It’s insane how stupid the Cybertruck looks next to the Rivian spec sheet.
It literally has nothing going for it other than the “look at me factor”. It’s incredible at how Tesla built a truck that’s hardly competitive with the Ford Lightning, a truck largely based on an ICE platform built by a legacy automaker. Oh and it came out 2.5 years earlier.
Yes, let’s just forget 48v, steer by wire, bullet-resistant structural skin. Uncompetitive? How much of. a tool tesla-hater does one have to be to dismiss the game changing cybertruck as uncompetitive and nothing more than look at me factor. tool
Doing a U turn with the flick of a wrist, pointless, and so unreliable airplanes would never consider using it. What a silly thing to get downvoted on, a bunch of ignorants who couldnt understand the complexity and importance of those paradigm shifts in vehicles, likely because of a Reddit fed frenzy of Divisive opinions. I bet you don’t make much of Elon Musk as a person either. lol
Yes because a plane that has higher safety standards than almost anything in the world and is rigorously inspected every few hundred hours by a team of trained mechanics is the same as a car right. There’s also a visible delay in the steering in the video lol. The more electronics and technology you add to a car the more things there are to break and the more expensive they are to repair. What’s the point of a truck if it’s not going to last atleast 100k miles being abused in dirty and wet conditions?
> Uncompetitive
In terms of doing pickup truck, things it is absolutely uncompetitive vs the R1T and Lightening. The thing is 95% of pickup truck buyers don't need to actually do pickup truck things. Don't let that delude you into thinking the rusting cybertruck is a better vehicle though.
>Yes, let’s just forget 48v, steer by wire, bullet-resistant structural skin.
Please explain why the average consumer would care about these things.
I guarantee 99% of the car buying public has no idea what a 48v system is or steer-by-wire is. It isn't a selling point and the benefit of either is miniscule. If bullet-proofing is important to someone, you are not buying a Cybertruck to begin with.
What they **do** notice are things like range, interior space, build quality, and features. All of with the Cybertruck does not excel in.
The Cybertruck came in dead last in the [Motortrend EV truck shootout](https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2024-tesla-cybertruck-beast-foundation-series-vs-gmc-hummer-ev-3x-vs-rivian-r1t-quad-motor-comparison-test-review/). This opinion isn't novel. It's a medicore product with a crazy design.
Can't you cherry pick either side of the Lightning vs Cybertruck? I mean the Lightning is abysmal in winter and offroad. Large overhangs, no heatpump, poorly managed battery. Meanwhile you can nitpick the Cybertruck for bed usability or design.
And they seem to be selling them, unlike Ford with their Lightnings. They're supposed to pass the lightning's all-time production count this summer and they only began production 6 months ago!
Holy biased user flair.
>I mean the Lightning is abysmal in winter and offroad.
Here is a video of a [Ford Lightning](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzLYP3CNY-g) easily climbing a hill that the [Cybertruck struggled on](https://x.com/DimaZeniuk/status/1716556240908681538). Mind you, the CT is on all-terrain tires and the Lightning is wearing all seasons. If the Lightning is "abysmal" then the CT is trash.
>I mean the Lightning is abysmal in winter
Highway range in a Texas "winter" (50 degrees) [was 254](https://www.autoblog.com/2024/01/06/the-cybertruck-achieved-less-than-80-of-tesla-s-advertised-range-in-a-youtuber-s-highway-test-during-texas-winter/?guccounter=1) for the Cybertruck. For 2024 the Lightning gets a heat pump and I image the extended range will be extremely similar.
The Cybertruck was billed as a generational leap in technology and at best, it's marginally better in some areas, worse in others.
The Silverado EV is going to decimate it. Early press cars are getting 450+ miles with room leftover in the tank. Gen2 Lightning on the dedicated EV truck platform is set to launch for MY26, and struggling up start Rivian makes an overall better product.
The mid-cycle update will make or break this truck. I'm hoping for Tesla's sake it was rushed out a year early to appease shareholders and there will be big updates in the works.
I mean, you have a Fiesta so the bias can go both ways =P
The offroad video you provided is from a pre-production truck, and 7 months before they gave customers the "Offroad Update". Doesn't feel like an apples to apples comparison!
