ebiking toddlers is where I draw the line
Posted by InvestigatorSenior@reddit | ebikes | View on Reddit | 73 comments
I need to decompress after today's ride.
Imagine this - a little boy about my knee height (6-8 yo?) on throttle propelled mini emoto zooming on cycling path. No adult in sight.
At first when I saw him I thought 'that's cute'. But then I noticed that he is passing me at significant speed difference one way and then effortlessly taking over going back.
And I'm riding 32kph at this point (combination of light Bosch SX cross bike, good road and me doing intervals, trying to get in shape). I'd wager he was going 50-ish kph.
And we all know little kids have no self preservation instinct and won't be able to avoid a crash if something sudden happens.
Parents weren't clueless - he was wearing big motorcycle helmet with tiny devil horns attached. This is in EU where mini emoto in question is illegal unless registered and insured as a full on motorcycle and ridden by an adult with class M license.
What do you think? Am I just old and not keeping up with the times?
8bitPete@reddit
Suck it up buttercup, PEV's are the future.
I dont see a problem, so long as they wear the propper safety đŠș gear.
sususl1k@reddit
Here in the Netherlands I see primary school kids no older than 10 riding fatbikes and all sorts of chinesium garbage on a daily basis (sometimes up to three kids on a single bike too). Itâs fucking grim how little some parents care about the safety of their own children as well as others.
redditorialy_retard@reddit
Yeet the child. Fine the parent.Â
No puberty, no electricity for your bike
commonhillmyna@reddit
I donât think puberty is an early enough cut off. 26 (or whenever the prefrontal cortex reaches full maturation) would be better. The pubescent and teenagers Iâve seen on e-bikes (especially when they are in the presence of love interests) are the real terrors⊠theyâre always riding without hands or helmets.
Straight_Waltz_9530@reddit
26 isn't when that happens. The researchers simply stopped tracking after that age. Critical rewiring and network refinement continue well into your late 20s and early 30s. Then of course the median decline later in life.
But let's be real. The real terrors are folks operating multiple tons of steel at high speeds through populated areas at any age. If you look hard enough, you'll find deaths due to e-bikes that don't involve a car/truck/SUV. They're rare, but they happen. They also pale in comparison to the number of deaths of pedestrians, bicyclists, e-bikers, etc. killed by motor vehicles each and every day.
\~40,000 deaths by cars each year, every year in the US alone.
Young kids on personal electric conveyances is an issue for sure, but never forget the full grown elephant in the room.
Superb_Raccoon@reddit
You seem young to be a grumpy old man.
You know they race 250cc motorcross "pre-puberty".
redditorialy_retard@reddit
Do you know how many % of children actually ride dirtbikes as a hobby?Â
It's like saying "Oh we should give kids access to a bow because some kids are trained in archery"Â
By all means if a kid has been riding since he was 5 years old go ahead. But you'd get hit by a moving truck first before you manage to pick a random kid that can ride a dirtbikeÂ
Superb_Raccoon@reddit
And so do you know if the kid was trained or not?
If not, what is your point?
scarfwizard@reddit
On cycling paths?
Superb_Raccoon@reddit
No 250cc should not be on cycling paths.
Salt-Lingonberry-853@reddit
Oh, well then it's almost like your 250CC motocross comment is irrelevant.
I agree with OP here, and I say this as a filthy casual enduro racer. I've got the carb out of my KDX200 out for cleaning right now, so don't think it's just because I hate dirt bikes.
xlonelywhalex@reddit
Yea .. and theyâre also trained how to do it.
LoudPack3000@reddit
People like you just suck on another level, they are the childs parent, not you maybe they should have been on private property letting their kid use the dirt bike but either way your a loser for your comment
EUCruzer@reddit
I think you may be confused about what a toddler is. Toddlers are definitely not 6-8 years old. A 6-8 yr old can competently ride a bicycle. Toddlers are 1-3 years old and still developing their walking and situational awareness skills.
LopsidedGiraffe@reddit
No child should be riding at 50km/hr.
EUCruzer@reddit
Exactly, thatâs why I said a 6-8 year old can competently ride a bicycle.
