You get my point though, yes? Some cars just shouldn't be messed with. The R35 did enough, bring back the old Skylines with the Inline 6 that we could mod to our hearts content. I feel the same about any classic muscle car (American, JDM, German, etc) though. Some of these beasts just need to breathe fire or let them die.
The spirit of the GTR is tunability, incredible handling, and advanced AWD. If they manage to retain all of those with a conservative hybrid setup that doesn't throw weight to the heavens, then hell yeah. I love ICE to the point I couldn't see myself buying a "performance" hybrid or EV, but I'm also not buying an R35, so Nissan doesn't give a shit what I want.
Well Jag is doing their restructuring thing. Maserati has pumped a ton of money into new models. I don't think they're dead yet, they're just revamping too. The Quatt will likely be back eventually, probably EV only. The Quatt has been around since the 60s, and it's had breaks before.
I would not lump Lexus in with Infiniti, Lexus is firmly an established luxury brand at this point that is frequently cross-shopped with the Germans. The B-tier luxury brands are more like Infiniti, Acura, Lincoln, and maybe Cadillac.
I was hoping someone would make this list because I was aware of a few but learn about a few more thanks to your comment!
Curious to also know how many of these are being discontinued again. I only know of the Venza being axed once before off the top my head,but I’m not sure about the others.
It's a famous marque that has been in continuous production since it was a Prince in the 50's. They shouldn't let it die, but this is modern Nissan we're talking about. Not good with money and make a lot of bad decisions. They're a mid-80's Japanese GM at this point.
The 400z should be all over the streets by now, but on any given day I'm more likely to spot 3 McLaren's than one 400z. That just doesn't make sense to me.
Unless they can turn their fortunes around, I wouldn't count on an R36 in a decade. Even if it was making money, they don't bank sales by model, but use profit to prop up cheap Altima repo queens.
I see quite a few 400z around me in NC. especially if I head into Charlotte. I wouldn't buy one because the price doesnt match performance, but I still see them around a lot
That's good to know, at least somewhere they are actually selling them. I'm in DFW where you see everything from a clapped out Kia missing both bumper covers and a hood, to Ferraris and Lambos in every color. But I still haven't seen a single 400z in the wild. I literally see more GT-R's and those are pretty rare here too. Saw a green/blue chameleon painted one yesterday.
I believe the spark was the unsafest car to buy at the moment with the most fatalities
My friend's wife was driving a Spark and t-boned a Highlander that turned left in front of her when she was going 45. Totaled the car, but all she had was a couple of bruises on her leg and a scrape from the airbag.
I'm not disputing it being the unsafest car, but I'm impressed with how well modern tin cans protect the occupant.
To be fair, the mirage/versa were still around 12k just before Covid. I car shopped a lot in those years and they jumped up to 16 from 12 in between 2019 and 2021.
I also have not gotten 37% in raises, in the last decade so I in theory make less now that I did 10 years ago.
You don't need to qualify that, you do, and you're not alone. The rich have gotten much richer and nobody else is feeling it, which is why this bout of inflation is becoming a sticking point in a way it literally never has been before. Wages are not keeping up.
TBF before we had the cybertrucks we had large trucks or cars and even less safety equipment. Certainly it's more safe to drive a new small car now than it was 20-30 years ago.
I was actually on a really small road one day and a great horned rhino weighing 7000 pounds, spanning the 60% of the road was oncoming. I had to drive on the literal side of the road to give myself some distance.
Sorry not rhino, cybertruck. Or was it a Rivian. Regardless I would’ve died if it hit me.
It was okay. It had a serious case of chipmunk car-ism. It was way too pudgy imo. Now it looks like a proper sedan like the civic and Elantra which got rid of their pudgy features.
I owned a 23 forte GT and personally thought it looked significantly better than the K4. Also pretty sure you can’t get the K4 with a 200hp turbo engine and a manual trans, which were the big selling points for me.
As much as I dislike Kia, the 6MT Forte GT wasn’t bad at all for what it was.
Their marketing department was asleep at the switch though, because nobody knew it existed, or else it would probably be a compelling cheaper alternative to the civic si or GTI.
I agree completely, that’s why I bought one. Personally I enjoyed the driving experience more than the SI and GLI as well. Very balanced dynamically with just a touch of oversteer at the limit, and suspension that was soft enough to not be jarring at all, but stiffened up really nicely under load. Also the engine felt much more like an old school turbo engine than either the SI or GLI, it was less smooth and less linear, which some people may see as less refined, I see it as more fun.
I was honestly kinda annoyed that the 6-speed in the Elantra N Line went away so that the Kia Forte could keep it. Still, I believe the turbo-4 from the Forte GT is coming back to the K4, just not at launch.
I'd have killed to get a hatchback Forte, but they axed it in the U.S. years ago. Still a damn good looking car though. I'm not sure how I feel about the K4 yet.
A hatchback forte with the 200hp turbo/6mt would've been great. Probably not much of a market for it but used focus STs are all clapped out with aftermarket bolt ons and a new GTI or Mazda3 Turbo is way more expensive than the forte GT sedan was.
I honestly find names easier to remember and apart from Ferrari and the GT40, the majority of iconic cars are named, whether supercars or family cars - Mustang, Camaro, corvette, corvair, Wrangler, Cherokee, Escort, Focus, navigator.
Disagree kinda preferred the only one in terms of looks. It's interior was also relatively high quality. IMO it was a ton of fun with the 1.6T + DCT. Very quick and nible. No LSD though which kind of sucked but it costed the same as the current base civic LX lol. But yeah I thought the Forte looked quite stylish.
Their parent company, Tata, has many brands.
They can afford to experiment. Jaguar and Landrover vehicles are only a fraction of their list. They will position themselves for the coming years with vehicles that are
on this list:
Nexon- Compact SUV | Petrol, Diesel | Manual,Automatic
Is it an actual downturn or is growth just slowing down a bit? I keep seeing conflicting reports about this, I think it's due to focusing on US or Global?
It could be mostly the US. It could also be that the industry is slow and inventory has just recovered from the supply chain issues. Overall though, I believe interest in EV here is low.
The batteries are losing their charge. Major hybrid producers have been ready for this for some time.
Great example are the Toyota mild hybrids running on either diesel or petrol.
Yeah, battery life is a big issue. Plus, the vehicles are expensive, most people who want one have one and the rest of us are unsure about investing in them.
That's not many brands. It's literally one brand. Tata motors and Tata basically ripped a JLR platform to make the Harrier and Safari - both absolutely mid cars that aren't cheap. If you believe Altroz and Nexon would sub the XJ and F-type on Jag's downtime you're total delulu
It’s a fluid situation mate. A huge company now slowly sticking it to their former rulers, the Brits. Look also at their versions of the once mighty Landrover.
They don’t give a rats about these once dominant
brands. Understand Indian mentality a bit, and you just might see the importance of the Tata name to them.
Do your own research.
The bigger picture of India v UK suggests that they have many ways to do it. Here are some stats to ponder.
https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2022/09/india-uk-fifth-largest-economy-world/#:~:text=This%20situation%2C%20coupled%20with%20a,no%20change%20in%20the%20ranking.
I'm not arguing for or against India's economic potential, just that Tata isn't doing a great job with JLR right now. This is cars, not r/noncrediblediplomacy
I would agree if the styling was completely different.
But for the A5 Coupe and Sportback, they basically look the exact same, except the sportback is slightly stretched, for me it doesn't look that much better to be worth a significant decrease in usability.
I agree. I never really was a fan of the sportback look, I'd rather get a sedan or wagon if I need more practicality. Not that I'm in a position to be buying a new Audi though 😂
My brother has one, it's is a very roomy car and imo better than the Rav4's, but he's had more trouble with it than his Grand Caravan (which is 3 years newer to be fair). Apparently it's just as bad on gas too.
I had one as a rental for a camping trip in the Pacific Northwest a few years ago. Engine is bland, fuel economy was surprisingly mediocre, but it had a lot of space inside and allowed my friend and I to sleep in it a few times because of the weather. Overall, good for what we needed it for but I'd never own one (I'd take a Rav4 hybrid instead)
I think the crazy part with it is just it's bad fuel mileage, the new ones are much better since they're hybrid but a 2013 4 cylinder Venza gets the same gas mileage as a 2013 Grand Caravan, which is twice as roomy in terms of cargo space. According to him it's a lot less reliable too, and I'm daily driving (bought it 9 years ago) his 05 Matrix he bought off the lot so he's been a Toyota guy for awhile.
The controls in the 2013 and ergonomic placement of them is awful. That’s our biggest complaint about it. Maybe they fixed those by the time yours came out.
Worst part about the 2nd Gen Venza is the lack of knobs and real buttons. It's annoying, but not something that overshadows the tech, comfort and excellence of the powertrain for me.
Crown Sport isn't sold in North America.
The Crown Signia that's coming here is the Crown Estate in Japan.
Similar to how th Crown Crossover in Japan is simply labeled Crown here (god knows why...they should've just kept the names the same).
The new Venza was placed oddly in their lineup. It made sense when it first launched but it quickly lost its place when they started introducing hybrid versions of everything else. It makes sense for it to go away for now. Maybe it'll relaunch in the future as an EV.
It's surprising to me that they are killing it, given the consistent sale numbers. Maybe there is just that much more profit margin on Crossovers/SUV's that it's worth taking over that production line.
That was the initial plan. But the chief enginer isn't convinced:
However, the company recently announced that it would be delayed until 2028 due to “the need to take zero risks on the performance level.”
[Chief enginer Daniele Danesin] said: “I’m not saying it’s not [STLA Large]. I think that the optimisation we’re looking for is optimisation of what is already available.” To that end, the company is also considering extending the Granturismo Folgore’s underpinnings. Danesin said it could “potentially” work for the Quattroporte, hailing two key benefits of its design: agility and a driving position comparable with that of combustion-engined sports cars.
Basically it sounds like he doesn't consider STLA Large sporty enough for the Quattroporte.
As far as I know the Gran Turismo is based on the Giorgio platform which is the same platform underneath the Alfa Romeo Giulia and Stelvio and Maserati Grecale which is a great platform, but what they didn't tell you is the STLA large is a derivative of the Giorgio platform, more optimized to also support hybridization and electrification. I'm not sure how much less sporty the STLA large is in comparison to the Giorgio but if they base it on an extended Giorgio that's fine by me and if proven to be reliable like the Giulias are, they could be a great used buy in a couple of years.
For now. The Quattroporte is coming back toward the end of the decade (~2028). But they're trying to rebrand by decreasing their offerings and dropping their entry-level models. The Levante is more expensive than the Grecale so I don't understand that, but mayb they figure the Grecal segment is more profitable.
It will be EV only so will be more of a Taycan/e-Tron GT competitor. That segment is going to get crowded because there's also the Lotus Emeya, Polestar 5, a rumored electric AMG GT 4 door, and likely a Jaguar product too with their rebranding. I don't think there are enough buyers for 7 different $150K electric luxury sports sedans. There are barely enough for 5 ICE models.
I‘m from Germany so the A4 sedan is a very rare sight anyways. People generally don’t like sedans here and the A4 Avant and A5 Sportback where much more common.
Its still sad, they were a fantastic everyday car if you live up north or otherwise need the AWD. Our family has now gone through 6 generations of them, putting hundreds of thousands of miles on ear, and never once has one broken down.
agreed, its wild it too so long for other automakers to offer AWD with more cars, Subaru wrote the book on it. Even though companies like Audi effectively invented it.
yeah, everyone has AWD now... also kinda annoyed they stopped offering manual for everything. My mom managed to snag the last gen Legacy with a manual, and its great.
The 8-Series has always replaced a 6-Series on its debut.
Until the 1-Series debuted, BMW's lineup only held two coupe models. Now, we have the 2, 4, and 8.
On the low end, the 2-Series has gotten pretty close to the 3 - to the point where it overlaps way too closely with the 4 in a saturated market.