Cybertruck resell is low because they're selling so many of these things. This is supply and demand. And it's not like the Lightning pulls in much on the used market... [Owch](https://carsandbids.com/auctions/3q4v6x2N/2022-ford-f-150-lightning-lariat)
For season 23 could we do and OUTBACK theme targeting Australia (THIS IS JUST AND IDEA BTW) for the seasonal car it should be ''Holden VL Walkinshaw'' or one of the latest cars 2017 \`\`HSV GTSR W1''could show appreciation to Australia's iconic car brand HOLDEN which discontinued in **20 October 2017** because of GM motors the car stats are
HSV launches **the W1**, its most powerful and last performance sedan ever. Its hand-built LS9 V8 produces 474kW, and the chassis is significantly uprated to deliver what HSV claims is racetrack performance for the road. -PLEASE READ MY COMMENT IF YOUR GONNA TAKE IT DOWN AND GOD BLESS LOVE FROM AUSTRALIA MELBOURNE. -I'm only 15 so forgive me if you had to read all this.
CT looks uncompetitive?
R1T is ramped up and this expensive. CT hasnt even ramped up yet.. give it a year, CT will have this thing beat in price and spec will match. Looks are polarizing but CT will give you a better bang for the buck.
> uncompetitive the Cybertruck looks next to the Rivian spec sheet
You are 100% right but i genuinely wonder how much that matters.
https://qz.com/tesla-cybertruck-sales-electric-pickup-trucks-ford-f150-1851481722#:~:text=In%20March%2C%20the%20Cybertruck%20notched,the%20Lightning's%20healthy%202%2C893%20registrations
* In March, the Cybertruck notched 1,158 new vehicle registrations. That’s more than the Rivian R1T’s 548, the Chevy Silverado EVs’ 319, and the GMC Hummer EV’s 192. Still, everyone lagged behind the Lightning’s healthy 2,893 registrations.
I have no idea if there are other factors at play, like if Tesla is still fulfilling preorders or if Rivian is having manufacturing bottlenecks. But on a quick surface-level glance the cyber truck is selling well enough and seems to be the "hot" thing with the average noncar enthusiast consumer, at least in the short term.
It goes beyond any bottleneck. Tesla's production rate right now is 70,000 units for their truck (and ramping). For comparison, Rivian sold 21,000 trucks in 2023 at a lower average price. In fact, Tesla just passed Hummer's all-time production count after being on the market for 6 months!
I don't think Reddit realizes that a lot of the hate on the truck has few roots. The rust stories ended up coming off with Windex. The carwash story was a fluke and unrelated to the infotainment. At the end of the day, the owners love their trucks.
Very cool thanks for the insight! How do you like your Roadster compared to your S? Do you track either of them? That is honestly quite the cool EV garage.
Love the Roadster... imagine a Miata sized car, maybe smaller, with a RWD 300+ electric horsepower. It's a blast. I've yet to track the thing.... these old EVs don't have fantastic thermals.
The S is the best daily I've had, and I've driven the competition. Nothing else checks as many boxes. Taycan has a compromised interior space and Lucid has a small trunk instead of a hatch. I've had fun with it at the dragstrip but I still really need to track it. It's a dream on road trips.
My only garage regret is it makes me look like an absolute Tesla nerd. I love their brand but I'm not some insane loyalist. I love looking around. My original plan when I was looking for a small car was to pickup something from Porsche.
All comments must remain civil and all Redditors are expected to remain courteous. If you wouldn't say it to someone sitting next to you on an airplane you should probably not say it here. Slurs and bigoted/hateful language are not welcome here.
> It has nothing going for it other than the “look at me factor”.
It wouldn't be the first vehicle in history to be bought for that reason. And if you're using it as a lifestyle rather than a utility vehicle - i.e. the utility is overkill for your purposes - then it really doesn't matter.
Nobody is going to whip out their cells phones to take a picture of a Cybertruck by the end of the year, if not sooner.
Once the hype has died off and nobody cares, who do you have left?
