enterprise environment is never really considered due to the costs of retraining staff.
Sensitive_Survey301@reddit
Its not going to reach 20%.People are stupid.They are going to buy new hardware to run windows 11 or buy macs
Guilty-Shoulder-9214@reddit
I’ll probably be upgrading then. Picked up my current laptop two years ago and have been running Ubuntu on it since. It’s an older HP Zbook G3 with a Xeon 1505m and quadro m2000m. Been pretty solid, but I’ve been pretty impressed by the Victus line of laptops - specifically, what you’re getting for the price and the generally positive reviews while simultaneously having a laptop that doesn’t have you questioning if your wrist is going to snap while picking it up, one handed.
alxhu@reddit
You can switch to Win10 IoT Enterprise LTSC and receive updates until 2032
Dr_Pie_-_-@reddit
I would be very surprised if more than 10% of windows users even knew what Linux was, and that’s being very generous. That is the biggest barrier to adopting Linux as a viable option, if users don’t even know it is an option…they won’t take it up…
_w62_@reddit
It doesn't matter. Your windows computer will get slower, you get malware, your copy-and-pasted word documents will still get deformed.
OkRaccoon3399@reddit
Personally I am considering both buying a new laptop and migrating to Linux. For the first time in my life, I am thinking about buying a Mac , just to have something stable and safe for work purposes (including must have proprietary software) and just change my current Windows laptop to Linux for everyday use. I am already trying Linux Mint on an old computer, in order to learn how to use it and the experience has been great tbh.
newjacktown@reddit
I bought a mac recently because I wanted long battery life and performance. Its amazing.
My dad has an old intel macbook - its sluggish and loses much of its charm.
Point I am making, a high spec linux machine running on near modern hardware will run beautifully.
jkl1100@reddit
apple collects more data than microsoft
newjacktown@reddit
I segment my use based on what machine I am on.
jkl1100@reddit
you do know that apple is even worse than microsoft when it comes to data collection right?. you guys are complete clowns
Lestwist50@reddit
Don't push them (window 11 and 10 user's) too hard. Help them the WORD stupid is your stupidity IF you push too hard! I am a KDE Neon user for 4.5 years now and loving it. Windows 11 would not work real well, I have Dell Inspiron 5735 laptop with no tpm circuit mod on Dell laptop mother board,so what happened win11 don't wanna work because of the security mod . God blessed you guys and gals work together on KDE and others to the GNU/Linux, keep up the good work on these distros of Linux.
jkl1100@reddit
nobody will switch
gatornatortater@reddit
Not as many as we would prefer, but it is true that some already have and are. And its not like many of us didn't switch back when Microsoft first talked about junking XP 15-17 years ago.
S48GS@reddit
In 2024 - Largest corporations buying 50 million computers for 6 months.
Switch what? Millions computers?
They just buying new with everything pre-installed - no one change anything, no one have time to do it.
In consumer-market it exactly same - people buying new PC/laptop with windows11 - no one care about "old" PC/laptop.
gatornatortater@reddit
I don't really understand your reply, but it appears that your are confusing the word "some" with the word "most".
silenceimpaired@reddit
What I hear is an influx of cheap hardware.
rantingathome@reddit
Yeah, if they stick to the deadline (I think it will be pushed one or two years), I am kind of looking forward to a glut of cheap refurbs.
A few tiny form factor machines will probably find their way into my house.
N0Name117@reddit
I honestly don't feel like I'm in desperate need of anymore cheap hardware. Computers as a whole have all pretty much gotten fast enough for basic tasks that I'm still running hardware which is a decade or more old at this point and it's more than sufficient for what it needs to do. Hell, even my primary laptop is already 4 years old and there's absolutely no good reason to replace it in the foreseeable future.
silenceimpaired@reddit
I’m riding the cutting edge for the sake of AI, but overall I agree.
InstanceTurbulent719@reddit
a lot of cope, it's gonna be just like every EOL windows edition, non tech savvy people stay on the OS until they get a new computer that comes with the new OS. Only some businesses and organizations required by law will upgrade immediately after
rantingathome@reddit
Not really. When 7 and 8 went EOL, if your perfectly functional machine was still working, your free upgrade to Win10 kept it going no charge.
