How similar are the modern Swiss and Austrian firearms related to the STG-44?

Posted by thatgymdude@reddit | Firearms | View on Reddit | 8 comments

Hello Everyone, I have a question regarding if there really is any commonality between the current offerings from Sig AG (the SIG55X series), B&T APC rifle family, and the Steyr Aug to the original designs Germany had for the STG 44 rifle? I went out to the range earlier today with my friend who has a Steyr Aug, and he brought a buddy of his who during conversation after we were done and walking back to our cars had an interesting take on our rifles. He told us he very much wanted a PSA STG 44 replica, and said to us both that our rifles were descendants of that design family of rifles. I questioned him about this as I doubted him, and he pointed to my APC300 and said "you literally have a modernized STG-44 if it survived until now, look at the grip, charging handle, and the overall design of that gun". He also said the Aug was also based on a similar idea, but a bullpup design and it was called the STG 77 as it was in the same family. I personally dont exactly buy it and I thought they are just both AR-18 derivatives. The the only firearm maybe that could qualify might be the HK G3, am I right about this or is he correct? I personally am not very knowledgeable about the history of the designs. Please no politics or anything related to that, I just wanted to know if he is right or wrong and the history online seems conflicting when I look it up. Thanks!

8 Comments

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DeafHeretic@reddit

From what I saw in Ian's vid on the 55x rifles, they were closer to a Kalishnikov than anything German. IIRC

Riker557118@reddit

Your friend is an idiot, that's like saying the f-150 is a modern version of a model T cause it has four wheels and a steering wheel. The STG-44 is a long stroke gas piston tilting bolt operated firearm. The SIG 550's have more in common with an M1 Garand than the STG-44 being long stroke rotating bolt, your B&T and the Steyr are AR-18 at the core. The G3 is closer to the MG-42/MG3 than the STG-44 with it's bolt design.

thatgymdude@reddit (OP)

I am glad I got the AR-18 part right, I am a fan of those types of rifles. I wont listen to that guy, thank you.

freakinunoriginal@reddit

The action of a self-loading rifle can usually be broken down into two components: operation, and locking. The StG-44 was a long-stroke gas piston, tilting-bolt. Neither of these on their own was innovative (that also describes the M1918 Browning BAR). It was the move to an intermediate cartridge, controllable in full-auto but effective further out than a pistol cartridge, that created a new class of firearm. The StG-45 was the roller-delay project that eventually got turned into the CETME and G3 as German engineers got shuffled around Europe before returning to West Germany. It shared many construction techniques with the StG-44, resulting in a similar external appearance. I'd agree that the G3 is the furthest evolution/direct descendant of the WWII StGs. Short-stroke actions like the AR-18, HK416, or that B&T APC have more in common with the Soviet SVT-40 (as far as the gas operating system); but the SVT-40's locking mechanism was tilting bolt, whereas the AR-18/HK416/Aug are all radial multi-lug locking mechanisms which we generally associate with the AR-10/AR-15 (although examples exist as early as the straight-pull bolt-action Mondragon rifles of the 1890s, or the semi-auto version from 1908). The Steyr Aug's official designation in Austrian service was StG-77, because Sturmgewehr's literal translation is "storm rifle", indicating its role - not its lineage. (Same goes for Swiss weapons designated StG-)

Thank you, that is really detailed and clears that up, this guy was just conflating designs and noticed the similarities in the name.

blacklassie@reddit

The STG 44 was the first successful assault rifle in an intermediate cartridge. So, in a very general sense, most modern assault rifles derive from the STG 44.

Thank you for clearing that up, that guy is just overgeneralizing for some reason then.

Able_Twist_2100@reddit

Inform him that drug addicts are not supposed to own firearms.

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