On the high end, the current 8-Series is not unique, elegant or luxurious enough to distinguish it at its current price point.
Enter the 6-Series. Hopefully it's not a transparently marked-up 4-Series, the way the Mercedes CLE is a transparently marked-up C-Class, but I bet you that will directly compare against at least the 6-cylinder version of that model. All it needs is a good, unique design and a wider track.
Maserati is dropping old products that have hurt their image. They still have three models all released this decade. It's part of their strategy to restore their image and be more of a small volume maker.
The Levante got great reviews all around. The Quattroporte was getting a bit dated but not a bad car by any means. I think the only one hurting their image was the Ghibli.
So they have the Grecale, MC20, what's the third I'm missing?
Granturismo. The Quattroporte will be back as an EV in 2028 as soon as they decide what platfom it will use. I don't really understand why they're getting rid of the Levante though.
It hasn't. I think it also suffers from having a V6 instead of a V8. A lot of people write it off based on that alone. But it drives very well from what I hear.
The problem with buying used performance cars (muscle cars/pony cars in particular) is they’re almost guaranteed to be beat to shit by their owners, save for some exceptions like M cars, Cadillacs, and Corvettes.
You have no idea whether that 20k miles on the odo was spent on highways at 2000rpm or doing burnouts in the middle of the street at redline.
It’s not that bleak out there. And I’ve seen people that have those cars for a while get bored of the performance and mostly just speed on the highway if anything
Camaro will be back, as it has been before. They take it off the market to let it cool, revamp the platform, and then bring it back with new marketing for a new generation of consumers.
I can see the V8 coming back. Ford is doing it right now. GM just last year invested billions into keeping their V8 alive. With how low production Camaros are, I think a V8 one will be back soon enough
Maybe they'll do the Dodge thing and offer both. A V8 SS for the purists, and a Ultium-powered EV for those who want Tesla performance without the... ya know, Tesla. Possibly as a coupe and sedan, too. Something's gotta replace the Malibu on rental lots, right?
Ford offset their V8 offerings with an EV version of the Mustang. Next time you see fanboys getting pissy and throwing a goddamn tantrum over "iT's NoT a ReAL mUsTanG", you can tell them it's because of the Mustang Mach E that the V8-powered GT gets to stick around.
I’ve heard the Mach-E having the Mustang name allowed the Mustang brand as a whole to meet EPA requirements to keep the v8, but I don’t know if that’s actually factual or not.
Mustang is not a separate brand. Moreover, it's not individual brands that have to meet CAFE - it's the automaker's entire lineup, inclusive of all brands.
They've been saying it for years and now they're finally killing them. God I hope they just let them die and don't turn it into the expected fucking electric sedan. I need to get rich so I can fulfill my dream of someday owning a ZL1. And I'm never selling my 2010.
Bummer that they’re an ergonomic nightmare that you can barely see out of. There’s a reason they didn’t sell as well as other similar cars despite performing well vs cost.
While I agree with the sentiment, the general consensus for the last 8 years has been "but I can't see out of it!!"
It's a phenomenal driving experience in a world-class chassis, but GM wasn't interested in building it to buyers' tastes. The 5th gen cars had notably bad visibility, and when designing the 6th gen, they hunkered down and made it worse. Owned and dailied one for 3.5 years, and it was something I could adjust to in a couple of days, but it was a compromised car in a way that the Mustang simply wasn't.
Ultimately, it's just an hiatus again. As far as my research can tell, it's getting the axe because it was on the Alpha-I chassis, and while the plan was to initially move it to the Alpha-II with the CT4 and CT5, that's also getting phased out in the next few years for their upcoming successors on the new VSS-R chassis underpinning the current Chinese CT6. I'm guessing the 6th gen got the extra push utilizing some excess production parts from the last few years of bad sales but didn't warrant enough work to move it over to the Alpha-II in the wake of that one's cancellation too.
No, but the V8s in the Camaro sure are all the same, lol. Except the ZL1. Which is supercharged. Which means it's NOT naturally aspirated. Which was the whole point of this comment thread, lmao.
Eh. The A5 is basically the A4 but with a lift back. The new B10 doesn't seem to slope as much in the back and considering they are going to offer either sportback or avant the structure will work for both.
Yes the b10 generation has been spied already. I love my sportback. It's hands down the most underrated feature of this car and more cars should have it.
For as small as that car is on the inside, that hatch/lift makes such a huge difference in size. I was pretty close to getting a TLC Type-S at one point but they had stability bars in the freaking trunk passthrough.
One thing I can say for German cars is they really know how to make a small car feel spacious. I came from the Lexus GS350 to the A5 and I feel like I haven't lost an interior space.
And yes the liftback is the best part of this car. I can throw my mountain bike in the back of this so easy. I've made Ikea runs in this. My favorite part is seeing people's faces when I open the trunk because they expect a tiny trunk lol.
What are all local handyman and painters around the US gonna drive now that Titans are gone?
Wild to think Jaguar made it this far as a luxury and sports car brand, to then not make it in a luxurious and sports minded car industry in the 21st century.
Tundra is my guess. Looks like a Ram, probably gets better mileage than one, hails from Texas and has great rebates on the hood. The only problem is that the turbo V6 hybrid has a habit of shitting itself, so Yoder's gotta get that sorted if they want the Titan's customer base. ~~Or just import the Hilux, lol.~~
My brother works at a jag/lr dealer, and those cars are always in the shop, especially the new electric ones. One car in particular spends more time in the shop than at the customers house.
Wealth inequality in the US is worse now than it was per-revolution France, and it's similar story in other western nations. The upper 20% are doing very well. Jaguar's potential customer base has never been larger and the ability to parts share has never been easier.
The competition at the upper echelon is harder now, but they could have borrowed an engine. They could have gone up market. Or they could have pivoted to something else. Instead they kept an unreliable powertrain and JLR as a whole refuses to address their F tier electronics reliability.
The 3.7L in the first two model years, yes, but they switched to the VR30 eight years ago, eliminating that link to the G37. You did remind me, though - those hybrid AWD cars seem to be insanely rare to come across nowadays.
Apparently the RWD version of the standard sedan was a tick quicker, but when you consider the weight disadvantage and the economy gain, it was a solid tradeoff on the hybrid. I'm not sure if they came standard with it or not, but if DAS was a requirement on the hybrid, I could see that having turned people off - reviewers and owners alike really didn't like how it felt. I steered my father away from that when he bought his 3.7L car, and he's been happy as can be with it for almost ten years now.
Yeah people shit all over the DAS. I personally declined the tech package because I didn't like how the DAS felt. I think the DAS was their biggest misstep with the line and basically killed it in the cradle.
With no development money to go around, the Q50's engines will never match the performance / efficiency profile of a basic BMW 330i, Audi A4 2.0T, or Mercedes C300. Except 10 years ago, the Q50 Hybrid did exactly that - all while using a real automatic transmission.
Picture a revised Q50 with the Frontier's 9-speed automatic, maybe the VC 2.0T / VR 3.0T instead of the 3.7 VQ (for emissions/displacement tax), and maybe even a option for a large enough battery to plug in. These are largely plug-and-play components; a segment-best competitor is a calibration away. A new dashboard isn't horribly expensive, and the new Z demonstrates the chassis is still good enough.
Now, if these things were applied to the old FM-based QX50, perhaps it would sell better. But the sedan form factor has an advantage in the form of enthusiast interest. What if Infiniti leaned a bit into that, and called the Q50 the Skyline? Add a bumper-and-wing package if you really want to play into it - that could be fun.
Here's another fun idea: The Q50's DAS means you can turn the steering wheel without turning the wheels. So why can't it be a video game controller? The people who love the Skyline are probably the same sorts of people who would love to play Playstation using their car's inputs. I'm not sure how many of them can buy a $50K luxury sedan, mind you...
In fairness, they weren't the only ones! Chevy dropped the Malibu hybrid without propagating a 1.8L/eCVT hybrid system to the Equinox; even Lexus didn't see a future with the GS450h powertrain in the IS sedan.
I can't think of a single example that shouldn't be back in production, frankly.
Yup. People in 2014 were worried about battery replacement costs, but here we are 10 years later and the batteries in those Q50s are going strong and people are asking for them to be produced again. They should have just let it cook and advertise it as their fastest model (I think it was until the RS400)
Between EVs shifting the Overton window and the introduction of all-hybrid mainstream cars (eg Camry), I think people are finally treating a hybrid powertrain as a valuable feature instead of a mysterious liability.
On that front, I can't think of a reason you can't use the Red Sport's engine with the hybrid system. Both seem to work with AWD. Compared to the heavy PHEVs the Germans are starting to make, I think it would impress.
For that matter, beef up the AWD system a bit. I wonder if selling something called a "Skyline GT-R" would attract some adequately-wealthy customers...
I agree fully. Basically they could have had their own version of the i8, but instead they're going full EV when they infrastructure isn't there yet. I honestly don't know if the brand will survive unless they're getting some massive subsidies for going full EV.
To be fair, the hybrid IS never died in full - it just left the US market, and focused on where it sold better (EU, JP, AUS markets). They could easily bring it back to the US if they felt it'd be worthwhile.
Does anyone anticipate F-Types to continue to depreciate or retain most of their value? It would be nice to pick one up in a year or two if they keep trending downwards
Historically it is perhaps abnormal. For the past 5 years? It actually seems low. There are only so many non SUVs left to kill, which is almost entirely what the list is. Remove the exotics, and there really aren't many vehicles going away.
2007 wasn’t that long ago, I’d just started working at a Nissan dealer as a lube tech when the GTR came out. Ended up doing another career entirely but it was cool to get to see it up close and drive it a bit when it was new.
I am not American so the education system is a bit different in my country. I am in the 2nd year of automotive mechanic school and I am supposed to graduate in the 3rd year.
It's actually insane how well they hold their value. Heavily modified 2012 GTRs with 75k miles on them still command like 75% of their original MSRP on the used market.
Yeah exactly, 10+ year old GTRs selling for 80-100k, saw a listing for a 2015 black edition for $160k today (albeit with 20k miles). I could pay similar prices and buy a long list of AWD sport cars like 911s, RS6 Avant, M4/M5, etc. that are new or used (not 10 years used)
This is the one I feel the most sad about. But also, I'd never buy a Nissan, so I guess it makes sense that they're killing it cause I'm betting many others are feeling the same.
Nissan isn't what it used to be. Now they're just a sub-prime loan company that happens to sell cars.
Yeah, the R35 was a favorite of elementary school aged me \~12 years ago, I still remember when the service manager at the dealership my dad would always take his old Infiniti to gave me a free promotional shirt of it.
I know it's probably a moonshot but I really hope I'll be in a spot in maybe 10 years to grab one of these late production examples since they're expensive enough that the owners usually take good care of them lol
Not surprised about the gtr that thing is an absolute dinosaur and overpriced for what you get. In 07 the msrp was amazing and i’d have gotten one hands down if i was old enough but now an r8 would be a better choice for similar money
In spite of the company going under, I somehow saw 2 Oceans today. They could have been the same one, but these were both very far apart, so it seems unlikely.
They could have kept it going pretty easily if they gave it a 9 speed and upgraded the top screen, and dash screen. It was a dumb decision to kill it entirely.
I was thinking the same thing. Update the interior and exterior and the transmission could've gave the car new life. And if they could have some how added a manual would've breathe some new life into it. Oh well In a year Infiniti is probably only going to be selling two vehicles.
It's such a shame. I have been a fan of the brand for a long time, but they probably won't even have a sedan when my Q50 dies. Oh well, Porsche still exists.
At least all the dealers are hybrid J/LR dealers, right? I don't think dealers are upset with Land Rover's performance.
The world forgetting Jaguar isn't great in general, but could also have the effect of resetting brand identity. By the time the XF was discontinued here, they had to use the Cadillac approach of selling a 5-Series competitor at 3-Series prices. It wouldn't be awful for their profits to shift a bit upmarket - maybe going back to the prestige tier of Porsche, Maserati, and... Well... Land Rover.