> Once the hype has died off and nobody cares, what do you have left?
A trail of razor sharp body panels that fell off on the highway, leading to a bricked hunk of metal in the breakdown lane with someone standing next to it telling anyone who will listen that it's still the very best truck they've ever owned?
Because they’re rare and you’ll maybe see one a year if you’re lucky. I see Cybertrucks 3-4x a week now in Austin.
They will be regular traffic in a few months. Weird, but regular.
I'd love to see a 400hp "base" model with maybe a simpler suspension for under $50k. I think it will add quite a bit of volume to Rivian sales. For most, these prices are just too high.
Wow. There is now a very stark difference between Rivian who is innovating and Tesla which used to have this reputation and now has the oldest fleet in the industry
To keep it in perspective, none of these are particularly stunning innovations. More like some solid updates to existing models, if anything. As a fan, I'd like to see Rivian re-invent or really shake up the EV sector.
I think the Lucids are nice too, even if I don't exactly have the money necessary to own one of their US-built Maybach killers. Also they look a bit like computer mice.
I only ever hear great things about lucid, but my family just got one and it's really not so great. The material on the seats is nice, but the seats themselves feel straight out of a kia. They're not soft and they get uncomfortable after a short while, unlike the i5 and eqs or even a base Lexus is. There are a ton of little tech issues that should have been ironed out by now: sometimes it just plays another audio stream at the same time as whatever you were already listening to and you can't turn it off, it shows navigation on both screens and you can't leave it up on one while you change your media stuff etc, you need to reprogram your garage door opener for every driver profile, the seats (and steering wheel and mirrors) don't change to your settings if the last driver was on a different profile (if you don't have easy entry on, which puts the seats too low for my mom to get in), you can't use the rear view camera and close the garage at the same time (like you'd be doing when backing out of your garage), and that's just what I have off the top of my head.
We got a great deal for an 18 month lease and at this point month 19 won't be a lucid.
Lucids and Polestars are *nice*, sure. but they're not very interesting.
chucking every feature under the sun into a 100 million dollar sedan isn't that interesting. making an off-road capable EV is actually something no one else is trying to do, or if they are, not well (cough TESLA cough)
>an off-road capable EV
too heavy, too low, with no way to refill gas (battery dies in the middle of nowhere and you are completely fucked. you arent bringing spare batteries liek you are extra gas)
an EV has a potential of recharging from the sun!
you won't get a LOT of charge, but you're not totally dead in the water!
but it's also not too low. clearance is perfectly fine for overlandery type missions that most people would want to do out the gate.
Do you realize how heavy a solar panel setup that could charge a car would be? It cant be any solar panel with an outlet lol. You are dead in the water and getting towed unless youre hauling a two thousand pound backup battery and another thousand pound solar panel setup. Thats ridiculous dude its already past the payload weight of the rivian. It will cut the range in half too.
These vehicles are not useful offroad
I appreciate Chauffeur-tier luxury boats for what they are, like the *Cadillac of Cars* Cadillac hasn't quite made yet (haven't heard much about the Celestiq, wonder how that's going).
Then again I am more of a street car person than an 4x4 person generally, my favorite SUV would probably be a GMC Typhoon. Different strokes, I guess.
I know they are in completely different market segments, but I've owned an Rivian R1T and a Lucid Air and they are both similar in the way they are wildly impressive in just how much stuff they do well. The Rivian leans more into versatile utility whereas the Lucid leans more into comfort (both relating to the drive and, by virtue of its long range, the charging experience).
In the end the Lucid is the best road vehicle I've ever had. It's quiet, fast, and comfortable with plenty of storage (really wish it had a liftback though, or even better was offered in a wagon). The Rivian was excellent when everything was working as it should, but had an inexcusable safety issue (airbag wouldn't activate for my wife, they said this is considered within spec unless a person over 130 lbs doesn't trigger it) and most importantly just a very poor service experience that was the symptom of a young company.
4 years in, I've spent a grand total of nothing beyond scheduled maintenance, and only had one small item need repairing under warranty. Obviously past != future, but thus far it's been more reliable than any BMW or Mercedes I've owned (5 total amongst the two brands.)
