Do you drive into the intersection or wait at the line when trying to turn left?
Posted by No_Idea_Guy@reddit | driving | View on Reddit | 381 comments
When trying to turn left at a busy intersection without left turn light and there is no gap with green light on, the consensus seems to be waiting for yellow light AND for the oncoming traffic to stop before turning. What I'm not sure is where should my car stop at when waiting for that yellow light. I see some people wait in the middle of the intersection, while others stop behind the line. Which is the legal and safe approach? Also, if the light turn red before you complete your turn, does that count as running a red light?
MandoHealthfund@reddit
I wait at the line now matter where I'm at. I'm not gonna sit in the middle of intersection when there's always the possibility of someone not paying attention and blowing through a red.
Humble-Train7104@reddit
You're doing it wrong.
MandoHealthfund@reddit
I drive the way I drive i can't risk turning my 7yo into an orphan because some dipshit runs a red light and slams into me
Humble-Train7104@reddit
Okey dokey.
felidaekamiguru@reddit
If you're that terrified of driving, maybe don't drive
MandoHealthfund@reddit
Not terrified of driving, if you lived around Atlanta you'd know how stupid and unpredictable the drivers around here are. Everyday to and from work I see multiple people making dumbass decisions
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
You should not drive if your fears make the roads worse for everyone.
BossJackWhitman@reddit
this is something that many people do, which causes traffic delays. the proper move is, like the top comment says, to advance as far into the intersection before beginning the turn as you can.
FluffySoftFox@reddit
Even in the States where it's technically legal to pull into the intersection it's still generally best safety practice to stay behind the line until there is room for you to clear the intersection safely
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Pretty much all of them.
No, this is rude, unsafe, causes traffic jams, and is even illegal in some places.
theres-no-more_names@reddit
r/confidentlyincorrect
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Lol yeah, all the state traffic codes are wrong 🤣
theres-no-more_names@reddit
Uhhh no, there isnt a single traffic code that states when making a left turn, you should sit in the intersection. You dont enter the intersection unless you are turning in the moment you entered it. You dont sit in the intersection EVER
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
/r/confidentlyincorrect
CombatWombat0556@reddit
This is what I do. I’ll just wait behind the line until it’s clear because shit happens and people might drive as soon as their light turns green
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
If you're going to drive unsafely and cause traffic problems, just stay home.
CombatWombat0556@reddit
How is waiting behind the line unsafe? I’m talking about other people being idiots and driving the second it turns green or people making a turn where they shouldn’t
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Breaking the rules in case other people break rules is a weird take.
Anyway, it's unsafe because it's against the rules and thus unexpected. Also because it causes traffic, which leads to more collisions. Also because it's extremely rude which leads to road rage.
CombatWombat0556@reddit
There’s no fucking law requiring people to pull in front of the line at a traffic light when both directions have green lights.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
It's legal pretty much everywhere, expected almost everywhere, and required in some places (if only by laws against obstructing traffic); and it's correct and considerate literally everywhere.
CombatWombat0556@reddit
I’m not going to risk my families life to be considerate, that’s just stupid. I’ll keep my family safe while pissing impatient people off and you can go ahead and increase the risk of a wreck
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
That's a confusing statement. So you're going to risk your faloes lives to be inconsiderate, then? Weird goal. 🤷🏼♂️
If you want to be safe, follow the rules. I'm not sure who the "impatient people" are in this situation.
Hersbird@reddit
It's even safer to not leave your house.
StevenJenkins64@reddit
Problem with this technique is drivers who do this tend to run the red.
At least where I live, you're allowed to be in the intersection on green, and on yellow, and allowed to clear it on red...you're not allowed to enter the intersection to make your turn after red.
It's a subtle distinction, but an important one. Plus, it never makes sense to me, you're so cautious that you don't enter the intersection when you can legally do so...yet you have no problem running the red light? Make it make sense.
ShadoeRantinkon@reddit
absolutely not in the case of unprotected left turns, especially in dense urban areas. Staying behind the line blocks straight -driving drivers to be able to filter to your right, increasing congestion
JohnnyD423@reddit
If you live in a permissive yellow state, the courteous and expected course of action is to advance as close to the center of the intersection as reasonable and wait for an opening. If the light turns red it's fine. You entered while it was green. Just clear the intersection once traffic has stopped.
ohmyback1@reddit
And if that fire truck comes at you on that cross street, we'll that little old house can just burn down, because you were there first right?
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
What the hell are you talking about? If you block a fire truck like this you've fucked up bad. There's no reason that correctly entering the intersection would cause this problem unless you're doing something else you shouldn't be.
ohmyback1@reddit
Whatever you say. You do you. I will follow the laws (that were changed) in my state. You do you. And answer to those that lose a home or heart attack issue because someone blocked an emergency vehicle in an intersection waiting fir traffic to clear.
il_fienile@reddit
Which state?
ohmyback1@reddit
Washington. I don't know when the law changed. Even when I learned to drive (too long ago) it was common practice. I think with the rising traffic, they just found the need to make rule changes.
anto_capone@reddit
Washington is stupid
Every other state has no issues and no emergency vehicles get blocked
ohmyback1@reddit
Well, after watching various live cop shows in various locations, that is not entirely true. People do not stop for emergency vehicles, they do block intersections. Drivers overall are just jerks. Whenever I see people driving stupid and not stopping, I curse them under my breath and hope that one day it is they or their loved one that is left waiting.
il_fienile@reddit
I can’t find such a law. I can find a Seattle PI article from 2012 that partly implies it, through some faulty reasoning. I can find a more recent piece from KIRO that quoted Brad Benfield with the Department of Licensing, saying, “A vehicle turning left at a signal-controlled intersection is allowed to enter the intersection if the light is green and wait for a safe gap in traffic to complete the turn. In heavy traffic, this might be when oncoming traffic stops for a yellow or red signal. Once oncoming traffic stops, the vehicle is allowed to complete the turn.”
The law the PI piece looked at addresses insufficient space on the other side of the intersection, not a requirement that a vehicle travel directly through the intersection. The incorrect claim that a vehicle couldn’t enter the intersection in the first place was based on a DOL driving exam question, but the DOL statement that I quoted above is more recent.
ohmyback1@reddit
I am not going down that rabbit hole. There was some officer that was in a newspaper or another that was answering questions. It may have been in there. We were chatting about it in a group.of people and it was brought up, I had to look it up. Did find it, but could quote where. It was the last 5 years or so. Nope, not suppose to advance into intersection to wait to turn.
il_fienile@reddit
Like I said, I couldn’t find any such law, but it reminded me of a similar unsubstantiated claim I’d encountered about Washington before, and I remembered having come across the PI article when I was trying to figure out if it was true. Seeing that it was later repudiated by the DOL makes me extremely skeptical (and I’m always skeptical that police officers write citations based on a nuanced understanding of the law), though, and it doesn’t look like the section of the code has been changed. It’s disappointing that in a culture with a million laws, something that actually impacts so many people throughout so much of the day wouldn’t be made very clear by the legislature.
ohmyback1@reddit
Yeah depends on how busy the cop is. The article that popped up this time was in Bellingham (?) So, probably bored
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
You just told us all that you don't follow the law 🤷🏼♂️
Why would anyone do this? What a weird thing to say.
Imaginary-Round2422@reddit
The light will change before the firetruck gets there, at which point you can complete your turn and pull over.
ohmyback1@reddit
If wishes were horses, I'd be up to my eyeballs in horseshit
Imaginary-Round2422@reddit
Which has fuck all to do with anything. You literally will always be able to go when the light changes because the other traffic is not allowed to go until the intersection is clear. Which means they must yield to you.
ohmyback1@reddit
No you're not thinking enough
Expensive_Plant_9530@reddit
If a Firetruck comes from the cross street, you have two choices:
Do nothing. The truck will just go around you, since you're not blocking the entire intersection. Maybe backup a little bit if there's room to do so.
Complete your turn if it's safe to do so.
If the truck wants you out of the way, they'll let you know by honking their horn at you. If that happens, you pull your car out of the way safely by any means necessary.
69brain69@reddit
I wait until I see an opportunity approaching before accelerating into the intersection. If there isn't going to be an opening I don't pull up. Too many people get hit by people running red lights or otherwise being trapped in an intersection because the other road is full. If there is an opening I do time my acceleration so I'm actually through faster than starting from the middle. Worst case one person got delayed because only one person is allowed past the line, me.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
If somebody died by getting trapped in an intersection, then they died of stupidity. How would you get "trapped"? There's no way that waiting correctly in the intersection would result in you getting trapped.
beatenintosubmission@reddit
Died? Where did that come from? No way to get trapped in an intersection? If you're turning left and that street back's up with traffic would you not be trapped in the intersection?
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
You would and it's illegal to enter the intersection in that case. But that's not the situation this thread is about.
beatenintosubmission@reddit
that side street can back up while you're in the intersection.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
That's exceptionally uncommon, but if it looks like that's a possibility you probably shouldn't enter the intersection. The other 99.9% of the time, its irrelevant.
FoundationalSquats@reddit
To add to this, it's not only legal to finish your turn once the light turns yellow/red, it's required. Do Not try and reverse.
MRSHELBYPLZ@reddit
I always wince when I see a driver get scared and they freeze right in the middle of the intersection when the traffic lights switch.
It’s like bro, you already passed the light, just go. Commit!
ThePocketPanda13@reddit
I drive for a living so I drive a lot, I see a lot of driver errors. One of the biggest I see is hesitation or freezing. Whether you're driving in a legal way or not be confident in every action, that will keep you out of a lot of potential accidents. Timid drivers are a hazard. So are slow drivers for roughly the same reason.
untoastedbrioche@reddit
my favorite part is the signs that'll have flashing lights indicating the stop light coming up is red.
and people see those and keep doing highway speeds or the lights green and it starts flashing and people continue to speed. and their response is "I'm not slamming on my breaks instead I'll run a red light"
and for that reason I understand why people freeze or get nervous. legally and morally they should turn but unfortunately life isn't fair and it takes one prick thinking they can run the red light to kill an entire family.
spacestonkz@reddit
Yes! This is rampant in my city, along with speeding 15 over even in 25 mph crowded downtowns, everybody be going 40.
I need to have a clear eyeline of all possible routes of oncoming traffic before I hit that gas. I lost count after 4 times vehicles zoomed through reds and would have tboned me if I hadn't waited two seconds to look after it went green before I hit the gas. I've seen so many tboned vehicles and witnessed two in front of me this year.