I’m sad to see the Titan go truth be told. It had just the right amount of tech and creature comforts that it should’ve been able to match sales of the others but between the failure of the Cummins and waiting a bit too late to redesign the first generation, I feared it wouldn’t be able to stay long in the market.
I like my 2022 Mitsubishi Mirage G4 very much since buying it new 2 years ago. It has its quirks and shortcomings, and, understandably, many would dismiss it because of them, in favor of a similarly sized vehicle; but a God damnit, it's treated me well with its little 5 speed transmission, and it's a huge step up from my previous 2006 Lancer.
Sad to see it go, not necessarily because the car deserves to live on (though, I do think that it was a steal of a buy at pre-COVID pricing for budget strapped buyers (which everyone is if you're considering a Mirage)), but because it's telling of the inexorable trend towards larger and costlier vehicles dominating the roadways, with the sedan (and manual transmissions) becoming a relic of the past.
When I pass this car on to my soon to be licensed daughter, I cringe at the thought of what inexpensive, reliable, standard transmission equipped sedans will be available to replace it with.
Honestly they aren’t that bad. Had one as a rental last year and it was a comfortable well driving truck. Great seats. It just suffered from the Nissan name being associated with cheap lease shit boxes so much so that most buyers never gave them a chance
Over 2 decades of 3rd gen RAM. I don't think any pickup has been on the market half that long? The OBS Chevy ran for what felt like forever and that was one decade.
Where did you get those numbers? 2001 was a different body style. The new ones came out for 03 and the hemi wasn't until 04. I have a 2003 Durango with a 360 in the garage. Calling the facelifted 3rd gen a 4th gen seems ridiculous to me but I guess that's the consensus. Here I thought the 4th gen was the new 2019+ update.
I made a mistake, first model year for the third gen was 2002. 2001 was second gen. The third gen is different enough in styling and components to be separate from the fourth gen, which includes the RAM Classic. 2019+ is 5th gen. The wikipedia page has a breakdown of each generation.
I had an 05 and now a 2018 and they might as well be the same. I get it, but calling the 3rd gen with a Ram box and slight facelift a new generation seems like a marketing scheme. A 76 and a 78 Ford have different grilles, but are mostly the same truck as another example. Thanks.
My favorite thing about the RAM Classic was how cheap it was. It was like having a midsized truck competitor, without it being... Well... Midsized. The American way.
Both GM and Ford have in the past kept a previous generation of their pick-ups on sale when a new one arrives, but usually only for one model year. For example, the PN-96 F-150 generation was available in 2004 as the F-150 Heritage, which included the F-150 Lightning performance truck.
On the other hand, they kept the previous gen Ram alive for half a decade after the new one dropped in 2019, I thought for sure the Ram Classic was also going to be a single model year transition as the torch was passed to the next generation.
I'm not surprised in a way as the price is significantly cheaper for the previous generation. Sure, it might not be up to snuff as the latest competition, but you are getting a new truck for less than rival makes.
I know a lot of folks hate on Jag and they deserve the reputation for not fixing their constant issues but I've seen some of their sports cars around and id have to say the designs look really good.
I just wish they would fix quality control or prices to fix if someone actually wants to take a chance.
I feel the same way about Maserati.
Stopping production altogether to retool as a luxury/expensive EV maker (coincidentally just as the arse falls out of the market, but that’s another topic)
Entire_Action_4565@reddit
The Chiron has been out for 9 years 🤯 obviously through many iterations it’s still being produced but I swear it didn’t come out that long ago.
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
Audi A5, S5, and RS5 Coupe and Convertible
Bugatti Chiron
Chevrolet Camaro
Ferrari 812
Ferrari F8 Spider
Fisker Ocean
Infiniti Q50
Jaguar E-Pace
Jaguar F-type
Jaguar I-Pace
Jaguar XF
Kia Forte
Lamborghini Huracán
Maserati Ghibli
Maserati Levante
Maserati Quattroporte
Mini Clubman
Mitsubishi Mirage and Mirage G4
Nissan GT-R
Nissan Titan
Ram 1500 Classic
Toyota Venza
cilantno@reddit
You’re a good one for saving us the click :)
DepthHour1669@reddit
Dead without replacement:
Audi A5, S5, and RS5 Coupe and Convertible
Chevrolet Camaro
Fisker Ocean
Infiniti Q50
Jaguar E-Pace
Jaguar F-type
Jaguar I-Pace
Jaguar XF
Maserati Ghibli
Maserati Levante
Maserati Quattroporte
Mini Clubman
Mitsubishi Mirage and Mirage G4
Nissan GT-R
Nissan Titan
Toyota Venza
With replacement:
Bugatti Chiron -> Tourbillon
Ferrari F8 Spider -> 269, sort of
Ferrari 812 -> 12Cilindri
Kia Forte -> K4
Lamborghini Huracán -> Temerario
Ram 1500 Classic -> Ram 1500, sort of
start3ch@reddit
Without replacement *yet. I’d bet they eventually bring the Camero and GT-R back, those names are too big
RezLifeGaming@reddit
I thought they already showed a concept for a fully electric replacement months ago for the GT-R
mikeymike831@reddit
How are they going to ruin Godzilla by making it electric? That's a travesty.
Coffee_Grains@reddit
Godzilla is only the R32 GTR.
mikeymike831@reddit
You get my point though, yes? Some cars just shouldn't be messed with. The R35 did enough, bring back the old Skylines with the Inline 6 that we could mod to our hearts content. I feel the same about any classic muscle car (American, JDM, German, etc) though. Some of these beasts just need to breathe fire or let them die.
Coffee_Grains@reddit
The spirit of the GTR is tunability, incredible handling, and advanced AWD. If they manage to retain all of those with a conservative hybrid setup that doesn't throw weight to the heavens, then hell yeah. I love ICE to the point I couldn't see myself buying a "performance" hybrid or EV, but I'm also not buying an R35, so Nissan doesn't give a shit what I want.
EpisodicDoleWhip@reddit
The GT-R was always about foregoing tradition and using technology to create the fastest car possible. Electric fits that bill exactly
RallyVincentCZ75@reddit
I'm pretty sure the Quattroporte will be back in some fashion too. Probably electric.
AutoModerator@reddit
*Camaro
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Jekhyde95@reddit
Jaguar and Maserati are almost completely dead basically
RallyVincentCZ75@reddit
Well Jag is doing their restructuring thing. Maserati has pumped a ton of money into new models. I don't think they're dead yet, they're just revamping too. The Quatt will likely be back eventually, probably EV only. The Quatt has been around since the 60s, and it's had breaks before.
biggersjw@reddit
Based on the list of Jaguars, what’s left to offer? Zilch?
Admiral_Pantsless@reddit
Probably why they’re taking a year off lol
rontonsoup__@reddit
F Pace only this model year
frakking_you@reddit
Wow
Pseudonym_741@reddit
Sir William Lyons spinning in his grave like a crankshaft under full throttle.
improbablydrunknlw@reddit
Because neither company picked a target market and stuck with it.
Too expensive to be an infinity/Lexus competitor, to cheap and poorly done to compete in the luxury segment.
WellEndowedDragon@reddit
I would not lump Lexus in with Infiniti, Lexus is firmly an established luxury brand at this point that is frequently cross-shopped with the Germans. The B-tier luxury brands are more like Infiniti, Acura, Lincoln, and maybe Cadillac.
vishysuave@reddit
It’s true. As an Infiniti owner, they’re literally just upbadged Nissans. Their last cool car was the G37, which was really a Skyline 370GT.
AscendantArtichoke@reddit
I was hoping someone would make this list because I was aware of a few but learn about a few more thanks to your comment!
Curious to also know how many of these are being discontinued again. I only know of the Venza being axed once before off the top my head,but I’m not sure about the others.
SilverStar04@reddit
The Venza is being replaced by the Crown Signia. Not exactly apples to apples though.
Source: Watched Doug’s review recently.
cilantno@reddit
🤌
Yhrite@reddit
So what does Maserati have now besides the MC-12?
Drzhivago138@reddit
*MC20; they also have the Grecale and the new GranTurismo.
Drzhivago138@reddit
So I guess that means no Alaska pickup.
stoned-autistic-dude@reddit
RIP GT-R. You served us well.
caranddriver@reddit
Rest in peace GT-R, you will be missed.
MunchamaSnatch@reddit
We will likely see the R36 within the next 10 years. It will be back. It sold too well for Nissan to abandon.
wolfpack_718@reddit
Didn’t sell well at all. Was never meant to turn profit, it only made a profit due to its extended life span.
franksandbeans911@reddit
It's a famous marque that has been in continuous production since it was a Prince in the 50's. They shouldn't let it die, but this is modern Nissan we're talking about. Not good with money and make a lot of bad decisions. They're a mid-80's Japanese GM at this point.
The 400z should be all over the streets by now, but on any given day I'm more likely to spot 3 McLaren's than one 400z. That just doesn't make sense to me.
Unless they can turn their fortunes around, I wouldn't count on an R36 in a decade. Even if it was making money, they don't bank sales by model, but use profit to prop up cheap Altima repo queens.
MunchamaSnatch@reddit
I see quite a few 400z around me in NC. especially if I head into Charlotte. I wouldn't buy one because the price doesnt match performance, but I still see them around a lot
franksandbeans911@reddit
That's good to know, at least somewhere they are actually selling them. I'm in DFW where you see everything from a clapped out Kia missing both bumper covers and a hood, to Ferraris and Lambos in every color. But I still haven't seen a single 400z in the wild. I literally see more GT-R's and those are pretty rare here too. Saw a green/blue chameleon painted one yesterday.
BeHard@reddit
For 17 years!
IDPotatoFarmer@reddit
Damnit, I was only a few hundred years away from having my down payment for my Bugatti Chiron in hand 😫
Pubsubforpresident@reddit
Nissan Titan?? Very surprised. Thought those were good trucks
mini4x@reddit
Quite a few sedans there.
With the death of the Mirage, what is the new "cheapest car in America" ?
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
Nissan versa
_That_One_Guy_@reddit
My friend's wife was driving a Spark and t-boned a Highlander that turned left in front of her when she was going 45. Totaled the car, but all she had was a couple of bruises on her leg and a scrape from the airbag.
I'm not disputing it being the unsafest car, but I'm impressed with how well modern tin cans protect the occupant.
franksandbeans911@reddit
I bet the Highlander just had a scratched door.
mini4x@reddit
Wow: Starts at $16,680, that is cheep.
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
Considering inflation. The car would’ve been 12k in 2012.
But yes it is dirt cheap considering the cost of new cars right now.
mini4x@reddit
So the 'price' really hasn't changed either, just the dollar is worth less.
dogpaddle@reddit
To be fair, the mirage/versa were still around 12k just before Covid. I car shopped a lot in those years and they jumped up to 16 from 12 in between 2019 and 2021.
mini4x@reddit
2018 it went to $12,200, 2019 - $13,385, 2020 - $14,730 new version came out, 2021 - $14,940, 2022 - $15,080, 2023 - $17,075.
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
Welll I just used the inflation adjustment ballpark. It’s just my estimate lol. I just searched it up. It used to be 10k.
https://www.kbb.com/nissan/versa/2012/
Recall. The minimum wage has barely increased lol
mini4x@reddit
KBB had the MSRP as $11,750 in 2012, thats the number I used.
I also have not gotten 37% in raises, in the last decade so I in theor make less now that I did 10 years ago.
ducky21@reddit
You don't need to qualify that, you do, and you're not alone. The rich have gotten much richer and nobody else is feeling it, which is why this bout of inflation is becoming a sticking point in a way it literally never has been before. Wages are not keeping up.
JvckiWaifu@reddit
As a former accent owner, they won't be missed.
aw3man@reddit
Spark has been gone for at least one model year already
OldRed91@reddit
Versa still available with a manual too!
