Cheap attack drones break through Israel's Iron Dome • Inexpensive fiber-optic drones are challenging Israel's high-tech defenses, shifting the military balance in the Middle East.

Posted by Naurgul@reddit | anime_titties | View on Reddit | 46 comments

A recent video showing an explosive-laden drone striking an Israeli Iron Dome battery couldn't have been more symbolic: Israel's famous air-defense system, which cost billions of euros, looked powerless against a small aircraft that cost a few hundred euros.

While the video's authenticity has not yet been verified, experts believe it is genuine.

The footage was published about a week ago by Hezbollah, a Lebanon-based pro-Iranian militia, which Germany, the US and several Sunni Arab states have classified as a terrorist organization.

The drone strike, if genuine, would mark propaganda victory for Hezbollah and reveal a significant vulnerability in Israel's military capabilities.

Since March, Hezbollah has increasingly used FPV (first-person view) drones to attack Israel, which provide pilots with a real-time image of their targets. Several Israeli soldiers have been killed in such strikes, and many more injured.

What concerns Israeli military experts is that growing numbers of these drones are not controlled by radio signals but via fiber-optic cables, unspooled from a coil. This means locating and jamming their communications has become virtually impossible with traditional electronic warfare methods.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu finds himself under growing pressure to act, recently telling Israeli media that he had ordered the "establishment of a special drone threat project." Yet Netanyahu also asked the public for patience, saying "this will take time."

[-]

Stubbs94@reddit

Israel is dependent on international support too. The internal propaganda only really works when you can pretend your enemies are hellbent on the destruction of your people.

[-]

kolitics@reddit

You have people are chanting “death to Israel, death to America”. How hard do they have to pretend to get support?

[-]

Stubbs94@reddit

And why do you think those people exist? It's because Israel has committed atrocity after atrocity in the region leading to the creation of both of their "big bad enemies" (Hamas and Hezbollah). And even then, they have both tried to reason with Israel multiple times, especially Hamas, which has been completely rejected by Israel to ensure the violence continues.

[-]

kolitics@reddit

Perhaps, but we were talking about whether it is in their self interest today to eliminate hamas and hazbollah or to perpetuate their existence for ongoing support, which is a valid possibility, but Id question whether they’d prefer the territory and security, could always point to another enemy for support, and stop short of eliminating them from international pressure.

[-]

WestcoastAlex@reddit

these videos showing Hizbo clearly targeting military vehicles and installations is ruining their propaganda about israeli civillians being targeted

[-]

Racko20@reddit

Are there a lot of Israeli citizens in Lebanon right now?

[-]

WestcoastAlex@reddit

they are targeting bases inside 'israel'

[-]

Racko20@reddit

What's with the quotes? Are they targeting Israel or aren't they?

[-]

WestcoastAlex@reddit

i could call them the zionist entity if you prefer

You would think Israel would learn by now that invading Lebanon is just a bad idea. They are incapable of actually fighting asymmetric warfare, and so they resort to just causing mass civilian casualties while their military position slowly becomes unfeasible. You'd think a hyper militarised state would have some sense. Even in the occupied Gaza strip, a territory they had besieged and full surveillance over for decades, they couldn't eliminate the resistance after a full-scale military incursion. The only rational conclusion to this is that Israel is more than happy to mass murder civilians than actually eliminate any resistance groups.

HerrHaschen@reddit

You would think that Israel would learn by now to treat their neighbors with the respect they've always demanded for themselves, but here we are.

YourFuture2000@reddit

Every colonialist/expansionist regime needs an enemy to symbolize threats that scares the people, who them will support their regimes genocides.

The oldest trick in the demagogue polutical book.

this_dudeagain@reddit

Asymmetrical warfare uses civilians as cover. If the rolls were reversed Hamas or Hezbollah wouldn't hesitate to kill every civilian in their path to reach their objectives.

hectorgarabit@reddit

Because the goal is not to eliminate the resistance, it is to eliminate the people.

Indeed. That's obvious to anyone who isn't a propagandist or an idiot.

Why wouldn’t they want to eliminate the militant group attacking them with rockets and drones?

abzftw@reddit

How else are they going to justify killing innocents ?

Keep thinking, you’re nearly there

Because fascist projects need a constant threat to keep the population in line. If Hamas and Hezbollah simply stopped resisting, they wouldn't have the justification for their bloodlust.

agitatedprisoner@reddit

If a fascist groups needs an external enemy then absent an external enemy why wouldn't it create one? I've read lots of articles to the effect that Israel created Hamas.

"In the 1970s and 1980s, Israeli authorities in the occupied territories initially supported and licensed the charitable and religious networks led by Sheikh Ahmed Yassin (who founded Hamas in 1987). The goal was to build up an Islamist counterweight to weaken Yasser Arafat's secular Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) and the broader Palestinian nationalist movement."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_support_for_Hamas

Who would've thought funding regressive theocratics of another god against progressive secularists could foster eternal war??!!

