Do car guys like any 3 row crossovers?

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bigtony8978@reddit

Durango 5.7, Sprite and bulletproof as long as they’re maintained

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

I'm honestly not a Dodge guy but I do love the transmission in that car. I imagine the engine is decent too.

I've heard a lot of bad about the new Jeep Grand Cherokee Long and I don't know if the Durango is any different/better (would think they are quite similar, although you can't get the 5.7 in the Jeep GCL).

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jkjeeper06@reddit

The transmission is the ZF8 auto. Its in many many different manufacturers since \~2008 (iirc)

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JonohG47@reddit

So the transmission is a ZF design. Back when they were Chrysler LLC, freshly divorced from Daimler, and actively courting takeover by Fiat, Chrysler had an urgent need to purge Mercedes mechanical systems and platforms from their product line. They also had a political imperative to continue to use their American manufacturing capacity.

Unlike other manufacturers (notably Audi, Alpina, Aston Martin and BMW, in the case of the ZF 8HP) Chrysler inked a licensing deal with ZF, allowing them to manufacture the 8HP and 9HP in-house, for installation in their own vehicles, paying ZF a per-unit royalty. In addition to this in-house production, they set up a joint-venture plant with ZF, for co-production.

The only vehicles that got actual ZF-produced units were the first model year, after which production shifted to the in-house units.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

So Stellantis makes their version of the 8 speed auto basically?

Still a good transmission though, isn't it?

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JonohG47@reddit

Yeah. The deal was originally inked by Chrysler LLC, and FCA then Stellantis inherited it. The 8HP (and the 9HP used in FWD vehicles) are ZF designs, but manufactured in the U.S. under license, either by Stellantis themselves, or the Stellantis/ZF joint venture.

Given the amount of taxpayer money that went into bailing out Chrysler, and the fact the U.S. government was a major shareholder for a while there, it would have been politically untenable for Chrysler to source transmissions manufactured in the E.U. by a German supplier, as a permanent solution, when they had sizable U.S. manufacturing capacity and UAW labor.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

Ah yeah, I like the transmission they use, but have heard reliability issues with the GCL as a whole vehicle.

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foolproofphilosophy@reddit

I thought I read that Stellantis only puts the ZF8 behind their V8’s but that’s what we’re talking about. I have one in a BMW and it’s very nice.

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DIMPLET0N@reddit

I would shy away from anything produced or made under the name of Chrysler-Fiat-Stellantis. Their vehicles are cheap for a reason - cheap parts, poor engineering, and low quality products.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

Honestly they aren't that inexpensive at all. I've compared Jeep Grand Cherokee to similar vehicles and its roughly a little more expensive than a Subaru Ascent and less than a Honda Pilot given similar options and configurations.

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DIMPLET0N@reddit

The quality of parts within Chrysler-made products is horrendous. They use plastic on anything and everything they can. My mother's Jeep Wrangler has some of the worst build quality I've ever seen. 90% of the interior is plastic and cheap leather, and the Jeep, while only having 115,000 miles on it, already shifts rough, shakes the interior while idling, and already has needed a new thermostat housing because, surprise, they're made of plastic.

Avoid Chrysler products.

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bigtony8978@reddit

The new gc is a completely different vehicle. I don’t know if you’re looking for brand new or not, but a late model Durango should be easy to come by. I’ve owned half a dozen 5.7 hemis and they’ve been absolutely problem free. I know people have had lifter and cam issues but I’ve seen none of it. Change the oil frequently and I’ve had them go past 200k. With the zf 8 speed they’re pretty damn quick and should satisfy car guy in you. Other than that, the Mazda SUV’s have surprised me with almost car like handling, they don’t have that hemi pull though..

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

Either new or like new (used with a warranty). The reason I'd want to go toward the Jeep GC Long is because its bigger than the Dodge. I am kind of surprised they don't offer the GC Long with a 5.7.

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Disastrous-Group3390@reddit

If you can’t get the 5.7, don’t bother.

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MtlGuy_incognito@reddit

I install emergency systems in vehicles and I was pretty impressed with the new Durango, all the officers I talk to think it's a big step up from the Exploder or Charger.