Koil_ting@reddit
TBF before we had the cybertrucks we had large trucks or cars and even less safety equipment. Certainly it's more safe to drive a new small car now than it was 20-30 years ago.
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
Not for pedestrians.
I was actually on a really small road one day and a great horned rhino weighing 7000 pounds, spanning the 60% of the road was oncoming. I had to drive on the literal side of the road to give myself some distance.
Sorry not rhino, cybertruck. Or was it a Rivian. Regardless I would’ve died if it hit me.
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
The Kia forte is just rebranded
stav_and_nick@reddit
Hot take; for what it was the Kia forte was good looking, or at least the hatchback was imo
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
It was okay. It had a serious case of chipmunk car-ism. It was way too pudgy imo. Now it looks like a proper sedan like the civic and Elantra which got rid of their pudgy features.
jwaldo@reddit
If anything the K4 looks pudgier to me. Everything's been squared off so much it kind of gives cinder block vibes. Then again I'm probably biased.
stav_and_nick@reddit
The new K4 looks like the Polestar 5 We Have At Home. But I don't even mean that in a bad way; it looks cool
Zappiticas@reddit
I owned a 23 forte GT and personally thought it looked significantly better than the K4. Also pretty sure you can’t get the K4 with a 200hp turbo engine and a manual trans, which were the big selling points for me.
forlackofabetterpost@reddit
There's supposedly a GT Line Turbo of the K4 coming next year but it will be 190hp
Zappiticas@reddit
And I’m assuming it won’t be offered with a manual
Bonkzzilla@reddit
8 speed auto only, from what I've read.
roman_maverik@reddit
As much as I dislike Kia, the 6MT Forte GT wasn’t bad at all for what it was.
Their marketing department was asleep at the switch though, because nobody knew it existed, or else it would probably be a compelling cheaper alternative to the civic si or GTI.
It punched higher than it’s 25k price tag
Zappiticas@reddit
I agree completely, that’s why I bought one. Personally I enjoyed the driving experience more than the SI and GLI as well. Very balanced dynamically with just a touch of oversteer at the limit, and suspension that was soft enough to not be jarring at all, but stiffened up really nicely under load. Also the engine felt much more like an old school turbo engine than either the SI or GLI, it was less smooth and less linear, which some people may see as less refined, I see it as more fun.
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
Could go Elantra N tbh. It’s a great car
handymanshandle@reddit
I was honestly kinda annoyed that the 6-speed in the Elantra N Line went away so that the Kia Forte could keep it. Still, I believe the turbo-4 from the Forte GT is coming back to the K4, just not at launch.
Spirited-Pause@reddit
Sure, if “what it was” = Kia going out of their way to half ass a bland design to keep costs down.
jwaldo@reddit
I'd have killed to get a hatchback Forte, but they axed it in the U.S. years ago. Still a damn good looking car though. I'm not sure how I feel about the K4 yet.
sexi_korean_boi@reddit
A hatchback forte with the 200hp turbo/6mt would've been great. Probably not much of a market for it but used focus STs are all clapped out with aftermarket bolt ons and a new GTI or Mazda3 Turbo is way more expensive than the forte GT sedan was.
Foodstamp001@reddit
Hopefully it works out better than when they uggified the optima rebrand to K5 and tanked sales
HalfFrozenSpeedos@reddit
What is it with some of these bizarre name choices in the USA? RSX, Q80, K4? - Is it a tacit admission that the world of idiocracy has come to pass?
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
K4 is the colloquial name for the forte in Korea. They decided to bring that naming scheme here.
It’s easier to tell the level of the car tbh. BMW does this the best Like M2, M3, M4, M5.
330i is base model 340i is upscale sport sedan M3 is full fledged sport sedan.
And 830i is bigger and more expensive than the 330i.
Kia had something similar to begin with. It’s much easier to remember than optima, forte or whatever imo.
HalfFrozenSpeedos@reddit
I honestly find names easier to remember and apart from Ferrari and the GT40, the majority of iconic cars are named, whether supercars or family cars - Mustang, Camaro, corvette, corvair, Wrangler, Cherokee, Escort, Focus, navigator.
aaayyyuuussshhh@reddit
Disagree kinda preferred the only one in terms of looks. It's interior was also relatively high quality. IMO it was a ton of fun with the 1.6T + DCT. Very quick and nible. No LSD though which kind of sucked but it costed the same as the current base civic LX lol. But yeah I thought the Forte looked quite stylish.
RudderForADuck@reddit
The new K4 is assbang ugly compared to any recent Forte year
ProdigyRunt@reddit
Damn, it looks nicer than the upmarket K5
magicnubs@reddit
IMO, the Carnival looks better than either of them
Roboticpoultry@reddit
And rumor has it we’re getting both the K4 sedan and the hatch/wagon in the US
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
Yup. The wagon would be an amazing daily for me. Currently have an Elantra.
UnderwhelmingAF@reddit
I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I saw one for the first time a few days ago and thought it was hideous.
Darisixnine@reddit
wtf no more Audi 5 series? So they’re done with coupes?
Cars-and-Coffee@reddit
The 5 lives on, but only in the 4-door sportback/liftback variety. Previously the 5 came in both 2 and 4-door formats.
Darisixnine@reddit
Yea so no more coupes than
Agloe_Dreams@reddit
You should have just put “Fisker” and “Jaguar”
Riverrat423@reddit
Jaguar is stopping production for a year , then plans to come back as only EV . So, yeah Jag is in real trouble.
Best_Cure@reddit
Their parent company, Tata, has many brands. They can afford to experiment. Jaguar and Landrover vehicles are only a fraction of their list. They will position themselves for the coming years with vehicles that are on this list:
Nexon- Compact SUV | Petrol, Diesel | Manual,Automatic
Tiago- Mid-Size Hatchback | Petrol, CNG | Manual,Automatic
Tigor- Compact Sedan | Petrol, CNG | Manual,Automatic
Harrier- Mid-Size SUV | Petrol, Diesel | Manual,Automatic
Altroz- Premium Hatchback | Petrol, Diesel | Manual,Automatic
Nexon EV- Compact SUV | Electric | Automatic
Nexon EV Max - Compact SUV | Electric | Automatic
Safari - Full-Size 7 Seater SUV | Diesel | Manual, Automatic
Tata Tigor Ziptron EV - Compact Sedan | Electric | Automatic
Punch - Micro SUV | Petrol | Manual, Automatic
Riverrat423@reddit
Yeah, but the EV market especially luxury EVs is in a downturn. In a year from now I doubt it will be much better.
ric2b@reddit
Is it an actual downturn or is growth just slowing down a bit? I keep seeing conflicting reports about this, I think it's due to focusing on US or Global?
Riverrat423@reddit
It could be mostly the US. It could also be that the industry is slow and inventory has just recovered from the supply chain issues. Overall though, I believe interest in EV here is low.
Best_Cure@reddit
The batteries are losing their charge. Major hybrid producers have been ready for this for some time. Great example are the Toyota mild hybrids running on either diesel or petrol.
Riverrat423@reddit
Yeah, battery life is a big issue. Plus, the vehicles are expensive, most people who want one have one and the rest of us are unsure about investing in them.
zilch26@reddit
That's not many brands. It's literally one brand. Tata motors and Tata basically ripped a JLR platform to make the Harrier and Safari - both absolutely mid cars that aren't cheap. If you believe Altroz and Nexon would sub the XJ and F-type on Jag's downtime you're total delulu
Best_Cure@reddit
It’s a fluid situation mate. A huge company now slowly sticking it to their former rulers, the Brits. Look also at their versions of the once mighty Landrover. They don’t give a rats about these once dominant brands. Understand Indian mentality a bit, and you just might see the importance of the Tata name to them. Do your own research.
Thomas_633_Mk2@reddit
The fact the Grenadier exists shows they're not sticking it to the Brits very well
Best_Cure@reddit
The bigger picture of India v UK suggests that they have many ways to do it. Here are some stats to ponder. https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2022/09/india-uk-fifth-largest-economy-world/#:~:text=This%20situation%2C%20coupled%20with%20a,no%20change%20in%20the%20ranking.
Thomas_633_Mk2@reddit
I'm not arguing for or against India's economic potential, just that Tata isn't doing a great job with JLR right now. This is cars, not r/noncrediblediplomacy
Best_Cure@reddit
Sorry. Cars, and… https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tata_Motors#:~:text=Subsidiaries%20include%20British%20Jaguar%20Land,Chrysler%20and%20Tata%2Dbranded%20vehicles.
RoosterDenturesV2@reddit
Only partly true, F-Pace production is continuing for North America as it sells pretty well here.
Gold-Tone6290@reddit
I didn’t even know Jaguar offered all those cars.
Blue387@reddit
The XF has been around for a while, dating back to the Ford ownership
Thomas_633_Mk2@reddit
My brain got very confused as to why they were selling an 80s Falcon for a moment
cheezturds@reddit
A5/S5/RS5 coupe going away is so lame, that was such an awesome car.
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
They are awesome cars, but personally don't see the point in buying a less practical car that has the exact same performance and is the same price.
Why not just get the sportback.
AnAudiS5@reddit
Weight savings
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
I'm sure your going to notice the extra... 77 lbs.
cheezturds@reddit
Because 2 doors look insanely better. Not everyone needs a 4 door. A 2 door with the lift back would be ideal
instaeloq1@reddit
Current gen A5/S5/RS5 look way better as a Sportback. The coupe looks unfinished.
cheezturds@reddit
I disagree, it’s one of the better looking coupes out there. Should just make that the A4 since that’s supposed to be the model with the 4 doors.
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
I would agree if the styling was completely different.
But for the A5 Coupe and Sportback, they basically look the exact same, except the sportback is slightly stretched, for me it doesn't look that much better to be worth a significant decrease in usability.
Tessoro43@reddit
Audi needs to kill A3 line not A5 line
cheezturds@reddit
Yeah the rs3 is pretty awesome though
ForcaAereaBelka@reddit
I agree. I never really was a fan of the sportback look, I'd rather get a sedan or wagon if I need more practicality. Not that I'm in a position to be buying a new Audi though 😂
cheezturds@reddit
I mean there’s too much electronics going on in the cars nowadays so Im not buying one either. Electric steering is no good
the_cajun88@reddit
wait, the camaro died
lmao, damn
nissansupragtr@reddit
Didn't the Venza just come back? That's pretty surprising
s1a1om@reddit
I hate my Venza.
Independent-Win-4187@reddit
It’s an SUV that looks like a minivan, right?
sierra120@reddit
No its a raised Toyota Camry with a hatch. It was a great Estate car. Similar to Audis AllRoad models.
Csalbertcs@reddit
My brother has one, it's is a very roomy car and imo better than the Rav4's, but he's had more trouble with it than his Grand Caravan (which is 3 years newer to be fair). Apparently it's just as bad on gas too.
Russkie177@reddit
I had one as a rental for a camping trip in the Pacific Northwest a few years ago. Engine is bland, fuel economy was surprisingly mediocre, but it had a lot of space inside and allowed my friend and I to sleep in it a few times because of the weather. Overall, good for what we needed it for but I'd never own one (I'd take a Rav4 hybrid instead)
Csalbertcs@reddit
I think the crazy part with it is just it's bad fuel mileage, the new ones are much better since they're hybrid but a 2013 4 cylinder Venza gets the same gas mileage as a 2013 Grand Caravan, which is twice as roomy in terms of cargo space. According to him it's a lot less reliable too, and I'm daily driving (bought it 9 years ago) his 05 Matrix he bought off the lot so he's been a Toyota guy for awhile.
land8844@reddit
It's what the Lexus RX was sold as in other markets (as the Toyota Harrier), before branching off into its own concurrent model.
takesjuantogrowone@reddit
I love my wife's Venza (2021)
s1a1om@reddit
The controls in the 2013 and ergonomic placement of them is awful. That’s our biggest complaint about it. Maybe they fixed those by the time yours came out.
takesjuantogrowone@reddit
Worst part about the 2nd Gen Venza is the lack of knobs and real buttons. It's annoying, but not something that overshadows the tech, comfort and excellence of the powertrain for me.
ringo-san@reddit
It venzigged when it should have venzagged
burrgerwolf@reddit
It’s getting replaced with the new Crown Sport, although it appears there was a possible overlap.
c172fccc@reddit
Crown Signia, not Crown Sport.
burrgerwolf@reddit
Interesting, didn’t realize Toyota called it that in NA. I was just in Japan and they were labeled Crown Sport.
aprtur@reddit
Crown Sport isn't sold in North America. The Crown Signia that's coming here is the Crown Estate in Japan. Similar to how th Crown Crossover in Japan is simply labeled Crown here (god knows why...they should've just kept the names the same).