No_Bend_2902@reddit
Swear to God this sub is for haters
James-B0ndage@reddit
80% of this subreddit is stuck up purist cyclists that only use overpriced bikes, and will hate on anyone that wants to go faster than is legally allowed.
BassesNBikes@reddit
Hoping for 100% soon, traveler!
LoudPack3000@reddit
This sub is literally full of old miserable losers that love laws and regulations and don't mind their basic freedoms being stripped from them lol, the same people who say "kids should spend more time outdoors" then say these bicycle outdoor activities are "too dangerous for kids" lol, if people are THAT worried about safety go stay inside ur fckin gated community bro when I was a kid I was helping the other kids make trails and jumps in the woods and flying down hills with no brakes going well past 40mph on a regular bike, but now that it's got a little electric throttle it's this huge fckin deal, it used to be legal in New York for a 50cc gas powered motor to operate on the streets with NO LICENSE. You could get that thing to 40mph, I swear I was a kid 10 years ago and I genuinely feel bad for the kids of today, because of people like the ones who flood this sub, you all suck. And I'm sure you know it too.
jademage01@reddit
can we maybe not assume how old kids are? I know us old folks hate it when people do that to us, why do we return the favour?
Fair-Discipline-1005@reddit
Mini e motos must be forbidden....
iceseayoupee@reddit
You are actually right on this one
Professional_Ad_6462@reddit
This is a generation of parents that bought a 13 inch iPad loaded toddler games to keep 18 - 30 month olds quiet in restaurants. Just a few days ago I was in a concert venue at a resort in the Algarve. Across from us was a British family late 30âs parents 8-10 year old boys all on their phones thruout the concert. Exhausted autistic parents raising another generation further along on the spectrum.
In the EU unlike the U.S. you canât just buy a hyabusa after high school. Motorcycle ownership is on a graduated scale to help young adults stay safe.
Like parents who make guns accessible in U.S. these parents should be criminally prosecuted.
LoudPack3000@reddit
No, he is not
TwoWheel_Detective@reddit
You're riding 32kph in the EU?
Were you wearing a motorcycle helmet?
Did you get the make/model of the mini emoto?
50 kph?
InvestigatorSenior@reddit (OP)
> You're riding 32kph in the EU?
you know that if you pedal hard enough and you're in shape you can get to 50ish kph on muscle powered bike?
I have no problem spinning cross bike on 50mm tires that weights 14kg to about 35kph on a good road. Fastest I went on this bike in 2 months I have it is about 40, gears end at 44. I expected to see some sings of instability but everything felt the same as going at much slower speed.
I'll tell you something better - after training hard past few months I'm able to propel my 36kg 'light' eMTB to 36kph on flat ground. It feels like I'm hitting my max effort but
And yes, all my ebikes are fully legal L1e 'pedelec'. In case of Bosch system motor cuts off completely as soon as speedometer shows 25.0kph. After that you push.
> Were you wearing a motorcycle helmet
what? would you going this speed on a muscle powered bike? People race on gravel getting averages faster than that and wear just regular road bicycle helmets. For MTB stuff I wear half face and knee protectors but that's about it.
> Did you get the make/model of the mini emoto?
funny. It looked like: kid on a bike, blink, no kind on a bike.
> 50kph
if someone is passing me at a speed comparable to car passing a pedestrian but I'm going about 30kph how fast is that? This is how it looked from my point of view.
TwoWheel_Detective@reddit
32 kph on a bike path with children around?
InvestigatorSenior@reddit (OP)
32kph on an empty stretch of separate special 'separate bicycle fast road' if translated directly from my local law. I'm legally allowed to go up to speed limit of an adjacent street which was 60kph.
This is why we have a law that to ride bicycle there you need to pass practical exam or be 18yo or older. Kids under 12yo need to be supervised by an adult. Kids under 10yo are considered pedestrians and need to use sidewalk and be restricted to safe sidewalk speed (widely recognized as <10kph).
TwoWheel_Detective@reddit
60kph on a bike path?
That seems dangerously fast on a bicycle.
The kinetic energy is off the charts!
And it's legal?
Seems like a double standard is in place.