Probably some of both, but according to the Alfa forums, the 2020s forward seem to be pretty solid - not bulletproof, but at least on par with other luxury sports cars. Alfa made lots of small improvements since the 2016 debut, and the electrical and engine issues (the most common issues in 2016/17 Giulias) seem to be mostly sorted out by 2019. The updated engine (changed to port injection) in 2020 is by all reports pretty easy to maintain, with some folks out to 80K miles already without issues.
Me too. A little apprehensive moving to full EV but after two years so far my family hasn't needed our gas car to do anything my EV couldn't be able to accomplish.
R3X just looks like such a fun complement to my commuter RWD Model 3.
The more money they have, the better cars they will make. All the innovative, non Elon brain rot people left Tesla 3-4 years ago.
Most of them ended up at Rivian. Nate ended up at GM, Ford, Lucid, Zoox, etc. as well.
> The entry-level models now use lithium-iron-phosphate (LFP) battery packs, If the battery size has decreased but the range is the same as the outgoing NMC units, then that’s saying something about how far LFP batteries have come
Its nice to see just how fast battery tech is improving and much better EVs in general are getting.
> The new cameras are 4K HDR units and can see three times farther and 10 seconds ahead at highway speeds.
God damn they took the complaints about low res personally
LiFePO4 are fairly proven as well. They've been around a while now in marine applications as deep cycle batteries for electric trolling motors.
And trust me, if they can survive on a bass boat doing 80mph ripping across a lake during a tournament over and over in any kind of weather condition, they should survive in an automotive application.
I might be wrong, but I've been told LiFePO4 will last much much longer than traditional lithium polymer batteries, to the point where you basically don't have to worry about battery degradation for 10+ years.
I think the Model 3 comes with LiFePO4 for the lower trim and it's desirable for certain people who are worried about longevity for this reason.
Yep, many LFP cells are rated for 4000-6000 charge cycles. In a typical modern EV pack, that translates to 1 million+ miles before the battery needs replacing. It’s at the point where you’d be more worried about things like coolant fittings within the pack failing than actual cell degradation.
And yes, the base(RWD) Model 3 has used LFP for several years. Ford introduced them on the base Mach E as well last year.
I was curious on the advantages because I've never heard of this battery type, per Google:
> LiFePO4 batteries are safer than Li-ion due to the strong covalent bonds between the iron, phosphorus, and oxygen atoms in the cathode. The bonds make them more stable and less prone to thermal runaway and overheating, issues that have led to lithium-ion batteries having a reputation for a higher risk of battery fires.
Only drawback is I think they're slightly heavier/less energy dense. What confuses me is the article stating that the battery size decreased and range improved on the Rivian though.
Range likely improved because the inverter efficiency, motor efficiency, and electrical architecture improved. Range isn't just a function of battery size, y'know. 🙃
true, but they're going to a less energy dense battery AND increasing range
they'd need some groundbreaking improvements in motor and inverter efficiency
There's two ways of defining "energy density": energy/weight (Wh/kg) and energy/volume (Wh/L).
The industry typical NMC tends to have 100% more energy/weight compared to LFP, but only 50% more energy/volume.
But the battery pack doesn't only contain the battery chemistry, they typically contain a significant amount of cooling and safety components. LFP is significantly safer and more tolerant to abuse and heat than NMC, I'm guessing they're able to save significant amount of volume from less cooling/safety needed because the chemistry itself is so much safer.
LFPs also lose performance more when cold, especially charging speed. Fast charging speeds and regen braking capacity on my 3 get noticeably worse even at 50F. If it’s below freezing out it can take 30-60min or more of preconditioning to get good fast charging speeds. Not the biggest deal on a road trip since the car can prep for the next charging stop the whole time, but if you need to top up in town while running errands due to limited home charging, that can balloon to a 1hr + charging stop in the winter time.
As watt*hours/mile goes up, you can decrease the battery size and get more range. From an old 2021-2022 model comparison I quickly googled, the best on the market at the time (e.g. Tesla 3 and Hyundai Ioniq) are around 250 watt*hours/miles, plus or minus like 25 watts for different test conditions. The '22 Rivian R1T is about 481 Wh/mi. Chevy Bolt is like 281 Wh/mi. Part of it is aerodynamics and the other is technology. Higher efficiency electronics.
