I tried to watch the debate tonight

[-]

ethanmx2@reddit

I outright refused to watch it for my own sanity. And I’m glad I did. Seems like nothing new was put forth. Just the same old cheap pops to rile each others bases.

Like who was this even FOR??? 90-95% of Dems and Reps are locked into their specific candidate. 85-90% of non-partisan voters won’t even show up for Election Day. Are we really wasting billions of dollars to try and sway about 10-15 million out of 250? About 4-6% of the voting population???

And more importantly: Does it even work?

[-]

RedEyedAquarist@reddit

I went in undecided and came out disgusted.

[-]

pinktastic615@reddit

How every libertarian always feels. Triply so this time as our candidate is the worst one they could ever find.

[-]

ethanmx2@reddit

All the more reason to vote Chase

[-]

LadyHedgerton@reddit

I generally would prefer to vote republican out of the two, since their policies tend to benefit business owners. But Trump? He just seems so old and mentally unstable. But I knew that already before last night, and it doesn’t change the fact that if he brings back bonus depreciation it can save me 6 figures in taxes. I’m undecided I guess, but it doesn’t even fucking matter because my vote doesn’t matter since I’m not in a swing state.

[-]

bananagramarama@reddit

Curious, why not just §179?

[-]

LadyHedgerton@reddit

179 can’t create a loss. So I can’t move it around between my multiple projects all under my real estate/construction business. With bonus depreciation I can use the loss from a property to offset a big profit on a spec project I sell, whereas income within that property (covered by 179) is just rents so basically negligible by comparison. I could buy multifamily just for the tax savings then cash out refi. It was very very powerful.

[-]

bananagramarama@reddit

I figured it was to create a loss! Thanks!

[-]

LadyHedgerton@reddit

Yeah for us real estate peeps the the 168k is where it’s at. :( hopefully if Trump wins he brings it back.

[-]

ethanmx2@reddit

All the more reason to vote Chase. Like seriously, 23 million people who voted in 2020 wasted their time voting for someone who was already going to win that state anyway. 5 million of them were just from California.

[-]

LadyHedgerton@reddit

The one thing that is throwing me off is the EPA thing in his platform. We’ve all seen photos of India/China, and there are lots of articles about the health effects of extreme pollution. I’d like to breathe clean air, I’d like my children to breathe clean air. Removing the tort cap, sure I like it, I don’t think it will fix this. Big companies will always have better lawyers and they can always dissolve and rebuild.

It just seems naive to think the legal system will do anything to curb our air quality rapidly degrading. And if that happened I’d probably leave to be honest, no one wants to live somewhere dirty and polluted. Any links I can read more? Like I have to imagine it’s still illegal to dump chemicals. Is it the EPA BS on like PPM and such that he wants to get rid of? Trust me I have no love for EPA bureaucracy but we’ve seen when companies go unchecked on pollution in other parts of the world, there’s a far lesser evil here.

[-]

Popular_Sprinkles_90@reddit

The only good thing I heard tonight is that there are no active military personnel in a combat zone. Other than that it was all the same crap

[-]

pinktastic615@reddit

Except there were at the time period of which she was speaking. The moderators failed to fact check it. My sorority sisters would fact check me and make fun of me for being wrong, but they found one of hers who wouldn't.

[-]

Scoutron@reddit

I’m pretty sure we have guys in Djibouti, which is not what I’d call a peaceful area

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

I don't know, she laid out some general policy. I'm not saying I'm for all or any of it but she did lay out some policy.

He has a concept and talked about people eating dogs... DJT you're a wild man.

[-]

ruben451@reddit

Technically not true. There are still troops in the DMZ in Korea. There is only a cease fire, they have never declared peace. I know it's nit picky, but as a former member of the U.S. Army, that distinction is important.

[-]

hblok@reddit

Ah, but are there military personnel in mostly peaceful zones?

[-]

IlIIIIllIlIlIIll@reddit

I wasn't planning on being this drunk and sad on a Tuesday night, but here we are.

[-]

PsychoticMessiah@reddit

Honestly I felt worse after the Trump/ Biden debate.

[-]

umpteenththrowawayy@reddit

Well that makes one of us. Honestly if the election were a democrat victory and I had to choose between Harris and Biden I’d pick Biden. Harris is just an unlikeable person.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

Yeah, this is a sane take... Not delusional at all.

[-]

umpteenththrowawayy@reddit

Sane or no, I just can’t stand Harris. She comes across as narcissistic and conceited.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

That's because you're on Trumps nuts. He's a fucking con man and he has brainwashed a huge amount of people. If you look at what he actually did, there's nothing positive with regard to spending the border etc. But as he said tonight, I won big. And all his hats just nod and say "You won big boss."

[-]

pinktastic615@reddit

You know, you can dislike multiple things at once.

[-]

umpteenththrowawayy@reddit

Nah I’m fully aware Trump sucks too, his economic policy amounts to a very expensive bandaid. Everyone knows we have a spending problem but none of the candidates we’re fed will ever try to resolve it.

[-]

MisterSippySC@reddit

Yea stupid people prefer to vote for people they like rather than someone who may be better suited for a job

[-]

LoneHelldiver@reddit

You mean the woman who knew that her drug lab technicians were drug addicts and were using the drugs they were testing but decided to not inform the defense attorneys because it would make her look bad? You know... an actual felony? That's the person who is better suited for the job?

The woman who's office admitted that they had not released prisoners who had exonerating DNA evidence because, as they themselves admitted, the men were in work programs and making money for the state?

Or are you referring to her sleeping with and taking all her first appointments from the very powerful at the time, Willy Brown? A point she later acknowledged when she publicly tried to distance herself from him? Is that the person that is better suited to run the country?

How about the least liked candidate in the debates? Possibly only rating better than Andrew Yang?

How about the person who has been in office for almost 4 years now which has shown a very real decline in almost every area of life in this country who has been gas lighting us into thinking that things are better?

How about the person who seems drunk at half of her appearances and only did one interview since being nominated where she had her VP as backup in a friendly forum where they only released less than half of the interview?

"We don't know for sure if they are Haitian" and "there are mostly photos of them eating geese" is not a good defense and we all know it's true. There is too much evidence including 911 calls. In a few weeks the NYT or WaPo will write an article about how "immigrants eating your pets is a good thing and here's why..."

[-]

AngryRobot42@reddit

"I have concepts of a plan" - Trump

[-]

pickles_in_a_nickle@reddit

“In Springfield, they are eating the dogs”

— Donald J. Trump

Made me hungry for a hot dog ngl

[-]

RelationTurbulent963@reddit

The guy at the town hall actually said they grabbed and ate a duck at the park

[-]

pinktastic615@reddit

According to residents, who have pictures of them carrying duck carcass, they are capturing the ducks at the lake, beheading them there, then taking them to where they live to cook. I've seen a picture, and read a story from a journalist. I would lean on the side of it being real.

[-]

Ok-Combination-9084@reddit

Even then that's a lot different than eating pets

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LoneHelldiver@reddit

There is a video of a woman eating a cat being arrested. No one knows if she's Haitian but it's real. There are stories, and these are not new stories, of people's pets being eaten. There are people testifying in city councils about said pets being eaten long before the memes broke out. Snopes fact check starts with a picture of a black man carrying a dead Canada goose and their fact check is "we have no proof he's Haitian."

Similiar incidents have happened in the past when large influxes of not very integrated populations were added to the country. What's so hard to believe?

[-]

Ok-Combination-9084@reddit

A goose is not a pet

[-]

dangered@reddit

While some people do keep geese as pets, I doubt the ones at the park belong to anyone. In the city counsel meeting (or whatever the meeting was) I did see another resident mention of farmer’s animals being slaughtered and the heads of the animals discarded near schools. It seems like it’s pretty bad over there and the mention of cats is just became a rumor because it’s so easily believable to everyone living there experiencing the insanity.

[-]

pinktastic615@reddit

Canadian geese are a protected species. But the posts about pets are typically from actual Springfield residents and they're all over, many before the story broke. I guess y'all could just drive up there and watch?

[-]

dangered@reddit

I don’t doubt the rumor may be true, there are documented videos of people within Haiti capturing and cooking up cats. It’s really about capturing someone who has done it.

It looks like in Haiti they keep the skulls for at least a short period so if they aren’t discarding them we may be able to know how widespread it is.

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pinktastic615@reddit

Today I saw a video of a guy saying he's from a nearby island and they do a ton a voodoo rituals with that sort of thing. I've known people from the nearby islands but would never have known to ask. My guess is to look for people who have lived near to Haiti and talk to them. Then ask where all that money from the Clinton Foundation went because they were supposed to go rebuild Haiti after some storm, but they built five small houses and left. Pretty sure there's been missionaries that went there, but I definitely do know any. Guess you could call a lot of churches and see if anyone knows any.

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dangered@reddit

I hope a journalist does just that, back in the 70’s/80’s when real journalists existed we’d already have answers.