Kapura01@reddit
They’re two different models, actually! The Sport is a little smaller, the Signia has three rows iirc.
xarune@reddit
Just 2 rows. It's a wagon they are labeling an SUV.
Kapura01@reddit
Oh you’re right! Idk why I thought it had three.
c172fccc@reddit
They’re not the same. The Sport is a small SUV, the Signia is more like an estate.
The_Strom784@reddit
The new Venza was placed oddly in their lineup. It made sense when it first launched but it quickly lost its place when they started introducing hybrid versions of everything else. It makes sense for it to go away for now. Maybe it'll relaunch in the future as an EV.
goaelephant@reddit
This is such a special car, the engine is something out of this world
Separate_Teacher1526@reddit
The Mirage is the real loss here. The car enthusiast world won't be the same.
YEGLego@reddit
It's surprising to me that they are killing it, given the consistent sale numbers. Maybe there is just that much more profit margin on Crossovers/SUV's that it's worth taking over that production line.
icecon@reddit
Mirage sales are up 114% YTD compared to last year. This year, 20,026 units, last year 9,344.
Mitsubishi itself is up 22%.
82,722 vs 67,734
solo118@reddit
wait so 4 door maseratis are dead? Grecale is the only one left, and then of course their latest sports cars?
DJAllOut@reddit
I just hope they don't name any more models after body parts, like the "Tonale." What are you driving these days? Oh the new Maserati Armpite
QuestionTop8210@reddit
They are supposedly coming with a new Quattroporte for 2026
strongmanass@reddit
BuckManscape@reddit
Italians. Heart on sleeve.
gstringstrangler@reddit
Straight from their racing strategy
QuestionTop8210@reddit
Most likely going to be on the STLA large platform is my guess
strongmanass@reddit
That was the initial plan. But the chief enginer isn't convinced:
Basically it sounds like he doesn't consider STLA Large sporty enough for the Quattroporte.
QuestionTop8210@reddit
As far as I know the Gran Turismo is based on the Giorgio platform which is the same platform underneath the Alfa Romeo Giulia and Stelvio and Maserati Grecale which is a great platform, but what they didn't tell you is the STLA large is a derivative of the Giorgio platform, more optimized to also support hybridization and electrification. I'm not sure how much less sporty the STLA large is in comparison to the Giorgio but if they base it on an extended Giorgio that's fine by me and if proven to be reliable like the Giulias are, they could be a great used buy in a couple of years.
darkimperator02@reddit
Stellantis is the new BL
strongmanass@reddit
For now. The Quattroporte is coming back toward the end of the decade (~2028). But they're trying to rebrand by decreasing their offerings and dropping their entry-level models. The Levante is more expensive than the Grecale so I don't understand that, but mayb they figure the Grecal segment is more profitable.
solo118@reddit
I am good with that! Hoping the new QP can rival the S class and 7 series and of course become more reliable along the way
strongmanass@reddit
It will be EV only so will be more of a Taycan/e-Tron GT competitor. That segment is going to get crowded because there's also the Lotus Emeya, Polestar 5, a rumored electric AMG GT 4 door, and likely a Jaguar product too with their rebranding. I don't think there are enough buyers for 7 different $150K electric luxury sports sedans. There are barely enough for 5 ICE models.
XSC@reddit
I got a friend with a new generation Venza and it has been riddled with problems.
6786_007@reddit
I've been a long time Toyota fan and my family has been heavily invested into Toyota. We've had multiple Siennas, Camrys, even Lexus.
But dam lately the news from Toyota/Lexus isn't great.
klaodheart@reddit
Nooooo not the Ghibliiii! How else will I think of Studio Ghibli while on the road? ):
Multifaceted-Simp@reddit
Wow lots of good cars gone
EnjoyMikeHawk1@reddit
Really the ram 1500 and camaro?
Motorized23@reddit
Damn, a lot of solid cars on that list :(
KaBar42@reddit
I just heard a million new junior enlisted cry out in anguish... before... simply crashing their Mustangs into a crowd.
SteelFlexInc@reddit
No more mirage?!
funkyfritos@reddit
Rip GT-R
AvroVulcanXM594@reddit
Clubman was a great car. Mini are currently rolling out new models so I hope they'll being it back but I doubt it.
skyshock21@reddit
No more Camaro? Nice! Can we also remove all the other cars in the “Just run the damn ball!” category?
mulletstation@reddit
Man I remember when Jaguar I-Pace was supposed to be the end of Tesla
11shovel11@reddit
Isn’t that all of Maserati? What else do they have SUVs?
youknow99@reddit
I mean... kinda saw that coming.
RepresentativeWin595@reddit
Whats happened with Hurracan?
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
Replaced by the Lamborghini Temerario
Imyourhuckl3berry@reddit
Thought it was a4 and s4 for Audi and they are going all in on the sport back a5/s5
Domyyy@reddit
Yes, that’s exactly what happened. The A4 and A5 both still exist in form of the new A5.
MrHawkeye76@reddit
A4 Sedan is kinda dead. A5 Hatchback Sedan and Wagon are now a thing. no more coupes or convertibles.
Domyyy@reddit
I‘m from Germany so the A4 sedan is a very rare sight anyways. People generally don’t like sedans here and the A4 Avant and A5 Sportback where much more common.
MrHawkeye76@reddit
Im a fellow german and I noticed the same... and don't understand it.
TitrationGod@reddit
Damn. Didn't expect the Forte here. Are they killing it to make room for the k4?
sinkrate@reddit
Yup, just a rebranding. Same as Optima -> K5
driftthabimmer@reddit
Maserati is so fucked with just the Grecale and the GT.
4score-7@reddit
RIP Jaguar.
BeigeChocobo@reddit
Thanks daddy
CmanderShep117@reddit
Jaguar: "we're just done in general!"
Ah2k15@reddit
If they are going to kill the Classic for good, I wish they’d do one more run of regular cab trucks.
mbbzzz@reddit
Subaru Legacy too.
Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit
wait what!?!? WHY! Its such a sensible car, and the platform that originally built Subaru's rally career. What a shame.
land8844@reddit
Because most people bought the wagon version, aka the Outback.
Be realistic - how many Legacy sedans have you actually seen in recent years?
Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit
The Outback and the Legacy wagon are two different vehicles.
derritterauskanada@reddit
Am I going crazy, I thought the Legacy Wagon was discontinued 2 generations ago?
Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit
You might be right, I don't think it made it to the newest generation sadly.
land8844@reddit
They're different now, but up until a few years ago they were the same thing.
KingMario05@reddit
Outback outsells it, like, 10 to 1. And unlike Yoder or Honda, Subaru doesn't have the cash on hand to keep both model lines around.
Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit
Its still sad, they were a fantastic everyday car if you live up north or otherwise need the AWD. Our family has now gone through 6 generations of them, putting hundreds of thousands of miles on ear, and never once has one broken down.
KingMario05@reddit
Yeah, such a shame. Hope they bring it back at some point, but I dunno.
The AWD Camry kinda killed its business model. :/
Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit
agreed, its wild it too so long for other automakers to offer AWD with more cars, Subaru wrote the book on it. Even though companies like Audi effectively invented it.
mbbzzz@reddit
Ikr I have a ‘21 Legacy XT and I enjoy it. I guess sales were not enough to keep producing it, especially as more competitors added AWD as options.
Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit
yeah, everyone has AWD now... also kinda annoyed they stopped offering manual for everything. My mom managed to snag the last gen Legacy with a manual, and its great.
mbbzzz@reddit
I’d totally dig a ‘final edition’ that’s manual and more rally/sport ready. I believe the Legacy was also Subaru’s longest running model name.
Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit
dude, if they made a send off legacy based off the original legacy RS turbo rally car from the early 90's.... and sold it in McRae blue
duuuuude, like a sorta STI but in a Legacy sedan, it would be awesome
https://i.redd.it/kvkfbp8ssec41.jpg
mbbzzz@reddit
That would be cool!
termi707@reddit
And the BMW Z4/MK5 Supra
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
No.
There is a rumor that the Z4/Supra will end production in 2026, but nothing official yet.
The 2025 Supra and Z4 are already being made.
Noopy9@reddit
They are bringing back the manual transmission in the z4 for 2025
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a46093511/2025-bmw-z4-manual-transmission/
termi707@reddit
So, I just looked it up, because I thought I could be wrong. I'm glad to hear it's still unconfirmed by BMW.
Hopefully we get the 8 series rumors to be pushed back as well.
TunakTun633@reddit
It sounds like we're getting a 6-Series in its place. Good enough, I say.
termi707@reddit
Not a bad trade, but I miss the days when we had both produced side by side...
TunakTun633@reddit
The 8-Series has always replaced a 6-Series on its debut.
Until the 1-Series debuted, BMW's lineup only held two coupe models. Now, we have the 2, 4, and 8.
On the low end, the 2-Series has gotten pretty close to the 3 - to the point where it overlaps way too closely with the 4 in a saturated market.
On the high end, the current 8-Series is not unique, elegant or luxurious enough to distinguish it at its current price point.
Enter the 6-Series. Hopefully it's not a transparently marked-up 4-Series, the way the Mercedes CLE is a transparently marked-up C-Class, but I bet you that will directly compare against at least the 6-cylinder version of that model. All it needs is a good, unique design and a wider track.
MaybeNext-Monday@reddit
Hopefully they make some sort of successor, the Z4 Supra is a really cool car.
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
You will be able to buy the legacy throughout 2025.
2025 will be the last model year.
https://www.subaru.com/vehicles/legacy.html
mbbzzz@reddit
Ohhh ok I got it mixed up. We’ll see the Legacy on next years list.
baltimoreboii@reddit
The fuck is Jaguar going to sell?
bestselfnice@reddit
They're apparently going to take a year off from selling cars. Not a joke.
ABirdOfParadise@reddit
The dealerships gonna be like a cafe and yoga studio?
RallyVincentCZ75@reddit
Nah, they still have Land Rovers to sell. And some times Volvos.
ABirdOfParadise@reddit
Oh yeah that's true, my local one is a Jag and Land Rover.
shellmiro@reddit
They're the gap year kid in college
Teledildonic@reddit
So it's gonna get belligerently drunk around Spain for the next few months?
wetchuckles@reddit
Seems like Maserati did too.
strongmanass@reddit
Maserati is dropping old products that have hurt their image. They still have three models all released this decade. It's part of their strategy to restore their image and be more of a small volume maker.
wetchuckles@reddit
The Levante got great reviews all around. The Quattroporte was getting a bit dated but not a bad car by any means. I think the only one hurting their image was the Ghibli.
So they have the Grecale, MC20, what's the third I'm missing?
strongmanass@reddit
Granturismo. The Quattroporte will be back as an EV in 2028 as soon as they decide what platfom it will use. I don't really understand why they're getting rid of the Levante though.
wetchuckles@reddit
Of course, Granturismo is stunning. Feels like it hasn't been advertised/marketed well though.
strongmanass@reddit
It hasn't. I think it also suffers from having a V6 instead of a V8. A lot of people write it off based on that alone. But it drives very well from what I hear.