It's fucking chaos out there. I can't trust enough people to follow the rules. It's not the same attitude as when I learned to drive 20 years ago. Not to mention cars are so much larger now. That's great for the driver and passengers... Not so much for who they're hitting...
scottb90@reddit
Larger cars also give people less feeling of the road which makes people drive faster. That's why it seems like people with big pick up trucks are always speeding cuz to them it doesn't feel like they are going that fast. It still annoys the hell out of me though since those are most likely to kill someone so they should be driving the safest out of everyone.
CarefulAd9005@reddit
The biggest vehicles have the least feel of the road, take the longest to brake, have less line of sight, harder to steer at higher speeds, deal the most damage, and are most likely to speed, and to add on have the worst fuel efficiency.
I genuinely believe this extreme viewpoint: trucks/SUV/Van only for necessity. As in, you shouldnt be casually driving a van or SUV unless you have 2+ kids, and trucks only for work requirements. Thats not fully fleshed out idea of course but general idea
ThePocketPanda13@reddit
Eh, i think some SUVs are better than others. Mine is small, I'm barely bigger than a sedan (2015 ford escape, literally the smallest SUV they make)
spacestonkz@reddit
Just doing a weight limit should do the trick.
I think my midsize sedan weighs more than your small SUV.
ThePocketPanda13@reddit
No matter what I think we can all agree on one thing. Fuck those big ass trucks. I am 5'6" I am not a particularly short woman, if your trucks hood is taller than me it shouldn't exist
spacestonkz@reddit
I was living in Europe for several years for work. When I moved back home the trucks had gotten so big! I was shocked when I went to cross the street and a truck was hanging into the crosswalk. As I passed 12 inches in front of the grill I couldn't see over the hood!
I'm just an inch or two shorter than you...
ThePocketPanda13@reddit
They're so f*cking big. They're the right size where their INSANELY BRIGHT headlights line up perfectly with my rear window, so if one is behind me at night I'm screwed. They also have the worst headlights. I have what I refer to as asshole headlights (they came with the car) They're so bright people often flash me their brights when I'm using lows. The big ass truck headlights are about 5 million times more bright.
CarefulAd9005@reddit
They wouldnt buy them if they had those mandatory speed caps like 18 wheelers nowadays
“This truck can not exceed 65mph” we would suddenly see less of them on the road… almost like they dont need them for the space but to be a road bully
Low-Limit8066@reddit
I’ll only run the yellow in that scenario if someone’s on my rear end and I see them flash just as I’m passing. Even if I’m going as close to the speed limit as possible I don’t trust someone behind me enough to react and stop in time. The light stays green even after I pass those lights. Any other time and I’m further back from the warning lights, I’m stopping
scottb90@reddit
I've been trying to teach my wife this exact thing. Hesitation is unpredictable an that isn't good in a driving scenario. She's a relatively new driver so it's understandable she gets kinda scared sometimes but it's almost caused a few accidents so I get pretty worried. I'm just glad we live far enough out of Seattle that it's not a nightmare to drive all the time.
Clean_Oil-@reddit
I know some people that are incapable of coming to a complete stop while also looking at the other 3 directions of traffic. To the point I can't ride with certain people because I get enraged by how many times they get into "no you go, no you go, no you go" situations when they were the first one to the intersection but didn't know it. I can't even remember the last time I've done that while driving. Some people can not multi task at all.
ThePocketPanda13@reddit
If you're gonna go, go with confidence, whether it's actually your turn or not
Low-Limit8066@reddit
What gets me is when people stop their entire car length in front of the stop line at a light in any lane. Sometimes they back up 🤦🏻♀️ in any case, they were already wanting to run that light anyway
Scruffylookin13@reddit
Its as important (even arguably more so) to drive decisively than correctly. If another driver knows what you are going to do they can adjust to it. If you are unsure it causes confusion on all ends
Trick_Definition_760@reddit
Dude the idea of trying to reverse after the light goes yellow during a left turn is the dumbest thing I’ve seen today. I’ve never even seen anyone attempt this.
FoundationalSquats@reddit
I see it all the time; mostly it's people who don't pull far enough into the intersection plus don't notice the light change until it's fully red and cross traffic has started moving. Then they panic and try to back up back into the turn lane.
EC_Owlbear@reddit
Best comments here.
Iracing_Muskoka@reddit
I think I recall that being described as " the car in motion" from the Ontario drivers handbook.
balanced_crazy@reddit
This needs more upvotes…
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
I think I've only ever heard the term "permissive yellow" on reddit.
Anyway this has nothing to do with yellow lights. You should enter the intersection (when the light is green) and wait for oncoming traffic to clear so you can turn.
JohnnyD423@reddit
You're probably right, but I can't think of a more concise way of saying "states that do not consider a driver to have run a red light so long as a part of their vehicle was kn yhe intersection when the light was green, but also yellow in some places."
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
You don't really need a word for that because that's pretty much every state.
HAWKWIND666@reddit
Just avoid the “box” so first responders can get thru
JohnnyD423@reddit
What box? I've only ever heard of the area between the corners of the intersection referred to as "the box," and that's exactly where you're supposed to wait.
HAWKWIND666@reddit
Basically have your back tires on the edge of the crosswalk behind you…then there still room in front for cross traffic to still get thru. But you’re not so far back that you get hung up if the light changes.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Blocking a crosswalk is actually bad, unlike whatever made-up thing you're talking about.
TravelingBartlet@reddit
If the light changes, you are in the box, so you go.. You have already entered the intersection so you must complete your turn.
That's the entire point of the maneuver that we are talking about here...
ARKzzzzzz@reddit
This is wrong
JohnnyD423@reddit
So enter the box, but only enough that your car is the only one that can make the light? That's not courteous. If you're waiting in the intersection when an emergency vehicle arrives, you make way. It's not complicated.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
No. Very explicitly, do not avoid the box. That's the whole point. You must get your ass into the box if you're waiting to turn left.
Also don't block first responders, obviously, but that's got nothing to do with properly turning left.
witchcrows@reddit
This is the way. When I was first licensed, I would get honked at if I didn't pull into the intersection before a left turn, so I do it now out of courtesy/not wanting to get honked at lol
Pushfastr@reddit
Don't do stuff just because someone honked at you.
Would you give me $5 if I honked at you? Probably not.
Reddidundant@reddit
That's true, but in this scenario I'm glad the honking led to witchcrows adopting correct driving habits.
witchcrows@reddit
Thank you! I'll be the first to admit I'm quite sensitive, so they have a point 😭 but in this case, I like to think that it did me a favor
2x4x93@reddit
Yes. Don't park there
supern8ural@reddit
Correct. The only time this would not be appropriate is if traffic were backed up on the street onto which you're turning, so that you aren't assured that you can clear the intersection.
ChairNo5983@reddit
Yeah, the one biggest, most common issue, are people blocking intersections and drive-ways. But, we have way too many people, too many lights. It's literally 10min/mile here in AZ in the Glendale, Peoria, Surprise areas. Then, we'll use the side neighborhood roads to get around, only to get rocks thrown at us for using curved roads "too" fast.
I was kidding about the rocks.. But, there are petitions for "more" speed bumps and pot holes just to slow everyone down even more.
Expensive_Plant_9530@reddit
Yep - if you can tell before you even initiate the turn that you can't clear the intersection because cross traffic is backed up? Don't do it. Just wait it out.
But otherwise, people who sit there behind the line and either turn at the last second (resulting in no one else having time to turn after him), or even worse - people who just sit there even when the light changes and don't move it all? Those people suck.
JohnnyD423@reddit
Absolutely correct. Thank you.
Lulusgirl@reddit
I get so mad when people wait feet behind the line. Drivers Ed, I was taught to pull up a bit. Not all the way through, but to go forward a little, and some people just don't understand this! And when heavy traffic clears, they hesitate, and I'm stuck waiting a whole other light.
Thuraash@reddit
If you don't do this in Chicago you're going to piss off all twenty of the cars waiting to turn left behind you. And they will ALL let you know how they feel about it.
thatG_evanP@reddit
As it should be.
Dahmer_disciple@reddit
Yeah we will! ITFU. Inch The F Up! If you’re lucky, it’ll just be horns. Normally, though, it’ll be horns and people screaming at you.
Advanced-North3335@reddit
The only way to live...and you just hate it when they don't pull far enough forward, so their opportunity to turn comes at the red and you're stuck not qualifying to make the turn as well.
usci_scure67@reddit
This is exactly what we were taught. You can go as far up to the center. And keep the tires straight don’t turn them until you’re ready. Last thing you want is someone rear-ending you and you end up in on-coming traffic.
Firm-Rest1860@reddit
People who don’t pull up and take the left on yellow are just as frustrating as those who don’t make a right on red where it’s allowed. Today I sat behind a guy who caused a traffic jam because he didn’t know how to yield left.
do_you_like_waffles@reddit
If there's no left turning light and traffic is heavy enough not to leave a gap then I won't turn at that intersection. Seems more hassle than it's worth. I tend to avoid turning left it I can.
Drive up a block and turn right, go down 2 blocks and take another right. Stay straight to go through the intersection, but this time you'll be going with traffic and won't need to turn at all.
473713@reddit
Smart driver
Gatsmith219@reddit
As others have said the important thing is if it turns red before you clear the intersection you gotta go then, preferably before it's red as long as everyone stopping. Totally okay to wait at the line with your signal on though. If I'm in my car I often move up & yield for the turn, if I'm on my motorcycle i usually will not, that way I just gotta watch my ass till turn time and I don't get killed in the intersection.
malfrutus@reddit
I was taught in driver’s ed (Rhode Island, in 1992) to pull into the intersection and wait for your opening. This is what I have almost aways seen people do since then. The past year or so I’ve noticed a spate of people (now in Maine) that do not pull into the intersection when waiting to make a left turn. It’s extremely frustrating especially when there’s only a single travel lane. Nobody can get around them, and then they’ll eventually run the red light after oncoming traffic stops. Those of us who know how to drive have now sat behind them and missed the entire light cycle. I’m glad I don’t drive into the city often.
Reddidundant@reddit
Exactly. There should be a special circle of hell for "those" people.
-Z-3-R-0-@reddit
I always see other people do it but it's not legal in my state and I'm not comfortable trying it so I don't do it.