IIRC Haitian culture is how Louisiana (specifically NOLA) became the birthplace of American voodoo. Not too hard to reach out and get an idea of how prevalent the practice is in Haiti today.

According to religious educational material:

Animal Sacrifice A variety of animals might be killed during a Vodou ritual, depending upon the lwa being addressed. It provides spiritual sustenance for the lwa, while the flesh of the animal is then cooked and eaten by participants.

https://www.learnreligions.com/vodou-an-introduction-for-beginners-95712

[-]

usedkleenx@reddit

People go to the park with their children to feed them. And then they see Hatians grabbing them an killing them. Because the geese have been domesticated and aren't afraid of humans. So yeah, they're basically pets. And can you imagine how horrific that is to see someone killing ducks and geese in your local park in front of children?

[-]

TheOrganHarvester123@reddit

There is a video of a woman eating a cat being arrested.

This was in Canton, not Springfield Ohio. We know she's not Haitian since she has previously been in contact with the law back in 2011 as well.

There are people testifying in city councils

Hearsay is not factual evidence of something occurring.

Snopes fact check starts with a picture of a black man carrying a dead Canada goose and their fact check is "

There's also the fact that this picture was in colombus Ohio and again, NOT Springfield Ohio.

What's so hard to believe?

The fact that the only means of evidence so far is hearsay, anything else is right wing media lying to our faces about the facts

[-]

undiagnosedAutist@reddit

That woman is certainly hatian. I lived around them for 20 years, they have a distinct look

[-]

pickles_in_a_nickle@reddit

Hahahhahahahahahaha cool

[-]

thedrugfiend01@reddit

There’s police body cam of a lady killing a kid and eating it on the side walk

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Makanly@reddit

Link?

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dangered@reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/libertarianmeme/s/ftl2lS1fiV

It’s a cat, I think OC just made a severe typo, as said before this is believed to be an Ohio resident.

[-]

Lord__Kur@reddit

That was an American citizen from Canton Ohio

[-]

Rich-Push4541@reddit

I never heard about that but I looked at houses for sale in Canton, OH last year cuz of how cheap they were. They were cheap for a reason.

[-]

Lord__Kur@reddit

It's the butthole of Akron.

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Rvtrance@reddit

There was a viral video of a woman who cooked and ate a dog. But she was American.

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nicehotcuppatea@reddit

There’s a photo of RFK eating one

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MisterSippySC@reddit

Okay but poaching a duck is not the same thing as stealing people’s pets and eating them, which was the main point which was made that was the most jarring

[-]

pinktastic615@reddit

There's a post here on reddit from 3 years ago talking about Haitians eating cats and a woman being afraid of her cats being eaten by a Haitian she knew. Three years ago. Also, that duck is a protected species.

[-]

MisterSippySC@reddit

Link it

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pinktastic615@reddit

Do you really think I can find a post from three years ago? I've looked, dude.

[-]

Saephon@reddit

Many people are saying the post happened, eh?

[-]

Rvtrance@reddit

Yeah, I think the duck thing is real, but the pet thing isn’t. And I don’t really have a dog in this fight no pun intended, so all I really wanna know is the truth.

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Trey33lee@reddit

I heard that was a video from Columbus.

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SpinoC666@reddit

The duck photo guy crossing the street is from Columbus, not Springfield.

[-]

undiagnosedAutist@reddit

They are. There's body cam footage of a woman eating a cat.

Most people don't have the experience of living around Hatians. I grew up in public housing. In the mid 90s we saw a major influx of Hatians moving in, and that's when peoples cats started disappearing, or outright turning up dead

[-]

pickles_in_a_nickle@reddit

It so true that when fact checked it becomes false.

Gl with that bubs

[-]

caligarelinquo@reddit

Darn subliminal message, I went to Wienerschnitzel

[-]

jackioff@reddit

gif

[-]

IfeedI@reddit

Just two more weeks....

[-]

GoodFaithConverser@reddit

Did Trump get cooked so bad you people can only think of BoTh SiDeS bad? Must’ve been a landslide victory for Harris.

[-]

NoNotThatScience@reddit

This was like a Mayweather fight. Watching it live and seeing anyone actually land a punch on Mayweather really influences you because he has this aura of invincibility about him... But when you go back and rewatch the fight you see he is easily winning the rounds.

Trump is no Mayweather especially this version of trump who is getting on in age (seriously go and watch his 2016 debates to see how drastically different he was in terms of quick wit and demeanour) but no one expected Harris to do well, most accepted the ABC hosts would be biased as hell but still thought Trump would get her uneasy and she would crumble like she has done in MANY softball interviews.

The truth is going into this we all knew kamala was not going to run on policy it was going to be trying to get Trump down in the dirt and use her softer demeanour as a woman to appeal emotionally to voters. And Trump who would have known this 100% walked straight into it. He did the same thing against Biden Few months ago, started off very well for 15 minutes and then got bogged down on insults and jabs.

Ultimately though people know Trump... He didn't perform well but is this going to change people's opinions, probably not? As for kamala who is more of an unknown commodity to most Americans, did she answer the questions she needed to answer to gain voters ? No, she may pick up a boost from her emotional pull but that's about it.

Also the fact checking bias was hilarious, at one point kamala repeated the Charlottesville hoax ("very fine people") which has been widely debunked since 2017 and the moderators just let it go, I believe in the same answer she also repeated the bloodbath hoax aswell. It was weird because Trump had been claiming the ABC hosts would be biased as hell but didn't have an answer for it ?.

Bad performance for trump imho but kamala didn't particularly impress enough to sway big voters, I think if the election was tomorrow I'd put my money on Trump still

[-]

GoodFaithConverser@reddit

we all knew kamala was not going to run on policy it was going to be trying to get Trump down in the dirt and use her softer demeanour as a woman to appeal emotionally to voters.

Cope. Kamala appealed to anyone with a brain. She presented actual policy (disagree or not), she has a plan and a record of results in the Biden administration, she's accomplished and successful and capable. Trump is just a loudmouth reality TV star with a failed presidency behind him where he only managed to... pass tax cuts. Big fucking whoop.

Also the fact checking bias was hilarious

Yeah they let Trump break in constantly, letting him get the last word on basically every topic, and barely commented on how absurd his statements were. Very biased for Trump, I totally agree.

[-]

savataged@reddit

Cope

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NoNotThatScience@reddit

Trying a little to hard there bud

[-]

savataged@reddit

Step 1: write an essay full of cope Step 2: claim other people are trying too hard

At least you’re consistent with your logical inconsistencies

[-]

donotswallow@reddit

Is this just an election thing, or has this sub just gotten this bad? I haven’t been on it for years, but the number of conservatives larping as libertarians is pretty mind numbing.

[-]

Rich-Push4541@reddit

The conservative sub has been ban happy for years so they flock here thinking it’s a safe haven for their bullshit views.

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DontBelieveTheirHype@reddit

Bro what are you talking about, everything pro Harris is being upvoted here. Apparently all these "Libertarians" now support gun control and higher taxes

[-]

THANATOS4488@reddit

A lot of Republicans have felt disenfranchised and shifted their beliefs towards the Libertarian party but their votes have not (yet) followed. Democrats also had a similar movement but it seems to have died down in recent years.

[-]

redlegsfan21@reddit

There was a moderation change a couple of years back that completely changed the dynamic of this sub. There's even a bot that comes around now that says that if you are left leaning libertarian, you are not a libertarian.

[-]

bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Hmmmmm you seem to think you know me. I’ve never met you before

[-]

The_Sour_Grapes@reddit

She did not win that debate by any means. It would have been even worse for her had the moderators not been active participants in her favor. Not once was she fact checked on her lies.

[-]

GoodFaithConverser@reddit

Trump lies with every breath. Whatever you could accuse Harris of, it's simply not on the same level whatsoever.

Also I hope most viewers can see Harris presenting actual policy, disagree or not, and Trump having no policies whatsoever. Barely even an outline of a policy.

[-]

The_Sour_Grapes@reddit

Did you really just say Trump has no policy? Have you been paying any attention whatsoever?

[-]

GoodFaithConverser@reddit

His policy is immigration bad. Maybe more tax cuts, but that comes with any republican whatsoever. He accomplished nothing during his first 4 years except... tax cuts.

In contrast, Biden with Harris has accomplished countless, concrete, actual policies. There's simply no comparison to anyone remotely honest.

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The_Sour_Grapes@reddit

I'd say his policy on immigration is pretty good. Stopping illegal border crossing should be a priority for this country and the Biden/Harris administration don't seem to give a shit; nor do we have any reason to believe Harris would correct the problem. Especially given her track record as the "border tzar". We seem to have entered the "find out" stage after the last 3.5 years of nonchalant border security. Cities that have been bombarded by illegals have seen an increase in violence, crime, homelessness, and a parasitic drain on taxpayer dollars. It's time to end that.