I googled it and found an insideevs graphic with the data. Take it with a grain of salt, I believe the new Hyundai Ioniq is slightly better than Tesla now, but I haven't seen the data.
They're also more resilient when it comes to frequently charging them to high percentages, they don't degrade from it as quickly as other types of batteries used in EVs so far.
>They've been around a while now in marine applications as deep cycle batteries for electric trolling motors.
Also, as the primary chemistry in use at BYD, largest EV OEM in the world. Tesla uses them too, on the base model 3/Y in most markets.
For a company that (according to the news anyways) is constantly on the verge of bankruptcy they did incredibly well for a mid-cycle refresh.
Gives me hope for the R3X
Yeah they have absurd pricing for the 2024 models. I got an R1S quad motor for 24 months at $800/mo with only a few grand down. It’s an amazing vehicle and just makes me more excited for the R3X to go with my Integrale
I jumped on a R1S lease deal also. It is an amazing vehicle, definitely worth it even at MSRP. It has so much capability, my build quality is great, and my local service center has some great people (even though I only needed it for one minor issue). I really want the company to to succeed, it seems like one of the only car companies whose values align with my own.
>For a company that (according to the news anyways) is constantly on the verge of bankruptcy
They IPO'd at the peak of the hype cycle and accumulated an absolutely staggering warchest for a young company their size and in such a tough industry. The problem is how quickly they're burning through it — all of this is essentially being paid for by investors who took a loss, at the moment.
I highly doubt Amazon will let this company die out considering how much each are currently reliant on each other. Worst case scenario Rivian becomes an Amazon subsidiary and pivots to commercial only. But considering Rivian got past the immense first step of getting personal vehicles in the mainstream I doubt Amazon would want to just throw that away
Amazon's not reliant on Rivian whatsoever, I'm not sure where you get that idea. They could drop them at a moments' notice and just pick up more e-Transit units instead, nothing stops them from doing it. The arrangement works well for them right now, but they're not stuck to it by any means.
I mean with a 16% stake in the company and all of those new EV delivery vans reliant on the company's service for repairs, while they aren't reliant per se it would behoove them to help keep the company in business.
Rivian's Market cap is 11.62 billion. Amazon has 85.07 billion of cash and cash equivalent on hand (they probably also have an insane power to borrow or raise capital if they wanted to). So Amazon owns 1.86 billion in Rivian stock. While that's a big number to you and me, that's not be a drop in the bucket for Amazon. If all their stock in Rivian disappeared over night it would hardly impact their financials.
They may use Rivian trucks for delivery. But if Rivian vanished over night, they could just go out and buy a bunch of E350's to do deliveries in. Hell, they could probably just send a lot of their shipments through USPS, UPS and FedEx like they use to.
In short, Amazon is not reliant on Rivian. They may use Rivian, they may benefit from Rivian, but they do not rely on Rivian. Their business would only be slightly impacted by Rivian if they went under.
Obviously the company itself will not fold if the partnership/investment dies out but there is so much money/physical investment/exec careers on the line that if you really think Amazon can drop them on a whim you are totally mistaken. Im curious do you actually know the internal politics at Amazon regarding the van order/partnership in general? Because there is absolutely 0 chance this investment dies out unless something catastrophic happens
Amazon kills off significant programs [all the time](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/amazon-halo-fitness-tracker/). That's part of being a company this big, you make a lot of diversified bets and sometimes things just don't work out so you need to cut 'em loose. To keep pouring money into a failed bet is categorical [sunk cost fallacy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost) — it is something venture capital arms *explicitly* aim to avoid.