I have a few Windows 10 machines that are perfectly fine and will be EOL for no good reason. Sure, I'll probably just bypass Win11 requirements, but having to work around this is just BS
Between the security issue and the huge e-waste issue it will cause, I think it may end up being delayed for a year or two at the last minute.
juleemafenide@reddit
People don't even know what an operating system is, like you said they just stick with the pre-installed OS when they buy a computer. Expecting most of them to switch to Linux is delusional
VivekBasak@reddit
Wake up babe! New Year of Linux hope just dropped
TraditionalMetal1836@reddit
I'm pretty sure there is a LTSC version that isn't IoT and missing dependencies.
Specialist_Leg_4474@reddit
OMG No! Be still my heart...
cain261@reddit
People will say this is going to be like every other time, but based off my personal experience this combined with the popularity of the steam deck is going to make Linux look like more of an option for this round (it’s what happened to me). If valve is able to play their cards right and finish the PC version of steamOS before the drop off date, I wouldn’t be surprised if it starts a small movement.
The69BodyProblem@reddit
Ironically why im here. I think I'll throw mint on my laptop and see how that goes.
mina86ng@reddit
People will continue using Windows 10 long past its EOL just like they did with Windows 7 and Windows XP. GNU/Linux usage won’t increase as consequence of Windows 10 EOL.
That’s always true. Problem is that many of those new users have expectation that everything will work in the exact same way as it does on Windows and have no desire to learn.
tom-dixon@reddit
People were sticking with Windows 98 long after XP came out, even though Win 98 was a virus infested hellscape with no security, and it didn't have basic features like a multi-user environment.
OP must be young if he genuinely thinks that EOL-ing a Windows means anything to the average Windows user. If anything, they will be celebrating the end of all those annoying updates.
ZorakOfThatMagnitude@reddit
If folks have a way to activate their copy of windows and can get it to run on their new hardware, they will do it. I've had people boast that they were still on Windows 2000 and had 2 backup computers to replace/part from their existing rig. Not everyone wants the latest and greatest. Some look at their computer like a piece of furntiure rather than an appliance.
Vasant1234@reddit
The traditional desktop usage model is slowly dying. Here in the US Chromebooks have become very popular. They are cheap and now come with 10 year support. I just don't see a migration to Linux desktop happening.
gatornatortater@reddit
The migration has been pretty constant for the last 30 years. But I agree that more windows people will just stop using laptops/desktops than will switch to linux or apple.
arthursucks@reddit
This ain't my first rodeo. They didn't flock to Linux when Windows Vista came out. They didn't flock to Linux when Windows 8 came out. Furthermore, they will not flock to Linux because of Windows 11.
They'll be angry for a month, then shrug, and use Windows 11.
chic_luke@reddit
Sadly this is what happens. Companies pull unpopular and anti-consumer moves all the time. They know most users either have needs the alternatives cannot provide, or that, overall, just caving in to their requests is by far going to be the most reasonable choice for their situation and time/willingness to learn something new.
This was made even worse by the fact that a product of the enshittification of everything is that many very young users have lost tech literacy. I am 25, but I frequently do offer tech support to users of every age range. Although I am still pretty young, I was definitely part of the older spectrum of gen Z, who grew up in the early 2000's - so you know the deal, Windows 2000/XP, eMule, having to manage local media libraries and burn rewriteable CDs, etc. Then, when we wanted to play together, things were not as straightforward as they were now. Someone had to host the server, and that someone had to get comfortable with open ports, upnp, etc. Someone needed to set up the TeamSpeak server and everybody else needed to set up the client. At the easiest, everybody needed to learn how to use Hamachi as a quick and dirty solution. We learned to get comfortable with computers from a very young age, and every nerd has engaged with piracy extensively, which was a whole set of lessons on computing on its own. The younger part of Gen Z and Gen Alpha both had increasingly less reason to use computers, and they have gotten used to getting all of their content from subscriptions.
We are at an awkward point where mass computer literacy peaked somewhere in the range of Millennials and Early Gen-Z - the people who grew up with a computer rather than with a smartphone - and then it took a nosedive right after. Many of the kids and young teens I have had to assist are positively at the same level of computer literacy as the average person the age of my parents. We are regressing hard. And those who can go online are not better. The communities and Discord servers that are managed by the current teens mostly have the strictest anti-piracy, anti-modding and anti-hacking rules I have ever seen. There seems to be a culture of "cleansing the Internet from the immoralities that people older than us" have done. I don't want to sound too old, but if the future of the future is an entire generation that was raised on extremely locked-down tech and who is frankly too technologically illiterate to do anything locally and not died down to a cloud service and half a million cute proprietary wrappers that abstract all of the complexity out to the point of not even making people ever have to know what a file or a directory is (!!) and that are mostly going around the Internet doing propaganda for the same things big tech vendors get their bottom line for... this is not good news for us, it's actually the big-tech companies behind this change whose mouths are watering just seeing this unfold.