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thelongyop@reddit

Sounds like you’ve really drank the Kool Aid. Harris mentioned last night that Donald Trump called up Republican supporters of a bi-partisan border bill asking them to kill it just so he could run on immigration issues. She said he would rather run on a problem than fix the issue which is true because if he really cared about the influx of migrants then he would’ve supported the bill. Also, the vast majority of illegal immigrants is overstayed visas, not border crossings. Crime is down in this country, look it up, and actually crime is committed at a higher rate by natural citizens than immigrants. Probably because if you’re here illegally, you do everything you can to avoid the police, not welcome interactions with them.

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The_Sour_Grapes@reddit

You mean the bill that would allow for 5000 illegal immigrants per day when the correct number is ...wait for it...zero? That bill? I'd shoot that down too on general principle. No help from Trump necessary. You see politicians put shit like that in there knowing full well the other side will reject it. Then they can say shit like "see?! It's their fault we don't have a solution."

Look, I'm all for people coming to this country through the legal process, but if their first act of coming here is a crime by crossing our border illegally...nope, GTFO. And expired visas? Those can be corrected without deportation through USCIS.

[-]

savataged@reddit

His big policy this election is tariffs… kinda the antithesis of libertarianism.

[-]

DontBelieveTheirHype@reddit

What is with these foreign non American accounts posting up in here about our politics? It's really weird

(PS - Name doesn't check out)

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TopKekBoi69@reddit

I haven’t heard Harris talk about a single way shes gonna enact her policies besides just saying she’s the “president of joyyyy”

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GoodFaithConverser@reddit

The president is not a king. She has plans and will work to pass them.

Trump's "concepts of plans" is just an embarrassment.

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

I thought Trump was terrible but I can’t say Kamala was much better. She’s pro fracking now? Does she even know what fracking is and how nasty it is from an environmental standpoint?

[-]

momowagon@reddit

Nah, Fracking is fine. Not a threat environmentally.

[-]

bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Sarcasm or ignorance?

[-]

momowagon@reddit

Just reality. Sorry you're so afraid.

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

We can agree to disagree. I’m going off the fact that it releases a lot of methane which is a big no no for climate change folks like the Democratic Party. So it’s funny to me seeing her flip flop on the subject.

[-]

heywood-jablomi99@reddit

Personally thought he won, neither did well at all because they are both babbling morons but that was to be expected.

[-]

future_pirate@reddit

I watched the Chase Oliver interview instead

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Plastic-Bluebird2491@reddit

I don't know how they didn't talk about the single biggest issue - we're fighting a proxy war, in Russia, via ukraine, with US supplied weapons, with ever escalating threats of nuclear violence. Meanwhile we don't have a president. Is joe really up for this challenge? if so, why was he removed from the ticket? If not - why isn't Kamala invoking the 25th amendment? Would seem to be far more pressing issue than the nonsense that was discused

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

I think you mixed up “single biggest issue” with single use plastics

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joedotphp@reddit

I've heard Harris "on script" and "off script."

This was 100% a time she was on a script.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

her had an earpiece in. thats why she was “on script” look up nova headphone earrings.

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Dionysiandogma@reddit

So that’s the new coping mechanism for MAGAs huh? She wore an earpiece? Hahaha ok

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NapoleonBlownapart-@reddit

Yeah dude, no politician would ever do that.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

Yeah dude and her past a fucking trial lawyer has nothing to do with her debate skills...

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NapoleonBlownapart-@reddit

What does that have to do with what I'm talking about?

I'm just saying politicians in general aren't trustworthy.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

That statement means nothing. Now look up your state congressional rep and let me know if that guy isn't trustworthy.

[-]

NapoleonBlownapart-@reddit

I don't think he's trustworthy either.

This isn't about a particular side.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

Do you think DJT is trustworthy?

[-]

NapoleonBlownapart-@reddit

Nope.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

There's a few that I like. Kinzinger is one. I liked Connor Lamb.

[-]

XiphosEdge@reddit

Where were her debate skills in 2020? She forgot about them or...?

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

Well, they were good enough to get her the VP slot.

Also, what does that matter as long as they are solid now. Trumpers always looking backward.

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XiphosEdge@reddit

She got the VP slot because Biden promised a woman as VP and then the DNC insisted he choose a black woman. She was one of 4 black women for him to choose from. Trump is a fucking idiot. The fact that you can't imagine that anyone could be against both major candidates makes you seem delusional.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

Send some proof of the DNC making Biden pick a black woman.

No, I'm just gonna call you on your facebook meme commentary.

[-]

XiphosEdge@reddit

Heres Biden promising a woman:

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/15/biden-woman-vice-president-131309

Here's Dems pressuring him to pick a black woman:

https://www.npr.org/2020/06/12/875000650/pressure-grows-on-joe-biden-to-pick-a-black-woman-as-his-running-mate

Cry about it.

[-]

Dionysiandogma@reddit

Whatever helps you sleep at night

[-]

NapoleonBlownapart-@reddit

What do you mean?

Do you think the same people (or like minded people in the past) that lied to fet us into wars, lied about just all kinds of things really, wouldn't cheat?

No... they would never

[-]

CaesarLinguini@reddit

The Benevolent Overlords? Never.

[-]

sunnyseshh@reddit

has nothing to do with being maga. look up the product that exists for public purchase and you will see it was in her ear.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

So, you didn't expect a fucking lawyer... Let that sink in genius a trial lawyer....

would be able to FUCKING DEBATE?

She's a lawyer! It is literally their job.

[-]

XiphosEdge@reddit

She literally shit the bed in the 2020 debates. If it was Herself's job, she must've been really bad at it? And for her to barely beat Trump at a debate while dishing out some of her own lies? It's pathetic.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

You think she "barely" won that? He was talking about eating dogs and that he had a concept of a plan...

[-]

XiphosEdge@reddit

And she was smugly smiling and shaking her head while he was truthfully calling her and the Biden admin out on still using his tariffs. Him saying one stupid thing doesn't suddenly absolve her of her own brand of pretentious absurdity.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

That's the only argument I've heard against her. She looked smug. Trump is the definition of smug. He is literally the most smug person on the planet. Maybe it is just his face.

[-]

XiphosEdge@reddit

And you zero in on the "smug" part while ignoring the tariff part. Typical.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

So, do you think Trumps tariffs are good?

[-]

XiphosEdge@reddit

My point is that she called them a "Trump sales tax", but she's still willing to use them. It's fucking idiotic that you can't see the problem here. Like I said, not eons better.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

Is she the president? You must really hate Trump because of his tariffs. Do you agree that they are a sales tax?

[-]

XiphosEdge@reddit

Nope

[-]

sunnyseshh@reddit

lmfao ive never said she wasnt a good speaker. if anything, the only thing she has going for her is that she presents very well and speaks eloquently when talking about certain issues. the problem is, a lot of these issues she doesnt regularly talk about or she has flipped her position on these issues. i would have liked to see her elaborate more on certain things, but given that i dont think either candidate has enough time to really present their arguments on certain points w the 2 min time limit, that has nothing to do with her.

[-]

the_BoneChurch@reddit

Yeah presenting well and speaking eloquently are requirements for the commander in chief. Also, not constantly saying that our nation is failing would be nice.

I sat and stared at the woods at a brewery this weekend while my kids played peacefully in the background. Felt like a pretty fucking successful experiment at that point. I'm not eating bugs and watching my children starve. I drive a car. People are nice. I can get a fucking burger at any second.

He's all fear and gloom. The president is a physical and psychological projection of the nations values. Other than that, they don't really do much. So in this case, I'm sick of fear and gloom. It's all he's got. "They're eating dogs and they're gonna kill you as our failing nation grasps for survival. You'll never vote again, the nation is a failure." Now what the fuck am I supposed to do with that?

[-]

sunnyseshh@reddit

unfortunately, over the last 4 years our nation has gone into major decline and this has been a failure of an administration. so many people are much worse off financially now than even right after covid. our failures in international affairs over the current admin is an embarrassment. i agree tho, there is a better way of talking about it. especially with the eating dogs things as that still is a new story, but absolutely happening. and i do live close enough to the community to have an actual opinion. there was a lot of fact checking on trump that was not done on kamala (even on subjects she was fact checked for in previous debates). the overall debate setup is screwed up.

i will say though what a wonderful weekend it sounds like your family had. i hope everybody is able to find that kind of peace and comfortability in the near future.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

You're simply wrong but you won't see it. Look at the markets. Look at general infrastructure rating among other first world nations. Medical spending etc. We have more navigable waterways than any nation on earth.

We are more supported by our allies now than any time in Trumps term. England, Germany, Australia, Canada, Mexico, should I go on??? Those are the important relationships. Not Russia, North Korea, and the Taliban. Ironically those are actual failing nations.

Trump has been a con man since he stepped on the scene in the 80s. He is entertaining at times but not when the rubber hits the road. He failed miserably during covid. He spent more than any President in history after inheriting a booming economy. The shit was tanking when covid hit which is ultimately what saved him in that realm.

Yeah, they should fact check them when they say blatant lies.

I was surrounded by hundreds of other people doing the same thing last weekend. Driving down the highway all I see is relatively new cars. Gas stations are pleasant and functional. Come on man. This country is fucking rocking. It has nothing to do with the president. Obviously, as Joe Biden is a zombie.

