Should they have let Worf kill himself?

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bobbywaz@reddit

Yes then he wouldn't have been a cliche in ds9

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UrdnotFeliciano667@reddit

If he had, then we wouldn't have had that asshole calling himself Worf in DS9.

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The_Humbergler@reddit

Miles O'Brien would have appeared in the most episodes.

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ILeftMyBrainOnTheBus@reddit

I love the idea that the TNG and DS9 writers just had a d20 and a results table.

1 invent new space bad guys

2 space anomalies

3 federation bad guys

4 fuck with miles

5 fuck with keiko

6 fuck with miles and keiko

7 q stuff

8 fuck with miles

9 klingon stuff

10 ferengi stuff

11 romulan stuff

12 fuck with miles

13 cardassian stuff

14 fuck with miles

15 give miles a bre... nah, fuck with miles

16 holodeck malfunction

17 fuck with reg

18 fuck with miles

19 fuck with miles

20 really fuck with miles.

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RetroGamer87@reddit

Is this how he became the most important man in Starfleet?

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flyingloony49@reddit

There's not enough 'fuck with miles' on there

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ILeftMyBrainOnTheBus@reddit

That's why we have TWO dice!

Nothing wrong with fucking with Miles AND having Q throw the ship into an interstellar cheese grater.

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They failed to uphold The Prime Directive in their own ship *unless Starfleet makes crew sign an agreement allowing Captain / Admin to make any call they deem fit, even if it differs from their cultural beliefs

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RetroGamer87@reddit

Why is his blanket so fabulous!

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E-emu89@reddit

“You must help me kill myself. I broke my back picking up a peanut.”

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Avasia1717@reddit

we'd still have the enterprise E if they let him.

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ExpectedBehaviour@reddit

Wouldn't have needed the Enterprise-E if Worf could have remembered to press the fire button.

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SirStocksAlott@reddit

The irony of running a level 1 diagnostic to ensure the ship will be ready for battle, but not being ready for an actual battle because the weapons are offline during the level 1 diagnostic.

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EffectiveSalamander@reddit

That's a big flaw. You should always be able to activate critical systems. Anything that makes the ship inoperable should be a starbase-only procedure, something rarely uses and only when there are other ships available.

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agent-V@reddit

Starfleet always messes up system processes. Heck Voyager couldn't even go to warp without a computer core. Or order a self-destruct when the Kazon hit a couple unrelated parts of the ship.

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ExpectedBehaviour@reddit

Not going to warp without a computer core makes sense since it requires continual sub-nanosecond-accurate coordination of thousands of separate components. What doesn’t make sense is that Voyager has two computer cores, a primary and a secondary, and should be able to maintain all key ship functions like warp drive if the primary core is offline.

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jakeod27@reddit

Little known fact, the secondary core was just Active Directory and Exchange.

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henryeaterofpies@reddit

And porn...lots and lots of porn.

Main reason they needed to get home was they had a whole quadrant of newly acquired porno

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jakeod27@reddit

Help me step-bro Kazon, I’m stuck in a Jeffries tube

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henryeaterofpies@reddit

Five nines of uptime doesnt exist in the future

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DiscordianDisaster@reddit

I mean they're alone in deep space half the time. It makes perfect sense to me that anything needed to allow the ship to run should be something you can do on your own. Honestly no chief engineer would fly otherwise. But having a diagnostic process you can't interrupt feels like a bad idea, and if it can't be interrupted, maybe don't do it unless you're super triple sure you are safe. Or maybe have like some backup defense systems that aren't offline? Do two phaser banks on separate circuits or something idk.

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Brunt-FCA-285@reddit

That was NOT his fault.

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Mass-Effect-6932@reddit

If Worf would have kill himself

Jadzia would still be alive. She would have been on the Defiant and Dukat couldn’t kill her at the temple on the station.
Julian and Erzi would have never met
Enterprise-E wouldn’t been destroyed. LaForge would have replaced Picard as Captain. He would been Picard last senior officer still serving with him since the Enterprise-D.

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andorejunior@reddit

He also wouldn't have slain gowron

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Piper6728@reddit

Yeah the Alpha Quadrant wouldve lost the Dominion war since Gowron would've ruined the Klingons holding things together with the Breen weapon

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veryverythrowaway@reddit

Jadzia would have died in that one episode where Worf went rogue to save her.

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Mass-Effect-6932@reddit

Idk, Jadzia wouldn’t have been in the runabout coming from her honeymoon with Worf. Starfleet probably would have contracted some other officer or ship that was in range to rescue the cardassian

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veryverythrowaway@reddit

Or she could have died at any point in season 4. It’s hard to say what happens when a major character disappears.

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Excellent_Title6408@reddit

If worf died, who would get his ass kicked everytime the plot demanded we take some threat more seriously?

