Intel Solidifies $3.5 Billion Deal to Make Chips for Military
Posted by Winter_2017@reddit | hardware | View on Reddit | 160 comments
Posted by Winter_2017@reddit | hardware | View on Reddit | 160 comments
BiteFancy9628@reddit
They just laid off 10k people. Convenient how all the big companies can fuck over their workers for a bad quarter and still get government pork.
BausTidus@reddit
I mean whats the alternative, let tsmc make military chips?
Exist50@reddit
Yeah. The military uses TSMC-made chips today.
iamtheweaseltoo@reddit
Problem is, TSMC is a foreign company to the US, so if shit were to happen and the US didn't had an alternative supplier they would be left hanging by their balls if all hell breaks loose in Taiwan. And even if TSMC does build factories inside the US, with something as essential as chips, you really don't want to put all your eggs in 1 basket.
Exist50@reddit
Samsung also exists, and also has US fabs.
Strazdas1@reddit
There is no advanced samsung facilities in US. Austin fab provides stable manufacturing of 65nm to 14nm processes.
Exist50@reddit
They're updating it. And even if you ignore their US fabs entirely, they're a second source outside of Taiwan.
adaminc@reddit
TSMC is already underway, building a factory in Arizona somewhere.
pianobench007@reddit
it will not be leading edge at the Arizona factory. It will be trailing edge node likely destined for high volume automotive production duty.
Intel will however have leading edge at it's Oregon facility and then beyond. Automotive is getting more tech heavy everyday.
Tesla's already have built-in computers that are GPU/CPU and game play enabled. It is only a matter of time for the Industry to all decide if they want to include all of that technology into their car computer today. The first most likely to do it will be Rivian along with VW group.
Most legacy automakers have a weird legacy system they have to overcome first. So time will tell how thigns go in the automotive world.
But it keeps looking like we will need more chips.
Derpshiz@reddit
It's 2024 still sir
Jlocke98@reddit
"jellybean" logic ICs and AMD's license to x86 both are results of governmental requirements for a 2nd source
Professional_Gate677@reddit
There is a difference between the military using a generic cpu/chip made by TSMC and a foreign company manufacturing silicon designed for some top secret program like missile guidance or radar systems.
Exist50@reddit
You'd be surprised how many "generic chips" are used for just those sorts of applications. Why get specialized silicon when COTS works just as well or better?
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Make them hire em back as a condition.
stubing@reddit
I think you have a hard time separating the difference between a bail out and the government buying something from a private company.
ThankGodImBipolar@reddit
Exactly - this isn’t a bail out. What other US company can the government buy chips on advanced nodes from? The CHIPS Act is different.
Evening_Feedback_472@reddit
You know they never got any government pork right that's why they had to lay everyone off.. I can promise to give you 100 bucks but never actually give you the 100 bucks
BiteFancy9628@reddit
The airlines got a $5 billion bailout. Amtrak has had 2 multibillion dollar bailouts. The banks had a colossal trillion dollar bailout and the government required every one of them to take the money even if they didn’t need it to not show which banks were weak. The car industry got a multibillion dollar bailout. And all of these were free money added to the national debt, not loans to pay back. Only in the case of the car industry did Obama squeeze a few tiny concessions out of them.
soggybiscuit93@reddit
Companies like Amtrak shouldn't be expected to be self-funded. If we don't expect our car infrastructure to turn a profit, neither should we expect that from our train infrastructure (Amtrak is quasi-public) or our mail infrastructure, like USPS.
Strazdas1@reddit
Public services shouldnt be run for profit anyway. They should be run to maximize public good. Didnt Amtrak got nationalized when it went bancrupt?
BiteFancy9628@reddit
I would agree. So they should not be for profit. Let the government take the lucrative northeast corridor to subsidize trains in the rest of the country instead of them making big profits then crying poor every few years.
a8bmiles@reddit
None of those bailouts were free money. All of them had repayment conditions and most of them resulted in profit to the government.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
I stand corrected. Some were free money others loans. Low interest loans to companies with bad credit and no hurry to pay them back.