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MisterMaryJane@reddit

Recycling the same stupid excuses. Not a good look

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sunnyseshh@reddit

is it recycling the same “stupid excuse” or is it a bunch of bootlickers ignoring reality?? any normal person can order these headphone earrings. i was looking at buying those exact kind for work a few weeks ago!!

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MisterMaryJane@reddit

Donald Trump was wearing nova headphones. Look it up

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sunnyseshh@reddit

since the bootlickers will keep crying instead of utilizing the phone in their hand, heres a close up still of an older model of the headphone earrings. look familiar??

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MisterMaryJane@reddit

You keep using bootlicker like you don’t like daddy trumps old ass boots. You show a picture of the earpiece but zero evidence of Harris wearing one.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

where have i mentioned trump?? i havent because it wasnt like he was just spectacular tonight. im just a bitch that knows her jewelry. you people are so fucking dumb you cant handle the idea of someone criticizing something for what it is without any emotional attachment to the claim. but since you asked, heres a screenshot of kamala’s look tonight in the middle of the debate! notice how the gold posts wrap around the pearl and point the microphone upwards exactly as the nova earrings do. the double posts support the microphone and clip attached to the back of her ear. so tell me now, what do you think of her pearls? still just a cute fashion statement?

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MisterMaryJane@reddit

Lmao earpieces are jewelry now? You keep using bootlicker and jumping at me when I’ve asked questions so it’s clear you’re for Trump.

That’s the evidence you’re providing. It’s comical just like trumps debate.

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XiphosEdge@reddit

Idk, dawg. I hate Trump, but Democrats spent months trying to gaslight everyone into thinking Joe Biden was fine even though he clearly wasn't. Wouldn't put it past any of you to take Harris' side on anything, no matter what it was or what evidence was provided. You are a bootlicker. You're just licking blue ones instead of red.

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MisterMaryJane@reddit

So since I think it’s the same old bullshit coming from Trump supporters, I’m a bootlicker?

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XiphosEdge@reddit

You're a Dem shill homie. You can try to back track some of the shit you've said in your comment history but your preferences are very clear. You wanna prove me wrong? Tell everyone here what's wrong with Harris. I mean, you can slice it any way you want, but Harris' performance at the debate was an obvious departure from her usual word salad and circular logic, so people reasoning that out with something entirely likely doesn't mean they're Trump supporters. Trump says stupid shit all the time (this debate was nothing new for him) and he usually does it to fearmonger, but Harris has spoken her fair share of inaccuracies and nonsense too. She won the debate for sure, if that's what you could honestly call it, but that doesn't mean she did it on her own lol and idk, I guess in my eyes that makes our political situation so much worse. For me, this debate was a disappointing affair no matter who won, whereas for you it seems like a delight. Also wild that the first time in at least the last 4 months that you come into the Libertarian sub is to engage in brain-dead Trump bashing, like a wind-up monkey clanging it's cymbals together. Trump bashing is fun, don't me wrong (like Diaper Don is my personal fav), but so is Harris bashing. As far as I can tell, you haven't engaged in any criticism of the Democratic party or Herself lmao it's pathetic.

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MisterMaryJane@reddit

This post has nothing to with Harris and her flaws. This is about a dumb conspiracy theory that has been debunked.

Keep moving the goal posts.

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XiphosEdge@reddit

Goal posts? Bahaha you just want some goal posts there so you don't get called on your shit. Who cares if she was or wasn't wearing Nova earrings? You're not here to talk about earrings. You're here to incite hatred for a guy that many people on this sub already don't like, including myself. Carry on however you want, you're just missing the part where Harris lied several times in this debate too. They're both trash and the fact that she performed better than a 78 year old crybaby isn't impressive. She could not have asked for an easier candidate to beat, but she's barely polling higher. It's pitiful. Maybe ask yourself why that is.

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MisterMaryJane@reddit

Lmao you are something else moving these goal post farther and farther. Be good

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XiphosEdge@reddit

Yeah yeah, the earrings were the "goal posts". Except they weren't. In the debate you were having with the other person they might have been. But I entered the chat specifically to argue that you are indeed a bootlicker. You have thus far deflected any opportunity to prove me wrong; ya know, by lobbing some genuine criticisms at the KHive Qween. Enjoy your boots, buddy.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

…theyre clip on earring headphones made to look and wear like pearl earrings. are you seriously that dense?? again, the only person that has mentioned trump is you. you cant properly defend your candidate without attacking another (that hasnt even been mentioned for that matter). so much for the party of peace lmfao.

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MisterMaryJane@reddit

Either are my candidates lol and now you’re assuming Harris is mine. Pot calling the kettle black. You’re seriously trying to push a stupid narrative with terrible evidence.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

i doubt youd be doing all that defending for someone whos not getting your vote. at this point, id be inclined to believe nothing different with the way youve been kissing her ass since you reaponded. so much for “true libertarianism” lmfao. youre seriously trying to ignore basic facts because youre so brainwashed you cant rationalize a politician wearing an ear piece earring.

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MisterMaryJane@reddit

Lmao I’m not defending her. I’m telling you that your reasoning is old and recycled. You show zero proof and you bring zero facts. All I’ve done is question your wildly dumb acquisition.

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ohreallynowz@reddit

I usually wouldn’t bother with this but I hate seeing disinformation spread so flippantly. Harris has had these earrings since at least 2022 and they don’t match that product.

https://www.nbcnews.com/meet-the-press/first-read/kamala-harris-calls-domestic-threats-dangerous-harmful-rcna47177

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sunnyseshh@reddit

finally someone worth a shit with an actual response. i have never seen her in these earrings, but if shes had them for awhile, then youre right clearly not an earpiece. not long before the debate i had just been shopping these out (headphone earrings) so her big pearls caught my eye and didnt look right.

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s3r1ous_n00b@reddit

Well even logistically, how would she keep a natural cadence with talking points being parroted?

Seems harder than just her having done her homework IMO.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

surprisingly it isnt as hard as most would think. it could be anything from feeding a line here and there or beginning to prompt the responses to like you said parroting the entire answer. kamala harris has always been a good speaker and has good stage presence, so it wouldnt surprise me if they gave her a prompt to start her responses and she rolled with it from there. she wasnt wearing an ear piece tho, so im betting they gave her the questions early like hillary in 2016.

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SellToCover3849@reddit

This is the dumbest shit ever. These are fucking professional speakers, and as a former trial lawyer, she has been a professional debater for decades.

Now, while Trump may be the rich slacker that pays other kids to do his homework for him, it's really not hard to prepare for the questions in advance. Given the questions in advance? Please. These debates are like 10 or 15 of the most obvious questions that anybody with a moderately competent staff is going to know what they are in advance. There is no need to be told them, nor is it even ad advantage. The political subs on reddit were discussing what the questions would be days in advance and would easily be able to pick the topics.

Basically it's like taking a test where you have to study for 20 questions and 10 or 15 of them will be on the test. That's not hard for normal people, just lazy billionaires that have never worked hard at anything their entire lives.

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s3r1ous_n00b@reddit

Well said. Trump marched into unfriendly territory and didn't give two shits about preparation. Frankly, I'm stunned. His entire debate prep team must be LIVID right now. How does that even happen??

I was going to vote for Kennedy before he pulled out-- that man knows how to speak goddammit. Instead, he got scared and ran for cover under this bumbling idiot. Fuck the uniparty.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

until the green/independent party gets the recognition it deserves, unfortunately those candidates will continue to lose/drop and endorse another candidate. theres too many people still against voting outside of the 2 party system and not enough donors willing to fund a massive campaign for a 3rd party candidate. wouldve loved to see a kennedy admin tho.

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s3r1ous_n00b@reddit

Well said.

Kennedy would have won if it weren't for the media machine and DNC lawfare, IMO. I want to see the merger of the gov. And the Media break up somehow, but I have no idea at this point how that can even happen.

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BabyJesus246@reddit

Lol no he wouldn't. Anti-vax doesn't play well to a majority of the population.

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s3r1ous_n00b@reddit

Anti corporatism does. And he makes a phenomenal case about the perverse incentives that our regulatory bodies have to push for more vaccines on the schedule. I encourage you to listen to him, and fact check him directly as I have. The actual information is disheartening to say the least.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

hard agree. even when he offered to take over for biden, the dnc wouldve never accepted him because hes too independent. he cant be bought and genuinely has the best interest of americans. they hated him for it. the crisis in journalism weve experienced the last 10-20 years has truly been so detrimental to politics and the way people see/understand how our country functions. which is why when people like rfk come out talking all this “crazy shit” about protecting our food and water supply, radiation, etc, its just perceived as insanity because civilians dont know what the real problems are.

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Bigdaddyjlove1@reddit

Yeah, I mean I get not liking her politics, but the lady has a law degree and was a prosecutor in a very large city. She's clearly intelligent. Please disagree with her, but those guys just fucking making up shit is sad.