Jazzlike-Crew2540@reddit
This is why National driving laws should be adopted. Then the whole Country can be on the same page.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
There are maybe a few states where it's not legal, but every time I've seen someone say this, they were wrong. It's legal and expected in almost every state.
4orust@reddit
Are you sure about that? Is it not legal to enter an intersection on green provided your exit is not blocked? Once inside the interaction you have the right of way even if your light turns red. Then you make the turn.
I was once stuck behind someone who refused to enter the intersection on green. We were there for three entire cycles! Absurd and pointless.
Reddidundant@reddit
Well obviously if it's not legal in your state then it shouldn't be done in your state. Out of curiosity, what IS your state?
DisastrousZucchini15@reddit
Depends where you come from. I think it's illegal in some states like Washington to enter the intersection and not complete your turn in the same motion. Entering and waiting = ticket
aggressive_napkin_@reddit
officer the oncoming car was speeding i could make the turn like any other time. I didn't want to die or kill somebody.
Reddidundant@reddit
OK, just did some Googling and I did see some varying advice from different sites of other states (I didn't specifically check Washington). But at least in my state - Arizona - it's legal and since I doubt I'll be driving out of state any time soon, that's all I need to know for now! :) https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/glendale/contributor/2015/10/05/drivers-can-wait-turn-left-intersection-green/73123378/
DisastrousZucchini15@reddit
As a fellow Arizonian, I am prepared for my potential out of state tickets
Reddidundant@reddit
If I ever travel out of the state (not at all likely at least in the near future) I'll be prepared too. :)
DisastrousZucchini15@reddit
To be fair, I only know it's illegal in other states, because I'm pretty sure that dude who killed a bunch of college kids a year or so ago, was actually pulled over twice scoping out the area and I think entering the intersection illegally was one if the reasons.
Reddidundant@reddit
Wow.
throwaway_0691jr8t@reddit
I used to do this, as it wasn't taught in my driver's ed class and I was the teacher's pet lol. Finally looked up why people did it earlier this year, and discovered the permissive yellow (in my state). I now pull up all the way. I think most people are in a similar circumstance as I was.
My cognitive reason for not pulling up was because people turning late would hold up cross traffic trying to turn left (which I thought was rude), and they already had their very short green light, but I mean it's technically legal so 🤷
Scienceheaded-1215@reddit
Lights are timed so that once yours turns red, the other lanes don’t turn green right away. I’ve noticed this is done in all the states I’ve lived.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
It generally doesn't hold up cross traffic much at all, unless you fall asleep in the intersection.
Reddidundant@reddit
Yeah, I suppose it's possible laws on this vary by state but for what it's worth my driver's ed was in Michigan. Only on Reddit have I ever seen the term "permissive yellow" so that was never a term used. Obviously you don't want to pull up to absolute dead center, but a few feet back from dead center so that there is room for a left-turner from the opposite direction to make a similar maneuver. But definitely, as far into the intersection as reasonable. The most important thing that driver's ed class emphasized with regard to this scenario is the importance of keeping the wheels straight until actually starting the turn. I.e., don't have the wheels starting to point left while you're waiting for a break in the traffic, because in the event you were rear-ended while waiting, it would push you into a potential head-on collision with opposing traffic.
throwaway_0691jr8t@reddit
I'm born and raised in MI so perhaps it varies by county? HA .... until we find out we're from the same one. But I agree with what you've said. I recall everything about actually prepping/making the turn, keeping wheels straight, etc., but nothing regarding that actual law. Weird, but it is what it is. It can def be frustrating when people don't pull up, but at least it is not unsafe.
Reddidundant@reddit
Wow - small world. My county was Wayne. But I moved to Arizona over 23 years ago and haven't been back, so maybe things have changed over the years.
Man-Phos@reddit
Peak redditor reply. This is worse than saying “this”. It literally sounds like you’re a Nazi
malfrutus@reddit
A nazi? wtf? It "literally" does not. You have some issues.
Man-Phos@reddit
Ah I suspect you fell for cunning non-Nazi use of “those” in “‘those’ people”
malfrutus@reddit
????????
Issues. 🤷🏼♂️🤦♂️
TVsKevin@reddit
"This guy judgmentally Redidits"
TheTightEnd@reddit
Your teacher did it right.
No_Juggernau7@reddit
I’ve always done this but one time I was doing this like normal and was ripped from autopilot when a passenger yelled “UMMM RED LIGHT” Which goddamn, I’m in the middle of the goddamn intersection. It’s not better to just sit here. I was saying that person and soon after broke up with them for a number of reasons. But yelling red light when I was obviously trying to turn left in the middle of the intersection was the primary reason I didn’t bother telling them.
Seven_Vandelay@reddit
I was taught the same thing. Just a few days ago though I got flipped off by the driver going straight from the opposite direction for doing that. Plain bizarre.
JabbaTheHutt12345@reddit
This isn't a defensive driving sub so the answers others are giving aren't the best. You should do what is the safest option. There are times where I will never drive past the line into the intersection to make a left turn. For example, a three-lane highway is way to dangerous since I cannot see all three lanes of oncoming traffic. If there is no advanced green light, then I will definitely drive past the line to "take control" on the intersection and eventually turn and most importantly with the exception as long as its safe. Some roads are so narrow and windy, pulling into the intersection could cause a collision head on
StevenJenkins64@reddit
Always drive into the intersection.
When making a left turn, you should be making a 90-degree turn, not a 45-degree turn.
deezgiorno@reddit
this guy smh…not if the intersecting road is 45 degrees
maryjayjay@reddit
I usually make a arc. I don't think my car can make a 90 degree turn. It seems to go in parts of a circle.
StevenJenkins64@reddit
That's weird. I drive a big truck. I pull up until the street I'm turning onto...if you drew a straight line through tge intersection...continuing the double yellow line of the road you're turning onto, straight through the intersection...I pull up at stop right at the line. When it's my turn to go, I turn the wheel and go right where I'm supposed to be.
tempo_rare@reddit
What does turn degree have to do with anything here?
StevenJenkins64@reddit
Because we're discussing where you should be in the intersection prior to beginning your turn.
iTaylor04@reddit
I wait at the line until I see a gap then I inch up. unless someone across is blocking my view, then I'll move up to see
justkozlow@reddit
That's your opinion, which is wrong. Enter the intersection and turn when able. You entered on a green, you're not committing any crimes. Learn how to drive.
iTaylor04@reddit
what's the difference then? please do tell what I'm doing that's so wrong to you
Imaginary-Round2422@reddit
1) If no gap ever comes until the light, you (and everyone behind you) are stuck waiting until the next green
2) It takes you longer to get to the left turn, which means you need a bigger gap, thus decreasing your chances of getting through the light.
iTaylor04@reddit
1) if no gap comes then no one can go? that doesn't make sense.
2) how so? if I look down the road for a gap then I pull up for the gap, how is that any different than already being in the road? either I can go because the gaps there or I can't go. Me waiting in the middle of the road does literally nothing in this situation
Imaginary-Round2422@reddit
1) You go when the light goes.
2) I takes more time to do that.
iTaylor04@reddit
1) people keep going when the light turns, most people around here aren't risking that
2) if I go that quickly, it's because the gap is that small. I'm there when the gap appears and people are welcome to be behind me idk how you can't understand that
jesssquirrel@reddit
Bro you're wrong, just take the L and learn
iTaylor04@reddit
i can guarantee I'd turn quicker than you would
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
If no gap comes, then the car at the front of the line can go, because he did what is legal and correct, and entered the intersection while the light was green.
tacitjane@reddit
The person behind you gets a legitimate opportunity to follow you when the turn becomes available. Staying behind the line means they can't go.
Pull up every time or just make three right turns. Stop fucking around.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
This is inconsiderate, unsafe, and sometimes illegal. Almost all states allow and most encourage or even require, that you enter the intersection while waiting to turn left.
iTaylor04@reddit
are you 100% serious with yourself🤣 illegal??
inch up=entering intersection in my comment
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
You're gonna need to go a lot more than an inch unless you drive a car for ants.
iTaylor04@reddit
i do.
I wait. I see gap ahead. i pull up. wait for gap. then I go.
not that big of a deal
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Illegal. You should already be in the intersection. I hilighted the part where you did it wrong.
iTaylor04@reddit
you can't be serious🤣
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
It's literally both what is legal and what is encouraged by all driving instruction. So yes, I am serious and so is the law. You are expected to enter the intersection while waiting to turn left. It is safe, correct, and considerate of others.
iTaylor04@reddit
That's what I do I'm not sure what your problem is here
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
I don't have a problem. I've been pretty consistent about the facts here. To be honest I'm even paying much attention at this point, just correcting anybody who replies with incorrect statements. I really don't know if I've even spoken to you before. If you were saying something wrong before that's probsbly what I commented on.
harley97797997@reddit
As with every traffic law, this differs by state. Some states allow pulling into the intersection, and some states do not. Check your local laws to find out what's legal in your state.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Almost all allow this, if not require it.
harley97797997@reddit
There are several variations. Some states like Minnesotta only allow one vehicle in the intersection waiting to turn.
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.15
Washington state and Oregon don't allow stopping in an intersection.
https://youtu.be/4sm820Qh3MU?si=eU2v7z1sHM7gut31
https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.202
https://codes.findlaw.com/or/title-59-oregon-vehicle-code/or-rev-st-sect-811-260/#:~:text=Unless%20entering%20the%20intersection%20to,no%20marked%20crosswalk%2C%20then%20before
The other law applicable here is whether completing a left turn is legal after the light turns red. Several states allow this, several others (ME, NH, CT, MO, NJ, NC, RI) only allow entering an intersection IF you can clear the intersection before the light turns red.
ExcitingActive8649@reddit
I have heard differing opinions from different cops on the WA law, and I don’t think the cited RCW says what you think it says. I kind of see how people misunderstand it, because it talks about impeding traffic, but if you read it carefully, it’s just specifying that there must be enough space to turn into on the other side of the intersection, and that that space must not impede traffic. You aren’t impeding traffic when you’re waiting, you are traffic.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Neither that Oregon law nor the Washington law that you cited say what you cla they say. I haven't looked at the others but I'm going to assume that it's still extremely rare for states to have weird laws about this, since historicaly almost all states have allowed, if not required, that people enter the intersection while waiting to turn left.
harley97797997@reddit
The state troopers in the video explaining the law disagree.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Police are often misinformed about the law. It's a problem.
harley97797997@reddit
Often, no. Thats reddit BS.