Still corrupt and shouldn’t happen unless we the people get to dictate the terms.
a8bmiles@reddit
It's totally fair to feel that way. My understanding is that they way that the terms are dictated has only one overarching goal: maintaining the stability of the economy. That's really the only thing the government cares about in these situations. "Fair" doesn't even make it into the room, much less to the table.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Of course. Because lobbyists and billionaires have our politicians by the balls. I’m not claiming it’s not a systemic problem or that there is an easy fix. But I can’t imagine a scenario in which the government has more power to reform bad actors in business than when their get rich scheme has just blown up and they lost their shirt. Even playing the old walk away from the negotiating table tactic to put the fear of God in them would have them groveling for whatever we feel like giving them.
In the banks bailout there were no consequences for cooking the books with crazy derivatives in the real estate market and no upside for Americans other than avoiding a depression. Instead the same Wall Street scammers repeated subprime on car loans and snapped up all the foreclosures so they could jack up everyone’s rent. I don’t even think they changed the minimum reserves banks were required to hold. They certainly didn’t bring back Glass-Stiegal and keep investment “banks” from gambling our savings.
a8bmiles@reddit
Yep, those are all fair points. Europe did a whole hell of a lot more regulation-wise to put limits in place to prevent or mitigate a reoccurrence. We certainly didn't over here.
Evening_Feedback_472@reddit
What does this have to do with Intel and that is nothing compared to other countries. That's why there's no development in North America people like you cry free money.
Look at china and how much they spent to build out their industries. High speed rail for one across the whole country
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Free money and fat government contracts at exorbitant prices that are give for political donations are more similar than you think. You’d be surprised.
Exist50@reddit
No, they're laying off 18,000 people because they missed earnings, the stock plummeted, and investors are demanding they do something about it.
Past-Inside4775@reddit
No, they aren’t.
They bought out a lot of employees who decided to voluntarily leave or retire early.
At my site, they’re laying off a handful. If that.
Exist50@reddit
They are cutting 18k people. Whether that's be taking voluntary leave or involuntary (which, from what I've heard, hasn't even been announced yet), that's the number in question. To pretend the layoffs are negligible is just laughable.
Past-Inside4775@reddit
There’s a huge difference. If this company was really on the verge of bankruptcy, they wouldn’t be paying $250k+ in some instances to entice older employees to retire
People here have known the right-sizing would be taking place for at least the last year.
I get that Intel lives rent free in your head, since there’s isn’t a comment chain in any of these threads you leave untouched with your hot takes, but you really don’t have a finger on the pulse as much as you think you do.
Exist50@reddit
So first you deny that the layoffs Intel themselves announced. Now you're claiming everyone expected layoffs for a while? And why use the PR "right-sizing" terminology instead of being honest about what that entails?
Lmao, I've seen your type do all sorts of gymnastics to defend Intel every time bad news comes out, acting as if it's all expected. If that were the case, Intel wouldn't have been hiring till recently, and wouldn't have guided as they did a quarter ago. Really that hard to accept that they're grossly mismanaged, and not being honest about the position the company is in?
Legal-Insurance-8291@reddit
Pork isn't even the right term to begin with. Pork refers to money alloted to a single district to buy that representatives vote.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Hmmm. Government cheese?
Professional_Gate677@reddit
The chips act is not a welfare program for employee bloat.
LeotardoDeCrapio@reddit
It kind of is. When it comes to the location of some proposed sites.
soggybiscuit93@reddit
Often times government contractors make sure to spread facilities around different congressional districts to ensure funding is supported by both parties.
Professional_Gate677@reddit
The only new site with construction is Ohio. Arizona is already almost fully built out. Oregon is basically fully built out. New Mexico is 218 acres and Ohio is 1000. No existing site is capable of expanding to give enough fab space that is forecasted to be needed. So a new site had to be started. Why Ohio? I’m sure there are reasons but to bring political posturing here is stupid.
soggybiscuit93@reddit
Ohio land is cheap. But when there's $Billions of subsidies on the table, there's always some political posturing involved in decision making. The act of receiving a subsidy is itself political.
I'm sure the fact that Ohio is a also a Swing state wasn't lost on Intel. There's cheaper land in other states. There's larger talent pools in other states.
Strazdas1@reddit
When you are building a fab at these costs, land costs arent not relevant unless you try to do it in a city territory or something.
LeotardoDeCrapio@reddit
Government is literally politics dude.