Sorry but an internal program for a standalone wearable eventually meant to be absorbed into their overall medical portfolio is not even close to their current lock in with Rivian
The Rivian investment by Amazon is already far beyond the venture capital moonshots faangs make to even consider sunk cost at this point
Again, there is no lock-in with Rivian. Rivian is a vendor, that's pretty much it. Amazon can switch away from them at any time. There is zero reliance on Rivian *whatsoever.*
If you can so confidently say a multi billion dollar investment, collaboration to the point of shared engineers and ground up custom vehicles and facilities, and a vehicle order magnitudes larger than typical vendor orders is just a vendor, then you are a prime example of the dunning kruger effect and there is no point in me replying to you further. Corporate reliance goes far beyond the survival of the company when the partnership sours
I can confidently say all of those things. Amazon has [about 10k Rivian EDVs](https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/amazon-says-it-has-10000-rivian-electric-vans-its-delivery-fleet-2023-10-18/) at the moment, well within expectations of a typical vendor relationship for a company that size. They aren't reliant on Rivian whatsoever.
No doubt almost all of these updates result in manufacturing cost improvements. OEMs learn a lot in their first few years of producing something new. Rivian more than anything needs to drive down their manufacturing costs to become profitable.
Q4 2022 they had a loss of about $124k/vehicle sold, Q1 this year they were at about $39k lost per vehicle sold. That's not how much they lose by building each vehicle, that's basically their net income divided by the number of vehicles sold. They're definitely making solid progress towards becoming profitable, I wouldn't be surprised if they start turning a profit within a year or so. That's what they told shareholders last year too, they expect to become profitable late this year.
RJ said they expect to have positive GM by end of this year. That is why they did significant upgrades and process simplification. Only time will tell if they achieve that. If they do then its all about scaling up production to hit positive FCF.
And he has reiterated this for 3 quarterly earnings calls in a row - so it’s something he knows is in the cards.
A miss there would be tragic at this point.
> That's not how much they lose by building each vehicle, that's basically their net income divided by the number of vehicles sold.
It's refreshing to see someone actually understand this is what it means.
Cars are bullets. You can kill a pedestrian or seriously injure someone at 30mph. I see so many people driving looking at their phones. Now you look at your phone, and mow down pedestrians 3 seconds, 60mph guaranteed death.
That’s true, and to your point a truck as heavy as the Rivian is probably reaching a point where the braking power is less important the amount of tread contacting the ground for a quick stop.
Regardless, my Rivian (a slower one) has stopped quicker than some small cars that I’ve driven.
INR? I just bought my quad r1t last week and love it, but as someone who believes I never have enough power, I’m like damn… cudda waited. I’m sure they’ll be 100k and not available for a year or more, right??
Been saying this, look how fast the tech has increased in even just the past 5 years. Give it 5 more and the ranges will greatly increase, battery weight AND cost will go down, and charging times come down... combined with all the benefits over gas... they are the future
I'm shocked how good Rivian seems to be at listening to their customers and making meaningful improvements.
It is kind of feeling like they're what Tesla should've, and could've been had they not fumbled basically every move since the Model X released.
Maybe now I can finally get one of these. The biggest holdup was I drive back to my parents about once a month, which is a 500+ mile journey and I always take 395. My goal for a long range EV is that I can get to Bishop on one charge, have lunch/dinner there and let my dog roam for an hour or so, then make it the rest of the way up. There was also no way in Hell I would get a Tesla for reasons that have been stated by quite a few people already.
Where have you been the last 20 years? It’s not just rich people buying expensive cars anymore. Plenty of middle class people are stretched thin in a car of this price point.
84+ month loan becoming the norm, being able to finance just about anything , rolling negative equity into a new car.
really have to wonder if there'll be a reckoning for the financial stretchers
I guess I'm just so out of the loop or not the ideal consumer, but financing a car for 84 months is about as batshit crazy as it gets. People really will go deep into the depths of debt hell for anything
the financial tools available nowadays to stretch your credit is crazy.
anything you buy online has a financing plan. even purchases made on a credit card can be split up over multiple months instead of paying the balance once a month.
Maybe someone who's put themselves in a bad financial position with an extravagant vehicle purchase while making a middle class salary should be a little more focused on needs and a little less on wants.