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brachus12@reddit

just restore him from the last transporter backup

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kkkan2020@reddit

this is a unpopular opinion but when picard told Q that one time that no being is important enough to usurp the rights of another... they definitely did worf dirty here by not allowing him to exercise his cultures belief in self deletion.

Riker also giving worf shit for his cultures beliefs on self deletion.

I would have transported a phaser 1 next to worfs bed stand walked out and looked the other way if he was really intent on ending his existence.

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tonymagoni@reddit

I know this will be an unpopular opinion, but Riker is in the right here. Two things: 1. Worf is asking Riker to do something against his beliefs. Riker's beliefs are no less important, and he has every right to balk at that and argue against it. He shouldn't be expected to throw away his own culture. 2. It's been repeatedly shown (even in this episode) that worf knows jack shit about actual Klingon beliefs. He's a Wikipedia expert, and letting him kill himself based on that would be insane

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manchuck@reddit

When he joined Starfleet, he then agreed to follow Starfleet laws. Since the Klingons never joined the UFP, Klingon customs that conflict would not apply. It's like if a woman decides to visit Saudi Arabia and refuses to wear a hijab, then she is going to get arrested. Now, if the Klingons decide to join, I'm positive there will be negotiations that would codify this situation. If the UFP agrees to allow Klingons to kill themselves, then yes they have to let him do that

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Phooney124@reddit

Yes. Honor traditions of his religion and ways. Its not fair to force 'the right way' without a choice. I also agree that Riker not doing it based on friendship was right according to his views.

Each person should be able to act in their best interests according to their beliefs.

The ending of the episode was good as well.

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Donjeur@reddit

When worf uses the real Klingon words for things why doesn’t the universal translator step in and auto tune it into English? It would be good to see episodes where they get irritated and try to disconnect their badges from it so they can use foreign words. Then have to reconnect their badges before beaming down to away missions but it takes a while to pair so they have to reset it a few times

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MrGeekman@reddit

Probably because it’s not Doctor Who.

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Donjeur@reddit

I was assuming the comm badges use Bluetooth but maybe it’ll be something else

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ILeftMyBrainOnTheBus@reddit

Comm badges are clearly psychic*.

Whenever a character presses their com badge a speaker in exactly the right room turns on before a word is uttered, and the precise recipient gets the message. No delay, as characters off screen will answer immediately.

*not to be confused with Badgey, who is clearly psychotic.

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secondtaunting@reddit

I think an explanation would be for words that are language and culture specific the universal translator uses those words. Sort of like how we have a word for suicide, but when we’re speaking about Japanese ritualistic suicide we say Seppuku. So it’s specific to that action inside of that culture. That or it just sounds cool. 🤷‍♀️

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aangnesiac@reddit

Another example is taarof in Persian culture. You're expected to offer guests anything and everything they might want, and the guest is expected to refuse that offer. It can go back and forth multiple times. It wouldn't make sense to use any other word or pronunciation for their little hospitality ritual.

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MrGeekman@reddit

Yeah, they’d probably have something better by the 24th century.

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ForswornForSwearing@reddit

We should have something better now.

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MrGeekman@reddit

Agreed. Though, for headphones, I’d still prefer wired, even just because I don’t want to have yet another device to charge and risk forgetting to charge it.

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ForswornForSwearing@reddit

I don't like sitting a foot away from my device, and the video not matching with the audio. Or walking ten feet away and dropping out.

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bgeorgewalker@reddit

We could have Riker run into a phone booth and then switch scenes and he is running into a giant orgy in Risa

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MrGeekman@reddit

Nice! That would also work for Superman!

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upthewaterfall@reddit

Same reason we use German words for things that Germans have words for but other people do not.

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Donjeur@reddit

No one who speaks German could be evil!

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kat-the-bassist@reddit

Worf blacklisted Klingon from his comm badge so he can use Klingon words without them being translated. The rest of the time, he's speaking Russian.

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Donjeur@reddit

Da!!!!

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eeeby@reddit

Maybe because at this point Klingon words are assimilated into human vocabulary. Kinda like how English got the words “jungle” or “bandana” from Urdu. Idk. The real answer is just because it makes his dialogue more interesting but this can be a head canon maybe.

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Donjeur@reddit

That’s a cool thought!

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SenatorCrabHat@reddit

I mean, if they had, the Dominion War would be a LOT different

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TangoInTheBuffalo@reddit

If they had, so much nonsense would have been avoided. No DS9, ergo, no Jadzia, and especially, no Ezri.

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andorejunior@reddit

Perhaps today is a good day to die

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WaitingToBeTriggered@reddit

SONS OF ODIN CALL

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Fine-Funny6956@reddit

Alexander could have pretended his father loved him if he had.

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DookieToe2@reddit

No, because then he wouldn’t be in DS9.