Strazdas1@reddit
The locations announced so far are all either near existing fabs or near universities that train people who would work in fabs.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Ah finally a comment that gets it even if we disagree. Make it a jobs program I say! More WPA and less chips. They’re bad for your health.
soggybiscuit93@reddit
CHIPS isn't a jobs program or charity. It's about securing domestic sourcing. If Intel is over employed for their financial situation, then lay offs are necessary.
According to this sub, Intel is both full of beauracratic bloat and shouldn't do any layoffs.b
Exist50@reddit
The assumption is, justifiably, that layoffs are not going to affect the people that need to be laid off. For example, Intel has badly missed their financial projections, and yet the CFO isn't going anywhere, despite that being his explicit responsibility.
NewRedditIsVeryUgly@reddit
Who said those 10K were related to this contract? It's a company with hundreds of thousands of employees, they absolutely have some failing projects that are losing money.
I understand getting mad about layoffs during high profits seasons, but Intel has financial difficulties even after getting this contract.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
If they can’t weather a couple of unprofitable quarters and pivot, retrain, and redeploy talent, they deserve to go out of business. VC startups go for 10 years without making a profit. Regardless of whether these layoffs are related to the contract they happen precisely when the contract was being negotiated. The government is allowed to use its influence and contracts to set conditions for behavior of companies who get contracts.
Danne660@reddit
Governments pushing companies towards bankruptcy because they lay people off is the same as the government making it illegal to hire more then the bare minimum of people.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
That’s the most idiotic thing I’ve heard in a while. “Encouraging companies to hire or at least retain American jobs is the same as forced layoffs.” That’s essentially what you just said.
How about this as an alternative rationale for what I’m proposing if you don’t care about workers.
The government should not enter into long term contracts with companies that are financially unhealthy because it presents too great a risk to taxpayer money if they go bankrupt and don’t complete the contract. They are likely to be back begging for government handouts to finish the job. Massive layoffs are a sign of a poorly performing company. That should incentivize them to think more carefully about big cuts to please shareholders.
Danne660@reddit
Massive layoffs are a sign of a poorly performing company, it means that they hired to many people, and if you punish them for taking the risk of hiring people then they will hire less of them.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Or they will even out their hiring and firing so it’s not a binge and purge phenomenon. And maybe with the right incentives they will think beyond quarterly profits and have a real strategy to survive and thrive for the medium term. They might even, God forbid, redeploy people they already employ instead of dumping them and hoping to find others in the market.
Danne660@reddit
Nope, way to risky thing to do if it might result in the government trying to push them into bankruptcy.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
No one is pushing anyone to anything. I’m just saying companies shouldn’t be entitled to plum government contracts without some strings attached.
Danne660@reddit
Companies that took the risk of hiring many people should not get government contracts?
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Companies that are hemorrhaging workers may not be a good stable bet. Also how they treat their employees should matter.
Danne660@reddit
Companies that hire worker might be a good stable bet.
BuchMaister@reddit
Sad for these people, but sometimes you need to drop weight from ship to prevent it from drowning in bad situation. A lot of VC startup fail eventually, while startup can make the risk as they are in the position to do something new and innovative, big companies like Intel can't really. Usually in these big companies there are huge inefficiencies, unneeded redundancies. Large layoffs allow these companies to better optimize - it makes the managers, choose to keep, only those they really need. In the case of Intel it's about staying in business.
NewRedditIsVeryUgly@reddit
Who is the arbiter of what company should go bankrupt? I absolutely don't trust governments to decide whether or not layoffs in the private tech sector are justified or not. Their solution to everything is to increase the debt, which is how you get to 35 Trillion$ US national debt. They're clearly clueless.
Intel is not a VC startup, and if they go bankrupt then about 120K employees will lose their jobs, in addition to the US losing their leading chip manufacturer. Flexing government muscle over a 3.5 billion$ deal is a terrible idea when you consider what's at stake.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Bankruptcy is managed by the courts. It ain’t a free market if Wall Street can gamble with no risk.
SovietMacguyver@reddit
Look, like it or not, Intel is is dire straights. This contract will help right the ship again, but so will cutting jobs. You act like this will be pure profit, but its more about cutting expenses and investing in ventures that will rebuild both its technological basis and its bottom line in order to make the company healthy once again. Only then, it can think about expansion - including jobs.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Sure. Prove it. Name one recent time when tech employers too profits and invested in the company in a way that increased jobs and pay instead of just stock buy backs or dividends for shareholders.
