Collapsing wildlife populations near ‘points of no return’, report warns | Biodiversity
Posted by HikingWithBokoblins@reddit | PrepperIntel | View on Reddit | 58 comments
SpecialistOk3384@reddit
There's one population that can collapse 70% or greatly more and the wildlife could recover better because of it...
R-K-Tekt@reddit
WWIII is around the corner so maybe, plus population is in decline thank god.
SpecialistOk3384@reddit
Well, not wishing for it at all. But I would say that wars are vastly destructive to animal and plant life as well.
The global human population was 800 million when the Declaration of Independence was signed.
We're giant rodents.
R-K-Tekt@reddit
Yeah that’s what I’m getting at, we’re greedy pests and it’ll eventually all come crashing down.
CasanovaPreen@reddit
we’re greedy pests
Not necessarily we. By and large - Indigenous populations live in rhythm with Earth and with non-human animals. The climate collapse is caused by capitalism and colonialism specifically.
HomoExtinctisus@reddit
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_Noble_savage
Indigenous populations say like the one at Head-Smashed-In Buffalo Jump lived in relative balance with nature because they didn't have technology to exploit resources further. They didn't chose to not have better technology, in fact their descendants adopted it as soon as they were introduced to it. The idea that indigenous people like those at Head-Smashed-In Buffalo Jump lived in perfect harmony with nature is an oversimplification as well.
The idea that a culture is going to protect nature is a modern phenomena and is antithetical to our biology. Many indigenous cultures did develop practices and traditions that enabled them to live sustainably within their environments for long periods but only because it was what allowed them to survive. Give them the choice to develop Ag and antibiotics then watch what they do.
CasanovaPreen@reddit
To quote Henry Cavill : "Wikipedia?! You're using Wikipedia as your source of information?"
Tsk. Tsk. Tsk.
HomoExtinctisus@reddit
OMG a source of facts. Grab your pitchforks.
Tank_Girl_Gritty_235@reddit
Cavil was being asked about nerd stuff and he's incredibly nerdy.
Inevitable_Ad_5664@reddit
Ummmm nope. Easter islanders, slash and burn in the Amazon etc
kittykatmila@reddit
Definitely need a massive population decline but I would love to not experience WWIII. Whenever anyone says that we need population growth for the economy, I feel nauseous.
R-K-Tekt@reddit
Oh def, war isn’t a great thing but if anything will reduce human population it’s either war or a major disease outbreak.
kittykatmila@reddit
It’s sad but it’s the truth 😭
Runningoutofideas_81@reddit
Maybe if Avian flu takes off.
boofingcubes@reddit
Well gents, it’s been a pleasure 🫡
23nm4573r@reddit
🫡
Vegetaman916@reddit
It is only a "point of no return" if you expect modern civilization to continue. Without that, it might take some time, but many species will rebound.
thehourglasses@reddit
Doubtful. The pace of warming is too fast—many species won’t have time to respond through traditional pathways like population migrations and speciation. Most will simply perish and never come back.
Vegetaman916@reddit
That may be true, and the evidence certainly suggests it. But we don't really know what will happen after, say, a global nuclear war. Exactly how it will affect the climate is up for debate, but it most certainly will affect it.
Also, you have to look at regions. I am here in the Mojave desert. Quite hot already. But wild goats and deer and rabbits and more thrive just fine. The lack of people and towns helps. But on the temperature angle, it will still be quite some time before Saskatchewan looks like Las Vegas.
But yes, many species will perish. But the only reference I was making here was in regards to animals humans traditionally raise as food. While civilization may be gone, small prepper type settlements will survive here and there, maybe my own little 15 person one. And the only animals that will matter for them are those needed to support the community. What happens 100 miles away or 40 years down the road... irrelevant to the needs of the moment.
twohammocks@reddit
I'm sorry to say this but there really is no safe place on earth anymore. We have to start realizing that the earth's atmosphere is like like the inside of a cars': when one person farts - everyone has to smell it. I think its time for one world government - so that companies can't continue to shift operations to where the environmental regs, water quality rules, human rights rules are inadequate. Thanks to globalization, and movement of capital, companies effectively ignore borders, but government's cannot.
ignoreme010101@reddit
despite the myriad dystopian facets to 1 global government, I do get a strong feeling it is would almost necessarily be a part of any true long-term sustainability. but it'd have to be done right and I don't have high hopes for that being a realistic expectation. but yeah whether considering problems like the the environment/ecosystems, or world-wars, it certainly seems humanity has progressed to the point we could do irreparable damage to the planet and/or the species, and if we can't figure out a way to address such things it doesn't bode well for the future. fermi's paradox and all..
