What’s the best BRAND that has a good compact, micro, and full sized competition gun? Or do you think sticking to brands is dumb?
Posted by SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit | Firearms | View on Reddit | 30 comments
Thanks to Bruen (Trump Supreme Court picks) I was able to get a carry permit recently. So I was thing of getting an optic in my G17 for competition (USPSA/steel), G19 and 43x for carry. Thought it made sense to keep it all within the same brand because same grip angle and manual of arms. I love the idea of having basically just the same gun but different size for carry, competition etc.
Then I did some testing and realized that 1911 truly is the best grip angle but don’t like safetys.
Sig has the Xfive Legion, I shot and loved it but feel like that 320 Xcarry/M18X has such a comically high bore axis. I
P365 looks awesome for carry.
Shadow Systems and M&P are tempting bit neither has that real 1911 grip angle or a heavy TXG or steel frame gun for competition.
M&P has good G19 and G48 sized guns but the CR920 seems like a jam o matic.
Also I live in a state that requires pistol permits and has a 10 rd mag cap so extra mag size doesn’t matter and the modularity of Sigs are helpful. It’s a pain to buy/sell/trade pistols here so there’s incentive to get it right the first time.
Humble Marksman argues that bore axis matters less than other factors ao maybe I should be open to the 320? https://youtu.be/RKg8Mlzyxro?si=oOptDLZpcHKM864g
FritoPendejoEsquire@reddit
I do think sticking with brands is not ideal. Not necessarily dumb.
But hopefully by the end of this month, Walther will have my vote. Once they add a micro.
SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit (OP)
Along the same lines; If M&P had a steel frame, or if the 320 Series had a low bore axis. Or if Glock didn’t have a stupid grip angle/hump/shitty sights and a steel frame this would make my decision easy.
I don’t understand how/why this industry is so slow to react to consumer needs. Walther seems cool but they have a 320 Bore axis without the modularity.
FritoPendejoEsquire@reddit
Based on grip angle and bore height, Are there any handguns you like?
SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit (OP)
365 series of Sig bit they lack a steel full size for competition without going to 320
M&P, good carry options but also lack a full size steel or TXG version.
I find the weight of the xfive legion more than makes up for the high bore axis but I’d like a similar light weight companion pistol. The lighter carry options is where it really makes a difference.
I know I’m being overly critical here; all these guns and brands perform well with enough training.
FritoPendejoEsquire@reddit
Seems like Sig is the closest thing for you. And the modularity thing you’re looking for.
The TXG is cool and all, but really bore height doesn’t matter with proper technique.
Watch Ben Stoeger. World champ. Master with a Glock. Just ran Staccato for a while. He likes Walther and is currently running a P320 X5 Legion.
His overall take is the gun doesn’t matter. Get what you like or you enjoy or you think is cool. Your technique will make it happen with whatever you run.
mctwiddler@reddit
Beretta 92 for all your needs
SniperSRSRecon@reddit
The fn 509 series is pretty good, not sure if they have a comp gun in that.
Karhu1202@reddit
As you mentioned, sig has quite a lot to offer and choose from. The p365 is a very small gun and very snappy, takes some time to get used to but it's a great pistol. The p365 also has variants with different grips and sizes to suit your needs. P320 has different options in length up to 6" barrels and they have a lot of aftermarket parts, especially to build raceguns with. The older p226 is also am awesome platform up to 6" barrels. Keeping things on one platform/manufacturer is a good idea for starters and there is a few decent options. Glock as you mentioned offeres a lot but I don't like the grip angle and the designs. Smith and wesson has all options too. If you like 1911, have a look at Kimber, they make 1911 style guns from compact carry size to racegun too and the design is awesome, especially if you are limited to 10 rounds anyway so mag size doesn't matter. Lots of aftermarket options too for that platform.
In the end it doesn't matter once you reach a certain point of training but it also doesn't hurt to have all things from one company.
Stay away from taurus or springfield, especially for a carry gun.
SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit (OP)
I think it matters even with a high level of competency. People who shoot Glock for years often have a hard time switching. And vice versa.
I think it’s prudent to at least stick to a certain grip angle and manual or arms. Eg. 1911 shooters who switch to guns with no safety incessantly going to turn the safety off during stress/competition.
Karhu1202@reddit
We have different understandings of training or different goals and that's fine. You are right, if someone who is only used to glocks for example grabs a different gun and tries running it, there will be some issues or at least a significant difference in speed and handling, but if you don't train to master a single weapon and instead train to understand shooting, you will probably be able to adapt easily to different guns. You might not get the best results with every gun but still manage to use different guns for a decent result. At least that's my opinion on that topic. As I said, pick whatever you like and there is no harm in having everything from one brand
Bobathaar@reddit
If you just want one brand I guess go Wilson Combat: edcx9 for compact, sfx9 3.25" for micro, and sfx9 or edcx9 5" for full sized comp gun.
SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit (OP)
Haha. I do have a decent budget and I’ve actually considered this. I dunno how I feel about external hammers and safeties on my carry pistol though.
Bobathaar@reddit
just a question of how much you train imo... the popular dogma of "no safety on guns" really supports the common denominator of people who buy a gun and only ever shoot that first box of ammo through it. If you train enough to have like a .8 sec draw to first shot... you're not going to "forget the safety"
SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit (OP)
I appreciate that perspective and I honestly love 1911s, I have a nice one.