JustThall@reddit
The have unsold inventory to supply dealers
elVanPuerno@reddit
Merch on their youtube channel
RallyVincentCZ75@reddit
Jag is gonna have to stick their landing pretty hard to come out of this alive. Cats do fall on their feet, but there have been exceptions.
No-Quantity9916@reddit
What's the deal with the A5/S5? I feel like I always saw them for crazy cheap when I was looking at A4 Avants.
bestselfnice@reddit
Fucking shame losing the Camaro. What a car. Never could have imagined as a kid having access to something that capable that cheap.
caranddriver@reddit
The Camaro will come back, hopefully in a similar form.
Montreal4life@reddit
when I was ready to buy this year no more Camaros available
land8844@reddit
They're not taking away the used ones? Buy some boomer's (un)used Camaro.
norfatlantasanta@reddit
The problem with buying used performance cars (muscle cars/pony cars in particular) is they’re almost guaranteed to be beat to shit by their owners, save for some exceptions like M cars, Cadillacs, and Corvettes.
You have no idea whether that 20k miles on the odo was spent on highways at 2000rpm or doing burnouts in the middle of the street at redline.
applepumper@reddit
It’s not that bleak out there. And I’ve seen people that have those cars for a while get bored of the performance and mostly just speed on the highway if anything
Montreal4life@reddit
I wanted new, plus the spec I wanted wasn't commonly available let alone by some boomer. I gave a glance at autotrader when I was looking
RabidBlackSquirrel@reddit
He'll want $20k over MSRP because it's a rare 1/10,000 spec and discontinued. He knows what he has, after all.
NuclearWasteland@reddit
Camaro will be back, as it has been before. They take it off the market to let it cool, revamp the platform, and then bring it back with new marketing for a new generation of consumers.
It's the Disney Vault of pony cars.
No-Necessary7135@reddit
Kinda like McRib except for the sports car buying public instead of pork belly futures.
NuclearWasteland@reddit
The McRib of Pony Cars does have a ring to it.
bestselfnice@reddit
The brand will be back, the V8 and stick won't.
RamenWrestler@reddit
I can see the V8 coming back. Ford is doing it right now. GM just last year invested billions into keeping their V8 alive. With how low production Camaros are, I think a V8 one will be back soon enough
KingMario05@reddit
Maybe they'll do the Dodge thing and offer both. A V8 SS for the purists, and a Ultium-powered EV for those who want Tesla performance without the... ya know, Tesla. Possibly as a coupe and sedan, too. Something's gotta replace the Malibu on rental lots, right?
RamenWrestler@reddit
What V8 sporty car is Dodge gonna have? Thought all the new ones are straight 6
KingMario05@reddit
Sorry, misspoke. I meant GM offering both a gas an electric variant. Except, instead of straight 6s, it's the big ol' small block.
land8844@reddit
Ford offset their V8 offerings with an EV version of the Mustang. Next time you see fanboys getting pissy and throwing a goddamn tantrum over "iT's NoT a ReAL mUsTanG", you can tell them it's because of the Mustang Mach E that the V8-powered GT gets to stick around.
Terrible_Armadillo33@reddit
This doesn’t make any type of sense. The Mach E is a SUV. How is that keeping a pony car around? They are not even in the same segment of vehicles.
Is the Escalade the only reason the corvette is still around? No.
randeus@reddit
I’ve heard the Mach-E having the Mustang name allowed the Mustang brand as a whole to meet EPA requirements to keep the v8, but I don’t know if that’s actually factual or not.
TenguBlade@reddit
Mustang is not a separate brand. Moreover, it's not individual brands that have to meet CAFE - it's the automaker's entire lineup, inclusive of all brands.
randeus@reddit
I see. So in a sense, the Mach-E is still helping keep the v8 Mustang around though.
JS1VT51A5V2103342@reddit
I think the V8 hybrid will be a thing. 2039ish
bestselfnice@reddit
There is no chance in hell they're introducing a new V8 Camaro in 15 years lmao
JS1VT51A5V2103342@reddit
what's the odds? I'll make you a bet
bestselfnice@reddit
Lmao yes I'll be counting on one of our two anonymous internet accounts paying out in a decade and a half from now
deleted_by_reddit@reddit
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cubs223425@reddit
I kind of hope it isn't, if only because GM's recent efforts are the kinds of things I'd hate to see burdening the Camaro name.
RangerHikes@reddit
I'm hoping we see some unusual stuff like inline 6s or some kind of mild hybrid that maintains the manual
DarthBrooks69420@reddit
Too bad they dismantled the tooling for the Atlas motor. A twin turbo direct injection variant using the turbos from the 2.7L would be dope.
DrWatson90@reddit
Yes, as an electric SUV
KingMario05@reddit
Don't. You. Dare.
miskinasde@reddit
Truly would be the worst timeline.
JS1VT51A5V2103342@reddit
Yep, its on a 15-year cycle. Expect the 2039 Camaro hybrid
TunakTun633@reddit
I really hope you're right.
Montreal4life@reddit
we'll see about that
NuclearWasteland@reddit
Bet
Montreal4life@reddit
I hope it comes back, I really do...
FixTheWisz@reddit
Maybe in 5 years, minimum.
joeislandstranded@reddit
Fingers crossed they don’t compromise visibility to make it look like it was stepped on by a giant.
Sure. Chopped tops were cool in the 50s when they modded their old 1930-40s cars, but it’s pretty silly for today’s cars
ZannX@reddit
If you look at everything they put into the C8, it sort of makes sense. Curious to see in what form the Camaro comes back as.
downbadmilflover@reddit
OR OR hear me out, it comes back as the Firebird 🥵
KingMario05@reddit
With the true Impala being reborn as a brand new G8? Yes please!
Salt_lick_fetish@reddit
Gimme that sweet sweet trans am!
cybertron2006@reddit
Pontiac coming back as the performance brand of GM is the best timeline.
land8844@reddit
GM is so weird with the Corvette, nothing else is allowed to be faster than it.
Alec_NonServiam@reddit
And now I'm imagining the new z06 Vette engine in the Camaro
C'mon GM you can do it!
7eregrine@reddit
Not even 6,000 sales. Wow. Chevy dropped the Malibu after 130,000 in sales.
mrbulldops428@reddit
They've been saying it for years and now they're finally killing them. God I hope they just let them die and don't turn it into the expected fucking electric sedan. I need to get rich so I can fulfill my dream of someday owning a ZL1. And I'm never selling my 2010.
Jimbenas@reddit
Bummer that they’re an ergonomic nightmare that you can barely see out of. There’s a reason they didn’t sell as well as other similar cars despite performing well vs cost.
land8844@reddit
GM gonna GM
KyledKat@reddit
While I agree with the sentiment, the general consensus for the last 8 years has been "but I can't see out of it!!"
It's a phenomenal driving experience in a world-class chassis, but GM wasn't interested in building it to buyers' tastes. The 5th gen cars had notably bad visibility, and when designing the 6th gen, they hunkered down and made it worse. Owned and dailied one for 3.5 years, and it was something I could adjust to in a couple of days, but it was a compromised car in a way that the Mustang simply wasn't.
Ultimately, it's just an hiatus again. As far as my research can tell, it's getting the axe because it was on the Alpha-I chassis, and while the plan was to initially move it to the Alpha-II with the CT4 and CT5, that's also getting phased out in the next few years for their upcoming successors on the new VSS-R chassis underpinning the current Chinese CT6. I'm guessing the 6th gen got the extra push utilizing some excess production parts from the last few years of bad sales but didn't warrant enough work to move it over to the Alpha-II in the wake of that one's cancellation too.
delebojr@reddit
You can still buy the CT4 and CT5 which are on the second gen Alpha platform (Camaro on first gen), but yeah, they're not priced as low as the Camaro
bestselfnice@reddit
They're also larger, heavier, and don't have an NA V8.
delebojr@reddit
I'd take a CT5-V Blackwing over any Camaro
OldManBearPig@reddit
What kind of comment is this? lol
You'd take a car that starts at $70,000 over a car that starts at $30,000?
Okay? Thanks for your input? lol
delebojr@reddit
The Camaro ZL1 starts at around $70k
OldManBearPig@reddit
The Camaro ZL1 isn't the only Camaro with a NA V8.
GimmeChickenBlasters@reddit
The ZL1 doesn't have an NA V8
OldManBearPig@reddit
You're right! But my comment still isn't technically wrong.
delebojr@reddit
Not all V8s are made the same
OldManBearPig@reddit
No, but the V8s in the Camaro sure are all the same, lol. Except the ZL1. Which is supercharged. Which means it's NOT naturally aspirated. Which was the whole point of this comment thread, lmao.
GimmeChickenBlasters@reddit
The ZL1 doesn't have an NA V8. The LT1 and SS do, which started at $37k
ad895@reddit
"any camaro" which includes the highest priced one.
OldManBearPig@reddit
and includes the lowest priced one?
mini4x@reddit
At 2x the price...
6carecrow@reddit
I think most people would, but they’re significantly more expensive than even a Camaro ZL1, so that’s not really a fair comparison
Viperlite@reddit
I love the 5 Blackwing too… but that’ll cost you like twice as much.
bschmidt25@reddit
A5, S5, and RS5 are gone completely? Damn. I liked them.
Santa_Hates_You@reddit
The new B10 generation is coming out for the A5 Sportback and Q5 only. No more regular A4 sedan after next year either, it will be an EV after that.
cheezturds@reddit
Wack.
Ran4@reddit
Why in their right mind ever bought an A4 sedan though? It's an absurd vehicle when the A5 sportback and A4 avant exists.
6786_007@reddit
Eh. The A5 is basically the A4 but with a lift back. The new B10 doesn't seem to slope as much in the back and considering they are going to offer either sportback or avant the structure will work for both.
6786_007@reddit
Yes the b10 generation has been spied already. I love my sportback. It's hands down the most underrated feature of this car and more cars should have it.
No-Necessary7135@reddit
For as small as that car is on the inside, that hatch/lift makes such a huge difference in size. I was pretty close to getting a TLC Type-S at one point but they had stability bars in the freaking trunk passthrough.
6786_007@reddit
One thing I can say for German cars is they really know how to make a small car feel spacious. I came from the Lexus GS350 to the A5 and I feel like I haven't lost an interior space.
And yes the liftback is the best part of this car. I can throw my mountain bike in the back of this so easy. I've made Ikea runs in this. My favorite part is seeing people's faces when I open the trunk because they expect a tiny trunk lol.
lique_madique@reddit
Audi is restructuring their line and introducing the next generation so we have to wait to see what they do
Dazzling-Rooster2103@reddit (OP)
Yes.
bwoah_gimmethedrink@reddit
Maserati butching their lineup and removing an SUV without offering a replacement - only at Stellantis.
Cranjesmcbasketball1@reddit
I did not know the Nissan Titan was dead, also basically All of Jaguar.
New-Buffalo-1635@reddit
What are all local handyman and painters around the US gonna drive now that Titans are gone?
Wild to think Jaguar made it this far as a luxury and sports car brand, to then not make it in a luxurious and sports minded car industry in the 21st century.
KingMario05@reddit
Tundra is my guess. Looks like a Ram, probably gets better mileage than one, hails from Texas and has great rebates on the hood. The only problem is that the turbo V6 hybrid has a habit of shitting itself, so Yoder's gotta get that sorted if they want the Titan's customer base. ~~Or just import the Hilux, lol.~~
cgduncan@reddit
My brother works at a jag/lr dealer, and those cars are always in the shop, especially the new electric ones. One car in particular spends more time in the shop than at the customers house.
They're garbage haha
SirSteyr@reddit
It's still a massive fail.
Wealth inequality in the US is worse now than it was per-revolution France, and it's similar story in other western nations. The upper 20% are doing very well. Jaguar's potential customer base has never been larger and the ability to parts share has never been easier.