State Troopers are the best ones to explain traffic laws and are relied on to interpret it often.
The Troopers on the video aren't the new kid that is still learning.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Sorry, between the actual law and some cop I'm going to trust the actual law. Thanks anyway.
tempo_rare@reddit
Really? Are you aware of any state that doesn’t allow pulling into the intersection? I’m asking because I’m just curious what’s the alternative in that case
harley97797997@reddit
There are several variations. Some states like Minnesotta only allow one vehicle in the intersection waiting to turn.
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.15
Washington state and Oregon don't allow stopping in an intersection.
https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.202
https://codes.findlaw.com/or/title-59-oregon-vehicle-code/or-rev-st-sect-811-260/#:~:text=Unless%20entering%20the%20intersection%20to,no%20marked%20crosswalk%2C%20then%20before
The other law applicable here is whether completing a left turn is legal after the light turns red. Several states allow this, several others (ME, NH, CT, MO, NJ, NC, RI) only allow entering an intersection IF you can clear the intersection before the light turns red.
Jimlee1471@reddit
TBF there is actually a valid reason for stopping at the line (which is sometimes known as a "stop bar").
I drive a semi for a living. You know how we always seem to take those wide right turns at the intersection? Here's what's happening: when a truck takes a turn the trailer tends to short-track that turn; IOW the trailer wants to take a shorter path around that corner than the tractor. If we didn't do that then the trailer would run right over that corner, obliterating anything (and anyone) unlucky enough to be standing there. This often means we have to temporarily take part of the left lane on the street we're turning from, as well as part of the left lane of the street we're turning onto.
You might already see where this is going: when a vehicle stops behind that "stop bar" then the semi can usually make that turn safely and legally. But, when a car goes past that line, then the tractor-trailer has to cut that corner short, causing his trailer to potentially run up on that curb and destroy whatever is on that corner.
Initially stopping at or behind the stop bar ensures that the semi can make that turn without putting nsomebody on the 7 O'clock news.
Pekseirr@reddit
So I'm supposed to stay out of the intersection, that I'm legally allowed to occupy, on the off chance a semi might need more of the road, then it's legally allowed to occupy. Got it.
Jimlee1471@reddit
The reason you got downvoted (not by me) was your lack of reading comprehension. Notice how I wrote, "Initially stopping at or behind..." That means first stopping, then (if the way is clear with no turning vehicles) proceeding past the stop bar.
There is a reason that line is there is the first place, and it has nothing to do with decoration.
Pekseirr@reddit
The reason you got down downvoted is people don't like truck drivers expecting special treatment and driving like jackholes.
Jimlee1471@reddit
Look, I have neither the time nor the crayons to explain this to you any further, so I'll ask you this question: if that stop bar doesn't apply to you then why TF is it even there in the first place? You're the asshole who think he needs special treatment.
Well, you're definitely "special", that's for sure...
RetiredBSN@reddit
I do not wait behind the line if I’m the first one in the left turn lane and light is green. If the light turns yellow and you’re behind the line you should stay there and not make your turn. If you’re in the intersection, you have the right to complete your turn once traffic clears and it’s safe.
Fury161Houston@reddit
In Houston/Harris County stays at the line. No sitting in the middle of the intersection. Not sure if it is a State or County law.
r2k-in-the-vortex@reddit
In the middle of the intersection, there will be an opening to turn when lights change and you will be there to complete your turn quickly and cars waiting for their green light can see you are there waiting to complete your turn. If you have not entered the intersection, you don't have time to complete your turn and will be driving out just as others are starting off with their green light, no bueno.
Some_Stoic_Man@reddit
If you pass the line before it's red, you're fine. Passing after red before it changes it's running a red and you can be ticketed for it.
Frosty-Diver441@reddit
I always wait for traffic because I was almost taken out by a huge truck when I had the right of way. Myself and the people behind me can wait a few seconds.
rsjohnson2u@reddit
Washington State, it's illegal to wait in the intersection to make a left. Do they ticket you? Depends on the cop and the day, but yes, they can.
bkydx@reddit
Since no one mentioned it only 1 Car in the intersection at a time.
If there is already a car in the intersection the 2nd car should stay at the line and not follow them.
Terrordyne_Synth@reddit
Here in CA, basically, everyone creeps into the intersection and then finishes the turn when it's clear. If you're at the line and the light turns red, you'd be running a red if you go.
JLF061@reddit
Personally I only enter the intersection when I see a space coming up and then I make the turn. I've seen instances when someone in the intersection waiting for space doesn't have one and when the lights turn yellow or red people aren't stopping for them and then the other cars go around them. I drive in the DMV and people run red lights all the time and if you get stuck in the intersection no one is waiting for you. I personally would rather not be in that situation.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
This is unsafe and incorrect, and often illegal.
JLF061@reddit
I don't understand why I should go into the intersection though. We're all turning left and if traffic is heavy where there isn't a space to go why would I put myself in danger. The only left lane I take while driving is on a busy intersection where I can see the road ahead for miles. I'll go in the intersection when there is a space. I've seen many people get stuck in that intersection when it's busy. And cars honking and driving around them. Why would I put myself in that position.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
So that you don't get stuck waiting behind the line for an hour waiting for traffic to go away. It causes more traffic! If you enter the intersection you're gauranteed to get through, even if you have to wait until the light turns red. Then you clear the intersection, and you'll have plenty of room to do it so you won't block anybody.
Woah, if you don't have space to go in the lane you're turning into, that's a completely different scenario. In that case it's illegal to enter the intersection. We're not talking about that here. This is about waiting in the intersection for oncoming traffic to clear before turning left.
Well yes, of course. You don't go in the intersection when the car ahead of you is still there waiting to turn. As soon as there's space, you go into the intersection.
Oncoming traffic can't be in your way since they're in a different lane.
I don't know what silly thing they've done, so I can't help there. There's no way to get "stuck" in an intersection unless the outgoing lane is full, but again, that's not the situation we're talking about.
You wouldn't. Nobody is suggesting that.
JLF061@reddit
Forgot to mention there are also people regularly walking since Baltimore and DC have very heavy foot traffic and most do not care that you are driving a death machine. I would pull out into the intersection if everyone else follows the rules but in MD you do not have the right of way in the intersection. You must yield to traffic and obviously other pedestrians. People still do it but you have to be fast and my car is not the kind of car that is fast enough for me to gas it and run through the intersection. A friend of mine drove my car once and almost got into an accident because she was slamming the gas trying to turn left before the straight traffic and kept yelling "why is your car not going". She barely made it through.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Pulling into the intersection does not harm pedestrians in any way. And does not prevent you from yielding. What the fuck?
WHAT? Your car absolutely does not need to be fast. In fact doing this correctly makes it less troublesome to have a slow car.
JLF061@reddit
I never said that it harms pedestrians or prevent you from yeilding. If you are making a left turn and there are pedestrians crossing, blocking that lane while you have a green light you have to yield to them before making the turn. And I'm only talking about populated cities like DC and MD in that example. If you have ever been to Baltimore at night especially there are people everywhere. So much so that it took me 45 minutes to drive a couple miles because the police sometimes have to block off roads because of the foot traffic.
And depending on the amount of space you have it does need to be fast. I personally don't do it but while driving straight I've had to slam on brakes because some idiot making a left turn thought they had enough time to make it. I don't want to be one of those people.
And no I'm not a troll. I drive hours everyday more than 100 miles because of my commute and because of the things I've seen and experienced I prefer to be safe than sorry. I just think it's wild that yall think it's inconsiderate to not immediately pull out in the middle of an intersection after the green arrow disappears. And I never said I wouldn't pull out in the middle of an intersection but I'm only doing so when there is a space. The specific intersection I'm talking about has a long road and you can see exactly where you have a space so the moment I see it I pull out. I can't go before then because there is a chance I'll be stuck. Also most people I see don't immediately go in the intersection they wait until they see a space, they inch up, then go.
I think you guys don't understand what I'm saying or maybe I'm not explaining it properly. The arguments you're making are against someone who waits multiple cycles or never goes. I don't do that.
JLF061@reddit
Seems like people in the comments are talking about an unprotected left turning and straight lane. Personally, I've encountered only a handful of those. I have a really small car so I typically go off to the side and cars can pass me.
Im talking about a left turning lane only. But I'm not going in the intersection. People get stuck because the traffic going straight doesn't stop for yellow and sometimes speed pass the red. Not to mention other cars turning right into the lane you're trying to go to. Then the lanes going perpendicular go and they will not wait for you. They just honk and go around you. And from my experience no one respects a tiny car. I thought it was just my experience but when my husband drove my car he realized just how dangerous it was and how everyone just disregards you.
I drive in the DMV and when it comes to Baltimore and DC traffic, laws are more like suggestions ( Baltimore more than DC). A lot of drinking and driving since there are popular bars everywhere, police blocking intersections, and regular people honestly trying to go home who will drive on the opposite side of the road just to pass all the traffic. People will honk and yell for not turning right for a light that says no turn on red, or if you fully stop at a stop sign. That's the only time I've encountered a straight and left turning lane. More often than not I'll just go straight and figure out another way to get to my destination. Or I'll go up slightly and cock to the right so people can get around.
Genuine Question: even if someone is in the intersection how does that differ in being behind the line? Either way the person in the intersection is still in the middle of the lane. To go around them you would more than likely have to encroach in the Right lane traffic that's going straight and turning right. Couldn't you also do that with the person going left? I have. But then again because my car is small I can zip in and out fairly easily.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
So you're not going to do what is safe and legal and expected because you're inconsiderate. Got it. That would have been a lot less typing.
Because then you don't end up sitting at the intersection for multiply cycles of the light while the idiot I'm front of you refuses to correctly enter the intersection.
What the hell are you talking about? Everyone should be in the middle of their lane. Who's going around anybody? If you're going straight, you just go straight. Somebody waiting to turn left won't be in your lane... Because they're turning left.
JLF061@reddit
Yeah I'm not risking my safety on a chance that everyone else is going to be considerate to me while making a left turn. You quite literally cannot 100 percent know that there will be a space for you to go in an intersection after the light turns red because like I said people run the red lights often and you do not have the right of way in MD. You have to yield to everyone else.