I didn’t say $40k, I said middle class. Middle class stretches well into the 6 figures by now, and there are plenty of people who make $100k for the first time and suddenly think they’re big ballers and can drop $70k on a vehicle. I don’t have any data to support that, but I also don’t know of any data that proves the contrary. It’s anecdotal, and I’ve seen my fair share of squarely middle class folks in vehicles that they really can’t afford that leads me to believe that it’s not *only* rich people buying these
Where have you been the last 10 years?
Everyone who owned land or stock before 2015ish has made a fucking killing. Upper and lower middle class is starkly divided between "whether or not you owned appreciating assets before the runup".
It's crazy, I watched all of the houses in my neighborhood double in value, and then *mooost* of the cars and lifestyles got nicer too. Tesla must have been delivering every other day during 2021. None of those people are stretched thin, they just saw their net worth hockey stick and are spending some of it
The target market for Rivian are people who are pretty well-off. I only see them around affluent neighborhoods in Boston.
It's a luxury electric pickup and SUV from a startup that was expected to have issues with early models. The vast majority of buyers are well-off buyers who prioritize early adoption, a tech-forward lifestyle, and likely some aspect of environmentalist leanings. The overlap between those details and high income is significant.
What about poor people who can’t even trim the tree around their house and it collapses on the roof and they have it tarped up for months? Their houses is worth 250k and they own a 100k car lol.
ROFL
What a ridiculous strawman argument...
I mean, what about the poor homeless guy who can't afford to charge his Cybertruck because electricity is too damn expensive?
I feel worse for the people (like me) who missed last month's clearance prices on 2023s. People for R1T leases for $550 a month effective. Insanely good deals. But alas my wife didn't want a pickup.
Well, leases in VA are tough because you guys have to pay the full tax on the vehicle. I’m in NJ where EV’s are still tax exempt so the crazy low payments are still possible here.
I don’t feel bad, that’s the risk with being an early adopter. We’re still in the stage where EVs have large changes and new competitors or refreshes all the time. If you have an EV today it’ll depreciate heavily due to reasons like this, and I hope most early adopters already accepted that.
This is much better (even for early adopters) than if EV development was stagnant
Usual rule of thumb with EV trucks is you get about half of rated range when towing. The biggest battery on these is 420 miles, so it might be able to do a 200mi tow on one charge. It'll be close, but probably doable. As for L2, do you really need more than 11.5kW? That's still enough to do 20-80% overnight. I guess some people do since Ford offers an 80A onboard charger on the Lightning...
As for CarPlay, they probably won't. I get the vibe they're taking a page from the Tesla playbook and want to focus on their native infotainment experience instead.
I am not sure with a 7k trailer 200 miles is doable with an EV. My neighbor had the first gen Rivian R1T and tried towing his boat and got only 80 miles which made him get rid of it in a record two months because the lake is 50 miles going there so going back he would have to charge.
I am worse, I tow race cars, side by sides, multiple jetskis, or camping trailers. 200 miles is enough to go where I need to and be back, it is the main reason why I got a half ton as the X5 is my daily. Level 2 at at least Tesla speeds is required because I drive alot every day, I would in a week be unable to get enough range, something my neighbor also ran into as it was his daily.
I wont budge on Carplay, Tesla and Rivian only have that to datamine and all infotainments are so horrible I just want to see my phone. I have tried the Tesla and Rivian UIs and they dont remember where my Spotify was when I got out and no Apple Map is a flat out dealbreaker. If GM tries this I wont buy their EVs either when they reach parity.
About 3-5% the first year, then maybe 1% every year or two thereafter. The degradation is much faster when the battery is new, once it "breaks in" it levels out quite a bit. The new base model has an LFP pack, so that should be even slower, at least after the initial break in. These aren't passively cooled batteries being fully cycled every day like your poor phone battery.
>Not to be outdone, the top quad motor R1 models get a performance boost, with output increasing from 835 hp and 908 pound-feet of torque to 1,025 hp and 1,198 lb-ft. That’s enough for the R1T to slingshot from 0-60 mph in 2.5 seconds in Launch mode, a tenth quicker than the braggadocious Tesla Cybertruck.
Well, these huge trucks performance are going more insane.