I would like to be proven wrong.
spez_sucks_ballz@reddit
Microsoft Lindows ™
Beersink@reddit
I don’t think that they’ll stick to the EOL date. It’s mainly predicated on TPM versions and I think Microsoft will relax the criteria and/or they’ll find a workaround. But if they don’t then yes, there are going to be a heck of a lot of home computers repurposed to Linux; possibly sent to the third world also.
TbL2zV0dk0@reddit
It is already possible to bypass the hardware requirements check and install Windows 11 on an old PC.
DHOC_TAZH@reddit
Yes, but 23H2 is the last point release that can be done on. It won't work with 24H2 and point releases after that. That's because of the popcnt and SSE 4.2 instructions, if a CPU doesn't support those, forget about upgrading to 24H2.
jkl1100@reddit
my laptop is 9 years old and supports SSE 4.2 lol
sadlerm@reddit
Don't all PCs after 2005 or something support this? It's basically a non-issue.
VividGiraffe@reddit
My workspace used Win7 long past EOL.
No, it won't.
Seriously, nobody in your life wants to hear your evangelical beliefs about an operating system.
Dominyon@reddit
I've already been planning to switch my desktop, laptop & wife's laptop to Mint (as suggested by OP) before win 10 EOL. I ran Ubuntu on a laptop 15+ years ago so I'm not wholly unfamiliar with the Linux experience.
Mint seems like the best choice to ease her transition and for me to not have many headaches trying to help her. I settled on a stable release as I don't have the time for constant troubleshooting these days, otherwise I was thinking openSUSE. Firing it up soon in Hyper-V to test it out beforehand.
The average user doesn't even probably know there are OSes outside of Windows and MacOS so the influx should primarily be computer literate folks I would think who are willing to learn with helpful community guidance.
ChrizzyDT@reddit
Such a stupid business decision. But it's Microsoft.
golden_bear_2016@reddit
bro you can't seriously believe this..
Business_Reindeer910@reddit
They didn't qualify some very much at all. If even %0.1 of the reddit windows haters switch, then "some" will indeed have switched :) hehe
Jimbuscus@reddit (OP)
0.41% is 1,000,000 users, +5% of those computers would be monstrous.
discoKuma@reddit
copium abuse is what that is.
Roman_EmpireSPQR@reddit
I'm about 2-3 weeks from dumping W10 altogether, I've got several machines now all with various Linux distros. Been with Windows since 3.1
newjacktown@reddit
Same boat.
My path:
Linux VM to test 2022 -> hard disk with linux install to boot bare metal and remove hypervisor layer 2024 -> get rid of windows OS. 2024
MrGravityMan@reddit
Guess I’ll just stay on Linux…….womp womp Microsoft
Frird2008@reddit
Even though I still use windows even on the machines I've partitioned Linux on, I have high hopes for Windows 12 that it'll be as reliable as Windows 10
__konrad@reddit
I still have 3 PC with Windows 7 and 1 with Windows XP (don't worry, all are dual boot)
chaosgirl93@reddit
XP was one of the last good versions of Windows. I miss it.
Ignisami@reddit
Xp wasn't good until sp2. Vista was great (imo) if you had the hardware, but most boxes that came with Vista didn't have enoug RAM to support it.
As someone with 4 gigs of ram at the time, I dodn't know Vista was considered dogshit until I spent more time on the 'net.
I still want the Aero theming back :V
aitorbk@reddit
That is because they rewrote the operating system. One of the guys who did the rewrite made some videos about it: B team made a mess.
chaosgirl93@reddit
Me too. It was neat.
MattStrationCycle@reddit
My kids will get screwed on this one, their pc's are fine and not so sure about going Linux since I might just rather get them mac mini's with an m4 if that ever comes out, if not....Pop!_OS it is.
INITMalcanis@reddit
Please keep in mind that "just google it" isn't just an asshole thing to say now: it's objectively bad advice. It was never great advice, especially as time went by, Linux evolved and a solution that was valid in 2005 might be completely invalid in 2015. But now google is trashed by SEO, sponsored results, AI-filtered information and deliberate information poisoning.