I've also never had an instance where there are lines of people behind me in a left turning lane. Idk what left lanes yall are turning in where you have to wait 3 or more cycles but that's never happened to me. There's always a space. So I'm not inching up until I see it. Also you're literally blocking traffic. Whenever I've seen anyone in the middle of the intersection I'm going around them. They should've never been there in the first place.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
You're sitting here telling us you're intentionally choosing the less safe, less correct action; so obviously it's a lie that you're not risking your safety.
You don't need anybody to be considerate to you when you do it correctly.
That's just absurd and not true.
So you're going to intentionally break the rules. Got it.
Yes, if you don't enter the intersection you will block traffic. That's why you must enter the intersection.
Why are they there? Unless you're breaking other laws they shouldn't be in your way. Or maybe they're also idiots like you, and they're just staying there because the light is red and nobody ever told them how to think properly?
brinazee@reddit
I doubt it's illegal. It's what is recommended in many driving handbooks.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Obstructing traffic is illegal, though rarely ticketed.
Can you show me a state handbook or traffic code that bans or discourages proper left turn behavior? It's extremely rare.
DPFizz@reddit
I’m a middle ground guy. I pull up till my front end is across the crosswalk, or the area of where one would be. The people that pull almost all the way to the middle, make it extremely difficult on the person across from them also trying to turn left to see when traffic clears enough to complete their turn.
Sad_Win_4105@reddit
I pull into the intersection just short of center so I'll be able to turn when the intersection clears. This is what I was taught in drivers Ed 50 years ago. Hopefully there will be room for another driver to wait in the intersection behind me so they can go too.
I hate it when a car sits and waits at the line until it's clear, or the light changes. Then when the light changes they bolt into the intersection, potentially causing an accident as well as creating a backup for those following since only one can enter per cycle.
For clarification, if the traffic is backed up on the street I'm waiting to enter and I won't be able to clear the intersection when the signal changes, I won't pull into the intersection if doing so is going to create gridlock.
Professional-Plum560@reddit
People gormlessly and unnecessarily waiting behind the line in this scenario is one of my absolute pet hates about other drivers. Your ignorance of the proper procedure is only making things more difficult for everyone, including yourself. Enter the intersection, drive forward as far as possible with your left blinker on, and wait for either a gap or an oncoming red, whichever comes first.
Tall-Measurement3795@reddit
Proper procedure be damned I do what's safe. The amount of red light runners in my area, if I can't see around the guy in the turn lane opposite me I'm staying at the line until either I can see it get a green arrow. The light turns red and I'm in the middle of the intersection expected to finish my turn I can't see if someone's going to run the red or not is not a situation I want to be in. You can deal with a little bit of inconvenience.
Expensive_Plant_9530@reddit
This seems a bit illogical to me.
Enter the intersection, wait for a gap. If none presents itself, and the light turns red, LOOK. Is there a car coming that looks like it's gonna run the red? Wait a moment. If it's not safe to clear, you wait until it is. You have priority, so cross traffic has to wait for you.
No one is telling you to turn left when there's a car that looks like it's gonna run the red.
Tall-Measurement3795@reddit
I think you missed the part where I can't see around the guy in the opposite turn lane. I do look. But looking does no good when view is obstructed. I'm sorry to say I didn't have X-ray vision. Cars run red lights where I'm at even when the red light has been on for more than 10 seconds.
So again. I wait until either I can see, or I have a green arrow.
Expensive_Plant_9530@reddit
If you can’t see past the opposite turner, you wait until you can.
Or, as you pull into the intersection, pull to the left slightly then straighten, so you’re better positioned to see past the other car. You might have to lean your head to the left to get a good view but it should be doable in most intersections.
Tall-Measurement3795@reddit
But then that puts me back in I have to clear the intersection when the light for the perpendicular traffic goes green while not being able to see if someone's is going to run the red light or not...
TheTightEnd@reddit
You can see the opposing traffic when you do that.
Expensive_Plant_9530@reddit
Sure but how is that not a risk anytime you go through an intersection then?
Tall-Measurement3795@reddit
But then that puts me back in I have to clear the intersection when the light for the perpendicular traffic goes green while not being able to see if someone's is going to run the red light or not...
TheTightEnd@reddit
If you can't see the person stopping at the line in the opposing lane, that is a you issue.
People are downvioting you because you are not being a safe driver, but rather a paranoid one who is hindering the travel of others.
FoundationalSquats@reddit
you can enter the intersection for your turn and after the light turns red just wait a beat until you can see the oncoming cars slowing down, then turn, take it slow if you have to but take the turn otherwise you're obstructing traffic.
if you can't be safe and follow proper procedure at the same time you shouldn't be on the roads
Tall-Measurement3795@reddit
I don't think you understand how bad people run red out here, but ok. I don't belong on the road.
supern8ural@reddit
You're from Maryland, aren't you?
The reason that people wait so long at a green light that I'm tempted to honk, I'm sure, is the unbelievable prevalence of red light runners. It's like you don't go on green for at least three seconds, but you're also expected to run a red light if it's been red for less than three seconds.
I also had to sit at an intersection for TWO LIGHT CYCLES the other day despite my path being clear because cross traffic wouldn't stop blocking the fuckin' box.
Tall-Measurement3795@reddit
Texas. I have a 4 mile drive to work and every intersection at least 5 people run the red. I've seen it go red, a few seconds go by the guys with the green go and have to stop. Guy runs it then the 4 cars behind him run it, and only then the guys with the green go. Happens like that almost every day. It's less often an issue in the evening, though. I'll sit at the line until I know I can go safely, sorry.
TheTightEnd@reddit
You can pull into the intersection and still make those allowances.
TheTightEnd@reddit
It is not unsafe to pull into the intersection to await the safe opportunity to turn. You can wait until there are clearly stopping vehicles in the oncoming lanes and then proceed, or until there is an adequate gap in traffic (which being in the intersection places you in a better position to utilize).
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Proper procedure is what's safe. You're saying you do it dangerously, on purpose.
ThePocketPanda13@reddit
It depends on the state. That's not legal in some.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
It's legal in almost all, and it's correct in all of them despite a possibly absurd law.
MRSHELBYPLZ@reddit
I’ve seen a car in front of me sit behind the white line, for 2 light cycles. TWO!!
No he wasn’t on his phone, he just had no common sense
BossJackWhitman@reddit
and when you add in the fact that the person sitting at the line is also on their phone, there's a further delay when it's time for them to move thru. that car needs to be on it, not just chilling.
TheTightEnd@reddit
Drive into the intersection. It places you in the best position to make the left turn either when the gap arises or the light turns yellow.
RecoverSufficient811@reddit
How did you get a license without knowing this?
ColonelMoostang@reddit
Im a firm believer in taking the intersection. It let's you get a better jump for an opening, let's those behind you around, and if the light changes, literally no one will bother you for going quick.
rrhunt28@reddit
I change what I do on a complex series of variables. Typically I pull out slowly a little.
Interesting-Ad1803@reddit
Check your state and local laws. But in some places, getting into a "trapped left turn" (that's what this is called) is illegal and you can be ticketed for it and also for running the red light if you go after it changes or blocking the intersection if you don't.
In other places this might be legal but going through a red is not. It's a tricky situation for sure, and in some intersections you might never get through if you wait. It's a case where you'll need to "tell it to the judge" if you get ticketed.
CODMLoser@reddit
which states is this considered illegal? I personally don’t know of any—and I’ve live in many different parts of the country.
Interesting-Ad1803@reddit
All that I know of. Running a red light is illegal.
CODMLoser@reddit
You aren’t “running a red light” in that situation. 🙄
Reference_Freak@reddit
Generally, entering the intersection which you can’t clear before the green becomes red is considered running a red and can be ticketed.
This can apply to left-turning drivers in some states which don’t exclude them.
It applies to drivers who are going through but pulled into the intersection and are stuck “blocking the box” preventing cross traffic from going.
Entering an intersection on a green is not permission to block the intersection so drivers should know how the state they’re driving in applies this to green-ball left turns.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Absolutely not. If that's true anywhere it's a very rare exception. Everywhere I am aware of, the red light means you can't enter the intersection. Once you cross the line, the signal light no longer matters to you.
No, that's an entirely different scenario. That applies if the lane into which you will exit the intersection is blocked. When that's not the case, it is legal and proper virtually everywhere to enter the intersection while waiting to turn left.
It wouldn't ever block the intersection unless you're doing something weird.
CODMLoser@reddit
well said!!
Imaginary-Round2422@reddit
You aren’t running a red light if it was green when you entered.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
I suspect the answer is none, but I usually say "very few" because I suppose it's possible some states are insane. None I've ever seen verified though.
blakeh95@reddit
This is correct and it is largely based on what version of the Uniform Vehicle Code the State patterned its law on, and if the law has since been updated.
Traffic Laws Annotated, 1979 (last available version for historical reasons) provides the following summary:
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Great comment, more informative than most here, ever; but I do t think this was specifically about yellow lights, it's about waiting in the intersection to turn left, in general. Even if you enter on green.
blakeh95@reddit
Right, but I was responding to the comment above me, which is talking about getting trapped in the intersection if you enter and wait to turn on a green light. This necessarily involves a green or yellow then turning to red. No one would call entering on green and turning on green as being "trapped."
In that context, the 4 states in the first bullet + the 24 states in the second bullet + 4 of the 5 states that are nonuniform (excluding LA) + 1 of the 10 states and DC in the last bullet permit entering on green or yellow and finishing the turn. That's 33 of 51.
The remaining 18 states (LA + 7 states in 4th bullet + 10 of 11 states and DC other than VA in the last bullet) would make it a violation to be "trapped" in the intersection. In those 18 states, a person entering to make a left--even on green--is taking a risk that they might not lawfully be able to complete their turn if it later turns yellow and then red.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Oh okay, I see what you mean but all the mentions of yellow lights were confusing, it made it seem like you were talking about a car entering on yellow, not simply being there when yellow turned to red.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
That's completely unrelated. OP asked about waiting in the intersection to turn. Presumably he already verified that there's room for him at the exit of the intersection. That's a totally different consideration.
Almost nowhere would consider this a red light violation, since you were already in the intersection.
Certainly, nowhere would both consider it a violation to go and a violation to stay in the intersection. That's just absurd.