The top speed for these heavy EVs is limited by braking and tire tech. That's why most of them come with limiters that are set much lower than lighter ICE equivalents. High end sports cars or even MB/BMW/AUDI sedans have been able to reach 60 mph in under 3.5 seconds for years. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has just set new braking standards and made automatic emergency braking mandatory on all vehicles within 5 years from now.
I was responding to a comment about acceleration, so top speed is irrelevant. EV top speed is limited for efficiency. If it wasn’t, the battery would run out exponentially faster above certain speeds. High end sports cars have historically been capable, yes, but their prices and availability made them much more exclusive and they generally weren’t daily drivers. More vehicles on the road more often makes the effort of government regulation more worthwhile and more likely. Nothing you said actually answered my question.
The culture that created that agreement and the culture driving this competition is very very different and so are the motivations. I seriously doubt anything like that happens here. Do you really see someone like Musk agreeing to do something that artificially limits the "look how cool I am because of what I can spend money on" factor in an agreement with a competitor?
They have already cratered. Carmax offered 44k for my 2022 R1T with 40k miles. You can find used T for under 50k. It's an absolute bargain for the price.
I have both Model Y and R1T, the miles that R1T shows is pretty much on point. I've put on over 40k miles and I'm 100% confident when my destination is 100 miles away and truck shows 110 miles left on charge that I'll make it there.
Model Y? Lol
no glovebox, no 6ft bed, that stupid tailgate gap cover that just traps dirt and rocks under it and you have to cover the buttons on the side rails if you put a canopy on it.
fix those things and i would have bought a rivian instead of a '24 tacoma.
ive lived out of my tacoma for a total of 9 months in the last 2 years on "overlanding" trips covering nearly 75k km. its been with me across every province Canada except nunavut, ive taken it to the arctic ocean, its driven on glaciers, its done sand dunes, its been down both the east and west coats of the states to the mexican border and the tip of Florida. if we go back to the beginning of covid in 2020 it adds another 5 months on the road with it over another 2 trips. theres also been countless weekend trips to go out wild camping.
i had a leer 100xr canopy with a drawer system i built underneath it that i slept on top of. cook station, DIY solar shower, i had taken my rear seats out and put a 12v 75L dometic fridge that was on sliders that came completely out of the truck, 2x100w solar panels on the cab that powered my 2nd battery that fit behind the rear seats storage compartment, and a 1000w inverter under the drivers seat.
Then it sounds like you truly overland and I agree it’s great for that. Maybe the R1TX will fix some of your complaints with the Rivian but now I hope you enjoy that new Tacoma and I hope the new drive train helps with the highway manners as the old Tacoma should never have been sold as is in my opinion.
biggest let down is that the new tacoma changed their rear door design and the fridge i have wont fit out of it. so now i need to change my bed drawer design so the fridge can go in the back.
Ranger doesn't offer anything that's not a crew cab in the U.S.
Frontier offers it in non-crew cab, as I just found out. Makes sense given it's practically unchanged in over a decade.
GMC/Chevy don't offer 6 foot beds in the midsize segment anymore.
>Frontier offers it in non-crew cab,
And with the [crew cab](https://vehicle-images.dealerinspire.com/b461-110009585/1N6ED1FJ8RN604473/a7d2998e9969234e82be8cc5cc2a45af.jpg) too, though I have yet to see one.
The newest Colorado/Canyon and Ranger don't offer anything besides a crew/5' bed. The Ranger teased SuperCab and crew/6' models when it was testing, but they never made it.
who is supplying the lfp battery? I believe the patents of CNRS, UT Austin and chinese exclusive licensing agreement has ended right? Is it still supplied by BYD?
I really wanted to hold out for an R2 but several things including the 0.99% promotion on Model Y had me finally pull the trigger. But it’s certainly nice to see good things going for Rivian. I anticipate keeping this model Y for as long as possible, but an R2 is certainly still on the board for a potential future next vehicle.
they just need to make it a 6ft box and their sales would go drastically up. id be driving one right now if it had the 6ft box, instead i bought a '24 tacoma.
I'd bet the sales would increase, but not "drastically". Looking at other mid-size crew cab pickups that do or did offer a 6' bed, it's not very common.
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