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s3r1ous_n00b@reddit

Well said.

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Ravenlock@reddit

This reply could use a little more "oh wow I sure did decide that everybody who found my 'basic facts' unlikely was a 'crying bootlicker' and 'dense' and 'fucking dumb' pretty confidently and maybe I could've dialed that back a bit."

Nobody owed you a deep research dive for the evidence that her earrings are earrings, but it's also true that she has them on in the third picture that comes up in a Google Image search for "Kamala Harris", so it's not like it's hard to find. You just weren't interested in doing "utilizing the phone in your hand" for the same 30 seconds that you lit up other people for not doing.

Which is fine. We all fuck up sometimes and we've all got biases. Just, y'know. Maybe note that this one bit you a little here.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

lmfao you people are fucking dumb. they are a legitimate product that exists and it was a legitimate question!! its not an uncommon practice for speakers to wear headphones, so why would it be so out of the ordinary for her to have some?? nobody was looking for a deep dive research, its as simple as googling if this product even exists and what it looks like. and i even provided the pics! whether she had one or not does not affect me personally, but it does beg the question of how legitimate these debates are (given the bullshit weve seen over the years with the changing rules). biases aside, im just a bitch that likes jewelry that has been shopping these out recently so her pearls caught my eye, like ive said. which i why i didnt mention anybody or anything else because performances aside, i was just curious about the earrings lol,

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Ravenlock@reddit

Uh huh.

An online search for the Nova H1 Audio Earrings shows that they do not currently appear to be on sale anywhere, and NOVA Products' website redirects to another company, Icebach Sound Solutions.

Additionally, backers on crowdfunding site Kickstarter have left messages from over a year ago asking for delivery status of their purchased H1 earrings that supposedly never materialized. NOVA Products' last login to Kickstarter was in May 2023.

But you just happened to be looking up a Kickstarter from 2021 that never delivered and that don't appear to be for sale, just in time to recognize something that looks like them at the debate. Had nothing to do with MAGAland tossing their newest conspiracy theory around, that's a pure coincidence. You'd just been "shopping them out" as a "bitch who knows her jewelry." Where were you going to buy them from, I wonder?

Tips for the future: a "legitimate question" and "being curious" look a lot more like asking or suggesting, and a lot less like stating things as facts, calling people idiots, and doubling down on how obviously true your (untrue) answer is until somebody meets your burden of proof. And it doesn't take any longer to see how many comments you're making about how actually, people ARE eating dogs and cats and how on other threads than it took to find the picture of her earrings.

Again, it's fine. You're 22, assuming you're not a troll account and that you have no reason to lie in other non-political spaces. I've been on Reddit longer than you've been out of kindergarten, which is a wild thing to think about. We've all been extremely confidently wrong online sometimes. Just take the L.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

lmfao youve figured me out going through my comments! then you shouldve probably seen what i do for work which i need some new headphones for. how is somebody with 15+ holes in their ears gonna find airpod type headphones that actually stay on?? you gotta start getting creative. truthfully i wouldve voted 3rd party this year for rfk (since youve been reading my comments you wouldve prob seen that too). unfortunately weve ended up with who we have now, so those are now our options. and yea ill stick to calling people dumbasses until theres something worth a shit thats actually being said. ex- the first bootlicker was shocked at the idea a candidate would ever do such a thing. is that really such a shock seeing the bullshit out gov pulls regularly?? yes my comments about my apolitical boyfriend deciding to vote trump because of the “eating dogs” has nothing to do with a personal bias. i was actually shocked when he said “yea fuck it theyre making me vote trump this year” as he has never liked trump or politics as a whole. he is truly the demographic of the “undecided voter” that people are asking about. and given that weve always lived in texas and now live in ohio, hes always been extremely pro immigrant (his parents are 1st gen immigrants) and still is shocked at what is happening is our area.

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Ravenlock@reddit

Alright, I can take that at face value. If you already have airpods, I'd recommend something like these that just attach to them because they already have better sound quality than anything you'll get for a comparable price.

If not, there are lots of over-the-ear loop earbuds that stay on similarly. I also like bone conduction headphones a bunch, which usually loop around the back of the head and sit on top of the ears pretty comfortably.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

thanks for the recommendation! those are super cute! i used to have something similar, but with as many posts as i have in my ear unfortunately those dont stay on my ear anymore :( i guess the search continues, but thank you! i genuinely appreciate your recommendation and advice!

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nickbutterz@reddit

While I agree that they don’t specifically match the earrings in question, I’m not sure what her having them from 2022 means?

According to Nova’s kickstarter page, they began sending these to customers in August 2021

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/nova-audioearrings/audio-earrings-earphones-made-earrings/

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paranoid_throwaway51@reddit

i mean, personally i dgaf cus im not an american.

but dont those look exactly like the product, or am i blind ?

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ohreallynowz@reddit

You are in fact blind, yeah

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paranoid_throwaway51@reddit

i mean, to me those look like the exact same earrings.

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pinktastic615@reddit

As a woman, there was a golden loop around the pearl and they were pretty. If there are people who are wearing ear pieces during debates, then she should have been giving actual policies and Trump should have gone on the offensive more. I got bored and turned it off.

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ohreallynowz@reddit

I mean, I’m sure I could dig up photos of her from prior to 2021 with the earrings. She really only alternates between a few pair, which makes sense to not have a “tan suit” issue. But again, I just don’t care that much and, again, they clearly are different AKA as we decided,you’re blind.

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SSweetSauce@reddit

Well if that was the case whoever was in her ear did a shitty job

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joedotphp@reddit

No. Just no.

Trump shit the bed. Deal with it.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

lmfao i upvoted you in agreement. nobody has mentioned trump.

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Staypuft1289@reddit

Boy anything to detract from your mango man losing a debate huh? Pathetic

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sunnyseshh@reddit

where was that ever brought up?? performances last night were all a mess all around lol im asking about some earrings.

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MMQ42@reddit

Cope…seethe

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Tankbot85@reddit

Yea not the same item that she was wearing. They were just earrings.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/nova-audioearrings/audio-earrings-earphones-made-earrings

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sunnyseshh@reddit

it looks like a different model she was possibly wearing. im still not convinced it wasnt an earpiece. as a pearl lover, ive never seen a pair of pearl earrings, clip on or not, hang like that.

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pickles_in_a_nickle@reddit

Hahhahahahahuahahahahahahha hahahahahhaha

The seeeeeeeeeeeeth

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RocksCanOnlyWait@reddit

It's more believable that ABC gave her the questions ahead of time. The media did it for Hillary in 2016.

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sunnyseshh@reddit

oh i definitely think so too and wouldnt be surprised. ive been getting ads about clip on headphone earrings and the nova earrings look identical to the pearls she was wearing tonight. look it up and see how the gold posts wrapped around her ear. definitely a headpiece.

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ElGDinero@reddit

It's all bullshit. Roughly 180 million Americans technically qualify to be president and these are the two options we're given? And one of the terrible options is actually a replacement for a previous, more terrible option.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

Am I nuts or does she seem like a way better option than anyone in the past two elections?

She's a lawyer which is kind of a requirement these days. If I take her at face value, it seems optimistic and hopeful which is nice.

I'm definitely sick of Trump and others saying we are a "failed democracy". That's such a bullshit talking point. When I heard it last night, as an American, I was finally like "Hey, fuck this guy. Quit putting us down." I know things could improve a lot but for the most part I'm not eating fucking bugs and starving to death. I went to a brewery last weekend and stared at the woods while my kids played peacefully in the background. It doesn't feel failed.

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No_Training1372@reddit

Democrats want to create a totalitarian socialist state with themselves firmly in control.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

This lets me know that I don't need to take you seriously.

So, why didn't they successfully solidify their iron grasp during eight years of Obama? Because all you fucking geniuses were parroting the same shit for eight years while he was president.

What argument are you gonna use next? "They gonna take yer guns brother!"

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No_Training1372@reddit

They will. If you are interested in liberty the left is not the place to be. Unless you just want to enjoy your weed and your soma and let the government run everything.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

When are they going to take our guns? You loons have been saying this for fifty years.

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No_Training1372@reddit

After the Democrats add a few more justices to the Supreme Court, then the Court will rule that the Second Amendment applies only to the National Guard. After that, the Democrats will ban assault rifles and then handguns and finally guns used for hunting. The Democrats are playing a long game not a short one. Just because the goal is long term doesn’t mean it is not a goal.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

Jesus H. You are completely gone. Who are they gonna replace? Name the justices. Name your state congressman. It's all bullshit dude. The 2nd amendment will never change.

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No_Training1372@reddit

They do not have to replace anybody. If Kamala Harris wins she can ask the Congress to increase the number of justices on the Supreme Court from nine to thirteen. Assuming she has a Democratic majority in both houses, she can accomplish this and appoint four new left wing justices who can toss the Second Amendment. There are 52 members of the House of Representatives from my state most of them Democrats.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

How does it feel to live in fear?