I would guess you don’t work in tech. It’s one hype cycle after another with barely a fig leaf of AI as an excuse to lay off a bunch of people to pump up the stock short term. Execs sell high and rebuy low, on a schedule of course so you can’t prove insider trading. AI can’t yet replace people for the most part. It’s virtue signaling.
All I’m saying is if large amounts of taxpayer money are involved in any way, we should get a cut, or be able to insist on good behavior from those companies. You wanna suckle the government test for profit? Play by Mama piggy’s rules.
This_Is_Livin@reddit
Lol yea, R&D, M&A...CapEx in general just doesn't exist
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Drop in the bucket. No doubt some companies spend more on R&D. It’s declining overall. I specifically mentioned job creation. Taking a bit of profits to hire a few pricey scientists and the rest straight to schemes to financially engineer the share price including layoffs is the name of the game.
You didn’t give an example btw. One that created more net jobs.
This_Is_Livin@reddit
Drop in the bucket lmao. Yea, I don't need to read any more. gg no re
soggybiscuit93@reddit
Intel got rid of stock buybacks over 3 years ago and just got rid of Dividends. Because they cannot afford it. They're spending over 40% of their revenue on R&D alone.
I'd agree with you that if they were highly profitable or in a similar financial situation as Nvidia, then they should be more heavily scrutinized for layoffs, but they're literally losing money and the CHIPS act alone isn't going to make up for that.
No-Relationship8261@reddit
Maybe they want the company not to lay off anymore people ??? I don't know if you noticed but Intel will go bankrupt in next 5 years if nothing is done. That is going to be 100k high paid people that indirectly creates a whole lot of jobs as well gone.
Like, if you think that they will all find jobs in other companies I have bad news for you. Intel employed nearly equal amount of people to TSMC+NVIDIA+AMD combined and TSMC here is more than half...
There is no way Nvidia+AMD+.... is filling the void Intel leaves behind in US economy.
gusthenewkid@reddit
Intel is overly bloated though.
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Doesn’t matter to the employees whose lives were ruined by layoffs in a terrible job market. We’ve got to get out of this quarterly profits mentality. People say about small businesses and restaurants if you can’t pay your employees a living wage you don’t belong in business. It’s an operating cost. Same should apply to big business. If you can’t weather a bad quarter or two and pivot your business strategy or retrain and redeploy staff from one thing to another, you don’t belong in business. The employees and taxpayers shouldn’t be your corporate safety net to dump them and then rehire later. We need tech unions.
SherbertExisting3509@reddit
America is going to favor American companies when it comes to military contracts. get used to it.
abort_retry_flail@reddit
Intel is an Israeli company.
Old_Wallaby_7461@reddit
this is like saying that Applied Materials is a Singaporean company
caustictoast@reddit
Started and headquartered in Santa Clara, CA. They have R&D in Israel but it’s very much an American company
BiteFancy9628@reddit
Of course. So favor American workers too as part of the deal.
III-V@reddit
Why in the world would layoffs have anything to do with getting future contracts?
BiteFancy9628@reddit
The government is allowed to put all kinds of conditions on government contracts. Security clearance, financial conditions, legal ones, geographic ones, political ones, etc. Lobbyists make most of rules. Let’s have a politician be a lobbyist for the people and make treating your employees well and creating American jobs required conditions.
Exist50@reddit
~18k
xugik1@reddit
It's only a matter of time before the government lets NVIDIA, AMD, Qualcomm, Apple, Google, Amazon, and Microsoft know that in order to engage in any government-related IT contracts, they must demonstrate that their semiconductors were manufactured in a secure U.S. facility and can ensure supply chain resilience.
oddoma88@reddit
all semiconductors are manufactured in a secure facility, since day 1.
xugik1@reddit
When China invades Taiwan, TSMC won't be secure.
BuchMaister@reddit
They can make with upcoming TSMC fab in Arizona which will have N4 at 2025, and another one in 2028 which have will produce N2/N3. I don't know if they do packaging there as well, but it can also be sorted out.
theQuandary@reddit
TSMC has been having issues and delays with the Arizona fab for a while now. They may wind up cancelling future fabs.
Entropy_Bug@reddit
No, they would not do that, just look at South Korea news where Chinese spyware are recruiting people for their Fabs, today I read an article where CEO send over 600 secret documents to China!
So, industrial spying nobody cancels as far as I remember....