CausalDiamond@reddit
Or instead of a OWG, just dismantle most industries and move towards more of an anarcho-primitivist world. It will take multiple generations.
ignoreme010101@reddit
ya but in practical reality you need a government to accomplish that. otherwise there's a power vacuum and nature abhors a vacuum ;)
Vegetaman916@reddit
Maybe so, but it is too late for those things to have any affect. 4 degrees of warming is already baked in, excuse the pun. Perhaps an abrupt end to civilization via nuclear war will have a positive effect. Perhaps not.
But right now, all that matter for those alive today is staying alive for as long as possible...
twohammocks@reddit
No. We still have a chance.
Vegetaman916@reddit
Mmm. Now who's not looking at the science?
But anyway, we have inevitable nuclear war to contend with as well, especially as resource scarcity starts to take hold...
aw4re@reddit
Shout out to Saskatchewan!!!
Vegetaman916@reddit
Is that you, Nate?
Less_Subtle_Approach@reddit
Love this genre of “journalism”. Can’t wait to hear about how we’re nearing the point of no return in 2045 for the eight remaining species of ocean based life.
diamondman203@reddit
Wait why are they being downvoted. I think the argument is that we keep doing “nearing the point of no returning” until we have passed it. The argument isn’t that they DONT think it’s happening; rather that journalism keeps pushing the goalposts until there aren’t goalposts to push.
Less_Subtle_Approach@reddit
Don't sweat it, asking redditors to read two entire sentences to completion is a lot. We're still "nearing" 1.5C even though we can wave to it in the rearview window as of 2023. I'll get plenty more opportunities to spark a thought or two.
AnEngineerByChoice@reddit
Do you know how far above we are now?
HomoExtinctisus@reddit
1.6C
Oralprecision@reddit
Oh goody, another reason to feel helpless about our own destruction.
So… what’s everyone having for lunch?
Thoraxe474@reddit
Soylent green
Spirited-Reputation6@reddit
It’s people!
Thoraxe474@reddit
All that's gonna be left
nubelborsky@reddit
For a while
twohammocks@reddit
Good point. want to help biodiversity? Drop meat. Reasons to drop meat 1. Cheaper. by 16%. 2. Reduce ghg emissions. Diet-related ghg emissions decreased by up to 25% for red and processed meat and by up to 5% for dairy replacements. 3. Improved life expectancy. Reducing red and processed meat or dairy increased life expectancy by up to 8.7 months or 7.6 months, respectively 4. Avoid PFOA/PFAS. A 1-serving higher pork intake was associated with 13.4 % higher PFOA at follow-up (p < 0.05). 5. Alternatives exist. Fungal bacon, insect protein, even muscle cells grown on a rice lattice. 6. Improved nutrition. Partial replacement of red and processed meat with plant-based alternatives improves overall diet quality but may adversely affect the intake of some micronutrients, especially zinc and vitamin B12. 7. Reduce deforestation. Eating one-fifth less beef could halve deforestation. 8. Less food transport emissions. International food imports. Food miles account for nearly 20% of total food-systems emissions 9. Ecosystem imbalance. Livestock make up 62% of the world’s mammal biomass; humans account for 34%; and wild mammals are just 4%. Global poultry weighs more than twice that of wild birds. 10. Reduce spillover risk. 'Nearly 80% of livestock pathogens can infect multiple host species, including wildlife and humans' 11. Reduce increased antibiotic resistance. Cattle watering bowl detection of antibiotic resistance genes - linked to overuse of antibiotics in cattle. 12. Reduce methane emissions. 120 Mt of methane projected from livestock by 2030 (close to reported fossil emissions) 13. More food and land for people and forests. 43% of all our crops go to livestock rather than humans. Why are we competing for soybeans with cows? 14. Ethical and humane treatment reasons. Animals are surprisingly empathetic 15. The animal agriculture industry is now involved in multiple multi-million-dollar efforts with universities to obstruct unfavorable policies as well as influence climate change policy and discourse. 16. Reduce dementia risk. 'Participants with processed red meat intake ≥ 0.25 serving/day, as compared to < 0.10 serving/day, had 15% higher risk of dementia (HR = 1.15; 95% CI: 1.08-1.23; P linearity <0.001)'
If the above doesn't convince you to drop meat, well nothing will, I guess.