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Shatophiliac@reddit

I feel like a 3 row crossover doesn’t really exist, at least with my definition of crossover. Typically a crossover is a small SUV on a car chassis, and virtually all of the 3 row vehicles I know of (except for a few old station wagons) are basically on a minivan or truck chassis.

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Disastrous-Group3390@reddit

I think that now, any SUV that’s not based upon a truck (body on frame) is now, by default, a crossover. (Some like the Grand Cherokee and Durango are unibody but their drivetrains and chassis layout mean they’re closer to ‘real’ SUVs than most of their competitors.) Crossover architecture is essentially a unibody wagon (or minivan) with (usually) added ground clearance and available AWD. As buyers gravitate to the more carlike offerings, the offroad chops lose prominence with each redesign, so you get closer to minivans each generation. Most of the people who buy them would be better off with a minivan but want SUVs for the image. IF people still bought cars, you’d see cars that are the less butch version, but now economy of scale doesn’t mean we get a car-SUV platform, we get an SUV-minivan-trucklet platform. (Or in Stellantis’ case, a Dodge-Jeep body architecture platform that uses Dodge-Jeep-Ram drivetrain parts.)

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

I may be using the wrong word. In my mind Crossover is unibody and full size are on frame on body. None of the full size are under 50k. They're all 50k+

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jstar77@reddit

CX9 we had was great. At the time it was the only one that an appreciable amount of storage behind the 3rd row.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

I wonder how the CX-90 is... It gets some interesting review by "savage geese" . Behind the 3rd row cargo space is a factor - it doesn't need to be huge but needs to be able to fit some luggage.

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right415@reddit

Wife's cx9 is kind of a choose 3rd row OR storage situation.

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MonkeyMD3@reddit

Agreed. Shopping the new cx9 & it's a huge downgrade in cargo space.

Only things comparable now are Atlas, Telluride, Palisade & Traverse

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regassert6@reddit

The CX-9 still has some driving fun as well.

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dad-guy-2077@reddit

My wife loves her Subaru Ascent, but to me it’s too much of a tank. It has the muscle to move all that mass once the turbo kicks in, so you’re basically lumbering along until you gun it.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

We have an Ascent now, it checks the boxes in terms of size, space ,speed , but just really boring.

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right415@reddit

I will say that I really love my wife's CX9. It's super comfortable and reasonably quick and it's got a third row. I personally have 60's muscle cars, 50's 4x4 with no power steering, an electric car, and an old sequoia for when I need to transport 8 people. I don't mind my wife's CX9 at all, I rather enjoy it. Highly recommend it.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

How about the new CX90 ?

Have to admit I wouldn't mind a plugin hybrid because I could do most of this vehicle's driving on battery only (except road trips.)

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gstringstrangler@reddit

Highlander

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Disastrous-Group3390@reddit

If you’re you’re a Toyota fan, either get the ‘24 and older 4Runner (a real, truck based, offroad capable SUV) or the Sienna. The Highlander has all the drawvacks of a the Sienna (not really off roadable, transverse engine, zero ‘fun’) without the convenience of sliding doors and flat floors.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

I'd like the 4runner but man the trunk space looks tiny (non existent) if you use the 3rd row.

Hesitated to mention it but we do some light offroading once a year for 2 weeks. It's more than I'd want to put a Highlander through (I just don't believe it would handle it) but our Subaru Ascent with good tires currently suffices.

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gstringstrangler@reddit

Just answering OP's question. I've had them all, the 4Runner is great except for how they program the throttle. The highlander is plenty fun, especially in the snow, they actually got the snow mode dialled pretty good to allow wheelspin and drifting. My girl has a 22 XSE for reference, looks pretty good too and uses like half the fuel of the 4Runner as she commutes downtown from the burbs for about a 20-30 minute drive each way.

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Disastrous-Group3390@reddit

Good to know. The only Highlander I have any time in belongs to friends. It was (as I’ve said elsewhere) an inconvenient minivan. Moaned and groaned, stereo sounded like it was tuned for talk radio, dash was a wall of weird looking plastic, and it was hard to get into the third row (and in or out of the second and third if in a parking space next to another car. Combine that with little ground clearance and highway tread tires, and I saw no ‘sport’ and conpromised ‘utilit.