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XiphosEdge@reddit

Am I nuts or does she seem like a way better option than anyone in the past two elections?

You are nuts. She's flip-flopped on multiple issues in blatant attempts to appeal to voters, while seeming to hold no real intention to keep her word. If she's so careless with her convictions she has no business being president. Neither does Trump, but saying she's a way better option than anything we've seen in the past two elections is:

A) Fucking moronic.

B) Hardly a brag, assuming you're talking major party candidates and even if it were true.

She's a lawyer which is kind of a requirement these days. If I take her at face value, it seems optimistic and hopeful which is nice.

"Joy" is part of her campaign, and it's an utterly psychotic slogan when she's in the business of arming a genocide against Palestinians and a war that should have never feasibly fallen on US taxpayers, as Ukraine isn't an ally. At least Trump has the nerve to say "we're fucked" while he's being bought out by Israel.

I'm definitely sick of Trump and others saying we are a "failed democracy". That's such a bullshit talking point. When I heard it last night, as an American, I was finally like "Hey, fuck this guy. Quit putting us down." I know things could improve a lot but for the most part I'm not eating fucking bugs and starving to death. I went to a brewery last weekend and stared at the woods while my kids played peacefully in the background. It doesn't feel failed.

Everyone with any sense is sick of Trump, but saying you're supporting someone who just flipped her stances to things like pro-fracking, pro-gun and pro-border wall, while still using Trump-era tariffs (they just raised tariffs on China in May actually) means that you are voting on one singular issue: abortion rights. Her stances flipping on some of these things are fine (like pro-2A, great!), but the fact that she is blurring the lines separating her from the Donald should alarm you. Be honest here, she realized that she didn't need to be a Joe Biden copy-cat to win, and in fact emulating him would cause her to lose. She realized she just needed to be a little better than Trump to win. That's what you're voting for, someone who is slightly better than Donald Trump. It's fucking pathetic.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

And with everything you said, she is still eons better than Trump.

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XiphosEdge@reddit

Except not eons. Slighty better.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

We can't really split hairs. To be honest, I don't hate Trumps policy and had he agreed to a peaceful transition of power I would probably agree with you. But the fact that he never conceded and did what he did, I can't. She's eons better.

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thefreebachelor@reddit

My problem with her is that she is too slick and if anyone doesn’t call her out on it then yikes.

The Trump Abortion Bans-He wasn’t in office when Roe v Wade was overturned. He also never signed any laws doing that. Those are state bans and she knows it.
Trump taxes-I agree that tariffs are taxes, but Biden has added to Trump’s tariffs not subtracted so she’s being intellectually dishonest.
Ukraine- She says that we have no military in combat zones, but that hasn’t stopped us from funding wars. What about the oil sanctions that caused the huge spike in gas prices in the first place? Will she repeal those?

All of her niceties are just ways of putting a smile to the actual awful policies that she will enact. Her record as attorney general alone should disqualify her for office, but since Tulsi Gabbard isn’t able to debate instead of Trump she can get away with her lawyer speak.

I have not voted for Trump in any of the elections, but yikes at the alternative in this one.

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

I'm having a hard time getting past 1.

Trump takes full credit for ending Roe v Wade and thanks to that the government can now place itself firmly between a free human being and a medical practitioner in several states. His supreme court picks absolutely started that snowball. No question about it.

Do you know who pays the tariffs and taxes? Bullshit talking point that hurts American companies and puts the government between capitalistic entities.
You might have a point but it is misguided. Saudi diplomacy is to blame for gas prices no one else.

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thefreebachelor@reddit

The fact that you completely ignored what I said about agreeing that what Trump did was a tax while at the same time ignoring that Biden added to Trump’s tariffs shows that we can’t engage in a conversation because you just hate Trump.

I didn’t even vote for the guy. Not either time. I’m not going to vote for him this time either, but I can be objective about who he is and is not. He’s a clown, but he’s not the devil.

Best of luck.

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SellToCover3849@reddit

The Trump Abortion Bans-He wasn’t in office when Roe v Wade was overturned.

RvW was only overturned because of 3 Supreme Court Judges that Trump appointed. I suspect just general bad-faith being posted here by you, but if you honestly didn't know that, then you should check.

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thefreebachelor@reddit

That’s beside the point. The wording, Trump Abortion Bans, is a ridiculous form of rhetoric. It’s like he proposed a bill akin to what we call Obamacare. The dude wasn’t even in office when it was overturned. It’s not bad faith. My degree is in rhetoric. I’m looking at this strictly from a rhetorical POV. My view on the debate is that one party believes the lies that they say while the other clearly doesn’t believe the lies that they state. That’s what makes her dangerous. She knows that she’s lying and uses every weapon that she has to deflect and/or defend herself for it. I’m mixed race myself born and raised in California before leaving the state and let me tell you I would NOT trust ANY Californian politician ESPECIALLY if they have a D next to their name.

As for Trump, I appreciate 2 things about him: 1. He’s willing to listen to ppl and change his mind.

He doesn’t start new wars something that no other president has ever done(or not done) in my lifetime.

Hillary was a lawyer too, but her reputation was so tarnished that she couldn’t lawyer her way out of losing. Kamala doesn’t have the same reputation.

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SellToCover3849@reddit

If Trump doesn't want to be tied to it, he should be happy to state that he had nothing to do with overturning RvW then. But, you realize she was responding to him saying "We got Roe v Wade overturned. Everybody wanted it". He's the motherfucker taking credit for it.

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LoneHelldiver@reddit

RvW was why RvW was overturned. It was a horrible case and horrible case law and RBG admitted it openly. The woman in the case said it was made up. It was a stretch and never should have been law.

That Trump appointed 3 judges who knew what everyone else knew is not a revelation or a conspiracy.

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thefreebachelor@reddit

You are missing the point here which is obvious by your bias. I’m not commenting on Trump at all. I’m commenting on her statements as she stated them from a strictly rhetorical point of view.

I don’t care what Trump says or doesn’t say in terms of the rhetoric that Kamala uses. I’m saying that she knows that what she’s saying is inaccurate and therefore is being intellectually dishonest. If we can’t have a conversation about this without you bringing up Trump as an excuse for her lies then this conversation isn’t going to go anywhere. Later on.

Once again I want to point out that I never once voted for Trump nor do I plan on doing so this time. I’m not voting for the candidate that is endorsed by Dick Cheney and the neoconservatives either as that I despise pro-war and anti-civil liberties parties.

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Kathilliana@reddit

I do believe she played very well to the crowd that kept saying, “ANYONE but these two.” (And they mean anyone in the duopoly, of course.)

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ecleipsis@reddit

Yeah it’s sad they are who our nation decided were the 2 most qualified people to run for office.

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Tesrali@reddit

Nitpick but the nation didn't decide, a bunch of party-monkeys did. Those same monkeys suppress ballot access for third parties.

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bravehotelfoxtrot@reddit

“Our nation” doesn’t decide shit. The candidates are presented to us by party leadership, who have no idea what Americans want and have no incentive to try figuring it out and obliging.

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DeathByFarts@reddit

We need ranked choice voting !!!!

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That-Guy-Over-There8@reddit

In Oregon this year we are getting to vote on ranked choice voting. I'm for it. But guess who exempted themselves from it? The people it would target the most, our state senators and representatives. The same people who wrote the initiative. As usual, the fix is in.

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Xumayar@reddit

Or Approval

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ProtonSerapis@reddit

For real. This is 100% the single most important thing every libertarian minded person should be focused on. Too bad the libertarian party doesn’t seem to give a shit.

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thefreebachelor@reddit

Our nation decided on both ppl? I’m no Trump supporter, but what vote did she get in the primaries?

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ecleipsis@reddit

That’s a fair point as she skipped primaries.

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PsyopSurrender@reddit

Nobody decided this but the bankers in control lol.

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Individual-Double596@reddit

"our nation decided" is a big stretch

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ImTalking2AnIdiot@reddit

In all honesty, I thought the strangest thing of the night was using the support of Dick Cheney as a flex to brag about. Liz Cheney is just a standard-type politician, but her father is on another level for legacy political nefariousness.

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heywood-jablomi99@reddit

I thought it was odd as well. Haven’t the democrats been hammering down on how terrible a person/politician he is since he was in office? Why would you want that endorsement

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upnflames@reddit

Very few democrats are going to vote Trump over Harris because of Dick Cheney's endorsement. She's trying to pull people right of center.

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XiphosEdge@reddit

Dick Cheney isn't "right of center", he's a fucking war criminal.

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ImTalking2AnIdiot@reddit

It's not Democrats that would flip, though, with the Cheney endorsement. It would be independents who might still be on the fence, who are roughly 35-55/60 years old and who still remember Cheney's manipulations and machinations during the Bush Jr/Iraq War years.

If any person from that age bracket went down the Cheney rabbit hole and researched the guy at any point in time during the past 23 years, they've realized he is the archetype of warmongering, neocon, "deep state" manipulator. He was installed with the VP position by Daddy Bush to make sure Junior didn't fuck up any of their grand strategy plans.