If you are interested in links to the scientific papers for the above let me know which one(s)
Oralprecision@reddit
Pretty big assumption - I have stopped buying meat personally, but I’ll eat it if I’m a guest and it’s what is provided.
twohammocks@reddit
Yep, sneaky :) Even 1/5 less meat is a good idea. I have dropped meat completely and I'm working on my dairy consumption. Not everyone can do as I have but even 1 person reads this and reduces their intake I am happy. https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-01238-5
Girafferage@reddit
Don't worry. Prices of beef will make most people drop to about 1/5.
twohammocks@reddit
prices of meat could come down significantly if they used muscle cells grown on rice lattice. Less H5N1 spillover chance from cows to humans too. And more land available for planting trees, growing food crops. And less methane. but this sub appears to not care.
TurtleStepper@reddit
Nah.
Ancient-Being-3227@reddit
Spotted owl.
a_wascally_wabbit@reddit
Every one always wonders about the Fermi paradox, but I feel like we are getting a first hand account on why there are no advanced civs
FuckTheMods5@reddit
You know how toddlers are always trying to kill themselves? I feel like humanity is in the toddler phase lol. Just CONSTANTLY fucking up by the numbers. Doing everything collectively wrong.
If there's no parent around to save the toddler, toddler dies. Hence, no advanced alien civilization. They all die off as a collective race before they get their shit together.
joyous-at-the-end@reddit
i thought we were in the teenager phase since industrialization, since we are selfish, dangerous, and only self-serving.
FuckTheMods5@reddit
Interesting, i dig it!
Kyzer@reddit
Bacteria will always survive, no matter what humans do. We may not be around to see natures revival but it WILL happen.
AnEngineerByChoice@reddit
May just take a couple million years
Puzzleheaded_Town_20@reddit
“We really did have everything, didn’t we?”
maevewolfe@reddit
Even with everything that’s gone wrong the last few years — Nobody had it as good as us, that’s for sure :(
HikingWithBokoblins@reddit (OP)
I feel this way. Boomer here with living memory of how much has changed and how quickly.
Fireflies. Love Bug swarms so thick you'd inhale them if you weren't careful. Stopping every couple of hours on a night drive to scrape the bugs off the headlights and windshield. Being awakened in the Spring because the birds were so loud. Every tiny creek full of tiny crawfish and tadpoles.
And the Gulf of Mexico now . . . I can't even think about it— too depressing.
I remember when the Red Snapper were threatened and they closed the fishery and the population recovered.
I remember when the alligators were threatened and all the conservation efforts and the population recovered.
People have the will to make things better; people want to help. I wish we'd had better guidance and less greed from the influential.
Animaldoc11@reddit
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2022/01/220113194911.htm
Hardly no one talks about this, but it’s happening. I’ll give just one haunting example. How many insects do you clean off the grill of your car after you drive somewhere?
bananapeel@reddit
I live in the PNW. The trees are showing signs of heat stress for about the last 5 years and it's getting worse. A few years ago we had a heat dome of 118F, which was around 10 degrees above the highest temp ever recorded here. There are very few birds in the forest. We used to have slugs, snails, salamanders, small garter snakes, and lots of frogs. Now they are all but gone.
Animaldoc11@reddit
If all the backboned animals died today, earth would be fine. When( not if) all the insects die, any life above insects on the food chain will be gone. All backboned animals will be dead
Spirited-Reputation6@reddit
Flies or wasps in around trash.