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gstringstrangler@reddit

A minivan is probably better if you need the third row all the time or have small kids, ours only gets used occasionally and our own are teens so they can sort themselves out. They prefer it to being 3 across in my crew cab pickup lol. The stereo is definitely a weak point, I wanted to get the higher trim just for that, but the XSE is the best looking imo. I like the interior but I have no idea what other years or trim levels look like.

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techrider1@reddit

2023-2025 Acura MDX

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

This is the same platform as a Pilot, right? Honestly I'd looked at a Honda Pilot (on paper) quite a bit. But haven't test driven one yet.

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jkjeeper06@reddit

I need a car I can drive 35,000mi per year with a lot of traffic and can haul my kids and dog. The highlander hybrid I bought is great for that. Its slow and handles poorly, but I don't have curvy roads or need to row my own gears in daily traffic. Its efficient, reliable, boring, and holds its value. I don't have to worry about keeping it that nice like my fun cars.

I keep my wrangler and M3 for weekend driving

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

So this 3 row vehicle, although its our kid hauler, only gets driven like 5-7k a year. We drive a pretty small EV the other \~15k miles a year. I will drive this vehicle almost every day but only maybe 10 miles and it will also get garaged. And then it will go on road trips also.

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jkjeeper06@reddit

With that few miles, I'd be looking at something more fun since fuel economy will be less significant. If you need large, a yukon denali with the 6.2 sounds great and is fun in a straight line. Something like an SQ7 will outperform it in many ways

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

Both a little over my price point but wouldn't mind an SQ7!

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pearlsbeforedogs@reddit

Have you considered a mini van?

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

Nah - I want something more fun to drive than a minivan.

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Disastrous-Group3390@reddit

A family friend has a three row highlander. I know it’s a Yota and will last forever, but it’s a moany, groany plastic penalty box inside, and there is NO ‘Sport’ to it. As for ‘Utilty’, it’s a minivan with inconvenient doors.

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jkjeeper06@reddit

100% correct! Mon-fri, I don't get any opportunity to enjoy my fun cars, so I just don't drive them. I'll take the M3 out on the weekends or at night but to sit on the highway in stop and go traffic for over an hour? No thanks! For how much I drive, it makes sense to have multiple cars. I know I can keep the toyota a long time while putting 35k/yr on it

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AdEnvironmental1632@reddit

Muranos are good

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Cranks_No_Start@reddit

CVT transmissions

Lost me here.

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foolproofphilosophy@reddit

When they break it’s catastrophic. There’s no middle ground. The odds seem low now but it’s still a risk that a lot of people don’t want to take. Other people don’t like the drive.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

Yeah, I don't like how they drive... Who does? I thought he or she was making fun of me saying continuous variable transmission transmission.

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foolproofphilosophy@reddit

Lol I’m probably guilty of saying “CVT transmission” as often as I say “CVT”.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

I understand the T in CVT stands for transmission. Not everyone does, but I guess car guys should :)

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Cranks_No_Start@reddit

Oh I know what they are. Constantly Variable Transmission and while there might be a solid one out there. They just suck the fun out of driving and most had the internal fortitude of soggy nachos.

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Disastrous-Group3390@reddit

Dodge gets a lot of hate, but we love our Durango R/T AWD. Blends in like a crossover, sounds and goes like a muscle car, tows like a Tahoe. 133k and nearly trouble free.

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Soundbyte_79@reddit

I like the Durango, I’m not sure I would consider that a crossover.

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Disastrous-Group3390@reddit

I don’t know either; it’s an odd thing. It’s sized like most crossovers, it has three rows and is is a unibody but the engine is longitudinal, powers the rear wheels by default, and it tows like body on frame full sizers. Magazines don’t know what to call it either. If a person wants what a crossover for logical reasons (mainly roomy but not big outside) then that person should consider it and not worry about the category.

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Unordinary_Donkey@reddit

Its just kinda clearly an track oriented SUV though. People hear SUV and assume it must mean offroader but stuff like the Durango and BMW x5 are still SUV even though they are not at all designed for any real offroad use.

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pearlsbeforedogs@reddit

Maybe we should call them "estate wagons", like the British do.

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WCATQE@reddit

not new, but a 200 series land cruiser.