Wouldn’t victory over hamas and hezbollah be extremely popular, mean they have expanded territory, and free them up to attack a new enemy?

Magjee@reddit

But they haven't been able to achieve victory against either

Not from a lack of trying

If eliminated, they would look for new resistance to be in conflict with to expand again

pimmen89@reddit

Hamas keeps Palestine divided, that’s very good for Israel. That’s why Israel supported Hamas before October 7th.

Paradoxjjw@reddit

It's why they supported the creation of Israel in the first place, to split Palestinian support away from the PLO

‘Greater joorael’ is a baffling idea

They’re going for the land and ethical grab while they can

It’s a shame the worlds is allowing it to happen

margotsaidso@reddit

You'd think a hyper militarised state would have some sense.

You could say the same about the US and their last few middle east adventures. It doesn't matter how competent or funded your military is if the goals aren't military ones.

CJBill@reddit

As von Clausewitz said "War is the continuation of politics by other means"

At the end of the day war isn't about meeting military goals, it's about political goals. It's why the US lost in Vietnam despite winning battles.

NearABE@reddit

I think that last part is fairly clear. The Israeli State needs the militia groups to continue threatening the Israeli citizens.

SpontaneousFlame@reddit

Each iron dome battery costs $50 million. Interceptors are on top of that and are $40k each.

Ouch! That has got to hurt. The peak of Israeli ingenuity and tech brilliance defeated by a bunch of people Israelis call primitives…

Dry-Season-522@reddit

They've already deployed successful laser-based systems.

lol. Source?

Here let me google that for you

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_Beam

So how did this happen?

Deployed to protect people, this strike only did property damage.

The wires will be cut. Wires that spool out also lead back to a source. Weapons keep evolving. Iron dome itself was an example of using large numbers of interceptor missiles to counter missiles.

snowflake37wao@reddit

Yeah when I got to that part about cables and spools, I got questions. How long of a cable? What if the cable snags? What about the part where the drone attached to the cable isnt coming back? What?

PreviousCurrentThing@reddit

Look up pictures from Ukraine, there are fields just criss-crossed with used fiber optic cables. Birds are making nests with them.

Given how far the static positions are from each other, cables have to be kilometers or maybe up to 10km long? It's an interesting question and I don't think I've seen any hard numbers.

In Ukraine, there's no real risk of tracing cables back to source as they're basically invisible from drones, and walking them back on foot is suicide. In an asymmetric situation like Lebanon, the IDF could theoretically walk the cables back, but they're so cautious with their ground forces the position would likely be cleared by the time they actually did.

NearABE:
> The wires will be cut.

How? Is Israel going to deploy several battalions with scissors across Lebanon?

>Wires that spool out also lead back to a source.

No risk of ambush or IED!

>Weapons keep evolving. Iron dome itself was an example of using large numbers of interceptor missiles to counter missiles.

Iron dome could do with an iron dome…

bluecheese2040@reddit

This is absurd. Iron dome isn't supposed to stop small fpv drones. It did an amazing job (although not as good as Israel would have u believe) stopping Iranian ballistic missiles.

This is akin to saying...oh rifles are useless cause artillery exists...no. each have their purpose.

chambreezy@reddit

Doesn't say they are supposed to. The iron dome doesn't stop ballistic missiles very well after they've eventually all been destroyed by drones.

sfaik the iron dome was mostly good at stopping small rockets and drones not ballistic missiles. Patriot are for actual ballistic missiles no? and THAAD for high altitude

either way none of it is designed to withstand dozens of incoming at a time and israel's days are numbered

Anary8686@reddit

Israel uses David's Sling, but most are now under going maintenance, so they're using Patriot missiles in the mean time.

tomato = tomato

DanDan1993@reddit

uh... its not meant to stop ballistic missiles either. It's for short range rockets and artillery, mostly.

it DOES have modifications to deal with long range missiles as well, but it's not included in the long-range interceptors Israel typically uses (Kela David\Arrow 3).

It actually does it job amazingly against short range rockets (up to 9 km when i define short). It has loads of vulnerabilities.

The United States constitution guarantees US citizens the right to have a hezbollah in the second amendment. Constantly citing the German government’s opinion on that amendment gets tiresome.

Hopefully it is obvious that the second amendment does not give citizens the right to organize with militant groups abroad. People in Lebanon need to do their thing over in Lebanon while people in Utah mind their own business in Utah.

AutoModerator@reddit

The link you have provided contains keywords for topics associated with an active conflict, and has automatically been flaired accordingly. If the flair was not updated, the link submitter MUST do so. Due to submissions regarding active conflicts generating more contrasting discussion, comments will only be available to users who have set a subreddit user flair, and must strictly comply with subreddit rules. Posters who change the assigned post flair without permission will be temporarily banned. Commenters who violate Reddiquette and civility rules will be summarily banned.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.