BuchMaister@reddit
Well it's up to US DOD and other intelligence agencies to make sure chips for defense contract are protected from foreign spies. Since this fabs are in the US they can have much more control, and for the money the DOD pays, even TSMC won't say no for the requirements.
haloimplant@reddit
Yeah for analog stuff most designers I know would rather light themselves on fire than try to port from TSMC to Intel
DaBIGmeow888@reddit
Then why did US govt give billions to TSMC and Samsung?
novexion@reddit
TSMc is building Us fabs
kingwhocares@reddit
Would be hilarious if China banned Intel now for national security reasons.
oddoma88@reddit
they would if they could live without Intel
Helpdesk_Guy@reddit
You're like half a year late – China already did that and banned Western CPU-technology, expressively AMD and Intel-CPUs.
ExtremeTech.com China Bans CPUs From Intel, AMD in Government Computers
kingwhocares@reddit
"In Government Computers". I was talking about the market as a whole.
GhostsinGlass@reddit
China wouldn't do that, they wouldn't want to turn off the faucet of investment money Intel puts into China.
Intel backing of Chinese startups raises alarm in Washington
Intel’s venture capital arm has emerged as one of the most active foreign investors in Chinese artificial intelligence and semiconductor start-ups, at a time the $147 billion (€134 billion) chipmaker receives billions of dollars from Washington to fund a technological arms race with Beijing.
Intel's China investments may have spurred fresh US restrictions
" Intel's investment arm might be forced to divest interests in China due to incoming US regulations governing American funds going to Chinese tech companies. The chipmaker is one of the biggest such investors, despite receiving billions from Washington to boost semiconductor production efforts at home."
Sen Josh Hawley on Intel Corp Investing Billions In China But Not Condemning Its Slave Labor
kingwhocares@reddit
From your source:
In February Intel Capital invested in a $20 million fundraising round by Shenzhen-based AI-Link, a 5G and cloud infrastructure platform, and last year led a $91 million round for Shanghai-headquartered North Ocean Photonics, a maker of micro-optics hardware.
Not even half of $111 million in 2 years isn't much.
Legal-Insurance-8291@reddit
$3.5 Billion sounds like a lot, but it doesn't even cover 1/10th the cost of these fabs. Intel still has a LOT of work to do.
Professional_Gate677@reddit
Crazy but intel can have more than 1 customer.
ProfessionalPrincipa@reddit
Awaiting a second one but why did the Pentagon pull out of its funding commitment?
1600vam@reddit
Foundries do not announce their customers.
Exist50@reddit
They do announce when they have customers though.
Professional_Gate677@reddit
Intel has announced a few. Perhaps you should google it?
Exist50@reddit
More like planned customers, contingent on Intel not missing more milestones as with Qualcomm.
And no major volume customers yet.
Professional_Gate677@reddit
Well of course they have contingent customers since their foundry unit up and running yet. Did you expect them to have customers receiving chips before they even starting running in HVM?
Exist50@reddit
I'm saying a) the customers they have planned aren't meaningful, and b) the last time they made such an announcement, the would-be customer ditched them for missing milestone. So they still have everything to prove.
Professional_Gate677@reddit
Microsoft isn’t meaningful? Qualcomm isn’t meaningful? Amazon Web Services? Who are they? I’ve never heard of them.
Exist50@reddit
Without knowing for what / what volume, yeah.
Again, Qualcomm bailed when Intel missed milestones.
They're not making Graviton at Intel, if that's what you're thinking.
Professional_Gate677@reddit
It went from they have no customers to well we don’t know what they are making so it doesn’t matter. Gravitron was created years ago and designed with ARMs PDK. So yeah I wouldn’t expect Amazon to redesign an existing architecture with Intels just released 18a PDK. Si whatever future silicon design they are working on. I can’t find any evidence of any deal cancellations from Qualcomm. Care to share your source?
Exist50@reddit
You yourself admitted they were contingent customers a few comments ago. Intel's not making any money from them yet.
"ARM PDKs" are not a thing. And Amazon only seems interested in them for a small amount of packaging. That's negligible, even assuming it too hasn't been canceled.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/intel-gelsinger-nvidia-turnaround-30febac6
Professional_Gate677@reddit
Of course they are contingent. The node isn’t in HVM yet. All customers are contingent for any company until the node is up and running.