I'm reality most places expect and allow you to enter the intersection while waiting to turn left, and allow you to clear it after the light turns red.
No_Entertainment_932@reddit
In the states where it is legal, it is permissable to go through the red light because you entered the intersection when the light was green/yellow. You can't get a red light violation for this
Hersbird@reddit
Even where there are red light cameras they are triggered further back, get into the intersection and you are past them. You just can't enter the intersection when the light is red. If you are already in the intersection you need to proceed through and clear it.
azgli@reddit
Judge by traffic. Heavy oncoming traffic with no visible breaks, stay behind the line until you can see a break. Then advance.
If you can see a possible break, pull out and be ready to turn safely.
CODMLoser@reddit
No, this is precisely the time you need to move to the center of the intersection and turn on yellow if needed. Usually 2-3 cars can safely turn left.
azgli@reddit
I've seen multiple times where you can't safely turn left in high traffic times. Even if you are in the intersection, the other light turns green before you can turn. I'll stay behind the line in those cases. Safety trumps time.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Thats when you turn
azgli@reddit
How is staying behind the line the less safe option?
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Because following the rules and being predictable is always the safest choice. It causes less traffic, less confusion for other drivers, and makes traffic flow more smoothly which reduces accidents.
More importantly, it's correct and expected and in many places legally required.
azgli@reddit
It is never the law or the rule to enter an intersection without knowing you can clear the intersection safely. The law may permit it, but it's always up to the driver to make the call based on safety. If you can find any legal requirement to enter an intersection without knowing you can clear it, please provide a link. I'd be interested to read it.
Staying behind the line when there is obviously no clear path through the intersection is absolutely the safest path and is always legal based on every law I've read. Find a law otherwise and link it if you can.
Making drivers with a green light wait for yet another car doesn't make traffic flow more smoothly or reduce accidents. Nor is it less confusing for other drivers. It's arguable that just the opposite is true; proceeding into the intersection when it's not clear and hoping for a clear path out and potentially blocking traffic is more dangerous and more likely to be disruptive to smooth traffic flow.
Staying behind the line when it's not clear to proceed is predictable and correct.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Correct. Nobody is suggesting to do that. That's an entirely different situation than the one OP asked about.
The rest of your essay there mostly just repeats this same idea that I never said myself. So I'm not going to address it line by line.
The bottom line is that the answer to OPs question is that one should enter the intersection while waiting to turn left. Obviously, if OP is even asking this question, the outgoing lane is not blocked. That's not the scenario we're talking about.
azgli@reddit
OP asked where to stop.
My answer is:
You stop behind the line and wait until you can see a possible gap in oncoming traffic. Then you may proceed into the intersection. Or you may choose not to proceed until it's visibly clear, staying behind the line.
If there is no visible gap in traffic, it's legal, correct, and safest to stay behind the line. It's also up to the driver to wait until they feel they can clear the intersection safely to enter the intersection, even if the light is green.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
This is incorrect. One should enter the intersection while waiting to turn left.
This is the exact opposite of reality. This is obstructing traffic and is illegal in some places, although rarely ticketed. It is correct and safe to enter the intersection while waiting to turn left. Vidivle gaps are thoroughly irrelevant, as the whole point is that you'd be able to complete the turn after the light turns red. That's the whole point - you don't need a gap in order to enter the intersection. Waiting behind the line can cause traffic delays because you may never get through the intersection.
azgli@reddit
This is why you wait:
https://www.reddit.com/r/dashcams/comments/1g1o9rg/red_light_runners_cause_collision_oc/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
That guy ran the red. I'm not suggesting that.
azgli@reddit
I'm saying it's a significant risk to trying to squeeze your left into the light change and why you stay out of the intersection if you can't see it's clear.
Plus, staying back means better sight lines.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Okay, but nobody was suggesting to do that. You're having an entirely different conversation.
azgli@reddit
Please find me a law that supports your statement that entering an intersection to wait is required and not just permissible.
There is no law in my state that I have found yet that can be interpreted to indicate that failing to enter an intersection that isn't clear would be an infraction.
CODMLoser@reddit
And your incompetence doesn’t trump everyone else’s time.
Hersbird@reddit
The break comes when the light changes and you see those cars coming to a stop. You can go before the cross traffic even gets a green, let alone gets moving.
azgli@reddit
Not always. Red light running is an epidemic here. I've seen three and four cars go through the red and I've seen the cars with a green held up for several seconds because of drivers running the red. If I can't see a gap, I'm not entering the intersection. Just because the light is yellow or even red doesn't mean oncoming traffic is going to stop.
It's unfortunately common to see someone who entered the intersection stuck there waiting for the red light runners to clear before they can even finish their turn, while traffic with the green is already entering the intersection.
There is little enforcement of red lights and everyone knows it. I've had drivers go around me to run the red.
Hersbird@reddit
Those cars won't be seen coming to a stop, and if there is a car waiting in the intersection to turn left they may save a life by not letting the cross traffic start and get tboned by the red light runner.
WonkySystem@reddit
This is an interesting discussion, seems most people are saying to wait in the intersection for the light to turn yellow then complete the turn?
Where I live, most people wait behind the line. Also, wouldn't it be dangerous if someone from the oncoming traffic decides to not slow down at yellow and instead speed up? What do you do in that situation or would it not affect your turn?
Draggonzz@reddit
Into the intersection, like I was taught and like you're supposed to. Can't make that turn from behind the stop line.
inventionnerd@reddit
Gotta know the intersection. If it's one of those that's a bitch to turn where the people going straight are going to illegally clog the intersection, then I wouldn't do it cause then you're gonna be fucked too.
Generally, I'll wait behind the line if I see there's a huge line of cars on the other side but as soon as it starts clearing and I know I can make my move, I move in and will turn ASAP as soon as it's open.
Vizeroth1@reddit
Anything that detects vehicles and adjusts the timing of the light is probably sensing vehicles at/behind the line, not in the intersection.
realityinflux@reddit
Generally I think the normal thing (and most courteous to drivers behind you) is to pull out a reasonable distance into the intersection so at least you and maybe the driver behind you can make the turn on that light cycle when the light turns yellow. Just a couple of possible problems: if you pull out too far, you might make it difficult for the driver facing you and also trying to turn left to either see the traffic coming his way, or to make the turn without hitting you. The other thing is if there are red light cameras, this has been known to generate a ticket if you get trapped in the intersection and rightfully complete your turn. I know of only one instance of this happening, in Arizona, so police tolerance may vary from town to town and state to state.
Scienceheaded-1215@reddit
What irks me is that we do have left turn arrows here but because of that, the lights take turns so a four way intersection only lets one lane go at a time. This means each cycle is about 10 minutes long. And those who take a full 10 seconds to realize their light turned green holds everyone up waiting to go behind them. If I’m first in line, I pay attention and accelerate like normal, not peeling out in my Mini - hardly! Yet, I look in me rear view mirror and every car in each lane is a mile behind me!
I swear, if ppl just paid attention and go on green, keep up with traffic, we wouldn’t need to worry about getting through the intersections so much. You can be safe - even safer- if you just pay attention! 😕
starsgoblind@reddit
There is another alternative. You can choose to turn at the next street or the street before and avoid it like I do.
brinazee@reddit
I try to minimize left turns as much as possible.
Mitch-_-_-1@reddit
As others have pointed out, as long as you aren't impeding others trying to make their left turn, you should move up and wait inches middle. If the light changes, you should clear the intersection as soon as it is safe. This isn't running the red light because you are already in the intersection.
AdPuzzleheaded4563@reddit
Always the intersection. I hate when people stay at the damn line.
Glassfern@reddit
Most places I've driven I've observed go into the intersection and go when there is space. But some cities are very stringent in the "don't block the box" rule and so they wait behind the line
minidog8@reddit
I was taught to pull into the intersection. If you don’t get an opening, you go as the light turns red. My boyfriend is from Washington and thought it was illegal!
minidog8@reddit
Just looked it up. It IS illegal in Washington!
Escapeintotheforest@reddit
In Texas we stop at the line when turning left … right typically has a little overhanging turning lane but left is at the line unless it’s a protected u turn thing …. At least as far as I know but I’m new so 🤷♀️ .
e-hud@reddit
I wait behind the white line until it's safe for me to turn.
I'm gonna get down votes but to me someone who waits in the intersection only to have the light turn red for them is now blocking all the other side traffic that has a green light yet must wait for the blocker to move out of the way. Waiting for your turn in the intersection instead of behind the line may get you through the light faster but it slows everyone else down.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Why would anyone be blocked like that? The left turner will clear the intersection long before any cross traffic is impeded.
Literally the opposite of reality.
You're trolling.
e-hud@reddit
You're assuming there's room for them after the intersection. There are a few near me that fill up very quickly and basically cause gridlock.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
I'm not assuming that at all, it's just a completely unrelated question. It's illegal to enter an intersection if the outgoing lane in blocked, so OPs question wouldn't even matter in that case. Nobody is talking about that because it's not the topic of the thread.
blakeh95@reddit
I'm not going to downvote you, but I will provide this context. It is intended that traffic on the cross street yield to vehicles "lawfully in the intersection" on green. How is a vehicle "lawfully in the intersection" when cross traffic has a green light? From turning left.
Technical_Annual_563@reddit
I don’t think just left turns could lead to being in the intersection when cross traffic has green. Just off the top of my head: misjudged traffic volume and ended up getting caught in the intersection after the light change, a pedestrian or other unforeseen obstruction, someone turning right very shortly after the intersection causing everyone to slow down and wait, an emergency vehicle. The rule also exists to protect lawful drivers when someone blatantly runs a red shortly after the light change.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
That's illegal almost everywhere.
blakeh95@reddit
It's not the only reason, but it is probably the most common.
I'm merely pointing out--as the Traffic Laws Annotated, 1979 does--that:
Technical_Annual_563@reddit
I don’t see where that mentioned left turns at all.
blakeh95@reddit
This might help. Left turns are a type of driver that may lawfully enter the intersection on a yellow signal and lawfully continue across it even though a red signal may be shown during the time of the crossing.
Technical_Annual_563@reddit
You said, “How is a vehicle “lawfully in the intersection” when cross traffic has a green light? From turning left.” You listed one situation, implying that was the major focus of any “first clear the intersection” rule, and I can’t find where you’ve shown that. Now you try to call me stupid after in no way shape or form proving what you attempted to claim. Yeah, okay.
blakeh95@reddit
This entire conversation is about turning left. So yeah, I targeted my response to that.