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iXenite@reddit

Worf is pretty consistently one of the most annoying characters in this series. No they should not have let him die for no reason.

What’s most frustrating was how difficult it seemed to be for 24th century miracle medicine to get Worf back on his feet.

Also, Worf trying to get his friends to kill him was messed up. But that’s one of Worfs biggest negatives is that he often thinks about himself and his honor before others and how they feel. It’s what makes him a bad father, brother, lover, and friend.

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Kennedygoose@reddit

No. They should have let Alexander do it.

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techm00@reddit

would have prevented years of shitty parenting on poor Alexander

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Global_Custard3900@reddit

Would have been the best move as a father he could have made.

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Thick_You2502@reddit

Yes.

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sausage_eggwich@reddit

lmao the title had me thinking this was r/shittydaystrom

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Happily-Non-Partisan@reddit

Given how progressive the Federation is supposed to be, I'm surprised they don't have Canadian-style medical assistance in dying (MAID).

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EvilWhiteDude@reddit

2nd Star Trek thread I’ve read in a row that talks about Seppuku. Are you guys sad summer time’s over? I don’t think they should have let Worf off himself. They should have tried motivating him by stripping him naked and covering his genitals with the same little disco washcloth they gave Geordi after Worf got him killed. Crusher and the nurses giggles’ would have enraged him and filled him with a fire for vengeance.

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heyitsmemaya@reddit

Klingon Logic: • “There is no honor in dying dishonorably” Also Klingon Logic: • “There is no honor in killing yourself.”

Most belief systems catch themselves in quandaries.

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heyitsmemaya@reddit

TBH I think if this episode were made after 2004-2005 (Terry Schiavo era not sure on years exactly) they would have let him…

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LAGirlinDC@reddit

Yes. It's like violating the PD of one person to not respect his wishes.

I feel like the Federation would have already have very specific laws in place.... did they?

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Icy_Sector3183@reddit

So, in Half a Life, they allow the scientist to return home and be put to death. Sure, he goes willingly, but it's very much due to the immense social pressure: In Timicin's case, his life is over whether he dies or not.

In Worf's case, I dunno. It's different because there's the possibility he might be healed?

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BigConstruction4247@reddit

This episode was contemporary (roughly) with Dr Kevorkian and the debate about euthanasia is the USA, which is still ongoing.

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LAGirlinDC@reddit

Omg I didn't put that together. Looks like the Worfs of our world are winning. Hehe

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strigonian@reddit

That's... not what the Prime Directive is at all.

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LAGirlinDC@reddit

LOL. OH WOW OTAY

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the908bus@reddit

When Riker and Worf were on the Borg cube in S3 of Picard, would have been great if Riker said “you’d have missed all this fun if you killed yourself bro”

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Abject-Management558@reddit

I can't imagine Riker referring to Worf as bro.

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BedroomVisible@reddit

They were going to but Alexander was too much of a wuss! /s

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Forlorn_Cyborg@reddit

Alexander should have accepted...DISCOMMEDATION.

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honeybadger1984@reddit

I would love to cross my arms and turn my back on Alexander. Just to watch him cry. I would even setup mirrors so I could watch and enjoy the tears.

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aneurism75@reddit

they should have just erased his memory and send him to a new life on DS9

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seamallorca@reddit

I have nothig to add to the discussion, but: Snorf.

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Swimming_Sink277@reddit

Worf if the surgery doesn't work THEN you can commit sudoku

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Forsaken-Income-2148@reddit

Did you mean seppuku? You definitely meant seppuku.

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SmartQuokka@reddit

THEN you can commit sudoku

Its a numbers game.

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Sea_Negotiation_1871@reddit

I think they should have let him play a number game even if it did work.

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bluekronos@reddit

I don't appreciate most people's thoughts on suicide. They call the act selfish.

They're happy to have someone live in agony every day as long as they don't have to experience the grief of their death.

Why is the pain of the suicidal person less valid than the people around them? Who's being selfish?

Respect people's decision. They don't make it lightly. You can do your best to convince them, but you don't shit on their feelings on the matter.

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Ok-Push9899@reddit

Why did the writers never try to give Worf some complex motivations? If it's not defending his sacred Klingon honour, or "walking a fine line between two cultures", he's got nothing.

I just wished the writers had entertained the possibility that Klingons, well Worf in particular, had more going on. Other Klingons have deceit, ambition, suspicion, and a range of paths to tread: Worf has nothing.

So this episode: I am injured, I am a warrior, I must kill myself. Oh, I don't need to? OK, done.

Worf offers as much challenging character motivation and character development as the fish in Picard's ready room. Data might ostensibly be the Tin Man from the Wizard of Oz, but in fact it's Worf. I have a feeling there was no writer who ever actually liked writing for him. The lines write themselves. The word "intriguing" could never be affixed to Worf. Like the fish, you know where he's at, at all times.

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