ARM designs chips on TSMCs node. You’re right it’s not ARMs pdk but again you’re not going to redesign a chip unless you need to. You are going to design new chips. You are so quick to cast something off as negligible because you don’t like it. Would you expect every company that fabs with TSMC to instantly cast them off and switch to Intel? No. You start by putting new products on their nodes and keeping old products on their current node.
As for Qualcomm, yeah that sucks if true. I can’t find any other references to that story other than that one WSJ article. No one else picked up the story which is incredibly rare if true.
There is also deals with Ericsson, Mediatek and others. Again this is a brand new business unit for Intel and it’s not even operational yet. So the fact they have customers already lined up says a lot.
Exist50@reddit
Of course we're talking about subsequent generations of chips, and there's no indication that Intel will be fabbing any of them. You can be assured, however, that AWS will certainly adopt the new TSMC nodes.
Or maybe because being a second source for packaging isn't a high value sale... Especially considering the capex Intel is putting into these fabs. Got going to fill those fancy new fabs...
Frankly, then you haven't been looking. Here's another person claiming the same. https://medium.com/@mingchikuo/qualcomm-may-have-stopped-designing-chips-for-the-intel-20a-node-meaning-that-intel-18a-r-d-and-bc29ea2493d1
Ericsson is Intel in house, not foundry. Mediatek doesn't seem to be using 18A, or Intel for anything significant in general.
Then why were you so eager to tout their success?
Professional_Gate677@reddit
Intel has announced a few customers for their 18a lineup already. Perhaps you missed them.
gahlo@reddit
Because they can make CHIPS pay for it instead.
Zezimom@reddit
Hopefully this initial deal just means it’ll be a reoccurring contract with more deals to come with the military in the future.
DehydratedButTired@reddit
Maybe they won’t use this for stock buybacks this time. What a hand out.
SherbertExisting3509@reddit
Why is the govt buying from a private company a handout?
DehydratedButTired@reddit
Imagine having an "extra" 110 billion dollars, but instead of using that to invest in your business (Where you are behind on fab technology), your talent (Which are being poached by AMD and Nvidia) or your marketing (Which has been horrible for the 2 decades because you didnt' care and you were ahead), you instead spend it on buying back a portion of your company from other people so that your evaluation is higher and your investors shares are worth more. Then a few years later you say "Oh god, we're doing bad. Please give us a few billion dollars goverment to bail us out".
People get all up in arms when companies have cool expensive offices, spend a lot on employee lunches or have high employee salaries. No one seems to give a fuck about huge stock buyback programs that are often more wasteful and only benefit shareholders (and c level executives who are paid in stock). It only adds insult to injury when a company that has been doing this grey area kind of market manipulation is telling people that they are going to go out of business and now the government needs to bail them out.
NeonBellyGlowngVomit@reddit
They already got handouts to do what they should have already been doing here without turning it into a contract.
tacticalangus@reddit
Which handout?
NeonBellyGlowngVomit@reddit
https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/newsroom/resources/us-chips-act-funding-intel.html
tacticalangus@reddit
Neither Intel nor any other company have received chips act funding yet. Feel free to check out the SEC 10K and 10Q documents and point out the chips act money (which you won't find on there).
ViniCaian@reddit
They still haven't gotten a single cent from this money btw
soggybiscuit93@reddit
non-paywalled link
ProfessionalPrincipa@reddit
Did they see the same thing Qualcomm, Broadcom, and others saw?
I guess that's why the Commerce department is out there begging for Apple and Nvidia to use IFS when Intel's design teams don't even want to use IFS.
Johnny_Oro@reddit
Broadcom haven't bailed out, an insider was just confirming that 18A yield wasn't ready yet, and the Reuters article made sound doom and gloom. And intel still has 10nm fabs. The military doesn't need the most cutting edge nodes, many fighters jets still use CPUs made in the 90s.
No-Relationship8261@reddit
Which is funny, because no one claimed that their first batch would be production ready... Like it's the first batch. It's good enough if some of the chips perform as expected.
Exist50@reddit
That's not what Broadcom expected either. Intel still failed.
No-Relationship8261@reddit
Oh you must have some insider info than ? Can you tell what exactly was not up to standard. Yields?, performance? Please share
Exist50@reddit
All the above. You see how they publicly downgraded 18A to the performance they originally claimed for 20A. Where do you think that leaves 20A itself. They've also stopped talking about the 2024 "manufacturing ready", and focus on just the year-later 2025 product launches. So an easier target and more time to hit it.