The competition at the upper echelon is harder now, but they could have borrowed an engine. They could have gone up market. Or they could have pivoted to something else. Instead they kept an unreliable powertrain and JLR as a whole refuses to address their F tier electronics reliability.
czarfalcon@reddit
Squeeze into a Frontier, maybe? I still see a decent number of those on the roads around me.
Agloe_Dreams@reddit
Not basically, actually all.
Cranjesmcbasketball1@reddit
If you go on their website its all still there, I didn't see the XJ on that list but apparently its been dead.
rontonsoup__@reddit
For many years
c172fccc@reddit
No, F-Pace has a 2025 MY.
HiTork@reddit
The Titan died in Canada after the 2021 model year, so up here, we have been used to its absence from Nissan show rooms for a few years now.
require_borgor@reddit
Too bad honestly, it had a rock solid drivetrain and the most comfortable seats of any vehicle I've ever sat in, save maybe Volvo
If I could have found an extended cab I would have bought it over my F150
Scazitar@reddit
Yeah JLR made a statement recently that they are pretty much axing the whole brand and focusing on a new lineup with a lot of talk of an EV focus.
So yeah jaguar as we know it is pretty much dead.
AOhKayy@reddit
I wish Mitsubishi would make cool cars again.
No-Necessary7135@reddit
Of course now that I have some disposable income, the Evo no longer exists.
lethargicbureaucrat@reddit
I loved my Mitsubishi Montero.
No-Necessary7135@reddit
I saw a Q50 coupe the other day and did a double-take. What a beautiful car. It's sad that Nissan let that entire brand get stale for so long.
darkgod25@reddit
Man sad to see the 812 go it still looks fresh imo
Maximilianne@reddit
i think the 812 looks better than the current 12cylinder with its terrible Daytona throwback design
darkgod25@reddit
i think the dodici cilindri is way overheated but it is a downgrade from the 812
solo118@reddit
Long live the Infiniti and Nissan GTR seems like the latest iterations were older than my kid in high school!
mini4x@reddit
Isn't the Q50 still largely a G3x, very long in the tooth..
vishysuave@reddit
The G37 was a rebadged Nissan Skyline 370GT. With them killing off the GTR and the Q50, they’re literally killing the Skyline.
AlexWIWA@reddit
Interior and body no, same engine though.
aprtur@reddit
The 3.7L in the first two model years, yes, but they switched to the VR30 eight years ago, eliminating that link to the G37. You did remind me, though - those hybrid AWD cars seem to be insanely rare to come across nowadays.
AlexWIWA@reddit
Yeah I really wish I had been smart enough to buy one. They're fast as hell for what they are
aprtur@reddit
Apparently the RWD version of the standard sedan was a tick quicker, but when you consider the weight disadvantage and the economy gain, it was a solid tradeoff on the hybrid. I'm not sure if they came standard with it or not, but if DAS was a requirement on the hybrid, I could see that having turned people off - reviewers and owners alike really didn't like how it felt. I steered my father away from that when he bought his 3.7L car, and he's been happy as can be with it for almost ten years now.
AlexWIWA@reddit
Yeah people shit all over the DAS. I personally declined the tech package because I didn't like how the DAS felt. I think the DAS was their biggest misstep with the line and basically killed it in the cradle.
aprtur@reddit
Completely agree - it should've been a standalone option, but I guess Nissan wasn't ready to split it from ProPilot yet at the time.
AlexWIWA@reddit
It's funny you say that. I had a post back in like 2018 where I was bitching that I couldn't get the smart cruise control without also getting DAS
solo118@reddit
yes, super long
mini4x@reddit
I guess sharing a platform with the Z and GTR explains that one too.
JamesPumaEnjoi@reddit
The Q50 Red Sport Black Opal Edition is a “guilty pleasure” of mine.
Same with the Ghibli Trofeo/Ultima 334
franksandbeans911@reddit
Also a shame that the Eau Rouge didn't see daylight and the one prototype that was built was crashed within minutes.
AwesomeBantha@reddit
Gotta love trim names that have 3 colors in them
TunakTun633@reddit
The Q50 is a painfully missed opportunity.
With no development money to go around, the Q50's engines will never match the performance / efficiency profile of a basic BMW 330i, Audi A4 2.0T, or Mercedes C300. Except 10 years ago, the Q50 Hybrid did exactly that - all while using a real automatic transmission.
Picture a revised Q50 with the Frontier's 9-speed automatic, maybe the VC 2.0T / VR 3.0T instead of the 3.7 VQ (for emissions/displacement tax), and maybe even a option for a large enough battery to plug in. These are largely plug-and-play components; a segment-best competitor is a calibration away. A new dashboard isn't horribly expensive, and the new Z demonstrates the chassis is still good enough.
Now, if these things were applied to the old FM-based QX50, perhaps it would sell better. But the sedan form factor has an advantage in the form of enthusiast interest. What if Infiniti leaned a bit into that, and called the Q50 the Skyline? Add a bumper-and-wing package if you really want to play into it - that could be fun.
Here's another fun idea: The Q50's DAS means you can turn the steering wheel without turning the wheels. So why can't it be a video game controller? The people who love the Skyline are probably the same sorts of people who would love to play Playstation using their car's inputs. I'm not sure how many of them can buy a $50K luxury sedan, mind you...
AlexWIWA@reddit
Dropping the hybrid was dumb as hell on their part. They discontinued it right when hybrids and EVs were starting to get popular.
TunakTun633@reddit
In fairness, they weren't the only ones! Chevy dropped the Malibu hybrid without propagating a 1.8L/eCVT hybrid system to the Equinox; even Lexus didn't see a future with the GS450h powertrain in the IS sedan.
I can't think of a single example that shouldn't be back in production, frankly.
AlexWIWA@reddit
Yup. People in 2014 were worried about battery replacement costs, but here we are 10 years later and the batteries in those Q50s are going strong and people are asking for them to be produced again. They should have just let it cook and advertise it as their fastest model (I think it was until the RS400)
TunakTun633@reddit
Between EVs shifting the Overton window and the introduction of all-hybrid mainstream cars (eg Camry), I think people are finally treating a hybrid powertrain as a valuable feature instead of a mysterious liability.
On that front, I can't think of a reason you can't use the Red Sport's engine with the hybrid system. Both seem to work with AWD. Compared to the heavy PHEVs the Germans are starting to make, I think it would impress.
For that matter, beef up the AWD system a bit. I wonder if selling something called a "Skyline GT-R" would attract some adequately-wealthy customers...
AlexWIWA@reddit
I agree fully. Basically they could have had their own version of the i8, but instead they're going full EV when they infrastructure isn't there yet. I honestly don't know if the brand will survive unless they're getting some massive subsidies for going full EV.
aprtur@reddit
To be fair, the hybrid IS never died in full - it just left the US market, and focused on where it sold better (EU, JP, AUS markets). They could easily bring it back to the US if they felt it'd be worthwhile.
TunakTun633@reddit
Oh, 100%. I think the V6 450h is better suited to US tastes, but Lexus has also historically sold a slow IS variant (250/300).
vishysuave@reddit
Infiniti sucks these days. I’m on my last one.
Elpandelabodega@reddit
Seams like all the cheap cars are going away. That should mean that the economy it is growing like hell and minimum salary is now 30 dollars an hour.
franksandbeans911@reddit
30 dollars an hour with the spending power of 20. Cheap cars are still cheap, you just have to adjust for inflation.
Europe_1986@reddit
Does anyone anticipate F-Types to continue to depreciate or retain most of their value? It would be nice to pick one up in a year or two if they keep trending downwards
1988rx7T2@reddit
If Jaguar ceases to exist (make a bunch of EVs nobody buys) as a brand they may end up orphaned which is probably not good for resale
franksandbeans911@reddit
Not good for parts either. With their dodgy quality, I wouldn't want to gamble with parts availability from a dead company.
sonic_sabbath@reddit
Exactly what I was thinking... Pick up a V8 F-Type and hold onto it for 20 years
Quake_Guy@reddit
Thought people would care more about them then they actually did.
Should have bought a KKR, seems they were more popular than any F type.
IStillLikeBeers@reddit
They will continue to depreciate. Regardless of what's going on with Jag, they all depreciate rather terribly, but V8 F-types may not be as bad.
eyeothemastodon@reddit
This seems like a lot of models. Is this as unusual as I think it is?
bosshawk1@reddit
Historically it is perhaps abnormal. For the past 5 years? It actually seems low. There are only so many non SUVs left to kill, which is almost entirely what the list is. Remove the exotics, and there really aren't many vehicles going away.
eyeothemastodon@reddit
Shit dude, exactly what I was wondering. Thanks!
-Ernie@reddit
With no more manual transmission you might as well add GTI to the list…
illawgickal@reddit
I never would be able to afford one, but sad to see the GTR go.
beh5036@reddit
Crazy to think those started production in 2007. Same year as the first iPhone.
DustyBusterson@reddit
2007 wasn’t that long ago, I’d just started working at a Nissan dealer as a lube tech when the GTR came out. Ended up doing another career entirely but it was cool to get to see it up close and drive it a bit when it was new.
hentai_wanker_69@reddit
To me 2007 feels like a long time ago because I was born that year. It feels crazy that they have made the same car for my entire life.
DustyBusterson@reddit
JFC I turned 21 in 2007, what grade are you in?
hentai_wanker_69@reddit
I am not American so the education system is a bit different in my country. I am in the 2nd year of automotive mechanic school and I am supposed to graduate in the 3rd year.
That_Swim@reddit
What did you move onto? I left automotive for industrial maintenanc.
DustyBusterson@reddit
Insurance, currently working from home making $8 an hour more than I did even after being promoted to assistant manager at Jiffy Lube.
BodegaCat@reddit
Same. I was hoping used models would be more affordable but sadly since the pandemic any put up for sale also appear to be extremely expensive
EpicHuggles@reddit
It's actually insane how well they hold their value. Heavily modified 2012 GTRs with 75k miles on them still command like 75% of their original MSRP on the used market.
BodegaCat@reddit
Yeah exactly, 10+ year old GTRs selling for 80-100k, saw a listing for a 2015 black edition for $160k today (albeit with 20k miles). I could pay similar prices and buy a long list of AWD sport cars like 911s, RS6 Avant, M4/M5, etc. that are new or used (not 10 years used)
TireShineWet@reddit
Early years with like 60k miles were in the $40k ish beginning of Covid
madcow9100@reddit
I was looking for one recently and ended up with an Aston Martin as a cheaper alternative. Wild to think about
cubs223425@reddit
Not just that, but the 50% MSRP hike by Nissan, and low production, means the used ones never get pushed down on price.
AndroidMyAndroid@reddit
Not with how quickly Nissan raised the price on the thing! It was relatively cheap when it came out.
rental_car_fast@reddit
This is the one I feel the most sad about. But also, I'd never buy a Nissan, so I guess it makes sense that they're killing it cause I'm betting many others are feeling the same.
Nissan isn't what it used to be. Now they're just a sub-prime loan company that happens to sell cars.
SolarMacharius562@reddit
Yeah, the R35 was a favorite of elementary school aged me \~12 years ago, I still remember when the service manager at the dealership my dad would always take his old Infiniti to gave me a free promotional shirt of it.
I know it's probably a moonshot but I really hope I'll be in a spot in maybe 10 years to grab one of these late production examples since they're expensive enough that the owners usually take good care of them lol
vinicelii@reddit
For a long time my dream car, unfortunately probably better off I never get one with the way Nissan has been going.
Vazhox@reddit
Same. The GTR and Camaro are the two cars I’m sad to see on the list
JoshJLMG@reddit
Not the Kia Forte!
mini4x@reddit
It's was redesigned and is now called the K4.
AlonsoFerrari8@reddit
No hatchback? Pass
mini4x@reddit
one exists, but seems not out yet, or not in the US .
andrewia@reddit
Technically the K4 is a different car, since it's on the new K platform. The K3/Forte was on the older J platform.
mini4x@reddit
Yes but its still the replacement for the Forte in their lineup.