I never said it was the only reason. In fact, I even said that earlier in this conversation:
e-hud@reddit
How does this handle flashing yellow turn lights? Aren't those the same as a yield? You're not legally in the intersection on green if your light was yellow, at least that's how I was taught.
Cross traffic gets a green light the same instant the other lights turn red. At least at the intersections around my town there is no pause between one direction turning red and the cross streets turning green.
blakeh95@reddit
Flashing yellow turn lights are generally "caution" which isn't quite the same as yield. However, left turns must still yield to oncoming traffic as a general rule (whether there was a light, a stop sign, or nothing).
For this:
I think you are misunderstanding what I said. Cross traffic must yield to traffic "lawfully in the intersection" when their light turns green. It has nothing to do with the color of the light that the vehicle turning left entered on--that's a separate question.
Most states permit entering and then clearing an intersection on both green and yellow.
e-hud@reddit
Oregon had tried changing it's laws to make it a ticketable offence if any part of your vehicle was in the intersection when your light turned red. Oh boy that made a lot of people mad. So now it's my understanding the law is written such that as long as any part of your vehicle is in the intersection before the light turns red you're fully legal to be there. What that has done is turned tons of people into jerks because they fly through intersections at the last split second of a yellow light, whether straight or turning. I've even had to wait for 4 cars that were behind the turn line to proceed through after I got a green light. Cops sitting in the next lane did nothing about multiple red light runners.
blakeh95@reddit
Oregon's current law (ORC 811.260) already requires drivers to stop at yellow lights unless it is unsafe to do so. I checked, and it is the same language as in Traffic Laws Annotated, 1979. Here is their commentary on Oregon's law:
e-hud@reddit
That's much closer to how I would expect the law to be. Thanks for updating me on it. Now if only the cops would do anything about the people who regularly violate this.
frog980@reddit
I always thought it could delay approaching emergency vehicles when you're sitting in the intersection. Otherwise the other cars aren't to proceed until the intersection is clear so I don't really know.
PowerPopped@reddit
Send it. Get in the intersection. If it turns yellow red while you’re waiting you get to go now since you need to clear the intersection
TheDutchTexan@reddit
Wait, don't block the box. Idiots get stuck in the middle. You also lose a ton of visibility when you stand there in the center like some nincompoop.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
This has nothing to do with "don't block the box" rules. That's about whether you have room in the lane into which you will exit the intersection.
It is legal and correct to enter the intersection while waiting to turn left in every state that I've ever checked the laws for.
TheDutchTexan@reddit
Cool. It's still dumb and you are putting yourself in a worse situation. Cope.
stayw0ke240@reddit
wait, you have a driver’s license but don’t know this? this info is on your g1 test and all your driving tests…?
LiquidTacoFest@reddit
You certainly don't have a DL. Stop before the line. Not on it. Not after it. If you have to creep a bit after the stop, so be it.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Weird troll.
CODMLoser@reddit
Why would you stop on a green light? In almost all states the law allows and drivers are expected to pull into the intersection to make a left turn (provided there is no left turn arrow etc).
darylandme@reddit
Huh? That may be protocol in some places, but most jurisdictions in North America dictate that you pull into the intersection (past the line) and clear the intersection when it is safe. If the light turns red you are legally permitted and required to complete your turn at that time if not safe to do so beforehand.
LiquidTacoFest@reddit
It's clear that you don't have a DL, or are ignoring the laws. Let me be clear...
STOP BEFORE THE LINE, THEN CREEP.
blakeh95@reddit
Cite any law that says you stop at a green light (not yield but stop).
SalamanderPop@reddit
You always this confidently incorrect or just when youre trolling on reddit?
darylandme@reddit
Why would you stop behind the line with a green light?
fastyellowtuesday@reddit
I'm very curious. You're all over these comments, but you're wrong. Why are you so confident when you are so wrong? Why do you not seem to understand that stopping at a green light is bad form?
FacelessPotatoPie@reddit
Depends on a few things. How long had the light been green and oncoming traffic flow are big factors.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
No. Of all the things that could even be close to justifying poor behavior here, those aren't even in the neighborhood of being relevant.
Unique-Landscape-202@reddit
I definitely try to avoid this. The only time I do is when there is absolutely no way that I'll find a gap in oncoming traffic. I've had to wait through entire lights because people speed through the intersection. If it's a turning lane or double lanes I won't do it, but when I'm in a single lane and there's cars pilling up behind me, I give them room to go around because otherwise they'll be stuck there just like I am. Sometimes I just have to wait until the very last minute to go because cars absolutely will not stop.
Again, I am not proud of this.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
You could solve this problem by simply driving correctly. You're making yourself ashamed for nothing. Just do it correctly and enter the intersection. It is legal in almost every state, and encouraged if not required in most.
TVsKevin@reddit
They really need to put this in a FAQ it gets asked so often. You should know by now that the answer is you wait at the line for a gap in traffic unless, and only unless, you prefer to pull out into the middle of the intersection to wait for a gap in traffic.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
Hahahaha brilliant troll
GeneralJavaholic@reddit
The legal option is whichever your state's driving manual says it is. Where I live, that's behind the line, as you are not allowed to enter an intersection and then stop.
FrickinLazerBeams@reddit
This question gets asked weekly. Every single time there are people who wrongly say to wait behind the line. Many of them quote their misunderstanding of the "don't block the box" rules, which they misinterpret to mean you can't enter until traffic clears, when it really means you can't enter if the lane into which you'll exit the intersection is blocked. Every single time they're corrected and many people even cite the relevant laws, and then it's pointed out that there are a few psychotic states that actually do make it illegal to enter the intersection, but they are few, and people do it anyway because it's correct.
Maybe just search for one of those threads and we can all pretend we typed out all the bullshit all over again, but instead we all do something more entertaining.
Mr_Candlestick@reddit
I pull into the intersection and go when there's an opening or the light turns red unless I'm turning onto a street that I know tends to get backed up all the way to the intersection which leaves me nowhere to go. In that scenario I wait at the line in case I can't turn.
Puzzleheaded_Bag1843@reddit
Pull into the middle of the intersection and wait for a gap to go. Don't wait for it to turn yellow before you turn especially if there is a gap, thats a good way to piss everyone off behind you.
jillwoa@reddit
In canada im preeeetty sure that its one of those things that its technically illegal to be in the intersection before youre ready to turn, but i also see cops do it, and never heard of that law being enforced. Id assume it would be a ticket if it caused issues or an accident, but its pretty much treated like jaywalking in my province.
rangeo@reddit
S turn into the intersection
KDogg41@reddit
I believe blocking an intersection is illegal in most states. The yellow light is to warn you it is about to turn red.
Efficient_Advice_380@reddit
When I'm in my personal vehicle, I will pull forward (called controlling the intersection)
In my work vehicle? Absolutely not
atlgeo@reddit
You pull into the intersection so that when oncoming traffic keeps going through the yellow, and you end up completing the turn as the light turns red, you're legal, you were already in the intersection; but you can't enter the intersection from behind the line after the light turns red, that's an infraction.
Sweaty_Web5089@reddit
When turning at a traffic light, your back tyres should not pass the line/ zebra crossing. If you are already in this position and the lights go red before you turn, it is not running a red as you entered the turn zone before the light was red for you.
spinnyride@reddit
In most states you can pull into the intersection past any lines but must yield to oncoming traffic. Only a few don’t allow you to enter the intersection when waiting to turn left.
It’s also taught to keep your wheels straight until you begin the turn in the event you get rear ended so you don’t get pushed into oncoming traffic
CedricCicada@reddit
In what states is it not legal to enter an intersection and wait to turn left?
LiquidTacoFest@reddit
Only after a proper stop. You failed to mention that.
blakeh95@reddit
What on earth are you talking about. You don't stop to turn left.
Are you mistakenly thinking this is about right on red?
JohnnyD423@reddit
Don't stop short like that. You stop others from being able to make the light as well. Wait at the mid point of the intersection.
Sweaty_Web5089@reddit
If you are turning left into a congested road, everyone else behind the first car ahead will block the intersection for the other two ways... hence why it is only one car that advances.
fastyellowtuesday@reddit
Yes, but that one should pull into the intersection, everyone else should wait behind the line.
felidaekamiguru@reddit
Uh, no. Everyone should stack up. If three people go through when the light turns red, so be it. That only means the light wasn't green long enough.
Sweaty_Web5089@reddit
I can agree with that, except in reality... everyone will pull up into the intersection.
JohnnyD423@reddit
The light changes and the vehicles in the intersection clear it. It's not complicated.
Jarsyl-WTFtookmyname@reddit
Pulling into the intersection is a mistake, then you have no room to move forward and have to turn into an opening with 0 momentum, meaning you need a larger opening. Stay back a bit, look for opening, and time it so you are moving forward to where you will turn as the opening gets there...that way you can get through a small opening.
BrianScottGregory@reddit
I've sat behind someone who decided to wait - not one - not two - but three lights until the road cleared to make a left. It's for this reason that I blasted my horn on the second one, to no avail.
You PULL into the intersection. This allows two or three vehicles to make it through the intersection every time. Otherwise, especially for busy intersections, you'll begin causing traffic to back up by waiting behind the line if there's no clearance for a light or three.
Alarming-Mark7198@reddit
You pull into the intersection and wait to make the turn. If you happen to turn after the light has turned yellow to red. You’re fine because you are already across the intersection at this point even a red light camera will not flash you
Humble-Common-8310@reddit
Pull into the middle and wait for an opportunity. If the light turns red before you get a chance, you and the car behind you can go since you’re both past the line and inside the intersection. People that don’t do this drive me crazy.
userhwon@reddit
Intersection.
In AZ if you're in the intersection you can stay there until the way is clear, even if the light turns red on you.
Done right, you can get three cars into the intersection, and take advantage of the gap from when oncoming cars are stopping halfway into the yellow llight, until cross-street cars have accelerated from the green. Done wrong, you become everyone's least favorite pile of molecular waste.
If you wait at the line, you may never get to turn in a lot of places.
Hersbird@reddit
Not only get out there, get out there far enough for the car behind you to also get at least over the crosswalk so they can go too.
jamesinboise@reddit
Really depends. Thinking of the lights is a big thing. If the lights go red real quick, you might be blocking cross traffic.