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XiphosEdge@reddit

Any little bit of support helps Herself's glorious cause

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ZYN9@reddit

Honestly Dick Cheneys support is going to push a ton of people away from her, myself included, because fuck Dick Cheney

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ImTalking2AnIdiot@reddit

I was discussing this very thing with a family member earlier today: that the support from Dick Cheney, and publicly welcoming it, might alienate a number of independents, maybe even some Democrats, from voting for her.

For the life of me, I do not understand why the organizers and planners of her campaign would even want the blessing from Dick Cheney, let alone publicly welcome it. There's a lot, and I mean A LOT of shitty politicians from the post-Nixon era, yet Cheney has to be one of the absolute worst, if not the worst. Honorable mentions or individuals tied with Cheney would be those who were amongst his best of friends and fellow evil human beings: Bush Sr and Rumsfeld.

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Important-Internal33@reddit

I felt like Harris was trying to sound Republican. Pro fracking (now), pro border security (now), pro Israel, pro police...

I can't stand Harris and am planning to vote for Chase Oliver, but she won that debate by default the minute Trump started ranting about illegals eating people's pets in Ohio, and then took the bait about crowd size. It was literally narcissism on display. He just can't laugh off shit that is inconsequential to most people. That's a problem.

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Bingo. Trump has completely lost it and Harris is just making it up as she goes

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Xumayar@reddit

I wouldn't say Harris is making it up as she goes, she's very much doing what the DNC strategists are telling her to do: Stick to the script we're giving you and let Trump make an ass of himself.

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

https://www.usatoday.com/videos/news/politics/2024/09/11/harris-shifts-fracking-stance-presidential-campaign/75018584007/

Yes, she is. Or else the DNC strategists are making it up for her as she goes, which is even funnier.

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Gandrix0@reddit

🤣

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PsyopSurrender@reddit

Harris is probably receiving help from whatever devices she is using regardless. Both of these people are fucking nuts and incompetent as fuck. Nothing literally NOTHING will change with the US if either is elected. Same old show.

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FreeFalling369@reddit

Still waiting for kamala to answer a question and answer without telling a lie

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Poptatus_Ulvinga@reddit

She was a nothing VP. Biden had to hide her for long stretches. I don't buy the timeline of how she was anointed successor while bypassing the whole primary process.

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FreeFalling369@reddit

Thats cause she is part of the system and libs would vote for stalin or hitler if they ran as blue

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momowagon@reddit

Why answer truthfully when Trump isn't going to call you out? He's too busy taking the bait defending his ego.

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Predsguy@reddit

There were a lot of cringe moments. Only one moment actually pissed me off. When they were talking about Jan 6 and Kamala looked directly at the camera and said that Trump promised there would be a bloodbath if he lost.

We already know that quote has been taken out of context and abused by the media. It's incredibly irresponsible of her to say that, knowing that she is intentionally being deceitful. We know Trump wasn't talking about actual violence or war with that quote. So for her to use it in a way that implies that he's promising violence is unacceptable. It's dangerous. It's fearmongering to scare people and we all know scared people are dangerous.

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baxterstate@reddit

It was also irresponsible of the “moderators” not to fact check her. All the fact check was done against Trump.

However, Trump knew it going in, and wasn’t prepared.

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Both sides just use fear mongering tactics now. None of it surprises me

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Frenzy475@reddit

Only one party stormed the capital and succeeded in delaying the certification of the vote while trying to hunt our politicians.

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

And my statement is still correct: both parties use fear-mongering tactics lmao

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Frenzy475@reddit

It's not really fear mongering when the fears have been validated. Would you say that Ukrainians would be using fear mongering tactics if they were to talk about the threat of Russia?

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Is Ukraine clinging to an event that happened 4 years ago? If yes, then I’d consider it fear mongering. If no, and the attacks are presently happening, then I’d consider it an active threat.

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Frenzy475@reddit

I would think that you would understand that while j6 happened 4 years ago, that the impacts are still happening today, and it is important to not delude ourselves into thinking it is over and nothing like it will happen again. Why do you think that Trump replaced Pence as his VP? Why do you think that Vance is talking about how he thinks that states should be submitting alternate slates of electors and stated that he would not have certified the results of the 2020 election? Why do you think that Trump, to this day, refuses to admit that he lost the 2020 election?

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

I can see you’ve bought into their fear-mongering hook, line, and sinker so no point in arguing. Best of luck to you my good sir

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Frenzy475@reddit

Sure, if you don't want to talk about it that is ok. I would just say that when Trump's own VP selection is telling you what they would do, I would recommend you listen :)

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Send a link to back up this claim?

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Frenzy475@reddit

https://x.com/theallinpod/status/1833336679488512074?t=515

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

“Do I think that we could have had a much more rational conversation to ensure that only legal ballots are cast? Yes.” Is that the statement you’re scared of? Maybe minute mark where he says he’ll overturn it.

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northernrange@reddit

Google this phrase for lots of air quality info: u.s. air quality map

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zdlbz@reddit

Harris basically was handed the win with Trump making ridiculous statements like “they’re eating dogs” whether it’s true or not who’s to say but it’s out of left field. She also had a message of positivity and did talk about a path forward (albeit probably a crooked one). Her facial expressions were very animated and did lack composure but I think she struck a nerve with her base in showing raw emotion. Trump did not score many points being so focused on what Harris said and having to comeback and focus on trivial matters. He would have been better off deflecting statements, acting like a classy gentleman and delivering solid policy objectives and pave a path forward out of the “worst economy in history”.

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sky_cat_duane@reddit

I award you no points. And may God have mercy on your soul.

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shapes88@reddit

I just trad that in Trumps voice. Lol!

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AvacadoKoala@reddit

Absolutely abhorrent

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PirateBrail@reddit

Here in Brazil, I've begun thinking seriously about defending the end of universal right to vote, because since the masses are dumb, dumb discourses and plans are what gain the most votes.

Is this thought still valid over there?

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PuttPutt7@reddit

I had the thought that only those paying taxes should get to vote, with some exceptions and outliers.. But the general idea that if you give a shit enough to work and positively contribute that you should get a vote.

But yeah.. In same boat.. Kinda glad we have a republic but wish the people who went into that republic weren't just there because they're good looking / speak well.

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PirateBrail@reddit

Ever heard of the thought experiment of the janitor in the apartment complex?

All the homeowners pay to be there, except the janitor, he gets paid to be there. Therefore, he doesn't have a say on the votes of the complex, because if he did, he'd always vote towards getting more money, even if the homeowners couldn't pay more.

I feel like here in Brazil there are more janitors (people that live off taxes) than homeowners (taxpayers), but the janitors in Brazil are allowed to vote, so populist governments keep coming back. I believe there should be a stop to this somehow.

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PuttPutt7@reddit

Yeah in the US we call those janitors "congress" because they get to vote in their pay raises whenever they feel like it.

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FreshFromRikers@reddit

I'm pretty sure the billionaire contingent would never allow this to happen.

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dontwasteink@reddit

https://youtu.be/QFgcqB8-AxE?si=YTEw6y_n3CXMqqko

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lightninghand@reddit

I'm just gonna write in my dad. He's a pretty good guy.

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Seventh_Stater@reddit

Pretty much.

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TxDirtRoad@reddit

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

I wish they had him dress up as a bear and just stand behind a third podium, no mic

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BuckToofBucky@reddit

That happens with Kamala supporters in general whenever she speaks

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

And Trump supporters can’t really get much dumber

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skinetchings@reddit

Genuinely feel like the MAGA hats are Iq markers sometimes. I work retail and a maybe late-20s woman came in wearing one. She bought like 7 things. I asked if she wanted a bag and she said no. After ringing her up I was like “are you sure you don’t want a bag” and she said no very adamantly. Then, I watched her awkwardly scoop everything into her arms and balance it on her way out of the store. Weird mfs.

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TwistedMemories@reddit

And the felon’s supports are so dumb and ignorant you can’t tell the difference.

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redhotmericapepper@reddit

Nuff said.

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Fuck_The_Rocketss@reddit

For real dude. Kamala responds to every question with pre-rehearsed non-answer platitudes and lies. Trump responds to every question by talking about immigration.

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ry_afz@reddit

Have you ever attended a debate? In high school they have debate club and even though I wasn’t part of it, I know for a fact they have scripts ready to go. I don’t see what’s wrong about presenting your rehearsed points. What did you want… a stumble…no preparation? I mean, seriously. If I was going up on any stage, you bet I’d have rehearsed lines ready.

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JAZthebeast11@reddit

Hey, ex high school debater here. I came second with my partner in the Canadian parliamentary nationals quite a few years ago.

There are many styles of debate. Here in Canada the predominant ones are Canadian Parliamentary and British Parliamentary. While there are many differences between the two, in both formats you have maybe 15-45 min depending on the tournament from hearing the thing you’ll be arguing and being assigned a side to making your speech. You are not allowed to use the internet in any way, so it’s very difficult to write an entire speech in that time (some speeches can be up to 12 minutes in Canadian Parliamentary).