If you don't want to help a new user, you don't have to. It's perfectly OK to link to a thread you read just last week where a similar question was asked. It's even OK to just say nothing and move on.
But "just google it" just makes things worse and gets in the way of people who do want to help.
znacidovla@reddit
I love when they say google it, but you already did and you were sent on that forum/subreddit where you asked
Jimbuscus@reddit (OP)
Very often I get delivered those very comments, from a Google search.
ward2k@reddit
Was doing a search for something emulated related the other day and the top result on Googles top upvoted comment was calling the OP an idiot and saying "learn to use Google"
I never understand why a website who's primary purpose is answering questions gets so violently upset by questions
Yes I get that sometimes people repeat questions a lot but there's a good chance that this very same comment you're typing might be the top result on Google one day
jojo_the_mofo@reddit
10 GOTO 10
Forward_Front_1379@reddit
4.5% to 15-20%
Don't be romantic. This will not happen just because Windows 10 support drops. My ptofessor was still using Windows 8.1 the last year (Haven't seen her since) and even the browser she use was showing a support for this OS dropped error at the top. She didn't install Linux and kept using Windows, so peoples are not like "Oh my PC can't get new Windows updates, let's switch to Linux then."
Forward_Front_1379@reddit
India might be 15%, my country is about to hit 9% too. But that doesn't mean it'll be any sooner. The amount of people having computer in India is probably less than USA and EU, I mean rich af countries, and peoples in those countries use less Linux on their computers. Linux will not hit 15% in a short timespan like this.
godzylla@reddit
Your math doesn't account for people who are just going to Yolo on win 10 after the EOL date. My dad falls into this category. I'd wager that the lions share of folks will just continue with win 10 into 2026.
Another20TtoIsrael@reddit
Just as a piece of antedoctal evidence, hearing that windows 10 was going to be EOL in 2025 is what made me switch to Linux in the first place
nitroburr@reddit
The amount of copium in this statements is insane, people will just continue using their Windows 10 computers even if they’re EOL (trust me, I’d love them to switch to Linux, but that’s not gonna happen)
Jristz@reddit
EOL with More than 45% marketshare... I think we gonna get a new XP at that point if the marketshare didn't shrink fast enough after EOL
Mcginnis@reddit
My old HTPC was getting a bit old and wasn't going toale the cut for windows 11. I decided to experiment and install fedora with KDE. Some things aren't as polished as windows or mac os. I kinda wish there was one standard that people used for games. But despite that the games seem to run fine. Looking forward to gaming more on it
Scout339v2@reddit
Once W10 reaches EOL I will be fully moving over to linux. Its gonna be rough because ive never been able to successfully get a VM to work, but hopefully some more of my software will natively be on linux before that happens.
sadlerm@reddit
Regular LTSC Enterprise (not IoT) is not EOL in 2025 either.
CatalonianBookseller@reddit
I've been using Linux for decades but it just ain't happening.
btwwhichoneispink@reddit
I am one of these users! Windows 10 EOL finally pushed me to make the switch and I’m loving it.
Fwiw, I chose Ubuntu.
No_Gain3931@reddit
I use Windows and Linux. I'll continue to use Windows 10 where needed without any concern. The fact that updates will stop is a feature, not a bug.
R2D2irl@reddit
I doubt Linux will grow much. Some - sure. But gaming is not enough of a reason. There is a lot of software people depend on, and can't run on Linux.
I migrated unsupported hardware to Linux, and it works well, but the majority of people will just buy new hardware or will stick to Windows 10 if cannot afford anything right now.
Like, people would face millions of paper cuts and would hate Linux. My example - I used imwheel to control mouse wheel speed, and used VibrantLinux to control colors of my screen. Ubuntu 24.10 makes Wayland default, and both tools I need, don't work, and have no alternatives. So basically, even features I had for years are no longer available, it's like a step backwards. Simple features that Windows XP had are not present in modern Linux OS. How many people would tolerate it?
sue_dee@reddit
I'm spending most of my time on Linux now. The next year will be about finding alternatives to a handful of not even full applications but functions of them I find essential. I hope I can get there with Python scripts.
I would like to figure out how to float my Win 10 installation into a VM though, just for insurance. There are a couple things licensed to it that would be handy to have.
Sir_Scarlet_Spork@reddit
You show me a version of modern Adobe lightroom that runs in Linux, I'll switch right now. Until then...alas.
Dist__@reddit
not everybody switches. no updates, no problems, right?
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