If there's heavy traffic, again, you might be blocking cross traffic when you're good red.
Also, if the signal isn't a flashing yellow arrow, the intersection may not be made for the left turn waiting.
Finally, if there's a dedicated/protected left at the start of end, I won't pull into the intersection.
matacines@reddit
Pull into the intersection to allow more space for other people trying to make the light. It’s soooo annoying when someone’s camping at the line to make a left turn
Imaginary-Round2422@reddit
Into the intersection! At too many lights, if you don’t, you’ll be sitting at that light for an hour.
nicky2socks@reddit
I'm in Phoenix AZ. During busy times of day there are intersections here will you will never be able to turn left if you wait for an opening. You have to enter the intersection then wait for oncoming traffic to stop at a red before you can finish your turn. Being stuck behind someone that does not understand that is infuriating. You have a better chance of cutting back into traffic and catching the next left.
ssjisM_7@reddit
I wait at the line if there's a left turn lane with another car in the intersection.
MONSTERBEARMAN@reddit
Definitely don’t wait in the middle of the intersection. Just pull out slightly pas the stop line.
Delicious-Farmer-301@reddit
If i reasonably believe that I will be able to get out of the intersection before the light turns red, I go into it.
There are a few intersections where people notoriously go straight through the red light, im talking three or 4 cars in a row, and then they wind up stuck in the intersection, causing not just me who is waiting to turn left but also the people who now have a greennlight to be stuck. I dont do it in those intersections.
igoturhazmat@reddit
It probably depends on how the Vehicle Code is written where you live. I’m in California and at a drivers ed course taught by the local PD they very clear about getting out into the intersection while the light is green with the understanding that because you entered on a green, you still have the right of way over cross traffic after the light changes. Though ya still gotta watch out for the dingleberries that don’t know that
ant2ne@reddit
STOP at the line. Then creep up for vision as needed. Gatdamn Missourians.
geek66@reddit
There are a number of factors:
But I have no problem pulling into the intersection to wait for a gap.
Keep your wheels straight(do not begin to turn)
I will not enter if I there is already a car waiting - I can not predict how good they are at clearing the intersection and it could leave you stuck.
scottwax@reddit
Move into the intersection, it will probably allow at least one other person can turn too. If you're in the intersection when the light changes, you have the right of way since you broke the plane of the intersection prior to the light changing.
BasedCourier@reddit
Depends if I can see past the car turning the other way. If not I go into the intersection to see past him. Also into intersection of the traffic is so bad you know you won't be able to make the turn before it turns red.
New-Assumption-3836@reddit
I pull into the intersection if it's a busy intersection that I might not get the opportunity to turn waiting on oncoming traffic and especially if there's a long line waiting to turn
BobsleddingToMyGrave@reddit
In my state, 1st vehicle moves to the center of the intersection, the 2nd pulls up to the intersection.
1st car goes through when clear or on Red.
2nd car replaces 1st car lather rinse repeat.
ohmyback1@reddit
This has been on here before and people get so pissy. Washington used to allow blocking the box to turn left. This changed I'm not sure when. But it's for a very good reason. Emergency vehicles cannot get through an intersection you are pulled into. Wasting precious time getting to a burning building or other Emergency.
Expensive_Plant_9530@reddit
Always enter the intersection, law permitting. It's far more efficient, and will avoid pissing off every person behind you also trying to turn left.
Basically I pull up as far forward as is safe before I block the opposite side from performing their own left turn.
If the light turns red and you're still sitting there, you clear the intersection as soon as it is safe to do so. The cross traffic yields to you. It's not considered running a red light, since you were already in the intersection when the light changed.
ChairNo5983@reddit
If you're in the intersection when it was yellow, then you have the right of way when the on coming is stopped for the red. But, if you stopped at the line before and waited, then you're stuck. Get into the intersection before red. Yellow only means "proceed when safe"
ohmyback1@reddit
You might want to check your state laws. When I was coming up, it was taught to pull into the intersection. Now that's illegal (in Washington). Blocking the box. If an emergency vehicle needs to get through on that cross street, you are in the way.
Specialist_Heron_986@reddit
Where encroaching into an intersection is allowed, I drive into the intersection when intending to make a left but not until any vehicles in the turning lane ahead of me have made their turn.
POAndrea@reddit
Read your state's rules of the road. Different states have different rules. Some say you must remain behind the stop line until you can complete your turn. Most say you can enter and stop in the intersection while your light is green and complete your turn once oncoming traffic is clear, even if it means on a red light. NOW, that being said, if there is an arrow to protect left turns, once that arrow turns yellow and red, you probably will not be allowed to enter the intersection until you have another green arrow. UNLESS it's one of the states that permit you to enter the intersection and complete your turn in one continuous forward motion once oncoming traffic is clear.
Read your state's rules of the road. Online versions often have short little videos showing what turns are allowed and what is not.
1962Michael@reddit
If you are going to go on the yellow or yellow/red, then you should be in the intersection. If you are in the intersection with your turn signal on, everyone knows what you intend do to.
OR if you are going to wait at the line, again with your turn signal on, that indicates that you are going to wait for a clear space or green arrow.
You don't want to wait at the line and then charge through the yellow. It takes longer, you'll be going faster, and others aren't expecting it. More chance of an accident.
RejectorPharm@reddit
Advance to just before the middle of the intersection.
You don’t want to set up a situation where only one person gets to turn per cycle.
IzzzatSo@reddit
You're supposed to pull up as far as you can without blocking anyone else's right of way. You can complete your turn after the light turns red if that is the first opening you get.
Upvotes4Trump@reddit
Pull up enough so emergency vehicles can still get through. Don't stop at the line and wait for a gap. You're adding extra travel distance to make the turn too, and need to wait for a bigger gap. Not to mention, all the people behind you want to go home too.
What drives me nuts is when the perfect gap is coming for me to make the left, then the last car slows down and decides to make a right. MOTHER!!!
StevenJenkins64@reddit
If emergency vehicles are coming, all traffic should be stopping anyways, and vehicles that are potentially blocking the road have the right of way to maneuver out of the way, regardless of light cycle, signage, etc.
Comprehensive_Fan140@reddit
Always head for the middle so you can at least make it through at the end of the cycle. There is a special place in hell for anyone not foing this! Jk
Best-Assist5680@reddit
What I do depends on where I am in the lane and when the light turns green. If the intersection is usually pretty chill, and I'm first, I'll pull almost to the middle but not quite so someone going the opposite direction can do the same.
If it's a real shitty intersection, and I'm first, I'll try and pull up about half a car length. Far enough to establish that I'm in but not far enough to get hit by some dumbasses that can't keep their vehicles straight. I'm still looking for enough ahead that if I see an opening coming up then I'll scoot up to halfway in the intersection.
If I'm not at the front and there's someone already waiting then I sit behind the white line until I can establish that there's going to be an opening that both the car in front of me and I can get through.
atticus-fetch@reddit
Move into the intersection and prepare to turn when traffic clears or at the first opportunity.
Reddidundant@reddit
I drive into the intersection. And if the old biddy ahead of me doesn't, I lay on the horn. MOVE!!!! There should be a special place in hell for those old scaredycats who stop behind the line and prevent one or more cars behind them from being able to proceed before the light changes.
TheCamoTrooper@reddit
Depending where you live it's required to "establish" and move into the intersection so that It guarantees no matter what one person can turn left per light cycle if it's not clear until the yellow. My ex failed her driving test for not establishing however that's here in Canada and laws may differ in other provinces or countries. I'd check your local laws for what the proper procedure is
Medical-Effective-30@reddit
Drive into the intersection. Only wait for the oncoming traffic to stop. No reason to wait for yellow. That would be fucking stupid. You go as far into the intersection until you would need to turn into the next lane over (from the opposite left-turn lane which is also YOUR left-turn lane).
Salty_Discussion_609@reddit
Depends.
PurrculesMulligan@reddit
If I’m first in line then I’ll wait in the middle. If there’s someone in front of me then I wait behind the line. It’s annoying when the light turns green and you’re held up by 3 people trying to squeeze through the left turn when their light turns red.
shugEOuterspace@reddit
yes you should establish yourself in the intersection, but don't turn your wheels until you're clear to turn in case you get rear-ended (don't wan't to be pushed in front of traffic)
AtYiE45MAs78@reddit
This is the only answer needed
Only1nanny@reddit
Drive into the intersection every time
mostlygray@reddit
In MN, the standard is to crowd the intersection to let people know your intentions. Get about half way in, and make the turn on the yellow if that's how it works out. You won't get in trouble if it turns red on the turn as you've made your intentions clear and you were already in the intersection.
That's how we were taught in driver's ed.
No_Difference8518@reddit
Always take control of the intersection. i.e. Drive into it and wai. At some intersections, with no advance green and a lot of traffic, this is the only way anybody gets to turn left.
Panthera_014@reddit
I go to the middle of the intersection - and I wish more people did - you can always get 1 extra car through - and if people aren't running yellows and red, you can sometimes get 2 cars through
tigrpal@reddit
If you're first in line, move into the intersection. If you're second in line wait at the line until the first car goes through then move up.
CODMLoser@reddit
Unless the intersection is wide enough to accommodate more than one car. some have room for 2-3 cars.
frenchornplaya83@reddit
God I hate people who don't move up. Cool, we'll just sit here for rounds and rounds of lights. Cool. So glad I left early.
One time I waited through like 4-5 lights because of some moron NOT MOVING AT ALL out of the turn lane. People were honking and they still just stayed. Completely clueless.
NikocadosAsshole@reddit
Wait in the intersection because then you can have a better opportunity at going and you wont miss the light if there was not an opportunity while it was green because since you are in the intersection you can turn once the oncoming traffic stops, this is at least in Wisconsin
Jdsmitty10@reddit
I was taught in drivers ed 24 years ago to enter the intersection and go on an opening or when the light turns red and opposing traffic is clearly coming to a stop..cannot stand when people sit at the line and sit through multiple lights because of traffic. Absolute morons. Those people need that new robo taxi Tesla just announced since they can’t drive correctly.
Hopfit46@reddit
Depends on the intersection, and the amount of traffic coming in the opposite direction, and the speed that people travel on the road.
Apprehensive_Bad6670@reddit
I suppose it could vary place to place, but where i am, one car can enter the intersection at a time for a left turn. Ithers must wait behind the line