No-Relationship8261@reddit
So 18A will be worse yields and less performance compared to TSMC 2nm ?
Exist50@reddit
Certainly less performance. Yield vs N2 would be unknown at this time. Probably will be close enough.
Exist50@reddit
So you didn't read the article. Literally the first sentence.
Emphasis mine. Also:
Broadcom was clearly looking at where they should be at this point in time if the node were as healthy as Intel claims, and their test chip results showed that not to be the case. Especially damning when Broadcom would only need mass production around 2026, if not later.
soggybiscuit93@reddit
The military also has a need for cutting edge chips. The secure enclave program that this contract is for isn't for mature nodes.
Johnny_Oro@reddit
I see, 18A is their best hope then.
Executor_115@reddit
Why pay for something when you can get it for free?
[quote]While the Pentagon would have been the natural source of funding, critics say DOD and intelligence agencies were reluctant to pay for Secure Enclave from their budgets. The CHIPS bill offered an opening, with an entire new source of taxpayer dollars on the table.[/quote]
https://www.politico.com/news/2024/05/23/3-billion-secret-program-undermining-bidens-tech-policy-00158757
ProfessionalPrincipa@reddit
LOL. I guess all that talk in previous posts about the U.S. military swooping in to save Intel's fab business with billions and billions of dollars of orders and subsidy was just wishful thinking. They don't even want to pay a dollar.
BuchMaister@reddit
thank you, even if though they give me "5 free articles for Redditors" I don't like such tactics and conditions.
Helpdesk_Guy@reddit
Thank you! Oh, and sorry for the sorry biscuit lately.
gingeydrapey@reddit
Haha in the near future they will force Nvidia and AMD to use Intel foundries too. Fair competition the uncle Sam way.
Lalaland94292425@reddit
This is akin the government throwing a dog a bone. I'm afraid it's a little too late for Intel. Their 5 nodes in 4 years plan is essentially a marketing scam.
Independent_Ad_2073@reddit
Yeah, those U.S. government contracts aren’t worth much anyway…./S
Exist50@reddit
They really aren't. This 2.5B is like 1/3rd of what Intel Foundry is losing this year alone.
Crank_My_Hog_@reddit
Curious if they'll ship them chips that they know will fail. Hmm.
Thoromega@reddit
Yikes Intell going to be military quality
Lt_Muffintoes@reddit
I said a few weeks ago that it's looking like intel's fate is to be absorbed into the MIC blob like Boeing
When lobbying > innovation, that's the dumpster you end up in
WorldlinessNo5192@reddit
The government is insane for not demanding Intel spin off the fabs.
imaginary_num6er@reddit
Bubbly-Obligation303@reddit
Well I know about it so not so secret anymore checkmate military
Eh-I@reddit
"My squadron ships out tomorrow. We're bombing the storage depots at Daiquiri at 1800 hours. We're coming in from the north, below their radar."
"When will you be back?"
"I can't tell you that. It's classified."
Franklin_le_Tanklin@reddit
https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Enclave
BuffBozo@reddit
Bro saw a word he recognized from a videogame and thought it was a reference? Reddit gamer moment? Wtf lmaoooo
Aurailious@reddit
lol, lmao even
Ducky181@reddit
Sounds like a fantastic fictional story. Someone should put it in a TV-show, game or something.
intelminer@reddit
Did someone's bot break?
SherbertExisting3509@reddit
Irrelevant
anskyws@reddit
Oh shit! Will they work?
GenZia@reddit
Bureaucracy...
But then again, military hardware is made by the lowest bidder—or so the saying goes. So that's pretty much in line with bureaucracy in a traditional sense.
Just watch out for oxidation issues, I guess?
SherbertExisting3509@reddit
Finally, some good news for Intel
Helpdesk_Guy@reddit
So this is eventually some … good news for Intel at last, I guess?
Legal-Insurance-8291@reddit
Technically yes, although it was already expected so largely baked into the stock price.
jedrider@reddit
I think I was expecting this. Intel or China (they do claim Taiwan).
OutrageousCycle1990@reddit
Hopefully military got some military-grade cooling solutions, because they are going to need one
croatiancroc@reddit
Now if only they cities get their fabs online.