Lawnmover_Man@reddit
This seems to be an intentional trolling account. Tagged and noted.
thereal_greg6@reddit
My conventional road bikes are capable of higher speeds than my e-bike simply because theyâre light, have good gear range, have slick tyres and I pedal hard. I wear a bicycle helmet.
TwoWheel_Detective@reddit
Yup. We have an acoustic biker in our community that loves
to chase and pass ebikes:)
ImprovementNo1056@reddit
First no child should be riding an ebike/emoto  2nd. Whoâs making these bikes with children  as the target market   And the parents who buy themÂ
MildlyAgitatedBovine@reddit
Hear me out... what if I'm on rollerblades and he's towing me?
Does adding 200 lb of 'can't quite stop quickly either' change your mind?
xlonelywhalex@reddit
And youâre a full grown adult capable of weighing a decision that involves personal bodily danger. Kids rely on their parents to make those decisions for them. You could stop trying to defend shitty parenting choices.
Superb_Raccoon@reddit
You are way behind the times. 3 yo, 50cc bike.
https://youtu.be/DQF8lrjqhL8?si=0w9S3iOPuOJ2fFUv
LEMental@reddit
Once again...On a bike path? You suddenly go silent when that is brought up.
BoringBob84@reddit
I agree. A child on an e-moto can be safe if they have protective equipment, if they have adult supervision, and if they are on private property or an ORV park. Turning them loose on a public bike path was very irresponsible of the parents because it was very dangerous for the child for for everyone around them.
Superb_Raccoon@reddit
I didn't go client, you 2 second attention span moron.
ProExpert1S500@reddit
Itâs too unsafe and they have it too easy. They need to have a normal bike and the difficulty of putting in the work to get moving and not have a motor/battery do it for them
TopRepulsive4766@reddit
Personally, I'm more worried about the lack of supervision than the kid actually riding the ebike. Kudos to the helmet though.
We have kids that age who ride similar ebikes, emotos etc. around here. Rarely do I see them alone for long periods though. Usually their parents or older siblings are with them or nearby. And I haven't seen any of em riding without helmets. Also at least half of em have other protective gear such as elbow and knee pads.
InvestigatorSenior@reddit (OP)
to be clear I don't have a problem with legal ebike despite law says that underage riders need to pass practical exam to ride a bicycle where I live and you need to be 12yo for that.
My problem is that this was crazy op, derestricted, illegal bike shaped object on public cycling path. And I have doubts about if rider in question was experienced enough to handle this much power at this speed.
LoudPack3000@reddit
Are u kidding me? A kid where you live needs to pass an exam to ride a regular bicycle? Holy shit you must be brainwashed like a motherfcker to think that's normal
James-B0ndage@reddit
So to clarify. You only care because itâs against the law? If it were legal itâd be ok? Yeah youâre just being an old curmudgeon
kozufox@reddit
He literally just said he didn't have a problem with a kid riding an ebike illegally underage, so the problem is clearly "child going 50kph on a bike path", not just that it's illegal.
James-B0ndage@reddit
But if that were legal, would he no longer have an issue. Thatâs my question
kozufox@reddit
Why even ask that question when he's fine with a different thing that's also illegal, but isn't nearly as dangerous?
TopRepulsive4766@reddit
We don't have that law here. And most of the kids that age I see riding do pretty well as riders. Once in a while there's one who goes over his or her limits, but we've never had any serious issues.
InvestigatorSenior@reddit (OP)
and we had an ebike witch hunt after fatal accident involving 2 young kids riding single 'ebike' (chinese special emoto) got widely publicized. Similar accidents followed and sometimes bystanders got hurt as well.
Now there's universal hate towards whole ebike community and situations like the one in question don't help. To give you an idea - last September distracted biker slammed into my eMTB while I was waiting for a green light. Guy was on his phone and wearing headphones, not paying any attention. Everyone around blamed me because 'it's an ebike'.
TopRepulsive4766@reddit
It seems bigger cities have a lot more problems with ebikes than we do here. More traffic is probably why.