It’s not about draw time it’s about making an error taking it off or switching it on by mistake. I’ve seen tons of videos on active self protection and studies done with weapon lights and Serpa holsters and mistakes made etc.
When people abruptly find themselves in life/death situations anything beyond point and click goes out the window.
If you fall to the ground or are shooting from awkward positions like in the side, under a car, left/one handed etc. there’s potential to knock the safety in by mistake.
My 1911 has such a satisfying safety to play with too. Very positive click. Part of me does want to get the same brand in 9mm haha.
I’m open minded about it. But I do think that I should go all guns have safety or none for consistency.
MGB1013@reddit
You could make an argument for almost any brand having guns capable of filling all those roles. That doesn’t necessarily mean that brand is the best at all 3 roles. I carry a Glock 19 or 43x not at work, I carry a bodyguard 2.0 at work, I shoot competition with a canik even though I love my shadow 2 I just shoot the canik better. Find what gun works best for your situation and don’t worry about the brand. I would rather someone carry a hipoint they can shoot well than a stacatto they suck with.
IllAssistance7@reddit
Is the 2.0 small enough to pocket carry? I have a 365x but it’s just slightly too big for me.
MGB1013@reddit
Yep. It’s tiny, but it’s a damn good shooting gun. Its overall length is like 1/4in longer than a lcp.
Deeschuck@reddit
I have a p320 XFull and a p365XL, both with Wilson grip modules, for exactly the reasons you describe. Common grip angle means I don't have to adjust my presentation with different platforms.
In your case I would skip the Xcarry/M18 and go with X5 and an XL. Everyone is different, but I shoot the XL better than the 320 compact. The bore axis is a lot lower on the 365 platform, and it does seem to make a difference when the barrel gets below 4" for me. The XFull is a Cadillac though... smooth and gentle ride.
You can throw a short grip module on the XL if you need extra concealment. Or step up to a Macro/Fuse if you really feel like you need something in the G19 size range, but with a 10 round max, there's really no need for a g19-sized pistol IMO.
Or- now that the Radian Ramjet 365 is out, you could get an X5 and a regular P365 and one of those for less than the 3rd pistol.
The Smiths are also excellent. You could even add a Bodyguard 2.0 for something substantially smaller than a 365.
SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit (OP)
This actually does make a lot of sense. Going 365XL + Xfive legion.
Deeschuck@reddit
I used to be a die-hard G19 fan until the XL came out. Like for 25 years. IMO the XL is the best compromise of concealability/shootability available, among non-comped pistols at least. I added the XFull so I'd have a range gun with the same grip angle, and actually CCW it with a Wilson Compact grip module in a T1 Xiphos sometimes.
B4ND4GN@reddit
CZ.
P01 is a great subcompact.
The 97(discontinued) is just as gud as any 1911.
The 75 is approved for military/police use by almost as many countries as Glock.
As far as the 75, there are 100 clones and variants and the aftermarket community can make a base factory pistol into the king of comp guns.
I think the king of comp 9mm is the tanfoglio which is a CZ75 clone.
Israel cloned the CZ when they made the Jericho.
Extremely reliable and comes from the factory with a great trigger.
Jazzlike_Half9988@reddit
Just my opinion, but I think shadow systems are overpriced and overhyped.
SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit (OP)
The appeal to me was: more neutral girp angle, some holster/parts compatibility with glock. Comes with decent sights and better optic mounting with no plate. To get all the mods I’d want on a Glock it would be the same price.
Jazzlike_Half9988@reddit
Yea. I bought a mr920 elite for the same reasons you listed. My issue is that for the price there are better options. For me, the sights are better and the aesthetics than a Glock. The trigger is different but not better necessarily. The gun heats up kinda fast and while it cycles faster, the recoil seems to be more erratic. The mounting system may be better, but honestly I have shot around 15,000 rounds through the mos plate and it has been fine. The mags it comes with are also worse.
All this being said, I also think Glocks are overpriced. For the price, there are better options that come with decent sights.
At least at my gun shop, a cz shadow 2 is only about $200 more. S&W are also decent, but just not over $1k like the shadow systems I bought.
Up to you, my shadow systems is just the only gun I have ever bought that I regretted is all.
SufficientOnestar@reddit
Research models not brands
Hoplophilia@reddit
My EDC is an M&P m2.0 Compact. If I were stuck with a full-sized for competition and a shield plus of some variant for
SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit (OP)
If you scroll down a bit you can do an overlay and see for yourself. Def doesn’t have the Glock hump which is good.
https://www.handgunhero.com/compare/smith-wesson-m-p-9-m2-0-metal-vs-glock-g17-gen-5-mos
Actually I just added a 1911 to the overlay it looks like you’re right.
HardstuckInUrMom@reddit
S&W does make all-metal M&Ps, and one is competition-oriented (called the Competitor).
There is nothing wrong with sticking to one proven brand, but I also like variety.
SunTzuFiveFiveSix@reddit (OP)
Yea. M&P I like because it really does have all the sizes. I shot the aluminum one but it’s barely heavier than the plastic. Not competitive compared to an xfive or CZ Shadow but still… I might go the M&P route. I wish the grip angle was more neutral like the 320s. If you compare it to Glock on Handgun Hero it’s closer to Glock than 1911.
Able_Twist_2100@reddit
The m&p metal weighs 4oz more iirc and a lot of people feel like the polymer flex does more for recoil.