The American format however relies EXTREMELY heavily on pre prepared statistics and statements, made days or weeks in advance. I find it to be a very boring format because instead of debating the efficacy of ideas and policy, you talk about whatever statistic supports your side and disparage everything else. Very boring imo

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ry_afz@reddit

Didn’t know that. Quite interesting. I came across an essay that argued the role of presidents we think of in the US is more like that of a prime minister. But our president has even less power.

However, everyone, likely because of the media, places too much emphasis on the presidency. It also makes sense why they stick to pre-prepared arguments and statistics that serve their side. Successful debates should be one where both sides are arguing ideas not each other’s personalities.

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Fuck_The_Rocketss@reddit

Sure. But they had no substance. And she was never pressed by the moderators or Trump into a scenario where she had to go off script. All she had to do was recite empty platitudes.

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KHDTX13@reddit

Are you seriously shocked that a former District Attorney, Attorney General, and Senator was able to navigate a debate convincingly

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thefreebachelor@reddit

Very low expectations and they almost never prove me wrong.

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ry_afz@reddit

That’s true. Lol What a waste of time.

Only thing I do like is how she called out Trump on a lot of thing false conspiracies he generated too frequently. These kind of events allow people to contrast people in the same room.

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HearthstoneExSemiPro@reddit

false conspiracies

might want to look them up first. you're going to be surprised

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the_BoneChurch@reddit

Yeah, you should be prepared to answer questions that you expect to come up in a debate. Who would have thought that. I mean it is literally the entire concept of debate club.

Fuck her for being prepared and not relying on fear to win.

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YoureInGoodHands@reddit

That's your job as a participant.

As a host, you are supposed to ask questions that get people out of that script. Not play into it

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ry_afz@reddit

I think it goes to show how the networks have bias. They aren’t impartial. I mean, having someone like a true Libertarian moderate two duopoly candidates would be so effective.

Let’s talk about Afghanistan, Ukraine and Israel and 500 other conflicts in the world. What about the US? What policies will you do to fix the country? Bringing down costs for groceries… what will you actually do? They don’t want to take any stands because they may lose voter support. All of their donors are also corporations literally benefiting from their political do-nothings.

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VagVandalizer69@reddit

It wouldn’t even matter. When either candidate was asked questions that they didn’t want to answer, they just rambled on about a different topic. It’s ridiculous that they aren’t forced to answer the question that they are asked.

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RonburgundyZ@reddit

What folks don’t realize is the power of America’s human capital. They can analyze what price gouging metrics are, legislate it, then penalize who do. But first give time to corporations to fix their prices. That’s one way to bring down the cost of groceries.

Long way would be to bring down the deficit.

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momowagon@reddit

After her non-answers, every time she took a jab to bait trump into ignoring her non-answer, and it worked. He's such a sucker, and he played it exactly the way the DNC wrote it up.

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Fuck_The_Rocketss@reddit

Yep. He’s wayyy too dumb to get it

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PsychoticMessiah@reddit

They all respond with prerehearsed lines. Theyvpra

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Sir_Incognito@reddit

You think Trump had rehearsed lines? Whatever you're smoking, I'd like some.

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XiphosEdge@reddit

He probably did, but like someone mentioned above, he threw out the script because he's a Bigly Brilliant Boy. Paraphrasing there.

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Fuck_The_Rocketss@reddit

Dude Trump wings everything and it shows. He SHOULD rehearse but he never will.

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Ebola714@reddit

What is your favorite flavor of Skittles? I'll tell you what my favorite problem with the USA is, it's billions of criminal, psychotic, illegal aliens coming into your backyard to take 'yer jobs and eat your hamster. Again want is your favorite flavor of Skittles? Nancy Pelosi is pushing rainbow Skittles to start WWIII.

Kamala: let's look to the future of Skittles for all Americans, it's a new flavor, perfect and not to crazy liberal, just kinda middle of the road optimism, an open book, puppies and Popsicles for everyone.

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deelectrified@reddit

The one that pissed me off most was

“Do you feel responsible for the deaths during the Afghanistan pull out?”

Harris: “I supported Biden and you no longer have to spend your tax dollars on that war”

Absolutely disgusting response about finances when asked about responsibility for deaths.

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gwhh@reddit

Don’t worry that 180 billion$ to Ukraine made up for ending the afghan war!

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

No words for Trump and whatever his animals concerns are now. I shut it off at the end when Harris said she’s never asked a witness or victim if they’re a Republican or Democrat aka did her job and acted like that was something.

Just limit the power of the feds, they’re clowns.

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brutalservant@reddit

I think we’re fucked no matter who wins.

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Inner_Rope6667@reddit

Kamala trounced Donald. He looked as demented as expected

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Frick yea I hope she sees this for you lol

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woodquest@reddit

Depressing, from now on I’ll stick to old episodes of the muppet show

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clarkstud@reddit

I’ve been watching old episodes of The Greatest American Hero and it’s actually been really good.

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-Buckwheat@reddit

A bummer when the choice is vote for a bad liar or a good liar.

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ThePeoplesDemocracy@reddit

Are you smarter for not watching that garbage and then collecting info about it after?

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

I think it’s best to get the info from memes instead of headlines because American politics are just a joke at this point

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101bees@reddit

At this point I just want the debates to be a fist fight in an Applebee's parking lot

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

gif

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King_Burnside@reddit

It was a 7 year old trying to out argue a 5 year old. I turned it off pretty quick.

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LibertarianLawyer@reddit

I was helping out at a scout troop meeting, and I am 100 percent certain that was a better use of my time last night than watching that debate.

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sovietonion123977@reddit

I don’t even bother. I was more interested in somebody reviving a mustang.

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ronpaulclone@reddit

Moderator: Mr. Trump you are literally Hitler. Do you regret being literally the devil? Majestic Vice President how do you respond to Trump being the devil?

Fact check: no babies are murdered after born. They just sit them there and watch them die. You’re a lying Hitler.

Fact check: the 800k Jobs they celebrate were adjusted down . You claimed they were fraudulent you’re a lying demon.

Fact check: Haitians aren’t eating pets. You may have seen it with your own eyes, heard dozens of reports, but one guy who we claim is the final authority says no. You’re a lying felon.

Trump: I have the greatest, many say the best policies. Look at the peace and prosperity we had. I have policies. And she hates policies. She has no policies. She’s totally ruined the country. The country is in chaos. I will solve it all. We did it once and we will do it again.

Kamala: The fact of the matter is he has no policies. I have policies that will make all of your dreams come true. They are for happiness, for you, Trump is a felon and I am a prosecutor. My policies are for making people happy. They will be full of dreams and joy. We need to turn the page from racism. And all you’ll see here tonight is Trump calling names and lying because hes literally Hitler and evil and wicked and a demon, felon and racist and evil. And I have policies that will make your dreams come true. Everything I said a year ago is not true anymore. Trust me dreams and aspirations and amazing wonderful love. And you’ll be happy.

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Dang. I’m sorry you wrote all that. I skipped reading the rest after you said Hitler lol

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THANATOS4488@reddit

It actually wasn't bad, made fun of Trump, Harris and the moderators

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SvartOgGul@reddit

The fuck did you expect?

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vrchue729@reddit

I should’ve lowered my expectations even more lol, I wasn’t expecting the best but man it was rough.

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nein_nubb77@reddit

The most truthful statement of the night. 👏

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Chemcorp@reddit

Exactly, in a country of over 300 million people why can’t the “UniParty” pick two better candidates to run.

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Or just allow more candidates on the stage.

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Chemcorp@reddit

Exactly. Sadly our national politics have become so ingrained to only be a duel party system that we will have to push hard for local wins to eventually get on the national level. The “parties” with the media have done a great job to paint every other third party as crazies.

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atticus13g@reddit

It’s okay. I’m the president. I had the most votes. The smartest matters all agree that no one maths more votes than me

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AldruhnHobo@reddit

We are living in joke universe now. Can I please wake up. These two, like they're the very best candidates out there out of hundreds of millions of people.

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Boto127@reddit

as a republican… trump did not look good

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bethechaoticgood21@reddit

Didn't watch it. It would just be a rerun of the last 8 years.

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Spe3dGoat@reddit

Even worse, watching it reinforces just how bad the future will be with either of these bozos.

Nothing will change for the better and things will slowly get worse.

We will have more personal censorship and government lies, less freedom for our bodies and less freedom for our own safety, higher prices and less opportunities.

Where is the pro-choice, pro-gun, pro-weed, anti-massive government spending on military and waste, pro-privacy candidate ?

Thomas Massie maybe ? Andy Beshear is close ? Can those two make a baby together and become the chosen one ?

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Sherviks13@reddit

I concur.

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Odd-Spinach-4398@reddit

The best part was watching trump make an ass out of himself with little to no effort lol. He brought immigration on damn near every single topic.

Kamala was fine I suppose. Just another politician.

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bigrigbilly123@reddit (OP)

Thought the same way

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