Once in a while a kid will be negligent here. I have yelled at the Surron kids a couple of times when I saw them without a helmet. I know a good portion of the kids by name here so they usually comply without argument. I don't think I've encountered any kids using phones while riding. I've seen them stopped with their phones out, but not while riding. I've seen em with earbuds in fairly often. Those with full-face helmets I can't tell. Never saw any issue resulting from earbud use though.
Purprocksrockmysocks@reddit
I was born on two wheels & started racing moto at 3 years old on paw-50âs so I support this kids freedom & give him a big ol hell yea brother but the real question is are you jealous the kids having a good time & you canât ? Laws are made to be broken,
Let him live & maybe you should live a little too ! Good day
LoudPack3000@reddit
God loves you đđȘđ
AreYouGonnaEatThis@reddit
Youâre just old. In Canada we let them ride dirt bikes. After a few falls, crashes, and wipeouts they learn pretty quick. They learn through experience.
syzygybeaver@reddit
Yeah. Off road. Not on public roads and bike paths.
bAddi44@reddit
Yeah...
I grew up in rural america in the 90s.Â
Me and all the other 8 year olds would go on day long rides on our dirt bikes and quads. This was not contraversial. Fields, pastures, etc.. most of the time unsupervised.
Tricky_Damage5981@reddit
Yes but we're not supposed to.. CAS takes a hissy fit if/when they find out (for good reason)
In Ontario, the minimum age to legally operate an e-bike on public roads is 16 years old. This applies to all e-bike styles. No exceptions are made for parental supervision, nor is a driver's license required, but the 16-year age floor is strictly enforced
Dirty_Power@reddit
lol. If CAS really cared non of my neighbours would have kids anymore. Nevermind the e-bikes, the number of gas dirtbikes ripping around the neighbour probably outnumbers them. But CAS is not taking kids from a million dollar neighbourhood to send to foster care.
Tricky_Damage5981@reddit
I said hissy fit; not that they really care
LEMental@reddit
You let them ride Dirt Bikes on a city paved bike path? Press X to doubt.
LSpliff@reddit
Lack of supervision is the issue here, not kid on motorcycle necessarily. I was racing motocross by that age.
BoringBob84@reddit
... on a cycling path?
LoudPack3000@reddit
Boring bob lol I'm sure your the life of the party everywhere you go dude đ I see people old grumpy and miserable complaining about kids on an e bike so often it's infuriating, unless it's an electric dirt bike stfu and fck off !
Significant-Pen-6049@reddit
I saw this last year on a city park walk path. It was so bizarre to see. Kid had full gear on , no parents anywhere cruising down the paved paths and he looked like he should be on a hot wheels battery car
muffin_disaster9944@reddit
Emoto like Stacyc are really popular in the US and we have one for our 4 year old.
James-B0ndage@reddit
Eh maybe thatâs not common over there, but over here in murica đ . kids play on vehicles like that all the time. The ones that live in rural areas especially will ride dirt bikes, 4 wheelers, snowmobiles. And parents let their kids start whatever age they want.
TheFlightlessDragon@reddit
The parents that allowed this are worse in my book that those who leave their kids unattended at home for long periods.
You arenât creating a situation where they might hurt themselves, you are creating a situation where they most definitely WILL and likely as not someone else too.
Embarrassed-Emu4442@reddit
As an owner of a slightly illegal class 3 bike, nope. Fine the parents. Throttle or PAS control (or lack therof) doesn't equate to child state or my own. You're completely right to feel that way.Â
I caught up to an older gentleman riding an Aventon (idk the model) and complimented his bike. I then turned right down an unknown road to avoid passing him xD
scarfwizard@reddit
Iâm confused by your measurements⊠you say toddler (usually thatâs 1 - 3yo), knee height (typically 60cm so a 10 month old âbabyâ) and also 6 - 8 years oldâŠ
âŠare you sure that they might also actually been a grown man? đ
fatcat111@reddit
It was Peter Dinklage.
Destroyer-Marauder@reddit
Unsupervised is the key here. A kid that age needs supervision on an ebike like that.
Glad to hear he was wearing a helmet though.
CaterpillarKey6288@reddit
Are your sure it wasn't a little person.
Ok-Assistance4133@reddit
No you're not wrong to be pissed about this. This is infuriating and dangerously unsafe.Â