PintoI007@reddit
Wow that actually looks kinda cool. Pretty robust feature set as well. Id probably choose that over the Elantra for looks alone.
handymanshandle@reddit
The Forte is getting rebranded as the K4, and more importantly it’s now on the same platform that the Hyundai Elantra has been on for four years now.
cpttucker126@reddit
Considering it one of the last cheaper cars you can buy and get it new under 20k. Its kinda sad.
ChasedWarrior@reddit
Yet the Malibu lives on
AlonsoFerrari8@reddit
I can always identify a tourist around here because Malibus are used as rental cars by the hundreds
VEGA3519@reddit
Not really, it will be discountinued in November this year
SFWarriorsfan@reddit
AMG GT63 S 4 Door couple should have been one of these too but AMG has decided one more year to sell the GT63 S E-Performance.
FordTaurusFPIS@reddit
LC500 STILL LIVING
icanredditgood@reddit
Dodge will be back with v8s and manual transmissions after they are sold off in bankruptcy
Sparks_PC_Building@reddit
.
rahim770@reddit
Not surprised about the gtr that thing is an absolute dinosaur and overpriced for what you get. In 07 the msrp was amazing and i’d have gotten one hands down if i was old enough but now an r8 would be a better choice for similar money
Important_Wasabi4914@reddit
One thing about the Fisker Ocean, it helps identify the dumb people.
PNF2187@reddit
In spite of the company going under, I somehow saw 2 Oceans today. They could have been the same one, but these were both very far apart, so it seems unlikely.
cwatson214@reddit
Or exceedingly brave, though I admit that's a thin line lol
BoK_b0i@reddit
Thank God the Mirage is dead
ZaheerAlGhul@reddit
RIP Q50 felt like they could've kept it going. With a refresh and maybe that 4 cylinder the qx60 got.
rontonsoup__@reddit
That qx60 engine is too unreliable. it honestly may have done more harm than good.
AlexWIWA@reddit
They could have kept it going pretty easily if they gave it a 9 speed and upgraded the top screen, and dash screen. It was a dumb decision to kill it entirely.
ZaheerAlGhul@reddit
I was thinking the same thing. Update the interior and exterior and the transmission could've gave the car new life. And if they could have some how added a manual would've breathe some new life into it. Oh well In a year Infiniti is probably only going to be selling two vehicles.
AlexWIWA@reddit
It's such a shame. I have been a fan of the brand for a long time, but they probably won't even have a sedan when my Q50 dies. Oh well, Porsche still exists.
covidcode69@reddit
I saw the K4 in person and it looks good.
euph31@reddit
I desperately want a Jaguar F Type, they seem so fun
mrRaikiri@reddit
The Titan?!
vistaflip@reddit
We're losing the last teeny car in north America.
Affectionate_Art1271@reddit
I wasn’t prepared for depression this evening.
MaybeNext-Monday@reddit
Anyone know of a car brand that survived having zero offerings for a whole year? Because I cannot imagine a universe in which that bodes well.
Teledildonic@reddit
TVR? They can't seem to stay alive, but they also won't stay dead.
StanknBeans@reddit
Are they really a car brand or just a bunch of blokes in a shed that make something occasionally?
MaybeNext-Monday@reddit
Yeah they feel too specialty to meaningfully compare
RoosterDenturesV2@reddit
They are still producing/selling the F-Pace, which is by far their most popular vehicle in North America.
simon2517@reddit
I believe Ford didn't sell any cars from May to December 1927. Not quite a year but they seemed to survive.
MaybeNext-Monday@reddit
Not really a comparable market though
Michelanvalo@reddit
The branding still has value. Someone can use it to re-tool the brand and relaunch it.
TunakTun633@reddit
At least all the dealers are hybrid J/LR dealers, right? I don't think dealers are upset with Land Rover's performance.
The world forgetting Jaguar isn't great in general, but could also have the effect of resetting brand identity. By the time the XF was discontinued here, they had to use the Cadillac approach of selling a 5-Series competitor at 3-Series prices. It wouldn't be awful for their profits to shift a bit upmarket - maybe going back to the prestige tier of Porsche, Maserati, and... Well... Land Rover.
NopeNotEvenOnce@reddit
Oh no, I guess I'll never have a chance to get that new Bugatti Chiron anymore. /s
benzguy95@reddit
I’m sad to see the Titan go truth be told. It had just the right amount of tech and creature comforts that it should’ve been able to match sales of the others but between the failure of the Cummins and waiting a bit too late to redesign the first generation, I feared it wouldn’t be able to stay long in the market.
DangerousAd1731@reddit
Kia forte lol
JaredUnzipped@reddit
I'm going to pour one out for the Mirage tonight.
BearBlaq@reddit
As an old venza owner, the new one had a good run. I even got my uncle and aunt to buy one and they love it.
darkoj-@reddit
I like my 2022 Mitsubishi Mirage G4 very much since buying it new 2 years ago. It has its quirks and shortcomings, and, understandably, many would dismiss it because of them, in favor of a similarly sized vehicle; but a God damnit, it's treated me well with its little 5 speed transmission, and it's a huge step up from my previous 2006 Lancer.
Sad to see it go, not necessarily because the car deserves to live on (though, I do think that it was a steal of a buy at pre-COVID pricing for budget strapped buyers (which everyone is if you're considering a Mirage)), but because it's telling of the inexorable trend towards larger and costlier vehicles dominating the roadways, with the sedan (and manual transmissions) becoming a relic of the past.
When I pass this car on to my soon to be licensed daughter, I cringe at the thought of what inexpensive, reliable, standard transmission equipped sedans will be available to replace it with.
VintageBandit@reddit
I loved my 15' Mirage. It was similar to what a modern Classic VW Beetle would be like. Just worked and worked and worked.
darkoj-@reddit
That's exactly what it does: it works. And for the price I pay in a car note, insurance, gas, and upkeep, it fits my lifestyle perfectly.
01101011000110@reddit
Damn, Nissan really missed on the Titan, didn't it?
beardmat87@reddit
Honestly they aren’t that bad. Had one as a rental last year and it was a comfortable well driving truck. Great seats. It just suffered from the Nissan name being associated with cheap lease shit boxes so much so that most buyers never gave them a chance
nissanfan64@reddit
The Ram Classic is finally going down? That’s actually a shame, I really liked how they kept that dinosaur going for so long.
I mean, to me they died when they dropped the single cab model a year or two ago but still. It’s neat even they still made Classics.
ThermalScrewed@reddit
Over 2 decades of 3rd gen RAM. I don't think any pickup has been on the market half that long? The OBS Chevy ran for what felt like forever and that was one decade.
Chompskiii@reddit
3rd gen RAM ran 2001-2008, 4th gen RAM ran 2009-2025, so not quite over 2 decades for either generation.
ThermalScrewed@reddit
Where did you get those numbers? 2001 was a different body style. The new ones came out for 03 and the hemi wasn't until 04. I have a 2003 Durango with a 360 in the garage. Calling the facelifted 3rd gen a 4th gen seems ridiculous to me but I guess that's the consensus. Here I thought the 4th gen was the new 2019+ update.
Chompskiii@reddit
I made a mistake, first model year for the third gen was 2002. 2001 was second gen. The third gen is different enough in styling and components to be separate from the fourth gen, which includes the RAM Classic. 2019+ is 5th gen. The wikipedia page has a breakdown of each generation.
ThermalScrewed@reddit
I had an 05 and now a 2018 and they might as well be the same. I get it, but calling the 3rd gen with a Ram box and slight facelift a new generation seems like a marketing scheme. A 76 and a 78 Ford have different grilles, but are mostly the same truck as another example. Thanks.
TunakTun633@reddit
My favorite thing about the RAM Classic was how cheap it was. It was like having a midsized truck competitor, without it being... Well... Midsized. The American way.
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HiTork@reddit
Both GM and Ford have in the past kept a previous generation of their pick-ups on sale when a new one arrives, but usually only for one model year. For example, the PN-96 F-150 generation was available in 2004 as the F-150 Heritage, which included the F-150 Lightning performance truck.
On the other hand, they kept the previous gen Ram alive for half a decade after the new one dropped in 2019, I thought for sure the Ram Classic was also going to be a single model year transition as the torch was passed to the next generation.
nissanfan64@reddit
And what’s kinda sad is that around here I see more Classic models than the next generation styling. And it’s honestly by a decent margin.
JamesNonstop@reddit
I think the styling on the classic is way better. And I bet the 0% financing helps!
HiTork@reddit
I'm not surprised in a way as the price is significantly cheaper for the previous generation. Sure, it might not be up to snuff as the latest competition, but you are getting a new truck for less than rival makes.
j250ex@reddit
Fairly good sales as well. Bunch of folks laid off at FCA last week as this model came to an end.
land8844@reddit
FCA isn't a thing anymore, it's been Stellantis (ask your doctor) for several years now.
1988rx7T2@reddit
Regulations. Also people got laid off due to it ending production
Dud3_Abid3s@reddit
Thank god for Ford keeping the V8 Mustang alive…I’m forever grateful.
internutthead@reddit
...ugh. Since no one else has said it...
The Venza? WHAT WILL EMPTY NESTERS DO NOW?!?
dinkygoat@reddit
The Lexus NX, probably.
p90rushb@reddit
Small cars, out! Luxury trucks, in!
geardownson@reddit
I know a lot of folks hate on Jag and they deserve the reputation for not fixing their constant issues but I've seen some of their sports cars around and id have to say the designs look really good.
I just wish they would fix quality control or prices to fix if someone actually wants to take a chance. I feel the same way about Maserati.
wetchuckles@reddit
Is Infiniti quitting on sedans altogether as well?
NotoriousCFR@reddit
Wasn’t the Camaro already discontinued? I feel like I’ve been hearing/reading about the death of the Camaro forever
austic@reddit
Nissan GT R was always on my list just got way too expensive. I swear those cars have more than d doubled msrp wise since they came out.
PopFew3030@reddit
GT-R is the saddest name on this list.
frunklord420@reddit
Most of these are either boring, bad or just outright unaffordable for their target audience.
Very few cars in here will actually be noticeably missed.
too_many_shoes14@reddit
What's even left of Jaguar then?
bucky_ballers@reddit
Stopping production altogether to retool as a luxury/expensive EV maker (coincidentally just as the arse falls out of the market, but that’s another topic)
x3nhydr4lutr1sx@reddit
Waymo in shambles.
land8844@reddit
Waymo also uses Chrysler minivans, which aren't going anywhere any time soon.
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JoyRydr@reddit
They announced a couple weeks ago that they're moving to Ionic 5s.
Barack_Odrama_007@reddit
Jaguar just CANNOT get right. Ugh
MaybeNext-Monday@reddit
Of the various manufacturers that over-committed to EVs, Jaguar and Maserati are at the bottom of the likely-to-survive-it rankings.
Oricle10110@reddit
Ironically, their old product lineup spelled out "E FIX"
1988rx7T2@reddit
Time to pour one out then.
My grandpa had an XJ12 40 years ago, they’re not what they were
c172fccc@reddit
F-Pace
Sarujji@reddit
Oh no! Not the Fisker.
Affalt@reddit
Kia Forte outsold and outlived the Scion tC; they were an even match a decade ago.
robbobeh@reddit
Ohhhh!! I love the Quattroporte
Tough_Steak@reddit
RIP VK56 and VR38, bad year to be a Nissan enthusiast. :[
DrWatson90@reddit
ThisIsTheWorst.gif
Wolf24h@reddit
Don't worry, they'll come back as crossovers/SUVs
mini4x@reddit
They claim to be going 100% EV.
StillPissed@reddit
Was just going to say, this just looks like they are adjusting to market trends. RIP cars?
yudha98@reddit
RIP Jaguar