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clydetorrez@reddit

This violates your first dislike, but we got my wife a 2024 Hyundai Santa Fe and it’s legitimately great. Tons of standard features, turbo engine pulls well, dual clutch gearbox isn’t great TBH, but plenty of space for kids and dog.

I actually take it to run errands pretty often instead of my Golf R.

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DudeWhereIsMyDuduk@reddit

I'd probably just get a minivan if I was in that market.

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Current_Variety_9577@reddit

As a car guy, it’s hard to get excited about a 3-row suv. As a dad and a dog owner, I appreciate the usability of a 3-row though. Models like a Mazda CX-90 at least helps cushion the blow of not driving something more exciting—and it won’t be the end of the world if someone gets chocolate on the seat…..

Often it’s the second car that can be a little less practical and opens up the opportunity to get something that appeals more to my senses.

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skiitifyoucan@reddit (OP)

I wonder about the CX-90 Plugin hybrid. Although it's got the 4 cylinder, most of our driving would probably be on the battery (which is nice to me).

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CMDR-LT-ATLAS@reddit

I only like performance sedans, hatches and 2 door coupes.

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Important-Ad1533@reddit

Ford Explorer, Honda Pilot

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vegatx40@reddit

Avoid the Subaru Ascent like the plague

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ArmadilloSad2515@reddit

What’s wrong with them? My grandparents moved to that from the outback for the better towing. They seem to love it but they barely drive anymore.

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vegatx40@reddit

Cvt Drives like a bathtub Ventilated seats hardly blow any air Lanekeeping more trouble than it's worth So high of the ground is easily blown by high winds I could go on

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ArmadilloSad2515@reddit

Sounds like the same issues our modern Impreza has too. Subaru has lost their way.

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vegatx40@reddit

I also have a Crosstrek. So slow I'm scared to merge on the highway

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ArmadilloSad2515@reddit

My wife has an 18 Impreza and she likes it, I wish we could find something else but if she likes it I’m happy. I just got rid of my 03 Impreza wagon for an 05 STi. Older Subarus just hit different.

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Disastrous-Group3390@reddit

Do they still build those?! I never see them!

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vegatx40@reddit

I wish they wouldn't. I hate mine

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DeepsCL9@reddit

As a car guy? Screw that. I'm shopping for an Odyssey now that my family is expanding. It's a giant boat that'll carry everyone and everything, with sensational ride quality. Be sure to test drive a 2018+ car and listen for that VTEC scream.

When I want to actually have fun, I'll roll out one of my manual sports cars.

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Ok-Tangelo4024@reddit

My wife's Highlander is ok. 3 rows, heated seats, AWD, infotainment...it ticks all her boxes but it's an absolute bore. It has 3 drive modes...normal, eco and sport. Sport feels normal. Normal feels like eco mode and eco mode is just pathetic. I don't "like" this car. I tolerate it.

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Abe-early@reddit

Ford Explorer ST.

My dad has one, it’s pretty neat for a full size SUV, really launches hard from a dig. Really nice interior and creature comforts, killer stereo. I put an exhaust on it, sounds pretty good (for a v6). I also put lowering springs that dropped it a little and gave it a good stance.

I’m not a fan of SUV’s as a whole, but it’s pretty cool. His is a 2020 he paid 44k for it last year, it only had 31k miles then.

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thestreaker@reddit

Can confirm the explorer ST is one of the most fun mommy mobiles to be had for the price. I bought the wife a 21’ last year with 20k on it and no real issues other than a camera recall so far. I put some 295 DWS 06+ tires on it and it eats the corners now. We considered a Telluride but they drive like a fancy NPC car. X5 40i is on the short list for next vehicle once the youngest is out of a car seat.

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kc_kr@reddit

If you’ve got younger kids to haul around, a minivan is better than any of the choices that have been named so far for 50k. Sorrynotsorry.

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Spiritual-Belt@reddit

For myself, no. I’ll take a minivan every time over a 3 row crossover. There’s nothing the crossover does better other than towing (but for a tow rig I need more than what the crossovers can offer anyway). Minivans are more comfortable, have way more room for people and cargo, and, dare I say it, are honestly better looking than the boring crossover that everyone is driving. That said, my mom bought a highlander hybrid at my recommendation and loves it and my parents are considering an older highlander for my 16 year old sibling’s daily driver

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